How does combat manuever's work?

[Silvestra]

Ive got a couple quick questions for combat manuever skill.

#1 Does it effect my DS at different stances? Say, if I go into stance guard and I had 100 CM ranks will my DS change if I had only 50 CM ranks? Oh and how much of difference is this change ...say at cap?

#2 Does it effect my Combat manuever attacks? If I had all 5 ranks of charge, will my successes change because I had 100 ranks rather then 50 ranks?

Thanks in advance . :)

[Latrinsorm]

CM has no effect on DS.

CM will make you better at maneuvering: the formula is complex (and currently unknown) but I know for certain that it is not as simple as 1 CM rank = +1 to your endroll.

[Stanley Burrell]

How does combat maneuver's what work?

[Cademus]

CM has no effect on DS.

CM will make you better at maneuvering: the formula is complex (and currently unknown) but I know for certain that it is not as simple as 1 CM rank = +1 to your endroll.

Are you certain about that?

Cut and pasted from Simu site.

Combat maneuvers training is a rather broad skill that covers many of the subtle "tricks of the trade" for melee combat. The more obvious benefits of the skill are the bonuses to attack and defense it provides. The bonus is dependant upon the stance you are in. When in more offensive stances it will help you hit harder, while in more defensive stances it will help you defend better compared to someone without it. The subtle aspects of the skill are found when trying to dodge special "maneuver" type attacks that one might face. Combat maneuvers skill figures into some but not all of these situations.

In fact it may be the other way around. It helps with DS, and doesn't help with manuever attacks...at least it doesn't mention helping in doing manuever attacks just defending against them.

[Stanley Burrell]

CM has no effect on DS.

CM will make you better at maneuvering: the formula is complex (and currently unknown) but I know for certain that it is not as simple as 1 CM rank = +1 to your endroll.

Two CM ranks + 2 weapon ranks (post 49 ranks) have added a +3 AS -- Are you sure this isn't DS effective?

[Stanley Burrell]

What the dude sporting the periwig said.

[Khariz]

Are you certain about that?

Cut and pasted from Simu site.

Combat maneuvers training is a rather broad skill that covers many of the subtle "tricks of the trade" for melee combat. The more obvious benefits of the skill are the bonuses to attack and defense it provides. The bonus is dependant upon the stance you are in. When in more offensive stances it will help you hit harder, while in more defensive stances it will help you defend better compared to someone without it. The subtle aspects of the skill are found when trying to dodge special "maneuver" type attacks that one might face. Combat maneuvers skill figures into some but not all of these situations.

In fact it may be the other way around. It helps with DS, and doesn't help with manuever attacks...at least it doesn't mention helping in doing manuever attacks just defending against them.

As to your boldened part.

It helps the E/B/P when you are in more defensive stances.

[AestheticDeath]

Before dodging came about I am pretty sure CM added to your physical DS.

I dunno about these days.

[Bobmuhthol]

CM indirectly adds to DS, especially in Cademus' reference, for the following reason:

CM adds to AS
50% * stance modifier = AS used for DS
CM adds to DS when stance modifier > 0

[Drew]

CM indirectly adds to DS, especially in Cademus' reference, for the following reason:

CM adds to AS
50% * stance modifier = AS used for DS
CM adds to DS when stance modifier > 0


No more. AS generated by CM is not calculated in your DS no matter what your stance.

[Drew]

Are you certain about that?

Cut and pasted from Simu site.

Combat maneuvers training is a rather broad skill that covers many of the subtle "tricks of the trade" for melee combat. The more obvious benefits of the skill are the bonuses to attack and defense it provides. The bonus is dependant upon the stance you are in. When in more offensive stances it will help you hit harder, while in more defensive stances it will help you defend better compared to someone without it. The subtle aspects of the skill are found when trying to dodge special "maneuver" type attacks that one might face. Combat maneuvers skill figures into some but not all of these situations.

In fact it may be the other way around. It helps with DS, and doesn't help with manuever attacks...at least it doesn't mention helping in doing manuever attacks just defending against them.


This wouldn't be the first (or last) time Simu's site was woefully out of date.

[Fallen]

What I want to know is how much does a rank of CM provide in terms of CMAN defense. Is it any sort of a tangible conversion? Lets keep it simple and say that you are defending in one OTHER than the one(s) you are training in at the time.

[Drew]

Latrinsorm will probably have a much better idea than I do, but I have seen it add to your CMAN defense. I added four ranks of CM (at once, no level up) and saw my CM defense go up two against a feint.

[Cademus]

What I would like to know is how much of a factor is CM ranks in doing succesful CM attacks? Generals would be ok, a lot, not much, moderately etc...

[Latrinsorm]

Are you certain about that?
Are you sure this isn't DS effective?100% positive.
It helps the E/B/P when you are in more defensive stances.According to whom?

As to CM ranks to CM defense, I don't know (yet). I am organizing a bit of research on it, though. Give it a month or so.

[Latrinsorm]

Level is by far the biggest factor (boo! hiss!): if Evarin was capped with 0 CM ranks, my warrior would have 0 chance of maneuvering him at 2x. Near and like-level, CM dominates. Your character will struggle to maneuver things with 1x or less CM training.

[Fallen]

I dont care about using them, I care about defending against them. I think 40 ranks is a good stopping point, as then you are running into major diminishing returns due to only getting 1 point a rank. I will have to work towards that soon.

True, a Capped warrior versus my capped pure even with 1x CM will nearly always hit me, but I can widen the gap between those NOT capped, and lower the endroll thresholds of those that ARE capped.