Another rogue retrain thread

[ravashaak]

So like many, I've recently returned to the lands after a long hiatus. I've been scrambling to perform as much research as possible considering all the changes to ambush, CMAN, guild, and so much else. I will need to retrain my body to fit with the new times.

I'm an OHE ambusher who likes to stay in the shadows and stance dance when necessary. I like to solo hunt. I also want to be able to pick my own boxes throughout my career (at least 95% of them, absolute worst case). Redux is nice, but I plan to wear padded plate by 70 or so trains, so redux isn't my primary concern. I'm a CoL master as well so keep the signs in minds when it comes to my mana, etc. I also presently plan to learn up to 406 since I like my brights. However, since it's only +10 to DS, I guess I could be convinced otherwise, so long as it's not the redux argument. Either way, I'd definitely want up to 404. I want to be able to use scrolls possibly for things like brills and other enhacing spells, when a caster cannot be found. I don't want to be completely hamstrung when I cannot get massies, etc. MIU for basic embeddables and unstun wands, blah blah blah. I also plan to ambush with a small blade where appropriate, for accuracy's sake. I still have some work to do on my guild skills (as you'll see below) but am willing to devote the time to it. I probably won't devote any points to pickpocket, even though it can be fun, rewarding, and sometimes neat for RP. I also want enough climb and swim to get anywhere I will need to get.

STATS

>info start
Level 0 Stats for Ravashaak, Half-Elf Rogue

Strength (STR): 40
Constitution (CON): 40
Dexterity (DEX): 80
Agility (AGI): 70
Discipline (DIS): 70
Aura (AUR): 80
Logic (LOG): 70
Intuition (INT): 70
Wisdom (WIS): 70
Influence (INF): 70

>info
Name: Ravashaak Une-Makhar Race: Half-Elf Profession: Rogue (not shown)
Gender: Male Age: 108 Expr: 3838365 Level: 64
Normal (Bonus) ... Enhanced (Bonus)
Strength (STR): 79 (14) ... 79 (14)
Constitution (CON): 68 (9) ... 68 (9)
Dexterity (DEX): 100 (30) ... 100 (30)
Agility (AGI): 100 (35) ... 100 (35)
Discipline (DIS): 87 (13) ... 87 (13)
Aura (AUR): 92 (21) ... 92 (21)
Logic (LOG): 89 (19) ... 89 (19)
Intuition (INT): 93 (21) ... 93 (21)
Wisdom (WIS): 79 (14) ... 79 (14)
Influence (INF): 85 (22) ... 85 (22)
Mana: 120 Silver: 0

Guild Skills

>gld skills
You are a member of the Rogue Guild.
You are current with your dues and must check in again sometime in the next 28 days.
You currently have 107 ranks out of a possible 331 for your training.

You have 56 ranks in the Sweep skill.
You need 54 training points to earn your next rank.
The Training Administrator told you to practice sweeping creatures.
You have 9 repetitions remaining to complete this task.

You have 5 ranks in the Subdue skill.
You are not currently training in this skill.

You have 13 ranks in the Stun Maneuvers skill.
You are not currently training in this skill.

You have 5 ranks in the Cheap Shot skill.
You are not currently training in this skill.

You have 33 ranks in the Rogue Gambits skill.
You are not currently training in this skill.

I plan to go ahead and master sweep since I am so close, but beyond that I am open to any suggestions. I'll likely pick up lock mastery as much as I dread doing it. Any other guild training suggestions are certainly appreciated. I have ideas, but nothing set in stone.

I've been working with Tsoran's spreadsheet in an attempt to come up with a viable training plan which would result in hunting/picking viability now (at 64 trains) as well as the same to the cap.

Proposed Skill Allocation:
Skill Ranks
Armor Use..........................| 130
Shield Use.........................| 65
Combat Maneuvers...................| 90
Edged Weapons......................| 130
Ambush.............................| 130
Physical Fitness...................| 55 (low but is that so bad?)
Dodging............................| 95 (how bad to not do 2x?)
Harness Power......................| 8
Disarming Traps....................| 148
Picking Locks......................| 150
Stalking and Hiding................| 130
Perception.........................| 65 (is this enough to hit my ambush mark and for disarming traps, etc?)
Climbing...........................| 20
Swimming...........................| 20
Arcane Symbols.....................| 4 (enough/too much?)
Magic Item Use.....................| 9 (enough/too much?)

Spell Lists
Minor Elemental....................| 6

Once I get enough ranks to wear plate, I will drop armor training. Since I will have no more spells to research that also frees up points. I could redirect some of those points into CM, Dodging, MIU, or other skills. Like I said, I will also pursue whatever guild skills will assist me with hunting and locksmithing. What sorts of CMAN skills do you suggest, considering my goals? Does anyone see any glaring faults in my plan? I'm open to any suggestions here as I prepare to FIXSKILLS. Thanks for taking the time to read and to reply!

- Ravashaak

[The Ponzzz]

As a rogue, take advantage of 3x in locksmith skills, dodge or hiding. I feel your dodge is a bit too low at 64.

[Asha]

Ponzzz your avatar is fucking awesome. :)

[The Ponzzz]

Don't you just want to taste the frosting in the cup?

[Asha]

rofl I couldn't, even though I KNOW it's just creme frosting.

[The Ponzzz]

http://www.morningstarr.co.uk/forum/images/smilies/2girls1cup.gif

:lolwave:

[LadyLaphrael]

If you plan to pick, you want to have at least 10 ranks in arcane symbols alone for scarab and glyph traps, 15 if you want to guarantee you're in the clear. Besides, more AS training is going to increase your scroll-invoked spell length. If you plan to make good use of your guild skills, crank up that physical fitness to at -least- 1x if not higher just for the stamina and stamina-recovery, if not for the added redux too. I'm sure you've seen the dozens of "What CMan should I choose" threads - Surge and Mobility are the two prime candidates in my opinion. If you're 64, you're going to be prime for moving into the Krag/Minotaur region soon (they got bumped to levels 71-78 in the last few months), so you'll need to boost your climbing up significantly if you want them to be a viable hunting option.

If you want to master LM easily, make friends with sorcerers/wizards who bring back dozens of boxes from a hunt at a time. I was at the point of earning almost a rank per day with the help I had.

[NocturnalRob]

i look at this and realize that at 258 ranks at level 56, I am a goddamned guild whore.

and if you want to reliably open/disarm 95% of your boxes, i would suggest 3x in lockpick/disarm. i would also advise that you stop at 404 until after cap. the points you put into 405/406 are put to better use in AS, MIU, and HP at this point.

[ravashaak]

Thanks for the input so far everyone. This is the kind of advice I was hoping for.

LadyLaphrael:
Thanks for the advice. That's the kind of stuff I was looking for. As for the minotaurs, do you think I'd be able to pick their boxes? Also, what kind of climb skill might I need for the area? I'm attempting to research it now, but let me know if you know off the top of your head. Thanks!

I think I stole your dirt the other day in the courtyard, so it's pretty big of you to help me out here :P

NocturnalRob:
You might not be a guild whore as much as I have been a guild slacker. Anyway, what does HP get me beyond more mana, which I am not sure I will need?

I'm not sure if I will be able to squeeze in 3x pick/disarm, but I will see what I can do to get closer. Thanks for the advice there.

[NocturnalRob]

HP gets you mana. That's about it. I have 5 ranks which has been fine so far for CoL and lores. Sometimes though when I'm cranking out 15-20 boxes, I run out of mana. And waiting around for pulses is not something I like to do.

You're fine with 8 ranks, I think. That might even be a couple too many.

[LadyLaphrael]

Yeti boxes will almost certainly be doable for you, but minotaurs (especially magi) can get difficult fast. My highest trap at level 72 is currently a -456, and it came off a magi, but that was one hell of a spike compared to their norm. Some magi locks spike into the 1000s, but they're generally in the 700-900 range.

I have 50 ranks in climb and have little problem other than a 3 second stumble from time to time trying to get up the landslide to lesser minotaurs, unencumbered. At 40 ranks, I would occasionally fall hard.

I have 7 ranks in HP and rarely, if ever, have any trouble loring my way through a pile of really difficult boxes, even with shutting off 404 and 403 as necessary for max XP gain. That's sitting on a node, but still...not a problem regardless.

You stole my dirt? Heh, I think I remember that and thought to myself "Yeesh, get guildx, why don't you?" It will run the sweep circuit for you and bypass any room that someone else is in, which is pretty nice.

On that note, look for the guildx script. (On occasion) It's really useful for hammering through tasks, but not without some amount of tweaking to fit your personal needs.

[ravashaak]

I'll pick up guildx. I was using another script that I had modified. Of course, it didn't account for other occupants in a room, and you happened to be the first person I ran across sweeping dirt, hence showing me the obvious flaw I somehow didn't think of. I like how I apologized, but that didn't stop the script from scooping up more dirt right after the fact. Haha I felt like an ass! ::grin::

Anyway, one more question about minotaurs and then I promise I'll leave you alone. I hear the warriors can disarm you. I normally avoid critters which disarm, especially since at first I will be using some loaner gear. Do you do anything special to avoid being disarmed? How bad is it?

- Ravashaak

[Widgets]

So like many, I've recently returned to the lands after a long hiatus. I've been scrambling to perform as much research as possible considering all the changes to ambush, CMAN, guild, and so much else. I will need to retrain my body to fit with the new times.

I'm an OHE ambusher who likes to stay in the shadows and stance dance when necessary. I like to solo hunt. I also want to be able to pick my own boxes throughout my career (at least 95% of them, absolute worst case). Redux is nice, but I plan to wear padded plate by 70 or so trains, so redux isn't my primary concern. I'm a CoL master as well so keep the signs in minds when it comes to my mana, etc. I also presently plan to learn up to 406 since I like my brights. However, since it's only +10 to DS, I guess I could be convinced otherwise, so long as it's not the redux argument. Either way, I'd definitely want up to 404. I want to be able to use scrolls possibly for things like brills and other enhacing spells, when a caster cannot be found. I don't want to be completely hamstrung when I cannot get massies, etc. MIU for basic embeddables and unstun wands, blah blah blah. I also plan to ambush with a small blade where appropriate, for accuracy's sake. I still have some work to do on my guild skills (as you'll see below) but am willing to devote the time to it. I probably won't devote any points to pickpocket, even though it can be fun, rewarding, and sometimes neat for RP. I also want enough climb and swim to get anywhere I will need to get.

STATS

>info start
Level 0 Stats for Ravashaak, Half-Elf Rogue

Strength (STR): 40
Constitution (CON): 40
Dexterity (DEX): 80
Agility (AGI): 70
Discipline (DIS): 70
Aura (AUR): 80
Logic (LOG): 70
Intuition (INT): 70
Wisdom (WIS): 70
Influence (INF): 70

>info
Name: Ravashaak Une-Makhar Race: Half-Elf Profession: Rogue (not shown)
Gender: Male Age: 108 Expr: 3838365 Level: 64
Normal (Bonus) ... Enhanced (Bonus)
Strength (STR): 79 (14) ... 79 (14)
Constitution (CON): 68 (9) ... 68 (9)
Dexterity (DEX): 100 (30) ... 100 (30)
Agility (AGI): 100 (35) ... 100 (35)
Discipline (DIS): 87 (13) ... 87 (13)
Aura (AUR): 92 (21) ... 92 (21)
Logic (LOG): 89 (19) ... 89 (19)
Intuition (INT): 93 (21) ... 93 (21)
Wisdom (WIS): 79 (14) ... 79 (14)
Influence (INF): 85 (22) ... 85 (22)
Mana: 120 Silver: 0

Guild Skills

>gld skills
You are a member of the Rogue Guild.
You are current with your dues and must check in again sometime in the next 28 days.
You currently have 107 ranks out of a possible 331 for your training.

You have 56 ranks in the Sweep skill.
You need 54 training points to earn your next rank.
The Training Administrator told you to practice sweeping creatures.
You have 9 repetitions remaining to complete this task.

You have 5 ranks in the Subdue skill.
You are not currently training in this skill.

You have 13 ranks in the Stun Maneuvers skill.
You are not currently training in this skill.

You have 5 ranks in the Cheap Shot skill.
You are not currently training in this skill.

You have 33 ranks in the Rogue Gambits skill.
You are not currently training in this skill.

I plan to go ahead and master sweep since I am so close, but beyond that I am open to any suggestions. I'll likely pick up lock mastery as much as I dread doing it. Any other guild training suggestions are certainly appreciated. I have ideas, but nothing set in stone.

I've been working with Tsoran's spreadsheet in an attempt to come up with a viable training plan which would result in hunting/picking viability now (at 64 trains) as well as the same to the cap.

Proposed Skill Allocation:
Skill Ranks
Armor Use..........................| 130
Shield Use.........................| 65
Combat Maneuvers...................| 90
Edged Weapons......................| 130
Ambush.............................| 130
Physical Fitness...................| 55 (low but is that so bad?)
Dodging............................| 95 (how bad to not do 2x?)
Harness Power......................| 8
Disarming Traps....................| 148
Picking Locks......................| 150
Stalking and Hiding................| 130
Perception.........................| 65 (is this enough to hit my ambush mark and for disarming traps, etc?)
Climbing...........................| 20
Swimming...........................| 20
Arcane Symbols.....................| 4 (enough/too much?)
Magic Item Use.....................| 9 (enough/too much?)

Spell Lists
Minor Elemental....................| 6

Once I get enough ranks to wear plate, I will drop armor training. Since I will have no more spells to research that also frees up points. I could redirect some of those points into CM, Dodging, MIU, or other skills. Like I said, I will also pursue whatever guild skills will assist me with hunting and locksmithing. What sorts of CMAN skills do you suggest, considering my goals? Does anyone see any glaring faults in my plan? I'm open to any suggestions here as I prepare to FIXSKILLS. Thanks for taking the time to read and to reply!

- Ravashaak

Welcome Back Old Timer. Now here's hopin some more old friends come back, I may have to coax Kaustic, Vaktof and the gang to make a return as well.

[LadyLaphrael]

I think the greatest defense to disarming is to train in the CMan yourself, and you seem to certainly have plenty of CMan points floating around. Aside from that, either hunt with a friend who can pick up after you or go straight for right arm - if it doesn't lop off, it'll at least hurt their ability to disarm.

[The Ponzzz]

I pick up 3 ranks of disarm and feint to have defense against it. CMANs are easy to migrate around, so if you want skills like disarm for defense, perfect for doing that. With 3 ranks, you are considered safe against like level creatures. Meaning they only have about a 30-50% chance of hitting you. Seeing you're 64, you're going to get nailed pretty hard with disarm. Will be 20 second RTs with your weapon on the ground.

Warriors don't stun there, so the best thing to do it leg them fast. Then remove their right arm. That will stop just about everything they can do to you. But a lot of people feel they are wasting time doing that and go right for the eye/ead crits. I personally like to make my hunts a bit safer and take 5-10 seconds more to make that possible per creature. I also have ewave, which was a blessing in there.

However, I also play Platinum, so, droppage happens on death as well. I take a LOT more safety precautions.

[ravashaak]

Haha! Thanks Widgets!