Enhancive Charges

[Swami71]

UPDATE

0. out of charges
1. a few
2. several charges
3. fair amount
4. quite a few
5. a lot
6. more than your average giantman can count/more than your average dwarf can count (depending on Bards race)
7. a huge number
8. almost innumerable
.
.
? nearly infinite amount

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
*original post*

Don't know if this is common knowledge but I didn't know the order.

I was charging up my CoL bracer and figured out some of the order of the charges.

1. quite a few
2. a lot
3. more than your average giantman can count
4. a huge number
.....

Thats as much as the bracers could hold. The value went up 2k when it was full. Was surprised to see giantman are actually decent counters after all.

[Fallen]

I believe there is: a few, before quite a few. Maybe even a smaller tier one too.

[Swami71]

anyone out there have a more complete list of the charges....just saw one with a good amount of charges. I'm guessing thats less than quite a few and the a few would be a step down from that.

[Fallen]

A few people do, but they are not sharing.

[Swami71]

A few people do, but they are not sharing.

Those bastards. I will ruin their secret. Its just a matter of time.

[Jinsem]

Those bastards. I will ruin their secret. Its just a matter of time.

Can't wait to compare notes :) Also, I think I am the only claming to have a full listing currently. Make sure you get the dupes.

Jinsem
Sew Ebil.

[Fornoxx]

I have runestaff that has "almost Innumerable amout of charge" unless its changed from when i got it a year ago

[Swami71]

Update


1a. several charges
1. fair amount
2. quite a few
3. a lot
4. more than your average giantman can count
5. a huge number
.
.
.
? almost Innumerable amount

Not sure on the order of the first 2 but there less than quite a few.

[Fallen]

More than your average giantman can count will change to, "more than your average dwarf can count" if a giantkin bard sings to an item of that charge thresshold.

A "nearly infinite amount" of charges I believe is the highest tier, and is uncapped. Items like this are usually auction quality, or are temp weighted/padded/flaring/etc items.

It would be good to work to pin all of this stuff down. I will continue to contribute here when I come across good information.

[BriarFox]

I'm not sure if "an incredible amount of charges" applies, but that's what several temporarily weighted/padded items have. Temp padding may differ from enhancives in tiers, though.

[Fallen]

That should be on the scale, IMO, yes.

[Latrinsorm]

A "nearly infinite amount" of charges Apparently the GM in charge of that one wasn't a math major.

[BigWorm]

Apparently the GM in charge of that one wasn't a math major.

I don't think we need delta-epsilon proofs in loresongs.

[Latrinsorm]

I can't imagine how giddy I would be if I found out mathematical proofs were involved in GemStone.

[Fallen]

You might actually start playing again. You big jerk.

[bluesmith]

I believe "Almost innumerable" is top of the line for PP enhancives...and then in descending order:

a huge number
more than a giantman can count
a lot
quite a few

[Latrinsorm]

You might actually start playing again. You big jerk.Awww! :hug:

[Swami71]

Can't wait to compare notes :) Also, I think I am the only claming to have a full listing currently. Make sure you get the dupes.

Jinsem
Sew Ebil.

What do you mean by Dupes?

[Jinsem]

What do you mean by Dupes?

Fallen got it in post 9, was throwing people off (including me) till a GM told us about it.

As a side note, and beleive me if you like or don't, but 2 tiers have been given a charge max. It's how I was able to get a rough estimate of charges in the tiers.

I like to loresing, and I wish to be good at it. Hence why I drained 2 items to figure this crap out.

Jinsem
Pocket Bard = FTW

[Swami71]

I'm thinking when my badge runs out i'll put something cheap in it like 1 max mana and fill it all the way up and watch the charges go down. Thanks for the idea Jinsem!

[grenthor]

Can't wait to compare notes :) Also, I think I am the only claming to have a full listing currently. Make sure you get the dupes.

Jinsem
Sew Ebil.

post what you got then. lets compare it to what everyone else comes up with and try to get a solid list.

[Swami71]

I don't know what there is to gain by keeping it to yourself. Oh well. Will all know soon.

[Some Rogue]

I don't know what there is to gain by keeping it to yourself. Oh well. Will all know soon.

It makes the epeen grow to enormous proportions when you can come into threads and brag that you're the only one who knows something.

[grenthor]

i can't imagine he was saying he was going to keep the information to himself. like the other guy said there's not really any reason to do so except to sit back and point and go 'neener neener neener I got you' and i don't think any of the regular posters here are 'that guy' are they? are they??

[Swami71]

Enhancive thoughts....

1. I don't think removing your badge or any other enhancive uses charges.
2. The more enhancives you wear the longer they last. My guess is it only drains one of them when that random drain comes around.
3. Putting more things in your badge like taking 3 stats to +10 makes it drain faster than just having one stat at +10. Which sucks cause whats the point of maxing out your badge.

[Swami71]

I'm thinking when my badge runs out i'll put something cheap in it like 1 max mana and fill it all the way up and watch the charges go down. Thanks for the idea Jinsem!

Well that didn't help. Badges only hold a Huge number.

[Fallen]

Even fully charged? You can charge a badge multiple times.

[Swami71]

Yes fully charged is a huge number of charges for the badges. Charged it 4 or 5 times then he told me its full. My friend has an enhancive that has nearly infinite charges so all hope is not lost...heh

Also the current list looks like it will cover most of the enhancives out there.

[Swami71]

Updated first post. Almost innumerable is the next higher after a huge number. Thats the best enhancive I have. So I'm out as far as posting more info. I think this list is mostly complete. I thought there would be more. Still don't know where a good amount fits in and how many there are till nearly infinite but I'm guessing nearly infinite is next.

[Jinsem]

Enhancive thoughts....

1. I don't think removing your badge or any other enhancive uses charges.
2. The more enhancives you wear the longer they last. My guess is it only drains one of them when that random drain comes around.
3. Putting more things in your badge like taking 3 stats to +10 makes it drain faster than just having one stat at +10. Which sucks cause whats the point of maxing out your badge.

People are killing me...

1 - It has a chance to do so.

2 - Why would you ever think this? If you have 3 enhancives in one item they all share the same pool. This in fact can actually make the item drain faster. It's also the MAIN reason why we can't stack PP enhancives on the same item, or item with previous enchancives.

3 - Correct, as I explained above.

Jinsem

[Jinsem]

Even fully charged? You can charge a badge multiple times.

Again...

Each time you charge an item with the ADG person, you are REcharging 20% of the charges in the badge. For some of the items (PP enhancives) this means a great deal. For some of the lower ones your recharging 2-3 charges per.

Jinsem
...

[Swami71]

Again...

Each time you charge an item with the ADG person, you are REcharging 20% of the charges in the badge. For some of the items (PP enhancives) this means a great deal. For some of the lower ones your recharging 2-3 charges per.

Jinsem
...

So an enhancive will always fill up in 5 charges from empty? So the more it holds the more your getting per charge? Though they may charge more BP per charge to.

[Swami71]

People are killing me...

1 - It has a chance to do so.

2 - Why would you ever think this? If you have 3 enhancives in one item they all share the same pool. This in fact can actually make the item drain faster. It's also the MAIN reason why we can't stack PP enhancives on the same item, or item with previous enchancives.

3 - Correct, as I explained above.

Jinsem

1. I removed and wore my badge a bunch of times (100 or so) trying to drain it and it remained the same. So I wouldn't be to worried about it. If at all.

2. When i was wearing 2 small pinworn enhancives, my badge, and 2 col bracers...5 total. They all seemed to last longer. But yes it is a guess and needs further testing.

3. Agreed

[Jinsem]

So an enhancive will always fill up in 5 charges from empty? So the more it holds the more your getting per charge? Though they may charge more BP per charge to.

At 100% empty yes. This was confirmed by Warden when the ADG first came out. As for your second part, yup. Third part does not affect second part. Enhancive rechrarge cost is compiled by many different factors. Where worn, items material, skill/stat affected etc.

Jinsem
Already done all this a while ago.

[Jinsem]

1. I removed and wore my badge a bunch of times (100 or so) trying to drain it and it remained the same. So I wouldn't be to worried about it. If at all.

2. When i was wearing 2 small pinworn enhancives, my badge, and 2 col bracers...5 total. They all seemed to last longer. But yes it is a guess and needs further testing.

3. Agreed

1 - And? I'm not trying to sound snotty, but I researched this a crap load when it first came out. A ton of NIR posts were done and I have the info. We then revisited it in the PP folder, and then in the Voln folder. I have the notes, I have the info, it's correct. Removing has a CHANCE to remove a charge. Unless you are at a break point with the charge quanities you just won't know. Removing DOES have a chance to remove a charge, just a hella low one.

2 - It's just your imagination. I really don't want to have to start putting out fires on the boards again...

Jinsem
Wants that damn lance.

[Swami71]

1 - And? I'm not trying to sound snotty

Nope, thanks for the info. Now if you'd just provide us with your list...heh

[crb]

Removing has a CHANCE to remove a charge. Unless you are at a break point with the charge quanities you just won't know. Removing DOES have a chance to remove a charge, just a hella low one.


No, it doesn't. Remember, like 1 month ago Zyllah corrected you on the boards. I know, I know, your narcissistic little brain may prevent you from processing statements that go against the fantasy world of your self perception, but that doesn't mean they aren't true.

Just so you know I'm thinking about you, I made you a gift.

http://www.addcaptions.com/image.php?str=Bestest+Enhanciver+Evar%21&shortname=Trophy004&color=80+0+160&size=12&font=Copperplate+Gothic.TTF&characters=18&up=0&left=0

[Fallen]

The problem, Jinsem, is the information you've provided isn't all in one single location which wont roll off the boards. I'm fairly certain none of this is up on Krakiipedia. If there were a thread where you posted the information HERE, it wouldn't be so easily lost.

I just wish the mechanics of enhancives were revealed when you loresong to them. Such as, from the pitch of your voice the brooch reveals to you that it has a chance to lose its charge upon being (Blah), and will slowly/moderately/quickly expend its charges while activated.

How awesome would that be?

[crb]

None of Jinsems shit, except maybe the loresing readouts, is accurate anyways. He's full of it.

[crb]

by the way, here are two Zyllah quotes:



Almost anything can have enhancive properties added. The only item I know for sure off the top of my head that doesn't work with the enhancive system is jewelry for piercings.

Enancive items have a set number of charges (but how many is different from item to item). The premium enhancives come with a lot of charges compared to most other items in the game. The charges are drained via a random roll system. The chance to lose a charge each time is quite small, but the longer you leave an item activated the more this will catch up to you.

There is a chance to lose a charge when you activate the item (which would be getting it in your hand if it's a weapon or shield or wearing it if it's a worn item). Then while an item is active there are periodic rolls made to see if a charge is lost. So the more you have an item active the more of these rolls take place.

People who keep their item active and are in the game for long periods of time tend to use up their enhancives much quicker than people who only keep theirs active for shorter periods or are not in the game as much. Of course there's also some luck to that and if the rolls go against you your item might seem to lose charges more quickly than someone else's, or if they go in your favor last much longer.

Zyllah




<<1 - Get/Put an item.
One chance per each use of the verb.>>

Not quite. Activating the item is when it has a chance to lose a charge. If it's activated by GET, such a weapon in your hand, then GET has a chance to lose a charge. If it's an item that is worn, then using WEAR activates it and has a chance to lose a charge. Removing an item or putting it away has no chance to lose a charge.

Zyllah

p.s. My personal rule of thumb is to only wear my enhancives when I'm using them. So like my warrior has one for Discipline to help with Berserk training (darn that sucky elf Discipline bonus!) and only wears it when doing guild tasks. My cleric has three that help with hunting, so I wear them if I'm in a hunt/rest cycle, but take them off if I'm doing other stuff in the game.


If you wanna laugh your ass off go look at Jinsem's posts in the officials game design>treasure folder starting at like post 1806. He says he was corrected by not wrong, admits that it is impossible to measure charges accurately, and yet says that he managed to accurately measure them.

Then, his enhancive godliness, who knows the most about enhancives because he has a bunch of MA accounts and buys them, ergo how could he not? Admits to apparently having skipped over the GM posts when GS4 was launched so he didn't even know to remove his items when not hunting. But of course, because he doesn't have those posts saved, they didn't exist. In fact he probably honestly believes he was the first person to ever remove an enhancive to save charges and that GMs didn't even implement that mechanic until he started doing it.

Such a bloody twit.

[Fallen]

This whole conflict is stupid, both on here and the officials. It is a tough subject to research, and bringing personal insults into the equation isn't helpful at all. Jinsem is far, far too uptight about criticism, and you're being rude, Viril. That being said, I think it is fairly definitive from what Zyllah posted that there are two ways to risk losing a charge,

1. Activating an item.
2. wearing an item

What surprises me is that there is no charge risk for DEactivating an item, however at this point I think Zyllah would have listed it if there was.

We don't see her mention if having MORE things enhanced via an item drains it faster, but logic dictates that it does. I am fairly confident that enhancive rates are weighted by the type of enhancive you have as well. Though at this point, unless someone has GM statements confirming or denying this, it isn't a definite.

In terms of the enhancive chart, lets post again what we have, and you people fill in the blanks if anything else comes up:

0. out of charges
1. a few
2. several charges
3. fair amount
4. quite a few
5. a lot
6. more than your average giantman can count/more than your average dwarf can count (depending on Bards race)
7. a huge number
8. almost innumerable

We also have this range for enhancives, though it seems to mostly apply to padding and temp equipment boosts (flares, TD boosts, etc):

It should be able to withstand an incredible amount of uses before its enhancement has completely degraded away.

I would put incredible amount as the top range of an enhancive item, as I believe incredible can be uncapped.

[Fallen]

My friend has an enhancive that has nearly infinite charges so all hope is not lost...heh

Also the current list looks like it will cover most of the enhancives out there. >>

Was reading carefully and saw this. Did you actually see the loresong readout and see it was nearly infinite? If so, that might be the Cap for enhancives, with the Withstand an incredible either 1 below it, OR only apply to weapons/shields/armor.

[crb]

This whole conflict is stupid, both on here and the officials. It is a tough subject to research, and bringing personal insults into the equation isn't helpful at all. Jinsem is far, far too uptight about criticism, and you're being rude, Viril. That being said, I think it is fairly definitive from what Zyllah posted that there are two ways to risk losing a charge,


Little fucker started it. I was just helping out posting what I new and that asshat came in and said I was wrong and I shouldn't post on the subject, purposefully being provactive, only to have his foot shoved into his mouth by Zyllah and be forced to admit his findings couldn't possibly be accurate. Jizzum has always been a little prick with his whole "I have 5 accounts, I know more than people with only 4 accounts, I cannot be wrong." attitude.

If he wants to post his shit fine, but he attacks me I'm going to put that dweeb in his place.

Is there a good word for someone who is arrogant about qualities he does not even possess?


We don't see her mention if having MORE things enhanced via an item drains it faster, but logic dictates that it does. I am fairly confident that enhancive rates are weighted by the type of enhancive you have as well. Though at this point, unless someone has GM statements confirming or denying this, it isn't a definite.

It has been posted. I once asked if it was possible to use PPs to add enhancives to something that already had them. I was told no, by Paul I think it was, and that even if I could I wouldn't want to because it would drain faster. I'm sure that Jinsem will claim that since he didn't know this it doesn't exist.



In terms of the enhancive chart, lets post again what we have, and you people fill in the blanks if anything else comes up:

0. out of charges
1. a few
2. several charges
3. fair amount
4. quite a few
5. a lot
6. more than your average giantman can count/more than your average dwarf can count (depending on Bards race)
7. a huge number
8. almost innumerable


I got an enhancive made with PPs more or less when they launched, and I've always used it intelligently, having been active on the boards when GS4 was launched and having read those early enhancive related guidelines GMs posted. I've had it for years now, never charged it, and it is still innumerable.

[Warriorbird]

Does being on the boards since GS4 launched matter? Especially when you've posted as much annoying crap as you have, crb?

I don't think so.

Both of you guys are somewhat intelligent. You should be sharing notes instead of bitching.

The Politics folder is for being a jerk.

[crb]

Go read the old posts in the treasure folder WB.

when I'm saying Jinsem doesn't think a post existed if he doesn't have a saved copy of it, I'm not lying. So ya... having been on the forums then DOES matter, because I read GM comments he apparently didn't... not that he'll admit such a thing is possible.

[Swami71]

My friend has an enhancive that has nearly infinite charges so all hope is not lost...heh

I didn't have the enhancive when I posted just new it was the highest i had seen in the new treasure system. I was wrong and it was almost innumerable. So that list is as good as I can get it for now.

[Morrff]

I cannot remember the merchants name that did the recent Dachres, however it was GM Liia's merchant and she directly told my 3 characters 3 different times that the dachres WILL degrade faster when worn/removed and it was wise to always wear them.
Maybe it works differently with these enhancers(I doubt it) but she was quite adamant that they will indeed wear faster without a doubt by wearing and removing them.

Also the bounty system does not always recharge enhancive items back to their original maximum amount of charges and it's my belief that the Dahcres and the "gift box" items they gave out at the turn of GSIII and GSIV will work the same when recharging them via the bounty system.

I remember my "gift box" enhancer lasted a LONG LONG(yrs) time and since having it filled through bounty points I would be hard pressed to say it lasted 1/10th the time it originally did(when there was no bounty system).

I was also told by another GM who I cannot remember(I know real helpful) that it used the last remaining charge it was currently working on when removing a WORN enhancive item and that held items(weapons, shields) worked differently. This was back when few enhancers were found through the old treasure system, about this time last year.

Player of Morrff's many

[Fallen]

The only things I have to clarify here are that it has specifically stated how the Adventurer's Guild recharge system works. However, I could have SWORN I maxed out the charges in a COL bracelet that died after 1 try. Anyway, what has been stated is it refills 1/5 the charges in an enhancive item. Maybe that has a lower end floor that if your item is like "Quite a few" It will cap it.

Premium Point enhancives come with a LOT of charges. I think they come charged to "Almost innumerable" every time.

[crb]

I cannot remember the merchants name that did the recent Dachres, however it was GM Liia's merchant and she directly told my 3 characters 3 different times that the dachres WILL degrade faster when worn/removed and it was wise to always wear them.
Maybe it works differently with these enhancers(I doubt it) but she was quite adamant that they will indeed wear faster without a doubt by wearing and removing them.


That doesn't conflict with what Zyllah said..

Obviously... you must remove it to wear it or rewear it, it is part and parcel of the process it. Once an item is worn, you cannot you know type "wear pin" over and over again without also removing. Doesn't mean that removing causes a loss.

[Jinsem]

If you wanna laugh your ass off go look at Jinsem's posts in the officials game design>treasure folder starting at like post 1806. He says he was corrected by not wrong, admits that it is impossible to measure charges accurately, and yet says that he managed to accurately measure them.

Then, his enhancive godliness, who knows the most about enhancives because he has a bunch of MA accounts and buys them, ergo how could he not? Admits to apparently having skipped over the GM posts when GS4 was launched so he didn't even know to remove his items when not hunting. But of course, because he doesn't have those posts saved, they didn't exist. In fact he probably honestly believes he was the first person to ever remove an enhancive to save charges and that GMs didn't even implement that mechanic until he started doing it.

Such a bloody twit.

Feel free to read it anyone. I think I'm safe on this.

http://www.play.net/forums/messages.asp?forum=102&category=6&topic=13&message=1839

You sure like to talk crap when people aren't around. But as I've always said, which you will probably twist into something else, if I don't know you, why do I care what you think? You obviously don't state the truth, not like I can edit an official post.

Enjoy your trolling. Withouts h8ters you'll never know if your doing stuff right :)

Jinsem
Le Yawn.

[Jinsem]

Little fucker started it. I was just helping out posting what I new and that asshat came in and said I was wrong and I shouldn't post on the subject, purposefully being provactive, only to have his foot shoved into his mouth by Zyllah and be forced to admit his findings couldn't possibly be accurate. Jizzum has always been a little prick with his whole "I have 5 accounts, I know more than people with only 4 accounts, I cannot be wrong." attitude.

I state what I know as fact and GM's correct it. Got a problem with that? As for the last part of your tirade, what? I get corrected a lot, I'm sure people will account for this :)


If he wants to post his shit fine, but he attacks me I'm going to put that dweeb in his place.

By typing text in a forum your putting me in my place? A battle at the lowest scale. Binary Battle! If you think typing about me and putting me down is going to "humble" me your probably wrong. You can rejoice that I may be without internet for a full year though! Starting next month. Rejoice and throw a party, please!


Is there a good word for someone who is arrogant about qualities he does not even possess?

Virilneus?


It has been posted. I once asked if it was possible to use PPs to add enhancives to something that already had them. I was told no, by Paul I think it was, and that even if I could I wouldn't want to because it would drain faster. I'm sure that Jinsem will claim that since he didn't know this it doesn't exist.

Uh, I've posted that several times? You lie too much. Enhancives have a single pool to withdraw charges from. The more enhancives you have the more chances you have to lose a charge. Thus the pool is atually smaller when you take all the enhancives into account.

Seriously, lie better.
Am I done yet?

Jinsem

[Jinsem]

The only things I have to clarify here are that it has specifically stated how the Adventurer's Guild recharge system works. However, I could have SWORN I maxed out the charges in a COL bracelet that died after 1 try. Anyway, what has been stated is it refills 1/5 the charges in an enhancive item. Maybe that has a lower end floor that if your item is like "Quite a few" It will cap it.

Premium Point enhancives come with a LOT of charges. I think they come charged to "Almost innumerable" every time.

Just sung all 3 of mine:
The trinket looks to have almost innumerable charges remaining.

Have to get that crumbly thing taken care of still :( And yes, I will still stand by the 20% for an item to be recharged at the ADG guy. I'm sure Mr. CRaB will get on his soapbox and say something else, or maybe he'll even say he told me it...

Also I think I already went over how it works for smaller charged items, if I didn't I can again.

Jinsem
Mr. CRaB = Too Easy.

[crb]

Jizzum I don't even know how you manage to get through the day with the brain damage you most assuredly have.

I posted something that was right, you said I was an idiot and I shouldn't post and then posted something that was wrong. Zyllah showed you were wrong, I mean, zyllah corrected your inaccuracy, god knows you're never wrong.

You then continued to insist that your conclusions had to be accurate because you had 5 accounts to test with, despite the fact that you thought that removing an item had a chance to drain a charge. To someone with say, an 8th grade education, having an assumption under which you run an experiment proved wrong means that your experiment is invalid. You literally had to have thought that charges were being drained twice as often as they were.

Then you admit that there is no way for players to ever know when a charge is drained, only when there is a chance for one to be drained, and you admit that there is no way for players to know exact charges, only the ball park figures provided by singing, yet you insist despite all these uncontrolled variables your experiment is sound enough and accurate, accurate enough for you to denounce any player or GM who says something that doesn't match with it.

The fact that you look back on your posts on the officials and not see anything wrong with it is truly amazing.


But when something, like the bracer a couple of posts up from this one, has a lot of charges left, a few charges left... what exactly is a charge? Is there a standard duration? Is this stuff even documented?


when handling an item it has a chance to use a charge.

when wearing an item every 10 minutes or so it has a chance to use a charge.



<<when wearing an item every 10 minutes or so it has a chance to use a charge.>>-V

Please don't say things you don't understand. Also make sure to say it all if you are going to pretend to help.

1 - Get/Put an item.
One chance per each use of the verb.

2 - Holding the item. (Like a weapon or shield)
From my limited studies it's closer to the Mana Pulses.

3 - Wearing the item. (Like a GiftBox item, or other wearable item)
Same as #2.




<<You actually don't have a chance to lose a charge when getting the item. The only items that happens on are weapons, shields, or runestaves since then you are wielding the item for its use. If it is a pinworn item you can grab it out of your cloak and put it up as much as you want and you won't lose charges by doing so.>>-Adam

It can happen with any enchancive according to the notes from the discussions I had over in the FWI folders.

<<so is there a definate number associated with the terms "a small number" "a large number" "a huge number" "more than your average dwarf could count" etc? >>

Yes. Although it seems I'm the only person with the info, and I don't plan to post it.



If you are going to not be using them for over 3 minutes take it off. This applies to people differently as you might suspect. A power hunter is logged in very long hours, by removing the enhancive you save a lot of chances to lose a charge. If your a hour here, hour there type, it won't impact you as much.

Like Carabele my giftbox items lasted quite some time before they ran out, I left them on all the time too (Noob, obviously you missed the earliest GM posts on enhancives - the ones that don't exist right? - added by CRB), . When I got them recharged I removed them when I wasn't using them, they've lasted for nearly 2 years now and not even half used.



<<1 - Get/Put an item.
One chance per each use of the verb.>>

Not quite. Activating the item is when it has a chance to lose a charge. If it's activated by GET, such a weapon in your hand, then GET has a chance to lose a charge. If it's an item that is worn, then using WEAR activates it and has a chance to lose a charge. Removing an item or putting it away has no chance to lose a charge.

Zyllah




>Please don't say things you don't understand. Also make sure to say it all if you are going to pretend to help.

Did a family pet die this morning or is this your normal sunny disposition?

What I posted was a direct quote from Ildran, the 10 minute figure is not something I came up with and then through my arrogance decided was accurate, he is the one who posted it. I really don't care what your "limited" studies say. Maybe YOU should be the one not posting what you don't understand or don't know about.



>If you are going to not be using them for over 3 minutes take it off. This applies to people differently as you might suspect. A power hunter is logged in very long hours, by removing the enhancive you save a lot of chances to lose a charge. If your a hour here, hour there type, it won't impact you as much.

Jinsem, Please don't say things you don't understand. Also make sure to say it all if you are going to pretend to help. You are incorrect. It is 10 minutes.




>Not quite. Activating the item is when it has a chance to lose a charge. If it's activated by GET, such a weapon in your hand, then GET has a chance to lose a charge. If it's an item that is worn, then using WEAR activates it and has a chance to lose a charge. Removing an item or putting it away has no chance to lose a charge.

Thanks for clarifying that Zyllah. Jinsem, you may want to check your assumptions for your, I'm sure, meticulously done testing.



<<What I posted was a direct quote from Ildran, the 10 minute figure is not something I came up with and then through my arrogance decided was accurate, he is the one who posted it. I really don't care what your "limited" studies say. Maybe YOU should be the one not posting what you don't understand or don't know about.>>-V

Funny since I don't have a post like that. I do have a few vague ones by him that cover the depletion of charges. As it stands now I'm probably the top authority on enhancives. Your the top authority at being .... Email sent!

<<V's other posts>>

Soap box and posturing for a position. Classic. Email sent!

<<Didn't you already post on this? Why would you say it again if you already "corrected" him?>>-NewKidOnTheBlock

If you call out one person, you may want to cover down and correct others that are doing the same thing. EO in full effect.

Jinsem
It's why I don't post info anymore, make sure to thank him.

(bold added for emphasis on the amazing arrogance of Jizzum, he's kind of a big deal don't ya know)



Funny since I don't have a post like that. I do have a few vague ones by him that cover the depletion of charges. As it stands now I'm probably the top authority on enhancives. Your the top authority at being .... Email sent!

Do you realize how arrogant you sound? Because you don't have a saved copy of it, it doesn't exist and never happened, and because you think you're the #1 expert on enhancives, you consider your opinions beyond reproach.

Zyllah already correct one thing which you stated as an unequivocal fact, you might want to start eating that humble pie now, before its too late.

Well Mr. Enhancive Guru, I actually started removing my giftbox item tne day GS4 launched, you musta missed those early posts by GMs (posts you also obviously don't have, hence I guess they don't exist?) because apparently your godliness failed to catch on until after it had been depleted once. For shame.

Though, I don't claim to be Mr. Enhancive Guru, I'm just Ildran's Parrot. He said that your chance to drain a change from handling is equivalent to your chance from 10 minutes of wearing. Actually, as I recall, he said it twice in different threads. They weren't announcements or heavily conversed forums as I recall.

Though, I am curious, how you so definitively test something Jinsem which allows you to so forcefully present your opinion as fact when...

1. Players have no way to get accurate charge levels, only ballpark ranges.
2. Nothing drains charges all the time, everything merely has a chance to drain charges, and we never see the rolls.
3. One of your assumptions was already stated to be blatantly incorrect. You thought you'd have a chance to lose a charge on get and put, and that is not true, so half the time you thought you were creating a chance to lose a charge, you weren't. Ergo, any testing you did under that assumption wouldn't be accurate (not that it could be that accurate anyways thanks to 1 and 2)... which again makes me question why exactly you're so confident in your conclusions.

I wish Simu had reasonable modern forum software so we could just do an archive search and settle it. Or of course, if Ildran would settle it.






Reply

<<Though, I am curious, how you so definitively test something Jinsem which allows you to so forcefully present your opinion as fact when...>>-V

You remove it and sing it after every hunt, over a period of months it goes down and you save the results in a text file that doesn't exist. I had 5 to play with.

<<1. Players have no way to get accurate charge levels, only ballpark ranges.>>

Correct. I've never said I know the exact amount per level, only there are levels. Also, we were told how many charges are in a giftbox when fully charged, but the my file doesn't exist :( We were also told about the dropped items and there cap to charges held, they were referenced to giftbox items for comparison.

<<Nothing drains charges all the time, everything merely has a chance to drain charges, and we never see the rolls.>>

Um, duh?

<<One of your assumptions was already stated to be blatantly incorrect. You thought you'd have a chance to lose a charge on get and put, and that is not true, so half the time you thought you were creating a chance to lose a charge, you weren't.>>

Reread it? I wasn't wrong I was corrected, and it's not a semantical debate. Ildran never stated that when we discussed it the few times it's been brought up. I also stated I didn't know that, and would add it to my non-existintal file. So I was right, just didn't know wearable items worked a bit differently. Posture all over that though :)

<<I wish Simu had reasonable modern forum software so we could just do an archive search and settle it. Or of course, if Ildran would settle it.>>

I'm always willing to be proven wrong, and if you know my past you'll know that GM's will jump through hoops to do so.

Personally I care less if you don't think I know what I am talking about, it's just like Charge Item. I use it without too much effort yet the people that say I am wrong have nothing but issues with it, I see a pattern :)

Jinsem
Is that more in line with your desire of posting style Emepoo ;)



I shudder to think the arrogance that had to have been seeping from the posts of yours that had gotten removed.

[crb]

Now Jizzum, I must ask, is your animosity towards me still just a result of me outbidding you for the AD wand at the EG auction? I mean, that is literally the only time I have ever interacted with you or any of your alts in game. I know you took that loss pretty hard, though what your bard was going to do with the wand I have no idea.

[Jinsem]

I posted something that was right, you said I was an idiot and I shouldn't post and then posted something that was wrong. Zyllah showed you were wrong, I mean, zyllah corrected your inaccuracy, god knows you're never wrong.

Z posted that your absurb 10 minutes this was right? Can you highlight for me, it seems your fond of it. I also had no problem saying I was incorrect, I could probably read through all your snippets and find what I actually said. It'd probably sound something like "That's not how I was told be Ildran."



You then continued to insist that your conclusions had to be accurate because you had 5 accounts to test with, despite the fact that you thought that removing an item had a chance to drain a charge.

This is fun cause I've already proved the above wrong. Your LYING. I said I had 5 items to test with, I also stated I removed it and sang it. You actually quoted it for me, thanks :) 12th table down?


I shudder to think the arrogance that had to have been seeping from the posts of yours that had gotten removed.

If it was the FWI section it was removed because of ANTI-SIMU antics. Emepoo gets heated over that for some reason :)

[crb]

Z posted that your absurb 10 minutes this was right? Can you highlight for me, it seems your fond of it. I also had no problem saying I was incorrect, I could probably read through all your snippets and find what I actually said. It'd probably sound something like "That's not how I was told be Ildran."

English lesson.

When I say "Zyllah posted you were wrong" it is not the same thing as saying "Zyllah posted I was right."

All GMs refused to confirm or deny my claim. Take that for what you will.

[Jinsem]

Now Jizzum, I must ask, is your animosity towards me still just a result of me outbidding you for the AD wand at the EG auction? I mean, that is literally the only time I have ever interacted with you or any of your alts in game. I know you took that loss pretty hard, though what your bard was going to do with the wand I have no idea.

While I'm unsure whatthat has to do with it, I can say no. I wasn't happy, I'm sure anyone that knows me knew that. But that wasn't it, and it was for my sorc. I do have one :) I guess I should say my loss was my gain too, since I got my Black Ora item, while kinda uninspiring, is still neat.

My issue with you, like a few others is your whining and arrogance. You either cry over something like a little girl getting 1 pigtail chopped off, or you posture over everyone telling them your all that and a bag of chips.

Now you get to reply, repeat everything you've already said and I get to use your quoting skills for my own gain.

Perhaps we should start our own thread so we can have some more fun and not bore everyone, or should we...

Jinsem
Having fun!

[grenthor]

:medieval: FORUM FIGHT!!!:medieval:

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c157/bingo969/Fight-1.jpg

[crb]

Pot kettle.

I wish I'd not deleted those emails you sent me bitching.

I'm opinionated, I've played a long time and have had time to develop both opinions and knowledge, I don't back down from an argument and have no problems posting about things I do not agree with. I am no cheerleader or yesman. You may call that whining, if it helps you be dismissive of what is being said by calling it whining, thats fine. Personally I think accusations of whining are probably overused in this community.

But I really gotta draw the line at you calling me arrogant. I don't go around claiming to be the expert on things, to the point of saying "As it stands now I'm probably the top authority on enhancives. " In fact I'll say right now I doubt I'm the top authority on any game system. I did co-discover the original spellburst formula with Chuckaar, but that doesn't exist anymore. Jesse knows more than me about necromancy. Sereg knows more than me about Demons. Mekthros or Evarin probably know more about scrolls. I know a lot about Alchemy, but only because I finished it, others know more, or will one day. Hmm... I do know a lot about OTF, but only from the standpoint of a few professions, so I'm hardly the top most expert. Can't think of anything else I'd even come close in.

Ah ha... I got one... I'm the foremost expert on how my own website works! There ya go!

[Morrff]

2310

I can confirm that Premium enhancers have the largest pool of charges IG. Whether it was in question still or not...I definitely confirmed that they do! I just confirmed this today a few hours ago, so it was newly confirmed news to me...

Now feel free continuing to verbally :club: each other!

[Audriana]

?? You mean to tell me that you get something enhanced after paying and waiting for 18 months and you still have to charge it up? It's still temporary?

[Morrff]

I'm not sure where you're getting that exactly, from my posts or someone elses, either way answer is:

No it comes fully charged and so long as you do not have them put the enhancement on a crumbly item the item will be able to be charged via AvG bounty point system after the last remaining charge wears off.

What I was mentioning is that the PP enchancive items have MORE charges in their pool then any other items.

EDIT: I think I misunderstood the question...Answer is YES it does wear out of charges, however it's quite easy to refill it and does not cost all that many BP's depending on what you have and how fast the charges drain

[Drevihyin]

This thread sure made the last couple of hours at work more enjoyable!

:thanx:

Drevihyin

[Fallen]

I can confirm that Premium enhancers have the largest pool of charges IG. Whether it was in question still or not...I definitely confirmed that they do! I just confirmed this today a few hours ago, so it was newly confirmed news to me... >>

This is almost always true, but you will find that auction quality enhancive items can be over charged with a far, far higher amount to start out. Once they drop down below a certain point they can only be brought back up to its highest limit, but they can start above it.

[Morrff]

This is almost always true, but you will find that auction quality enhancive items can be over charged with a far, far higher amount to start out. Once they drop down below a certain point they can only be brought back up to its highest limit, but they can start above it.

I was thinking perhaps they tied with the giftbox enhancers, I've yet to and doubt I ever will find an enhancer that lasts as long as those did(before they have been refilled)

Maybe the Dahcres will surprize me in that effect, I've yet to have one wear off and I've been removing/wearing one of them and never taken off the other, both with the exact same enhancive qualities also done the same day....Time will tell.

[Fallen]

Eh, I am talking about true auction items, like the 605 item and such, not door prizes to a shitty non-pay event.

[Jinsem]

I was thinking perhaps they tied with the giftbox enhancers, I've yet to and doubt I ever will find an enhancer that lasts as long as those did(before they have been refilled)

Maybe the Dahcres will surprize me in that effect, I've yet to have one wear off and I've been removing/wearing one of them and never taken off the other, both with the exact same enhancive qualities also done the same day....Time will tell.

Let's see, it's been a while since I've had a reply to one of my posts and I'm kinda going through withdrawls... So let me say this and see what I get. You can either beleive me or not, up to you.

Giftbox items have exactly half the charges the PP items get. True, or false? Did a GM post this or didn't they. Am I just making this up to get attention from someone who loves to threaten me with walls of text?

Could be, or I COULD know what I am talking about.

Jinsem
Carry on.

[Morrff]

I have no clue what relation the giftbox enhancers actually have compared to anything other then my experience when I got them and how long they lasted, of course this was before many enhancive items even existed and I did very little to no testing. I was just shocked how long the brand new items lasted(I didn't for a time think they were ever going to run out).

I don't know if some GM/officially or unofficially posted that comparison. I do happen to know that according to one of, if not THE most credible persons I know still playing this game and who actually knows these things factually(the actual #'s themselves)... Did inform me that PP enhancing an item leaves the largest pool of charges available currently in an enhancive item.

Which isn't to rule out that Dahcres and other grand auction items don't have the same pool or are overcharged to begin with. I was specifically asking about PP enhancing without any regards to other enhancive items.

[crb]

It was posted that PP enhancives are comparable to giftbox ones, and vice versa.

This was after Jinsem started reading forums, so he didn't miss it, like so many others.

[Jinsem]

It was posted that PP enhancives are comparable to giftbox ones, and vice versa.

This was after Jinsem started reading forums, so he didn't miss it, like so many others.

You need to remove those ruby tinted glasses. Seriously. How is 750 (made up?) comparable to 1500(made up?)? I mean come one, try to give me a hard time or something. I've had better battles with Nodrye, and that's just sad.

Ildran put out a crapload of info when the system first came out. I have a special place in my black heart for this system. Get over yourself, or look into 2 mirrors facing each other and give yourself a hug. I may help you a bit.

As for the board comments, really? I've been annoying people for more then just a few months. So uh, really?

Jinsem

[Swami71]

As you sing, you feel a faint resonating vibration from the green garnet circlet in your hand...

The circlet resonates with your voice, indicating that it enhances its owner in the following ways:
It provides a bonus of 3 to Magic Item Use Ranks.
This enhancement may not be used by adventurers who have not trained 28 times.
The circlet looks to have quite a few charges remaining.

You sense that the green garnet circlet will crumble into dust after its last enhancive charge has been expended.

You sense that the green garnet circlet will disintegrate after its last magical charge has been expended.

>order 5
Edrelsk takes your circlet and peers at it through a large green crystal lens. He hands it back, saying, "I can charge this up a bit. It'll cost 21600 of your bounty points, though."



The magical strength of this item is strong. It could probably handle the imbedding of an entirely new spell, if handled with care.

The stickpin resonates with your voice, indicating that it enhances its owner in the following ways:
It provides a bonus of 6 to Harness Power Bonus.
This enhancement may not be used by adventurers who have not trained 21 times.
The stickpin looks to have more than your average giantman could count charges remaining.

You sense that the inset pewter stickpin will crumble into dust after its last enhancive charge has been expended.

You sense that the inset pewter stickpin will persist after its last magical charge has been expended.

>order 5
Edrelsk takes your stickpin and peers at it through a large green crystal lens. He hands it back, saying, "I can charge this up a bit. It'll cost 7560 of your bounty points, though."


Found this interesting how much more the smaller one cost to recharge. I think both of these started with a huge amount of charges too and I've been wearing them the same amount of time. First one is head worn and the second is pin. I guess part of it is ranks compared to bonus. Bonus being cheaper to charge.

[droit]

Bumping an old thread to see if anyone has quantified the enhancive charge levels (i.e. a "fair amount" of charges = 5-10, etc.).

[Asrial]

Adventurer's Guild Badge Value Loresong

nothing = 1 silver

+1 to dexterity bonus (but empty) = 22k

after 1 recharge = 22k (quite a few)
after 2 recharges = 44k (a lot)
after 3 recharges = 66k (average giantman)
after 4 recharges = 88k (huge)
after 5 recharges = 100k (huge)

.

I charged up another badge to full and will watch if/how the price changes over time.

While it may not get us an exact charge list.. we might be able to use value to determine percentage of charges remaining.

[crb]

Bumping an old thread to see if anyone has quantified the enhancive charge levels (i.e. a "fair amount" of charges = 5-10, etc.).

Yes, someone has, a list is posted somewhere.

At one of the merchant events a recharger gave us actual charge numbers as her quotes, so it was pretty easy to figure out.

Suprisingly enough, the charge values are really low (single digits for a lot of treasure enhancives, PP ones topping out at 150), meaning the chance to lose a charge must also be really tiny.

I don't remember the full list, but it is somewhere.

[Jinsem]

(single digits for a lot of treasure enhancives, PP ones topping out at 150)

Unless they changed the "Enhancive System" this is VERY wrong. Ildran made a mistake when the PP system came out and spilled some beans. After that another GM made a simple statement that made figuring out the PP charges, and the giftbox charges. After that it was easy enough to figure out the charge amounts.

Shocking no one has this down yet.

Jinsem
Care less if anyone thinks I have it or not.

[Asrial]

Shocking no one has this down yet.Probably because no one really cares enough to research it :P

I'm only interested because I'm curious about having an accurate understanding of charge explanations with loresinging.

[Asrial]

0-20 charges = a lot (fully charged fusion weapon (2 charges from AG) and human/helf only jewelry)

fresh +6 brawling vambrace (huge) + 20 more charges = innumerable

Anyone have an idea of how many charges the vambrace has stock?

.

middling skill = 90 (bonus or ranks) -- Ebon Gate harness power human/helf only jewelry

strong amount = 50 ranks -- Ebon Gate enhancive brawling vambraces

.

Here's a nice little tidbit...

AUCHAND: "The AG does 10 charges per charge. This is known." (11/5/10)

[Asrial]

So unless someone wants to chime in with refuting data...

AG Badge Maximum Capacity = 50 charges

0. out of charges
1. a few
2. several charges
3. fair amount
4. quite a few -- 10 charges
5. a lot -- 20 charges
6. more than your average -- 30 charges
7. a huge number -- 40 and 50 charges
8. almost innumerable
.
.
? nearly infinite amount

.

At least it's enough to start with to determine when to do something with a crumbly enhancive (IE: toss it in a locker for fusion).

[Fleurs]

Enhancive jewelry is always more valuable as jewelry, crumbly or not.