Stick a Fork in Kerry, he's DONE!!! [Archive] - The Gemstone IV Players' Corner

Parkbandit

11-02-2004, 11:28 PM

Originally posted by Farquar

Originally posted by Atlanteax
A President Kerry would had been a disaster...

I doubt anyone could be a bigger disaster then W. Worst president in history.

I'm an eternal optimist. I always thought the good guy wins and the facist would lose. That being said, things aren't looking up for the good guys right now. More importantly, things aren't looking good for civilization right now.

What the fuck are you babbling about? You obviously haven't seen the latest. Don't be so silly.. Bush still has the lead.

He is the good guy in my book.

Hulkein

11-02-2004, 11:30 PM

I think they are both 'good guys' at heart, I just agree with one moreso than the other one.

Farquar is probably one to whine about why we are so polarized too, lol.

Farquar

11-02-2004, 11:32 PM

Just so sad. W is killing the country, but people are too concerned about the gay dude down the street and other people's babies to notice.

Chadj

11-02-2004, 11:32 PM

<<Stfu>>

stfu

Chadj

11-02-2004, 11:34 PM

By the way,

Bush: 207
Kerry: 199
To Be Decided: 132

That isn't any more than 5 minutes old

Farquar

11-02-2004, 11:37 PM

Kerry can win without Ohio AND Florida, but he needs to win the triple crown(MI, WI, MN) to stay in the race. The area is incredibly close right now.

GSTamral

11-02-2004, 11:39 PM

If Bush wins Florida and Ohio at this point, its over. Alaska will be republican

219 +27+20+3 = 269.

He loses every other state, its a tie. The house is projected republican, the senate is projected to have the republicans gain one or 2 seats.

11-02-2004, 11:42 PM

Farquar I think the race is a bit more about the current situation in Iraq than homosexuality. At least in my neck of the woods, though thats a obvious.

GSTamral

11-02-2004, 11:44 PM

Florida just projected to Bush by no other than Dan Rather at CBS

Scott

11-02-2004, 11:45 PM

Looks like 4 more years.....

Latrinsorm

11-02-2004, 11:46 PM

Originally posted by Chadj
By the way,

Bush: 207
Kerry: 199
To Be Decided: 132

That isn't any more than 5 minutes old From where? I haven't seen any totals like that. Fox has it 210 to 1somethingsomething, CNN has had it 197 188 for hours, ABC has it 237 188 (Florida!!!).

edit: Don't tell me you're watching CBS. :down:

[Edited on 11-3-2004 by Latrinsorm]

Lockrebezz

11-02-2004, 11:47 PM

John F. Kerry (DEM) 611,938 51%
George W. Bush (REP)* 581,231 48%
Ralph Nader (IND) 6,634 1%
42% of precincts reporting

Looks like Kerry may have picked up Wisconsin.

Lockrebezz

11-02-2004, 11:48 PM

Originally posted by Latrinsorm

Originally posted by Chadj
By the way,

Bush: 207
Kerry: 199
To Be Decided: 132

That isn't any more than 5 minutes old From where? I haven't seen any totals like that. Fox has it 210 to 1somethingsomething, CNN has had it 197 188 for hours, ABC has it 237 188 (Florida!!!).

edit: Don't tell me you're watching CBS. :down:

[Edited on 11-3-2004 by Latrinsorm]

www.msnbc.com shows those numbers.

Latrinsorm

11-02-2004, 11:49 PM

Originally posted by Lockrebezz
John F. Kerry (DEM) 611,938 51%
George W. Bush (REP)* 581,231 48%
Ralph Nader (IND) 6,634 1%
42% of precincts reporting

Looks like Kerry may have picked up Wisconsin. I don't know if that's how the networks do it, but you realize that there's a chance Bush gets over 70% of the vote in that state, right?

Lockrebezz

11-02-2004, 11:50 PM

Originally posted by Latrinsorm

Originally posted by Lockrebezz
John F. Kerry (DEM) 611,938 51%
George W. Bush (REP)* 581,231 48%
Ralph Nader (IND) 6,634 1%
42% of precincts reporting

Looks like Kerry may have picked up Wisconsin. I don't know if that's how the networks do it, but you realize that there's a chance Bush gets over 70% of the vote in that state, right?

He could, but im going to pull a CBS and put Wisconsin as a Kerry state this time around.

GSTamral

11-02-2004, 11:50 PM

Wisconsin is still in doubt. The Southern areas that trend republican are still up in the air. Michigan is not as tight as it looks, I'm not sure why they have not projected it to Kerry yet.

PS. Of all races, I am in shock that Hawaii is trending republican.

Farquar

11-02-2004, 11:51 PM

Originally posted by Dave
Farquar I think the race is a bit more about the current situation in Iraq than homosexuality. At least in my neck of the woods, though thats a obvious.

I wish it were. Kerry would have won by a landslide if that were true.

[Edited on 11-3-2004 by Farquar]

Drew

11-02-2004, 11:51 PM

Originally posted by GSTamral
If Bush wins Florida and Ohio at this point, its over. Alaska will be republican

219 +27+20+3 = 269.

He loses every other state, its a tie. The house is projected republican, the senate is projected to have the republicans gain one or 2 seats.

Unless one of Maine's house district goes Republican, then it will be 270-268.

Anyway, the networks are calling Florida for Bush now, CNN and FoxNews have yet to do so.

Looks like it's all Ohio now. If Bush loses Ohio he'll need to get Wisc. and NM. To force a tie. Or Michigan, and hawaii I think.

Hulkein

11-02-2004, 11:53 PM

It's safe to put Michigan and Minnesota in Kerry's column, this coming from a Bush supporter.

Iowa, Ohio, Wisconsin, and Nevada are the real tight ones to watch as time goes by. Also, that 1 Maine vote that is up in the air and Hawaii could be huge for Bush.

Alfster

11-03-2004, 12:49 AM

Originally posted by Maimara
Fucking right.

For those of you not in the know, Wisconsin is to Minnesota what West Virginia is to everywhere else.

Never, ever confuse Minnesota with Wisconsin.

PS Atlanteax, your mail bomb is on its way. <3

(joking, btw.)

Ya know, here in Wisconsin we think of Minnesota as everyone else's West Virginia..

And yes, never ever confuse Wisconsin with Minnesota. We know how to drive in Wisconsin.

Atlanteax

11-03-2004, 12:50 AM

With 246 EC votes... Bush has a commanding 52-48% lead in Ohio, a lead of 140k votes, at 83% reporting...

... and would just need Nevada or New Mexico or one other state.

However, Bush will likely win both Nevada and New Mexico...

.

So we now get to look forward to 4 more years of Bush (instead of Kerry). :smug:

Latrinsorm

11-03-2004, 12:58 AM

Commanding? In OHIO? Send me some of what you're smoking plz.

But: New Mexico, Nevada, Wisconsin, and Hawaii gives Bush the win.

[Edited on 11-3-2004 by Latrinsorm]

Sean

11-03-2004, 12:59 AM

Originally posted by Atlanteax
So we now get to look forward to 4 more years of Bush (instead of Kerry). :smug:

If by we you mean you then yes.

Latrinsorm

11-03-2004, 01:01 AM

p.s: The polls closed, Fox (they're unbiased!!!!!) has Bush with 269, time for bed.

peam

11-03-2004, 01:05 AM

Bush is going to win. All of the supporters of the low-tax, gay free, cross-toting America, I hope you enjoy the reaping.

The next four years of blustering our military power at brown people, obtrusive and oppresive measures by our government, and mishandling of the nation's fiscal matters will provide for loads of entertainment.

I truly do fear our equal, fair, and free America will progress further into the downward spiral.

[Edited on 11-3-2004 by peam]

11-03-2004, 01:08 AM

Bush will take NM and win the election.

Hulkein

11-03-2004, 01:12 AM

FOUR MORE YEARS.

Hahaha, Electoral-vote was wrong, OH NOEZ!!

longshot

11-03-2004, 01:15 AM

4 more years of a culture of ignorance fueled by fear and hatred.

We can all look forward to our top scientist fleeing to countries where their research is governed by common sense, rather than a 2000 year old religious text.

We can watch the deficit grow by funding the "War on terror", where we pay out the ass for six girls named Shonique and Loquicia to stick their fingers up the ass of every third airline passenger. In the meantime, new 'rab terrorists train in indonesia, the Phillipines and Malaysia for $.20 a day.

We can look forward to contribution and mutual cooperation from our powerful global allies... like Spain... er... Poland... er... Bulgaria.

We can watch people trample laws in the name of Jesus.

The country is now like the Italian restaurant in the movie "Goodfellas". It's going to be busted out by corporate guys in suits, rather than guys named Carbone and Jimmy.

I can't believe the American public is this stupid. It's like everyone in the country has regressed to a neanderthal.

Arkans, you rule now.

Now is the era of ignorance.

Edited to add an "and"...

[Edited on 11-3-2004 by longshot]

ThisOtherKingdom

11-03-2004, 01:19 AM

Leave it to longshot to sum everything up perfectly.

Hulkein

11-03-2004, 01:26 AM

Originally posted by ThisOtherKingdom
Leave it to longshot to sum everything up perfectly.

I'm going to celebrate with six quarts of whole milk, 24 oz's of sirloin, and a rack of ribs.

ThisOtherKingdom

11-03-2004, 01:27 AM

Originally posted by Hulkein

Originally posted by ThisOtherKingdom
Leave it to longshot to sum everything up perfectly.

I'm going to celebrate with six quarts of whole milk, 24 oz's of sirloin, and a rack of ribs.

Yet again you make the mistake of assuming I give a shit about what you eat.

GSTamral

11-03-2004, 01:30 AM

Bush has been projected to win Ohio. Bush is also looking like he will take wisconsin, where the only outstanding areas are rural, and Kerry holding a tenuous 20,000 vote lead, new mexico and nevada. Several Democratic strongholds have shifted, and some state races are much closer than they were in 2000. I believe when all is said and done, only 3 states will be different from 2000. Iowa, Wisconsin, and Hawaii.

The shock for me, actually, is that Bush is winning the national popular vote by such a large margin. That is indeed, something I never saw happening, especially with the record turnout

GSTamral

11-03-2004, 01:33 AM

Again, I must say though, not to count the chickens before they hatch. That 100,000 vote lead Bush has in Ohio is far from commanding.

Meos

11-03-2004, 01:37 AM

We're fucked.

GSTamral

11-03-2004, 01:40 AM

The one thing I am extremely disappointed with is the death of the southern democrats. They were the closest voice of reason on either side of the senate, voicing very conservative fiscal qualities, with a more progressive social agenda. What we will find, is that the Senate will be extremely polarized, with strongly conservative republicans and northern liberal democrats, which threatens quite a standstill depending on the use of the filibuster.

I know this message board is highly vocal and very left of the norm, but Bush is winning by 3.5 million votes right now, despite the record turnout democrats believe they needed to win.

Cast aside the "they are all idiots" and "I hate republicans" and maybe you'll see more and more why the democrats simply needed to field a more conservative democrat, in which case I think they would have won this election handily. The democrats did nothing to prevent the polarization of opinion. In fact, they helped to further propogate it with their choice for president.

Lord Deprav

11-03-2004, 01:43 AM

Originally posted by longshot

I can't believe the American public is this stupid. It's like everyone in the country has regressed to a neanderthal.

You are right. I can't believe people are stupid enough to vote for the worst president of all time.

To all of you who voted Bush, look in your hearts and ask yourself what good has he done for you and your country. The only thing that anyone can ever argue with me is that he gave you a tax break. I can accept that. Can you accept that part of the tax break will affect your Social Security in the long run? I hope your happy when all the money you dumped into the SS pool won't be there in 10 years because the money looks pretty now. Thank god I am educated and know how to invest my money.

Deprav

GSTamral

11-03-2004, 01:45 AM

Latest projections:

Senate:
55 republicans, 44 democrats, 1 independant.

Congress 233 Republicans, 202 Democrats
Pickup of 6 seats overall for Republicans.

Record Turnout for president showing Bush swinging more than 4 million votes from last election, but winning the same states as before, and losing the same states as before.

We are in for perhaps the most contentious partisan next 4 years as possible.

GSTamral

11-03-2004, 01:48 AM

<<
Thank god I am educated and know how to invest my money.
>>>

Again, you accuse everyone who voted for Bush of being stupid. I re-iterate again, the man that Newsweek and Time called the smartest man alive voted for Bush, and not just for financial reasons. There are a variety of reasons why people vote republican. Many of those people think Clinton was a terrible president, myself included. Not that I think Bush is any better, because I chose not to cast a vote this time around, but the blanket stupidity reasoning does nothing for your cause and your beliefs other than re-assert your own lack of cultural relativism.

Lord Deprav

11-03-2004, 01:49 AM

Originally posted by Meos
We're fucked.

Boy that is truely the brightest statement I have heard all day. I pity you republicans who are not rich and think electing this motherfucker back to office is going to help make you any money. It's going to be grand when our economy gets so bad and everyone is unemplyed. Can't wait till tell my children in 50 years about the greatest depression that I lived through. Can't wait to tell my children why we wasted so much money dropping bombs into the sand. Can't wait to tell my children how the United States are a bunch of terrorist. Killing for oil instead of paying for it like any other country would. I was proud of the US after how close people came during a time when we needed to. I am sadden that we are not that close anymore. We once again were split up by political partys. I may be a democrat, but I swear I would vote republican just to get this motherfucking Hitler out of office. He is nothing but a Tyrant.

kheldarin

11-03-2004, 01:51 AM

HAHA, all of the Democrats are crying now. Cmon, it's not even officially over yet.

Kite

11-03-2004, 01:53 AM

kerry ------>:injured:

GSTamral

11-03-2004, 01:53 AM

For the record Deprav, UPS made record profits this last year, and our stock award is the highest its been since the company went public.

Companies re-assessed job situations, but the country is making more money in 2004 than it did in the banner year in 1998.

I hate to break it to you, but we were in a recession between the years of 1999-2002. The market will take significantly longer than that to recover.

More importantly, perhaps you should research what a liquidity trap is before you blame Bush entirely for the economic situation. I personally don't believe he's done enough, but most any economist will tell you this recession began during the Clinton administration as a pullback from the record gains in 1998. Inventory levels were too high, Investment was capped, and companies began the re-structuring and cost-cutting measures that signal that phase of any economic cycle.

11-03-2004, 01:54 AM

And they call us stupid?... the above speaks for itself.

Hulkein

11-03-2004, 01:54 AM

Deprav, buy some Kleenex man.

I was prepared to simply not post had Bush lost, not sit here and make negative sweeping generalizations.

Do the same.

Nakiro

11-03-2004, 01:54 AM

Bush is winning by 3.2m popular votes.

I wonder if Jessie Jackson is going to be a rightous prick and demand that Bush should've been President if he wins the popular vote but loses the electoral vote.

Lord Deprav

11-03-2004, 01:55 AM

Originally posted by GSTamral
<<
Thank god I am educated and know how to invest my money.
>>>

Again, you accuse everyone who voted for Bush of being stupid. I re-iterate again, the man that Newsweek and Time called the smartest man alive voted for Bush, and not just for financial reasons. There are a variety of reasons why people vote republican. Many of those people think Clinton was a terrible president, myself included. Not that I think Bush is any better, because I chose not to cast a vote this time around, but the blanket stupidity reasoning does nothing for your cause and your beliefs other than re-assert your own lack of cultural relativism.

Right and wrong is pretty clear. The smartest man alive? I don't even want to get into that. Determining someones intelligence by other flaws in human testing is not a very good idea. I am very upset in the American people. How can anyone not see whats right and wrong. There is no gray. Its black and white. As I stated I don't care about party's. I care about the man who is going to be in charge of my country. I don't care if Right wingers win the republic. I have faith in them. I have no faith in this piece of shit. How can anyone?

Lord Deprav

11-03-2004, 02:00 AM

Companies don't live forever. But new businesses have to develop which is just not happening. Thats why jobs are being lost so often. I live in Ohio and see it personally everyday. I am not blaming Bush on the high gas prices. But the shithead isn't even going to raise the standards for min wage? Welfare be ready!

Edaarin

11-03-2004, 02:15 AM

The voting turnout in Charlottesville was 72%.

If nothing else, this election certainly did pull the voters out.

- A non-voter.

Hulkein

11-03-2004, 02:17 AM

I gotta admit, with this turnout, I am very surprised Bush did as well as he did. He's probably going to win the popular vote by a few points.. Who would've thought with this turnout?

Nakiro

11-03-2004, 02:23 AM

Originally posted by Lord Deprav
Companies don't live forever. But new businesses have to develop which is just not happening. Thats why jobs are being lost so often. I live in Ohio and see it personally everyday. I am not blaming Bush on the high gas prices. But the shithead isn't even going to raise the standards for min wage? Welfare be ready!

Raising minimum wage is a bad, bad thing.

landon

11-03-2004, 03:00 AM

John Kerry is going to put our country into a risky state with his petty bullshit. He lost and he should take it like a man, for once.

Geoff

11-03-2004, 03:04 AM

Originally posted by Nakiro
Bush is winning by 3.2m popular votes.

I wonder if Jessie Jackson is going to be a rightous prick and demand that Bush should've been President if he wins the popular vote but loses the electoral vote.

Damnit Nakiro, I wanted to be the one to point that out.

If nothing else, (and I don't think this election is a lock yet so this is how I'm consoling myself if it swings Kerry's way) I'll get to remind every whiny Democrat I had to hear tell me that Bush shouldn't have been our president based on the popular vote what hippocrits they are for the next 4 years.

GSTamral

11-03-2004, 03:14 AM

Gap is up to almost 3.8 million now

Nakiro

11-03-2004, 03:39 AM

Indeed, Bush has won the popular vote by a visible margin.

Nieninque

11-03-2004, 03:40 AM

Fucking hell.
Stupid Americans have voted for a fucked up version of Planet of the Apes again...only this time, even Charlton Heston is on the bad guys side

:spaz:

TheEschaton

11-03-2004, 04:42 AM

Damn,

I had nightmares about this all night here in Africa, and now its ALMOST NOON HERE AND THERE'S NO RESULTS.

But it's pretty fucked up if you ask me. Ohio the new Florida? I can't even speak comprehensible English any more at this point, I didn't sleep last night, listening to BBC World on the shortwave.

Argh.

Well, I only come back in 2006. And I can extend for another coupla years til Hillary wins in 2008.

As for the African continent, everyone who's heard me say, "It looks like Bush will win the Presidency" has looked at me with deep pity and asked me, "Why is he even still in the running?"

Bah. It's noon, it's 105 degrees, I think I'll just go back to bed. Argh.

A dejected liberal,
-TheE-

Ilvane

11-03-2004, 05:36 AM

I had this odd feeling that Ohio was going to be the place, because of the Republicans screaming about the ballots there.:grin: It's also really odd that the exit polls were so wrong. It's fishy.

I'm not giving up hope yet, it's 254-252 according to CNN, and the provisional ballots haven't been counted in Ohio yet.

Even if Bush wins, he's going to have to deal with a very divided electorate. Those who didn't vote thinking it didn't matter I'm sure are kicking themselves right now too.

I can't believe it's even close, because to me the choice was so clear.

If Bush wins, my conscience is clear. All the bull that Bush pulls is on you idiots who voted for him.

No offense.;)

-A

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 05:43 AM

The just called Nevada and Ohio for Bush. They said that Bush's margin of victory in Ohio is "statistically insurmountable." Start crying, Michael Moore.

-K

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 05:45 AM

Originally posted by TheEschaton
Well, I only come back in 2006. And I can extend for another coupla years til Hillary wins in 2008.

Hahaha. If this happens, I'll trade you, Africa for my place here. I'd rather not participate in an America with president Hilary Cliton. Vom.

-K

Ilvane

11-03-2004, 05:55 AM

What's wrong with Hillary?

She would have at least told Bush to take a flying leap if she had been running.

-A

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 05:57 AM

Hilary, ew. I hate her attitude, I hate her demeanor. I think naming a book about yourself "Living History" is extremely arrogant. Also, if she was such a strong fiesty chick, she would have told her philandering husband to take a flying leap a long time ago. Instead, she writes in her book, (high-pitched Victorian voice), "Oh, I could have just wrung his neck!!!"

-K

TheRoseLady

11-03-2004, 06:28 AM

Who just called Ohio for Bush? You talking about our Republican (Former Democrat) turned Republican opportunist Sec of State (Can you tell that I hate him?) - The votes are still being counted. There are reports of up to 250,000 ballots that won't be counted for days.

This is the state that the polls closed at 7:30 pm and people were still lined up at midnight to vote. Do you realize that each and every single vote here represents the face of a person who sometimes waited for hours in the rain to voice their choice and the best comment that someone can muster is about Michael Moore who resides in Michigan.

Until the electoral votes move into one column or the other, I'll beg everyone to at least understand that those of us here in Ohio don't want to be in the middle of a big fight. I had hoped that there would be a decisive victory in one way or another so that we would not be thrust into the scrutiny of the world.

I've been amazingly impressed by some of the caution and intelligent comments made by many of those who support Bush - Atlanteax and Dave - consider yourself not included amongst those who have shown great class in this thread by not reducing themselves to mindless schoolyard taunts.

Neither candidate has been declared a winner, but regardless of who ends up with the electoral votes - there are people on the other side who won't take it easily. And if you had passion for this election - have a bit of regard for the other side as many of us have considered this the most important election of our lives.

Nakiro

11-03-2004, 06:33 AM

There's a 140,000 vote differential in Ohio.

Of the possible 250,000 they'd have to win 195,000 of the 250,000 to tie.

Warriorbird

11-03-2004, 06:42 AM

They've reported it'll take up to 11 days. While I think Bush has probably won, I'm sure battles over it will go on for a while. If some miracle occurs and Kerry wins... it is going to be funny to hear the Republicans whining about winning the popular vote but losing the electoral college.

SiKWiDiT

11-03-2004, 06:58 AM

Originally posted by Nieninque

Fucking hell.
Stupid Americans blah blah blah...

Why are you even posting in this thread you muppet?

Please have a nice, tall glass of stfu.

[Edited on 11-3-2004 by SiKWiDiT]

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 07:03 AM

Originally posted by Nakiro
There's a 140,000 vote differential in Ohio.

Of the possible 250,000 they'd have to win 195,000 of the 250,000 to tie.

TRL - what Nakiro said. I never said it wasn't important or any of the other stuff in your rant. I realize people are very emotional about this election. The bottom line is that the numbers for Kerry simply aren't there.

And I don't know who the guy on the news was that said Ohio. I realize it's not official. But again, the numbers for Kerry aren't materializing.

-K

TheRoseLady

11-03-2004, 07:24 AM

Originally posted by SpunGirl

Originally posted by Nakiro
There's a 140,000 vote differential in Ohio.

Of the possible 250,000 they'd have to win 195,000 of the 250,000 to tie.

TRL - what Nakiro said. I never said it wasn't important or any of the other stuff in your rant. I realize people are very emotional about this election. The bottom line is that the numbers for Kerry simply aren't there.

And I don't know who the guy on the news was that said Ohio. I realize it's not official. But again, the numbers for Kerry aren't materializing.

-K

Understand that it came from the Whitehouse Chief of Staff - of course the info from the Republican Sec of State for Ohio. It's not over until it's over.

As far as considering my heartfelt post a rant, well thanks for really understanding the heart of the message there...

Nakiro

11-03-2004, 07:44 AM

The information actually came from the Secretary of State in Ohio, which is the person who is responsbile for making sure the state correctly counts ballots.

It really isn't a bi-partisan issue.

Nakiro

11-03-2004, 07:46 AM

I realize part of that post was repetitive to what you've already stated TRL. Sorry, I'm kind a sleepy at the moment.

GSTamral

11-03-2004, 07:47 AM

There aren't 250,000 provisional ballots. There are between 150,000 and 250,000. If that number comes up closer to the middle, Kerry would basically need a clean sweep.

AnticorRifling

11-03-2004, 07:48 AM

I can't wait for the election to be over so the boards can stop being subjected to the deluge of election threads. Get rid of those and the Warclaidhm threads and we would be down to just the good stuff again.

Farquar

11-03-2004, 07:52 AM

If Bush wins, this country's in for a rough ride. In a few years, when all you have on your plate is your/your kid's draft slip, a $7.00 Social Security check, and an $18.00 arthritis pill, you people will finally realize what some of us have been crying about.

P.S. I'm tired of seeing that "smartest man alive" voting for Bush BS. Who cares if #1 voted for Bush, if the next ~55 million people down the list voted for Kerry?

Nakiro

11-03-2004, 07:58 AM

You lost ':oP

Back

11-03-2004, 07:59 AM

Well, fuck. I’m a popular vote kind of guy, so it looks pretty clear to me that W. is back. Even if Kerry somehow pulls out the electorate, I still have to concede to the majority. The majority have spoken. Our government is firmly entrenched with republicans with justices to nominate that will seal them in for a long time to come.

I really hope that W. does better these next 4 years and that the republicans can relax and really do some work to unify us as a nation. With my expectations so low after the previous 4, it would be unimaginable to do worse. I will write down all those campaign promises now and keep checking them as the years roll by. I will also keep my voice and criticize where I discern error in judgement.

Some may have lost faith in America. Especially our over-seas friends and continental neighbors. But don’t. This country is united in an odd sort of way. This election has brought out record numbers of voters. This, despite the conflict and results of this election, to me is an optimistic sign of the people’s desire to raise their voices concerning their nation’s direction.

Also, he can’t run again in 2008, so sit tight. :)

Ilvane

11-03-2004, 08:00 AM

Don't fear, fellow Democrats. They have a big mess to clean up. If Kerry loses, Bush and his Republicans are going to have to take care of Iraq, the economy, the mess with Al Queda, the prescription drug costs, the deficit, the unemployed, the underemployed, the poor, the taxes, the need for health care costs to go down, for both the country and the small businesses...the underfunding of the 'No child left behind", the actual amount of troops that need to be sent to Iraq, etc..etc..

I could go on more, but you get the idea. Even if Bush wins, think positive..at least he has no one to blame for this mess but the Republicans, and himself.

-A

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 08:04 AM

Originally posted by Maimara
if Bush wins I'll put that signature of mine back up.

I'm waiting.......

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 08:08 AM

Originally posted by TheRoseLady
As far as considering my heartfelt post a rant, well thanks for really understanding the heart of the message there...

That's just the problem, it's not an emotional issue. The election isn't decided by who sheds the most tears over the campaign or who can be the most heartfelt. It's sheer numbers. And again, the numbers for Kerry in Ohio just aren't materializing.

-K

AnticorRifling

11-03-2004, 08:09 AM

Originally posted by Farquar
If Bush wins, this country's in for a rough ride. In a few years, when all you have on your plate is your/your kid's draft slip, a $7.00 Social Security check, and an $18.00 arthritis pill, you people will finally realize what some of us have been crying about.

P.S. I'm tired of seeing that "smartest man alive" voting for Bush BS. Who cares if #1 voted for Bush, if the next ~55 million people down the list voted for Kerry?

Good bring back the draft.

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 08:15 AM

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 08:15 AM

Minimum wage was raised in Nevada.

-K

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 08:25 AM

Originally posted by SpunGirl
Minimum wage was raised in Nevada.

-K

It was raised in Florida as well.

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 08:30 AM

It was a very emotional issue for me.

-K

Betheny

11-03-2004, 08:34 AM

Here you are, o great master.

DeV

11-03-2004, 08:42 AM

Originally posted by Backlash
Some may have lost faith in America. Especially our over-seas friends and continental neighbors. But don’t. This country is united in an odd sort of way. This election has brought out record numbers of voters. This, despite the conflict and results of this election, to me is an optimistic sign of the people’s desire to raise their voices concerning their nation’s direction.

Also, he can’t run again in 2008, so sit tight. :) Nicely said Backlash. It is a little disheartening that Kerry has lost but after all the majority of Kerry supporters were riding on hope and the majority of our fellow Americans have chosen Bush once again.

sidenote: I can't believe there were people who actually voted for Alan Keyes in the Senate race in Illinois. Crazy.

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 08:44 AM

Originally posted by Maimara
Here you are, o great master.

Excellent. You will make a fine subject.

11-03-2004, 08:46 AM

For some people it is a emotional issue. My future depended on this election, im just happy it turned out the way it did.

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 08:48 AM

Dear Mr. Kerry;

The election is over and now you must stand up and take it like a man. Make a nice concession speech.. thank your supporters and proclaim Bush the victor. Take the high road and help mend the divide you had a hand in creating.

Do it today.

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 08:52 AM

Originally posted by Dave
For some people it is a emotional issue. My future depended on this election, im just happy it turned out the way it did.

People can be emotional about it all they want, but that won't change the outcome once all is said and done. Getting angry that someone posts, "Someone said on the news that so-and-so won..." because you're emotional about the election is ludicrous.

Asking people to please consider the faces and hearts of the people who stood in line to vote when making a remark on a message board about Michael Moore is equally ludicrous. Seriously, if a flip remark will injure your political soul that much, maybe you're in the wrong place. It's not like I'm joking about the holocaust. People lined up in the rain to vote. That's nice. Kerry is still going to lose.

-K

11-03-2004, 08:56 AM

oh I agree spun. But then again I am immature because i said that bush won nevada, and called somebody else rant an example of what he called republicans. according to TRL

Nieninque

11-03-2004, 08:57 AM

Originally posted by Dave
For some people it is a emotional issue. My future depended on this election, im just happy it turned out the way it did.

Everyone's future depended on it. Even people who dont live in/come from America

11-03-2004, 08:57 AM

Some more than others though.

DeV

11-03-2004, 09:02 AM

That is selfish and wishful thinking. Your vote means just as much as the next person. Everyone's future has been affected.

longshot

11-03-2004, 09:05 AM

Originally posted by Dave
For some people it is a emotional issue. My future depended on this election, im just happy it turned out the way it did.

?

Is your future to lay writhing in the desert with your cock and balls blown off by an IED because you were doing a job that you weren't trained to do with inferior equipment?

11-03-2004, 09:05 AM

The biggest issue worldwide was the war on terror. Do you think if kerry won we would end it? I have news for you, this is going to go on for 20 or more years. We have started something that should have been delt with a long time ago, kerry would have had to stayed with it no matter what. Kerry's only way to make things better in iraq was to bring in UN troops. The United states would still have just as many soldiers over there, the only difference is they would be wearing blue beret instead of a black one.(or tan, green, maroon). Thats all he offered, and that was not enough.

DeV

11-03-2004, 09:05 AM

Originally posted by Parkbandit
Dear Mr. Kerry;

The election is over and now you must stand up and take it like a man. Make a nice concession speech.. thank your supporters and proclaim Bush the victor. Take the high road and help mend the divide you had a hand in creating.

Do it today. Bush won. However I don't know what kind of message it would send if he conceded before every vote has been counted. Meaning, what kind of message would it send to those counties that are not done reporting: that their vote doesn't count in some way? I have been thinking about it and agree that he probably "should" concede and probably knows his chances are slim to none but it will come down to the wire and I think that's a good thing considering the voter turn out this year.

Edited to fix a grave error. :rolleyes:

[Edited on 11-3-2004 by DarkelfVold]

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 09:06 AM

Everyone is affected by the outcome of an election, but I would wager that some people are more DIRECTLY affected than others. For example, there could be a white female, like me, 24, like me, with a host of other similarities. The only difference being that her husband is in the military and mine is an educator, I would wager she would feel the effects more readily than I.

-K

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 09:07 AM

Originally posted by DarkelfVold
That is selfish and wishful thinking. Your vote means just as much as the next person. Everyone's future has been affected.

Sorry.. my future wouldn't have changed really had Kerry or Bush won.

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 09:09 AM

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 09:09 AM

Originally posted by Parkbandit

Originally posted by DarkelfVold
That is selfish and wishful thinking. Your vote means just as much as the next person. Everyone's future has been affected.

Sorry.. my future wouldn't have changed really had Kerry or Bush won.

Really? What if in two years and a new supreme court your wife or girflriend is brutally raped, and not allowed to have an abortion? That'd affect your life pretty dramatically.

-K

Betheny

11-03-2004, 09:10 AM

It affects our future.

Economic recession or boom, terrorists or no, foreign policy...

DeV

11-03-2004, 09:10 AM

Originally posted by Parkbandit

Originally posted by DarkelfVold
That is selfish and wishful thinking. Your vote means just as much as the next person. Everyone's future has been affected.

Sorry.. my future wouldn't have changed really had Kerry or Bush won. Ok then, Edine's vote can be more important than yours. :)
It's not "more" important than mine or my neighbor or my co-worker's. On a broader scale, minus PB of course, we are all affected, indirectly and directly.

11-03-2004, 09:11 AM

Originally posted by longshot

Originally posted by Dave
For some people it is a emotional issue. My future depended on this election, im just happy it turned out the way it did.

?

Is your future to lay writhing in the desert with your cock and balls blown off by an IED because you were doing a job that you weren't trained to do with inferior equipment?

What inferior equipment? What lack of training? I want to know where you get your information so I can find it. I need to know what forgien armed forces use a better body armor that the current Intercepter body armor worn by all troops over there. Granted the M4-carbine and the m16 are not the best weapons, though that is mostly do to the 5.56 nato round than anything else.

People at home complain about the deficit yet you expect all of the hummers to be armor plated... heres news its going to cost a lot.

Im confident in the training I recieved
I can shoot well, I know what to do under fire, I am confident in my ability to act correctly during a firefight. I did not know that you had experienced military life so far and the training one recieves. Please let me know where you went to basic and what unit you were attatched to.

(sometimes it is best to keep things to yourself when you are truely ignorant on a subject)

DeV

11-03-2004, 09:13 AM

Didn't a unit in Iraq refuse to go out on a mission because of inferior equipment? Not sure if you get punished for doing something like that but it did hit the news a couple of weeks ago.

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 09:13 AM

Originally posted by SpunGirl

Originally posted by Parkbandit

Originally posted by DarkelfVold
That is selfish and wishful thinking. Your vote means just as much as the next person. Everyone's future has been affected.

Sorry.. my future wouldn't have changed really had Kerry or Bush won.

Really? What if in two years and a new supreme court your wife or girflriend is brutally raped, and not allowed to have an abortion? That'd affect your life pretty dramatically.

-K

I don't play the what if games. You are taking a pretty big leap there....

1) Bush will replace at least 2 Judges on the Supreme Court with anti-abortion stands.

2) Both Supreme Court Judges will be confirmed.

3) Roe vs. Wade will be overturned.

4) My wife or kids will be brutally raped.

5) My wife or kids will get pregnant on that one rape.

I think I have a better shot of getting attacked by Al-Queda.. and thus I am glad Bush won. Thanks.

Betheny

11-03-2004, 09:14 AM

Either way, Dave, it was your choice to join the military. No offense, I have no sympathy for your political views because they relate to your service. You chose to join. Your vote and your beliefs on the election are no more important than the rest of us.

11-03-2004, 09:15 AM

Originally posted by DarkelfVold
Didn't a unit in Iraq refuse to go out on a mission because of inferior equipment? Not sure if you get punished for doing something like that but it did hit the news a couple of weeks ago.

no a reserve unit refused to go out because they claimed that their trucks were not in working order.

You see each unit is required to preform the maintanence on their own equipment.
they only have their self to blame for the problem that they ran into.

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 09:15 AM

I'm glad Bush won too, don't get me wrong. But that doesn't mean you're not affected.

-K

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 09:20 AM

Originally posted by SpunGirl
I'm glad Bush won too, don't get me wrong. But that doesn't mean you're not affected.

-K

But in reality.. it doesn't matter who is in the White House.. the effect on the typical American will be minimal. This isn't a Dictatorship.. it's a Democracy where we have checks and balances. It's our entire Government that makes and decides policy for the country.. not just one man.

Hulkein

11-03-2004, 09:24 AM

<<t's also really odd that the exit polls were so wrong. It's fishy.>>

Not really. Exit polls aren't very accurate.

<<I had hoped that there would be a decisive victory in one way or another so that we would not be thrust into the scrutiny of the world.>>

A 4 million popular vote victory and 120k or so lead in Ohio is pretty decisive.

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 09:27 AM

Originally posted by Hulkein
<<I had hoped that there would be a decisive victory in one way or another so that we would not be thrust into the scrutiny of the world.>>

A 4 million popular vote victory and 120k or so lead in Ohio is pretty decisive.

Also, I would personally be proud to be part of such a deciding state, to have cast my vote in the area where it comes down to the nitty-gritty. But I guess when you're losing you'll wail over anything.

-K

DeV

11-03-2004, 09:27 AM

Originally posted by Parkbandit

Originally posted by SpunGirl
I'm glad Bush won too, don't get me wrong. But that doesn't mean you're not affected.

-K

But in reality.. it doesn't matter who is in the White House.. the effect on the typical American will be minimal. This isn't a Dictatorship.. it's a Democracy where we have checks and balances. It's our entire Government that makes and decides policy for the country.. not just one man. One man with a ton of influence and power to make decisions and recommendations based on what he believes is in the best interest of the country. This election wasn't just to decide a president it also saw a bigger addition of Republican fire power in the congress and the house. The effects are not minimal unless the "typical American" is in the minority and everyone else is the majority.

11-03-2004, 09:27 AM

I am absolutely giddy.

The doom and gloom the liberals here are spewing is just hilarious.

YOU ELECTED BUSH OMG DAVE IS GOING TO DIE BY IEDs.

YOU ELECTED BUSH WE R GOING 2 B POOR W/ NO MEDZ.

YOU ELECTED BUSH THE WELRD WLL H8T US.

Give me a break. All I know, is if Hell freezes over and somehow Bush loses, I really really hope you liberals will be crying that Bush should have won due to the popular vote. So far, one Kerry supporter has done that, and that's the only one I currently have any respect for.

- Arkans

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 09:28 AM

It would be strangely ironic if Bush lost the popular and won the college, actually.

-K

11-03-2004, 09:30 AM

Bush won't be losing the popular vote at the rate it is going. He has over 3 million popular votes for him.

- Arkans

11-03-2004, 09:31 AM

arkans I have to ask, why Stalin?

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 09:31 AM

Er. Excuse me and my lack of sleep.

I meant it would be ironic if he WON popular and LOST the college. Irony, yes.

-K

DeV

11-03-2004, 09:31 AM

He definitely won the popular vote this time around.

11-03-2004, 09:33 AM

Stalin is my avatar simply because I am responding to Chica's avatar (Miss X). We are COMRADES IN THE REVOLUTION!!!111

- Arkans

longshot

11-03-2004, 09:44 AM

Originally posted by Nieninque

Everyone's future depended on it. Even people who dont live in/come from America

This is very true.

It's something that you really can't understand unless you leave the United States, either. We're completely insulated from the rest of the world.

The culture of ignorance that has existed since dubya's presidency makes it clear that not knowing where things are on a map, as well as telling people to fuck off if they don't agree with us are perfectly acceptable.

This ideology has been extended to the homeland in the form overt racism and a Christianization of laws that tramples separation of church and state.

This looks rediculous in the eyes of the rest of the world. Despite the arrogance and ethnocentrism adopted by the current administration, most of the world is not white and not Christian. And even if a country is, religious devotion is removed from
the political process.

This father figure role assumed by Bush through his heavenly mandate allows him to perpetuate this culture of fear. It is this fear that drove every bumpkin out from the swamps of the panhandle to vote.

Voters have surrendered power to a corrupt administration that has endangered America's position in the world. No matter how much we spend here, and no matter how much barbed wire we put around our embassies, we will always be vulnurable outside of the United States. The continental US will be our "green zone", and the cycle of fear will will continue. Expenditures to fund our crusades in the desert will effectively gut the infrastructure of the country.

The Christian Taliban will take hold. "The others", minorities that don't share the same evangelical beliefs, and those with ideals and values perceived different, will provide the fuel to create the legal framework of separation. Rather than try to understand and reconcile differences, new laws will be written to subjugate and drive a wedge between the others that will serve the role of fear fuel.

This is all possible through fear... fear of watching an increase in taxes go to a welfare mom that doesn't deserve it, or some homo that is trying to scam the insurance system and might move next to you.

As the money pit in Iraq will be deferred to future generations, and a growing deficit threatens to destabilize the entire world economy, our enemies wait. They watch us burn the candle from both ends.

It's over now.

It's just hard to believe.

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 09:45 AM

The discussion about the provisional votes is almost laughable. Traditionally, most of them won't even count due to either the person already voting the proper way or that the form was not filled out properly.

Even if every single one of them DID count.. Kerry would have to take about 85% of them in order to squeek out a win. Kerry didn't take any state with that type of result.

Bush won Ohio. Bush won the election. It's a statistical fact.

11-03-2004, 09:45 AM

You've got to be kidding me, right?

- Arkans

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 09:48 AM

Originally posted by Arkans
You've got to be kidding me, right?

- Arkans

The real sad part is.. he actually believes in the garbage he posts.

It's scary.

longshot

11-03-2004, 09:48 AM

Having lived abroad, I can say that.

The rest of the world thinks that we have pretty much gone crazy...

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 09:49 AM

They're welcome to think that. Just don't come crying to the US for military support or famine relief the next time the shit hits the fan.

-K

longshot

11-03-2004, 09:50 AM

Originally posted by Arkans
You've got to be kidding me, right?

- Arkans

Akrans, as the least developed person on these boards, I really don't expect you to understand.

Seriously, you're on like brain-stem level.

I can listen to PB, and I understand he disagrees with me, but you bring dick to the table.

11-03-2004, 09:51 AM

ROFL.

Bitter much, longshot?

It's okay, you can go cry about how the world will fall apart and America will get PWNed by the evil terrorists. Do you want me to warm that bottle of milk for you and fetch you a blanket?

- Arkans

i remember halloween

11-03-2004, 09:52 AM

Originally posted by SpunGirl
They're welcome to think that. Just don't come crying to the US for military support or famine relief the next time the shit hits the fan.

-K

oh they'll come crying no matter how unpopular we become, i promise you that.

Wezas

11-03-2004, 09:56 AM

Well I watched most of the news stations last night. From about 7pm - 11pm.

And then for some reason I crashed. Hard. I don't normally go to sleep until 2am or so - but I think all the pretty colors on the screen screwed with my head.

Bush won the popular vote. It looks like he'll also win the electoral vote. Ohio has a decent margin - and I doubt the provisional ballots are enough for Kerry to win.

That being said - how would the republicans here feel if Kerry wins Ohio, the electoral vote, and the presidency - even though he received millions less popular votes then Bush?

Nieninque

11-03-2004, 09:57 AM

I thought it was well put.

America is seen by people outside the US very differently than it is by the US people.

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 09:58 AM

As I said, Wezas, that would be bitter bitter irony for Bush. I think the Electoral College is bullshit, but it's going to take a lot of people pissed off over it before it changes. I notice no one did much about it last time, maybe I should say pissed of REPUBLICANS.

-K

Nieninque

11-03-2004, 09:59 AM

Originally posted by Arkans
ROFL.

Bitter much, longshot?

It's okay, you can go cry about how the world will fall apart and America will get PWNed by the evil terrorists.
- Arkans

Isnt that what Bush has been saying for the last two years?

longshot

11-03-2004, 10:01 AM

Originally posted by Arkans
ROFL.

Bitter much, longshot?

It's okay, you can go cry about how the world will fall apart and America will get PWNed by the evil terrorists. Do you want me to warm that bottle of milk for you and fetch you a blanket?

- Arkans

I'm not bitter at all.

You missed the point entirely.

It was fear and hatred that made people vote for Bush. That was my point.

I think in time, people will realize that it was a mistake.

Having said that, I think you are one of the least enlightened and poorly educated people that post here.

I pity your ignorance.

Your valiant attempts to talk like a "man's man" who is cooking a deer over a spiket while holding a quarter barrel in his offhand is comical. It's almost like you have something to prove... maybe you think Tayre's hot or something?

This is for another thread though.

In conclusion, people don't realize what was at stake here... not just for the US, but for the entire world. Hence the above rant.

PB can think I'm a fucktard... I'm okay with that.

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 10:16 AM

Originally posted by Wezas
Well I watched most of the news stations last night. From about 7pm - 11pm.

And then for some reason I crashed. Hard. I don't normally go to sleep until 2am or so - but I think all the pretty colors on the screen screwed with my head.

Bush won the popular vote. It looks like he'll also win the electoral vote. Ohio has a decent margin - and I doubt the provisional ballots are enough for Kerry to win.

That being said - how would the republicans here feel if Kerry wins Ohio, the electoral vote, and the presidency - even though he received millions less popular votes then Bush?

I would claim that Kerry stole the election for the next 4 years and that no matter what Kerry did during that 4 years, I would say he is a fuckup.

Oh wait.. I sounded like a Democrat there.. didn't I. :lol:

If Bush won the popular vote and lost the electorial vote.. I would still say we need election reform... including the Electorial College. My stance wouldn't change because of who is in the White House.

11-03-2004, 10:16 AM

longshot, let me be blunt. You're a complete idiot. Your political views are the ones that are backed up by fear and hatred. They are backed up by the highschool mentality of "WHAT WILL OTHERS THINK!?!?!" and *THAT* is a shame.

The very idea that you would even suggest that people voted for Bush due to fear and hatred is insulting in the least. It is a statement made with no base, and frankly, deserves to be brushed off the same way that Michael Moore is.

Your opinion is your opinion, but thank God that you are in the minority, because frankly, we would be completely FUCKED if people held your crazed beliefs here in the United States. America made the right choice and now we can all sit back and see the hatred that is going to just spill over from the left.

- Arkans

PS: I truly pity YOUR ignorance.

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 10:21 AM

Originally posted by longshot
PB can think I'm a fucktard... I'm okay with that.

Actually, I find myself agreeing with you on most things.. politics just isn't one of them. I think you are bitter that your candidate lost and you posted your frustration.

I simply do not see it like that. If Kerry were to win.. hey, so be it. Like I said before, my belief is that life for me would continue as it always has and that the person in the White House has relatively little effect on my life.

11-03-2004, 10:25 AM

Isnt that what Bush has been saying for the last two years?

Depends on you spin it. I really believe that he thinks he is the better man for the job. I happen to agree with the sentiment.

- Arkans

Latrinsorm

11-03-2004, 10:54 AM

Originally posted by longshot
4 more years of a culture of ignorance fueled by fear and hatred.

We can all look forward to our top scientist fleeing to countries where their research is governed by common sense, rather than a 2000 year old religious text.

We can watch the deficit grow by funding the "War on terror", where we pay out the ass for six girls named Shonique and Loquicia to stick their fingers up the ass of every third airline passenger. In the meantime, new 'rab terrorists train in indonesia, the Phillipines and Malaysia for $.20 a day.

We can look forward to contribution and mutual cooperation from our powerful global allies... like Spain... er... Poland... er... Bulgaria.

We can watch people trample laws in the name of Jesus.

The country is now like the Italian restaurant in the movie "Goodfellas". It's going to be busted out by corporate guys in suits, rather than guys named Carbone and Jimmy.

I can't believe the American public is this stupid. It's like everyone in the country has regressed to a neanderthal.

Arkans, you rule now.

Now is the era of ignorance.

Edited to add an "and"...

[Edited on 11-3-2004 by longshot]
Originally posted by Lord Deprav
You are right. I can't believe people are stupid enough to vote for the worst president of all time.
Originally posted by Ilvane
All the bull that Bush pulls is on you idiots who voted for him.
Originally posted by Farquar
If Bush wins, this country's in for a rough ride. In a few years, when all you have on your plate is your/your kid's draft slip, a $7.00 Social Security check, and an $18.00 arthritis pill, you people will finally realize what some of us have been crying about. Wait, I thought the Republicans were the fear-mongerers and character assassins. :?: And where's that Dennis Miller quote about people equating Bush with Hitler?

And for God's sake, longshot, use your brain.
The culture of ignorance that has existed since dubya's presidencyI guess that whole Ugly American thing was just a big myth, huh?

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 11:06 AM

1:00 PM for Kerry's concession speech.

11-03-2004, 11:07 AM

My heart feels like an alligator.

- Arkans

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 11:08 AM

Matt Lauer said it! 1pm EST?

-K

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 11:11 AM

yea.. 1PM eastern.

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 11:12 AM

According to Laurer/Couric, Kerry has in the past few minutes called Bush to concede over the phone.

-K

Chadj

11-03-2004, 11:26 AM

I DEMAND A RECOUNT! OF ALL VOTES! IN EVERY STATE!

:thumbsdown: Fuck. Bush won. Now, I just have to wait for a second american civil war to break out, or wait for the nukes to start landing on my face. Either way, the world just got fucked over :(

11-03-2004, 11:27 AM

Yes, Bush will nuke everyone. First target? Your pot stash, Chadj.

- Arkans

xtc

11-03-2004, 11:27 AM

Originally posted by Chadj
I DEMAND A RECOUNT! OF ALL VOTES! IN EVERY STATE!

:thumbsdown: Fuck. Bush won. Now, I just have to wait for a second american civil war to break out, or wait for the nukes to start landing on my face. Either way, the world just got fucked over :(

Chadj the American people have spoken. Bush won the popular vote and if Kerry has conceded the Electoral College vote.

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 11:29 AM

Sente

11-03-2004, 11:32 AM

We might as well have skipped this election (and the whold campaign) and used the 2000 results.

46 states went the same way as 4 years ago.

Bush lost New Hampshire, which he carried in 2000. He's likely to hold onto Ohio and could take Iowa and New Mexico away from the Dems.

Meos

11-03-2004, 11:35 AM

The "cowboy fuck you" president prevails then. To me it was a big mistake by the democrats to almost completely ignore most the "rural" states that Bush completely dominated. Kerry connected very well with people in hmm... shall I say more cultured regions of the US. Hopefully the democrats think about this a little bit when they choose their candidate in 08.

Bush is still a fuckin moron. The war in Iraq was unjustified. His cabinet is corrupt. He called himself "a war president" I just don't think anyone in this day and age should call themself that unless we're already in world war 3.

Life will go on. I just hope I don't get drafted for that fucker.

11-03-2004, 11:38 AM

Meos, you do realize that the President cannot issue a draft by himself correct?

The House of Representatives sent through the draft bill and it got a whopping two votes. The democrats that sponsored the bill didn't even for it. I wouldn't worry about being drafted.

- Arkans

Latrinsorm

11-03-2004, 11:41 AM

Originally posted by Arkans
The House of Representatives sent through the draft bill and it got a whopping two votes. The democrats that sponsored the bill didn't even for it. I wouldn't worry about being drafted.Do you happen to know which two voted for it?

Meos

11-03-2004, 11:42 AM

Please man, I've lived here my whole life. I know how the system works.

Bush's foreign policy could make it necessary. I didn't say it was inevitable truth. But, the threat remains in my mind.

xtc

11-03-2004, 11:44 AM

Originally posted by Meos
The "cowboy fuck you" president prevails then. To me it was a big mistake by the democrats to almost completely ignore most the "rural" states that Bush completely dominated. Kerry connected very well with people in hmm... shall I say more cultured regions of the US. Hopefully the democrats think about this a little bit when they choose their candidate in 08.

Bush is still a fuckin moron. The war in Iraq was unjustified. His cabinet is corrupt. He called himself "a war president" I just don't think anyone in this day and age should call themself that unless we're already in world war 3.

Life will go on. I just hope I don't get drafted for that fucker.

The draft has only been instituted under a Democratic President.

Jenisi

11-03-2004, 11:52 AM

Not gonna read this entire thread but let's just say it's a sad sad morning...

Meos

11-03-2004, 11:52 AM

Lyndon Johnson, Also a cowboy mother fucker. That's a topic for another thread.

Chadj

11-03-2004, 11:52 AM

Originally posted by Parkbandit

Originally posted by Chadj
I DEMAND A RECOUNT! OF ALL VOTES! IN EVERY STATE!

:thumbsdown: Fuck. Bush won. Now, I just have to wait for a second american civil war to break out, or wait for the nukes to start landing on my face. Either way, the world just got fucked over :(

Smoke another one dumbass.

... I wasn't being serious. O_o

Farquar

11-03-2004, 11:52 AM

I suppose its comforting that "only in America" could a man that had little international political experience, who basically bankrupted every enterprise he touched, who can barely piece together a coherent sentence without a speechwriter, steal the presidency.

A man who then, during said presidency, creates an international quagmire, places the country in the worst economic position in recent history, and who actually believes that cutting taxes during a war is the right thing to do, actually manages to get himself reelected by a pretty healthy margin.

P.S. Thanks Arkans, for teaching me a new argumentative method. Next time I'm in court, ill just use l337 speak to discredit the other lawyer's arguments.

P.P.S. Enjoy community college.

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 11:54 AM

Originally posted by Meos
The "cowboy fuck you" president prevails then. To me it was a big mistake by the democrats to almost completely ignore most the "rural" states that Bush completely dominated. Kerry connected very well with people in hmm... shall I say more cultured regions of the US. Hopefully the democrats think about this a little bit when they choose their candidate in 08.

Bush is still a fuckin moron. The war in Iraq was unjustified. His cabinet is corrupt. He called himself "a war president" I just don't think anyone in this day and age should call themself that unless we're already in world war 3.

Life will go on. I just hope I don't get drafted for that fucker.

It was actually Democrats that proposed the Draft. Please get you facts straight. I won't even go into your other baseless babble as I am basking in victory right now.

I've tried to be gracious this morning, but the whining is making it extremely difficult.

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 11:56 AM

Jenisi

11-03-2004, 11:56 AM

This election was a catastrophic success for Bush.

Chadj

11-03-2004, 11:56 AM

Just for PB..

I

WANT

A FUCKING

RECOUNT.

xtc

11-03-2004, 11:59 AM

Originally posted by Farquar
I suppose its comforting that "only in America" could a man that had little international political experience, who basically bankrupted every enterprise he touched, who can barely piece together a coherent sentence without a speechwriter, steal the presidency.

A man who then, during said presidency, creates an international quagmire, places the country in the worst economic position in recent history, and who actually believes that cutting taxes during a war is the right thing to do, actually manages to get himself reelected by a pretty healthy margin.

P.S. Thanks Arkans, for teaching me a new argumentative method. Next time I'm in court, ill just use l337 speak to discredit the other lawyer's arguments.

P.P.S. Enjoy community college.

Bush won in 2000, period. Saying anything else makes you seem stupid. I can understand how the world may be shocked today to see Bush re-elected.

You may have noticed 3.8 GDP growth in the fourth quarter in the USA.

Unemployment in the USA is around 5.5-5.8 %.

Clinton's budget surplus was on paper only. The tech bubble burst so those projections weren't accurate.

Bush is a dumb ass who has made a ton of misakes. But let's be honest. Voting a Preseident out during a war has never been done in the history of the USA.

Farquar

11-03-2004, 11:59 AM

It's funny PB, that you pro-Bush folk have no replies to claims that Bush is a moron. That's really the best you can do?

CrystalTears

11-03-2004, 12:01 PM

I don't consider someone a bad speaker automatically a moron. I know quite a couple of people who are very intelligent but have a hard time putting their thoughts into words. Just my opinion.

Chadj

11-03-2004, 12:02 PM

There is more than just the bad speaking.

IMHO, Bush is a complete moron. His cabinet isn't, but he is almost most definately stupid as shit.

Meos

11-03-2004, 12:05 PM

Draft, draft, draft... that wasn't even the point of the post just something I wanted to add in the end. With this war in Iraq (there is a war right, I shoudl check my facts) there will always be the fear of a draft in my mind depending what way things turn. Lets not even talk about North Vietnam..

Kurts views = DRAFT LESS LIKELY WITH KERRY AS PRESIDENT

/end draft rant

Facts... facts are too easy to twist or take out of context. I don't wrack my brain pouring over facts, I go with my gut feelings.

Bask in your glory.

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 12:08 PM

Originally posted by Farquar
It's funny PB, that you pro-Bush folk have no replies to claims that Bush is a moron. That's really the best you can do?
Actually Bush scored higher on a military IQ test than Kerry did. I simply do not agree with you that he is a moron and your baseless attacks are tiresome at best.

You can argue that Bush is a horrible orator. You can argue that we should never have gone to war in Iraq. You can argue that Bush wears his Christianity on his sleeve too much. You can argue that Bush won't support gay rights. You can argue that Bush won't support a woman's right to abortion. These can be backed up with actual facts.

But when you spew stupidity on a message board saying "BUSH STOLE THE 2000 ELECTION!" "BUSH PLACED THIS COUNTRY IN THE WORST ECONOMIC POSITION IN RECENT HISTORY" it makes you look like a retard because they are based upon piles of heaping shit you have heard from Michaelmoore.com and moveon.org.

And by the way.. many Presidents are elected to the White House with very little international political experience.. ala Bill Clinton.

Chelle

11-03-2004, 12:08 PM

The people have spoken. I am so glad America made the right choice. We will be going out to dinner to celebrate.

I'd also like to add: :moon2:

That is all.

xtc

11-03-2004, 12:08 PM

Originally posted by Meos
Draft, draft, draft... that wasn't even the point of the post just something I wanted to add in the end. With this war in Iraq (there is a war right, I shoudl check my facts) there will always be the fear of a draft in my mind depending what way things turn. Lets not even talk about North Vietnam..

Kurts views = DRAFT LESS LIKELY WITH KERRY AS PRESIDENT

/end draft rant

Facts... facts are too easy to twist or take out of context. I don't wrack my brain pouring over facts, I go with my gut feelings.

Bask in your glory.

Personally I go with hard and fast facts. If you had quoted the difficulty army recruiting stations are having I would have been more inclined to listen you. Or if you had discussed how thinly spread the troops are fighting in Iraq and Afghanistan.

I think the draft would have been just as possible with Kerry at the helm. If he had won he would still have had the war in Iraq to deal with. A war I personally oppose.

Farquar

11-03-2004, 12:09 PM

Originally posted by xtc
Bush won in 2000, period. Saying anything else makes you seem stupid. I can understand how the world may be shocked today to see Bush re-elected.

You may have noticed 3.8 GDP growth in the fourth quarter in the USA.

Unemployment in the USA is around 5.5-5.8 %.

Clinton's budget surplus was on paper only. The tech bubble burst so those projections weren't accurate.

Bush is a dumb ass who has made a ton of misakes. But let's be honest. Voting a Preseident out during a war has never been done in the history of the USA.

The 2000 election is always debatable, at least for anyone with half a brain that would recognize that thousands of African-Americans in Florida did not, in fact, intend to vote Buchanan in 2000.

3.8 GDP growth...how much of this was due to the defense industry?

The unemployment rate doesn't count people who aren't looking for jobs or have been out of work for a certain period of time. (1-2 years?)The rate is BS.

A little on-paper budget surplus is a hell of a lot better than a MASSIVE on-paper deficit.

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 12:10 PM

Originally posted by Meos
Bask in your glory.

I will. Thanks.

Chadj

11-03-2004, 12:12 PM

Originally posted by Parkbandit
I like penises. The key to a happy day is having many penises in it.

...

(above may or may not have actually been stated by PB)

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 12:12 PM

Originally posted by Parkbandit

Originally posted by Farquar
It's funny PB, that you pro-Bush folk have no replies to claims that Bush is a moron. That's really the best you can do?

Actually Bush scored higher on a military IQ test than Kerry did.

It's funny, Farquar, how you have no reply to the fact that Kerry is clearly more moronic.

-K

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 12:13 PM

Originally posted by Chadj

Originally posted by Parkbandit
I have a huge penis.

...

(above may or may not have actually been stated by PB)

While it is true.. I've never stated it.

Chadj

11-03-2004, 12:14 PM

I have an IQ of borderline genius level, but I am failing courses and fucking up in school.

Intelligence is MUCH more than IQ.

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 12:14 PM

Originally posted by SpunGirl

Originally posted by Parkbandit

Originally posted by Farquar
It's funny PB, that you pro-Bush folk have no replies to claims that Bush is a moron. That's really the best you can do?

Actually Bush scored higher on a military IQ test than Kerry did.

It's funny, Farquar, how you have no reply to the fact that Kerry is clearly more moronic.

-K

Now now.. I was just posting that to counter his stupid claim. I don't endorse an IQ test as the true determining factor of one's intelligence.

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 12:16 PM

Originally posted by Chadj
I have an IQ of borderline genius level, but I am failing courses and fucking up in school.

Intelligence is MUCH more than IQ.

THIS IS YOUR BRAIN ON DRUGS.

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 12:16 PM

Of course, PB, any more than Bush's skills as an orator are a determining factor of one's intelligence.

-K

Farquar

11-03-2004, 12:17 PM

It's funny, Farquar, how you have no reply to the fact that Kerry is clearly more moronic.

-K

He did have a reply, he said he was drunk or had a hangover. I believe it. I took the SAT the day after a party, and arriving at the test center 20 minutes late with a hangover scored a 13 something. I took the test again clean a couple of months later with no additional prep, and scored considerably higher.

xtc

11-03-2004, 12:17 PM

Originally posted by Farquar

The 2000 election is always debatable, at least for anyone with half a brain that would recognize that thousands of African-Americans in Florida did not, in fact, intend to vote Buchanan in 2000.

3.8 GDP growth...how much of this was due to the defense industry?

The unemployment rate doesn't count people who aren't looking for jobs or have been out of work for a certain period of time. (1-2 years?)The rate is BS.

A little on-paper budget surplus is a hell of a lot better than a MASSIVE on-paper deficit.

The fact remains that Bush won the 2000 election legally. In every election people spoil ballots and vote incorrectly. You can't divine voter intent, you must go by what is on the voting card. If there was any doubt of the intent of the people in Florida I would this election has cleared that up.

After 9-11 security became a major issue in the US. As such security has become a money making industry. That said war is fought differently then it use to as such war isn't the economic boom it use to be. I think many sectors of the US economy are doing well.

The unemployment is always a key economic indicator. Again saying it isn't shows your ignorance.

There is alot about Bush I don't like but let's not spew propaganda.

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 12:17 PM

Originally posted by SpunGirl
Of course, PB, any more than Bush's skills as an orator are a determining factor of one's intelligence.

-K

Even more so darlin'.

:)

Chadj

11-03-2004, 12:18 PM

hahahhaha, thats mad funny <3.

I stopped smoking Ganja though. It's actually because of me missing a lot of school due to football and other stuff. :thumbsdown:

But if I recall, you've smoked some of the herb yourself in your time, PB... :smug:

Originally posted by Parkbandit
Not only do I LOOOOVE penis, I love it when men go down on me while I smoke a lil' bit o' teh mary jane from a pipe

(above quote is purely fictional. Durr)

[Edited on 11-3-2004 by Chadj]

xtc

11-03-2004, 12:19 PM

Originally posted by Parkbandit

Originally posted by Chadj
I have an IQ of borderline genius level, but I am failing courses and fucking up in school.

Intelligence is MUCH more than IQ.

THIS IS YOUR BRAIN ON DRUGS.

Chadj your IQ is bordeline genius? I remember Jessica Simpsons mother claiming her daughters IQ was 160. That would be the same as Bill Gates.

What method of IQ testing did you employ?

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 12:21 PM

Originally posted by Farquar

It's funny, Farquar, how you have no reply to the fact that Kerry is clearly more moronic.

-K

He did have a reply, he said he was drunk or had a hangover. I believe it. I took the SAT the day after a party, and arriving at the test center 20 minutes late with a hangover scored a 13 something. I took the test again clean a couple of months later with no additional prep, and scored considerably higher.

Wow, going into an important test drunk or hungover. Now THAT'S some genius-level thinking. Moron.

-K

Chelle

11-03-2004, 12:21 PM

Originally posted by Farquar
It's funny PB, that you pro-Bush folk have no replies to claims that Bush is a moron. That's really the best you can do?

Soo tell me, (out of morbid curiosity) what does it say about Kerry, to get beat by a "moron"? The "moron" won twice, maybe he isn't what you think he is. Because he's obviously doing something right.

Chadj

11-03-2004, 12:21 PM

Several online, and one at the University of Waterloo. All said I was borderline genius (except one online one that said I was genius.. I dismissed that one). Although they all have different ways of scoring and testing and levels and stupid bullshit, I believe I scored high 130's on average. It's been a while though.

[Edited on 11-3-2004 by Chadj]

pennywise

11-03-2004, 12:22 PM

Just as a by the way, the almost even split in America between Bush and Kerry (I say bush and kerry instead of Dem and Rep, because its silly to assume) is quite amazing. Not just in the industrial (including the not so industrial Pacific) verse rural split, but also in the states themselves. There were very small margins in many states. California, Tennessee, Maine, Minnesota, etc, were all less than a 60-40 margin one way or the other. Its actually kind of neat, to be less than academic about it. One can only wonder what would happen if in 2008 one of the parties ran a moderate.

pennywise the worried, still scary, clown

Ps. Meos, saying something like ""Kerry connected very well with people in hmm... shall I say more cultured regions of the US" is an amazing ignorant statement. That no one else called you on this is baffling.

Farquar

11-03-2004, 12:23 PM

Originally posted by xtc
The unemployment is always a key economic indicator. Again saying it isn't shows your ignorance.

I didn't say it wasn't a key economic indicator. I said BS in the sense that it doesn't capture the actual state of unemployment in the country, especially among the poorest and disenfranchised. It might very well predict wide economic trends. Then again, so can football scores and groundhogs.

Farquar

11-03-2004, 12:25 PM

Originally posted by SpunGirl

Originally posted by Farquar

It's funny, Farquar, how you have no reply to the fact that Kerry is clearly more moronic.

-K

He did have a reply, he said he was drunk or had a hangover. I believe it. I took the SAT the day after a party, and arriving at the test center 20 minutes late with a hangover scored a 13 something. I took the test again clean a couple of months later with no additional prep, and scored considerably higher.

Wow, going into an important test drunk or hungover. Now THAT'S some genius-level thinking. Moron.

-K

I blame youthful indiscretion, something Bush can't claim. Btw, 1300 is the 90% percentile and I scored above that the first time.

Latrinsorm

11-03-2004, 12:26 PM

Originally posted by Farquar
at least for anyone with half a brain that would recognize that thousands of African-Americans in Florida did not, in fact, intend to vote Buchanan in 2000.You're right, of course. It's obvious they wanted to vote for Bush. But no use crying over spilt milk, mama always told me.

xtc

11-03-2004, 12:27 PM

Originally posted by Chadj
Several online, and one at the University of Waterloo. All said I was borderline genius (except one online one that said I was genius.. I dismissed that one). Although they all have different ways of scoring and testing and levels and stupid bullshit, I believe I scored high 130's on average. It's been a while though.

[Edited on 11-3-2004 by Chadj]

Chadj if your scored high 130's you're very smart but not borderline genius. Remember the world is filled with vagrant intellectuals. Quit the dope and start working in school.

I am editing as I may have been incorrect. Chadj if you took the Stanford-Binet test and scored high 130's you may be close to genius.

[Edited on 11-3-2004 by xtc]

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 12:27 PM

And what can Kerry claim? Your scores are really irrelevant to this discussion.

-K

Farquar

11-03-2004, 12:31 PM

Originally posted by SpunGirl
And what can Kerry claim? Your scores are really irrelevant to this discussion.

-K

The same thing, youthful indiscretion. Its a military intelligence test...come on. It's like those standardized tests you take in elementary school. Sure you take em, sure you try, but nobody really cares how you do.

Sorry about posting my score, I didn't mean to antagonize you. I'm sure you did fine on the SAT.

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 12:33 PM

Actually, I didn't take the SAT. I only took the ACTs, and I did awesome. Having already graduated from college and left that behind me, though, I no longer feel the need to parade my score around and use it in arguments about someone else's intelligence.

Hitler was a brilliant orator, and I'm going to have to say he was a huge moron. Good orator or bad, it doesn't mean someone is intelligent or not. You calling him a moron and demanding that your name-calling be addressed is simply another whiny, petulant song in the long list of them I've been reading today.

-K

Farquar

11-03-2004, 12:39 PM

I don't think Hitler was a moron. Dictators generally aren't stupid people. In fact, I think he was pretty smart to be able to maniupulate an entire nation. You call him stupid because you intertwine morality with intelligence, another exmple of erronous bible-belt thinking.

xtc

11-03-2004, 12:41 PM

Originally posted by SpunGirl
Actually, I didn't take the SAT. I only took the ACTs, and I did awesome. Having already graduated from college and left that behind me, though, I no longer feel the need to parade my score around and use it in arguments about someone else's intelligence.

Hitler was a brilliant orator, and I'm going to have to say he was a huge moron. Good orator or bad, it doesn't mean someone is intelligent or not. You calling him a moron and demanding that your name-calling be addressed is simply another whiny, petulant song in the long list of them I've been reading today.

-K

I found this online regarding Hitler's IQ. Hitler may have been mad but I have never thought him stupid.

Now take the source for what you will, it doesn't seem very credible though.

"Although Hitler's IQ was never officially measured, doctors estimated it at around 145."

http://www.americannewsreel.com/archives/2004/09/george_w_bush_i.html

[Edited on 11-3-2004 by xtc]

DeV

11-03-2004, 12:43 PM

Bush is far from a moron as that would mean he has the mental intelligence/capacity of an 8 year old child or worse. The man may not be the brightest crayon in the box but he certainly knows how to win an election and his ability to lead the masses surpases that of his inability to speak publicly without making obvious and embarassing blunders. To say he is a moron or stupid is to underestimate him and the political power he has amassed.

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 12:44 PM

:lol: :lol: :lol:

Post here a little longer, Farquar, before you start lumping me in with the bible thumpers. I got rid of my bible when I was fifteen and I've never looked back.

Hitler was stupid because he had the unfortunate personality flaw of being a racist. It wasn't all his influence, either. The Germans were looking for a scapegoat after WWI, and Hitler provided them with one. It's not like he waltzed into a dandy situation and just turned the whole ship around.

The bottom line is that if Bush was really the moron you claim he is, he would have been hard pressed to be elected anywhere, much less to the presidency. Again, your name-calling does nothing to prove your point. Argue about an issue, please, and maybe you can get away from repeating "moron, moron, moron."

-K

Chadj

11-03-2004, 12:44 PM

Hitler was intelligent. As were his advisors. He fought a war against the world (Minus the USA untill 1942 or whenever they came in. I can't remember, and won't be bothered to check) and held out for years.. A stupid person can't necessarily do that.
He was also very persuasive.

But he was a sick and twisted, fucked up person.

Sort of like Bush!

And if anyone takes me seriously on that last comment, please stfu.

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 12:46 PM

Originally posted by Farquar

Originally posted by SpunGirl
And what can Kerry claim? Your scores are really irrelevant to this discussion.

-K

The same thing, youthful indiscretion. Its a military intelligence test...come on. It's like those standardized tests you take in elementary school. Sure you take em, sure you try, but nobody really cares how you do.

Sorry about posting my score, I didn't mean to antagonize you. I'm sure you did fine on the SAT.

Actually.. Kerry's remark was more in jest I believe than his actual recollection of the day and night prior.

Valthissa

11-03-2004, 12:46 PM

some relevant data on Bush/Kerry intelligence

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/10/24/politics/campaign/24points.html

(you may need registration)

and some relevant data on intelligence in general

http://www.psych.utoronto.ca/~reingold/courses/intelligence/cache/1198gottfred.html

just in case anyone is looking for actual information.

C/Valth

DeV

11-03-2004, 12:47 PM

Hitler was very far from stupid. The man was highly intelligent yet mentally unstable which people choose to overlook.

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 12:48 PM

Originally posted by Farquar
I don't think Hitler was a moron. Dictators generally aren't stupid people. In fact, I think he was pretty smart to be able to maniupulate an entire nation. You call him stupid because you intertwine morality with intelligence, another exmple of erronous bible-belt thinking.

There are many examples of how Hitler was a moron. Just take the opening of 2 fronts with USSR as one such example. That's not bible-belt thinking.. that's Proper War Campaigning 101.

Farquar

11-03-2004, 12:49 PM

You assume that because Bush wouldn't have been elected if he weren't smart. I invite you, just for a moment, to abandon all your instincts and just think for a second.

Powerful people, his friends included, want him in power. Imagine that you are one of these powerful Bush friends, a powerful business owner with a clear agenda. Would you want someone in power that was intelligent, opinionated, and articulate? Or would you want someone with a lightweight intellect, malleable will, and agreeable disposition? What situation would make it easier for you to get your agenda accomplished?

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 12:50 PM

Thanks, Valthissa! I read the first article and am going to look over the second.

-K

Edaarin

11-03-2004, 12:51 PM

Originally posted by Chadj
I have an IQ of borderline genius level, but I am failing courses and fucking up in school.

Why do I find the IQ part hard to believe?

Online IQ tests are complete horse shit. Real IQ tests are scored independent of age as well, which leads me to believe that you're full of shit on that. Mental age and IQ are completely different things.

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 12:52 PM

Originally posted by Farquar
Powerful people, his friends included, want him in power. Imagine that you are one of these powerful Bush friends, a powerful business owner with a clear agenda. Would you want someone in power that was intelligent, opinionated, and articulate? Or would you want someone with a lightweight intellect, malleable will, and agreeable disposition? What situation would make it easier for you to get your agenda accomplished?

Ah, conspiracy theories rear their laughable heads! I would pick secret option C, wanting someone in power who agreed with my ideals, or even better, MYSELF in power. Putting up someone truly moronic to the scrutiny of the American public wouldn't be a very smart idea now, would it?

Looks like your "moron" passed that scrutiny by a nice, healthy margin. Or are all the people that voted for Bush morons, too?

Once again, your name-calling is baseless. Please discuss an actual issue.

-K

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 12:54 PM

<3 fucking SpunGirl

xtc

11-03-2004, 12:56 PM

Originally posted by Edaarin

Originally posted by Chadj
I have an IQ of borderline genius level, but I am failing courses and fucking up in school.

Why do I find the IQ part hard to believe?

Online IQ tests are complete horse shit. Real IQ tests are scored independent of age as well, which leads me to believe that you're full of shit on that. Mental age and IQ are completely different things.

If he really tested at the University of Waterloo I would accept their score. Waterloo is a first rate school.

Parkbandit

11-03-2004, 12:56 PM

Originally posted by Parkbandit
<3 fucking SpunGirl

Edited to add: That's an adjective there.. not a verb. Don't be a pig.

Hulkein

11-03-2004, 12:58 PM

Originally posted by longshot
This is very true.

It's something that you really can't understand unless you leave the United States, either. We're completely insulated from the rest of the world.

The culture of ignorance that has existed since dubya's presidency makes it clear that not knowing where things are on a map, as well as telling people to fuck off if they don't agree with us are perfectly acceptable.

This ideology has been extended to the homeland in the form overt racism and a Christianization of laws that tramples separation of church and state.

This looks rediculous in the eyes of the rest of the world. Despite the arrogance and ethnocentrism adopted by the current administration, most of the world is not white and not Christian. And even if a country is, religious devotion is removed from
the political process.

This father figure role assumed by Bush through his heavenly mandate allows him to perpetuate this culture of fear. It is this fear that drove every bumpkin out from the swamps of the panhandle to vote.

Voters have surrendered power to a corrupt administration that has endangered America's position in the world. No matter how much we spend here, and no matter how much barbed wire we put around our embassies, we will always be vulnurable outside of the United States. The continental US will be our "green zone", and the cycle of fear will will continue. Expenditures to fund our crusades in the desert will effectively gut the infrastructure of the country.

The Christian Taliban will take hold. "The others", minorities that don't share the same evangelical beliefs, and those with ideals and values perceived different, will provide the fuel to create the legal framework of separation. Rather than try to understand and reconcile differences, new laws will be written to subjugate and drive a wedge between the others that will serve the role of fear fuel.

This is all possible through fear... fear of watching an increase in taxes go to a welfare mom that doesn't deserve it, or some homo that is trying to scam the insurance system and might move next to you.

As the money pit in Iraq will be deferred to future generations, and a growing deficit threatens to destabilize the entire world economy, our enemies wait. They watch us burn the candle from both ends.

It's over now.

It's just hard to believe.

Don't you think you're being over-dramatic?

The world has always disliked us, our country has always been ignorant to foreign things. This isn't something perpetuated by Bush.

It's four more years, this isn't as if Bush has taken a hold on our country for decades to come like Castro.

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 12:58 PM

:heart: you too, PB.

-K

Hulkein

11-03-2004, 01:02 PM

Originally posted by Farquar
P.S. Thanks Arkans, for teaching me a new argumentative method. Next time I'm in court, ill just use l337 speak to discredit the other lawyer's arguments.

... A lawyer voting for.. KERRY AND EDWARDS? Who would've thought?

DeV

11-03-2004, 01:04 PM

Damn, I missed Longshot's post. Nicely said.

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 01:04 PM

Any lawyer should know that calling the opposition names is a bad idea. Instead, rely on facts to discredit the other party. Oops.

-K

Ylena

11-03-2004, 01:09 PM

"Kerry connected very well with people in hmm... shall I say more cultured regions of the US. "

You've got to be kidding me. The elitist crap inherent in that statement is, in large part, why Kerry lost. Trust me, for those of us in the middle, the strident left-wing rhetoric is just as objectionable as the bible thumping on the right. Disagreeing with someone does not mean that I am less cultured. I bet you think Mensa is a great organization, too. I think it's terrific when people can gather together and congratulate themselves because they're smarter than everybody else.

What this election was about, for me, was who was the better of two bad choices. Let's be realistic. Frankly, they both suck. I'm starting to think we could do better by picking the president through lottery.

Who in their right mind would want the job? Anybody truly competent at running large organizations is going to go into the corporate world, where you can make a lot of money and not live in a fishbowl.

Two things were crucial in my decision to vote for Bush.

(1) Teresa Heinz Kerry. Last time I checked, it's not a co-presidency. You want me to vote for her, I'll be happy to - when her name is on the ballot. I had enough of Hillary Rodham Clinton's agenda, and I don't particularly care to see us repeat the mistake. I realize that your spouse is going to influence your opinion, but I draw the line at letting the spouse create policy.

(2) My wallet. Health care is NOT a right. Social security is NOT a right. Being born within the borders makes you a citizen, but it does NOT guarantee that the world owes you a living. TANSTAAFL. For those of you who haven't read Heinlein, "There ain't no such thing as a free lunch." Based on the promises Kerry made during the campaign, there's no way my tax burden would not increase measurably. I already pay a double tithe to the government, and I'm not particularly willing to shoulder any more of the burden. (By the way, I want to thank my fellow Californians who voted for the 3 billion dollar stem cell research initiative. Tell me, where the hell is THAT money coming from?)

Let me be perfectly clear. I don't think Bush is a great president. I would have LOVED to have had an alternative candidate that I could have voted for. Kerry was not the guy.

My biggest wish is that somebody, anybody on the political scene rises up that has some real passion, charisma, and ability to lead. Unfortunately, we've created a climate in which I don't think that can happen anymore.

Elizabeth

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 01:10 PM

I love it when you pop your head in, Liz.

-K

Hulkein

11-03-2004, 01:11 PM

Spun, if I may say, it seems you voted for Bush?

I thought you were definitely going for Kerry.

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 01:13 PM

I was undecided until the minute I walked into the poll, to be honest. I am conservative on many issues. I am liberal on other issues. I voted for Bush for a few reasons, mostly because I decided that the things I fear Bush will do are less realistic possibilities than the things I fear Kerry will do. Lesser of two, and all that.

-K

Farquar

11-03-2004, 01:15 PM

Originally posted by SpunGirl
Ah, conspiracy theories rear their laughable heads! I would pick secret option C, wanting someone in power who agreed with my ideals, or even better, MYSELF in power. Putting up someone truly moronic to the scrutiny of the American public wouldn't be a very smart idea now, would it?

Looks like your "moron" passed that scrutiny by a nice, healthy margin. Or are all the people that voted for Bush morons, too?

Once again, your name-calling is baseless. Please discuss an actual issue.

-K

I just asked you to think, I wasn't calling anyone names. Clearly it will be a long-term for you.

Bush acknowledged that his political base consists, most importantly, of the "haves, and the have mores." His buddies? Ken Lay, formerly of Enron, his pals and connections at Halliburton, various oil magnates whose names I can't recall. Hardly a "conspiracy" in the true sense. Everyone knows about it.

Additionally, people find it hard to be billion-dollar CEO's and president at the same time. Bush already shares many ideals with these people, but they have a cya policy, that just in case their interests change, they know they have a strong sphere of influence with an intellectually weak ruler.

Moron is just a pet name for him, and Bush is definitely not a moron under the American Psychological Association intelligence guidlines. Perhaps I'll go as far as saying he's the least intelligent out of all the 43 presidents in U.S. history. His advisors are capable people, and so is his cabinet. I suspect they play a larger role than anyone knows or cares to admit.

Tsa`ah

11-03-2004, 01:15 PM

4 more years, providing he doesn't alienate a large enough portion of this population and get himself assassinated. History has shown that presidents at war have more attempts on their lives.

4 more years providing he isn't impeached. The current stance on Guantanamo Bay detainees held outside of constitutional reach, and complete disregard for the Geneva Convention may be enough to come round again and bite off an ass cheek or two.

I hope for the sake of this Nation we see some drastic improvements in policy, but in all honesty the track record of Bush is not one indicative of change.

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 01:16 PM

Then your demands that people respond to claims that Bush is a moron were what, exactly? I can go back and find the post if you like.

-K

Edited - found it:

Originally posted by Farquar
It's funny PB, that you pro-Bush folk have no replies to claims that Bush is a moron. That's really the best you can do?

[Edited on 11-3-2004 by SpunGirl]

Atlanteax

11-03-2004, 01:18 PM

Seems Kerry is delaying his Concession speech till 2pm.

CrystalTears

11-03-2004, 01:18 PM

I :heart: Liz!! That was so well said! I so agree! :clap:

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 01:19 PM

Originally posted by Atlanteax
Seems Kerry is delaying his Concession speech till 2pm.

Fucker. I have stuff to do today. Now I'm really glad I didn't vote for him.

-K

xtc

11-03-2004, 01:19 PM

Originally posted by Tsa`ah
4 more years, providing he doesn't alienate a large enough portion of this population and get himself assassinated. History has shown that presidents at war have more attempts on their lives.

4 more years providing he isn't impeached. The current stance on Guantanamo Bay detainees held outside of constitutional reach, and complete disregard for the Geneva Convention may be enough to come round again and bite off an ass cheek or two.

I hope for the sake of this Nation we see some drastic improvements in policy, but in all honesty the track record of Bush is not one indicative of change.

Tsa'ah I agree with you here 100%

xtc

11-03-2004, 01:20 PM

Originally posted by SpunGirl

Originally posted by Atlanteax
Seems Kerry is delaying his Concession speech till 2pm.

Fucker. I have stuff to do today. Now I'm really glad I didn't vote for him.

-K

lol then why do you care about the concession speech?

Farquar

11-03-2004, 01:22 PM

Originally posted by SpunGirl
Then your demands that people respond to claims that Bush is a moron were what, exactly? I can go back and find the post if you like.

-K

I want people to respond to claims that Bush's level of intelligence does not meet the standard that society expects of the leader of the most powerful nation in the history of human existence. Thats what I "meant" by "moron." I'm sure he's incredibly likeable, fun to be around, and an all around nice guy. That's part of the reason he won.

I would, however, rather have an unlikable hawk of a man that was also a cunning genius ruling the country though.

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 01:22 PM

Because I want to see it, I'm still interested. I just don't want to wait around for another forty minutes.

-K

DeV

11-03-2004, 01:22 PM

Originally posted by SpunGirl

Originally posted by Atlanteax
Seems Kerry is delaying his Concession speech till 2pm.

Fucker. I have stuff to do today. Now I'm really glad I didn't vote for him.

-K :wtf: He lost already. What does it matter at what time he gives his speech.

SpunGirl

11-03-2004, 01:26 PM

Originally posted by Farquar

I want people to respond to claims that Bush's level of intelligence does not meet the standard that society expects of the leader of the most powerful nation in the history of human existence. Thats what I "meant" by "moron." I'm sure he's incredibly likeable, fun to be around, and an all around nice guy. That's part of the reason he won.

I would, however, rather have an unlikable hawk of a man that was also a cunning genius ruling the country though.

Seems to me that society (meaning the majority of the voting American public) finds Bush's level of intelligence just dandy. He might not be a supergenius, but neither are most people in America. I'm not sure where you get your info on what people expect, but maybe it's not the same as what YOU expect.

The election results speak for themselves.

Also, an asshole cunning genius? Yes, that's who I want for my leader, someone unapproachable. We have problems with foreign relations now, I'd hate to see what would happen with someone like that representing us.

Your assumption that everyone values sheer intelligence over likeability is just that, an assumption. And you know what people say about that.

-K

Edited to add - as a lawyer, you should know that a little likeability can go a long way. You can have a shrewd asshole genius trying a case, but if that asshole fails to make a connection with the jury, your chances of winning are less. A slightly less genius-like person who is very personable and comes across that way has a much better shot at getting the points they want the jury to remember to sink in. People are people.

[Edited on 11-3-2004 by SpunGirl]

xtc

11-03-2004, 01:29 PM

Originally posted by Farquar

Originally posted by SpunGirl
Then your demands that people respond to claims that Bush is a moron were what, exactly? I can go back and find the post if you like.

-K

I want people to respond to claims that Bush's level of intelligence does not meet the standard that society expects of the leader of the most powerful nation in the history of human existence. Thats what I "meant" by "moron." I'm sure he's incredibly likeable, fun to be around, and an all around nice guy. That's part of the reason he won.

I would, however, rather have an unlikable hawk of a man that was also a cunning genius ruling the country though.

There have been ineffective Presidents who were brilliant look at Jimmy Carter. Based on Bushes SAT score of 1206 his IQ would be 129 which means he is very smart.

Your spin matches Karl Rove's.

longshot

11-03-2004, 01:44 PM

Originally posted by Hulkein

Don't you think you're being over-dramatic?

A little bit. I'll agree the style was a bit over the top, but I still believe that there's a lot wrong.

The world has always disliked us, our country has always been ignorant to foreign things. This isn't something perpetuated by Bush.

It's four more years, this isn't as if Bush has taken a hold on our country for decades to come like Castro.

There has always been ignorance, but Bush has made it acceptable to compromise knowledge, learning and understanding for "moral resolve". This is really disturbing to me.

I understand that countries have disliked the United States for various reasons. I'm not trying to portray that the world was some Utopia before Bush took office. It wasn't.

But, if you are going to have a "war on terror", it has to be a truly international effort.

The financing required for a terror threat, not even an actual operation, but simply a threat costs nearly nothing. Think of how much has been spent in terms of security? It costs like 20 cents a day to live in Southeast Asia and certain parts of the middle east. These people have extra kids so one or two can die for the cause.

We will use an example....Camel Fucker Allah Muhammed. He's a 16 year old, and thus far, his life has consisted of eating food, reading the Koran, and whatever training will lead to his death. Maybe he learns how to pull a rip cord on his bomb vest, or light his shoes on fire. The worth of his life is next to nothing.

This is the enemy.

There's millions of Habib Camel Shit Mackmars all across Southeast Asia, the Middle East, and now in Europe. The ghettos of Germany are filled with poor and uneducated Turks. Already half the prison population of France is Arab.

Rather than deal with population issues that lead to desparate circumstances, under "moral resolve", programs to curb population growth in these countries are slashed. It's a bit hypocritical...

Everything Bush has done in terms of global policy has been shortsighted and half assed. There's just too much at risk for this to continue, in my opinion. That's why I'm pissed.

I've grown up in a Republican household, and I supported Bush in the last election. I never supported Clinton. I supported the war in Iraq in the beginning. I wanted all of Afganistan liquidated after my friend died on 9/11.

It was hatred. It was some Darth Vader shit. "Give in to the Dark Side..."

To have people our age, Hulk, getting their limbs blown off by Ackbar Cum Guzzler Farak? Because of "resolve"? One American is worth 10,000 of them. We are better. We should not be in the mess we are now.

It's just not right. There was too much at risk.

By scaring people that if they vote for Kerry, Bakar Shit Eater Murmar will blow up their family, Bush won.

It was fear and hatred.

(Cheney is the Dark Sith Lord)

xtc

11-03-2004, 01:48 PM

Originally posted by longshot
]

We will use an example....Camel Fucker Allah Muhammed. He's a 16 year old, and thus far, his life has consisted of eating food, reading the Koran, and whatever training will lead to his death. Maybe he learns how to pull a rip cord on his bomb vest, or light his shoes on fire. The worth of his life is next to nothing.

This is the enemy.

There's millions of Habib Camel Shit Mackmars all across Southeast Asia, the Middle East, and now in Europe. The ghettos of Germany are filled with poor and uneducated Turks. Already half the prison population of France is Arab.

I've grown up in a Republican household, and I supported Bush in the last election. I never supported Clinton. I supported the war in Iraq in the beginning. I wanted all of Afganistan liquidated after my friend died on 9/11.

It was hatred. It was some Darth Vader shit. "Give in to the Dark Side..."

To have people our age, Hulk, getting their limbs blown off by Ackbar Cum Guzzler Farak? Because of "resolve"? One American is worth 10,000 of them. We are better. We should not be in the mess we are now.

It's just not right. There was too much at risk.

By scaring people that if they vote for Kerry, Bakar Shit Eater Murmar will blow up their family, Bush won.

It was fear and hatred.

(Cheney is the Dark Sith Lord)

This has to by one of the most ignorant, racist rants I have read here. Shame on you.

[Edited on 11-3-2004 by xtc]

Hulkein

11-03-2004, 01:55 PM

I think it was a pretty good post.

He's not a racist person, don't take what he said like that.

You bring up good points though Longshot, I'll give ya that.

Latrinsorm

11-03-2004, 01:57 PM

Originally posted by Farquar
Bush acknowledged that his political base consists, most importantly, of the "haves, and the have mores." Yep, nothing says "rich folks" more than rural Western America. That huge swath of red isn't running through Connecticut.
Perhaps I'll go as far as saying he's the least intelligent out of all the 43 presidents in U.S. history.He wasn't the guy giving a 3 hour speech in the pouring rain. Nor was he the guy who figured that the Great Depression would work itself out. I could continue, but it's time for class.

DeV

11-03-2004, 01:59 PM

Originally posted by xtc
This has to by one of the most ignorant, racist rants I have read here. Shame on you.
Actually it wasn't ignorant or racist. It is reality and as blatantly true as one could get. This is what we have gotten ourselves involved in. Shame is definitely not on him.

xtc

11-03-2004, 02:05 PM

Camel Fucker Allah Muhammed

There's millions of Habib Camel Shit Mackmars all across Southeast Asia

One American is worth 10,000 of them. We are better.

Those are racist statements.

Farquar

11-03-2004, 02:07 PM

Originally posted by SpunGirl
Your assumption that everyone values sheer intelligence over likeability is just that, an assumption. And you know what people say about that.

-K

I guess I was mistaken. The thing is, I tend to identify with stuffy, elitist, blue-blood Ivy league east coasters. I've been around these people my whole life. Hell, I'm one of them. I've managed to befriend, respect, and have meaningful relationships with generally unlikable doctors, lawyers, businessmen, etc. I figured the American people would get over it, because anything would be better than what we had just gone through in the past four years. Its easy to take stuff like this for granted though.

Edited to add - as a lawyer, you should know that a little likeability can go a long way. You can have a shrewd asshole genius trying a case, but if that asshole fails to make a connection with the jury, your chances of winning are less. A slightly less genius-like person who is very personable and comes across that way has a much better shot at getting the points they want the jury to remember to sink in. People are people.

Actually, I practice the type of law where I sit in a dank pit of an office, buried neck-deep in documents for 12 hours a day. I'm likeable, yeah, but I don't have to be.

Originally posted by xtc
There have been ineffective Presidents who were brilliant look at Jimmy Carter. Based on Bushes SAT score of 1206 his IQ would be 129 which means he is very smart.
Your spin matches Karl Rove's.

I just explained, right in the post you quoted that it wasn't that Bush was smart, but is he smart enough? Moron was a relative term. Read more critically.

Originally posted by Latrinsorm
Yep, nothing says "rich folks" more than rural Western America. That huge swath of red isn't running through Connecticut.

Black gold baby, black gold. Quite convenient for you to fail to mention that.