The State of Sorcery

[Dighn Darkbeam]

With Gemstone 4 now fully (and in some aspects laughably) upon us I am interested to hear how the sorcerers of Elanthia are faring after the changes.

General - How has your hunting tactics changed in GS4? What is your opinion of the new spells (Eye Spy, Torment, OHC MD, Blood Burst, Scroll Infusion) Have you had any success with wizard wands and/or bolting during your hunts?

OHE/OHB/BRAWLERS - Is the added defense helpful in your current hunting areas? Do you have the necessary points required to train in all the prime sorcery skills? Are you currently .5x or 1x shield trained?

Staff users - Is your defense for your level adequate? Do your added magical skills aid significantly in combat/utility situations to justify the loss of hard DS?

Ranged Weapons - Is your defense adequate? Do you find your weapon to be a useful tool in your current hunting environment? Do you believe your current style of training will be viable throughout your career?

Lores - What is your current lore training? Which lores do you find more useful? Have you trained in Spiritual lores or Elemental lores for the flares?

Any other thoughts concerning the changes or any existing aspects of the profession are also welcome.

Kris na Su'ta

[Trinitis]

Adredrin is a staff user.

As such, his DS ranges between 385 and about 420, depending on how many boxes and how much silver I find during the hunt. I find this to work out fine, as the oldest critter in Stronhold (shamans) have an AS of about 360. Yes, I can be hit in extream chances, but I find I dodge/block the attacks more then I see numbers, and have yet to be actually hit.

As for spells, I was using implode in Stronghold, till I found out DC rips them all a new one. So as of now, I use DC.

In zombies (hunting with Adredrin's love) I enjoy 708'ing their arms, and watching the hands kick the hell outta them, great fun there.

-Adredrin

[Moist Happenings]

Gremblar is a staff user as well.
Around the same DS(Adredrin and I were the same level until last night, I think). Same results as him in Illoke, but when I fall down I still can't get hit unless a mystic or shaman hurls a boulder, in which case my DS is around 320(280 or something if on the ground).

I use DC, Pain inflict(when fighting stone giants or trying to sacrifice), and implosion works well too. But DC is by far the best spell to use, with an occassional disintegrate or pain inflict to finish something off.

[Fraidycat]

I have found my DS drop not too bad . . .
My hunting tactics have had to be changed due to this as open handed / stance off / casting is not too clever anymore.
Shimm will remain using sword an shield for defense becouse he doesnt train in enough Magic to let him use a staff . . no real loss there.
I have found a few critters in his 'able to hunt' list have had thier TD raised , some by 30 points (:( ) but still they are not unbeatable with a quartz orb to hand.
I have not trained in any elemental or spiritual lores yet as I have no idea what they do fer me.
I'm gonna have to rely on this thread to maybe show me a good path to take but till then all my TP's go on my CS.

Shimm

[GSLeloo]

My DS dropped a lot. Where it was nearly 500, it now barely breaks 300. My spells got better, I have more now and am using a runestaff but the DS issue is ridiculous.

[Moist Happenings]

Your DS dropped a lot because you let someone who doesn't know what he's doing with staves train you. You have no reason to bitch.

Might I add that you also have a 17 second roundtime due to encumbrance. This lowers your DS significantly.

[Edited on 11-24-2003 by Neff]

[StrayRogue]

Neff, you are wrong. Example: Level 40 sorc DS of about 550 in GS3 now has a DS of about 370-400 with sword/shield. Staves provide less DS in total, and I think the difference is even more protracted in the lower to mid levels.

[Moist Happenings]

If she can barely break 300, something is wrong. The reason people think that stave DS is SO much lower than sword/shield DS is because they aren't training correctly. At cap, I will be 15 DS lower than a 1x/.5x sword/shield user because I trained correctly.

If she trained for DS then she would be able to get to nearly 360 DS in defensive.

[StrayRogue]

As I said, at the cap. The gap is bigger. And that all depends on if they are training souly .5x shields which I know alot of pures are NOT doing. I for one am not doing. Staves provide less DS. Period.

[Skirmisher]

Yah Stay, I have not done extensive testing or anything, but my sorc is about 30 trainings or so and has approx the same, maybe a little less but not much, def with a staff that she did with sword and shield. That plus she seems to do better with spells now than she did.

I'm not a big Simu cheerleader or anything but overall I am finding a heck of alot less to be upset about and more to like than I was anticipating.

[Fraidycat]

you would go nuts at my training plan .. .
I don't have any proof that I'm a sorcerer anymore.
I only use MD, DC and sometimes PI to hunt.
I use a sword and shield so you wouldnt know it to look at Shimm either . .
His DS is good as it can be at his age and his CS is the same . . .
Just thinking that it seems crazy to miss out on all the things i made Shimm a sorcerer for when really he is only a warrior that casts instead of swings and gives himself guards to remain warriorlike . .pant pant pant

Shimm

[Fraidycat]

To put it a simpler way . . .
I have to ferget training in ANY lores . . elemental , spiritual . . demonic . . necro ect. .
Forget training in scroll , MIU , Runes ect. .
Just so I can make the DS and CS he needs to survive
Begin flaming my obsessive, compulsive training regime now . . .

Shimm

[StrayRogue]

How much CM and Dodge you got?

[GSLeloo]

I was trained very well and my encumberance isn't that bad. He asked me what I wanted to have and I told him and he did it for me. My friend who is also a sorcerer who was trained by herself or someone else also said she has a horrible defense (she's a sorcerer also using a runestave) so it's not just me.

[Xcalibur]

A cute and intelligent woman such as her can't be wrong, it's against the law of nature.

(can someone tell me, if the staff protect against bolt?)

[Fraidycat]

CM and dodge . . hahah

[StrayRogue]

Then you aren't training for max DS then.

[Fraidycat]

Oh nice . . . then you expect me to further reduce any chance of raising my CS by training in something that would execute my TP's?
I understand that you mean I can raise my defenses further but that is unrealistic . . .
I don't ACTUALLY want to be a warrior or rogue.

Shimm

[Fraidycat]

Here comes the part where you make me eat my words . .

[StrayRogue]

Ah right. I thought you were going for max DS no-matter-what style. Dodge is a little far, however CM is perfectly doable, or atleast the ranks to get the specific Maneuver DS skills. If you want max DS/CS, simple: Triple Spells.

[Moist Happenings]

Yeah. Triple spells as much as you can. Maintain 11x magic ranks, and triple spells

Single your sorcerer list, overtrain MnE first, then spirit. At level 63 I have the following:

Sorcerer 64
MnE 74
Spirit 30

My DS is well above what I need it to be. And the spirit spells, last I checked, aren't capped as far as max defense. I'm finished with MnE spells as of this level, so from now on i'm pumping every little extra bit I get into spirit. Your DS will be fine if you do that.

[Fraidycat]

Thanks . .. I didnt know that
Will do fellas . . .
Thankyou verymuch fer pointing out a way I hadnt had the brains to see . . (chuckles)

Shimm

[StrayRogue]

Remember sorcery ranks give you extra DS through Cloak of Shadows.

[Dighn Darkbeam]

Remember sorcery ranks give you extra DS through Cloak of Shadows. >>>

Also know that overtraining in the sorcerer circle will not give you added DS from 712. The spells benefit is maxed when Spell Ranks = Level. Always stay current, but dont overtrain in the Sorc circle for DS.

[Moist Happenings]

Yeah. always 1x your sorcerer list

I've found the best way to get DS all around, plus some extra CS is to get 430, then 130, then leave spirit at 130 until MnE is at 474, then pump everything left into spirit because 102 is uncapped.