To the market bringing silvers down below 10$/mil

[fallenSaint]

I hate you. That is all.

[Celephais]

It's not the market's fault... it's Simu's.
/Summon Lysanderesc "death of simu" thread.

[Some Rogue]

It's not the market's fault... it's Simu's.
/Summon Lysanderesc "death of simu" thread.

/conjure Methais

Methais: /casts level 8 Goatse of the infinite

Lysander asplodes.

[bubbauno]

It's not Simu's fault it's the people who are stupid and in such a rush they try to undercut everyone else to sell super fast.. Over time people are constantly forced to undercut more and more which has slowly brought the price down. It would be simple to get it back above 10 per if everyone agreed not to sell for lower than that but that will never happen cause the people who sell for that cheap are poor and obviously desperate to be willing to lose money. I just think it's retarded how people quote the "current price" as what some crazy desperate idiot sells at one time compared to the norm.

[Celephais]

:rofl: @ OSEC economics.

[NocturnalRob]

It's not Simu's fault it's the people who are stupid and in such a rush they try to undercut everyone else to sell super fast.. Over time people are constantly forced to undercut more and more which has slowly brought the price down. It would be simple to get it back above 10 per if everyone agreed not to sell for lower than that but that will never happen cause the people who sell for that cheap are poor and obviously desperate to be willing to lose money. I just think it's retarded how people quote the "current price" as what some crazy desperate idiot sells at one time compared to the norm.

says the guy who has access to 1/4 of the silvers in the game. your stock is dropping! sell, sell, sell!!

[Some Rogue]

Or fewer players = lower demand
no silver drain = higher supply

hence, lower silver costs.

I AM A FUCKING ECONOMIC GENIUS.

[Fallen]

And people wonder why they kicked the shit out of loot hunting.

[AestheticDeath]

I have to agree with Tsin.

It's just all the little guys, and a few of the one timers coming in, seeing others seeing at X amount, then saying they will sell for $1 less per mil. Several people do it at the same time, or someone comes in with a stock of like 300-500m like has happened several times in the last year, and they do the same thing.

There are too many silvers for sale, and to get yours sold over the other guys most people drop their price. I have been having to drop my prices because of it. And I still don't get very much silver sold.

I have never dropped below what someone else sells for, besides gsauctions I guess. But when 3-4 people are selling cheaper then me, I basically get no sales no matter how trustworthy I am.

[waywardgs]

It's not Simu's fault it's the people who are stupid and in such a rush they try to undercut everyone else to sell super fast.. Over time people are constantly forced to undercut more and more which has slowly brought the price down. It would be simple to get it back above 10 per if everyone agreed not to sell for lower than that but that will never happen cause the people who sell for that cheap are poor and obviously desperate to be willing to lose money. I just think it's retarded how people quote the "current price" as what some crazy desperate idiot sells at one time compared to the norm.

You just described how markets work... perfectly. Oh, and you also described price collusion... perfectly. I looked back through the threads... 1m used to be $15 8 months ago. Now 1m is $8. That's not from 'People who are stupid and in such a rush". That's the market. Econ 101.

[Fallen]

The addition of these premium items will help with the purchasing of silver to a small degree, but does nothing to address the problem in the long term. Silvers need to leave the lands in order for them to rise in value.

What makes silvers leave the lands in very large numbers?

Auctions and new expensive mechanical incentives/requirements.

It would be awesome if they sold stuff like +1 to a stat potions for 20 million each, up to a full 100 for the stat. People would blow billions.

[Widgets]

The addition of these premium items will help with the purchasing of silver to a small degree, but does nothing to address the problem in the long term. Silvers need to leave the lands in order for them to rise in value.

What makes silvers leave the lands in very large numbers?

Auctions and new expensive mechanical incentives/requirements.

It would be awesome if they sold stuff like +1 to a stat potions for 20 million each, up to a full 100 for the stat. People would blow billions.

And then there goes Game Balance!

...What may seem like one good idea at the time, could likely throw off 20 other things in the process.

[waywardgs]

And the other thing is that it's not Simu's responsibility to drain silvers from the lands in order to keep silver to dollar exchanges favorable to a few people who make money playing the game. Their responsibility is game balance, not profiting the players. They could care less if silvers went for a dollar a million. They don't want people selling em anyway.

[Gan]

You just described how markets work... perfectly. Oh, and you also described price collusion... perfectly. I looked back through the threads... 1m used to be $15 8 months ago. Now 1m is $8. That's not from 'People who are stupid and in such a rush". That's the market. Econ 101.

My GOD someone gets it.

It would tickle me to death if silvers dropped to $1 a million. Too bad you cant short sell here. ;)

[fallenSaint]

And the other thing is that it's not Simu's responsibility to drain silvers from the lands in order to keep silver to dollar exchanges favorable to a few people who make money playing the game. Their responsibility is game balance, not profiting the players. They could care less if silvers went for a dollar a million. They don't want people selling em anyway.

Actually thats wrong, if they arent worth shit for cash that means they arent worth shit in game either. You want a quality high end item your going to have to fork over a trade, coins arent cutting it much.

[waywardgs]

Actually thats wrong, if they arent worth shit for cash that means they arent worth shit in game either. You want a quality high end item your going to have to fork over a trade, coins arent cutting it much.

Um... if for some reason it were impossible to trade silvers for dollars... i still want that 10x mcp brig. It's still desirable. It's still valuable. The dollar/silver thing is just an exchange rate, not the reason for playing.


...at least... for me. I'm not playing GS so I can pay my rent, though.

Simu never designed the game or intended the game to have a real dollar value. That's what everyone seems to be forgetting.

[Fallen]

And then there goes Game Balance!

...What may seem like one good idea at the time, could likely throw off 20 other things in the process.

Uh, how would having all 100's unbalance the game? I'm nearly there myself. You DO know this is easily obtainable via enhancives, right?

[GS4Ranger]

I have never dropped below what someone else sells for, besides gsauctions I guess. But when 3-4 people are selling cheaper then me, I basically get no sales no matter how trustworthy I am.

I'm just waiting on my paycheck this week, then I'm contacting you :P

[AestheticDeath]

I'm just waiting on my paycheck this week, then I'm contacting you :P
Sweet, a customer!

It would be awesome if they sold stuff like +1 to a stat potions for 20 million each, up to a full 100 for the stat. People would blow billions.


And then there goes Game Balance!

...What may seem like one good idea at the time, could likely throw off 20 other things in the process.
I like the idea of permanent stat increases as well. It's not overpowering in the least. We used to be able to do this anyways without potions. All you had to do was place your stats right.

So long as you cap the permanent potions at 100 like before that is.

But that was one reason I was pissed at the new level caps, not only were they limiting a lot of skills, and the uberness of being a higher level than someone else, they made it so the highest possible stat total at cap is 990. And I think only one profession gets that high, everyone else is 980s or lower.
They should have redone the stat growth with the cap in such a way you can still max all stats.

And waywardgs, how exactly is the 'market' different from people selling low to get out from under something before someone else? I have not taken any classes in that area, but I thought the point of the market was to invest, and let the value grow. Not do a shit load of work so you can sell your investment cheaper than the next guy.

[crazymage]

One simple way for simu to implement a coin drainage is to make enhancives rechargable via silver and bounty points.

[Martaigne]

One simple way for simu to implement a coin drainage is to make enhancives rechargable via silver and bounty points.

And (non-permanent) breakage and repair.

[crazymage]

And (non-permanent) breakage and repair.

Yep. or introduce that mining system they had open during ebons gate.

[Celephais]

The idea that you can fix the silver value by holding out is extremely stupid. You're going to get undercut because it's not a limited resource, any asshole can sell silvers. The demand does not outweigh supply... silver prices are going to continue to fall.

OSEC. Organization of the silver exporting characters... it doesn't work.

[waywardgs]

Sweet, a customer!
And waywardgs, how exactly is the 'market' different from people selling low to get out from under something before someone else? I have not taken any classes in that area, but I thought the point of the market was to invest, and let the value grow. Not do a shit load of work so you can sell your investment cheaper than the next guy.


Th "market" is nothing more than a representation of the rules of supply and demand. In GS, a high supply + a low demand = low silver prices. It's simple math. The market is not a guarantor of increased value, there is no guarantee that your work will result in an end increase in value if the demand for your work decreases. The beauty of the market is that no one individual or group of individuals can control it for any length of time because, in the end, it's all about the math of supply vs. demand. The silver exchange rate is what it is not because you want your investment to "grow" but because it is the meeting place of people's willingness to pay vs. people's willingness to sell. The market is not there to make you money. It's not a governing body. It's a collection of interactions between humans that only cares about your investment in terms of how much other people care about your investment. It represents you and your influence and wealth only insofar as it relates to the influence and wealth of all the other people engaging in the market.

[Sablemane]

Wow, brings back my basic econ class back in college. You teach?

[GSMeureii]

Th "market" is nothing more than a representation of the rules of supply and demand. In GS, a high supply + a low demand = low silver prices. It's simple math. The market is not a guarantor of increased value, there is no guarantee that your work will result in an end increase in value if the demand for your work decreases. The beauty of the market is that no one individual or group of individuals can control it for any length of time because, in the end, it's all about the math of supply vs. demand. The silver exchange rate is what it is not because you want your investment to "grow" but because it is the meeting place of people's willingness to pay vs. people's willingness to sell. The market is not there to make you money. It's not a governing body. It's a collection of interactions between humans that only cares about your investment in terms of how much other people care about your investment. It represents you and your influence and wealth only insofar as it relates to the influence and wealth of all the other people engaging in the market.


I dont care about the thread too much as I don't sell silvers, but this post did sound intelligent. I just couldn't get past the first word missing a letter though! :club:

[AnticorRifling]

I dont care about the thread too much as I don't sell silvers, but this post did sound intelligent. I just couldn't get past the first word missing a letter though! :club:

'

People that live in stone houses shouldn't throw glass or something.