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View Full Version : Patch 2.3



Drew2
10-14-2007, 12:16 PM
There are so many awesome things going on in this patch I can't even begin to talk about it.




World of Warcraft PTR Patch 2.3.0

The latest test realm patch notes can always be found at http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/patchnotes/test-realm-patchnotes.html


The latest patch notes can always be found at http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/patchnotes/

Zul'Aman


Zul'Aman is a 10-player, level 70 outdoor instance located in the Ghostlands. Players will be able to confront six new bosses including the Forest Troll Warlord Zul'jin.
Guild Banks Introduced


The Guild Bank is a shared repository for an entire guild and will be accessible through Guild Vault objects near existing banks. The Guild Bank will allow players with the appropriate permissions to store items and money for use by the rest of the guild. Permissions to withdraw and deposit money and items are controlled by the guild leader through the guild controls menu. The Guild Bank is divided up into separate tabs so that the guild leader may restrict access or group items into distinct categories.
Up to 6 purchasable tabs each containing 98 item slots
Permissions to view/deposit/withdraw per tab
You may use your Guild Bank withdraw limits to pay for item repairs (now enabled on all merchants)
Transaction logs of the last 50 actions in the bank viewable on a per tab basis
General

Experience: The amount of experience needed to gain a level has been decreased between levels 20 and 60. In addition, the amount of experience granted by quests has been increased between levels 30 and 60.
Expertise: We have added a new stat and associated rating called expertise and expertise rating. Expertise rating converts to expertise at the same rate that weapon skill rating formerly converted at. Each point of expertise reduces the chance for your attacks to be dodged or parried by 0.25%.
Healing reduction effects will now affect all health drain spells and abilities (e.g. Mortal Strike will reduce health gained from Drain Life).
Healing: Almost all items and enchantments that provide bonus healing now also provide a smaller number (approximately 1/3) of bonus spell damage. There are a few items and enchantments where this was not possible, such as random-stat items and Zul'Gurub enchantments, but this is now the case on virtually all other items.
On Kill Effects: Items and abilities that trigger on killing an enemy will no longer trigger on using an ability that kills your pet.
Silence effects now have diminishing returns when used on PvP targets.
Weapon Skill: All items and abilities that granted weapon skill have been changed. In most cases, they were converted to expertise or expertise rating. Ranged attacks do not benefit from expertise, so ranged weapon skill has generally been replaced by critical strike bonuses or hit bonuses. In a few cases, talents have been changed to other effects to avoid granting players excessive amounts of expertise.
A new flight path has been added to the Rebel Camp in northern Stranglethorn Vale.
Flying units can see ground units and vice versa at any altitude.
Players no longer gain the moving AOE radius bonus if they are jumping.
Client spell cast requests are now sent to the server even if your player is already casting another spell. This eliminates the need for /stopcasting in macros to compensate for latency.
Vendor Discounts: All vendors with an associate faction now give discounts at all levels above neutral.
Friendly: 5% discount
Honored: 10% discount
Revered: 15% discount
Exalted: 20% discount
Quest givers who have available daily quests will have a blue exclamation point instead of a yellow one.
Pets will try to get behind their targets when engaging in melee combat.
You can now obtain a tiny Sporebat pet with exalted Sporeggar faction.
An Azure Whelp pet now drops from the blue dragonkin in Azshara.
If you are seated and try to use abilities that require you to be standing, you will stand up and use them. This can be disabled with: /console autoStand 0 .

Racial Abilities
Dwarf: Gun Specialization now increases chance to critically hit with Guns by 1% rather than increasing weapon skill.
Gnome: Escape Artist cooldown increased to 1 min, 45 sec.
Humans: Sword Skill now increases the critical strike chance with swords and two-handed swords by 1%.
Orcs: Axe Skill now increases the critical strike chance with axes and two-handed axes by 1%.
Troll: Bow and Thrown Specialization now increases chance to critically hit with those weapons by 1% rather than increasing weapon skill.
PvP

Arenas
The top ranked team of each battlegroup for each format will receive a new unique title for the end of Season 2 called “Merciless Gladiator”.
Battlegrounds
Daily quests have been added targeting a random battleground for that day. Look for Alliance Brigadier Generals and Horde Warbringers near your faction's battlemasters in all major capitals.
Dropping the Flag in a battleground will now result in a debuff that will not allow you to pick up the flag again for 3 seconds.
Druids who are shapeshifted when they receive the Restoration buff from battlegrounds will now correctly regenerate mana.
Players will now be able to cast spells for free in the Battleground before it begins.
Players will now be able to cast spells for free for a few seconds after being resurrected by a Spirit Guide in the Battleground.
Alterac Valley
Additional Warmasters no longer report for duty upon destroying an enemy tower. However, destroying an enemy tower still eliminates the associated opposing Warmaster.
All Warmasters are linked to each other and their respective Generals and can no longer be pulled individually.
Honor from capturing towers has been increased.
All Commanders and Lieutenants have left Alterac Valley in search for other battle opportunities.
Players will no longer be sent to their starting tunnels on death unless that team controls no graveyards in the battleground.
Many NPCs in Stormpike and Frostwolf holds are no longer elite
Bonus Honor in Alterac Valley is now only awarded during the battle for destroying enemy towers and slaying the enemy Captain. Upon conclusion of the battle, bonus honor is also awarded for intact towers, a surviving Captain, and for victory in the battle. The total bonus honor awarded should be similar to the previous total.
The Horde and Alliance now have a limited number of reinforcements available in the battle for Alterac Valley. The number of reinforcements available is reduced upon player death, loss of towers, and death of Captain Galvangar or Balinda Stonehearth. In addition, all available reinforcements are lost upon the death of General Drek'Thar or Vanndar Stormpike. If a team is reduced to zero reinforcements, the opposing team wins the battle.
Towers and Graveyards in Alterac Valley are now captured in 4 minutes (down from 5).
Eye of the Storm
The points awarded from capturing the flag in Eye of the Storm is now increase based on the number of bases the capturing team owns.
Warsong Gulch, Arathi Basin, Eye of the Storm
Additional bonus honor is now awarded upon conclusion of the battle.
Druids

Barkskin: It is no longer possible to cast this spell while Cycloned.
Cure Poison and Abolish Poison are now usable in Tree of Life Form.
Cure Poison, Abolish Poison and Remove Curse range increased to 40 yards.
Entangling Roots: It is no longer possible for multiple Druids to have Entangling Roots on the same target. In addition, it will now always be removed correctly if multiple Druids overwrite each other's Entangling Roots.
Feral Attack Power: Items that granted bonus attack power in Cat, Bear, Dire Bear, and Moonkin forms have been re-evaluated. In almost all cases, the attack power on the item has been increased. This change corrects an issue where feral weapon damage was not keeping up with other classes in its rate of increase.
Force of Nature: This ability will no longer automatically break stealth on victims in its casting area. Nearby stealthed characters may still be attacked if they are too close to the summoned Treants.
Heart of the Wild: This talent no longer provides 4/8/12/16/20% bonus Strength in Cat Form. Instead it provides 2/4/6/8/10% bonus attack power.
Hibernate: This spell will now always be removed correctly if multiple Druids overwrite each other's Hibernate.
Intensity (Restoration) increased to 10/20/30% mana regeneration.
Primal Fury: This talent will now be learned correctly even if purchased while the Druid is dead.
Rebirth cooldown reduced to 20 minutes, from 30 minutes.
Remove Curse is now usable in Moonkin Form.
Shapeshifting Spells: Some of these spells were causing additional unintended threat. That additional unintended threat has been removed.
Soothe Animal: This spell now properly consumes Nature's Swiftness.
Tranquility now gains additional benefit from spell damage and healing bonuses.
If you are in a shapeshift form and try to use an ability that may only be used in caster form, you will leave the form and use that ability. This means that you can shift from one form to another in one action. If you don’t have mana to shift form, you will get an error message and remain in your current form. This can be disabled with /console autoUnshift 0
Hunters

Aimed Shot (Marksmanship) now reduces healing done to that target by 50% for 10 seconds.
Arcane Shot (Ranks 6 and above) now dispel 1 Magic effect in addition to their normal damage.
Explosive Trap: The initial damage dealt by this trap is now also increased by 10% of your ranged attack power.
Immolation Trap: The total damage dealt by this trap is now also increased by 10% of your ranged attack power.
Misdirection: This spell will now always be removed correctly if multiple Hunters overwrite each other's Misdirection.
Readiness: This talent now finishes the cooldown on Kill Command.
Serpent Sting, Immolation Trap and Explosive Trap all gain additional damage based on ranged attack power.
Serpent Sting: The total damage dealt by this sting is now also increased by 10% of your ranged attack power.
Steady Shot: Tooltip clarified to indicate base weapon damage is used in the damage calculation.
Trueshot Aura (Marksmanship) no longer costs mana to cast and will last until cancelled.
Wyvern Sting (Survival) is now instant cast and has a maximum duration of 10 seconds in PvP.
Mages

Arcane Intellect and Arcane Brilliance mana costs reduced.
Arcane Meditation (Arcane) increased to 10/20/30% mana regeneration.
Arcane Missiles: Players will no longer get strange error messages when casting this spell at evading targets. The spell will simply fail.
Detect Magic removed. All players may now see their target's beneficial effects at all times.
Evocation now regenerates 15% of total mana every 2 seconds rather than increase Spirit based regeneration.
Fire Ward and Frost Ward now gain additional benefit from spell damage bonuses. Base absorb values of ranks 5 and 6 have been reduced.
Hypothermia duration increased to 45 sec.
Ice Barrier now gains additional benefit from spell damage bonuses. Base absorb values of ranks 5 and 6 have been reduced.
Improved Fireball: The reduction in damage coefficient caused by this talent has been removed.
Improved Frostbolt: The reduction in damage coefficient caused by this talent has been removed.
Polymorph: It is no longer possible to polymorph a player and have that player remain mounted. In addition, it will now always be removed correctly if multiple Mages overwrite each other's Polymorph.
Portal Spells: Portal spells to capital cities can no longer be cast in battlegrounds.
Remove Curse range increased to 40 yards.
(NEW SPELL) Ritual of Refreshment available on trainers at level 70.
Spellsteal: It is no longer possible via this spell to get two Forbearance debuffs at the same time.
Paladins

Blessing of Light: Lower ranks of Flash of Light and Holy Light are now properly penalized when used with this Blessing.
Cleanse and Purify range increased to 40 yards.
Crusader Strike (Retribution) cooldown reduced from 10 to 6 seconds.
Divine Favor: When this ability is cast immediately after a critical heal, it will no longer be removed incorrectly.
Exorcism mana cost reduced.
Fanaticism (Retribution) now also reduces threat caused by all actions by 6/12/18/24/30%.
Hammer of Wrath mana cost reduced.
Holy Wrath mana cost reduced.
Improved Seal of the Crusader (Retribution) benefits folded into the base spell. This talent now gives the benefits of the Sanctified Crusader talent instead.
Judgement of Light: The combat log will now show the mana gained from rank 5 of this ability as Judgement of Light instead of Seal of Light.
Judgement of Wisdom: It is no longer possible for the mana energize effect to trigger off of reapplication of the Judgement of Wisdom.
Paladin seals no longer have a low chance to be dispelled if you have 3 points in Sanctified Seals.
Precision (Protection) now increases spell hit chance as well.
Pursuit of Justice (Retribution) is now 3 ranks and increases movement speed by 5/10/15% and also reduces the chance you'll be hit by spells by 1/2/3%.
Sanctified Crusader (Retribution) renamed Sanctified Seals, which now increases your chance to critically hit with all spells and melee attacks by 1/2/3% and reduces the chance your Seals will be dispelled by 33/66/100%.
Seal of Vengeance: The bonus damage this ability dealt when the debuff is fully stacked on the target was incorrectly too low. It is now increased.
Spiritual Attunement: This ability will now gain mana properly from Vampiric Embrace heals.
Vengeance (Retribution) duration increased from 15 to 30 seconds.
Vindication (Retribution) frequency and duration increased and now reduces all attributes by 5/10/15%, not just Strength and Agility.
Weapon Expertise (Protection) renamed Combat Expertise, now increases expertise by 1/2/3/4/5 and total Stamina by 2/4/6/8/10%.
Priests

Chastise (NEW) is now available to Dwarf and Draenei priests at level 20. Chastise causes Holy damage and incapacitates the target for 2 seconds.
Circle of Healing: The base amount of healing from this spell has been reduced along with increasing the bonus it receives from bonus healing effects. Characters with more than 1338 healing will see their Circle of Healing heal for more than previous patches. Characters with less than 1338 healing will see their Circle of Healing heal for less.
Cure Disease and Abolish Disease range increased to 40 yards.
Divine Spirit: It is no longer possible for a target to simultaneously have Divine Spirit rank 5 and Prayer of Spirit Rank 1 icons showing at the same time.
Elune's Grace (Night Elf) effect changed to reduce chance to be hit by melee and ranged attacks by 20% for 15 seconds. There is now only 1 rank of the spell.
Fear Ward is now available to all priests at level 20. Duration reduced to 3 minutes, cooldown increased to 3 minutes.
Fixed a bug where the global cooldown was triggered when shifting out of Shadowform.
Holy Fire: The tooltip on rank 4 has been adjusted.
Inner Focus: Rank 4 will now properly affect Lightwell.
Inner Focus: This effect is now properly consumed by casting Mind Soothe.
Meditation (Discipline) increased to 10/20/30% mana regeneration.
Mind Soothe: This spell will now consume Inner Focus.
Pain Suppression (Discipline Talent) is now usable on friendly targets, instantly reduces the target's threat by 5%, reduces damage taken by 40% and its cooldown has been reduced to 2 minutes.
Prayer of Healing, Circle of Healing and Holy Nova (healing effect) now gain additional benefit from spell damage and healing bonuses.
Power Word: Fortitude, Divine Spirit, Prayer of Fortitude and Prayer of Spirit mana costs reduced.
Power Word: Shield now gains additional benefit from spell damage and healing bonuses. Base absorb values of ranks 10, 11 and 12 have been reduced.
Shackle Undead: This spell will now always be removed correctly if multiple Priests overwrite each other's Shackle Undead.
Shadow Word: Death: Resilience no longer reduces the backlash damage from this spell.
Starshards (Night Elf) is no longer channeled, costs 0 mana, is now a Magic effect, lasts 15 seconds, causes damage every 3 seconds and has a 30 second cooldown.
Starshards: The damage per tick of this ability no longer changes during the duration of the effect.
If you are in Shadowform and try to use an ability that my not be used in Shadowform, you will leave Shadowform and use that ability. This can be disabled with /console autoUnshift 0
Rogues

All poisons will now enchant the weapon for 1 hour, increased from 30 minutes.
Blade Flurry: This ability now works correctly in all cases with shielded targets.
Blind is now a physical (no longer a poison) attack. Reagent requirement removed. Now shares the same diminish category as Cyclone and is now diminished in PvE as well as PvP.
Cheat Death (Subtlety) chance to trigger increased to 33/66/100% and now also causes the rogue to take 90% less damage for 3 seconds when the effect triggers. This effect cannot occur more than once per minute.
Cold Blood: Fixed an issue where this buff was sometimes getting removed when an attack missed.
Dirty Deeds now also increases damage against enemies below 35% health.
Fleet Footed (Assassination) now increases movement speed by 8/15%.
Kick: Interrupting a channeled spell with this ability will now always properly prevent casting spells from the same spell school for 5 sec.
Precision: This talent now also applies to ranged weapons.
Remorseless Attacks: This talent can no longer be triggered by the death of a rogue's target dummy or other pet.
Riposte is now subject to diminishing returns in PvP.
Rogue's Deadly Throw missile speed increased significantly and snare duration increased slightly.
Ruthlessness now only affects melee finishing moves. It no longer works with Deadly Throw.
Sap: Multiple Saps placed by multiple Rogues will now be handled correctly in all cases.
Shadowstep (Subtlety) can now be used at any time, not only while stealthed. Threat caused by next Ambush, Garrote or Backstab is reduced by 50%. Cooldown increased to 40 seconds.
If you are in Stealth and try to use an ability that may not be used while stealthed, you will leave stealth and use that ability. This can be disabled with /console autoUnshift 0
Shaman

Chain Heal: The tooltips on tanks 1-3 have been adjusted.
Chain Lightning cast time reduced to 2.0 (from 2.5), mana costs reduced, benefit from spell damage reduced appropriately.
Cure Poison and Cure Disease range increased to 40 yards.
Earth Shield: This spell will now always be removed correctly if multiple Shaman overwrite each other's Earth Shield.
Earth Shock: Interrupting a channeled spell with this spell will now always properly prevent casting spells from the same spell school for 2 sec.
Elemental Focus (Elemental) now reduces the mana cost of the next 2 damage spells by 40%.
Frost Shock is no longer subject to diminishing returns.
Grounding Totem: This totem is now destroyed upon redirecting any spell to itself.
Lightning Bolt cast time reduced to 2.5 (from 3.0 where applicable), mana costs reduced, benefit from spell damage reduced appropriately.
Lightning Mastery (Elemental) cast time reduction reduced to .1/.2/.3/.4/.5 seconds.
Lightning Overload (Elemental) now has a 4/8/12/16/20% chance to occur and the additional spell causes half damage and no additional threat.
Mana Spring Totem effect increased.
Mental Quickness (Enhancement) now also increases spell damage and healing equal to 10/20/30% of your attack power.
Two-Handed Axes and Two-Handed Maces are now trainable by all Shaman at the appropriate weapon masters. The Enhancement talent has been replaced by Shamanistic Focus.
Shamanistic Focus (New Enhancement Talent): After landing a melee critical strike, you enter a Focused state. The Focused state reduces the mana cost of your next Shock spell by 60%.
Shamanistic Rage (Enhancement) now also reduces all damage taken by 30% for the duration.
Spirit Weapons (Enhancement) threat reduction increased to 30% from 15%.
Rockbiter Weapon: For ranks 4, 5, 6, 7, and 8 the increased damage resulting from this enchantment has been reduced slightly to match the intended numbers given in the tooltip. Ranks 1, 2, 3, and 9 are unchanged.
Water Shield: This spell no longer costs any mana to cast and its duration has been shortened. At the end of its duration, it now grants mana for any remaining globes. In addition, the mana granted per globe has been substantially increased.
Windfury Weapon: This enchantment can no longer be triggered while you are disarmed.
Warlock

Banish can no longer be cast on targets tapped by other players or groups.
Conflagrate: The Immolate debuff will now always be removed correctly when this spell is cast.
Drain Life and Siphon Life now reduce the amount healed when the warlock is affected by healing reducing effects (e.g. Mortal Strike, Wounding Poison).
Hellfire: This spell will no longer cause enemy spells to increase casting time or reduce channel time. It will also no longer prevent flag captures in Battlegrounds.
Nether Protection (Destruction) now has a new, more distinct visual effect.
Ritual of Souls now takes significantly less time to cast and complete.
Seed of Corruption detonation will now obey line of sight.
Shadow Embrace: This talent's effect can no longer trigger other effects.
Shadow Ward: This spell now gains additional benefit from spell damage bonuses. Base absorb value of rank 4 has been reduced.
Soul Siphon (Affliction) now increases damage by 2/4% and no longer affects Drain Mana.
Soul Siphon (Affliction): If a Warlock already has a particular spell cast on a target, reapplying before its duration ends will no longer grant an additional bonus.
Warrior

Charge will work more often when targets are up against unpathable areas like walls and poles.
Defiance (Protection) now also grants 2/4/6 weapon expertise.
Devastate (Protection) now combines the effects of Sunder Armor into its effect. It is also now affected by all talents and items that affect Sunder Armor.
Disarm is now subject to diminishing returns in PvP.
Improved Berserker Stance (Fury) now also reduces all threat caused while in Berserker Stance by 2/4/6/8/10%
Improved Intercept and Weapon Mastery have swapped locations in the talent trees.
Intervene will no longer place you in combat.
Hamstring now has a 10 second duration when used on PvP targets.
Mace Specialization (Arms) now has a reduced chance to occur but generates 7 rage instead of 6.
Pummel: Interrupting a channeled spell with this ability will now always properly prevent casting spells from the same spell school for 4 sec.
Shield Bash: Interrupting a channeled spell with this ability will now always properly prevent casting spells from the same spell school for 6 sec.
Shield Slam (Protection) now always tries to dispel one Magic effect on the target.
Sweeping Strikes and Deathwish have swapped locations in the talent trees.
Sweeping Strikes (Fury) now lasts 10 seconds and affects your next 10 swings.
Sweeping Strikes: This ability now works correctly in all cases with shielded targets.
Tactical Mastery: This talent also now grants greatly increased threat from Mortal Strike and Bloodthirst when in Defensive Stance.
Weapon Mastery (Arms) now reduces duration of Disarm effects against you by 25/50% rather than giving you a 50% chance to avoid or full immunity to Disarm effects.
Whirlwind: This ability now strikes with both weapons when a Warrior is dual-wielding.
Professions

All primary profession trainers outside of capitals (Alchemy, Blacksmithing, Enchanting, Engineering, Leatherworking, Tailoring) have been changed to train up to Artisan level (skill level 300) in their respective professions.
The capital cities now possess Artisan level trainers for the primary professions they support, and are surrounded by their newly-dubbed Apprentices where applicable. Please visit your local Master trainer when you wish to train.
You can now control-click on a recipe to see how the item that is made by that recipe will look on you in the dressing room.
Alchemy
Added a sound for when a cauldron is created.
Added a new potion to alchemy trainers: Mad Alchemist's Potion. This new potion requires Alchemy to consume.
Blacksmithing
A new world drop recipe for an Adamantite Weapon Chain has been added. This new weapon chain both reduces disarm duration and increases parry rating.
Sharpening Stones and Weightstones now last 1 hour.
Cooking
Daily cooking quests are now available from The Rokk in Shattrath City! In addition to gold, you can receive random cooking reagents and new recipes as a reward for completing these quests.
Reduced the maximum skill obtainable from recipes between 200 and 300. This does not include Outland recipes.
Enchanting:
Duration of wizard and mana oils created by enchanters has been increased.
The Surefooted enchantment now requires Fel Iron Rod (was Runed Eternium Rod).
Added a new enchant shield recipe to trainers that increases resilience.
Engineering:
Cogspinner Gearcutter in Ironforge and Sovik in Orgrimmar now sell the schematic for the Steam Tonk Controller in a limited supply.
Engineers can now create incredible new flying machines! Find Niobe Whizzlespark in Shadowmoon Valley to learn these fantastic new plans.
Engineering potion injectors no longer require engineering skill to use.
Materials required to create the Steam Tonk Controller have been reduced. To reflect the reduced requirements, the maximum skill gain has also been reduced somewhat.
Plans for a new Field Repair Bot are rumored to belong to a select few Gan'arg Analyzers in Blade's Edge Mountains.
Plans for a new arrow making device can be found from Sunfury Archers.
The plans for adamantite shells now create an Adamantite Shell Machine. The machine creates 200 high quality bullets at a time, with 5 charges per item.
Fishing:
Players can now track fishing nodes. This ability is learned from a journal sometimes found in crates obtained through fishing.
New fish can now be caught in Zul'Aman and Deadwind Pass. Recipes for preparing these new fish are obtained through the daily cooking quests.
Fishing difficulty reduced for some areas in Nagrand.
You can now fish in Ironforge again.
Herbalism
Picking herbs will no longer cause effects on items to trigger.
Fel Blossoms are now unbound, but have an additional requirement of 275 herbalism to use.
Jewelcrafting:
A new skyfire meta gem recipe can be obtained from the Coilskar Siren of Shadowmoon Valley. This new meta gem increases critical strike rating and critical strike damage with spells.
Leatherworking:
Stylin' hats no longer require Zhevra leather.
Greatly increased the radius of the Drums of Battle, Drums of Restoration, Drums of Speed, and Drums of War.
Increased the range at which you can gain leatherworking skill from crafting drums.
Removed the casting time from the Drums of Battle, Drums of Restoration, Drums of Speed, and Drums of War.
Slightly increased the radius of Drums of Panic.
Reduced the casting time of Drums of Panic and added a global cooldown equal to the casting time.
Reduced the faction required to obtain Drums of Battle and Drums of Panic.
Drums of Speed and Drums of Restoration are no longer world drop recipes, and can now be obtained from the Mag'har and Kurenai faction vendors with revered standing.
Drums can now be used while shapeshifted.
A new recipe is available from Grand Master leatherworking trainers to create glove reinforcements, providing a substantial armor bonus. Reinforcements are a permanent enchantment and cannot be placed with other permanent enchantments.
New recipes are available from Grand Master leatherworking trainers to make 20 slot quivers and ammo pouches.
New recipes are available from the Honor Hold, Thrallmar, and Lower City quartermasters to create 24 slot quivers and ammo pouches.
A new recipe is available from Grand Master leatherworking trainers to make a 20 slot bag to hold leatherworking supplies.
The ogres in the barrier hills are rumored to have a pattern for a 24 slot bag to hold leatherworking supplies.
Mining
Mining will no longer cause effects on items to trigger.
Items

All old world dungeon bosses have had their loot revisited. Players will now find that the loot dropped inside instances will be of Superior quality.
Arena Relics: New relics have been added to support all talent trees for relic users. In addition, most of the arena-system relics have been renamed so there is a more consistent naming convention.
Arakkoa Feather: This item can now be sold to a vendor.
Ashtongue Talisman of Lethality: This item will no longer trigger when the victim of your finishing move is immune to that attack.
Ashtongue Talisman of Vision: The mana granted by this trinket has been increased.
Ashtongue Talisman of Vision: This item will no longer receive multiple chances to trigger per cast of Stormstrike.
Ashtongue Talisman of Zeal: The damage over time affect from judgments has been adjusted so that it will work properly. It now has a shorter duration, and is not refreshed by melee attacks.
Ashtongue Talisman of Zeal: The damage over time effect from this trinket is no longer refreshed by autoattacks and does not charge mana.
Atiesh: This item can no longer open portals in battlegrounds.
Band of Eternity will now make the correct sound when moved in a player's inventory.
Black Bow of the Betrayer: The triggered effect from this item will no longer use up charges of Misdirection. In addition, the triggered effect will no longer break crowd control effects.
Bloodsea Brigand's Vest will now make the correct sound when moved in a player's inventory.
Boundless Agony can now be disenchanted.
Cataclysm Raiment: The bonuses on this set have been adjusted.
Cooldown removed from Noggenfogger Elixirs. The shrink effect will no longer stack with other shrink effects.
Cowl of Benevolence will now make the correct sound when moved in a player's inventory.
Crystalforge Raiment: The bonuses on this set have been adjusted.
Darkmoon Card: Vengeance: This item will no longer trigger from environmental damage.
Dropped items that were rings/trinkets/one handed weapons that were previously unique are now unique-equipped. That means that you can have more than one of those items, but you can only have a single one of them equipped.
Enriched Terocone Juice: This item now properly provides mana regeneration no matter how it is used.
Essence of Death now drops from level 57-60 non-elite undead in the Eastern Plaguelands.
Expose Weakness: The triggered effect from this talent will no longer use up charges of Misdirection.
Felsteel Chests: The loot from these chests has been improved.
The Felsworn Gas Mask will now work when you put it on while mounted.
Gladiator's armor pieces of like nature from various seasons will now all meet the requirements for their shared set bonus. This means if you are using 2 pieces of Season 1 gear and 2 pieces of Season 2 gear of the same design you will now have your 4 piece set bonus.
Gladiator's Chain Gauntlets: The bonus damage on these gloves has been increased from 4% to 5%.
Grand Marshal's Dragonhide Helm: The intellect on this item was increased slightly to match the equivalent Horde-only item.
Hand of Antu'sul: The effect that triggers from this item will no longer cause a cooldown on Warrior's Thunderclap ability.
Libram of Saints Departed: This relic now functions properly again.
Lightfathom Scepter will now make the correct sound when moved in a player's inventory.
Lockboxes will now display the numerical lockpicking skill required to open them.
Low Level Cloth Items: All agility and strength on low-level cloth items has been replaced with other stats, usually bonus spell damage, but also sometimes other stats beneficial to mana users.
Merciless Gladiator's Chain Gauntlets: The bonus damage on these gloves has been increased from 4% to 5%.
Mr. Pinchy: This item no longer destroys itself when its charges run out. This resolves some bugs that occurred when its final charge was used.
Mystical Skyfire Diamond: A cooldown has been added to this item's effect, but the chance for it to trigger has been increased.
Ogri'la Faction Vendor: This vendor now sells potions useable anywhere for a large number of Apexis Shards.
Overseer Disguise: It is no longer possible via use of this item to be on a mount while in Moonkin Form or Tree of Life Form.
Pendant of the Violet Eye: This trinket will no longer fire multiple times from a single casting of some Paladin spells.
Shadowmoon Grunts will no longer drop Black Temple quality loot.
Shiffar's Nexus Horn: Many spells and abilities can now trigger this item that were unable to before.
Skyshatter Raiment: The four piece bonus is now being applied correctly and the two piece bonus will affect the correct spells.
Tidefury Raiment: The additional mana granted to Water Shield by this set has been increased.
Tome of Fiery Redemption: This item no longer can be triggered by casting blessings.
Totem of the Thunderhead: The additional mana granted to Water Shield by this totem has been increased.
Unstable Flask of the Sorcerer: This flask will now provide the bonus to healing specified in its tooltip.
Vambraces of Ending will now make the correct sound when moved in a player's inventory.
Dungeons and Raids

Players that complete the attunement quests for Tempest Keep and Coilfang Resevoir may now choose to display a new title, "'character name' Champion of the Naaru."
The Requirement for Heroic Keys has been lowered to Honored.
Elite mobs outside of pre-Burning Crusade dungeons have been changed to non-elite.
The level ranges of pre-Burning Crusade dungeons have been adjusted to a narrower range.
Meeting stone level requirements, the Looking for Group system, and quests have been adjusted to match the new dungeon level ranges.
Auchenai Crypts
Wandering Ghosts are now neutral to players
Summoned Ghosts now take longer to summon in.
Auchindoun: Sethekk Halls
Mobs inside Sethekk Halls will now continue to award Lower City reputation into Exalted.
Caverns of Time: Battle of Mount Hyjal
Increased the reputation awarded for killing Archimonde in Hyjal Summit.
Hellfire Citadel: Magtheridon's Lair
Mind Exhaustion is not applied until Magtheridon is successfully banished.
Karazhan
The number of creatures that must be killed in the Karazhan Servants Quarters area before a miniboss spawns has been reduced.
Phase hounds in Karazhan will now phase out less frequently.
Coldmist Widows no longer wipe threat when casting Poison Bolt volley.
The Chess Event chess in Karazhan now has a tap list so it can only be looted by players who were involved in the chess event.
Wrath of the Titans will no longer cause Shackle Undead to break.
Tempest Keep
The Blood Elves that patrol the Tempest Bridge no longer patrol directly into Prince Kael'thas Sunstrider's chamber.
The use of Ice Block, Divine Shield, Cloak of Shadows, and other similar spells and abilities will no longer prematurely detonate High Astromancer Solarian’s Wrath of the Astromancer spell.
Kael'thas
All four advisors have had their health reduced by 10%.
All of the summoned weapons have had their health reduced by 10%.
Al'ar
The ability "Meteor" has been renamed to "Dive Bomb".
Mechanar
Nethermancer Sepethrea's Frost Attack now reduces movement speed by 25% rather than 50%.
Quests

New random Daily Dungeon quests have been added for both the heroic and non-heroic five-person Outland dungeons, as well as for the 5-person Caverns of Time instances. Each day both a single heroic and a single non-heroic dungeon are randomly targeted by these quests. The Consortium quest givers can be located in Shattrath's Lower City
Quest givers who have available daily quests will have a blue exclamation point instead of a yellow one.
Aether rays can now be wrangled earlier.
Dustwallow Marsh
Many new quests have been added to the zone.
The Steamwheedle Cartel have just completed building the new town of Mudsprocket in south west Dustwallow Marsh.
Level 1-60 dungeon quests have had their experience and faction rewards increased.
Many elite creatures and quests in the level 1-60 experience have been changed to accommodate solo play.
Nutral, the flight master in Shattrath City, now has a quest for characters who are level 70 and do not yet have a riding skill of 225. The quest will direct a character to visit the appropriate riding instructor in Shadowmoon Valley so that the player will know where they can purchase the skill necessary to use a flying mount.
The icon for the Charged Crystal Focus has been changed.
The range of the Battery Recharging Blaster used in the quest, "Recharging the Batteries" has been increased.
The Repolarized Magneto Sphere now only functions within the Blade's Edge Mountains.
Upon completion of the Ghostlands quest, "A Little Dash of Seasoning", if a character still has the Apothecary's Poison; it will be removed from their inventory.
User Interface

The Auction House UI has been much improved. The useless categories have been removed (Plate-Cloak for instance) and a number of additional sub categories have been added. In addition, many items have had their category changed so that they make more sense.
The Auction house time periods have been changed. Now items can be put up for sale for 12, 24, or 48 hours. The option to put up items for 8 hours has been removed.
Sorting of auction house searches has been simplified so you can only sort by one column, and automatic sub-sorts have been created for those columns to be as useful as possible. In addition, sorting is now done on the server so as you page thru results, items will appear to be sorted across the entire results instead of just the page you’re looking at.
The Battle Map has been renamed to the Zone Map and can be turned on for any zone rather than just PvP objective zones. There is now a drop down in the world map screen that allows you to choose when the zone map should display.
Items that have cooldowns will now display the base cooldown time in the item tooltip.
All players now have a tracking bubble on their minimap. From that menu you can select a specific type of vendor or npc to look for or you can select a specific tracking type if your character has tracking. Yes this means that hunters can take all of those tracking buttons off of their action bars.
Game objects that you can interact with have a glow around them and display their name over the object to make them more obvious.
Items with Metagems in them will now display the gems required to activate the metagem and whether those requirements have been met on the item tooltip.
When you take damage and have a full screen UI up, the edges of the screen will flash red so you know you are under attack.
Inspect distance has been increased to 30 yards.
When you inspect another player, you can now see their talent choices as well as their equipment.
There are now options for displaying health and mana values on your health/mana bars for you/your party and to display that information either as percentages or as numbers.
When you are possessing a target (Priest Mind Control, Eyes of the Beast, using a Steam Tonk, etc), you now get their action bar as your primary action bar rather than having a mini action bar above your normal action bar.
The Mind Control and Possession action bar has been revamped.
You can now send up to 12 items in a single mail message.
When you have an outgoing mail open, you can right-click on items to attach them to that outgoing mail.
When you have a trade window open, you can right-click an item to move it to the trade window.
When you have unopened mail, you can mouse over the recent mail icon and get the name of the people who most recently sent you the mail.
When you speak with an NPC with a single function (Banker, Flight Master, Etc) and who has no other gossip options or quests you will go straight to their functional pane rather than to the gossip pane. Most importantly this means that clicking on a flight master will bring up the flight path map directly rather than the gossip pane with the option to bring up the flight path map.
Quests that are much below your level will now have the tag (Low Level) in the gossip pane attached to the quest. This will make it easier to tell which quest to accept when a quest giver has both low and high level quests.
You can now set the loot threshold (/threshold) with a word as well as the loot threshold number for an instance-
/threshold Epic- also sets the party loot threshold to Epic items or better quality
/threshold Rare-sets the party loot threshold to Rare items or better quality
Corpses that belong to someone in your party, but that you cannot loot will say in the corpse mouseover who has loot rights on that corpse. This will help skinners who want to know who to talk to in order to skin their corpse, as well as master looters when special loot drops on a normal monster. Everyone will then see that there is a monster that the master looter has loot rights on.
When an item drops that you cannot loot due to uniqueness or other factor, you will get a chat message letting you know what the item was that you passed rolling on.
If a player is looting a corpse and there are one or more items on it that player cannot loot, the player will still be able to see those items (although not able to loot them). This only is for green or better quality items. The cases this should affect are for the profession recipes that only a player of that profession can loot or when master looter is on and there is a threshold or better item on the corpse.
The raid panes that have been pulled out into the gamefield should save their option settings between sessions now.
When raid bosses send an important message to the center of your screen it will be larger and have an effect that makes it more noticeable.
The raid warning command now appears in a larger font in the center screen and grows and shrinks slightly when it appears to make it more noticeable.
NPCs with a single function will now display an icon that indicates their function on mouseover.
NPC's with level appropriate quests will now always appear on your minimap as yellow exclamation points. NPC's that have quests that you have completed will now display as yellow question marks instead of yellow dots. In addition flight masters that you have not yet gotten the flight point for will display on the minimap as a green exclamation point.
Npc's will display an icon on mouseover that gives a more specific indicator of their function rather than just a gossip bubble. Questgivers will now show a question mark as their in game mouseover, Innkeepers will show a hearthstone as their in game mouseover and so on.
When an Addon attempts to perform an action that is prohibited in combat, you will get a chat message "Interface action failed because of an AddOn". This only occurs once per login.
Many interface elements now display players in their class color so you can easily recognize what class a player is. Interface elements affected by this are LFG, Channel UI, Guild and Who.
You can now pull the list of players in a channel out into the gamefield by clicking and dragging the channel name onto the gamefield. This list will show all the players in the channel sorted by voice chat status.
Voice chat will now display the nameplate for who is talking when you are in a chat group. Currently it only displays the nameplate when you are in a party/raid.
When multiple people are talking in a voice chat session, it will show the names of up to four people who are talking at the same time.
The value of the TargetNearestDistance setting is validated at load time.
If a non-standard refresh rate is selected in the video options, it will now be saved.
The Spell Detail slider setting has been reset to the default setting. Prior to 2.3 the default for all systems was the maximum setting which was not appropriate for all hardware.
Many On Use items now display the cooldown in the item tooltip.
The tooltip for Block on the character sheet now displays the amount of damage reduced by a successful block.
New macro commands: /targetlastenemy, /targetlastfriend
New macro command to target by entire name: /targetexact
If you get a message "Interface action failed because of an AddOn", this means that an AddOn interfered with the Blizzard UI in some way. To diagnose this, enter the following into chat "/console taintLog 1" and restart the game and try to reproduce it. If you reproduce it, you can quit the game and search through the file Logs\taint.log for the word "blocked" and mail the log to the author of the AddOn listed there. Once you have done this you can turn off logging by entering the following into chat "/console taintLog 0”
For more details on UI macro and scripting changes, see the UI & Macro forum.
World Environment

Creature AI has been changed to no longer prioritize attacking unfeared targets over feared targets.
Stranglethorn Vale
Saltscale Tide-Lords no longer have frost nova
The fear on Mosh'ogg Lords is reduced
Lowered the fireball damage of Defias Pillagers
Increased the cooldowns on the heals of Kurzen Medicine Men
The standard Disarm ability that many creatures use now has a duration of 5 seconds instead of 6 seconds.
Sonic Burst now silences for 6 seconds instead of 10.
Bug Fixes

An issue with spawn rates in Forge Camp: Terror and Forge Camp: Wrath has been fixed.
Fixed the position of one of the Box of Mushrooms objects at Ango'rosh Stronghold for the quest, "Stealing Back the Mushrooms".
Fixed the position of a mineral node in the Blade's Edge Mountains so that it is no longer floating in the air.
Fixed a problem with the directions in the quest, "The Ultimate Bloodsport".
Fixed a bug in the pet sheet stamina mouseover tooltip that showed an incorrect health increase value.
Fixed an issue with aura stacking and debuff cooldowns when reapplying a debuff after being charmed.
Reverse cooldowns are correctly refreshed when a buff is reapplied by another player.

Sean of the Thread
10-14-2007, 12:24 PM
Wow some cereal shit going down.

Nieninque
10-14-2007, 12:29 PM
Arcane Shot (Ranks 6 and above) now dispel 1 Magic effect in addition to their normal damage.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v254/Sakurelf/dispelhunter.jpg


Elune's Grace (Night Elf) effect changed to reduce chance to be hit by melee and ranged attacks by 20% for 15 seconds. There is now only 1 rank of the spell.
Fear Ward is now available to all priests at level 20. Duration reduced to 3 minutes, cooldown increased to 3 minutes.
Starshards (Night Elf) is no longer channeled, costs 0 mana, is now a Magic effect, lasts 15 seconds, causes damage every 3 seconds and has a 30 second cooldown.

Three good changes IMO. Starshards is now going to be more than a comedy spell, and fear ward for all is good. Elunes grace will now appear on my priest's action bars.


Fixed a bug where the global cooldown was triggered when shifting out of Shadowform.

Took them three years to fix, but GG.


Frost Shock is no longer subject to diminishing returns.

WTF? Everything else in the game is being put on diminishing returns and they take this shit OFF? Redarded.

RichardCranium
10-14-2007, 12:47 PM
I've never played WoW before. Is that weird?

Solkern
10-14-2007, 12:58 PM
I've never played WoW before. Is that weird?

yes

Trouble
10-14-2007, 01:32 PM
To me, giving Dwarf/Draeni priests a mini-stun/interrupt is way too OP in exchange for giving all priests FW. I like the 10/20/30% Meditation change though. The targetable Pain Suppression (a.k.a SaveDar!) is nice, but I don't see myself going 41 Disc any time soon. I love the heal to dmg conversion idea, but I'll probably still carry two (actually like 3.5) sets of gear since it will likely still be a loss of dmg over my dps set. I'm not sure I like the free mana Starshards; I know it's kinda a joke of a spell, but in priest v priest fights (for example) mana is always the limiting factor. I like how 1337 is the cut-off for the Circle of LoL changes. It sucks that Dispel Magic is the only 'cleansing' spell that wasn't buffed to a 40-yard range, but I guess that's the price we pay for the both offensive and defensive utility.

I also like the faction rep discount changes, although I guess I'll have to pull a Woten and get exalted wth all possible factions. At this point I'm revered with pretty much everyone but only exalted with the largely useless Frostwolf, Violet Eye, and Zandalar factions. I think I'm like one bosskill away from exalted with Hydraxians too, heh.

The AV changes are interesting... no more tower NPCs and fewer warmasters (will help Horde more than Allies I think because even with the AFK changes allies still usually have more towers capped than horde do). I love the free buff time, since I cast like 4k mana of buffs on myself when I rez. Changing most of the NPCs in the bases to non-elite will greatly help the Horde since we usually end up pulling the whole base. I like the EotS flag change and I love the added honor to the other BGs (main reason I play AV all the time is for honor, even when the others have holidays).

Hunters got a HUGE PvP buff with the dispel thing.

Nieninque
10-14-2007, 01:44 PM
Wow...I never even saw the BG changes. Alterac Valley is now retarded.

senorgordoburro
10-14-2007, 02:21 PM
I've never played WoW before. Is that weird?

This is the only game I play, the only other games I've played are Starcraft and Diablo back when they first came out for a little while. I've never played anything newer on the computer than those 2 games, and I also don't own a single console. Although, when I was in college my roomate had a PS2 and we would play the hell out of some NCAA Football while drinking some beer.

Sean of the Thread
10-14-2007, 03:25 PM
I'll have to try it but nice changes for AV if you're horde.

Shit has been so stacked for allies it's not funny. You guys can piss in your Wheaties for awhile and stfu.

Drew2
10-14-2007, 03:32 PM
I'm stoked about the FP at the Rebel Camp. I have a few lowbies I gotta go thru STV with after the exp changes in 2.3 and that will make shit SOOOO much easier.

And wtf is this "creating a cauldron" business in the Alchemy changes?

Hips
10-14-2007, 03:33 PM
I love all the priest changes. For someone like me who doesn't have a dps set, now having roughly 600 +spell damage from my +heal gear (on top of the 200ish I already have) is going to be amazing.

I might actually be able to farm my primals by myself now, instead of begging my boyfriend to help on his rogue! :O

Drew2
10-14-2007, 03:36 PM
Yeah I might be able to do shit on my druid now, but I hate pretending I'm a lolkin.

I much prefer being feral spec if I have to kill shit. But I'll take what I can get while resto.

Hips
10-14-2007, 03:41 PM
I'm afraid to go shadow, even temporarily, because I know I'll love melting faces and not want to go back to holy/discipline. :(

Drew2
10-14-2007, 03:46 PM
I'm praying to the gods of Jelly that one day they allow Argent Dawn to transfer to a PvP server. It's unlikely, but it happened once before for another RP server so I hold onto hope.

Nieninque
10-14-2007, 04:11 PM
I'll have to try it but nice changes for AV if you're horde.

Shit has been so stacked for allies it's not funny. You guys can piss in your Wheaties for awhile and stfu.

The funny thing is, it really isnt stacked either way at all.
When they made the AFK changes, I think I was in zero wins that whole first weekend...nothing else was changed in AV other than the fact that the horde were no longer able to AFK idle in their starting tunnel.

Part of me thought, "wow this is really shit, I have lost every single AV this whole weekend".

Another part of me thought "hahahaha these mugs have been idling AFK in their starting tunnel for years when they could have been melting faces and winning every AV...suckers!"

I can win any AV with five or ten able people. It's not about terrain, it's about not being retarded.

Sean of the Thread
10-14-2007, 04:18 PM
I know I'm just pulling this out of my ass but I swear I've only won 25% of AV ever as horde.

Lol my friend was doing the AFK thing last month and was getting 20,000 plus honor on the weekend doing nothing but watching tv and pushing the up arrow every 4 minutes.

Trouble
10-14-2007, 04:28 PM
Lately I've been winning about 1/3 of the AV's I play, which is much better than the 1/15 it was before the AFK changes.

There's no denying the terrain differences (wide open FW GY compared to SP), the tower differences (much easier to cap a Horde tower than an Alliance tower), and the added NPCs the Horde must deal with (will be fixed in the patch). I've never witnessed the Vann single pull, I hear about it a lot but I don't think people in our battlegroup know how to do it or they choose not to do it; either way it will be fixed too.

Tsa`ah
10-14-2007, 06:02 PM
I think DM was one of the few servers that didn't have a big afk problem until cross realm BGs started.

It was really uncommon for the horde to lose ... and that was only when half the alliance side was stacked with a single guild pre-made team.

Cross realm pvp forced us to put up with the AFK tards and that disease spread.

To say the alliance does not have an edge in AV is a denial of reality. They have the advantage of a few very long tunneled choke points, many elite NPCs that have to be pulled, and a hearth point that is right on top of their last GY flag ... just to name a few.

When they removed a bulk of the faction mobs from the game, they pretty much gave the alliance a straight shot to the horde base.

Nieninque
10-14-2007, 07:11 PM
I think DM was one of the few servers that didn't have a big afk problem until cross realm BGs started.

It was really uncommon for the horde to lose ... and that was only when half the alliance side was stacked with a single guild pre-made team.

Actually, DM had a bit of a topsy turvy history when it came to AV.

It used to be that alliance (pugs) would roll horde (pugs) consistently.
Then Soutalgon taught the horde pugs that AV was a PvE battle and the Horde turned the tables. That was pretty much the case until the cross server BGs came in.


Cross realm pvp forced us to put up with the AFK tards and that disease spread.

To say the alliance does not have an edge in AV is a denial of reality. They have the advantage of a few very long tunneled choke points, many elite NPCs that have to be pulled, and a hearth point that is right on top of their last GY flag ... just to name a few.

When they removed a bulk of the faction mobs from the game, they pretty much gave the alliance a straight shot to the horde base.

See. I've played AV on Horde and alliance and I really thing that people who cry favouritism (unless they are talking about warlocks) are talking shit.

There are choke-points on both sides. There are elite NPCs on both sides. Both final GY's are right next to the flags.

The approach to frostwolf GY is pretty open, there are several ways around to SP.

The one advantage I HAVE noticed is the positioning of the warmasters and how the Horde have that easier, but as they are getting rid of warmasters, no-one cares.

Tsa`ah
10-15-2007, 06:46 AM
Actually, DM had a bit of a topsy turvy history when it came to AV.

It used to be that alliance (pugs) would roll horde (pugs) consistently.
Then Soutalgon taught the horde pugs that AV was a PvE battle and the Horde turned the tables. That was pretty much the case until the cross server BGs came in.

You give Soultanoob too much credit. The DM horde scale tipping occurred when they reduced the number of faction mobs and nuked the midfield catapults. At best he just irritated people in the match enough to just getting it over with.

I think I played a grand total of 10 matches with that asshat, at best he was a distraction in that 10 of us could take a different path to SP while a good chunk of alliance would camp SH just to kill him an any healing group he conned into running with him. I believe in those 10 matches I was on the winning end of things 3 times.


See. I've played AV on Horde and alliance and I really thing that people who cry favouritism (unless they are talking about warlocks) are talking shit.

There are choke-points on both sides. There are elite NPCs on both sides. Both final GY's are right next to the flags.

I'm sorry, but you need to pay attention to the length and positioning of choke points, elite mobs, and flags.

SP gy, and the roads to it are all viable and long choke points past SH. There are 3 separate elevations for any road to it and only 2 one way access to the other (going down hill). It's really nothing for 5-10 alliance to hold off 20 or more horde vying for SP considering the coverage the flag and gy have being in a gully.

After that you have the bridge and several elite NPCs that will be pulled no matter what ... with archer coverage from the towers that reach from mid bridge to several yards past the aid flag. You can send a few people ahead to pull everything from the aid flag, but if the towers aren't taken care of ... you're not going to get away with it if the area isn't swarmed with horde by that time.

When you flip it over to the other side of the map and examine the one semi-viable choke point (the second gate leading to Drek) ... it's really laughable.

Once SF is under alliance control, there's nothing keeping them from bypassing everything between SF and FW:relief. Horde elites are so spaced that Alliance can ride past them and right up to FW and the relief hut. Once inside of our base they really only have to clear the elite at the hut and the towers for pulling.

The alliance aid flag is pretty much right on top of alliance recall point ... right outside of Van's base. The horde relief flag is not only outside of tower protection, but outside of horde protection since it's way off to the right and choked by a bridge and trenched.

Face it, once SF is capped ... everything from SF to the relief hut is optional outside of 2 towers and the hut flag. You don't pull many NPCs getting to Drek while the horde have to pull everything from SH to the aid ... including vendors that have ungodly amounts of health.

Nieninque
10-15-2007, 08:23 AM
You give Soultanoob too much credit. The DM horde scale tipping occurred when they reduced the number of faction mobs and nuked the midfield catapults.

The Horde were already rolling AV when they took the NPCs out.


At best he just irritated people in the match enough to just getting it over with.

I think I played a grand total of 10 matches with that asshat, at best he was a distraction in that 10 of us could take a different path to SP while a good chunk of alliance would camp SH just to kill him an any healing group he conned into running with him. I believe in those 10 matches I was on the winning end of things 3 times.

Oh, make no bones about it, he was a dick. His strategy was fine, his delivery was appalling. What he did though, was teach enough of the pugs that it was a PvE exercise rather than a PvP battleground. For some reason, the Horde couldnt grasp that idea up until his era (I am talking pugs here btw).


I'm sorry, but you need to pay attention to the length and positioning of choke points, elite mobs, and flags.

SP gy, and the roads to it are all viable and long choke points past SH. There are 3 separate elevations for any road to it and only 2 one way access to the other (going down hill). It's really nothing for 5-10 alliance to hold off 20 or more horde vying for SP considering the coverage the flag and gy have being in a gully.

Then I would say that the Horde are to blame, not the terrain. Horde can go the top road and round the back, to SP, they can go the direct road, or they can go down the valley and back up and round the back, past the harpies. I really cant see this as being any harder than having to come past IB and Tower Point, although once you get past FW, the only choke point you have is in Frostwolf Garrison. The difference being that Horde have, in the main, seen fit to defend IB graveyard more than the Alliance have seen fit to defend SH. Again though, that comes from the personnel rather than the terrain.


After that you have the bridge and several elite NPCs that will be pulled no matter what ... with archer coverage from the towers that reach from mid bridge to several yards past the aid flag. You can send a few people ahead to pull everything from the aid flag, but if the towers aren't taken care of ... you're not going to get away with it if the area isn't swarmed with horde by that time.

All of which applies to the Alliance at Frostwolf, with the two towers, WITH THE EXCEPTION OF: the wandering Elite NPCs. That much I concede. However, balanced with the positioning of the warmasters in the general's room, which favours the Horde by far, things work out pretty balanced.


When you flip it over to the other side of the map and examine the one semi-viable choke point (the second gate leading to Drek) ... it's really laughable.

Like I said, there are choke points at IB GY, Tower Point, the bottom gate to Drek AND the top gate to Drek. The two gates to Drek are reachable by the archers. It all works out pretty much the same. There is no way of avoiding that bottom gate any more. There is no way to come up the waterfall way any more. That's when Alliance had it easier, now it is pretty much six and two threes.


Once SF is under alliance control, there's nothing keeping them from bypassing everything between SF and FW:relief. Horde elites are so spaced that Alliance can ride past them and right up to FW and the relief hut. Once inside of our base they really only have to clear the elite at the hut and the towers for pulling.

True, but if they dont take FWGY, they struggle due to the zerg from the Horde defence. The point about the NPCs I agree with.


The alliance aid flag is pretty much right on top of alliance recall point ... right outside of Van's base. The horde relief flag is not only outside of tower protection, but outside of horde protection since it's way off to the right and choked by a bridge and trenched.

Well, once the last flags have been capped it is pretty much a done deal anyway, though I take the point about recalling to protect the aid station/relief hut. On the flip side, given the fact that most people who are recalling are heading into the General's room anyway, it doesnt make a great deal of difference.

Parkbandit
10-15-2007, 09:52 AM
Who didn't have Soutagon on /ignore? How can you teach anything when no one is listening?

Weird.

sst
10-15-2007, 10:07 AM
I think DM was one of the few servers that didn't have a big afk problem until cross realm BGs started.

It was really uncommon for the horde to lose ... and that was only when half the alliance side was stacked with a single guild pre-made team.

Cross realm pvp forced us to put up with the AFK tards and that disease spread.

To say the alliance does not have an edge in AV is a denial of reality. They have the advantage of a few very long tunneled choke points, many elite NPCs that have to be pulled, and a hearth point that is right on top of their last GY flag ... just to name a few.

When they removed a bulk of the faction mobs from the game, they pretty much gave the alliance a straight shot to the horde base.

It all depends on what server you're on really. On skullcrusher Horde kick ass in AV and always have since i started on the server and that has not changed at all.

Tea & Strumpets
10-15-2007, 10:08 AM
This patch blows for elemental shaman. Anyone that likes anything about this patch at all is hereby ordered to go jump in a fire.

Some Rogue
10-15-2007, 10:38 AM
QQ Pony Boy

Not much for PvE rogues either. Mostly nerfs and a PvP buff thrown in along with a nerf.

Parkbandit
10-15-2007, 11:13 AM
QQ Pony Boy

Not much for PvE rogues either. Mostly nerfs and a PvP buff thrown in along with a nerf.


Yea... for pvp, it wasn't bad but nothing for pve. I'll stick with my hunter.

Some Rogue
10-15-2007, 11:23 AM
Even PvP there were more "bug fixes" and nerfs than buffs.

Sean of the Thread
10-15-2007, 11:31 AM
QQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQ

Tea & Strumpets
10-15-2007, 11:33 AM
QQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQ

Why you son of a bitch!

Parkbandit
10-15-2007, 11:34 AM
Even PvP there were more "bug fixes" and nerfs than buffs.


Really?

Rogues

All poisons will now enchant the weapon for 1 hour, increased from 30 minutes Buff
Blind is now a physical (no longer a poison) attack. Reagent requirement removed. Now shares the same diminish category as Cyclone and is now diminished in PvE as well as PvP. Buff
Fleet Footed (Assassination) now increases movement speed by 8/15%. Buff
Kick: Interrupting a channeled spell with this ability will now always properly prevent casting spells from the same spell school for 5 sec. Bug Fix
Precision: This talent now also applies to ranged weapons. Buff
Remorseless Attacks: This talent can no longer be triggered by the death of a rogue's target dummy or other pet. Bug Fix
Riposte is now subject to diminishing returns in PvP.Nerf
Rogue's Deadly Throw missile speed increased significantly and snare duration increased slightly. Buff
Ruthlessness now only affects melee finishing moves. It no longer works with Deadly Throw. Nerf
Shadowstep (Subtlety) can now be used at any time, not only while stealthed. Threat caused by next Ambush, Garrote or Backstab is reduced by 50%. Cooldown increased to 40 seconds. Buff

Some Rogue
10-15-2007, 12:11 PM
All poisons will now enchant the weapon for 1 hour, increased from 30 minutes Buff (BFD)

Blind is now a physical (no longer a poison) attack. Reagent requirement removed. Now shares the same diminish category as Cyclone and is now diminished in PvE as well as PvP. Buff (Nerf, it can now be dodged, blocked, parried and has diminising returns. Plus I was never hurting for reagants.)

Fleet Footed (Assassination) now increases movement speed by 8/15%. Buff (Buff, but too deep in the tree for a combat rogue.)

Kick: Interrupting a channeled spell with this ability will now always properly prevent casting spells from the same spell school for 5 sec. Bug Fix

Precision: This talent now also applies to ranged weapons. Buff (LOL, ranged weapons? Who the fuck uses ranged weapons?)

Remorseless Attacks: This talent can no longer be triggered by the death of a rogue's target dummy or other pet. Bug Fix

Riposte is now subject to diminishing returns in PvP.Nerf

Rogue's Deadly Throw missile speed increased significantly and snare duration increased slightly. Buff (PvP buff.)

Ruthlessness now only affects melee finishing moves. It no longer works with Deadly Throw. Nerf

Shadowstep (Subtlety) can now be used at any time, not only while stealthed. Threat caused by next Ambush, Garrote or Backstab is reduced by 50%. Cooldown increased to 40 seconds. Buff (Once again, PvP buff but kind of a wash since cooldown was increased. Also, no serious PvE rogue is going this deep in the subtlety tree.)

So that's 2 meaningless changes, 2 bug fixes, 3 nerfs, 2 pvp buffs, and 1 change to PvP that's pretty much a wash

Krendeli
10-15-2007, 03:21 PM
There are so many awesome things going on in this patch I can't even begin to talk about it.
Experience: The amount of experience needed to gain a level has been decreased between levels 20 and 60. In addition, the amount of experience granted by quests has been increased between levels 30 and 60.


FUCK! I just turned 59 this weekend. I hate this game.

Skeeter
10-15-2007, 03:25 PM
this patch probably wont drop for another month or 2. You'll be 70 by then.

sst
10-15-2007, 03:32 PM
I'm not to happy with what they did to us slightly overpowered mace PVP warriors =( oh well ill still stun the shit out of people, just not as often

Parkbandit
10-15-2007, 04:36 PM
All poisons will now enchant the weapon for 1 hour, increased from 30 minutes Buff (BFD)

Blind is now a physical (no longer a poison) attack. Reagent requirement removed. Now shares the same diminish category as Cyclone and is now diminished in PvE as well as PvP. Buff (Nerf, it can now be dodged, blocked, parried and has diminising returns. Plus I was never hurting for reagants.)

Fleet Footed (Assassination) now increases movement speed by 8/15%. Buff (Buff, but too deep in the tree for a combat rogue.)

Kick: Interrupting a channeled spell with this ability will now always properly prevent casting spells from the same spell school for 5 sec. Bug Fix

Precision: This talent now also applies to ranged weapons. Buff (LOL, ranged weapons? Who the fuck uses ranged weapons?)

Remorseless Attacks: This talent can no longer be triggered by the death of a rogue's target dummy or other pet. Bug Fix

Riposte is now subject to diminishing returns in PvP.Nerf

Rogue's Deadly Throw missile speed increased significantly and snare duration increased slightly. Buff (PvP buff.)

Ruthlessness now only affects melee finishing moves. It no longer works with Deadly Throw. Nerf

Shadowstep (Subtlety) can now be used at any time, not only while stealthed. Threat caused by next Ambush, Garrote or Backstab is reduced by 50%. Cooldown increased to 40 seconds. Buff (Once again, PvP buff but kind of a wash since cooldown was increased. Also, no serious PvE rogue is going this deep in the subtlety tree.)

So that's 2 meaningless changes, 2 bug fixes, 3 nerfs, 2 pvp buffs, and 1 change to PvP that's pretty much a wash

A simple "Damn, you are right" will suffice from you in the future.

Some Rogue
10-15-2007, 05:02 PM
A simple "Damn, you are right" will suffice from you in the future.

I proved my point. Go back to playing your huntard. It fits you well. :tool:

StrayRogue
10-15-2007, 07:51 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YTp9uYnyGLA

Sean of the Thread
10-15-2007, 07:53 PM
Fucking shit! Now that's cool.

StrayRogue
10-15-2007, 07:54 PM
Looking like s3 is using tier6 skins too.
Couple of things in the test realm not mentioned by Blizz such as Disarm Shot for Hunters, bear mount, couple of new recipes/patterns. Probably another rogue mech nerf too.
Min range possibly is getting shrunk for ranged. Hunters may also get a MS like effect on their aimed shot. Not like they need another pvp buff, but hey.
S1 is looking to be cheaper to buy, honor-wise, than the blue pvp stuff now. 14500 for the most expensive armour piece.

Odups
10-15-2007, 08:12 PM
Am I the only one thinking the Defias Pillager nerf was due for a looooooong time? >.>

*flee*

Trouble
10-15-2007, 09:37 PM
They're still on the top 10 most dangerous mobs list every day, along with warlock pets, hehe.

Some Rogue
10-16-2007, 12:18 AM
The bear mount was mentioned awhile ago when they first talked about Zul'Aman.

Sean of the Thread
10-16-2007, 12:26 AM
What exactly is a bear mount?

Sean of the Thread
10-16-2007, 12:27 AM
OH FOR FUCKS SAKE I cannnnnnot begin to tell you how upset I am that I googled "BEAR MOUNT"



I just died inside a little...



ffs

Donquix
10-16-2007, 12:41 AM
Congrats blizzard on finally reading message board posts from 2005/6

Basically every one of these changes were suggested by players a year or more ago. I blame Melissa for the slow implementation.

I mean...what the fuck at elunes grace and starshards being as is for too long, non-scaling traps, no damage increase at all for healing priests even though they're asked to farm just like everyone else, and buffs costing mana for casters in battlegrounds at start/rez.

The only thing i don't get is the arcane shot change....cause yeah, thats totally unnecessary. I can see that one being rescinded.

Methais
10-16-2007, 01:07 AM
Hunter dead zone is being removed too.

Odups
10-16-2007, 05:00 AM
Amani War Bear (http://www.worldofraids.com/news/october/zulaman/loot/Nalorakk/amaniwarbear.jpg)

Don't forget Ritual of Refreshment (http://www.worldofraids.com/news/october/2.3/ritualofrefreshment.jpg)! I might have to actually bother with Heroics too for the new Heroic badge loot.

StrayRogue
10-16-2007, 08:53 AM
Confirmed. S3 is recoloured tier 6.
The Warlock set is bright blue (lol)

Parkbandit
10-16-2007, 09:18 AM
Looking like s3 is using tier6 skins too.
Couple of things in the test realm not mentioned by Blizz such as Disarm Shot for Hunters, bear mount, couple of new recipes/patterns. Probably another rogue mech nerf too.
Min range possibly is getting shrunk for ranged. Hunters may also get a MS like effect on their aimed shot. Not like they need another pvp buff, but hey.
S1 is looking to be cheaper to buy, honor-wise, than the blue pvp stuff now. 14500 for the most expensive armour piece.


What else do they need to nerf rogues in mech for now? They've already moved the chests to beyond the elevator.. making it impossible to stealth chest runs there now.

It was the only reason I played my rogue... made a shit ton of gold there.. plus still have about 40 blue gems on my bank alt.

Parkbandit
10-16-2007, 09:34 AM
Hunter dead zone is being removed too.

It should be. It's stupid that I can't fire a weapon if you are within 8 yards of my hunter. Any kind of fight where you have to group up to avoid a charge or whatever, I'm sitting there spamming traps and one of my two melee hits. It's dumb.

Tea & Strumpets
10-16-2007, 09:41 AM
It should be. It's stupid that I can't fire a weapon if you are within 8 yards of my hunter. Any kind of fight where you have to group up to avoid a charge or whatever, I'm sitting there spamming traps and one of my two melee hits. It's dumb.


It's dumb you can attack me from 41 yards away. Die.

Parkbandit
10-16-2007, 10:10 AM
It's dumb you can attack me from 41 yards away. Die.


It's a talent spec just like most other classes have. Cry less bitch.

Some Rogue
10-16-2007, 10:56 AM
It should be. It's stupid that I can't fire a weapon if you are within 8 yards of my hunter. Any kind of fight where you have to group up to avoid a charge or whatever, I'm sitting there spamming traps and one of my two melee hits. It's dumb.

Q fucking Q huntard.

How many of those fights are there really?

It's stupid I have less armor as a rogue than some fucking clothies yet I stand in range of cleaves and AoE spells. There's a hell of a lot more AoE'ing and cleaving mobs than ones that charge.

Methais
10-16-2007, 12:52 PM
It should be. It's stupid that I can't fire a weapon if you are within 8 yards of my hunter. Any kind of fight where you have to group up to avoid a charge or whatever, I'm sitting there spamming traps and one of my two melee hits. It's dumb.

It doesn't necessarily mean that you can shoot something at point blank. There's just not gonna be the dead zone where you can neither use ranged or melee. I don't know if that means they're increasing melee range at least for hunters, decreasing the minimum distance for ranged, or both.

Arcane Shot dispelling buffs shouldn't go in though that's just retarded and senseless.

Trouble
10-16-2007, 01:06 PM
Q fucking Q huntard.

How many of those fights are there really?

It's stupid I have less armor as a rogue than some fucking clothies yet I stand in range of cleaves and AoE spells. There's a hell of a lot more AoE'ing and cleaving mobs than ones that charge.

AoE's I can't help with (other than l2resistgear) but don't forget for things like cleaves and hatefuls, you have 4-6 times the dodge that a clothie would have. I dunno if those types of attacks can be parried, but you'd have that as well.

Methais
10-16-2007, 01:10 PM
AoE's I can't help with (other than l2resistgear) and Cloak of Skill

Fixed.

Some Rogue
10-16-2007, 01:26 PM
Resist gear would gimp my damage which is the only reason rogues are there...dodge, I have around 28% I think buffed. So one in four I am dodging, but all it takes is one to get through. Not to mention, rogues pull aggro at 110% of the tanks threat, ranged at 130%.

Cloak of skill has a cooldown and doesn't make you completely immune nor does it stop the physical AoE damge like Gruul has.

Tea & Strumpets
10-16-2007, 01:38 PM
Resist gear would gimp my damage which is the only reason rogues are there...dodge, I have around 28% I think buffed. So one in four I am dodging, but all it takes is one to get through. Not to mention, rogues pull aggro at 110% of the tanks threat, ranged at 130%.

Cloak of skill has a cooldown and doesn't make you completely immune nor does it stop the physical AoE damge like Gruul has.


Have you considered learning to play?

http://www.smithmarketing.net/images/gold_charging_rhino.gif

Methais
10-16-2007, 01:40 PM
Everytime I see a rhinoceros I can't help but think of BLOODNINJA.


bloodninja: Ok baby, we got to hurry, I don't know how long I can keep it ready for you.

j_gurli3: thats ok. ok i'm a japanese schoolgirl, what r u.

bloodninja: A Rhinocerus. Well, hung like one, thats for sure.

j_gurli3: haha, ok lets go.

j_gurli3: i put my hand through ur hair, and kiss u on the neck.

bloodninja: I stomp the ground, and snort, to alert you that you are in my breeding territory.

j_gurli3: haha, ok, u know that turns me on.

j_gurli3: i start unbuttoning ur shirt.

bloodninja: Rhinoceruses don't wear shirts.

j_gurli3: No, ur not really a Rhinocerus silly, it's just part of the game.

bloodninja: Rhinoceruses don't play games. They f*cking charge your ass.

j_gurli3: stop, cmon be serious.

bloodninja: It doesn't get any more serious than a Rhinocerus about to charge your ass.

bloodninja: I stomp my feet, the dust stirs around my tough skinned feet.

j_gurli3: thats it.

bloodninja: Nostrils flaring, I lower my head. My horn, like some phallic symbol of my potent virility, is the last thing you see as skulls collide and mine remains the victor. You are now a bloody red ragdoll suspended in the air on my mighty horn.

bloodninja: Goddam am I hard now.

Some Rogue
10-16-2007, 01:42 PM
Haha, that's what he meant by it.

Kenn
10-23-2007, 12:49 PM
I'm not looking forward to the changes to disarm in 2.3, nor am I looking forward to the lame ass color scheme of the warrior S3 armor. But I'm glad they nerfed Skillherald and mace spec. Go go starting S3 with 5k arena points and 75k honor saved up though. :D

Drew2
10-23-2007, 12:51 PM
Too bad they're only letting 1500 arena points transfer. =/

Tsa`ah
10-23-2007, 12:52 PM
I'm not looking forward to the changes to disarm in 2.3, nor am I looking forward to the lame ass color scheme of the warrior S3 armor. But I'm glad they nerfed Skillherald and mace spec. Go go starting S3 with 5k arena points and 75k honor saved up though. :D

That 5k in points means squat when S3 hits .... point wipe.

Tsa`ah
10-23-2007, 12:52 PM
Too bad they're only letting 1500 arena points transfer. =/

They're really going to let some points carry?

Kenn
10-23-2007, 12:53 PM
When did they announce a point wipe? They let the 5k transfer over from S1 to S2.

Tsa`ah
10-23-2007, 12:55 PM
When did they announce a point wipe? They let the 5k transfer over from S1 to S2.

Negative unless you were the lucky recipient of some sort of bug.

Kenn
10-23-2007, 12:57 PM
The bug was that people had their 5k rollover, purchase the 3 pieces, then the server reset giving them back their 5k points and letting them keep the 3 pieces. So people were allowed to start the season with full S2 armor. As far as I know, they've never announced that only a percentage of arena points roll over. Also, I know for a fact I started S2 with 3k arena points so I could buy my axe.

Edit: And then I got fucked over for the first 1/3 of season 2.

Drew2
10-23-2007, 01:07 PM
Aimed Shot (Marksmanship) now reduces healing done to that target by 50% for 10 seconds.

Hunters are already fucking overpowered in PvP as it is. This is just fucking disgusting.

Kenn
10-23-2007, 01:12 PM
Arena Rewards include epic weapons and armor sets and are exceptionally useful for PvP combat, as they are loaded with PvP-centric stats such as Resilience and Stamina. These items are purchased with Arena Points, the currency of the Arena System. Arena Points do not decay and you can stockpile a maximum of 5,000 at any given time. To claim your rewards, visit the Arena vendor in Area 52 in the Netherstorm region of Outland

Do players keep their Arena Points after a season ends?
Yes.

Taken from the WoW arena info page. If someone can come up with a blue post to contradict this, I'd be greatly appreciative.

StrayRogue
10-23-2007, 01:13 PM
Yeah, I'd love to see a post saying we will only get 1.5k arena points to begin next season. I've saved up roughly 4k myself.

Drew2
10-23-2007, 01:14 PM
Yeah I thought I saw it on worldofraids.com (a link to a blue post, that is) but I can't find it. Maybe I'm hallucinating. WHO KNOWS.

Kenn
10-23-2007, 01:16 PM
Hunters are already fucking overpowered in PvP as it is. This is just fucking disgusting.

Not really, I've never really had problems with hunters in pvp, marksman or BM. The only one that gave me the least bit of trouble was BM and even then, 1v1 I try to force them to pop Beast Within as soon as possible, then toss on a sword 'n board, demo / thundercalp their pet, and spam the fuck out of shield block while running at them. With the pet behind me, its attacks don't eat up my block so I soften the blows from the hunter, and I just outlast until Best Within fades.

And in arenas, this won't be ground breaking either. Good players will be able to LoS the Aimed Shot rather easily. As soon as we see hunters, we utilize the pillars in Nagrand and BE or the tomb in Lorderon.

Edit: with a bit of resilience and more HP, hunters shouldn't be a problem for locks either. Just don't forget to toss a few DoT's on the pet. Double syphon life is still useful.

StrayRogue
10-23-2007, 01:18 PM
Cheat Death (Subtlety) chance to trigger increased to 33/66/100% and now also causes the rogue to take 90% less damage for 3 seconds when the effect triggers. This effect cannot occur more than once per minute.

Awesomesauce.

Methais
10-23-2007, 01:24 PM
Cheat Death (Subtlety) chance to trigger increased to 33/66/100% and now also causes the rogue to take 90% less damage for 3 seconds when the effect triggers. This effect cannot occur more than once per minute.

Awesomesauce.

Where do you see this?

StrayRogue
10-23-2007, 01:25 PM
Latest notes.

Methais
10-23-2007, 01:28 PM
Link please.

Nevermind, found it. Damn, that's fucked up.

Trouble
10-23-2007, 02:03 PM
Wow they are making everyone OPed in PvP now. They should just give everyone BFGs and a GodMode keycode in arena and be done with it.

They need to give priests plate armor, a pally bubble, 100% immunity to interrupts, and a chance on proc to increase heals by 200% for 15 seconds.

Man, just when I was starting to get into arenas...

StrayRogue
10-23-2007, 02:05 PM
Everyone is powerful against some and weak against others.

Trouble
10-23-2007, 02:11 PM
Everyone is powerful against some and weak against others.

Who is a holy priest powerful against? LoL

I don't give a shit about 1 on 1 since I always die when I get ganked; I'm talking priests no longer being needed in arena. What team would bring a priest now? Just bring 5 DPS since there are at least three ways to reduce healing, at least 3 ways to remove buffs, and then there's silence, stun, counterspell, etc.

Yeah, yeah cry more, I know. I should have rolled a different class.

StrayRogue
10-23-2007, 02:15 PM
I fuck up holy paladin's as a pvp holy priest. As a healer you're not supposed to be attacking anyway.

And if you want to go the glass cannon route, sure take 5 dps. Were I a pure pvp healer I'd probably want to be a shammie or paladin, but I do a lot of pve too (where I'm happier to be a priest than I would be a pala/shammie).

Believe me I know how frustrating. You always seem to get nuked straight off. I found it really stopped happening (as much, or at least as successfully) once I got over 10k hp and some resilience.

Tsa`ah
10-23-2007, 02:17 PM
If you can't fuck up a pair of warriors as a dps/holy priest ... stick with healing.

StrayRogue
10-23-2007, 02:18 PM
Warriors and rogues are the two things priests can't do shit about (at least holy ones).

Tsa`ah
10-23-2007, 02:19 PM
I disagree completely.

I've done enough 2v2 runs with a dps warrior (holy specced) to come to this understanding.

There's jack shit a pure melee combo can do about it.

StrayRogue
10-23-2007, 02:22 PM
I'd like to see any holy priest 1 on 1 with a pvp warrior.

Lets see. No fear. No escaping. Crap heals. No time to do any kind of damage except SW:P&D.

Trouble
10-23-2007, 02:26 PM
I fuck up holy paladin's as a pvp holy priest. As a healer you're not supposed to be attacking anyway.

And if you want to go the glass cannon route, sure take 5 dps. Were I a pure pvp healer I'd probably want to be a shammie or paladin, but I do a lot of pve too (where I'm happier to be a priest than I would be a pala/shammie).

Believe me I know how frustrating. You always seem to get nuked straight off. I found it really stopped happening (as much, or at least as successfully) once I got over 10k hp and some resilience.

I never said anything about attacking, so we'll call that a mutual misunderstanding. I only heal. The only DPS I do at ALL these days is to get Aether Rays down to 20% health and to Holy Fire rats in instances. :)

My priest has 10k health and about 200 resil self-buffed, so I'm getting there. But my point is that priest will be useless with all of the ways to reduce effective healing, all of the ways to remove buffs, all of the ways to silence, and the fact that they tend to get focus-fired quickly.

But yeah I might have to get my shaman up to 70 for PvP healing.

Tsa`ah
10-23-2007, 02:31 PM
I'd like to see any holy priest 1 on 1 with a pvp warrior.

Lets see. No fear. No escaping. Crap heals. No time to do any kind of damage except SW:P&D.

Maybe you missed the 2v2 reference I made? Maybe you're also forgeting aoe/damage/heal.

StrayRogue
10-23-2007, 02:32 PM
I guess it all depends on the team you're with and who you're facing. Sometimes I don't get nuked at all, heh.

Trouble
10-23-2007, 02:33 PM
If you can't fuck up a pair of warriors as a dps/holy priest ... stick with healing.
You can solo two warriors as a Disc/Holy priest? video please. And besides, I am sticking with healing already.


I've done enough 2v2 runs with a dps warrior (holy specced) to come to this understanding.

There's jack shit a pure melee combocan do about it.
2v2 with an MS warrior can be good enough for the 1500 bracket, depending on the teams. Kill the rogue then the warrior and hope the priest has big enough heals to cover the poison/MS. Throw in a caster with CC though and it gets more difficult. A melee shaman can take down a priest faster than a rogue if they get lucky combos.

StrayRogue
10-23-2007, 02:34 PM
Maybe you missed the 2v2 reference I made? Maybe you're also forgeting aoe/damage/heal.

Even if you were left alone, as in not getting damaged, you'd run out of mana way before you could kill a warrior with your aoe.

And you only made the 2v2 reference in your second post. Not your first.

Tsa`ah
10-23-2007, 02:49 PM
I've outdamaged my parter as dps/holy ... and shadow fiend isn't a tree skill ... you also forget about reflective shield and a good many other dps improvements offered by the discipline tree.

All in all, it's a build geared toward pure melee ... I like the flexibility I have with shadow.

StrayRogue
10-23-2007, 02:52 PM
I'd put my money on the rogue or pvp warrior vs any holy priest every time.

Trouble
10-23-2007, 03:14 PM
Once they make the +heal count towards +damage I might start tossing some SWPs around (or a IF+DP) depending on the opponents (no pallies or priests); but for the most part, I aim to keep myself alive long enough for my partner to at least kill one of the other team (in 2v2) or render the opposing healer ineffective (in 5v5). If we have a pally in 5v5 I become a dispel and mana burn bot, assuming I'm not being focused.

Parkbandit
10-23-2007, 03:41 PM
Hunters are already fucking overpowered in PvP as it is. This is just fucking disgusting.


I think hunters are far from 'overpowered' now.. I think we're on an even keel with most classes (except warlocks). These changes, if they ever come to fruition in this patch, make it hard to dispute that hunters WILL become overpowered. Daddy like though. :)

Outdrsyguy1
10-23-2007, 04:19 PM
I think the arena point carryover is still 5k. I've heard lots of rumors about it being random other amounts but never seen any blue posts saying it's not 5k this season. And i look at the worldofraids site every day.

Methais
10-23-2007, 04:26 PM
Wow they are making everyone OPed in PvP now. They should just give everyone BFGs and a GodMode keycode in arena and be done with it.

Mages still blow anus in arenas, mainly 2v2 and 3v3. And then Blizzard nerfed mages even more by increasing Hypothermia to 45 seconds.

Sean of the Thread
10-23-2007, 04:52 PM
5 v 5 don't they rule because of CC?

Atlanteax
10-23-2007, 04:57 PM
Not when you need to take down 1-2 of the opposing team in Focus Fire before they do it to your team.

First team that succeeds starts a cascade implosion in the other team.

Methais
10-23-2007, 05:14 PM
5 v 5 don't they rule because of CC?

A good warlock can CC just as good if not better than a mage.

Fear > Polymorph in every possible way in pvp. Seduce too, which is basically polymorph without the healing and without fear of spell pushback since nobody bothers attacking pets hardly. But it shares DR with fear and damage breaks it, and fear doesn't.

Spell Lock is pretty much equal to Counterspell. Slightly shorter lockout, but silence effect built in

Water elemental comes in pretty handy though for melee CC and some burst damage.

Line of sight is what really fucks mages hard in arenas though, hence why I said they suck balls mainly in 2v2 and 3v3, since their 5v5 role is more CC than damage.

Mages are getting a huge buff in 2.3 though - with the leveling being sped up, it'll be much easier for me to finish leveling my lock.

Keller
10-23-2007, 06:00 PM
There is no doubt that druids and warlocks are the most OP'd classes in arena right now.

Warlocks: Fear, Seduce, Silence, Curse of Tongue, DoTs (they can CC, Curse of Tongues, DoT the focus-fire target, and re-CC their cc target). They are by far the most OP class in arena.

Druids: Cyclone, Root, HoT+Kite. Second most OP class.

Hunters will never be OP'd. They are too soft. IMO.

Nieninque
10-23-2007, 06:02 PM
Negative unless you were the lucky recipient of some sort of bug.

Or maybe just someone that plays the game

The 5k points transferred over from s1 to s2 if you had them stored up.

Kenn
10-23-2007, 07:31 PM
I will be honest: trying to drop a geared holy priest is rediculously hard for me. And dropping a geared shadow priest / warlock is next to impossible as a warrior. The only advantage I ever have is in BG's when my gear far surpasses my opponent's. Warriors shine much more with support, as time drags on, warrior's DPS doesn't peter out. All mana based DPS'ers will eventually go OOM in longer fights. Another reason locks and mages are so good in the higher up arenas: life tap, evocation, mage water.

And someone mentioned 2 warrior DPS. I've been on a double warrior DPS team. Any other 5v5 team with a hunter or frost mage really worked us over. Once the mage caught BoP or BoF, we couldn't stay on top of them. Hunters would just drop frost traps and our FF target would run through it until we got entrapped. Warriors have their uses, but I think there are much stronger classes in arenas. Makes me wish my shadow priest was 70. :(

Edit: When teamed up against a warrior led DPS set up, mages are incredibly good. One of the top teams in our battlegroup was SPriest / Frost Mage. They were full merc early on in the season and stopped playing to focus more on 5v5's. I think they've since transfered to BG7. A really strong 3v3 set up is Frost Mage / SPriest / Mace Combat Rogue. With the changes to hunters in the next patch, I was thinking about leveling my Shadow Priest up and teaming with my roomate's lock and our buddy's hunter. Scorpid Poison + Viper's Sting + Drain Mana + Siphon Life + Drain Life + spriest / lock synergy. We were tossing around the team name "Team Drain You."

Methais
10-23-2007, 07:43 PM
All mana based DPS'ers will eventually go OOM in longer fights. Another reason locks and mages are so good in the higher up arenas: life tap, evocation, mage water.

Mages are rarely able to cast a fireball or frostbolt in an arena, nevermind channel Evocation for 8 seconds, or even just a few seconds. Plus you can buy arena water now with honor points, so water isn't exactly mage team exclusive anymore, but sitting down to drink isn't exactly easy to do anyway in most cases.

Locks on the other hand, yeah they can go forever. Mages have mana issues in long fights. Warlocks, not so much.

The only advantage mages really have over warlocks is that they're more fun to play, which I suppose can be all someone needs, but then losing isn't much fun either.