Critting Formula

[Bigby]

Anyone know the formula to get what type of crit rank wounding? And is it accurate?

[Bobmuhthol]

Raw damage / crit divisor = crit rank

100% accurate.

[Bigby]

Nice, thanks Bobmuhtol.

Two questions, how do I calculate for Raw damage and how do I get crit divisor?

[Bobmuhthol]

Crit divisor depends on the armor: skin/leather/scale/chain/plate is 3/5/7/9/11

Raw damage is (endroll - 100) * damage factor + 0.5, truncated

Note that all of this relies on there not being weighting/padding/redux, as all of those are factored in separately

[Bobmuhthol]

Also note that crit rank is actually randomized, so the real rank you get is anywhere from [(calculated crit rank + 1) / 2, calculated crit rank], truncated

[Bigby]

Is it also true that Claids add on 40 points to the raw damage, but that Crit weighting is randomized so those 40 pts are actually 1 to 40 points?

[Bobmuhthol]

Yes, but only for calculating the crit - you don't actually see those 40 points in the damage done to the target.

[Latrinsorm]

Crit divisors go 5/6/7/9/11.

Weighting randomization is tricky, as I brought up a little in the other thread. Claidhmores are especially tricky because one guy claims to have had data that showed them not randomizing at all, but not even he really believes that. In general, I don't think anyone's ever made a compelling argument between the 1-x and x/2-x camps.

This doesn't make analysis impossible, just something to keep an eye on. :)

[Riltus]

Raw damage / crit divisor = crit rank

100% accurate.

Not quite.

trunc[(Raw Damage + .5)/ Crit Divisor] = Crit Rank



Raw damage is (endroll - 100) * damage factor + 0.5, truncated
or

Raw Damage = round [(endroll - 100) * DF]

E.g., the plate crit divisor is 11. You will get a rank 1 crit with minimum raw damage of 10.5 and a rank 5 crit with minimum raw damage of 54.5.

trunc[(10.4 + .5) / 11] = Rank 0 crit
trunc[(10.5 + .5) / 11] = Rank 1 crit
trunc[(54.5 + .5) / 11] = Rank 5 crit

Although the crit divisors for the different armor groups are 5/6/7/9/11, the RANK 1 crit divisors are:

Skin = 4.5
Leather = 5.5
Scale = 6.5
Chain = 8.5
Plate = 10.5

I know that damage weighting randomizes from 0 to X (where X is maximum weighting) and not 1 to X, but I don't know if the same is true for crit weighting.

A damage weighted weapon with Level 5 weighting will yield random results of 0/1/2/3/4/5.


Riltus

[Celephais]

A damage weighted weapon with Level 5 weighting will yield random results of 0/1/2/3/4/5.

Linear?

[Celephais]

Is it also true that Claids add on 40 points to the raw damage, but that Crit weighting is randomized so those 40 pts are actually 1 to 40 points?

I thought 40 points of crit weighting was actually only a max of 20 points of phantom damage.

Trunc(((SuccessMargin * DF) + (Rnd(1-40) / 2) + 0.5) / CritDivisor) = CritRankMax

or did I get a wrong formula somewhere?

[Bobmuhthol]

I've been told that claidhs are +40 damage as opposed to +40 crit weighting level, and I stopped caring a long time ago so I just believed people when they said it.

[Celephais]

Okay so if claidhs were +40 phantom damage they would be +80 crit weighting level? Do I have that right? So when we talk about Fel-Hafters and their heavy crit weighting of 9-11 they only add up to ~5 phantom damage.

[Bobmuhthol]

Correct.

[Riltus]

Linear?

I can't completely confirm that. I only had 100 - 150 none crit hits, but the results seemed to indicate that the distribution was linear. A confirmation would probably require closer to a thousand samples.


Okay so if claidhs were +40 phantom damage they would be +80 crit weighting level? Do I have that right? So when we talk about Fel-Hafters and their heavy crit weighting of 9-11 they only add up to ~5 phantom damage.

From the weapon guide on the website:

The claidhmore is an especially massive variant of the two-handed sword. It's enormous bulk provides natural critical weighting to the weapon, making the claidhmore the weapon of choice of many warriors

Claidhmores are crit weighted with Level 40 crit weighting not level 80 damage weighting.

Damage weighting is added on after the combat resolution. It does not affect crits and will be a random amount added based on the level of weighting.

Raw damage + crit damage + any additional damage from the weighting (in that order) = Total Damage Points

As others have stated, crit weighting is phantom damage that is added to a hit. Exactly how is still unclear.

This, however, should not be too difficult to determine.

Find a critter and determine its armor type. Second, using the Claid DF vs that armor calculate the endroll necessary to cause a Rank 1 crit. Third, swing at the critter just hard enough to hit it but not hard enough to cause a Rank 1 crit (without the weighting). Now observe if there was any crit from the hit and what rank that crit was. Rinse and repeat 20 - 30 times.

If you do not get any crit, that would strongly indicated that crit weighting will not increase a rank 0 crit to a rank 1 or greater crit.

Repeat this again with endrolls that should cause Rank 1 crits (without weighting) using the crit divisor for the armor group. With a large enough sample you could begin to get a more clear picture of how/how much crit weighting will increase crit ranks.

Even with this data, crit randomization might muck-up any conclusions but you should be able to determine whether or not it is a random amount (0-40) or a fixed amount of phantom damage i.e., 40 or 40/2.

Riltus

[TheEschaton]

and you guys call me a dork for being into Harry Potter. I don't know ANY of this shit.

[Celephais]

Claidhmores are crit weighted with Level 40 crit weighting not level 80 damage weighting.

Completely mis-understood what I was getting at there. If (after randomization) you get 40 points of crit weighting, that's 20 points of phantom damage used for crit rank determination. If you manage to get 40 points of phantom damage (or boosting a rank 1 to rank 9 on skin) then you've got 80 points of crit weighting.

No one said anything about damage weighting. When crit weighting is actually applied in the formula it acts as damage for determining crit. The formulas I have seen show that value (damage added for determining the crit rank purposes but not actually damage done) as half of the points of crit weighting.

So a weapon w/ 40 points of crit weighting can add up to 20 points to the value that's divided by the crit divisor.

[Bobmuhthol]

I think the damage weighting was a typo, his point was claidhs are +40 weighted and not +80 weighted.

[Celephais]

I think the damage weighting was a typo, his point was claidhs are +40 weighted and not +80 weighted.

Ah okay, the change in wording was tough to see as a typo, but re-reading it with "it's possibly a typo" in mind, it makes sense.