McCain seeks to delay debate to focus on economy

[Gan]

NEW YORK (AP) - Republican John McCain says he's directing his staff to work with Barack Obama's campaign and the debate commission to delay Friday's debate because of the economic crisis.

In a statement, McCain says he will stop campaigning after addressing former President Bill Clinton's Global Initiative session on Thursday and return to Washington to focus on the nation's financial problems.



McCain also said he wants President Bush to convene a leadership meeting in Washington. Both he and Obama would attend the session.


http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D93D8TDO0&show_article=1


__________________________________________________ _________


Does McCain read the PC???
(we discussed this very thing in a previous thread).
(wonder how many libs will claim this is a delay tactic by saying McCain is afraid of debating Obama. )
:yes:

[crb]

Not a great idea IMO. Obama is a shitty debater. "uh uh uh uh uh"

But... I guess he is putting country first.

[Tsa`ah]

Not a great idea IMO. Obama is a shitty debater. "uh uh uh uh uh"

But... I guess he is putting country first.

Lol ... okaaaayyy.

[Keller]

Not a great idea IMO. Obama is a shitty debater. "uh uh uh uh uh"

But... I guess he is putting country first.

How is he putting country first?

I'm not saying it's a bad idea -- but I don't get how this helps the country.

[ClydeR]

I don't get it.

McCain would have outperformed expectations in the debate. His and Obama's presence on a high-profile committee working on the banking crisis is sure to politicize the matter and slow progress, especially when any congressional work will be done in a chamber controlled by the Democrats. I can't figure what he hopes to accomplish either from a political or legislative angle.

Perhaps he thinks Bush will appoint a committee with equal numbers of Republicans and Democrats and that the Democrats in Congress will cede their legislative authority to this committee.

Timeo Danaos et dona ferentes.

[Kefka]

Obama supporter and chief debate negotiator Rep. Rahm Emanuel, D-Ill., told MSNBC that "we can handle both," when asked about his reaction to McCain's call to postpone the first debate because of the administration's bailout plan.

He believes they are making good progress on Capitol Hill on the bailout and his initial reaction is that the work on the Hill should not preclude the debate from taking place.

An Obama campaign official told ABC News the Democratic presidential candidate called McCain this morning to suggest a joint statement of principles.

McCain called back this afternoon and suggested returning to Washington.

Obama is willing to return to Washington "if it would be helpful." But reiterated Obama intends to debate on Friday.


http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar/2008/09/mccain-not-comm.html

[Gan]

"If it would be helpful..."

:wtf:

[Kefka]

Not a great idea IMO. Obama is a shitty debater. "uh uh uh uh uh"

But... I guess he is putting country first.

I rather hear 'uh's' instead of sounding like someone memorized a script. Gives me the impression he's actually thinking out his answers.

[Parkbandit]

LOL.. I just noticed the paintshop of McCain's hand in Bush's pants.

[CrystalTears]

Aw, I was looking forward to the Friday debate too.

[ClydeR]

McCain has enough trouble simply talking to crowds with pre-prepared rhetoric, much less a formal debate. We'll see when the debates finally come around.

Don't kid yourself. McCain is a good debater. He participated in several debates during the Republican primaries. Although he did not "win" all of those debates, his performance was on average better than any other debate participant.

Obama also participated in many debates in the Democrat primaries. He won a few of them, but Clinton won more, in my opinion. His performance was better in the later debates than in the earlier ones, which leaves the possibility that he might surprise us with a really good performance.

[CrystalTears]

He's a masterdebater, amirite??!

[Gan]

I"m looking forward to a debate as well. However, under the current circumstances both candidates need to have their asses back in DC as a way to reflect that they are working on finding a solution. In effect, they need to DO THEIR JOB.

This is a great opportunity to demonstrate some leadership during a crisis situation. Not hiding out with your campaign advisors practicing for a debate.

Once a solution has been found/reached and their presence is no longer needed nor necessary then they can get back to campaigning.

[Parkbandit]

Does McCain read the PC???
(we discussed this very thing in a previous thread).
(wonder how many libs will claim this is a delay tactic by saying McCain is afraid of debating Obama. )
:yes:







I will go ahead and take full credit for posting this suggestion first. I DO believe that McCain fucked up by discussing it with Obama's camp prior to just doing it like I suggested.

[Gan]

However a senior Obama campaign official said Obama "intends to debate."

"The debate is on," a senior Obama campaign official told ABC News.

McCain said he called on the Commission on Presidential Debates to postpone the debate scheduled for Friday in Mississippi, to ensure quick congressional action. The campaign is also suspending its advertising, pending an agreement with Obama.

“I have spoken to Senator Obama and informed him of my decision and have asked him to join me,” McCain planned to say in New York City, according to advance excerpts released by his campaign. “I am calling on the president to convene a meeting with the leadership from both houses of Congress, including Senator Obama and myself. It is time for both parties to come together to solve this problem.”

Obama supporter and chief debate negotiator Rep. Rahm Emanuel, D-Ill., told MSNBC that "we can handle both," when asked about his reaction to McCain's call to postpone the first debate because of the administration's bailout plan.

He believes they are making good progress on Capitol Hill on the bailout and his initial reaction is that the work on the Hill should not preclude the debate from taking place.

An Obama campaign official told ABC News the Democratic presidential candidate called McCain this morning to suggest a joint statement of principles.

McCain called back this afternoon and suggested returning to Washington.

Obama is willing to return to Washington "if it would be helpful." But reiterated Obama intends to debate on Friday.

McCain and his top advisers said the Republican presidential candidate has not committed to voting for the massive financial bailout plan proposed by the Bush administration, with aides saying he will reserve final judgment until there is a final product.

A senior McCain campaign official said that the “Bush package is dead. This is a serious situation. Package must be resolved by the time markets open on Monday."

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid said Tuesday that McCain had assured Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson that he would support the $700 billion legislation.

Asked about that Wednesday, McCain responded: “I did not say that.”
Senior advisor Mark Salter then interjected saying, “He hasn’t said that to Paulson or to Reid or to anybody else. He hasn’t said that to me.”

McCain campaign political director Mike DuHaime told reporters at a lunch meeting in Washington that the senator will not commit until he sees the final package that comes to the Senate floor.

“He’s going to do what he thinks is right,” DuHaime said at a lunch sponsored by the Christian Science Monitor. “He’ll make a vote as a leader in this country, and people will look to him.”

DuHaime added, “Quite frankly, I think you could ask Sen. Obama if he’s going to do what he thinks is right. I mean, he has never -- I believe -- never once made a decision that is an unpopular decision or went against the orthodoxy of his party, and was one that was one that was a tough decision to make. . . . Sen. McCain has done that throughout his entire career, his entire life -- not just in politics, but his life.”

DuHaime said that while McCain understands the urgency, many voters continue to have important questions about what the bailout means to them.

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar/2008/09/mccain-not-comm.html

[Kefka]

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, in a statement that would be unlikely to go out without the Obama campaign's approval, dismisses McCain's suspension:

This is a critical time for our country. While I appreciate that both candidates have signaled their willingness to help, Congress and the Administration have a process in place to reach a solution to this unprecedented financial crisis.

I understand that the candidates are putting together a joint statement at Senator Obama’s suggestion. But it would not be helpful at this time to have them come back during these negotiations and risk injecting presidential politics into this process or distract important talks about the future of our nation’s economy. If that changes, we will call upon them. We need leadership; not a campaign photo op.

If there were ever a time for both candidates to hold a debate before the American people about this serious challenge, it is now.


http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0908/Reid_McCain_return_would_not_be_helpful.html

[Parkbandit]

Wait.. so Dirty Harry is now saying that this was all Obama's idea?

I love it.

[Gan]

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, in a statement that would be unlikely to go out without the Obama campaign's approval, dismisses McCain's suspension:

This is a critical time for our country. While I appreciate that both candidates have signaled their willingness to help, Congress and the Administration have a process in place to reach a solution to this unprecedented financial crisis.

I understand that the candidates are putting together a joint statement at Senator Obama’s suggestion. But it would not be helpful at this time to have them come back during these negotiations and risk injecting presidential politics into this process or distract important talks about the future of our nation’s economy. If that changes, we will call upon them. We need leadership; not a campaign photo op.

If there were ever a time for both candidates to hold a debate before the American people about this serious challenge, it is now.


http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0908/Reid_McCain_return_would_not_be_helpful.html

Well of course Reid doesnt want McCain back in Washington.
DUR

[Keller]

"If it would be helpful..."

:wtf:

How would these two be helpful?

I asked this of crb, but I guess I'll ask it more generally.

Neither has anything close to an expertise in economics. Neither has banking experience. Both have strong political motivations -- either of their own accord or at the behest of their party. I'd actually prefer both of them to stay out of it.

[Gan]

I will go ahead and take full credit for posting this suggestion first. I DO believe that McCain fucked up by discussing it with Obama's camp prior to just doing it like I suggested.

I'll call that bet.

I posted it on 9/22

http://forum.gsplayers.com/showthread.php?t=36217

Lay em down suckah.

[Jesuit]

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, in a statement that would be unlikely to go out without the Obama campaign's approval, dismisses McCain's suspension:

This is a critical time for our country. While I appreciate that both candidates have signaled their willingness to help, Congress and the Administration have a process in place to reach a solution to this unprecedented financial crisis.

I understand that the candidates are putting together a joint statement at Senator Obama’s suggestion. But it would not be helpful at this time to have them come back during these negotiations and risk injecting presidential politics into this process or distract important talks about the future of our nation’s economy. If that changes, we will call upon them. We need leadership; not a campaign photo op.

If there were ever a time for both candidates to hold a debate before the American people about this serious challenge, it is now.


http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0908/Reid_McCain_return_would_not_be_helpful.html


Sept. 17 (Bloomberg) -- The U.S. Congress is unlikely to pass new legislation to overhaul financial regulations this year because ``no one knows what to do,'' Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid said today.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=amvDrVe.VghE

[Gan]

How would these two be helpful?

I asked this of crb, but I guess I'll ask it more generally.

Neither has anything close to an expertise in economics. Neither has banking experience. Both have strong political motivations -- either of their own accord or at the behest of their party. I'd actually prefer both of them to stay out of it.

Why do they go to Washington at all then? In a time of crisis they need to be where they work, where things get done.

Otherwise we could sell off the Capital Building and every Senator and Representative could just telecommute to work and save the taxpayers billions in lodging, travel, office space, etc.

Anytime you have something serious happen and no, repeat NO, solution is evident, then its best to gather the team together to work on a solution. Right?

And considering that both of these guys are applying for the job of President, I think its a great opportunity for them to demonstrate their willingness to lead. To do something involving the matter at hand. Not hide out in some out of the way place sheltered from any possibility of taking charge, taking a risk, or making something happen.

When there's a fire of this magnitude, do you leave guys at the station? Or do you call all hands?

(I'd call all hands, cause you never know when you'll need the additional resources)

Once a solution is found and agreed upon by both houses and the administration then they boys can get back to their campaign fun. Until then, its time to go to work.

[Jesuit]

Why do they go to Washington at all then? In a time of crisis they need to be where they work, where things get done.

Otherwise we could sell off the Capital Building and every Senator and Representative could just telecommute to work and save the taxpayers billions in lodging, travel, office space, etc.

Anytime you have something serious happen and no, repeat NO, solution is evident, then its best to gather the team together to work on a solution. Right?

And considering that both of these guys are applying for the job of President, I think its a great opportunity for them to demonstrate their willingness to lead. To do something involving the matter at hand. Not hide out in some out of the way place sheltered from any possibility of taking charge, taking a risk, or making something happen.

When there's a fire of this magnitude, do you leave guys at the station? Or do you call all hands?

(I'd call all hands, cause you never know when you'll need the additional resources)

Once a solution is found and agreed upon by both houses and the administration then they boys can get back to their campaign fun. Until then, its time to go to work.

Come on Gan, you know Harry Reid has everything under control. Americans want debates, who gives a shit about the economy?

[Gan]

Not to mention how silly and potentially damaging it would be for Obama to appear on national TV at the debate and be there by himself while his opponent is in Washington doing something.

I would call this cutting ones nose off to spite their face. I think its a bad political decision not to be in Washington during a time like this.. for any national representative that I vote for.

[Gan]

Come on Gan, you know Harry Reid has everything under control. Americans want debates, who gives a shit about the economy?

That scares me almost as much as a Biden presidency.

[Parkbandit]

I'll call that bet.

I posted it on 9/22

http://forum.gsplayers.com/showthread.php?t=36217

Lay em down suckah.


FUCK.. I didn't even see your commentary at the bottom.

I give.

[Keller]

Why do they go to Washington at all then? In a time of crisis they need to be where they work, where things get done.

Otherwise we could sell off the Capital Building and every Senator and Representative could just telecommute to work and save the taxpayers billions in lodging, travel, office space, etc.

Anytime you have something serious happen and no, repeat NO, solution is evident, then its best to gather the team together to work on a solution. Right?

And considering that both of these guys are applying for the job of President, I think its a great opportunity for them to demonstrate their willingness to lead. To do something involving the matter at hand. Not hide out in some out of the way place sheltered from any possibility of taking charge, taking a risk, or making something happen.

When there's a fire of this magnitude, do you leave guys at the station? Or do you call all hands?

(I'd call all hands, cause you never know when you'll need the additional resources)

Once a solution is found and agreed upon by both houses and the administration then they boys can get back to their campaign fun. Until then, its time to go to work.

I guess I am skeptical that either would be helpful. But I think if we've ever got a set of candidates who think on their own and have helpful recommendations, it is now. I just don't trust that either has a leash long enough to make any truly unorthodox (and therefore unique) contributions and that their presence would just further exascerbate an already highly political decision.

What I'd like to see happen is get together 5-8 successful private investors/businessmen and 5-8 highly educated/experienced public officials (regardless of their body of government). Get those people into a roundtable discussion and let the congress watch. Too often we're getting politicized diatribes and not useful questions.

[Jesuit]

I guess I am skeptical that either would be helpful. But I think if we've ever got a set of candidates who think on their own and have helpful recommendations, it is now. I just don't trust that either has a leash long enough to make any truly unorthodox (and therefore unique) contributions and that their presence would just further exascerbate an already highly political decision.

What I'd like to see happen is get together 5-8 successful private investors/businessmen and 5-8 highly educated/experienced public officials (regardless of their body of government). Get those people into a roundtable discussion and let the congress watch. Too often we're getting politicized diatribes and not useful questions.

If you don't think either candidate has anything to offer maybe you should've donated your $500 to Nader instead.

[crb]

I rather hear 'uh's' instead of sounding like someone memorized a script. Gives me the impression he's actually thinking out his answers.
What are you saying? You know your man Obama is the most scripted candidate ever? His teleprompter is practically attached at the hip.

And yes, if you think Obama is a good debater you've got blinders on. He sucks, he sucked up all the primary debates, and only one he did decent in was the one that was so biased that even SNL made fun of it. He quite frankly, sucks when he is off a script.

I'm a John McCain supporter, I'll freely admit John McCain sucks when on a script, and is much better when he can just speak his mind. That is just his style, and obama is the opposite, why is that so hard for the sheeple to admit?



How would these two be helpful?

I asked this of crb, but I guess I'll ask it more generally.

Neither has anything close to an expertise in economics. Neither has banking experience. Both have strong political motivations -- either of their own accord or at the behest of their party. I'd actually prefer both of them to stay out of it.

If education is the requirement why doesn't Phil Gramm just run things? Instead you have liberals who aren't educated on economics attacking the guy when he says things that are truthful, if not tactful.

Most of congress doesn't understand this issue, don't kid yourself. Our elected representatives are not the smartest people out there. What McCain and Obama could do is not educate congress on the intricacies of mortgage securities, but rather make an effort to stop the partisan posturing that has the potential to derail the whole thing.

[Keller]

If you don't think either candidate has anything to offer maybe you should've donated your $500 to Nader instead.

Or maybe reading comprehension lessons for you.

[Keller]

If education is the requirement why doesn't Phil Gramm just run things? Instead you have liberals who aren't educated on economics attacking the guy when he says things that are truthful, if not tactful.

Most of congress doesn't understand this issue, don't kid yourself. Our elected representatives are not the smartest people out there. What McCain and Obama could do is not educate congress on the intricacies of mortgage securities, but rather make an effort to stop the partisan posturing that has the potential to derail the whole thing.

No real disagreement.

Except that I don't see how raising the political stakes (the entire executive branch) will make it less partisan. I might be wrong, but that's my gut feeling.

[Jesuit]

Or maybe reading comprehension lessons for you.

No, you're not that articulate. Did I miss something?



I guess I am skeptical that either would be helpful.

[Gan]

Lets be clear that I dont have the expectation that either Obama or McCain can solve this crisis all by themselves.

I do have the expectation for both candidates to be part of the team that works on getting a solution hammered out through (as Crb said) both sides of the fence and presents it to the people.

I expect them to work and if possible lead. Since thats what they are asking to do in November.

[Keller]

No, you're not that articulate.

BURN!


Did I miss something?

The rest of my post most likely.

[Kefka]

What are you saying? You know your man Obama is the most scripted candidate ever? His teleprompter is practically attached at the hip.

And yes, if you think Obama is a good debater you've got blinders on. He sucks, he sucked up all the primary debates, and only one he did decent in was the one that was so biased that even SNL made fun of it. He quite frankly, sucks when he is off a script.

I'm a John McCain supporter, I'll freely admit John McCain sucks when on a script, and is much better when he can just speak his mind. That is just his style, and obama is the opposite, why is that so hard for the sheeple to admit?

You're referring to the last debate when McCain was answering questions before it was given? I wouldn't count on anymore 'debates' such as that one.

[Jesuit]

BURN!



The rest of my post most likely.

Ok.

[Kefka]

Not to mention how silly and potentially damaging it would be for Obama to appear on national TV at the debate and be there by himself while his opponent is in Washington doing something.

I would call this cutting ones nose off to spite their face. I think its a bad political decision not to be in Washington during a time like this.. for any national representative that I vote for.

Probably not as damaging as McCain being up on Capitol Hill, alone at night, claiming he's working on the important business of our economy. Especially with the way he's been dodging the media.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TC5ApHGJ218

[Keller]

Jesuit: Can someone "have something to offer" which is not helpful?

Is it possible that further politicizing an already highly political situation would be an unhelpful "offering"?

Do you understand what it means to be "helpful"?

[Gan]

Aiming to prove how serious he is about addressing the financial crisis, John McCain has instructed his staff to take all his campaign commercials off the air, a spokesman tells Politico.

"As John McCain said, now is the time to put partisanship aside and come together to do the work that the American people expect," said Tucker Bounds.

McCain aides are now in the process of contacting TV station across the country to get their ads taken down, according to Bounds.

Asked how long they would go dark, Bounds only said: "We're taking our guidance from Sen. McCain on that."

http://www.politico.com/blogs/jonathanmartin/0908/McCain_taking_ads_down.html?showall

[Keller]

How is removing political ads helpful?

[crb]

He shouldn't remove his ads, just switch them.

<cut to john mccain sitting against a black background>

My fellow Americans, now is not the time for political posturing. We need to solve this financial crisis and we need both parties to do it. I've stopped campaigning and am heading to washington now to work to get things done, please join me in urging your elected representatives to do the same.

[Jesuit]

Jesuit: Can someone "have something to offer" which is not helpful?

Is it possible that further politicizing an already highly political situation would be an unhelpful "offering"?

Do you understand what it means to be "helpful"?

So it's too much to ask that people do the job that they are paid to do?

Someone had to step up. I guess McCain shouldn't have done anything out of fear of being accused of politicizing politics.

[Soulpieced]

Not to mention how silly and potentially damaging it would be for Obama to appear on national TV at the debate and be there by himself while his opponent is in Washington doing something.

I would call this cutting ones nose off to spite their face. I think its a bad political decision not to be in Washington during a time like this.. for any national representative that I vote for.

This said, does anyone think it's a possibility of this actually happening? It would certainly make for interesting television if McCain no-showed because he went back to DC to actually work on this. Could obviously slant it either way, but it would definitely make headlines.

[Keller]

So it's too much to ask that people do the job that they are paid to do?

Someone had to step up. I guess McCain shouldn't have done anything out of fear of being accused of politicizing politics.

Thanks for answering my questions.

I never said it was too much to ask people to do the job they are paid to do. I said that I was skeptical that it would be helpful for them to do the job they are paid to do given their posture as the two candidates for President.

I've never accused McCain of using this as a political maneuver. I sincerely believe McCain thinks he is doing what is best for the country by pulling the plug on the debate (now the ads, that's another thing). It's customary for the winning candidate to postpone and avoid debates and the losing candidate to encourage them -- so why in the world, other than out of a genuine interest to help the crisis, would McCain want to delay them?

[Gan]

How is removing political ads helpful?

Surely you understand the significance of imagery and public perception in any effort that happens in Washington? How better to demonstrate to the average American that fixing this problem is the most important thing to him at this time.

[BigWorm]

McCain was the one who wanted this debate to focus on the economy and foreign policy in the first place. God forbid the candidates engage in a public debate on how to fix our current economic situation.

[Keller]

Surely you understand the significance of imagery and public perception in any effort that happens in Washington? How better to demonstrate to the average American that fixing this problem is the most important thing to him at this time.

You're answering a different question: how is this helpful to the McCain campaign? I would agree with your answer.

I was asking how this is helpful to Washington finding a solution (if Washington even has a solution).

[Keller]

McCain was the one who wanted this debate to focus on the economy and foreign policy in the first place. God forbid the candidates engage in a public debate on how to fix our current economic situation.

You mean a public finger pointing contest on which political party is responsible?

Call me a cynic, but it's tired.

[Jesuit]

Thanks for answering my questions.

I never said it was too much to ask people to do the job they are paid to do. I said that I was skeptical that it would be helpful for them to do the job they are paid to do given their posture as the two candidates for President.

I've never accused McCain of using this as a political maneuver. I sincerely believe McCain thinks he is doing what is best for the country by pulling the plug on the debate (now the ads, that's another thing). It's customary for the winning candidate to postpone and avoid debates and the losing candidate to encourage them -- so why in the world, other than out of a genuine interest to help the crisis, would McCain want to delay them?

Isn't it obvious? McCain is afraid. It's not like he asked Obama to do 10 Town Halls or anything.

[BigWorm]

Isn't it obvious? McCain is afraid. It's not like he asked Obama to do 10 Town Halls or anything.

Seriously why does McCain want to change the debate format so badly? First the town hall thing and now trying to cancel the first debate.

[Keller]

Isn't it obvious? McCain is afraid. It's not like he asked Obama to do 10 Town Halls or anything.

How far afield are you going to go to save face? Just apologize for wrongly mischaracterizing my positions and move on.

[Gan]

You're answering a different question: how is this helpful to the McCain campaign? I would agree with your answer.

I was asking how this is helpful to Washington finding a solution (if Washington even has a solution).

Ahhh. Ok.

The only side effect is that any ads might distract from the efforts that are being taken during this time. And a distraction could be considered a bad thing.

[Keller]

Ahhh. Ok.

The only side effect is that any ads might distract from the efforts that are being taken during this time. And a distraction could be considered a bad thing.

Will the Senate be screening ads instead of holding hearings?

I don't get it. Do you mean in the large societal picture, commercials are distracting?

[Jesuit]

How far afield are you going to go to save face? Just apologize for wrongly mischaracterizing my positions and move on.

I'll go as far as asking you and your wife if it was $1000 well spent after the election is over. I'll even offer your wife $1000 to come over to my house if she wants to recoup her losses. That's how much of a gentleman I am.

[Gan]

Seriously why does McCain want to change the debate format so badly? First the town hall thing and now trying to cancel the first debate.

Its really a vast right wing conspiracy to remain in power through this election. Firstly Senator Graham, being omnicient as he is, timed the deregulation bill to cause the housing bubble and subsequent banking collapse at exactly this moment so John McCain could use this as an excuse NOT to debate the awesomeness of Barack Obama and to further derail the remaining 60 days so as to sneak into the white house by diverting the all wise American public to focus on this single issue instead of the other REAL issues that surround this Presidential Race. This was planned beacuse the GOP already knew we would be at war, so a wag-the-dog scenario could not be used.

Remember, you heard this conspiracy here first. ;)

[Keller]

I'll go as far as asking you and your wife if it was $1000 well spent after the election is over. I'll even offer your wife $1000 to come over to my house if she wants to recoup her losses. That's how much of a gentleman I am.

You mean you're going to offer to fuck my wife to make her whole?

Wow, you ARE a gentleman.

[Gan]

Will the Senate be screening ads instead of holding hearings?

I don't get it. Do you mean in the large societal picture, commercials are distracting?

Please tell me you're being obtuse.

The media will be following McCain (and hopefully Obama) almost full time. Any ads that are run are bound to cause a distraction when the media picks up on them.

[Keller]

Please tell me you're being obtuse.

The media will be following McCain (and hopefully Obama) almost full time. Any ads that are run are bound to cause a distraction when the media picks up on them.

Distract who?

[Kefka]

Sen. Barack Obama (D-IL) just gave a press conference responding to Sen. John McCain’s (R-AZ) suggestion that they both suspend their campaigns, postpone Friday’s debate in Mississippi, and return to Washington to deal with the financial crisis. Obama said that he would like to the debate to go forward as planned because “it is going to be part of the president’s job to deal with more than one thing at once”:

With respect to the debates, it’s my belief that this is exactly the time when the American people need to hear from the person who, in approximately 40 days, will be responsible for dealing with this mess. And I think that it is going to be part of the president’s job to deal with more than one thing at once. I think there’s no reason why we can’t be constructive in helping to solve this problem and also tell the American people what we believe and where we stand and where we want to take the country.


http://thinkprogress.org/2008/09/24/obama-debate/


A majority of Americans say the debate should be held. Just 10% say the debate should be postponed. A sizable percentage of Americans, 36%, think the focus of the debate should be modified to focus more on the economy. 3 of 4 Americans say the presidential campaign should continue. Just 14% say the presidential campaign should be suspended. If Friday's debate does not take place 46%, of Americans say that would be bad for America.

http://www.surveyusa.com/client/PollReportUC.aspx?g=54d651a7-a62b-4420-bb32-9dd6b2df8c02

[Gan]

Distract who?

Stop it.

[Gan]

Sen. Barack Obama (D-IL) just gave a press conference responding to Sen. John McCain’s (R-AZ) suggestion that they both suspend their campaigns, postpone Friday’s debate in Mississippi, and return to Washington to deal with the financial crisis. Obama said that he would like to the debate to go forward as planned because “it is going to be part of the president’s job to deal with more than one thing at once”:

With respect to the debates, it’s my belief that this is exactly the time when the American people need to hear from the person who, in approximately 40 days, will be responsible for dealing with this mess. And I think that it is going to be part of the president’s job to deal with more than one thing at once. I think there’s no reason why we can’t be constructive in helping to solve this problem and also tell the American people what we believe and where we stand and where we want to take the country.


http://thinkprogress.org/2008/09/24/obama-debate/


Because we all know that Obama already has a solution to this problem and he's going to UNVEIL IT at the debate.

Please.



A majority of Americans say the debate should be held. Just 10% say the debate should be postponed. A sizable percentage of Americans, 36%, think the focus of the debate should be modified to focus more on the economy. 3 of 4 Americans say the presidential campaign should continue. Just 14% say the presidential campaign should be suspended. If Friday's debate does not take place 46%, of Americans say that would be bad for America.

http://www.surveyusa.com/client/PollReportUC.aspx?g=54d651a7-a62b-4420-bb32-9dd6b2df8c02

I love opinion polls. They're great when you want to prove an point and need data massaged accordingly.

[Jesuit]

You mean you're going to offer to fuck my wife to make her whole?

Wow, you ARE a gentleman.

No, I don't want to fuck her. I told you I'm a gentleman. I just want to spank her while she calls me daddy.

[Danical]

:wtf:

Are you retarded?

[Keller]

Stop it.

I'm serious. Who is it distracting?

[Keller]

No, I don't want to fuck her. I told you I'm a gentleman. I just want to spank her while she calls me daddy.

Glad to see you can hold a rational conversation with the grown ups.

Thanks!

[Daniel]

Yea. There's no coincidence in McCain's exposure to the people and events leading to this crisis and his not wanting to talk about it in a public forum.

[Keller]

you're being obtuse.

I was walking home from the office when it dawned on me that you had called me obtuse. I smiled slyly and chuckled under my breath. Unfortunately I had been staring into the distance but also had my eyes directed toward a heffer of a woman and she smiled back. I wanted to stop her and explain that I wasn't smiling at her and that my standards are much higher.

[Danical]

KELLER LIKES FATTIES!!!!!

[Jesuit]

Glad to see you can hold a rational conversation with the grown ups.

Thanks!

You're the one who assumed I meant fucking. I'm just going by what Parkbandit tells me your wife likes.

[Keller]

You're the one who assumed I meant fucking. I'm just going by what Parkbandit tells me your wife likes.

What does any of this have to do with the apology you owe me? Further, what does it have to do with your inability to actually engage in a discussion?

[Jesuit]

What does any of this have to do with the apology you owe me? Further, what does it have to do with your inability to actually engage in a discussion?

Hey don't shoot the messenger.

[Keller]

Hey don't shoot the messenger.

Are you done yet? Prepared to rejoin the conversation?

[Danical]

Hey don't shoot the messenger.

You're being a dick for no good reason other than you feel butthurt about getting PWN'd on an internet forum.

Give it a rest.

[Parkbandit]

Seriously why does McCain want to change the debate format so badly? First the town hall thing and now trying to cancel the first debate.


McCain believes that this is a dire time for the US financially and has made the determination that the Country should come first and that he should get back and do the job he was elected to do.

Whether or not that is really his reasoning, I can't fault him for it.

[Parkbandit]

You're the one who assumed I meant fucking. I'm just going by what Parkbandit tells me your wife likes.

Obviously, she likes big assholes and a tiny penis.

Why do you think she spent all that time in France?

[Gan]

I'm serious. Who is it distracting?

You mean who would it distract. It being political advertisements by one of the major presidential candidates. Said advertisements being aired to the general public during this financial crisis.

IMO
1. It would distract John Q Public from focusing on what needs to be focused on, primarily keeping up to date with whats happening in Washington and on Wall Street. It would also distract said member of the public from focusing that attention on his or her respective representative to get this shit fixed.

2. It would distract the media from focusing on what is more important. Financial > Politics for the time being.

3. It would distract the candidates as they are split between managing their campaign, the debates, and the ads that cause a reaction to both the public and the media - /goto #2.

So in essence, yes it would be a distraction. Even Barack got it right when he said that now is a moment where the crisis is greater than politics. Too bad he has not followed through with that thought yet. :(

[Gan]

I was walking home from the office when it dawned on me that you had called me obtuse. I smiled slyly and chuckled under my breath. Unfortunately I had been staring into the distance but also had my eyes directed toward a heffer of a woman and she smiled back. I wanted to stop her and explain that I wasn't smiling at her and that my standards are much higher.

I'll take credit for the 'gotcha' then. :)

[Gan]

Reid to McCain: Don't Come Back to Capitol

September 24, 2008 5:14 PM
A Democrat tells ABC News that, in a phone call late this afternoon, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., told Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., that it would NOT be helpful for him to come back to Washington, D.C., to work on the Wall Street bailout bill.

McCain this afternoon suspended his campaign and said he would skip the first presidential debate in order to return to Capitol Hill to work on the log-jammed Bush administration legislation, which, as of Wednesday afternoon, was in peril.

McCain had phoned Reid to ask about the prospects of him, Sen. Barack Obama, D-Ill., and others to sit down and work together on hammering out a bipartisan proposal.

"Sorry," Reid said to him, a Democrat close to Reid says.

Reid then read McCain the statement he had just put out: "This is a critical time for our country," says the Reid statement. "While I appreciate that both candidates have signaled their willingness to help, Congress and the administration have a process in place to reach a solution to this unprecedented financial crisis. I understand that the candidates are putting together a joint statement at Sen. Obama’s suggestion. But it would not be helpful at this time to have them come back during these negotiations and risk injecting presidential politics into this process or distract important talks about the future of our nation’s economy. If that changes, we will call upon them. We need leadership; not a campaign photo op. If there were ever a time for both candidates to hold a debate before the American people about this serious challenge, it is now.”

A source close to Reid said McCain didn't have much to say after that. Reid, the source says, thinks McCain's maneuver is a gimmick born from bad poll numbers and the fact that "debate prep must not be going very well."

- jpt

UPDATE: McCain senior adviser Mark Salter emails: "Yesterday, Harry Reid said that consensus couldn't be achieved without John McCain's leadership. John stepped up and is providing that leadership. Now Senator Reid seems to have changed his mind for reasons we'll let him explain. But what he should understand is that this isn't about Harry Reid or John McCain or Barack Obama. It's about the American people and, in the words of Warren Buffet, the financial Pearl Harbor they're facing. John's committed to doing his part to help avert that calamity. We hope Senator Reid is too."


http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/09/reid-to-mccain.html

[Danical]

:yawn:

nothing unexpected - political maneuvers.

http://www.mobilegamefaqs.com/newsimgs/stratego.jpg

EDIT: Where's the email evidence? That's pretty stupid to go back on what you said a single day previous.

[Daniel]

You mean who would it distract. It being political advertisements by one of the major presidential candidates. Said advertisements being aired to the general public during this financial crisis.

IMO
1. It would distract John Q Public from focusing on what needs to be focused on, primarily keeping up to date with whats happening in Washington and on Wall Street. It would also distract said member of the public from focusing that attention on his or her respective representative to get this shit fixed.

2. It would distract the media from focusing on what is more important. Financial > Politics for the time being.

3. It would distract the candidates as they are split between managing their campaign, the debates, and the ads that cause a reaction to both the public and the media - /goto #2.

So in essence, yes it would be a distraction. Even Barack got it right when he said that now is a moment where the crisis is greater than politics. Too bad he has not followed through with that thought yet. :(


The job of the people is to elect leaders who can do the day to day operations of the country.

I'd argue that it's more important for the people to know and be able to fully decide who their leader will be for the next 4 years than to "be aware of what is going on".

[ClydeR]

Now that I've had a chance to think about it more, I realize this is just another instance of big phony McCain playing drama queen.

When Russia invaded Georgia, big phony McCain injected himself into the middle of it, as if he were already president. Contrary to McCain's statements at the time, most Americans don't think that we are all Georgians now.

When Hurricane Ike was bearing down on the Gulf Coast, big phony McCain flew to Mississippi the day before it hit for a press conference and photo op with Mississippi's governor. At the press conference, McCain just repeated info that anybody watching the teevee already knew. It was a sickening, shameless performance.

When the stock market started collapsing last week, McCain took a moment between his many conflicting statements (fundamentally strong economy one day, recession the next; don't bail out AIG one day, bail out AIG the next) to reassure us that he was monitoring the markets closely so he could act if needed.

After missing more votes than any other Senator, including Ted Kennedy who has brain cancer, and after not voting at all since April, big phony McCain wants us to believe that he can intervene and solve the whole problem. That's after admitting early this year that he doesn't know much about economics and after saying at a press conference yesterday that he didn't have an opinion on the bailout because he had not had an opportunity to review Bush's proposal.

I'm telling you McCain is a big phony and, it is now clear to me, a drama queen.

[Tsa`ah]

....

Oye ...

First you have to wonder about the motives of a man demanding congress get back to work some time ago ... and then getting back to work himself months later.

McCain hasn't done his job as a Senator since the beginning of the primary season.

On top of that ... McCain's awesome oratory skills ... unscripted.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w1AjO-IxfMY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HNnTxr0NI00

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D6IlGXhCUHo

That's just a few ... I think you have some warped sense of reality.

[Mabus]

On top of that ... McCain's awesome oratory skills ... unscripted.

McCain has not been touted as a "great speaker". That would be like saying Biden was always tactful.

But a couple Obama moments, just for you:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=omHUsRTYFAU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sqcnjxYiG7M&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EpGH02DtIws

[Tsa`ah]

Maybe you should inform your iffl (idiot friend for life) ... considering I was responding to his wasted hard drive space.

[Kefka]

The memo, titled “TALKING POINTS: SUSPENDING THE CAMPAIGN,” includes a list of points the campaign wants emphasized, and includes this warning from Kise: “Please do not proactively reach out to the media on this.”

McCain’s plans to stop campaigning — and a proposal to cancel Friday’s debate with Obama — had already been widely reported Wednesday afternoon.

Still, Kise was surprised at his e-mail snafu, as Pelzer reports:

Told by a reporter that the e-mail had been sent to him and others in the media, Kise said, “F*ck, tell me I didn’t send it to the wrong list.”

Kise said the talking points were meant for McCain volunteers.

http://washingtonindependent.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/09/mccaintalkingpoints1.jpg

http://washingtonindependent.com/7396/colo-mccain-staffer-accidentally-leaks-talking-points-to-reporters

[Back]

Now that I've had a chance to think about it more, I realize this is just another instance of big phony McCain playing drama queen.

I'm telling you McCain is a big phony and, it is now clear to me, a drama queen.

^^^

Cheers, CR.

[Moist Happenings]

I'd really rather let their actions do the talking instead of seeing who can look better than the other in front of a camera. Granted, politics is vastly different than it was years ago, but if you think back to some of our best presidents in history, you're gonna see a lot of presidents that didn't speak well to crowds, or convey themselves well to the media, whatever medium that might have been in for their time.

But, their actions spoke louder than what they did or didn't have to say.

[Warriorbird]

Best debate dodge ever. I like how the Republicans have been going 'Not a problem!' about the economy for such a long time. Ultimately it might be a bad choice for McCain though... Obama is very human as a debater too.

[crb]

This debate was national security, not the economy.

[Back]

This debate was national security, not the economy.

Your point is that McCain will not debate because the debate topic changed from a crucial issue we all face to another crucial issue we all face?

[Parkbandit]

Your point is that McCain will not debate because the debate topic changed from a crucial issue we all face to another?

No shit for brains. His point was to correct someone who claimed this was a debate about the economy.

[crb]

Your point is that McCain will not debate because the debate topic changed from a crucial issue we all face to another crucial issue we all face?
The debate topic hasn't changed...

Do you like... not watch the news or read the newspaper or what?

Debate topics are set months in advance, formats are set. This is the national security debate, it has always been the national security debate (foreign policy really). The second debate will be on domestic issues. This is the format of our president debates.

[Back]

No shit for brains. His point was to correct someone who claimed this was a debate about the economy.


The debate topic hasn't changed...

Do you like... not watch the news or read the newspaper or what?

Debate topics are set months in advance, formats are set. This is the national security debate, it has always been the national security debate (foreign policy really). The second debate will be on domestic issues. This is the format of our president debates.

So, a presidential candidate can’t debate ANY topic unless there is a format for the debate is what I am getting from these responses.

I call bullshit.

[Parkbandit]

So, a presidential candidate can’t debate ANY topic unless there is a format for the debate is what I am getting from these responses.

I call bullshit.

God, you are fucking dumb as gum.

[Back]

God, you are fucking dumb as gum.

When you have no legitimate response, call the other person (insult).

[Parkbandit]

When you have no legitimate response, call the other person (insult).


I'm not sure you can claim that was an insult.. since in fact you are dumb as gum.

[Back]

I'm not sure you can claim that was an insult.. since in fact you are dumb as gum.

Checkmate?

When you have anything at all to contribute that is not a personal attack, not just not on me but anyone with whom you happen to disagree with, please do enlighten everyone except myself to your profound wisdom.

[Kefka]

So the solution is easy. Dodge the debate. Even better, take down all campaign ads because... well it just looks presidential!

[ClydeR]

The debate topic hasn't changed...

Do you like... not watch the news or read the newspaper or what?

Debate topics are set months in advance, formats are set. This is the national security debate, it has always been the national security debate (foreign policy really). The second debate will be on domestic issues. This is the format of our president debates.

National security and the domestic economy are sometimes interchangable issues. If the debate goes forward Friday, the economy will somehow find its way onto the stage.

It works in reverse too. McCain has in the past tried to turn economic issues into national security issues. Look at McCain's response to an economic question a few months ago.


Senator, what do you see as the gravest long-term threat to the U.S. economy?


McCain at first says nothing. He sits in the corner of a sofa, one black, tasseled loafer propped against a coffee table. We're in the presidential suite on the 41st floor of the New York Hilton. McCain has come here - between a major speech on the economy in Washington, D.C., this morning and a fundraiser tonight at the 21 Club - to talk to us and to let us take his picture. He is wearing a dark suit, as he almost always does, with a blue shirt and a wine-colored tie. He's looking not at us but into the void. His eyes are narrowed. Nine seconds of silence, ten seconds, 11. Finally he says, "Well, I would think that the absolute gravest threat is the struggle that we're in against radical Islamic extremism, which can affect, if they prevail, our very existence. Another successful attack on the United States of America could have devastating consequences."


Not America's dependence on foreign oil? Not climate change? Not the crushing cost of health care? Eventually McCain gets around to mentioning all three of those. But he starts by deftly turning the economy into a national security issue - and why not? On national security McCain wins.

http://money.cnn.com/2008/06/20/magazines/fortune/Evolution_McCain_Whitford.fortune/

[Gan]

I just have to add, how many town hall debates did Obama decline from attending when McCain invited him to have them?

[Back]

Way to raise the bar. I guess the shoe is on the other foot now. I’m all out of clich&#233;s.

Why are Americans so against themselves?

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

I just have to add, how many town hall debates did Obama decline from attending when McCain invited him to have them?

Quite a few, not that that's surprising. Given how much Obama out fundraised McCain, it was much more pragmatic campaigning wise to not give McCain any free publicity if it could be helped. Town Hall debates would have done just that.

[Gan]

Regardless of fund raising implications. It was a chance to debate. Now a chance missed.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

Regardless of fund raising implications. It was a chance to debate. Now a chance missed.

And it wouldn't be so dire if McCain wasn't coming out of left field wanting to change the official debate only a few days before it's scheduled to happen.

I don't buy that McCain and Obama are in dire need of being in Washington DC right now rather than continuing to campaign-- in fact I think this close to the election it's impossible for the politics of the campaign season to not be injected into EVERYTHING they both do, which I think would be a huge detriment to the negotiations.. not to mention neither are economical wizzes and there have been huge bipartisan steps and efforts that involved neither of them in trying to work out a deal on the bailout plan. This comes across as trying to be able to grab credit for something that neither of them can legitimately take any credit for. I think the joint statement of support of a bi-partisan deal was a great step, and they should certainly stay updated on the situation, but their active involvement could hurt this way more than help.

Also, McCain claimed to stop his campaign but for the rest of the day he continued to campaign.. though he did use the "Have to go to DC right away!" card to cancel a TV appearance so he could get interviewed by Couric in NYC at the same time. McCain is trying to appear Presidential and it's backfiring on him. IMO he's coming across as erratic and irrational. In the past two weeks the entire Campaign hasn't been able to keep a story or position straight on this whole debacle.

[Gan]

Here's where you and I disagree then.

[BigWorm]

McCain was supposed to be on Letterman last night, but had to rush to the airport to get back to Washington and thus had to cancel hours before taping. Letterman was pissed and made no effort to hold back as he ripped on McCain for most of the episode. Check it out yourself, its pretty hilarious.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XjkCrfylq-E

[Daniel]

Here's where you and I disagree then.

I'm shocked.

[Tsa`ah]

I just have to add, how many town hall debates did Obama decline from attending when McCain invited him to have them?

Classic blame deflection.

[Gan]

Classic blame deflection.

So the fact that McCain invited Obama to debate and Obama refused is considered deflection to the instance where many are saying McCain is afraid to debate Obama as a result of his request to delay this debate?

Classic partisan logic.

[Tsa`ah]

You're trying to impose blame on Obama for not being able to see into the future.

I'm sorry .. but it's a bullshit attempt.

[BigWorm]

So the fact that McCain invited Obama to debate and Obama refused is considered deflection to the instance where many are saying McCain is afraid to debate Obama as a result of his request to delay this debate?

Classic partisan logic.

More like McCain wanted to change the agreement that was already in place in order to give himself an advantage since he is perceived to do better in town hall discussions than formal debates.

[Gan]

By formal you mean scripted?

[Gan]

You're trying to impose blame on Obama for not being able to see into the future.

I'm sorry .. but it's a bullshit attempt.

I'm imposing blame on Obama for refusing the town hall debates.

I'm mocking the attempt at trashing McCain for delaying this upcoming debate for the want of being in Washington so this financial mess can be worked out.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

So the fact that McCain invited Obama to debate and Obama refused is considered deflection to the instance where many are saying McCain is afraid to debate Obama as a result of his request to delay this debate?

Classic partisan logic.

McCain made a last ditch effort to try to wrestle control of the debates because he wasn't able to pick ones in a setting and about subjects that would be slated to help him and hurt Obama.

Obama wasn't "afraid" to debate McCain, he didn't want to give McCain the free publicity, especially since he smashed McCain as far as fundraising goes. It doesn't take rocket science to figure that out. I don't see any clear and logical reason why McCain is not wanting to debate Obama though.

[Keller]

I don't see any logical reason why McCain is not wanting to debate Obama though.

Because he genuinely feels it is in the best interests of the country.

I believe he believes that.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

Because he genuinely feels it is in the best interests of the country.

I believe he believes that.

I don't know what to believe he believes.

He's behaving like the crazy old man that comes out with a garden hose screaming "Get off my lawn!"

[Gan]

Much like McCain isnt 'afraid' to debate Obama now. ;)

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

Much like McCain isnt 'afraid' to debate Obama now. ;)

And again, what's the rationality of McCain wanting to put off the debate?

There's no reason why they can't both stay on top of the situation and go forward with the debate. They are not needed in Washington and going neck deep in this (both of them) I think would hurt it more than help given the campaign season politics that we both know would not be left out of anything this close to the election.

To be clear, I don't think it's fear on McCain's part why he wants to push back the debate. I think given how much sheltering the campaign has done in regards to Palin and the media, he's stalling for more time for her to study-up so to speak before going toe to toe with Biden. Thing is, the official debate dates have been set for months and if they're scrambling to get their shit together, they have no one to blame but themselves.

[Gan]

And again, what's the rationality of McCain wanting to put off the debate?

There's no reason why they can't both stay on top of the situation and go forward with the debate. They are not needed in Washington and going neck deep in this (both of them) I think would hurt it more than help given the campaign season politics that we both know would not be left out of anything this close to the election.

To be clear, I don't think it's fear on McCain's part why he wants to push back the debate. I think given how much sheltering the campaign has done in regards to Palin and the media, he's stalling for more time for her to study-up so to speak before going toe to toe with Biden. Push all the debates back and give Palin a bit more time.

Its already been echoed here that when there's a crisis, people need to go to their stations and be ready to do their job. Its a simple concept of crisis management. Its not a "Call me when you need me" mentality. Its one that appears to be ingrained in McCain. I would hazard a guess to say its from his military experience. Which might be why Obama doesnt get it.

As a voting constituent I want my representatives in Washington doing their job. That includes McCain. Especially so since he's applying for the job as leader.

This financial crisis, while building up, didnt come to a head until this week. Everyone hopes to see a resolution by today. What damage will it be to postpone the debate by a few days until this is ironed out?

Its a matter of perception. Something you might consider thinking about.

[BigWorm]

Its already been echoed here that when there's a crisis, people need to go to their stations and be ready to do their job. Its a simple concept of crisis management. Its not a "Call me when you need me" mentality. Its one that appears to be ingrained in McCain. I would hazard a guess to say its from his military experience. Which might be why Obama doesnt get it.

As a voting constituent I want my representatives in Washington doing their job. That includes McCain. Especially so since he's applying for the job as leader.

This financial crisis, while building up, didnt come to a head until this week. Everyone hopes to see a resolution by today. What damage will it be to postpone the debate by a few days until this is ironed out?

Its a matter of perception. Something you might consider thinking about.

Jesus Christ could you possibly be any more self-righteous?

[Gan]

Jesus Christ could you possibly be any more self-righteous?

I prefer 'logical'.

Feel free to echo your opinion if you're not to afraid to do so.

[Parkbandit]

I think you are talking above Big Worm. Dumb it down, lest he consider you self righteous (which made me laugh)

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

Its already been echoed here that when there's a crisis, people need to go to their stations and be ready to do their job. Its a simple concept of crisis management. Its not a "Call me when you need me" mentality. Its one that appears to be ingrained in McCain. I would hazard a guess to say its from his military experience. Which might be why Obama doesnt get it.

As a voting constituent I want my representatives in Washington doing their job. That includes McCain. Especially so since he's applying for the job as leader.

This financial crisis, while building up, didnt come to a head until this week. Everyone hopes to see a resolution by today. What damage will it be to postpone the debate by a few days until this is ironed out?

Its a matter of perception. Something you might consider thinking about.

Oh good god. It's an insult to anyone who's been in the service to hint that rushing into a situation that you don't have a firm grasp on is something you're taught in the military. I guess my dad who served over 20 years wasn't "taught" correctly since he agrees McCain is not behaving rationally about this in the slight.

If you honestly believe that 40 days out from an election, both or even just one candidate running for President will leave their campaign politics out of ANYTHING they do that the American public will see, then you're incredibly naive.

The bill is not going to collapse without them and election politics could do a LOT to seriously harm the bipartisan efforts being made. Both Senators are doing their jobs by voicing concerns for parts that they take issue with, praising parts that they agree with, and then voting accordingly when the time comes. But the people who are negotiating and working to come to an agreement don't need campaign politics muddying up the water.

Also, the debates are to help the American people decide who will lead the country and determine the tide for the next 4 years at least. At present, that is the largest and most pressing issue and takes precedent. Running for leader of the free world shouldn't be put on hold to deal with a crisis that is being handled fine without them. Ability to prioritize, see things in perspective and multi-task all make great qualities in a leader. But I guess you can't be a leader if you weren't in the military right? That is unless you're John Kerry.

[DeV]

I see no need to cancel a much planned for and anticipated presidential debate. Why? It's called multi-tasking. While this is an extremely important piece of legislation, it's not as if their input won't be either requested or considered objectively if volunteered.

Personally, I'm looking forward to the VP debate with each passing day.

[Gan]

Oh good god. It's an insult to anyone who's been in the service to hint that rushing into a situation that you don't have a firm grasp on is something you're taught in the military. I guess my dad who served over 20 years wasn't "taught" correctly since he agrees McCain is not behaving rationally about this in the slight.
Question: Who's your father voting for?


If you honestly believe that 40 days out from an election, both or even just one candidate running for President will leave their campaign politics out of ANYTHING they do that the American public will see, then you're incredibly naive.
So you think McCain is being completely disingenuous with this? That makes me chuckle.


The bill is not going to collapse without them and election politics could do a LOT to seriously harm the bipartisan efforts being made. Both Senators are doing their jobs by voicing concerns for parts that they take issue with, praising parts that they agree with, and then voting accordingly when the time comes. But the people who are negotiating and working to come to an agreement don't need campaign politics muddying up the water.
THANK GOD you're here to be the ray of clarity in this fiasco. I bet we'll see you on TV next touting a solution to this crisis. Please tell George hello when you call the white house and let him know that Reid et. al. all have it under control and that nobody else is needed. They all have fast jets and can come running when they're called right? ROFLCOPTER


Also, the debates are to help the American people decide who will lead the country and determine the tide for the next 4 years at least. At present, that is the largest and most pressing issue and takes precedent. Running for leader of the freeworld shouldn't be put on hold to deal with a crisis that is being handled fine without you.
So postponing (not canceling) the debate a week will make a huge difference?
Which person would you want to elect as fire chief? One who runs to the fire to help put it out or one who just sits back and says "Call me if you need me"?

[Tsa`ah]

I'm imposing blame on Obama for refusing the town hall debates.

That's an attempt to deflect the current issue and lay the blame for McCain's action at the feet of Obama.

Every single election year the candidates haggle about debate forums and the style of debate. Every year candidates seek the most beneficial setting, topic, and style.


I'm mocking the attempt at trashing McCain for delaying this upcoming debate for the want of being in Washington so this financial mess can be worked out.

Tell me then, what good will McCain do? He isn't on a single committee that has squat to do with the economy. Tell me what he's going to do as a Senator after not doing his job for close to a year?

The only thing McCain can do at this point is slow the process and inject politics into it. That's it.

If he can't answer the phone when congress actually needs him ... what makes you think he's even fit for the oval office?

What the hell is he going to do as president? Suspend his presidency in order to help congress?

[Tsa`ah]

Personally, I'm looking forward to the VP debate with each passing day.

Not going to happen. Palin is going to suspend the campaign, and thus the debate, because there's going to be some foreign affairs disaster that requires her direct involvement.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

Question: Who's your father voting for?

He was voting for McCain until the last two weeks hit (OMG I DONT COME FROM A HARDCORE LIBERAL FAMILY!!one1). Now he says unless McCain pulls something major out of his ass or Obama seriously fucks up, he's voting Obama. There you have it.


So you think McCain is being completely disingenuous with this? That makes me chuckle.

Yes, I think McCain is trying to use this for political gain. I can't blame him for it, and say it's entirely unexpected, but I can say I think it's a bullshit move.


THANK GOD you're here to be the ray of clarity in this fiasco. I bet we'll see you on TV next touting a solution to this crisis. Please tell George hello when you call the white house and let him know that Reid et. al. all have it under control and that nobody else is needed. They all have fast jets and can come running when they're called right? ROFLCOPTER

Other politicians have said that they're doing just fine without Obama and McCain, not to mention relevant additions and subtractions have been made without either Senator needing to be there and yell them down. Apparently basic logic translates into something outlandish that you're not able to understand but I can't say I'm surprised.

In your world, "Senators with more economic experience and not in a campaign season should be the ones who negotiate a bipartisan bill" = OMG THIS BITCH THINKS SHE KNOWS EVERYTHING. Good to know how your mind works.


So postponing (not canceling) the debate a week will make a huge difference?
Which person would you want to elect as fire chief? One who runs to the fire to help put it out or one who just sits back and says "Call me if you need me"?

If it pushes all of the debates back, then yes, this close to the election it could make a big difference. Especially giving Palin an extra week to prep for the VP debate, given how unsure a lot of people are about her and how little media time she's had.

And who would I elect as Fire Chief? The one who knows what the fuck he's doing and doesn't act like a chicken with a sliced off head in a crisis. A more apt example would be that you have two guys who aren't trained to fight fires to elect as a Fire Chief, who do you elect? The one who recognizes that he's not an expert and delegates responsibility to those who are, or the one who grabs a cup of water and charges into the flaming building alone?

But I'm not surprised that being able to delegate, let alone multi-task effectively isn't a priority, given we elected a president twice who can't think and eat a pretzel at the same time. But no Gan, you're totally right-- politics has nothing to do with McCain's actions! NO WAY!

[Gan]

That's an attempt to deflect the current issue and lay the blame for McCain's action at the feet of Obama.

Every single election year the candidates haggle about debate forums and the style of debate. Every year candidates seek the most beneficial setting, topic, and style.
Politics aside, wouldnt you agree that the more opportunities to debate the better?




Tell me then, what good will McCain do? He isn't on a single committee that has squat to do with the economy. Tell me what he's going to do as a Senator after not doing his job for close to a year? I didnt realize that only committees were the ones who voted a measure into a law.


The only thing McCain can do at this point is slow the process and inject politics into it. That's it. And be there to lend his influence or anything else he can contribute. I didnt realize that if politicians were not sitting in their respective chair or committee that they were not effective or needed. Go figure.


If he can't answer the phone when congress actually needs him ... what makes you think he's even fit for the oval office?

What the hell is he going to do as president? Suspend his presidency in order to help congress? And yet you chastise him for putting his campaign on hold in order to go to Washington to help with this crisis. To do his job as a Senator.

Amazing.

[Tsa`ah]

Politics aside, wouldnt you agree that the more opportunities to debate the better?

For us? Absolutely. Of course your question simply magnifies McCain's disaster of a choice. For the candidate(s) ... not at all.



I didnt realize that only committees were the ones who voted a measure into a law.

You realize you're trying to play both sides of the fence between two threads ... right?

How long does it take to vote? He doesn't have to be on capitol hill, or even in the beltway to lend his input, to voice his objections ... just to vote.


And be there to lend his influence or anything else he can contribute. I didnt realize that if politicians were not sitting in their respective chair or committee that they were not effective or needed. Go figure.
And yet you chastise him for putting his campaign on hold in order to go to Washington to help with this crisis. To do his job as a Senator.

Amazing.

He hasn't done his job as a Senator in about a year ... suddenly he has an urge to. Absent of that, the last bit just agreed with me. If he doesn't have to be on a committee to influence it or contribute ... he can do just as much over the phone.

Your argument is weak.

[DeV]

Not going to happen. Palin is going to suspend the campaign, and thus the debate, because there's going to be some foreign affairs disaster that requires her direct involvement.I'm really hoping the Obama camp doesn't cave in to this bullshit.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

I'm really hoping the Obama camp doesn't cave in to this bullshit.

I don't think they will unless public opinion suddenly swings opposite of where it's currently going.

I also think that debate committee will fight McCain tooth and nail on this and hope they'll do so no matter what.

[Gan]

For us? Absolutely. Of course your question simply magnifies McCain's disaster of a choice. For the candidate(s) ... not at all.
So you would agree that by not partaking in the town hall debates, Obama did a disservice to the voting public? And by not partaking in the town hall debates - perhaps the focus being placed on the one being delayed would not be that significant? Debate early, debate often.



You realize you're trying to play both sides of the fence between two threads ... right?
Enlighten me to this perception of yours.


How long does it take to vote? He doesn't have to be on capitol hill, or even in the beltway to lend his input, to voice his objections ... just to vote.
Since you're the one saying he's not needed, you tell me (us) these intricacies of being a Senator in the US Senate.


He hasn't done his job as a Senator in about a year ... suddenly he has an urge to. Absent of that, the last bit just agreed with me. If he doesn't have to be on a committee to influence it or contribute ... he can do just as much over the phone.
Huge difference in campaigning during a non-crisis and campaigning in a crisis. Wouldnt you agree?
Is it ok for you to be away from your hotel during slow times? What about when you have a fire, or some other form of catastrophe or crisis? I think you know the answer to that.


Your argument is weak.
As appears yours.

[Tsa`ah]

I think it was "take the retard pill" day for republicans today.

[Gan]

He was voting for McCain until the last two weeks hit (OMG I DONT COME FROM A HARDCORE LIBERAL FAMILY!!one1). Now he says unless McCain pulls something major out of his ass or Obama seriously fucks up, he's voting Obama. There you have it.
Thats what I thought. Thanks for confirming that. ;)



Yes, I think McCain is trying to use this for political gain. I can't blame him for it, and say it's entirely unexpected, but I can say I think it's a bullshit move.
Let me guess, you're voting for Obama too. ;)




Other politicians have said that they're doing just fine without Obama and McCain, not to mention relevant additions and subtractions have been made without either Senator needing to be there and yell them down. Apparently basic logic translates into something outlandish that you're not able to understand but I can't say I'm surprised.
Name me one GOP leader who has said that. I can name you at least 3 high ranking DNP leaders who have predictably said it. Partisan politics, something for you to consider.


In your world, "Senators with more economic experience and not in a campaign season should be the ones who negotiate a bipartisan bill" = OMG THIS BITCH THINKS SHE KNOWS EVERYTHING. Good to know how your mind works.
In my world, I dont presume to know the scope and detail of what others do for a living. I simply have expectations of them to do their job when they are required to. Moreso in times of crisis.


If it pushes all of the debates back, then yes, this close to the election it could make a big difference. Especially giving Palin an extra week to prep for the VP debate, given how unsure a lot of people are about her and how little media time she's had.
So 7 days is magically going to make Palin know more about the issues? Have a better camera presence? The same for McCain? Are you serious?


And who would I elect as Fire Chief? The one who knows what the fuck he's doing and doesn't act like a chicken with a sliced off head in a crisis. A more apt example would be that you have two guys who aren't trained to fight fires to elect as a Fire Chief, who do you elect? The one who recognizes that he's not an expert and delegates responsibility to those who are, or the one who grabs a cup of water and charges into the flaming building alone?
LOL I see what you did there. Good one. Only I see Obama holding a cup of water ready to douse the fire from half a continenent away with a cell phone in the there hand to take that 'call'. I see McCain standing on the sidelines ready to jump in when needed. There's that perception thing again.


But I'm not surprised that being able to delegate, let alone multi-task effectively isn't a priority, given we elected a president twice who can't think and eat a pretzel at the same time. But no Gan, you're totally right-- politics has nothing to do with McCain's actions! NO WAY!
Right, that didnt sound biased at all. In any way.

:facepalm:

Good luck in November.

[Gan]

I think it was "take the retard pill" day for republicans today.
Obviously it is the puke on the PC day for the democrats. Glad you could make your contribution.

[Tsa`ah]

Obviously it is the puke on the PC day for the democrats. Glad you could make your contribution.

The problem is that (aside from making the same classic PB blunder in political affiliation) your logic is very circular in rebuttal. Case in point ...


So you would agree that by not partaking in the town hall debates, Obama did a disservice to the voting public? And by not partaking in the town hall debates - perhaps the focus being placed on the one being delayed would not be that significant? Debate early, debate often.

See ... McCain wanted the debates early on. Obama didn't see the need (and after Saddleback ... why would you unless McCain agreed to the same style at a union hall where he went first and Obama could just sit in the audience until his turn). McCain doesn't want to debate now ... in fact no one would bat an eye in surprise if he cancelled the rest of them.

You are attempting to argue for McCain's action while arguing against Obama's. The difference is that both candidates finally agreed on the debate schedule and McCain is making excuses ... not Obama.

The argument goes beyond the realm of retardation.


Since you're the one saying he's not needed, you tell me (us) these intricacies of being a Senator in the US Senate.

Are you seriously trying to suggest that McCain can make any sort of contribution on the floor that he can't over the phone or via satellite? Your argument is still circular.


Huge difference in campaigning during a non-crisis and campaigning in a crisis. Wouldnt you agree?

No, I would not ... not in the least. By your own argument this is taking away the opportunity of the people to judge either candidate. This is exactly the time to campaign ... and do one's job as a senator. Not one or the either.


Is it ok for you to be away from your hotel during slow times? What about when you have a fire, or some other form of catastrophe or crisis? I think you know the answer to that.

You're making an inapplicable comparison. McCain is not the president. The buck stops with me and my business. Were there over 100 partners, the assertion would make sense. There is very little, if anything, McCain can do outside of robbing the people by returning to his job.

You'll probably come to understand this when you tire from chasing your tail around the bush.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

Thats what I thought. Thanks for confirming that. ;)


Let me guess, you're voting for Obama too. ;)



Name me one GOP leader who has said that. I can name you at least 3 high ranking DNP leaders who have predictably said it. Partisan politics, something for you to consider.

In my world, I dont presume to know the scope and detail of what others do for a living. I simply have expectations of them to do their job when they are required to. Moreso in times of crisis.

So 7 days is magically going to make Palin know more about the issues? Have a better camera presence? The same for McCain? Are you serious?

LOL I see what you did there. Good one. Only I see Obama holding a cup of water ready to douse the fire from half a continenent away with a cell phone in the there hand to take that 'call'. I see McCain standing on the sidelines ready to jump in when needed. There's that perception thing again.

Right, that didnt sound biased at all. In any way.

:facepalm:

Good luck in November.

And you're voting for McCain? What the fuck does it have to do with anything? I'm talking right now to someone who likes McCain/Palin and agrees with my assessment of the situation. OMG CONSPIRACY?!one1

And try Boehner as one who's said they're close to an agreement as it is-- and without McCain being there to negotiate. But clearly he's a dumb Obamaniac and doesn't know what he's talking about. The bill is srys business and how dare anyone interfere with this totally altruistic move on McCain's part! Also, LOL at "I don't presume to know what others do for a living." If you don't know what a President or any politician needs to do for a living then please keep your retarded ass away from a voting booth, thx. I guess you know enough that any contribution McCain makes ABSOLUTELY MUST BE IN PERSON! You know, not via phone or any other communication medium. No, instead he must cancel all of his campaign stuff and fly off to DC immediately (or you know, do a bunch of stuff and then fly out the next day, same difference) to negotiate a bill that's being negotiated by more qualified people and working smoothly without him. Though I guess now we're gonna hear about thinking that he do something remotely is an insult to him being a POW.

A whole extra week to study and cram for the debate? Yeah, that could make a big difference. Even an extra 24 hours to get polished up further can make a big difference. This isn't like they're delaying a dinner party, ffs.

Considering McCain is already demanding to be allowed to charge into that metaphorical burning building holding his teeny little metaphorical water cup, I'm really interested to know how you equate Obama as being in that position-- since Obama is the one who's on the sidelines, giving input where he feels he can and then letting the EXPERTS (and you know, people on things like the Senate Banking Committee) take care of business.

Oh.. and, I'll always go for a rimshot at Bush, sorry that it hurts your feelings. I despise him and no matter who wins in November I'll be glad when that tool is out of the White House. Thank god a lot of the country feels the same way.

[Gan]

The problem is that (aside from making the same classic PB blunder in political affiliation) your logic is very circular in rebuttal. Case in point ...



See ... McCain wanted the debates early on. Obama didn't see the need (and after Saddleback ... why would you unless McCain agreed to the same style at a union hall where he went first and Obama could just sit in the audience until his turn). McCain doesn't want to debate now ... in fact no one would bat an eye in surprise if he cancelled the rest of them.
So all 10 or so invitations at the early debates were exactly cause and effect as you stated? Really?


You are attempting to argue for McCain's action while arguing against Obama's. The difference is that both candidates finally agreed on the debate schedule and McCain is making excuses ... not Obama.

The argument goes beyond the realm of retardation. Whats retarded is applying the same standard thinking everything else is the same. Last I checked, we were not calling for such a crisis in our markets as we are now, back then. If we did not have a crisis on our hands that required immediate action from politicians then I would agree with you completely. But thats not the case, on either part.




Are you seriously trying to suggest that McCain can make any sort of contribution on the floor that he can't over the phone or via satellite? Your argument is still circular. Senator Tsa'ah, I did not realize that you knew so much about the workings of the House and Senate in Washington. Silly me, I simply thought you were a hotelier and part time farmer.




No, I would not ... not in the least. By your own argument this is taking away the opportunity of the people to judge either candidate. This is exactly the time to campaign ... and do one's job as a senator. Not one or the either. Postpone != taking away the opportunity for the people to judge.
Cancel = taking away.
Last I checked, McCain still intends to go through with the debate.




You're making an inapplicable comparison. McCain is not the president. The buck stops with me and my business. Were there over 100 partners, the assertion would make sense. There is very little, if anything, McCain can do outside of robbing the people by returning to his job. So would you require your managers to report to work if something catastrophic occur to your hotel?


You'll probably come to understand this when you tire from chasing your tail around the bush. You speak from experience with this?

[Tsa`ah]

I think today you earn the "right over your head" award.

Your chasing your tail trying to pin this on Obama, and at the same time (despite your argument) commending McCain on not being able to be a Senator and a presidential candidate simultaneously.

[Gan]

And you're voting for McCain? What the fuck does it have to do with anything? I'm talking right now to someone who likes McCain/Palin and agrees with my assessment of the situation. OMG CONSPIRACY?!one1
Funny, I spoke with an Obamamaniac this morning who wants Obama front and center in Washington. ZOMG CONSPIRACYBACKATJOO!


And try Boehner as one who's said they're close to an agreement as it is-- and without McCain being there to negotiate. But clearly he's a dumb Obamaniac and doesn't know what he's talking about. The bill is srys business and how dare anyone interfere with this totally altruistic move on McCain's part! Also, LOL at "I don't presume to know what others do for a living." If you don't know what a President or any politician needs to do for a living then please keep your retarded ass away from a voting booth, thx. I guess you know enough that any contribution McCain makes ABSOLUTELY MUST BE IN PERSON! You know, not via phone or any other communication medium. No, instead he must cancel all of his campaign stuff and fly off to DC immediately (or you know, do a bunch of stuff and then fly out the next day, same difference) to negotiate a bill that's being negotiated by more qualified people and working smoothly without him. Though I guess now we're gonna hear about thinking that he do something remotely is an insult to him being a POW.
I cant wait to see your book on the inner workings of Congress. And you still did not provide one member of the GOP that said "stay away". My point still stands.


A whole extra week to study and cram for the debate? Yeah, that could make a big difference. Even an extra 24 hours to get polished up further can make a big difference. This isn't like they're delaying a dinner party, ffs.
If someone as experienced as Biden fears giving Palin one extra week of preparation then I'm seriously laughing at his selection as VP. Not that Biden would be spending the time NOT preparing either. The same could be said for Obama and McCain. Sorry if that logic fails you.


Considering McCain is already demanding to be allowed to charge into that metaphorical burning building holding his teeny little metaphorical water cup, I'm really interested to know how you equate Obama as being in that position-- since Obama is the one who's on the sidelines, giving input where he feels he can and then letting the EXPERTS (and you know, people on things like the Senate Banking Committee) take care of business.
Yes, wanting to lead is such a bad quality. Shame on McCain for wanting to jump in. He should just sit back in Mississippi and they should just call him if they need him. ROFFLE


Oh.. and, I'll always go for a rimshot at Bush, sorry that it hurts your feelings. I despise him and no matter who wins in November I'll be glad when that tool is out of the White House. Thank god a lot of the country feels the same way.
Thats no suprise sugartits. I'm glad there's just as much pragmatic and responsible people who dont agree with you as do. Believe you me I'm glad. :)

[Gan]

I think today you earn the "right over your head" award.

Your chasing your tail trying to pin this on Obama, and at the same time (despite your argument) commending McCain on not being able to be a Senator and a presidential candidate simultaneously.
Way to address the points.

You're as flavorful (as shit can be) as ever.

:clap:

[Warriorbird]

I love how every strategic move is totally political to you unless McCain does it, Gan.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

Funny, I spoke with an Obamamaniac this morning who wants Obama front and center in Washington. ZOMG CONSPIRACYBACKATJOO!

I'm not the one being paranoid like you, so that's great. Your argument of "OMG BUT UR VOTING FOR OBAMA" is plain retarded. Right now you're coming across as having your lips firmly sealed to McCain's ass no matter what he decides to shit out. Cute.


I cant wait to see your book on the inner workings of Congress. And you still did not provide one member of the GOP that said "stay away". My point still stands.

Not really. And again, if you can't figure out the jobs our politicians are supposed to do I think it'd be a good idea for you to sit out this election.

You're trying to argue that he's needed there and will do good-- there's been people on both sides saying that's just not so. McCain is not needed there and the more pressing issue is the Presidency, at least it should be for him. Why, oh why, does he need to be there IN PERSON when the negotiations were taking place just fine without him and will likely wrap up without him having a seat? Is there some reason why he can't be like all the other Senators and continue their delegated projects while giving their input remotely?


If someone as experienced as Biden fears giving Palin one extra week of preparation then I'm seriously laughing at his selection as VP. Not that Biden would be spending the time NOT preparing either. The same could be said for Obama and McCain. Sorry if that logic fails you.

It's about being ready to go and prepared, especially when you've known MONTHS IN ADVANCE WHAT THE DATE IS. Call it semantics if you want but for a campaign that's running on having more experience and ability to handle a situation than the other guys, it's rather stupid to not be prepared in advance and pretty much nulls that idea. Either she's ready or she's not, and I see no reason why something that was mutually decided upon quite a while ago should be taken back because they don't think she's ready. In fact I think it's pretty damn unfair to Sarah Palin because this shows how little confidence they have in her ability. Yeah, I think Biden is gonna mop the floor with her but babying her is doing nothing to assure the American people she's ready. I want to hear what she has to say (crazy, I know) before the two weeks leading up to November 4th.. so do a lot of other people!


Yes, wanting to lead is such a bad quality. Shame on McCain for wanting to jump in. He should just sit back in Mississippi and they should just call him if they need him. ROFFLE

Are you eating shrooms? I mean really, first you make it sound like McCain is being all heroic, then you make it sound like he's being measured and Obama is the one being erratic, and now you're not denying that he's indeed charging into that burning house.

Wanting to lead is a good quality, but isn't some infallible virtue when that desire translates into stupid behavior. And you're yet to explain why McCain can't do both at the same time and why he needs to be physically there for the negotiations.


Thats no suprise sugartits. I'm glad there's just as much pragmatic and responsible people who dont agree with you as do. Believe you me I'm glad. :)

I guess Bush is super popular and most people are sad to see him go..And you know, a ton of people on both sides don't want the debates to actually continue as scheduled.. and the poll numbers going up for Obama and down for McCain, I'm sure that's all in our heads.

Simply put, you are wrong. Obviously you're not gonna see the light on this one but thank God you're not the one who gets to call the shots on the debate-- and so far, the debates are going to continue as scheduled and without delay. Hurrah.

[Gan]

I love how every strategic move is totally political to you unless McCain does it, Gan.

I believe I have already stated that this was also a political move.

Nice try.

[Gan]

I'm not the one being paranoid like you, so that's great. Your argument of "OMG BUT UR VOTING FOR OBAMA" is plain retarded. Right now you're coming across as having your lips firmly sealed to McCain's ass no matter what he decides to shit out. Cute.
So that would mean you have your lips wrapped around... ?
Be careful opening that door.



Not really. And again, if you can't figure out the jobs our politicians are supposed to do I think it'd be a good idea for you to sit out this election. My minor in college was political science. And I still do not know all the inner workings of the Senate. What education can you claim to know everything that happens in chambers? I'll save you some effort here, you cant claim all knowledge - which is the point I'm getting at. And believe me, I'll be voting. ;)


You're trying to argue that he's needed there and will do good-- there's been people on both sides saying that's just not so.
I've asked for this twice. Put up your source or quit using it as an empty argument.


McCain is not needed there and the more pressing issue is the Presidency, at least it should be for him. Why, oh why, does he need to be there IN PERSON when the negotiations were taking place just fine without him and will likely wrap up without him having a seat? Is there some reason why he can't be like all the other Senators and continue their delegated projects while giving their input remotely? Thank you for your opinion. I'll stick with mine. I want EVERY congressman in washington right now. I've already said that, and it is not just exclusive of McCain. Washington helped screw this up, they need to have their asses there to help fix it.



It's about being ready to go and prepared, especially when you've known MONTHS IN ADVANCE WHAT THE DATE IS. Call it semantics if you want but for a campaign that's running on having more experience and ability to handle a situation than the other guys, it's rather stupid to not be prepared in advance and pretty much nulls that idea. Either she's ready or she's not, and I see no reason why something that was mutually decided upon quite a while ago should be taken back because they don't think she's ready. In fact I think it's pretty damn unfair to Sarah Palin because this shows how little confidence they have in her ability. Yeah, I think Biden is gonna mop the floor with her but babying her is doing nothing to assure the American people she's ready. I want to hear what she has to say (crazy, I know) before the two weeks leading up to November 4th.. so do a lot of other people! LIKE WE KNEW MONTHS IN ADVANCE THAT OUR FINANCIAL MARKETS WOULD TAKE A SHITTER THE EXACT SAME WEEK AS THE DEBATES!!! zomg conspiracy!!11 Open your eyes?



Are you eating shrooms? I mean really, first you make it sound like McCain is being all heroic, then you make it sound like he's being measured and Obama is the one being erratic, and now you're not denying that he's indeed charging into that burning house. I've never said he's charging into a burning house. That was your analagy. Are you huffing paint?


Wanting to lead is a good quality, but isn't some infallible virtue when that desire translates into stupid behavior. And you're yet to explain why McCain can't do both at the same time and why he needs to be physically there for the negotiations. I didnt realize that we were all supposed to go by your definition of stupid behavior. To me THAT sounds like stupid behavior.



Simply put, you are wrong. Obviously you're not gonna see the light on this one but thank God you're not the one who gets to call the shots on the debate-- and so far, the debates are going to continue as scheduled and without delay. Hurrah. Simply put, I think you're wrong! WHOA! See what I did there? Obviously you're not going to see the light on this one but thank God you're not the one who gets to call the shots on the debate-- and so far, the debates are going to continue as scheduled without delay. Hurrah. Tell me how stupid Obama will look if he's the only one standing at the podium tonight. ;)

[ElanthianSiren]

Okay, so that's fine... Obama and McCain are needed in Washington direly. I believe McCain believes that.

But why do we need to SUSPEND campaigns?

Isn't that the role of the VP to take over for the president in times when the president is otherwise occupied?

Edit: Palin should be stepping up and acting more vice presidential if this is what McCain needs to do IMO.

Editedit: the whole thing about pulling ads really baffles me.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

So that would mean you have your lips wrapped around... ? Be careful opening that door.

Currently a carrot stick, but thanks for inquiring. I don't have any reason to be worried though-- I've already voiced things I don't like about Obama and don't defend him when he does something outright retarded (unlike your defense of McCain at this moment).


My minor in college was political science. And I still do not know all the inner workings of the Senate. What education can you claim to know everything that happens in chambers? I'll save you some effort here, you cant claim all knowledge - which is the point I'm getting at. And believe me, I'll be voting. ;)

And where did I ever claim all knowledge? Oh wait, that'd be never. You're trying to use an irrelevant, far-reaching idea (judging people is wrong!! spare me the self-righteousness) and splitting hairs over something that doesn't even matter. I don't have to know everything that goes on behind closed doors to know the gist of what our politicians need to do, and what I do need to know I can easily look up.

The negotiation started without McCain and didn't have McCain's presence while it was progressing (and progressing in a positive way). I don't need 4 years of political science to make the conclusion that any input John McCain wants to have, he doesn't need to physically be there for. And that any input he does make (or Obama makes) like it or not will be carefully measured due to the fact they are campaigning. Everything right now is political for them both, it doesn't take a genius to figure that out.


I've asked for this twice. Put up your source or quit using it as an empty argument.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/09/25/politics/washingtonpost/main4477380.shtml
http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/election2008/2008-09-24-mccain-debate_N.htm
http://www.politico.com/blogs/thecrypt/0908/Frank_Republicans_winced_when_McCain_was_mentioned _in_meeting.html


Of course logic, and the liberal media, is conspiring against McCain.. BLACK HELICOPTERS.

In turn though, how about you give me some of what you'd consider proof that McCain's presence will make much difference with this bill.


Thank you for your opinion. I'll stick with mine. I want EVERY congressman in washington right now. I've already said that, and it is not just exclusive of McCain. Washington helped screw this up, they need to have their asses there to help fix it.

Because the more people you pack into a kitchen, the faster dinner gets cooked.

Have you stopped and considered, objectively, why you want everyone back in Washington? Everyone to sit in and get to squabble on these meetings that have been repeatedly said to be "very delicate".. Sure it'll make you feel fuzzy inside but it doesn't. do. anything.

Not to mention you don't need to physically be there to contribute. Why the hell is physical geography so important in fixing a problem that has nothing to do with who's physically in DC right now or not? Is there some huge difference between McCain saying over the phone, "I disagree with this" than saying it in person? I mean besides the fact that in-person would mean possibly postponing the debates and halting the campaigns.


LIKE WE KNEW MONTHS IN ADVANCE THAT OUR FINANCIAL MARKETS WOULD TAKE A SHITTER THE EXACT SAME WEEK AS THE DEBATES!!! zomg conspiracy!!11 Open your eyes?

No, but again, does the entire country grind to a halt over this? Should it? No. Shit happens, you should learn to multi-task if you want to be the leader of the free world.


I've never said he's charging into a burning house. That was your analagy. Are you huffing paint?

Rofl, You can't even keep your analysis of his demeanor straight.


I didnt realize that we were all supposed to go by your definition of stupid behavior. To me THAT sounds like stupid behavior.

Haha, wow Gan. Just wow. Contrary to what you believe, I think there are some baselines to stupid behavior.. you know, the sort of thing that underlies why we have these things called ethics, etc. Fairly commonly held standards of behavior and judgment and logic.. but no, if McCain does it it must be right. Circular logic ftl.


Tell me how stupid Obama will look if he's the only one standing at the podium tonight. ;)

Not nearly as stupid as McCain will look standing in DC with his thumb up his ass instead of at the debate he knew would take place months in advance. Since, you know, he's not the one who can negotiate this bill anyway.

[Gan]

Okay, so that's fine... Obama and McCain are needed in Washington direly. I believe McCain believes that.

But why do we need to SUSPEND campaigns?

Isn't that the role of the VP to take over for the president in times when the president is otherwise occupied?

Edit: Palin should be stepping up and acting more vice presidential if this is what McCain needs to do IMO.

Editedit: the whole thing about pulling ads really baffles me.

The campaign suspension and pulling of ads is a political move.

[CrystalTears]

I don't understand what's stupid about wanting to do your job and deal with an issue and postpone something that can wait a week.

[Tsa`ah]

You're confusing postpone and cancel.

If you can't handle doing your job as a Senator (which he hasn't been doing) and running a campaign ... how in the hell is he going to perform the duties of the CiC?

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

I don't understand what's stupid about wanting to do your job and deal with an issue and postpone something that can wait a week.

Or do your job which includes doing multiple things at once?

[ElanthianSiren]

The campaign suspension and pulling of ads is a political move.

Then it's a dumb move because the most logical question then follows of... where the hell is his VP candidate? I need that pic that Cephalis sometimes posted of dumb and dumber for this election season. I'm going to have a coronary I swear.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

Eh, I'm just glad that the debate is continuing anyway at this point.

[crb]

Just because you can do multiple things at once doesn't mean you shouldn't focus on and respect a problem that has a certain enormity to it.

Are these the same liberals who criticized Bush for finishing reading a story to children after a plane hit the WTC?

And, pray tell, how exactly could (this is all moot anyways, Obama is at the whitehouse right now) Obama focus on this problem while giving a speech at a rally. Is he Hiro? Hiro isn't a black dude, Hiro is an asian dude.

Don't get me wrong, I think it is great Obama can walk and chew gum at the same time, someone give that fella a gold star. But I'd rather have a guy who doesn't compare a huge financial crisis to chewing gum as president.

In the end, it is about respect. Do you respect the problem enough to give it your undivided attention?

Ladies (and ashliana), riddle me this, do you like it when your husband/boyfriend turns on say... Sportcenter during sex? Are you amazed at his amazing ability to multitask? Or would you rather he pick whichever is most important to him, and focus on that?

Ladies? Anyone? Bueller?

[CrystalTears]

This is just stupid. If it was Obama's idea to be all proactive and postpone the debates to work on this issue, Obama supporters would be fapping and calling McCain unpresidential.

[ElanthianSiren]

I always susected men could cum over money.


That comparison is riddled with flaws. My boyfriend is way too tied up to turn on sports center, but he's also not a porn star.

[Clove]

Personally I don't think either Obama or McCain are urgently needed in the Senate. I don't think either of them have been logging much time up on Capitol Hill during the campaign and legislation has been moving on without them.

This is just marketing for both candidates. An opportunity to look involved, instrumental and concerned. Personally I'd rather see the debate on Friday.

While there's no doubt the extra time benefits all the candidates, I personally feel it benefits Palin the most. She could use every hour to polish and bone-up (and I'll volunteer to help her with the bone part) on national and international politics, policy and legislation; much more than Biden, McCain or Obama. So McCain gets to look good in front of the nation while he squeezes a little extra cram time for his VP.

Obama and Biden get to look good too (and extra prep time doesn't hurt) and even though it may be in their best interest to give Palin as little prep time as possible they can't pressure the McCain camp to go ahead with the original debate dates without having it spun back at them as being "irresponsible and unconcerned" by preferring to go to a debate which can be rescheduled instead of allowing all the "key players" to participate when they're "urgently needed".

In my opinion this is pure PR (for both sides) with the added perk of buying time for Palin to tune up her game.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

This is just stupid. If it was Obama's idea to be all proactive and postpone the debates to work on this issue, Obama supporters would be fapping and calling McCain unpresidential.

I'd be fucking pissed, actually. Just like if Obama gives in to demands to postpone I'll be really pissed.

There have been Obama supporters on this board who have gone rabid over decisions he's made that they disagree with. I don't get why this is the fall-back "defense" considering it's not really the case.

[Parkbandit]

You're confusing postpone and cancel.

If you can't handle doing your job as a Senator (which he hasn't been doing) and running a campaign ... how in the hell is he going to perform the duties of the CiC?

So you are saying that Obama isn't qualified to be CiC?

[Warriorbird]

Personally I don't think either Obama or McCain are urgently needed in the Senate. I don't think either of them have been logging much time up on Capitol Hill during the campaign and legislation has been moving on without them.
-Clove

Clove... winner of 'most honest post in this thread.'

[Parkbandit]

This is just stupid. If it was Obama's idea to be all proactive and postpone the debates to work on this issue, Obama supporters would be fapping and calling McCain unpresidential.

BINGO

[DeV]

If it was Obama's idea to be all proactive and postpone the debates to work on this issue, Obama supporters would be fapping and calling McCain unpresidential. Come on now...

I'd hope the McCain camp wouldn't be putting up with that bullshit either.

[DeV]

I don't know about anyone else but I want to see a fucking debate. Nothing more, nothing less. Especially the VP one. :yes:

[CrystalTears]

Honestly I'm just tired of when this side does it it's okay but the other side does it and it's not. I realize it's all political bullshit, but it's just driving me insane.

I WANT to see the debate this Friday. I have that bitch timed to record. It doesn't mean that I think they're stupid for wanting to participate and help with an issue. They're using it for leverage of 'LOOK AT ME BEING ALL PRESIDENTIAL', yeah I get it. I'd like to see more of that too.

I was a drama major. Their acts fascinates me. The arguments here don't.

[Clove]

I don't know about anyone else but I want to see a fucking debate. Nothing more, nothing less. Especially the VP one. :yes:Me too! C'mon DeV take a "vacation from yourself" with me and explore your inner freak (and I promise to pause the freak-fest so we can watch the debate). Hey would it be easier if I tucked back for you? Put on a little rouge? Invited the Mrs? What dya say?

[Parkbandit]

I've been clear on my disdain for McCain over the years... but I think he did what he truly believed needed to be done. While I disagree with the whole drama of suspending his campaign and taking commercials off the air.. I DO believe that he went to Washington to try and do the fucking job he was elected to do.

Now.. do I think that this bailout is necessary? Not really. Printing up 700 BILLION DOLLARS in new crisp worthless currency is only delaying the crash, since it's not really reforming anything.. just throwing more money on the fire.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

I don't know about anyone else but I want to see a fucking debate. Nothing more, nothing less. Especially the VP one. :yes:

Same here.

Honestly, if I didn't feel the VP debate was being jeopardized by this request to postpone, I'd likely not care as much as I do. But Palin hasn't really had a chance yet to show her stuff and I want to see what she has to say, and I don't want to wait longer to hear it.

[DeV]

Me too! C'mon DeV take a "vacation from yourself" with me and explore your inner freak (and I promise to pause the freak-fest so we can watch the debate). Hey would it be easier if I tucked back for you? Put on a little rouge? Invited the Mrs? What dya say?
It pains me to say this because I :heart: you so much, but maybe if you grabbed a magic wand, turned yourself into any random lady on the PC (CT, for example) I'd glady fuck your brains out till your g-spot was disabled in between watching the debate and watching you squirm. And don't you worry, the misses would have her turn.

If you can't give me that, then you know what you can do with your tucked penis and face full of rouge, you man child you. You're :welcome: .

[Back]

This is just stupid. If it was Obama's idea to be all proactive and postpone the debates to work on this issue, Obama supporters would be fapping and calling McCain unpresidential.

The only problem with this reasoning is... it’s not reality.

Hate to burst that bubble.

[ClydeR]

McCain has gotten out of a lot of tough spots before when most of us had written him off. But I can't for the life of me see any way out of this mess for him. I think he's gambled one too many times.

Below is more about McCain's gambling habit. The Time article also discusses how Obama plays poker.


Over time he gave up the drinking bouts, but he never quite kicked the periodic yen for dice. In the past decade, he has played on Mississippi riverboats, on Indian land, in Caribbean craps pits and along the length of the Las Vegas Strip. Back in 2005 he joined a group of journalists at a magazine-industry conference in Puerto Rico, offering betting strategy on request. "Enjoying craps opens up a window on a central thread constant in John's life," says John Weaver, McCain's former chief strategist, who followed him to many a casino. "Taking a chance, playing against the odds." Aides say McCain tends to play for a few thousand dollars at a time and avoids taking markers, or loans, from the casinos, which he has helped regulate in Congress. "He never, ever plays on the house," says Mark Salter, a McCain adviser. The goal, say several people familiar with his habit, is never financial. He loves the thrill of winning and the camaraderie at the table.

Only recently have McCain's aides urged him to pull back from the pastime. In the heat of the G.O.P. primary fight last spring, he announced on a visit to the Vegas Strip that he was going to the casino floor. When his aides stopped him, fearing a public relations disaster, McCain suggested that they ask the casino to take a craps table to a private room, a high-roller privilege McCain had indulged in before. His aides, with alarm bells ringing, refused again, according to two accounts of the discussion.

More... (http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1819898-1,00.html)


The moment the car stopped at McCain’s hotel in downtown New Orleans, he set out at his usual fast clip for Harrah’s, across the street. McCain is an avid gambler. Wes Gullett, a close friend who worked for McCain for years, told me that they used to play craps in Las Vegas in fourteen-hour stints, standing at the tables from 10 a.m. to midnight. “Craps is addictive,” McCain remarked, and he headed for the fifteen-dollar-minimum-bet tables.

More... (http://www.newyorker.com/archive/2005/05/30/050530fa_fact_bruck?currentPage=all)

I don't approve of gambling.

[Keller]

And the whole sequence of events confirmed Treasury’s fears about the decision by Bush, at the urging of McCain, to allow presidential politics into what were already difficult negotiations.

Link: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0908/13918.html

Let me be the first to admit I think Sen. Dodd et al threw the first punch by pulling that "MISSION ACCOMPLISHED" moment on the capitol steps -- but McCain instigated the fight by affirming that, even though he has good intentions, he's got poor judgment. Neither of these men needed to be there and all they did was raise the stakes which were already dreadfully high.

Further, I think the House plan sounds like it should be explored. But my inner tin foil hat feels like it's a stunt to allow McCain to get them to the table after they make their nominal dissent to help themselves at the polls. Hopefully the electorate is smart enough to recognize what he did was talk his own party to the table to pass legislation his parties administration has piloted.

The next couple of days are going to be some of the most important, or at least the most interesting, days in any of our lives. Enjoy them.

[Clove]

It pains me to say this because I :heart: you so much, but maybe if you grabbed a magic wand, turned yourself into any random lady on the PC (CT, for example) I'd glady fuck your brains out till your g-spot was disabled in between watching the debate and watching you squirm. And don't you worry, the misses would have her turn.

If you can't give me that, then you know what you can do with your tucked penis and face full of rouge, you man child you. You're :welcome: .What if I could get CT to join? Would you do me for the "price of admission?" (and don't worry the missus would still take a turn).

[Gan]

McCain has gotten out of a lot of tough spots before when most of us had written him off. But I can't for the life of me see any way out of this mess for him. I think he's gambled one too many times.

Below is more about McCain's gambling habit. The Time article also discusses how Obama plays poker.





I don't approve of gambling.

If nobody takes you seriously, why do you even post?

Oh wait, its called Backlash syndrome.

Nevermind.

[Gan]

Link: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0908/13918.html

Let me be the first to admit I think Sen. Dodd et al threw the first punch by pulling that "MISSION ACCOMPLISHED" moment on the capitol steps -- but McCain instigated the fight by affirming that, even though he has good intentions, he's got poor judgment. Neither of these men needed to be there and all they did was raise the stakes which were already dreadfully high.

Further, I think the House plan sounds like it should be explored. But my inner tin foil hat feels like it's a stunt to allow McCain to get them to the table after they make their nominal dissent to help themselves at the polls. Hopefully the electorate is smart enough to recognize what he did was talk his own party to the table to pass legislation his parties administration has piloted.

The next couple of days are going to be some of the most important, or at least the most interesting, days in any of our lives. Enjoy them.

Agreeing on principles

Earlier in the afternoon on Thursday, the mood on on Capitol Hill was very different.

Frank, Sen. Christopher Dodd, D-Conn., and other key lawmakers negotiating with Paulson announced that they had reached agreement on a set of principles for legislation to enact the historic proposal.
The bailout proposal - the most dramatic government intervention in the financial system since the Great Depression - calls for the Treasury Department to buy up bad mortgage securities from banks in an effort to get them to lend again.

The proposal, as amended by leaders in both chambers, will help homeowners, curb executive pay packages at participating firms and provide oversight of Treasury's actions, Dodd said in a lunchtime address.

"We've reached a fundamental agreement on a set of principles, one, for taxpayers, which is tremendously important," he said. "We're very confident we can act expeditiously."

A few hours later, after a widely anticipated White House meeting at which Bush said he expected a deal could be crafted "very shortly," the negotiations had broken down.

Details on the plans
The principles the Democrats said had been agreed upon call for Congress to make $250 billion available immediately with $100 billion available, if needed, without requiring additional congressional approval, said two senior Democratic aides familiar with the negotiations. The second half of $350 billion would then become available by a special approval of Congress.

On executive compensation, the draft would require limits on compensation for executives of any company participating in the bailout. These caps would apply for as long as the company is in the program.

This would include some language to limit excess "golden parachutes."
Treasury would also get an equity stake in the companies being helped by the bailout, though what type remains to be worked out.

But House Republicans are not on board, according to Minority Leader Rep. John Boehner, R-Ohio.

"House Republicans have not agreed to any plan at this point," Boehner said Thursday.

Instead, they issued a statement of economic rescue principles that calls for Wall Street to fund the recovery by injecting private capital - not taxpayer dollars - into the financial markets. Easing tax laws would prompt investors to put in their own dollars, they said.

The plan also calls for: participating firms to disclose the value of the mortgage assets on their books, ending Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac's securitization of "unsound mortgages," reviewing the performance of the credit rating agencies and having the Securities and Exchange Commission audit failed companies to ensure their financial standing was accurately portrayed.

House Republicans also want to create a panel to make recommendations for reforming the financial industry by year's end.

Meanwhile, the ranking Republican on the Senate Banking Committee has another idea. Sen. Richard Shelby, R-Ala., said he doesn't support the Treasury plan until there is serious consideration of alternatives. He proposed Thursday adding funds to the Federal Reserve and Treasury to allow them to lend more to financial institutions.

http://money.cnn.com/2008/09/26/news/economy/bailout_talks/index.htm?cnn=yes

[Gan]

WASHINGTON (AFP)--Republican White House hopeful Sen. John McCain denied Thursday there ever had been any deal in place between Congress and the White House on a $700-billion Wall Street bailout plan.

McCain said on ABC News after talks at the White House that also included his Democratic rival Sen. Barack Obama that he still hoped to go to the scheduled presidential debate Friday night in Mississippi.

But his senior campaign adviser Steve Schmidt accused Obama of putting himself before his country, by continuing to run campaign ads while the high-stakes political drama over the economic crisis was playing out.

McCain said he knew going into the White House meeting called by President Bush that there was no deal, after having said Wednesday the debate should be canceled if a bailout wasn't secured.

"I knew going in, because I had been over on the House side with my House Republican colleagues, there never was a deal," McCain said. "But I do believe the meeting was important to move the process along."

Democrats accused McCain of unhelpful grandstanding and poisoning the process with presidential politics by putting his campaign on hold and returning to Washington, with a deal apparently almost in place.
But Schmidt said McCain was working to persuade enough lawmakers to support the package.

"The problem right now is that any rescue package has to pass by a majority vote," Schmidt told reporters outside McCain's campaign headquarters in Arlington, Va.

"There is not yet a majority of Democrats or Republicans who are willing to vote yes for anything," he said. "The votes at this hour do not yet exist."

Schmidt also accused Obama of buying up time vacated by McCain on TV networks for campaign advertisements, when the Republican made up his mind to pull down his ads Wednesday.

"It is an example once again of Sen. McCain putting his country first, while Senator Obama puts Senator Obama first," Schmidt said.

http://www.nasdaq.com/aspxcontent/NewsStory.aspx?cpath=20080925\ACQDJON200809251939D OWJONESDJONLINE000948.htm&SourceCode=&mypage=newsheadlines&title=McCain%20Says%20There%20%27Never%20Was%20A%2 0Deal%27%20On%20Wall%20Street%20Bailout

[Kefka]

Might as well change the title:

McCain seeks delay in bailout to keep away from the debates.

[Kefka]

Frank blames House GOP for breakdown of deal

WASHINGTON - The chairman of the House Financial Services Committee declared Friday that an agreement on legislation to relieve a spreading financial crisis depends on House Republicans "dropping this revolt" against President Bush.

Rep. Barney Frank said leading Democrats on Capitol Hill were shocked by the level of divisiveness that surfaced at a White House meeting Thursday, not long after key congressional players of both parties declared they'd achieved the broad outlines of an agreement on a bill implementing the administration's proposed $700 billion bailout plan.

Frank said he did not think that Democrats were going to see a substantially different proposal from the plan the administration has been trying to sell to lawmakers and which had been the focal point of closed-door talks for days. He called the rival proposal being pushed by House conservative Republicans "an ambush plan."

Participants in a meeting late Thursday afternoon that Bush had at the White House with congressional leaders and presidential candidates John McCain and Barack Obama said it descended into arguments. The disagreements were so deep-seated that some lawmakers wondered aloud just who — and how many — negotiators would show up for the resumption of talks later Friday morning at the Capitol.

"I didn't know I was going to be the referee for an internal GOP ideological civil war," Frank, D-Mass., said on CBS's "The Early Show."


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080926/ap_on_bi_ge/financial_meltdown

[Gan]

By NEDRA PICKLER, Associated Press WriterThu Sep 25, 7:21 PM ET

Barack Obama on Thursday criticized lawmakers who are holding up a deal on the $700 billion financial bailout plan, saying they need to clarify their objections so an agreement can be reached that will save the economy from further damage.

The Democratic presidential nominee spoke in a round of television interviews after a White House meeting also attended by Republican presidential rival John McCain. Obama said he left thinking they will reach a deal, but some work still needs to be done.

While other Democrats said McCain is part of the problem, Obama would not criticize his opponent directly. He told CNN that he and McCain must be careful not to "start injecting presidential politics into delicate negotiations."

He said he tried to understand the objections to the approach being taken by congressional leaders and the Bush administration.

"The question I asked was, `Well, do we need to start from scratch or are there ways to incorporate some of those concerns?'" Obama said on ABC's "World News." "I think that at this point the president, the secretary of the Treasury and those who are expressing some of these concerns have to provide some clarity."

Obama said he hopes McCain will go ahead with their debate scheduled for Friday night in Mississippi. McCain said Wednesday they should delay the forum to focus on the crisis. But Obama said on CNN: "My sense is that we can do more than one thing at a time."

He told NBC's "Nightly News" that he'll raise the economy at the debate, even though it's focus is supposed to be foreign policy.

"With this looming in the horizon, this has an effect all across the globe," he said. "We can't be strong abroad if we're not strong at home."

Obama said jobs, economic growth, retirement accounts, small businesses and financial markets will all be at risk without a bailout plan.

Democratic and Republican lawmakers announced a tentative deal at midday Thursday, while Obama was en route to Washington. Obama told the "CBS Evening News" he was not sure what went wrong.

"Obviously it's pretty frustrating for Democrats having seen the mismanagement that's been taking place over the last several years to feel like we've got to step in and get something done," he told CBS. "But that's how I think many of us feel, that we can't worry about how we got here. Now we've got to take some serious steps."

"It's important not to inject presidential politics into this," Obama said. "My preference is to use the phone ... in a way that's not a photo op because I think that sometimes prevents things from getting done."

An Obama aide says the Illinois senator has been working the phones between campaign events to stay on top of developments with the negotiations and offer his help, speaking daily with Democratic congressional leaders and Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson.

Obama called Senate Banking Committee Chairman Chris Dodd, D-Conn., on his cell phone Thursday morning for an update when Dodd happened to be in a meeting with Republican Sen. Bob Bennett of Utah, working on a deal. Dodd passed the phone to Bennett, and Obama spoke briefly with him as well.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080925/ap_on_el_pr/obama_68&printer=1;_ylt=Ano_2teJ57clRBcA5Ub3OrBh24cA

[ClydeR]

If nobody takes you seriously, why do you even post?

Attacking me won't cover up the fact that McCain is taking a big gamble here. Nor will it cover up the fact that McCain has a gambling problem. I found two more articles.

First is an article about McCain's attendance at the American Magazine Conference in Fajardo, Puerto Rico, in 2005. Members of Congress routinely get invited to meetings and conferences at interesting places. They're really just vacations paid for by lobbyists.


In the middle of a two-hour gambling session, the Arizona senator introduced himself to an attractive young brunette and invited her to join him at the craps table. He soon declared the woman, who was attending the conference on behalf of a Rhode Island-based technology firm, to be his lucky charm, and forbade her to leave while his winning streak lasted.

More... (http://ellensander.com/2005_10_01_cp_archive.html#112994470473340489)

And second is an article with a photo (http://independentsources.com/2006/06/03/john-mccain-gambling-las-vegas/) someone took on a cell phone of McCain gambling in Las Vegas in 2006.

I don't think McCain's political gamble with the debate is going to be a winner. In fact, I think this stunt has irrecoverably destroyed his chances of being president.

[CrystalTears]

Crackpot Chronicles... :lol: OMG just stop. For the love of God, stop.

[Kefka]

McCain bows out of Los Angeles debate
By Kathy Kiely, USA TODAY

John McCain abruptly canceled plans to debate Republican presidential rivals George W. Bush and Alan Keyes in California this week in order to stump for votes in New York.

McCain's decision, confirmed by officials of his campaign Sunday, came as a shock to organizers of Thursday night's debate, which is being hosted by the Los Angeles Times and televised nationally by CNN.

Officials at the newspaper and the cable network said the Arizona senator's campaign had accepted their invitation to the debate and that they had not been formally notified of a change of heart.

"This is quite surprising," Los Angeles Times executive Maryanne McNellis said Sunday. The date has been set since spring, and the Times "had been assured several times" by McCain campaign officials that he would participate, McNellis said. Organizers said they will go ahead with a Bush-Keyes debate.


http://www.usatoday.com/news/opinion/e1259.htm


Phew! Don't worry folks! McCain got this just like the last time!

[ElanthianSiren]

The plot thickens...

I didn't remember that.

[ClydeR]

Phew! Don't worry folks! McCain got this just like the last time!

And the time before that.


Today was hardly the first time John McCain has put Country First by showily "suspending" his campaign for the White House. On March 31, 1999, a week before his scheduled "official announcement" confirming the months-old news that he was running for president, and a week after Bill Clinton sent bombers over Kosovo, McCain announced that "It's not appropriate at this time to launch a political campaign."

How'd that work for him politically? According to sympathetic biographer Robert Timberg,


His decision amounted to a masterful political stroke. The Washington Post's Mary McGrory said that "professional politicians of both parties were wowed by McCain's beau geste.... McCain has made himself the de facto Republican foreign policy spokesman, and is getting yards of publicity for a non-event." The kudos kept pouring in, as did even more demands for him to appear on news-oriented TV talk shows. On one day alone, Monday, April 5, he could be seen arguing his case on Fox News's Crier Report, CNN's Larry King Live, PBS's Charlie Rose, two programs on CNBC, and two more on MSNBC, according to the Post's Dan Balz. Balz quoted one Republican strategist as labeling the conflict in Kosovo "All McCain, all the time." By week's end, syndicated columnist Mark Shields, on CNN's Capital Gang, said, "Let me just say in thirty-five years in Washington, I have never seen a debate dominated by an individual in the minority party as I've seen this one dominated by John McCain."

More... (http://www.reason.com/blog/show/129016.html)

Step 1. Announce suspension of campaign.
Step 2. Use the publicity to really campaign.
Step 3. Fizzle out.

[crb]

Frank blames House GOP for breakdown of deal

WASHINGTON - The chairman of the House Financial Services Committee declared Friday that an agreement on legislation to relieve a spreading financial crisis depends on House Republicans "dropping this revolt" against President Bush.

Rep. Barney Frank said leading Democrats on Capitol Hill were shocked by the level of divisiveness that surfaced at a White House meeting Thursday, not long after key congressional players of both parties declared they'd achieved the broad outlines of an agreement on a bill implementing the administration's proposed $700 billion bailout plan.

Frank said he did not think that Democrats were going to see a substantially different proposal from the plan the administration has been trying to sell to lawmakers and which had been the focal point of closed-door talks for days. He called the rival proposal being pushed by House conservative Republicans "an ambush plan."

Participants in a meeting late Thursday afternoon that Bush had at the White House with congressional leaders and presidential candidates John McCain and Barack Obama said it descended into arguments. The disagreements were so deep-seated that some lawmakers wondered aloud just who — and how many — negotiators would show up for the resumption of talks later Friday morning at the Capitol.

"I didn't know I was going to be the referee for an internal GOP ideological civil war," Frank, D-Mass., said on CBS's "The Early Show."


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080926/ap_on_bi_ge/financial_meltdown
They have enough votes to pass it without house republicans.

They just don't want to.

This is how Democrats govern, they wanted the majority, but with the majority comes responsibility, they don't want to have the responsibility for passing important legislation.

They could pass it now, they won't. It is all political manuevering.

[Keller]

They have enough votes to pass it without house republicans.

They just don't want to.

This is how Democrats govern, they wanted the majority, but with the majority comes responsibility, they don't want to have the responsibility for passing important legislation.

They could pass it now, they won't. It is all political manuevering.

Cite?

[Gan]

Attacking me won't cover up the fact that McCain is taking a big gamble here. Nor will it cover up the fact that McCain has a gambling problem. I found two more articles.

I'm merely calling you out on your obvious attempt to portray a Republican when you are not.

I would say good job, but it has not been.

[Keller]

I'm merely calling you out on your obvious attempt to portray a Republican when you are not.

I would say good job, but it has not been.

He was pretty convincing for the first couple of weeks. At least to me.

[Kefka]

They have enough votes to pass it without house republicans.

They just don't want to.

This is how Democrats govern, they wanted the majority, but with the majority comes responsibility, they don't want to have the responsibility for passing important legislation.

They could pass it now, they won't. It is all political manuevering.

Hmmm. Sounds a lot like 'let them take credit for our mess.'

[crb]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26900453/

McCain IS going to the debate.
sweetness

[crb]

Cite?
Rep Paul Ryan said as much in a statement I heard on CNBC this morning.

[Keller]

Rep Paul Ryan said as much in a statement I heard on CNBC this morning.

Hmmm. That's pretty disheartening if true. Can we just call a mulligan and put everyone up for election this November?

[ClydeR]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26900453/

McCain IS going to the debate.

That's good news, though a complete reversal of McCain's earlier statement that he would skip the debate unless a deal had been reached.

[Tsa`ah]

Cite?

As usual ... his ass.

[Parkbandit]

Hmmm. Sounds a lot like 'let them take credit for our mess.'


:rofl:

So you are somehow blaming Republicans for the credit crisis going on? You would have to be blissfully ignorant of the facts behind it to come to that conclusion.

If the Democrats want this passed, they easily have the votes to pass it in the House. Slam dunk. Why don't they? It's not like it will end up getting Vetoed by Bush.. he's the one that put it on the table. Why not just vote this fabulous bailout and be done with it?

The Senate Republicans haven't shown a spine in years.. so they won't stand in the way. Pass it on through and take full credit for saving the USA.

[Parkbandit]

As usual ... his ass.

Really? Are you that inept to figure out how many Republicans vs Democrats there are in the House? Come on Googleboy.. I'll even provide the link for you:

www.house.gov

[Tsa`ah]

Really? Are you that inept to figure out how many Republicans vs Democrats there are in the House? Come on Googleboy.. I'll even provide the link for you:

www.house.gov

I'll let you in on a little secret short bus .... I haven't blamed dems or republicans separately ... I've blamed both, along with the administration.

If you really want to play "who is at fault" ... you have to go further back, you know ... to the 109th that was led by a republican majority. Even then, they're not at complete fault.

That may be a bit too complex for your meager comprehension skills ... I'll get some crayons and my nephew for something more your speed.

[TheEschaton]

sweetness



BUT HE R NEEDED TO FIX EKONOMICAL KRYSIS!!!!111

[Parkbandit]

I'll let you in on a little secret short bus .... I haven't blamed dems or republicans separately ... I've blamed both, along with the administration.

If you really want to play "who is at fault" ... you have to go further back, you know ... to the 109th that was led by a republican majority. Even then, they're not at complete fault.

That may be a bit too complex for your meager comprehension skills ... I'll get some crayons and my nephew for something more your speed.

I usually don't have time to deal with your constant stupidity.. but I'm done for the day.. so here we go.

Dear Simpleton.. I'm now going to quote the posts in order.. of the post I responded to of yours. You let us all know where you got lost:


They have enough votes to pass it without house republicans.

They just don't want to.

This is how Democrats govern, they wanted the majority, but with the majority comes responsibility, they don't want to have the responsibility for passing important legislation.

They could pass it now, they won't. It is all political manuevering.

I bolded the important part for you.. seeing how you need help.

Now this one:


Cite?

And finally your stupid one:


As usual ... his ass.

Now.. which one did you have a tough time understanding? The source Keller needed "cite" on was that the Democrats could effectively pass this legislation since they have a majority in the House. Not sure how you had difficulty in figuring it out... with your googledegree and all. Hell, I even provided the site for you, all it took was simple math for you to count up D's and R's.

Your deflection was cute.. as Ashliana will probably come on here and remark "B-b-b-b-b-but the Republicans!" was never a question. It was a pretty simple thing even someone with your limited intellect should be easily able to ascertain.

Number of House Democrats > Number of House Republicans

Come on Tsa'ah.. even you with your remedial math "skills" you could come up with the correct answer with some help and someone to handle a calculator for you. Do I need to count them up for you since they go over 10 and you don't have the fingers necessary to count them all up?

Let me know if you still need help in understanding a relatively simple concept.

[crb]

Number of House Democrats > Number of House Republicans

and some republicans are on board as well.

[Keller]

Are all house democrats in favor of this? I didn't know this was a partisan issue.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

Are all house democrats in favor of this? I didn't know this was a partisan issue.

I don't think some people can comprehend when one side isn't just rabidly trying to fuck over the other.

Right now I'm really glad they're taking their time. That's a lot of money.

[Tsa`ah]

Now.. which one did you have a tough time understanding? The source Keller needed "cite" on was that the Democrats could effectively pass this legislation since they have a majority in the House. Not sure how you had difficulty in figuring it out... with your googledegree and all. Hell, I even provided the site for you, all it took was simple math for you to count up D's and R's.

Your deflection was cute.. as Ashliana will probably come on here and remark "B-b-b-b-b-but the Republicans!" was never a question. It was a pretty simple thing even someone with your limited intellect should be easily able to ascertain.

Number of House Democrats > Number of House Republicans

Come on Tsa'ah.. even you with your remedial math "skills" you could come up with the correct answer with some help and someone to handle a calculator for you. Do I need to count them up for you since they go over 10 and you don't have the fingers necessary to count them all up?

Let me know if you still need help in understanding a relatively simple concept.

I'm going to lay this out for you as simply as I can ... because my nephew and his crayons aren't readily accessible at this moment.

This isn't a party issue. There are republicans that do not want this bailout, there are democrats that do not want this bailout ... most of the United States doesn't want this bailout.

Now when you have bi-partisan resistance and bi-partisan support (at the same time) ... what thought does that spark in your half dead brain?

It should tell you that there isn't agreement within party lines, there's likely to be bi-partisan disagreement as well ... meaning it's not going to be very easy to pass without bi-partisan support.

Come to think of it, chances are that my three year old nephew is a bit too advanced for you ... I'll probably have to give him a double shot of turkey with a vicodin chaser just to bring him down enough pegs to be level with you.

[ElanthianSiren]

:lol: @ Narcissi's sig pic.

Is Palin the OMG'ing one in red?

[Daniel]

Wait a second. Weren't CRB and the R-team yesterday exonerating McCain and the republicans for not moving a bill out of committee?

What's the supposed "difference" here?

Oh..My bad. I forgot who I was talking about here.

[Clove]

Who were you talking to?

[Daniel]

I was just kinda pontificating out loud.

It's a new technique I'm working on.

[Parkbandit]

I'm going to lay this out for you as simply as I can ... because my nephew and his crayons aren't readily accessible at this moment.

This isn't a party issue. There are republicans that do not want this bailout, there are democrats that do not want this bailout ... most of the United States doesn't want this bailout.

Now when you have bi-partisan resistance and bi-partisan support (at the same time) ... what thought does that spark in your half dead brain?

It should tell you that there isn't agreement within party lines, there's likely to be bi-partisan disagreement as well ... meaning it's not going to be very easy to pass without bi-partisan support.

Come to think of it, chances are that my three year old nephew is a bit too advanced for you ... I'll probably have to give him a double shot of turkey with a vicodin chaser just to bring him down enough pegs to be level with you.


Oh.. I hadn't realized your Mommy was unavailable to read the headlines today. Since a very large majority of Democrats are for the bill and only the Conservative Republicans are against the bill, I'm not sure how you can claim this isn't a party issue. Maybe you just don't understand the term "Party Issue"? Is your 3 year old Nephew around that can explain it to you?

For someone who pretends to be a pseudo-intellectual Google genius.. it's amazing you are unable to find the sources you so desire.

I'm going to let you in on a little secret shit for brains. Go to www.google.com and type in:

House of Representatives+bailout

Once you do that, click on the news link and it will bring you to the news sources. From there, you will find a large number of sources that will let you know that it's only a group of conservative Republicans that are (or were) "holding" up this bill.

Hell.. I don't have the confidence in you to allow you to follow those directions very well, so I'll do the work for your parents. Let them know they owe me more money for dealing you another life lesson:

http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2008/09/26/bailout-talks.html

(Here's the key paragraph.. since I doubt you can even click the link)

An agreement will depend on House Republicans "dropping this revolt" against Bush's plan, said House financial services committee chairman Barney Frank.

Frank said he did not expect to see a substantially different proposal at Friday's discussions from the plan the Bush administration has been trying to sell to lawmakers.

Bipartisan efforts to work out a deal stalled Thursday night.

The CBC's Alison Smith, reporting from Washington, said the obstacle appeared to be a group of conservative Republicans in the House of Representatives whose constituents don't like the idea of giving away taxpayers' money to save financial firms from their own folly.

Here's another one Wonder Boy:

http://www.reuters.com/article/marketsNews/idUSWAT01014320080925

WASHINGTON, Sept 25 (Reuters) - Many Republicans in the U.S. House of Representatives do not support the U.S. Treasury Department's proposed $700 billion bank bailout but a "solid number" are likely to vote for it in the end, a Republican member of the House Financial Services Committee said.

"I expect though that between today and tomorrow, and maybe into Saturday, you will see a solid number of Republicans voting for it," Rep. Peter King of New York said on CNBC.

A Democratic member of the committee, Rep. Brad Sherman, said that if Congress does not act on the bill in the next few days, it would not likely pass in its current form.

"My calls are coming in about 300 to 2 against this," he told CNBC. "That's why if this bill doesn't pass on Saturday or Sunday, it won't pass in its current form, because if members go home and actually talk to their constituents, they'll see the anger at this," he said, adding that he was not saying it wouldn't pass in the next few days.

I bolded the important parts for you.. since we both know you would have asked for help later on anyway.

[Tsa`ah]

Dear god ... you are the definition of retarded.

Why not look up democratic opposition to bailout.

[Parkbandit]

Dear god ... you are the definition of retarded.

Why not look up democratic opposition to bailout.

Dear God is right moron. I'm going to dumb this post down as far as possible.. but even then I have very little faith you will understand it.

Here is your post:




This isn't a party issue. There are republicans that do not want this bailout, there are democrats that do not want this bailout ... most of the United States doesn't want this bailout.


To which you've yet to provide a source from.. must be from the same place you claimed crb got his information from.. your ass.

Now.. here's where it gets tricky, Shit for brains:

Currently, the party makeup of the House is as follows:

Democratic: 236
Republican: 198

Here's a really tough part for you.. now we have to subtract these numbers to find the "majority"

236 - 198 = 38

So.. 38 more Democrats than Republicans in the House.

While I'm sure you are probably looking in the air by now, screaming for your Mommy to come explain this to you.. looking up the Democrats who oppose the bill would only be PART of the solution.. since you have already claimed that it's not a partisan issue and that there are Republicans on board for it.

So if we took your 2nd grade 'advice' and only looked up the Democrats opposed to this bailout.. which part of the equation would we be missing? HINT: I purposely underlined the important part in the above paragraph for you.

While I'm certain you still didn't come up with the correct conclusion that we need to find out how many Republicans are FOR the bill.. I'm sure we can all agree that you are indeed a weak link and an all around stupid buffoon.

[Kefka]

Barney Frank basically said that unless the Republicans can agree on a bill, there will be no bill. Democrats were not about to stick their necks out and vote for a highly unpopular bill just before an election and then have the Republicans hammer them for it unless the Republicans also vote for it. All the meetings ended at 10:30 P.M. with no agreement. The NY Times headline on the story starts with Talks Implode During Day of Chaos. That about sums it up.

Curiously enough, although John McCain came roaring into Washington to solve the problem, he has been quiet as a mouse since getting there. In particular, he has not given any indication whether he supports Boehner's plan or Paulson's plan. If he could forge a compromise, he might look good, although Democrats would surely note that all he had done was bring warring factions of the Republican Party together, not working with the Democrats.

(http://www.electoral-vote.com)

That's the article I was looking for. Why should Dems pass an unpopular bill that will fix a problem that conservatives brought upon us? Trust they are in no rush to pass any bill, and focus is, rightly, where it deserves to be.


-
CNN poll: GOP takes brunt of blame for economy; Obama gains

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- By a 2-to-1 ratio, Americans blame Republicans over Democrats for the financial crisis that has swept across the country the past few weeks, a new national poll suggests.

That may be contributing to better poll numbers for Sen. Barack Obama against Sen. John McCain in the race for the White House.

In a CNN/Opinion Research Corp. survey out Monday afternoon, 47 percent of registered voters questioned said Republicans are more responsible for the problems currently facing financial institutions and the stock market; only 24 percent said Democrats are more responsible.

Twenty percent blame both parties equally and 8 percent say neither party is to blame.

The poll also indicates more Americans think Obama, the Democratic presidential nominee, would do a better job handling an economic crisis than McCain, the Republican presidential nominee.


http://edition.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/09/22/cnn.poll/index.html?eref=edition_business

Thank God Frank is too smart to fall for that trap.

[Parkbandit]

Thank God Frank is too smart to fall for that trap.

Too smart? Is this the same Frank that said:

"These two entities—Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac—are not facing any kind of financial crisis," said Representative Barney Frank of Massachusetts, the ranking Democrat on the Financial Services Committee. "The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies, the less we will see in terms of affordable housing."

THAT Barney Frank is too smart?

Thanks for the laugh. I enjoyed it.

[Daniel]

Too smart? Is this the same Frank that said:

"These two entities—Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac—are not facing any kind of financial crisis," said Representative Barney Frank of Massachusetts, the ranking Democrat on the Financial Services Committee. "The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies, the less we will see in terms of affordable housing."

THAT Barney Frank is too smart?

Thanks for the laugh. I enjoyed it.

It's interesting that you can laugh at something said 5 years ago and yet are conspicuously silent about similar things said months (Days) ago by republicans.

[Parkbandit]

It's interesting that you can laugh at something said 5 years ago and yet are conspicuously silent about similar things said months (Days) ago by republicans.

It's interesting that you can't laugh at something said 5 years ago by a Democrat and yet continue to laugh about similar things said months (Days) ago by Republicans.

I'm pretty sure you didn't see what I did there.. but essentially I called you a fucking dumbass hypocrite. How's it taste, boy?

[Daniel]

Hilarious.

If you can't see the difference between something said FIVE YEARS AGO, when everything *was* fine as compared to things said WEEKS AGO when they were not, then you're a fucking retard.

[Parkbandit]

Hilarious.

If you can't see the difference between something said FIVE YEARS AGO, when everything *was* fine as compared to things said WEEKS AGO when they were not, then you're a fucking retard.

Weird.. there were plenty of people saying that things *weren't* fine 5 years ago... and had they acted then, we wouldn't have people saying things today.

And yes, you are a fucking retard.

[Sean of the Thread]

Damned hypocritesizers.

[Warriorbird]

I'm sure that you've said 'things are fine!' more than anybody else on these boards apart from Ganalon, PB.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

Damned hypocritesizers.

Every time I see that part of that scene I laugh until I cry.

[Parkbandit]

I'm sure that you've said 'things are fine!' more than anybody else on these boards apart from Ganalon, PB.


Source?

And I'm pretty sure I wouldn't have the same access to Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac as Barney Frank... would you agree? Grats on making the dumbest comparison today.

[Daniel]

Source?

And I'm pretty sure I wouldn't have the same access to Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac as Barney Frank... would you agree? Grats on making the dumbest comparison today.

Rofl. Irony.

[Gan]

I'm sure that you've said 'things are fine!' more than anybody else on these boards apart from Ganalon, PB.

Nice one to pull out of your ass.

[Kefka]

Source?

And I'm pretty sure I wouldn't have the same access to Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac as Barney Frank... would you agree? Grats on making the dumbest comparison today.

Well there is this:

http://forum.gsplayers.com/showthread.php?t=4411&highlight=recession


You didn't make the post, but you sure contributed to it's defense.

[Tsa`ah]

Well there is this:

http://forum.gsplayers.com/showthread.php?t=4411&highlight=recession


You didn't make the post, but you sure contributed to it's defense.

Many a good laugh to be had.

[Parkbandit]

Well there is this:

http://forum.gsplayers.com/showthread.php?t=4411&highlight=recession


You didn't make the post, but you sure contributed to it's defense.

So wait.. 'context' works only when it's in your benefit? And that thread was talking about the economy as a whole in 2004.. the discussion here was more focused on Fannie May and Freddie Mac.. something that wasn't brought up in the thread you linked.

I'm sure you were just confused.. :(

[Parkbandit]

Many a good laugh to be had.


Eh.. I think the threads where it's pointed out how much of a hypocrite you are are far more full of good laughs.

Then again, there are so many of those threads, it's hard to pick a real winner.

[Kefka]

So wait.. 'context' works only when it's in your benefit? And that thread was talking about the economy as a whole in 2004.. the discussion here was more focused on Fannie May and Freddie Mac.. something that wasn't brought up in the thread you linked.

I'm sure you were just confused.. :(

Weird... I thought we were referring to this line:


Weird.. there were plenty of people saying that things *weren't* fine 5 years ago... and had they acted then, we wouldn't have people saying things today.

Unless you think everyone was talking about Fannie and Freddie 4/5 years ago.

[Tsa`ah]

Eh.. I think the threads where it's pointed out how much of a hypocrite you are are far more full of good laughs.

Then again, there are so many of those threads, it's hard to pick a real winner.

How about this short bus ... you go on and have yourself a dandy time digging those threads up and showing the world/forum.

Busting your ever so large glass jaw doesn't perk my fancy today ... so you just go on and dig, make a thread, and when I'm so inclined I'll come join in and show you what a real Biden/Palin debate would look like.

[ClydeR]

Someone from the New York Times must have read my two (http://forum.gsplayers.com/showpost.php?p=808392&postcount=172") posts (http://forum.gsplayers.com/showpost.php?p=808623&postcount=181) in this thread about McCain's gambling problem. They had an article about it in Saturday's paper.


For McCain and Team, a Host of Ties to Gambling

By JO BECKER and DON VAN NATTA Jr.
Published: September 27, 2008

Senator John McCain was on a roll. In a room reserved for high-stakes gamblers at the Foxwoods Resort Casino in Connecticut, he tossed $100 chips around a hot craps table. When the marathon session ended around 2:30 a.m., the Arizona senator and his entourage emerged with thousands of dollars in winnings.

A lifelong gambler, Mr. McCain takes risks, both on and off the craps table. He was throwing dice that night not long after his failed 2000 presidential bid, in which he was skewered by the Republican Party’s evangelical base, opponents of gambling. Mr. McCain was betting at a casino he oversaw as a member of the Senate Indian Affairs Committee, and he was doing so with the lobbyist who represents that casino, according to three associates of Mr. McCain.

The visit had been arranged by the lobbyist, Scott Reed, who works for the Mashantucket Pequot, a tribe that has contributed heavily to Mr. McCain’s campaigns and built Foxwoods into the world’s second-largest casino. Joining them was Rick Davis, Mr. McCain’s current campaign manager. Their night of good fortune epitomized not just Mr. McCain’s affection for gambling, but also the close relationship he has built with the gambling industry and its lobbyists during his 25-year career in Congress.

More... (http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/28/us/politics/28gambling-web.html)

[Parkbandit]

Weird... I thought we were referring to this line:



Unless you think everyone was talking about Fannie and Freddie 4/5 years ago.

Ah. I can see how someone like you could so easily be confused. SINCE we were specifically discussing Fannie and Freddie, and how McCain said there was problems with those two institutions specifically and how Barney Frank said that there was no problems specifically with Fannie and Freddie... You got lost. Now that you've seen the light, I'll expect a retraction.

[Parkbandit]

How about this short bus ... you go on and have yourself a dandy time digging those threads up and showing the world/forum.

Busting your ever so large glass jaw doesn't perk my fancy today ... so you just go on and dig, make a thread, and when I'm so inclined I'll come join in and show you what a real Biden/Palin debate would look like.

Wow... Poor Shit4Brains sounds angry. If it was only one or two threads that you look like a gigantic flaming hypocrite.. I would. But the number of threads with links would no doubt create severe lag not only on this form but quite possibly the entire Internet.

Safe to say, your hypocrisy is very well documented and known on this forum that merely calling you a hypocrite should produce responses of "thank you Captain Obvious"

And a debate between you and I has never been as interesting as a Palon / Biden debate. No one likes to pick on the mentally disabled... And I apologize for doing it so often with you. Sure, it feels good while I'm doing it, but I later feel bad, knowing you are incapable of any real intelligent thought.

I'm sorry since I know I won't be able to stop myself in the future... But know that later on, I will feel remorse and pity for you.

:(

[Tsa`ah]

Wow... Poor Shit4Brains sounds angry. If it was only one or two threads that you look like a gigantic flaming hypocrite.. I would. But the number of threads with links would no doubt create severe lag not only on this form but quite possibly the entire Internet.

Safe to say, your hypocrisy is very well documented and known on this forum that merely calling you a hypocrite should produce responses of "thank you Captain Obvious"

And a debate between you and I has never been as interesting as a Palon / Biden debate. No one likes to pick on the mentally disabled... And I apologize for doing it so often with you. Sure, it feels good while I'm doing it, but I later feel bad, knowing you are incapable of any real intelligent thought.

I'm sorry since I know I won't be able to stop myself in the future... But know that later on, I will feel remorse and pity for you.

:(

Lol ... if that post sounded angry to you ... maybe you should take your ear away from the screen and read it instead.

But I digress. You made the claim that this forum was rife with threads showing me to be a hypocrite, yet you backed out of the charge to find them like a heroin addict given a free ticket to the dopamine clinic. Typical.

Go ahead short bus ... I gave you two days and you have zilch. Back it up already.

Maybe this is where I turn your words back around when pointing out it's Palin ... not Palon.

[Parkbandit]

Lol ... if that post sounded angry to you ... maybe you should take your ear away from the screen and read it instead.

But I digress. You made the claim that this forum was rife with threads showing me to be a hypocrite, yet you backed out of the charge to find them like a heroin addict given a free ticket to the dopamine clinic. Typical.

Go ahead short bus ... I gave you two days and you have zilch. Back it up already.

Maybe this is where I turn your words back around when pointing out it's Palin ... not Palon.

Maybe you missed this point:




Safe to say, your hypocrisy is very well documented and known on this forum that merely calling you a hypocrite should produce responses of "thank you Captain Obvious"

While I realize you have nothing better to do than to google up useless shit on a constant basis and provide more proof of your pseudo-intellectualism, I haven't the time nor inclination to point out that which everyone knows here to be a fact: You are indeed hypocritical piece of shit.

But hey, you REALLY got me on that Palin spelling. That burn hurts so bad Shit4Brains. So bad.

PS - If you look at the location of the "I" and the "O" on a computer keyboard, you will understand it was a simple typo.. especially when you realize I was posting that from an iPhone. But keep your burn moment Shit4Brains, it comes so rarely for you and I want you to really enjoy it as you head off to your "special" classes today.

[Tsa`ah]

Umm ... you're not proving anything short bus. Get to digging for documentation.

[Parkbandit]

Umm ... you're not proving anything short bus. Get to digging for documentation.

Start a poll if you believe you are somehow not a hypocrite Shit4Brains. Chances are, most people here know the truth... you are.

Start the poll.. unless you don't wish to see the results.

[Gan]

Start a poll if you believe you are somehow not a hypocrite Shit4Brains. Chances are, most people here know the truth... you are.

Start the poll.. unless you don't wish to see the results.

I bet Daniel would do it

[Tsa`ah]

Start a poll if you believe you are somehow not a hypocrite Shit4Brains. Chances are, most people here know the truth... you are.

Start the poll.. unless you don't wish to see the results.

So you can't find any I take it. Typical of you to talk out of your ass.

[Parkbandit]

So you can't find any I take it. Typical of you to talk out of your ass.

You might be the only one safe on the planet to assume as much as you do, since you can't possibly be made a bigger ass out of.

Like I said Shit4Brains, make yourself a poll if you are that confident that people here aren't smart enough to know you are a flaming, piece of shit hypocrite.

http://media.ebaumsworld.com/mediaFiles/picture/379231/624013.png

[Keller]

I bet Daniel would do it

You never give me any credit.

:nono:

[Daniel]

I bet Daniel would do it

still butt hurt about most of the of thinking your a lying sack of shit? Awww poor baby

[Gan]

You never give me any credit.

:nono:
Well, to be honest - you have not made a poll about me yet. :p



still butt hurt about most of the of thinking your a lying sack of shit? Awww poor baby
No, just pointing out the obvious.

[Tsa`ah]

You might be the only one safe on the planet to assume as much as you do, since you can't possibly be made a bigger ass out of.

Like I said Shit4Brains, make yourself a poll if you are that confident that people here aren't smart enough to know you are a flaming, piece of shit hypocrite.

Man ... you just dance a jig like no one else after your ass cheeks flap out some incredibly foul bullshit.

The onus isn't on me to prove/disprove your assertions. If you want a poll, make it. If you claim the forum is full of "easy to find" examples, link them. It's really not that difficult for the average person to prove or disprove ... so have at it already and stop passing your burdens onto me.