Endless Swarm of Merchants!?

[Peanut Butter Jelly Time]

I never thought I'd say there would be TOO MANY merchants running around, but there really has been recently. Either this is Simu's distraction ploy to hide the complete lack of significant improvement over the last two years, or simply their way of trying to hold the small hardcore fanbase that likely wouldn't leave anyway. Regardless, it's hideous.

Alterations used to be prized to quite a few people, and stumbling on a merchant was a great day for anyone, and now they're literally a daily event. When you have a span that carries more guaranteed merchant sightings than peak days of Ebon Gate, there's a problem there.

Overall, it has cheapened even the nicest of shows, and the most elegant of long descriptions. So, feedback? I may be the only one who really feels this is a sad, sad pattern of events, but that's just me.

PS: Oddly enough I really don't mind premium point alterations, despite the ridiculous "summon a merchant" status that it carries. If this rate of merchant runs continues, I don't see anyone putting 600 points into an alteration ever again, anyway.

[radamanthys]

Their rarity gave it an artificially high value. One of the game's highest values is that of character customization. Leaving that to the merchant hunting elite doesn't do much for the game. With the game in it's 18th year, unique items are in massive supply, anyway. Offering these types of services is a boon, not a bane.

[Fallen]

Well...the point of getting an alteration doesn't HAVE to be to increase an item's worth for resale. It should be about personalizing an item to better suit your character. More chances to do that is always a good thing.

[CrystalTears]

I don't play enough to run into them as much as others do. The one time I ran into one this weekend, she would only work on stuff from her cart or robes, and my character didn't want either. I don't get stuff from a merchant just for the sake of getting.

[Lord Nelek]

I like the increase in merchants, I just think they need to limit who is allowed to get work done.

I think there are a few people who get too many services and they should put a limit on those people.

[Fallen]

Yes, even if they increased the amount of merchants 10x, there would still be people who never get an alteration, and those that would get another 40 a month.

Some people are willing to spend hours hunting down merchants, waiting in line, developing OOG ways of coordinating where merchants might be, and most importantly, finding new crap to alter, or altering things they have no intention of actually keeping. That, or just making new characters to get fully outfitted in altered gear.

I'm not saying this is a good thing, or a bad thing. It is just the way some people enjoy GS.

[Celephais]

Hmm... we should start a list of desired alterations... where those who aren't heavy merchant hunters (like me) put up a desired alteration and a minimum base item, and how much they're willing to pay for it... Then those who are merchant hunters who get way too many alterations could look at the list, pick out an item and get the alteration done.

Something like:
Short: "A cloak"
Long: "A simple black cloak"
Minimum: Closable Back/Shoulder VLA <6lb
Paying: 500k (400k if not closable)
Good until: 6/1/08

[Peanut Butter Jelly Time]

While the idea has potential... what happens the first time Backlash throws up 17 shows to get done in the middle of Ebon Gate, and doesn't actually want any? Not saying Backlash really would, but this is the type of problem I see with that sort of situation. Someone blatantly misleading others into wasting their alterations. On top of that, duplicates may be an issue, especially during large-scale events, or slow updates.

[thefarmer]

I like the increase in merchants, I just think they need to limit who is allowed to get work done.

I think there are a few people who get too many services and they should put a limit on those people.

I disagree.

[Drunken Durfin]

How would you enforce it?

[CrystalTears]

I like the increase in merchants, I just think they need to limit who is allowed to get work done.

I think there are a few people who get too many services and they should put a limit on those people.
I disagree as well. Why should you put on a limit on what people are able to gain in the game as far as merchants is concerned? If they're available more often, why shouldn't anyone get anything they want? It just sounds like an opinion from a jealous point of view.

[Tolwynn]

The trouble with putting a limit on how many merchant services one can receive, is that it would open the door for other such requests for other people who skew towards one certain area of development in game.

Why not limit how much xp one can get in a certain time frame, as well as overall? Why not limit the amount of silvers one can obtain in that same frame, regardless of source?

Then you can end up with same sort of cyclical bitch-induced nerfing that was all the rage among the professions years back, which I'm sure is an outcome everyone would want.

[Belnia]

Any sort of service that has no mechanical benefit (ie: changing descriptions, so it fits people better) should be widely available.

Ever play on a MUD where restringing is available to any player who wants to go edit their items? Yeah, people don't look alike. If anything, I'd love to see more options for players to customize their gear without GM-intervention.

[Celephais]

While the idea has potential... what happens the first time Backlash throws up 17 shows to get done in the middle of Ebon Gate, and doesn't actually want any? Not saying Backlash really would, but this is the type of problem I see with that sort of situation. Someone blatantly misleading others into wasting their alterations. On top of that, duplicates may be an issue, especially during large-scale events, or slow updates.

It'd just be an honor/rep based thing... you'd have to put your name next to the request and then people could decide if it's worth their alter... contact infromation would be availible and skeptical merchant whores could contact the individual ahead of time and take it as commision.

It'd be completely unofficial, just say a thread on these boards, where people could post what they want and what they'd pay... I think anyone stupid enough to get something done for backlash or another of the horde of idiots would get the non-payment they deserve.

[ViridianAsp]

I think it's called better customer service most of us pay 40 and up for the game, if you don't like it, go play WoW.

[Anebriated]

yay for having 1 basic account!

[TheWitch]

If that thundering fuck Tsin would just find a different way to assert his lame ass cyber dominance, the game would be a better place in so many respects.

Including merchant services.

[thefarmer]

Plenty of people are as bad as Tsin.

He's just blatantly, braggingly, visible at it.

[TheWitch]

Which is why he's a thundering fuck, not just a fuck.

[diethx]

Which is why he's a thundering fuck, not just a fuck.

I thought you were referring to his giant, fatassness. It was funnier then :(

[Sweets]

I just came back to gemstone in the fall after a two year hiatus. I LOVE having merchants around every other day. I don't get to them all, I don't get picked all the time but it gives the regular "alter" hunter a bit of a chance. Special alters shouldn't be an almost unachievable goal for the casual player. It's a definite improvement and I hope Simu keeps it up.

[CrystalTears]

Me too. I'm hoping to get more chances to spruce up my characters as a casual player. I'm just having a hard time finding farmer merchants. :(

[Peanut Butter Jelly Time]

Eh, I suppose I'm a bit swayed by the ease I had in assembling a simple outfit that fit my characters, with a few "nice" items. I never really saw the point in every single item on you requiring a SHOW. How often to people lift their feet off the ground to show you the heart-shaped iron imbedded into their heel? At any rate, I may just be bitter as I was never all that successful vs. merchant huntz0rs, yet for some reason, this still annoys me. The idea that Simu definately knows that people are simply outright selling off services they have no use for was enough to handle before, but now they're feeding it? Ahwell, one of the few reasons I can't see myself reactivating soon (provided my daisho doesn't sell :yes: )

[Beldonn]

Eh I don't know who's living under a rock here but let me clue you in on somethin if you weren't aware. The normal 'super alteration farmer hunter' pulls in 3 to 5 accounts. Theirs, a few offline friends, maybe their girlfriend/boyfriend. Tsin? No. Tsin pulls in 12. Last merchant in Illistim was doing deepenings only, not lightenings. 32 people were there. Tsin left after hearing that, upset he didn't get his way. There were I think a bit under 2 dozen left. 1 who left was my friend who had to get cash to pay for HIS alter he was up for.

I think that they should limit who gets alters/merchant services. Just because you bring in 8 different fucks doesn't mean you should get to pass off 1 item to each 1 who gets selected to bottom it out or get it to minimum weight. I've seen ONE merchant...ONLY one...tell Tsin to fuck off because he was passing over an item and he wouldn't work on it twice. That's my card on it and hey...it's even an idea. No same item can be worked on twice. Even if it passes ownership. Then at least Tsin would have to find a dozen items and wait for a dozen merchants to finish off crap instead of max lightening 1 item per merchant/etc.

And finding alter merchants is so easy now I played my friends char when she logged off, I asked the merchant if I could bring 'a friend' in *my char* brought him in, got them BOTH alters. The price? I had to sing about fucking turnips and wheat grass or some such tripe. Funny, but it shows that special services are no longer a 'demanded' service. It's at the GM's convenience/whim. That sorta annoys me because we could go 2 hours with no alter merchant, or 2 weeks. It's all..up to them /shrug. But now they aren't required to make appearances every so often to keep us baited. Now they can just do nothing.

Oh, and I am not saying Tsin is alone in this bring-a-dozen-leeches to the merchant events. But he is one of maybe a handful of people who DO pay that much for GS every month. I don't know anyone personally that has over 6 accounts active. Sorry heh.

My two cents. Thanks.

[radamanthys]

An account/person, rather than character, limitation would be excellent, in theory. However, that would exclude a household where multiple people play, of which there are enough to deter the idea.

[diethx]

An account/person, rather than character, limitation would be excellent, in theory. However, that would exclude a household where multiple people play, of which there are enough to deter the idea.

That's a pretty lousy idea, unless you're talking about a situation like this:


Just because you bring in 8 different fucks doesn't mean you should get to pass off 1 item to each 1 who gets selected to bottom it out or get it to minimum weight.

Now if you have 8 different fucks that you pay for, you should be able to get one item worked on for each of them. I'm against passing shit back and forth like he does though.

A limitation of one service per account per merchant wouldn't be bad, but one per actual player? Stupid. Once they start limiting people to paying for only a single account, then maybe. But if someone pays for more, they should be able to get more for that money.

Tsin's still a tool though.

[thefarmer]

Funny, but it shows that special services are no longer a 'demanded' service. It's at the GM's convenience/whim. That sorta annoys me because we could go 2 hours with no alter merchant, or 2 weeks. It's all..up to them /shrug. But now they aren't required to make appearances every so often to keep us baited. Now they can just do nothing.

It's always been up to a GM's whim/etc as to when/if they show up. A GM might be required to put in a certain amount of hours per month/quarter, but it's up to them to decide when to do it.

Did you really think this was a change in some way?

[Celephais]

I don't see why they don't state a "you must have the item on you in order to get it altered/serviced" before spinning, then spin and whisk away the winners, should easily help fix the problem.

[diethx]

I don't see why they don't state a "you must have the item on you in order to get it altered/serviced" before spinning, then spin and whisk away the winners, should easily help fix the problem.

That would be great, actually. I wish they'd do it more often :/

I'm an MA'er and I still hate to see the blatant item swapping that goes on.

[thefarmer]

I don't see why they don't state a "you must have the item on you in order to get it altered/serviced" before spinning, then spin and whisk away the winners, should easily help fix the problem.

The FWI one tonite did just that.

No passing of items, no leaving to get items.

[Kayse]

I like the increase in merchants, I just think they need to limit who is allowed to get work done.

I think there are a few people who get too many services and they should put a limit on those people.

I agree. I was trying to get my character's hair altered today in Icemule and at least 4 of the people spun already had their hair altered (and he spun and only worked on 10). I understand possibly wanting to get a change after awhile, but it really irritated me that people who already had altered hair were able to get it. It just seemed a little greedy to me. Heh. And at merchant events it seems like the same damn people are always getting alters.

I like the increased merchants, but it doesn't do me much good since I work nights and thats when most have been appearing.

[thefarmer]

I agree. I was trying to get my character's hair altered today in Icemule and at least 4 of the people spun already had their hair altered (and he spun and only worked on 10). I understand possibly wanting to get a change after awhile, but it really irritated me that people who already had altered hair were able to get it. It just seemed a little greedy to me. Heh. And at merchant events it seems like the same damn people are always getting alters.

I like the increased merchants, but it doesn't do me much good since I work nights and thats when most have been appearing.

Most of people who get merchant work... work at it. Do you? It always seems like the people that attend the fewest amount of merchant events, and don't get picked always seem to have the biggest problems with other people getting work.

[Sean of the Thread]

Suck it Trebek.

[CrystalTears]

Most of people who get merchant work... work at it. Do you? It always seems like the people that attend the fewest amount of merchant events, and don't get picked always seem to have the biggest problems with other people getting work.
And maybe what some are trying to say that is that you shouldn't have to "work" at getting an alteration.

For that example, it would have made a little more sense to choose the people who haven't had a hair alteration first, and then spin for the rest.

So people who casually run into a merchant don't have a chance because people who chase merchants get first pick, which makes it more difficult for that player to get something special for themselves.

I personally don't care either way. I've spent most of my GS gaming life not getting alterations. Most of the ones on my ranger were either handed to her or were bought. My rogue has alterations because I used to attend the paid events. So I'm okay with what I currently have. But I sympathize with those that have to battle against the ones who have a ton of stuff and they have very little.

I personally blame the GMs running the merchants, not the chasers. GMs have control of who can be eligible and the rules before anything can be done. There is nothing stopping them from telling people that those with nothing will get chosen first.

[Sweets]

Do they still have some merchants only working on people who haven't had an alter in the last month/few months/days etc? This seemed like a good all around solution.

[Celephais]

The FWI one tonite did just that.

No passing of items, no leaving to get items.
Did it happen before or after 10:30? I want to take credit...

[Kayse]

Most of people who get merchant work... work at it. Do you? It always seems like the people that attend the fewest amount of merchant events, and don't get picked always seem to have the biggest problems with other people getting work.

If I'm available (and I want the service) I go to every merchant event I can. So, yes I work at it. I wasn't complaining about not getting alters per se. I get my fair share.

When it comes to other alters, I don't usually care. But I was commenting on the fact that people who already had their hair alter done in the past were waiting to get picked to have it altered again. Like I mentioned in my previous post, I suppose they wanted change but all the changes were so tiny, it was basically a rewording of the sentence they previously had. It just seemed greedy to me when there were many people at the event who didn't have it done yet. Considering 4 or 5 out of the 10 picked had it done already, it was just a little frustrating. (ok I felt like I repeated myself 10 times, but I'm tired and its late here :)

I wouldn't mind if a character couldn't get their hair, eyes or other features altered for a period of time if they had already gotten them done recently.



For that example, it would have made a little more sense to choose the people who haven't had a hair alteration first, and then spin for the rest.

I personally blame the GMs running the merchants, not the chasers. GMs have control of who can be eligible and the rules before anything can be done. There is nothing stopping them from telling people that those with nothing will get chosen first.

And yes I agree. ;)

[thefarmer]

And maybe what some are trying to say that is that you shouldn't have to "work" at getting an alteration.

For that example, it would have made a little more sense to choose the people who haven't had a hair alteration first, and then spin for the rest.

So people who casually run into a merchant don't have a chance because people who chase merchants get first pick, which makes it more difficult for that player to get something special for themselves.

I personally don't care either way. I've spent most of my GS gaming life not getting alterations. Most of the ones on my ranger were either handed to her or were bought. My rogue has alterations because I used to attend the paid events. So I'm okay with what I currently have. But I sympathize with those that have to battle against the ones who have a ton of stuff and they have very little.

I personally blame the GMs running the merchants, not the chasers. GMs have control of who can be eligible and the rules before anything can be done. There is nothing stopping them from telling people that those with nothing will get chosen first.

If they do it this way, then pretty soon it becomes expected for everyone to be able to get an alteration, and by this I mean that after awhile of doing this, everyone's going to feel entitled to an alteration after x number of days.

What the point of a GM running merchants in that case? Just stop them completely and have a ticket system where everyone can get an alter.

We'll not even go into the MA hordes that can just use different characters to suck up the alters regardless of your suggestions.

[thefarmer]

I wouldn't mind if a character couldn't get their hair, eyes or other features altered for a period of time if they had already gotten them done recently.

Why stop with features? Why not do any alterations?

I could care less about getting my characters features done every chance I could, (and in fact I've turned down quite a few merchants because of it), but I would care if someone limited me on how many times I could do it because soandso showed up to their first merchant and hadn't had work yet.

[Sylvan Dreams]

Perhaps I missed it, but so what if a person has a lot or a little alterations?

Simply put, certain people get a lot of services because they work for them. They merchant hunt. A casual player who doesn't ever check for merchants, who doesn't read the calendar, who just wanders aimlessly at festivals without a map, really shouldn't expect to get loads of alterations. The merchant hunter that has a network of friends, a good map if not the layout memorized, scripts, etc. Why should a person half-assing it all expect to come out as equal?

The people who don't chase services will still not get services, restrictions on everyone else or no.

[thefarmer]

Why should a person half-assing it all expect to come out as equal?

Because it's not Fair...

[Sylvan Dreams]

Because it's not Fair...

Pfft.

Why should people that can only play 1 hour a week versus people that can play 20 a week be behind in levels? They should get free levels!

Why should people that can't afford a pay event ticket not be able to go? Simu should have a Pay Event Assistance program!

Why should a warrior not be able to cast spells like other people just because they're a warrior?

Why should pures be limited in CMAN's?!

Give me a break.

[CrystalTears]

If they do it this way, then pretty soon it becomes expected for everyone to be able to get an alteration, and by this I mean that after awhile of doing this, everyone's going to feel entitled to an alteration after x number of days.
But then everyone would have had work done at one point or another. OMG the travesty.


What the point of a GM running merchants in that case? Just stop them completely and have a ticket system where everyone can get an alter. Awesome idea. Make it so. I don't see why people should be dependant on GMs to get customization on themselves or their items anyway.


We'll not even go into the MA hordes that can just use different characters to suck up the alters regardless of your suggestions. Eh, I don't care about MAers, as it should be per account, not per player. Since you can only have one character per account logged in, you have said chosen character at the merchant. Merchants have control. There shouldn't be situations where the player can say OMG I don't want this guy, I want to bring my other guy. Eh, too late, should have thought of that before you got in line.

Like I said, I don't see why people should have to chase anyone for work done for themselves. Once there's a merchant available, it really shouldn't matter how said person got to that merchant, whether by stalking them or idly finding them while minding their own business. I just don't think it's so gawd awful terrible that if someone there doesn't have any of that work done to get first crack at it. OMG IF HE REALLY WANTED IT HE WOULD CHASE THEM ALL THE TIME! Please.

[CrystalTears]

Pfft.

Why should people that can only play 1 hour a week versus people that can play 20 a week be behind in levels? They should get free levels!

Why should people that can't afford a pay event ticket not be able to go? Simu should have a Pay Event Assistance program!

Why should a warrior not be able to cast spells like other people just because they're a warrior?

Why should pures be limited in CMAN's?!

Give me a break.
Now you're just being silly with these comparisons.

[thefarmer]

But then everyone would have had work done at one point or another. OMG the travesty.

Awesome idea. Make it so. I don't see why people should be dependant on GMs to get customization on themselves or their items anyway.

Eh, I don't care about MAers, as it should be per account, not per player. Since you can only have one character per account logged in, you have said chosen character at the merchant. Merchants have control. There shouldn't be situations where the player can say OMG I don't want this guy, I want to bring my other guy. Eh, too late, should have thought of that before you got in line.

Like I said, I don't see why people should have to chase anyone for work done for themselves. Once there's a merchant available, it really shouldn't matter how said person got to that merchant, whether by stalking them or idly finding them while minding their own business. I just don't think it's so gawd awful terrible that if someone there doesn't have any of that work done to get first crack at it. OMG IF HE REALLY WANTED IT HE WOULD CHASE THEM ALL THE TIME! Please.

I bet you like Communism too.

"Everything must be fair!"

[Belnia]

I don't see why people should be dependant on GMs to get customization on themselves or their items anyway.

Because even with GM controlled alteration, we STILL see some really stupid, ugly or just plain nonsensical items. Imagine how much worse it would be if left completely in player hands.

[CrystalTears]

I bet you like Communism too.

"Everything must be fair!"
A little out of left field, don't you think? Just because I feel that a merchant could at least pick one person from that group who hasn't had anything done yet? Hardly.


Because even with GM controlled alteration, we STILL see some really stupid, ugly or just plain nonsensical items. Imagine how much worse it would be if left completely in player hands.
So? Let the player have whatever they want. What, because in real life people don't have hideous outfits? It makes it interesting to see them walking by though.. makes for some fun conversation. If the player is happy, so what?

Oh I know... that fairness again. Sorry.

[Sylvan Dreams]

But then everyone would have had work done at one point or another. OMG the travesty.

It's not a travesty, but honestly the whole "it's not fair" alteration movement really implies that everyone is entitled to at least one piece of work.


Like I said, I don't see why people should have to chase anyone for work done for themselves. Once there's a merchant available, it really shouldn't matter how said person got to that merchant, whether by stalking them or idly finding them while minding their own business. I just don't think it's so gawd awful terrible that if someone there doesn't have any of that work done to get first crack at it. OMG IF HE REALLY WANTED IT HE WOULD CHASE THEM ALL THE TIME! Please.

If you don't seek the merchants out, should they just come to you?

How are you going to tell if someone doesn't have any of that work done? Can you look into their lockers to see if they already have 10 sets of flaring armor? Can you see if they have 1 alter, 0 alter or 1000 alters in their locker? How do you know how many, if any, of those alterations were done by that character? That account?

If you want merchant work, it's simple - show up as often as you can. Come prepared with ideas so that you go fast and other people have a shot at getting work too. Don't be the person that takes a half hour arguing over a single word or item.

[CrystalTears]

It's not a travesty, but honestly the whole "it's not fair" alteration movement really implies that everyone is entitled to at least one piece of work.
If they show up to a merchant and everyone has something done and they have nothing, why not give them that chance to have something? What IS the big deal to let them have first crack at it?

If you don't seek the merchants out, should they just come to you?
I'm not talking about a merchant finding people in the lands who have nothing. I'm talking about the people already at the merchant.

How are you going to tell if someone doesn't have any of that work done?
Feature alterations are pretty easy to figure out. Those are the ones I'm mainly advocating.

Can you look into their lockers to see if they already have 10 sets of flaring armor? Can you see if they have 1 alter, 0 alter or 1000 alters in their locker? How do you know how many, if any, of those alterations were done by that character? That account?
I believe that merchants/GMs have a way to know if an item has been worked on recently or not. As far as alterations in general go, unless the merchants keep tabs on when the last alteration was done for each character, you're right, that would be hard to track. People could easy just wear trash every time they go to a merchant and say see, I have nothing. But I have been at merchants where they somehow know if someone has received something recently or not, so it's not impossible.

I would still like to see a way for people to be able to have their items altered in ways other than a merchant. Dyer tents are a nice start, but it needs to expand from there.


If you want merchant work, it's simple - show up as often as you can. Come prepared with ideas so that you go fast and other people have a shot at getting work too. Don't be the person that takes a half hour arguing over a single word or item.
I agree with you. I don't like it when people take forever to decide on what they want. If they don't know, move onto the next person, and if there's time, come back to them at the end. I don't think everyone should suffer and have to wait around just because they're unprepared.

[Sthrockmorton]

An account/person, rather than character, limitation would be excellent, in theory. However, that would exclude a household where multiple people play, of which there are enough to deter the idea.

5 people in my family play. All with multiple characters. All with a laundry list of things they'd like to get done.

Unfortunately, I'm probably the only one that gets to the merchants really well, let alone plays at the hours that merchants usually come.

If I got denied an alteration service for one of them because I was controlling their accounts, I'd be pissed.

On that same note, if I get picked and don't have one of my family members items or something to do for myself, I usually ask on psinet if anyone has anything they'd like me to get done for them or see if anyone in the room who didnt get selected needs anything...

As far as the Tsinbots go, it might help you to keep in mind that someone like Tsin is paying $100's of dollars to play this game every month. Most are paying between $15-$40. Just because he's merchant whoring shady dealer, doesn't mean he doesn't deserve the alterations. Anyone willing to pay what he pays per month and give up his life to GS deserves more work than others. He also pays the price of having 95% of the games population wanting to kick him in the nuts IRL.

What bothers me are the people that have 1-2 characters that get drawn at every single merchant appearance I see them at, and I used to be at nearly every single one. Which means they got drawn quuuiiiite a bit with extremely difficult odds going against them. Coincidence?

Sorry if that was long winded or hard to read. Saturday at 9:30am after being out the night before isn't my sharpest time...

[Liberi Fatali]

If that thundering fuck Tsin would just find a different way to assert his lame ass cyber dominance, the game would be a better place in so many respects.

Including merchant services.

Oh what the. THUNDERING FUCK? THAT'S MY PHRASE. Who are you?!?!?!?

[War Angel]

I'm probably in the minority here, but I appreciated the merchants that limited their work to a target group of people. (ie females, males, polearm users, ect.) This means people who will USE the item, more times than not, are being picked for a service.
I personally only head over to a merchant if it's something I want done for one of my characters. I feel if it's something I can't use or don't want, I have no right to take it away from someone else who would/could.
Sure some people get a lot of work done. Of course there is favoritism. Life's not fair even in a fantasy world.

[diethx]

Yeah, I totally agree with Sylvan Dreams about nearly everything. I do think that if you work for it more, you should get more for your efforts. I also think that almost all merchants shouldn't restrict their work (or give preference) to someone who "has never had an alter". Chances are, if they wanted that alter so badly, they'd work to be at more merchants.

However, I don't think it would be a miserable idea for a merchant to run one or two events per month listed on the calendar ONLY for people who don't have any features. That way, ONLY those who have no features will show up (and any others who don't know how the hell to read, who won't get chosen).

Forget getting preference at regular merchants though, that's just BS. The harder you work, the more you get. If you can only be a casual player, don't expect to get services like those who really work for them do.

[CrystalTears]

Yeah, I totally agree with Sylvan Dreams about nearly everything. I do think that if you work for it more, you should get more for your efforts. I also think that almost all merchants shouldn't restrict their work (or give preference) to someone who "has never had an alter". Chances are, if they wanted that alter so badly, they'd work to be at more merchants.
Eh, and maybe I'm just in the minority and don't feel that people should have to treat this game like a job just to get special enhancements. I also never said that anyone should be refused service, just that they be nice once in a while and give others a chance. Just a dream of mine, I realize I'm asking too much.


However, I don't think it would be a miserable idea for a merchant to run one or two events per month listed on the calendar ONLY for people who don't have any features. That way, ONLY those who have no features will show up (and any others who don't know how the hell to read, who won't get chosen).
I don't have a problem with that at all.

I wish they had more services like the pavilion where you can go in and change your look whenever you want. It would actually be nice if the pavilion offered enhancements of your choice which you pay for, seeing as how it's free right now.

The alteration argument has been going on forever. There will always be those that would like to see everyone get at least something, while others would rather run from the landing to Vaalor in order to get their hair changed for the seventh time and run over anyone who stands in their way. I just think there needs to be happy medium somewhere to appease as many people as possible. (This is the one of those places where the liberal side of me comes out.)

[diethx]

Eh, and maybe I'm just in the minority and don't feel that people should have to treat this game like a job just to get special enhancements. I also never said that anyone should be refused service, just that they be nice once in a while and give others a chance. Just a dream of mine, I realize I'm asking too much.

I never said you said that :)

I think getting your hair changed 20 times for one or three words each time is pretty dumb. My girls have had the same features since features were available. I also agree that people should be nicer to each other more often when it comes to spots. I personally gave up like 4 features at the Winterfest because I didn't have anything really to get done, and just wanted to watch.

I just don't think the merchant should be giving up 5 spots to people who don't have features, when they only plan on doing 10 people out of 100, and there are others who want something legit and worked hard to get there. I just wouldn't want to be penalized in the present for being lucky enough in the past and getting my eyes or hair done, yanno? At a NORMAL merchant, anyway. I would love to see someone run something a couple times a month for people who don't have any features, however.


I wish they had more services like the pavilion where you can go in and change your look whenever you want. It would actually be nice if the pavilion offered enhancements of your choice which you pay for, seeing as how it's free right now.

I'd love this too, but they're such nazi's with QC, it would never fly. :/

[Belnia]

I believe a certain minimum number of services should be guaranteed to anyone attending a pay event, even if it is only 1 or 2. But during the regular year? It's fair game for everyone.

[Gnomad]

Oh what the. THUNDERING FUCK? THAT'S MY PHRASE. Who are you?!?!?!?He stole your catchphrase?

What is this mother fecking Mickey Mouse bull squash?

[Back]

Its great that there is more customization for the players. I had more work done at Ebon’s Gate this year than I have had playing off and on since 97. With the subscription rate as low as it is it kind of makes it more worth it to play knowing that these services are easier to get. Plus, on GS’s side, its probably a lot easier and worth the time to keep the player base happy.

[Stanley Burrell]

He stole your catchphrase?

What is this mother fecking Mickey Mouse bull squash?

Man.

I thought every JD catchphrase had a lil' something to do with:

"..."

But, I guess that waving the flag of Dixie, online, while trying to get accepted by the Galloway locals permits one to use "Thundering Fuck" as their own personally coined catchphrase :rolleyes:.

Oh, and:

...

For actually reading this post. If you did.

[Sweets]

Hip Hip Horray for Gemstone becoming a bit easier. I know the nerfing of alot of things isn't quite welcome but I actually made it to level 20! Me! The whole Lorminstra gift is awesome. Atlers and leveling more easily done? Glad I'm back.

[Nilandia]

The whole Lorminstra gift is awesome.
You mean the Gift of Lumnis, right? :D

Gretchen

[Sweets]

You mean the Gift of Lumnis, right? :D

Gretchen


Yeah, Lumnis. Ummm...yeah. I'm enthusiastic, not necessarily smart. :D

[thefarmer]

Yeah, Lumnis. Ummm...yeah. I'm enthusiastic, not necessarily smart. :D

You're posting in the wrong thread...

[AestheticDeath]

Only thing I hate about merchants is sitting at one waiting for fucking four hours.. and having nothing to show for it.

Go in room order, stop when your times up. None of this fucking, pick 5, waste an hour BSing and RPing while I wait for some stupid fuck that got picked and doesn't know what he wants to have done. Then pick another 5. Then another 5....

Just fucking DO IT... If they can't think of something, move them to the back of the line.

[AestheticDeath]

Oh and post all your fucking rules, that the GMs work by, so we don't waste time bringing items that you won't work on. I know there are alter rules, but I have yet to see any type of concrete rule on how light an item can be, or how much it can hold.

And half my items get turned away not because its too light, or holds too much, but the combination of the weight and capacity. And the spot its worn.

I think its pretty fucking stupid to have such limits on items when there are already a FUCKTON of them that are so far beyond the limits they are trying to restrict things to now.

BTW the fuck is going to be in all of my posts now, until I am not sick, and my mood is not so dark. I find it pretty easy to get pissed off now. Anyone been in that spot?

[Back]

BTW the fuck is going to be in all of my posts now, until I am not sick, and my mood is not so dark. I find it pretty easy to get pissed off now. Anyone been in that spot?

Yep. Noticed. Been there done that. This too shall pass.

[Back]

It'd just be an honor/rep based thing... you'd have to put your name next to the request and then people could decide if it's worth their alter... contact infromation would be availible and skeptical merchant whores could contact the individual ahead of time and take it as commision.

It'd be completely unofficial, just say a thread on these boards, where people could post what they want and what they'd pay... I think anyone stupid enough to get something done for backlash or another of the horde of idiots would get the non-payment they deserve.

For the record all of the work at this past Ebon’s Gate was solely purchased by the one char I play in GS. I never asked anyone to get anything for me.

I don’t mind getting used as a hypothetical... but I do mind being unfairly, and unsubstantially, compared to other players who do not keep to their deals.

[Nieninque]

Unsubstantionally isn't a word.

[Katt]

Oh and post all your fucking rules, that the GMs work by, so we don't waste time bringing items that you won't work on. I know there are alter rules, but I have yet to see any type of concrete rule on how light an item can be, or how much it can hold.

And half my items get turned away not because its too light, or holds too much, but the combination of the weight and capacity. And the spot its worn.

I think its pretty fucking stupid to have such limits on items when there are already a FUCKTON of them that are so far beyond the limits they are trying to restrict things to now.

BTW the fuck is going to be in all of my posts now, until I am not sick, and my mood is not so dark. I find it pretty easy to get pissed off now. Anyone been in that spot?


That is kind of like the short skirt I bought from you that holds a VLA. I went to get it altered and "short" was already in the design yet they made me change it because it holds too much to be short. It already was short! I didn't get it deepened more or anything! hehe.

[Back]

Thanks, spellchick.

[Celephais]

For the record all of the work at this past Ebon’s Gate was solely purchased by the one char I play in GS. I never asked anyone to get anything for me.

I don’t mind getting used as a hypothetical... but I do mind being unfairly, and unsubstantially, compared to other players who do not keep to their deals.
Gee, maybe if you hadn't acted like a raving lunadick, I wouldn't have used your name in my example.

[Back]

Oh come on, Cornbread...

You and I have never interacted in GS (that I know of). Yet you feel you can insinuate me as some kind of GS scammer?

[Celephais]

Oh come on, Cornbread...

You and I have never interacted in GS (that I know of). Yet you feel you can insinuate me as some kind of GS scammer?
No no, I'm sure your GS character has plenty of integrity. I'm just saying you as an individual, lack psychotic integrity, so who knows what that'll translate into :)

I just picked a person, it happened to be you, I actually would have no problem dealing with you in game in some manner that would require trust, but I'm pretty trusting in GS because well... what is the worst that can happen. I guess it would have been better if I said Zimzum, but that's been done before.

Oh and I still really don't have a problem with you, go back to being normal and you're a great poster, good to have someone who's got a bit of an artistic eye (or at least is somewhat vocal about it). Gotta have duckskin here... about everything.

[Back]

Apology accepted.

You and I have also never met in person so I can say you are not qualified in any way shape or form to judge me as an individual. Nor can I you.

What happens on PC? Thats up for debate.

[Celephais]

Apology accepted.

You and I have also never met in person so I can say you are not qualified in any way shape or form to judge me as an individual. Nor can I you.

What happens on PC? Thats up for debate.
Any action any person takes is a reflection of the person themselves, direct or not, so what I know about you as an individual, is that you would freak out on a forum if cornered. That's the extent of what I know about you as an individual and I made my judgement based on that.

I also know you seem to be taking any shots at your character rather personally, when most people would have given me the jerk off emoticon and been done w/ it.

[Back]

You seem bright, Cornbread. And you have photochop skillz. Profit from it.

[Trinitis]

How are you going to tell if someone doesn't have any of that work done? Can you look into their lockers to see if they already have 10 sets of flaring armor? Can you see if they have 1 alter, 0 alter or 1000 alters in their locker? How do you know how many, if any, of those alterations were done by that character? That account?

Jumping in late on this but -

Easy. Gemstone is based off millions of text files. Your char is a text file. Your locker is a text file. Each item in your locker is a text file. Just have another text file made (if it's not already) called WORK. Each time a GM does work for said person, you open that file, and type "Alteration - 1/16/08 - GM XYZZ". Problem solved.

But honestly, it's not hard for a GM to track things. Myself and a friend have been toying with a MUD idea for a while now and have already looked into the backbone of the game..it's just a filing system with thousands of text files.

Thats why there is that pause after the GM has made your item/alteration, before they pass it over. They are making a new text file for that item, pasting the information into it, and adding their name to it. I'd assume the weird code you get from time to time when a GM is working on something is simply from them doing the "work" inside the text file, and doing a copy/paste that hits some of the GSL in the text file by mistake.

[Asha]

If you're seriously going to go for the text game of your own, I'd love to hear about it.

[Celephais]

Yeesh, you're looking into starting a MUD and that is the grasp you have on how they work?

[thefarmer]

Muds are just a bunch of txt files. How hard can it be to make one?

[Trinitis]

Yeesh, you're looking into starting a MUD and that is the grasp you have on how they work?

Note I did say "basically".

Yes, I know they can and are more complex. But at their root, they are a large collection of text files.

At least, in the program we were checking out. And I assume, thats how most of them work, as it's much easier and much more clean then one would think.

[g++]

Your operating system is also technically "A collection of text files" the lines of text in gemstone have attributes and reactions to the hundreds of different actions you can perform on them. The system is highly object oriented. To insinuate you could replicate it typing into wordpad is a little naive.

[Trinitis]

Your operating system is also technically "A collection of text files" the lines of text in gemstone have attributes and reactions to the hundreds of different actions you can perform on them. The system is highly object oriented. To insinuate you could replicate it typing into wordpad is a little naive.

Yet every single item is a text file. Which assists in my entire point in this thread. Since they are already editing/making a new text file when they are altering, it's not hard to edit another text file stating they did X work for this person on X date. My guess is, they already do.

[diethx]

(bunch of posts)

Are you sure you don't have a mullet?

[Celephais]

Yet every single item is a text file. Which assists in my entire point in this thread. Since they are already editing/making a new text file when they are altering, it's not hard to edit another text file stating they did X work for this person on X date. My guess is, they already do.
... wow really? Your grasp of how programs work is terrible. Each item isn't its own file, gemstone might be terribly programmed (by the way they react to some changes being so difficult), but there is no way they have a seperate file for each item. Likely all of the items are stored in a database (flat file database or not), if this file is compressed it won't be human readable in "file format". Yes, it shouldn't be difficult to add a "merchant work notes" section to the data file for characters, but your concept of a text file or seperate programs is rather messed up. The GMs have special commands they enter into the game to do most of the work you see being done (alterations for example), so the rare times you see them say something really messed up is just them accidently hitting ' before they type in the command.

[Trinitis]

... wow really? Your grasp of how programs work is terrible. Each item isn't its own file, gemstone might be terribly programmed (by the way they react to some changes being so difficult), but there is no way they have a seperate file for each item. Likely all of the items are stored in a database (flat file database or not), if this file is compressed it won't be human readable in "file format". Yes, it shouldn't be difficult to add a "merchant work notes" section to the data file for characters, but your concept of a text file or seperate programs is rather messed up.

Research muds, then come back to this thread.


The GMs have special commands they enter into the game to do most of the work you see being done (alterations for example), so the rare times you see them say something really messed up is just them accidently hitting ' before they type in the command.

Yes, they most likely have commands that allow them to edit the files that the items are stored in. Could I be wrong on how GSL works or how the data is stored? Maybe. But the fact remains that the program that my friend researched, and the multiple mud software I've poked around with all stored each and every item in a different text file.

Example : A text file for a set of forest green brig. All FGB links to this text file. All the info on a basic set of FGB is stored in this text file. If I was to change that brig to "a set of ugly ass brig", the stats stay the same, but a new text file is made for "a set of ugly ass brig".

[Stanley Burrell]

<<file>>

Did anybody on-site staff ever disclose how much room the DATs collectively take up? Or how many user accounts (active + inactive) there are?

I have a feeling the file size is either much smaller or much larger than I think it is.

GemStone is ... 1 gigabyte flat! That's my own undoubtedly stupid guesstimate :D

[CrystalTears]

the multiple mud software I've poked around with all stored each and every item in a different text file
You don't really believe GS works this way, do you? You really think they're going to have a file for EVERY item in the game? There's no fucking way.

The one time I helped a friend with a MUD, we never had to create files for items. They were all commands to create, edit and destroy items.

Having to create files for items seems like a seriously rudimentary system. GS may not be state of the art but I seriously doubt it revolves around text files.

[Celephais]

Trinitis must be really creative, because there is no way he's been asked to help with the technical side of his friends new MUD. It seems pretty clear to me that his friend was just dumbing down how it works in order to explain it to Trinitis. The overhead of using the filesystem as a database would be ridiculous. I don't suspect they've got it properly into a single relational DB, but I don't think they'd crutch themselves on an OS like that.