View Full Version : 15 British Soldiers Seized By Iranians
Methais
03-23-2007, 04:46 PM
And it wasn't posted here within 5 minutes after the story broke. You guys are slacking.
http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1602389,00.html?cnn=yes
Miss X
03-23-2007, 04:51 PM
Yeah, I was just about to post the link to the BBC story. It's all over the news here as you can imagine. (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6484279.stm)
Coley and I were just chatting about it, I would guess they will return them unharmed, but relations with Iran are strained already, so this will really stick the knife in.
Nieninque
03-23-2007, 04:54 PM
They've done this before, not so long ago.
Methais
03-23-2007, 04:58 PM
In a galaxy not so far, far away....
First off, How the FUCK do you let yourself and 15 of your comrades get captured. Fight to the fucking death.
Secondly, its time to start killing Persians, and a lot of them.
crazymage
03-23-2007, 05:12 PM
First off, How the FUCK do you let yourself and 15 of your comrades get captured. Fight to the fucking death.
Secondly, its time to start killing Persians, and a lot of them.
Because they're smarter than you and they know they'll be released?
Nieninque
03-23-2007, 05:14 PM
Because they're smarter than you and they know they'll be released?
DONT QUESTION DAVE'S MILITARY KNOWLEDGE!
HE IS IN IRAQ YOU KNOW!!?!?!?!
Miss X
03-23-2007, 05:20 PM
First off, How the FUCK do you let yourself and 15 of your comrades get captured. Fight to the fucking death.
Secondly, its time to start killing Persians, and a lot of them.
I think that might actually have been the dumbest post I've ever read. That's quite an accolade because there's some dumb shit around here. Wow.
Nieninque
03-23-2007, 05:23 PM
First off, How the FUCK do you let yourself and 15 of your comrades get captured. Fight to the fucking death.
Secondly, its time to start killing Persians, and a lot of them.
One day, I hope quite strongly that you find yourself in the situation those Marines found themselves in.
I hope you put your money where your mouth is and fight to the death, sparing the world of any more of your fucking stupidity.
Just saying.
Because they're smarter than you and they know they'll be released?
Sorry, after having to deal with the after effects of the kidnappings of U.S. Soldiers first hand, I would much rather die than be captured. I don't care who you are, if you're not an ally the only way your getting near me in a situation like that is if im knocked out or dead.
Miss X
03-23-2007, 05:28 PM
Sorry, after having to deal with the after effects of the kidnappings of U.S. Soldiers first hand, I would much rather die than be captured. I don't care who you are, if you're not an ally the only way your getting near me in a situation like that is if im knocked out or dead.
This just shows what little regard you have for human life. You have to understand, the officer in charge of those men is on a far higher plane of intelligence than you or I, in terms of military strategy. Why fight to the death and risk losing 15 men when you can co-operate and save them?
Sorry, after having to deal with the after effects of the kidnappings of U.S. Soldiers first hand, I would much rather die than be captured. I don't care who you are, if you're not an ally the only way your getting near me in a situation like that is if im knocked out or dead.
Maybe, just maybe you might for the love of God use your brain more than just 1% of the time.
Also, all Persians are likely smarter than you by milestones. :(
One day, I hope quite strongly that you find yourself in the situation those Marines found themselves in.
I hope you put your money where your mouth is and fight to the death, sparing the world of any more of your fucking stupidity.
Just saying.
My dear, you have no fucking clue the situations I have found myself in or dealt with while I have been in Iraq. I assure you, I have put my "money where my mouth is."
Sean of the Thread
03-23-2007, 05:31 PM
BUT THE IRANIANS ARE OUR FRIENDS AND LOVE US!!! roflroflrofolrlfllololz
2) what dave said. 15 US SOLDIERS is a serious force to be reckoned with... WTF WERE THEY THINKING laying down arms. Risk of torture/execution or years of imprisonment would give me plenty of motivation to fight to the last breath.
They are alive though. They weren't US soldiers. And they were actually thinking, thankfully.
roflroflroflrofl?
Yeah, sure.
Methais
03-23-2007, 05:34 PM
BUT THE IRANIANS ARE OUR FRIENDS AND LOVE US!!! roflroflrofolrlfllololz
2) 15 US SOLDIERS is a serious force to be reckoned with...
15 British soldiers though, not so much.
BUT THE IRANIANS ARE OUR FRIENDS AND LOVE US!!! roflroflrofolrlfllololz
2) what dave said. 15 US SOLDIERS is a serious force to be reckoned with... WTF WERE THEY THINKING laying down arms. Risk of torture/execution or years of imprisonment would give me plenty of motivation to fight to the last breath.
Thank god somebody here understands. I just noticed they are all women so their views make a bit more sense, prior to that i could not fathom it.
Sean of the Thread
03-23-2007, 05:40 PM
Thank god somebody here understands. I just noticed they are all women so their views make a bit more sense, prior to that i could not fathom it.
<----USMC veteran.
My decision would have been instantly easy.
Thank god somebody here understands. I just noticed they are all women so their views make a bit more sense, prior to that i could not fathom it.rofl
nvm
Daniel
03-23-2007, 05:41 PM
The difference is that Iran and the UK aren't at war (yet).
No DEV, you have a pussy, You're a woman. You're view of "surrender be a coward, save yourself" is now understandable when I put you being a woman into context.
Nieninque
03-23-2007, 05:42 PM
LOL
Dave you are a moron.
Grats on following your dreams. Respect for walking the walk. Just STFU now because as much as you want to talk, it's just fucking gibberish. You have no clue about anything outside of your own fucked up little world...despite the delusions you have of being privvy to top secret military information.
You dont have some fantastic affinity for military strategies as evidenced by your posts here, you are not Rambo and you are not in Sparta. Thankfully, you just have to do as you are told and dont yet have the role of instructing others what they should be doing.
It will be a sad day for mothers across the United States of America when that day comes.
Knobhead.
The difference is that Iran and the UK aren't at war (yet).
Daniel, we are not at war with iran (yet). Would you have surrendered?
No DEV, you have a pussy, You're a woman. You're view of "surrender be a coward, save yourself" is now understandable when I put you being a woman into context.You have a pussy too, it just happens to have a dickhead on the other end. Your point?
Hulkein
03-23-2007, 05:44 PM
Two women who have never served vs. the opinion of a marine and someone who has been fighting Iraq....
LOL
Dave you are a moron.
Grats on following your dreams. Respect for walking the walk. Just STFU now because as much as you want to talk, it's just fucking gibberish. You have no clue about anything outside of your own fucked up little world...despite the delusions you have of being privvy to top secret military information.
You dont have some fantastic affinity for military strategies as evidenced by your posts here, you are not Rambo and you are not in Sparta. Thankfully, you just have to do as you are told and dont yet have the role of instructing others what they should be doing.
It will be a sad day for mothers across the United States of America when that day comes.
Knobhead.
No dear, ive just dealt with recovering dead americans who were captured in Kabul. As I said, I will be dead before that happens to me.
Sean of the Thread
03-23-2007, 05:44 PM
I'm not gonna lie I'd do what the boss said.. doesn't mean I'd like it.
If there wasn't a "boss" there it would have to the last round.
<----E-4 SL
You have a pussy too, it just happens to have a dickhead on the other end. Your point?
Um, you didnt understand the post. That was pretty much the point.
I'm not gonna lie I'd do what the boss said.. doesn't mean I'd like it.
If there wasn't a "boss" there it would have to the last round.
<----E-4 SL
Sean2 is right on this part.
Two women who have never served vs. the opinion of a marine and someone who has been fighting Iraq....
Dave is insulting other military personnel for following orders in a situation he was NOT involved in in any way, shape, or form. They did as ordered. That's pretty much where I'm coming from, gender aside.
TheEschaton
03-23-2007, 05:49 PM
Too bad being in the military doesn't actually make you smarter, Dave. That was retarded.
It seems the military has done nothing for you but get you ass from weak-willed, self-loathing girls who love men in uniforms and have to pull down their shirts to show off their cleavage to mask their insecurity and hide their inability to think for themselves.
Good for you.
-TheE-
Dave is insulting other military personnel for following orders in a situation he was NOT involved in in any way, shape, or form. They did as ordered. That's pretty much where I'm coming from, gender aside.
Did you even note what ive been saying about their leadership?
Daniel
03-23-2007, 05:52 PM
Daniel, we are not at war with iran (yet). Would you have surrendered?
It's a non issue. I have a job that is distinctly different from theirs. If I were a sailor, on a boat I'd have to take into the account A) The best interests of my country, B) The best interests of my men and C) The reality of the situation.
In this situation, it wouldn't have been in the best interest of either to "fight to the death" and the reality is that I wouldn't expect the Iranian military to do anything that would cause a nuke to come flying up their nose.
In which case, it wouldn't be worth it to risk the interests of my country and my men for personal pride. That's what we mean when we swear to "Selfishless service".
Too bad being in the military doesn't actually make you smarter, Dave. That was retarded.
It seems the military has done nothing for you but get you ass from weak-willed, self-loathing girls who love men in uniforms and have to pull down their shirts to show off their cleavage to mask their insecurity and hide their inability to think for themselves.
Good for you.
-TheE-
TheE, its fine if you want to insult me, You know me "somewhat" from posting on a message board. The other however is not unnecessary and uncalled for IMO.
Miss X
03-23-2007, 05:53 PM
You know nothing about their leadership, besides the fact they have far more experience than you do.
Also The task force's commander, Commodore Nick Lambert, said:
"The 15 people were understood to be safe and had reacted in an "extremely professional way, in line with the rules of engagement".
The rules exist for a reason, your job is to follow them, not make them.
I can’t find the details. Anyone know what kind of boat the Iranians had? If it was larger than a rubber raft I think the brits made the prudent decision.
Hulkein
03-23-2007, 05:55 PM
I'm surprised Iran even has a Navy capable of capturing any British sailors.
Sean of the Thread
03-23-2007, 05:55 PM
It's a non issue. I have a job that is distinctly different from theirs. If I were a sailor, on a boat I'd have to take into the account A) The best interests of my country, B) The best interests of my men and C) The reality of the situation.
In this situation, it wouldn't have been in the best interest of either to "fight to the death" and the reality is that I wouldn't expect the Iranian military to do anything that would cause a nuke to come flying up their nose.
In which case, it wouldn't be worth it to risk the interests of my country and my men for personal pride. That's what we mean when we swear to "Selfishless service".
Bingo.
Hulkein
03-23-2007, 05:56 PM
Dave is insulting other military personnel for following orders in a situation he was NOT involved in in any way, shape, or form. They did as ordered. That's pretty much where I'm coming from, gender aside.
I wasn't agreeing with anyone really (since I don't know the details), just laughing at differences between the two arguing sides.
Sean of the Thread
03-23-2007, 05:56 PM
I will say 15 marines could make a serious fucking mess of them. Like Daniel said.. comes down to what the boss says and thats what goes.
Nieninque
03-23-2007, 05:57 PM
Two women who have never served vs. the opinion of a marine and someone who has been fighting Iraq....
Dave Vs 15 Marines...
It's a non issue. I have a job that is distinctly different from theirs. If I were a sailor, on a boat I'd have to take into the account A) The best interests of my country, B) The best interests of my men and C) The reality of the situation.
In this situation, it wouldn't have been in the best interest of either to "fight to the death" and the reality is that I wouldn't expect the Iranian military to do anything that would cause a nuke to come flying up their nose.
In which case, it wouldn't be worth it to risk the interests of my country and my men for personal pride. That's what we mean when we swear to "Selfishless service".
If we were in a boat on water, there are multiple options aside from surrender. No matter where you are in Iraq you are within a few min of air cover, not to mention reposition yourself into "friendly" water. The moment shots are fired by Iran, what happens? We also don’t nuke countries for the death of 15 people, as is evident by our current relations with Iran, and Iran's actions within Iraq.
I’ve seen what happens up close and personal when Soldiers are captured by "Shi'a" groups and if i can help it wont let that happen to me
Nieninque
03-23-2007, 05:59 PM
Also The task force's commander, Commodore Nick Lambert, said:
"The 15 people were understood to be safe and had reacted in an "extremely professional way, in line with the rules of engagement".
The rules exist for a reason, your job is to follow them, not make them.
Woah...would you look at that!
You mean they cant just go off fighting to the death at some brown people?
Sean of the Thread
03-23-2007, 06:00 PM
Dave Vs 15 Marines...
15 Marines could ruin almost anyones day.
Woah...would you look at that!
You mean they cant just go off fighting to the death at some brown people?
I really hope it pays off for them in the end. and they come back to their families alive and in one piece. My view is still the same.
I can’t find the details. Anyone know what kind of boat the Iranians had? If it was larger than a rubber raft I think the brits made the prudent decision.
Hrmm if the brits were in one they could have easily outran their captors.
Sean of the Thread
03-23-2007, 06:08 PM
I really hope it pays off for them in the end. and they come back to their families alive and in one piece. My view is still the same.
QFT.
Truly that's what it's all about isn't it.
Sean of the Thread
03-23-2007, 06:09 PM
Hrmm if the brits were in one they could have easily outran their captors.
Their snaggle teeth really add to the wind resistance factor doesn't it.
Their snaggle teeth really add to the wind resistance factor doesn't it.
Damnit i didnt take drag into account.. Alas, Dev, MissX, Daniel, Niq, you were all right.
Nieninque
03-23-2007, 06:15 PM
I really hope it pays off for them in the end. and they come back to their families alive and in one piece. My view is still the same.
Actually, Dumbass, your view has changed from:
First off, How the FUCK do you let yourself and 15 of your comrades get captured. Fight to the fucking death.
to various agreements with Daniel and Sean2 about doing as they were told.
Skimming back through, I cant find the exact posts now because you are deleting shit like a mofo, however, your view hasnt been the same for more than three posts.
Sean of the Thread
03-23-2007, 06:18 PM
I was a cocky dumb fucker but I'd still do what the boss said.
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b236/Japgross/OE.jpg
Nieninque
03-23-2007, 06:18 PM
No dear, ive just dealt with recovering dead americans who were captured in Kabul. As I said, I will be dead before that happens to me.
So what you are saying is that the American soldiers who were killed were in some way inferior soldiers to yourself, maybe more stupid, or cowardly even and that they fucked up by getting themselves taken hostage and killed and you would never be so stupid or cowardly to suffer a similar fate?
Actually, Dumbass, your view has changed from:
to various agreements with Daniel and Sean2 about doing as they were told.
Skimming back through, I cant find the exact posts now because you are deleting shit like a mofo, however, your view hasnt been the same for more than three posts.
MOD CHECK!!!
Did i delete any posts?
My view is still the same dear cunt.
HOW THE FUCK DO YOU LET YOURSELF BE CAPTURED, FIGHT TO THE FUCKING DEATH.
However, you have to follow orders, and that is the way it goes. I hope they made the right decision and they all come home to in one piece.
Nieninque
03-23-2007, 06:21 PM
MOD CHECK!!!
Did i delete any posts?
My view is still the same dear cunt.
Same old Dave...Change the posting name, same shit to post.
HOW THE FUCK DO YOU LET YOURSELF BE CAPTURED, FIGHT TO THE FUCKING DEATH.
However, you have to follow orders, and that is the way it goes.
And you can't see the contradiction in there?
I hope they made the right decision and they all come home to in one piece.
Most benevolent of you.
So what you are saying is that the American soldiers who were killed were in some way inferior soldiers to yourself, maybe more stupid, or cowardly even and that they fucked up by getting themselves taken hostage and killed and you would never be so stupid or cowardly to suffer a similar fate?
No, they surrendered, died because of it.
Nieninque
03-23-2007, 06:23 PM
No, they surrendered, died because of it.
So you ARE saying the American soldiers who were killed were in some way inferior soldiers to yourself, maybe more stupid, or cowardly even and that they fucked up by surrendering and being killed?
They were at war, after all...and we arent at war with Iran, but you think the Brit Marines should have fought to the death rather than surrender.
Same old Dave...Change the posting name, same shit to post.
And you can't see the contradiction in there?
Most benevolent of you.
What did i say in said "deleted" post?
Nieninque
03-23-2007, 06:24 PM
What did i say in said "deleted" post?
Sadly, you deleted it before I read it.
Skirmisher
03-23-2007, 06:25 PM
I would hope that those talking smack about these British marines realize that they are also insulting quite a large number of US soldiers throughout history who have also surrendered when faced with overwhelming forces.
The fastest inflatable boat in the world can't outrun cannon or heavy machine gun fire and even a small gunboat would have far more firepower than 15 marines.
Miss X
03-23-2007, 06:26 PM
MOD CHECK!!!
Did i delete any posts?
Yes.
So you ARE saying the American soldiers who were killed were in some way inferior soldiers to yourself, maybe more stupid, or cowardly even and that they fucked up by surrendering and being killed?
They were at war, after all...and we arent at war with Iran, but you think the Brit Marines should have fought to the death rather than surrender.
No, im saying they surrendered, and died for it.
Yes.
Miss X, what post was deleted that is not on the board right now?
Please repost it, Since ill bet it says exactly the same as another post that is up.
Nieninque
03-23-2007, 06:29 PM
Miss X, what post was deleted that is not on the board right now?
Please repost it, Since ill bet it says exactly the same as another post that is up.
What do you think happens to a post that is DELETED?
I would hope that those talking smack about these British marines realize that they are also insulting quite a large number of US soldiers throughout history who have also surrendered when faced with overwhelming forces.
The fastest inflatable boat in the world can't outrun cannon or heavy machine gun fire and even a small gunboat would have far more firepower than 15 marines.
Okay, but it can outrun most "large" vessels. If shots were even fired i would take that into account. No shots were fired.
What do you think happens to a post that is DELETED?
I have no clue im not a mod, nor have i ever been one. Im sure if she can tell that a post was deleted it would be easy enough to tell what said post was.
Nieninque
03-23-2007, 06:35 PM
No, im saying they surrendered, and died for it.
You said
First off, How the FUCK do you let yourself and 15 of your comrades get captured. Fight to the fucking death.
Implying that to have been captured, whether by force or by surrendering, that there was something inherently wrong in the actions that the Marines and anyone else in a similar postion, took.
You implied that what you think should have happened was that they should have instead, engaged with the Iranians, thereby sparing themselves the fate they would face should they have been captured...although you acknowledge that they would have died in the process.
You subsequently imply that you are better than these Marines, or the American soldiers, who deaths you have dealt with, in that you would never have been as stupid or as cowardly to have been in that situation in the first place.
Skirmisher
03-23-2007, 06:36 PM
Okay, but it can outrun most "large" vessels. If shots were even fired i would take that into account. No shots were fired.
Yes, because they used their heads and saw that they were outmatched.
You are supposed to be a professional soldier yet you are talking with your gut here.
These marines were not facing some militia but obviously Iranian regular naval forces.
No one is going to say that that is a time and place calling for some kind of custer's last stand by the sea.
I understand you have seen some horrific things but use your head here.
CrystalTears
03-23-2007, 06:39 PM
This is one of those rare instances where experience doesn't mean you learned from it. At all.
Nieninque
03-23-2007, 06:39 PM
Okay, but it can outrun most "large" vessels. If shots were even fired i would take that into account. No shots were fired.
You dont even know what kind of vessel the Brits were on, let alone the Iranians.
Stop talking out your arse now. We get the message.
They could have tried to displace in the least, I didnt know that no shots were even fired, which makes it more appaling in my book.
As I said. They surrendered, and died for it. I've learned from their mistakes.
Nieninque
03-23-2007, 06:40 PM
This is one of those rare instances where experience doesn't mean you learned from it. At all.
QFT
Nieninque
03-23-2007, 06:40 PM
They could have tried to displace in the least, I didnt know that no shots were even fired, which makes it more appaling in my book.
As I said. They surrendered, and died for it. I've learned from their mistakes.
So you are saying that you wont make the same "mistakes" that they made?
CrystalTears
03-23-2007, 06:41 PM
How the FUCK can you say "I've learned from their mistakes" and "you have to follow orders" in the same breath with a straight face?
Same old Dave. Damn.
[QUOTE=Skirmisher;566572]Yes, because they used their heads and saw that they were outmatched.
You are supposed to be a professional soldier yet you are talking with your gut here.
QUOTE]
You're 100% right, MY gut reaction is to fight to the fucking death, and not get captured.
If I was ordered by my superior to "not" fight to the fucking death I would not have much of a choice.
How the FUCK can you say "I've learned from their mistakes" and "you have to follow orders" in the same breath with a straight face?
Same old Dave. Damn.
They did not follow orders when they surrendered, They did it on their own. Which is why they were thrown in the back of the vehcials and shot.
CrystalTears
03-23-2007, 06:44 PM
We're talking about this story, jarhead.
CT, im not a jarhead. SEAN2 was/is (once one always one) I'm a grunt.
Not to mention... If the story is to be believed these Iranians were in Iraqi waters... Which could be considered an act of war, especially since (according to the news) we have begun to actively target iranians in Iraq.
CrystalTears
03-23-2007, 06:50 PM
Two women who have never served vs. the opinion of a marine and someone who has been fighting Iraq....
You know what, if this were about anyone else serving, I'd agree with you.
However Dave hasn't learned a goddamned thing. He's using his service as a chick magnet and to give him an edge in political/war discussions in order to say "I know what I'm talking about, I'm here." He's there, but not paying attention.
For all we know, they hand him a pamphlet at the beginning of each week to get "caught" up. He reads the headlines then wipes his ass with it.
Nieninque
03-23-2007, 06:53 PM
Not to mention... If the story is to be believed these Iranians were in Iraqi waters... Which could be considered an act of war, especially since (according to the news) we have begun to actively target iranians in Iraq.
Geography Lesson for you:
The Shatt al-Arab (Arabic: شط العرب, "Coast of the Arabs") or the Arvandrud (called اروندرود: arvandrud in Persian) , is a river in Southwest Asia of some 200 km in length, formed by the confluence of the Euphrates and the Tigris in the town of al-Qurnah in the Basra Governorate of southern Iraq. The southern end of the river constitutes the border between Iraq and Iran
Nieninque
03-23-2007, 06:57 PM
(according to the news)
So you are telling me that you get your information from the news, and not from lunching with the Generals?
That's exactly what I am telling you Nien.
Geography Lesson for you:
Um, Your military said this.
"I've got 15 sailors and marines who have been arrested by the Iranians and my immediate concern is their safety," the Cornwall's commander, Commodore Nick Lambert said in an interview aboard his vessel .
"There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that we were in Iraqi waters. Equally the Iranians will claim that they were in Iranian waters. The extent and the definition of territorial waters is very complicated," he added.
So if there is absolutely no doubt that they were in Iraqi waters by those in charge, no matter what the Iranians think, according to the Brits they were there illegally in the first place.
You know what, if this were about anyone else serving, I'd agree with you.
However Dave hasn't learned a goddamned thing. He's using his service as a chick magnet and to give him an edge in political/war discussions in order to say "I know what I'm talking about, I'm here." He's there, but not paying attention.
For all we know, they hand him a pamphlet at the beginning of each week to get "caught" up. He reads the headlines then wipes his ass with it.
That is exactly why I'm in the military CT, how did you figure that out?!.
radamanthys
03-23-2007, 07:05 PM
<tinfoilhat> Maybe they're just playing catalyst :-p</tinfoilhat>
Ok... I get what he's saying. He's seen fellow tortured/captured GIs and helped haul their riddled, flayed carcases away. In his eyes, it seems, it's either a.) kill a bunch of those lowlifes and a likely quicker death or b.)flaying, car batteries to the balls, etc.
I'd probably be inclined to agree. It was an act of war aimed at them... soldiers are killers, and the boss keeps that killing instinct in check. He's the guy that gets to make that decision, because he knows the rules, and is well informed of the area and anything that could happen. Since it had happened before, he was probably briefed about the event and given orders on how to handle it. But, left to soldiers... a group of other soldiers comes up to ya... it's not usually a tea party.
Daniel
03-23-2007, 07:05 PM
You know what, if this were about anyone else serving, I'd agree with you.
However Dave hasn't learned a goddamned thing. He's using his service as a chick magnet and to give him an edge in political/war discussions in order to say "I know what I'm talking about, I'm here." He's there, but not paying attention.
For all we know, they hand him a pamphlet at the beginning of each week to get "caught" up. He reads the headlines then wipes his ass with it.
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
a
You are one dumb mothefucker.
No shit.
CrystalTears
03-23-2007, 07:07 PM
I'm dumb because I think Dave is full of shit? Thanks for sticking up for your fellow military guys, no matter how retarded they come across.
So much for being probably one of the few military people I respected on these boards.
Stanley Burrell
03-23-2007, 07:09 PM
Coming from half the side of my family's personal Argentine experience what with the Faulklands/Malvinas, I will say that the British fleet don't be fuckin' round.
Smuggling happens a lot more than breaching of international boundaries. The Iranian splinter diplomat/militia/naval/whatever pot stirrers don't seem to easily seperate run-of-the-mill crime from war crime.
The fact that this has happened before (and from my point of view, deliberately coincides with some of Tehran's diplomat sabotage facades) makes me a little bit concerned at what levels of Iranian authority these actions are being carried out under -- And that super powers' recon is going to the shitter and/or needs to be revised.
I hope this crap doesn't powder keg. You don't have to excercise a supragovernment naval trickledown border code to understand whether or not you're overstepping an imaginary line whilst smuggling chopshop fodder.
This really trails off into a secular, regional crime vs. world/war crime tangent, but ehhhgfgrthwhatever...
Nieninque
03-23-2007, 07:14 PM
That's exactly what I am telling you Nien.
Good, then STFU coming across like you know anything more than anyone else. Moron.
Um, Your military said this.
"I've got 15 sailors and marines who have been arrested by the Iranians and my immediate concern is their safety," the Cornwall's commander, Commodore Nick Lambert said in an interview aboard his vessel .
"There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that we were in Iraqi waters. Equally the Iranians will claim that they were in Iranian waters. The extent and the definition of territorial waters is very complicated," he added.
So if there is absolutely no doubt that they were in Iraqi waters by those in charge, no matter what the Iranians think, according to the Brits they were there illegally in the first place.
Firstly, Im not saying the Brits were in the wrong dumbass...only that you dont have a clue what you are talking about...although you are showing that better than I can.
Let me refresh your memory: "If the story is to be believed these Iranians were in Iraqi waters... Which could be considered an act of war"
The quote you included in your post did not support your argument in the slightest...only that the British Commodore was sure that they were in Iraqi waters, and that the Iranians would be sure they were in Iranian waters.
The extent and the definition of territorial waters is very complicated," he added.We are still not at war with Iran and as strained as this makes relations between us and them, it still isnt an act of war...yet.
Daniel
03-23-2007, 07:18 PM
I'm dumb ...
Yes. You are dumb as fuck for implying that someone would go fight a war to A) Get ass and B) Win arguments on an online board.
I mean Dave OBVIOUSLY gives so much of a shit about you, "Mrs. CrystalTears" that he would risk life limb and sanity to prove a point.
Hulkein
03-23-2007, 07:24 PM
So you are telling me that you get your information from the news, and not from lunching with the Generals?
The one British guy I saw on the news said they were in Iraqi waters.
I wasn't agreeing with anyone really (since I don't know the details), just laughing at differences between the two arguing sides.Ah, ok cool.
I laugh at gross flagrant stupidity so I guess I can somewhat relate.
CrystalTears
03-23-2007, 07:32 PM
You're a fucking idiot if you think I was stating exactly why he joined. No, I'm saying that being in the military hasn't improved his insight on life one iota. I'm humorously saying that in my opinion, with the way he spouts off shit, that he joined for all the wrong fucking reasons. I was being sarcastic, fuckbag.
Nieninque
03-23-2007, 07:33 PM
The one British guy I saw on the news said they were in Iraqi waters.
I wouldnt dispute it
So Nien, you're saying there was Iranian military in Iraqi waters? I just want to make sure i Understood that.
Daniel
03-23-2007, 07:36 PM
You're a fucking idiot if you think I was stating exactly why he joined. No, I'm saying that being in the military hasn't improved his insight on life one iota. I'm humorously saying that in my opinion, with the way he spouts off shit, that he joined for all the wrong fucking reasons. I was being sarcastic, fuckbag.
Yes...because it's dumb as fuck to be sarcastic about why someone decided to GO TO A WAR. I'd deck you in the fucking face if you ever said shit like that to me in person and gladly go to jail for it.
I mean...I'm really upset I lost your respect. I really am. I'll just go sign up for another tour so I can get it back.
Nieninque
03-23-2007, 07:39 PM
So Nien, you're saying there was Iranian military in Iraqi waters? I just want to make sure i Understood that.
Congratulations on understanding nothing.
I am not in a position to make that judgement. I shall leave that decision to those with the necessary information at their disposal.
CrystalTears
03-23-2007, 07:39 PM
Whatever, Daniel. You win. Dave is a fucking asset to the services. I'm done.
Hulkein
03-23-2007, 07:40 PM
I'd deck you in the fucking face if you ever said shit like that to me in person and gladly go to jail for it.
hahahahahahaa
Daniel
03-23-2007, 07:41 PM
You win.
Yayy!!!!!!
Warriorbird
03-23-2007, 07:49 PM
They're not actually the Iranian Navy but some naval terrorist outfit apparently. Hmm.
All the more reason to surrender to them?
All the more reason to surrender to them?You are still questioning military personnel decisions. Why are you asking laypeople questions that you yourself do not have all the facts enough to answer?
If you would have fought to the death then good for you. Seriously, that's great to know. We are informed.
OHH okay so I’m supposed to shut up when you jump all over me? Sorry hon. I don't work that way, never have, never will.
Where did I ask you to shut up, cupcake? I asked you a question in fact. Answer it and please don't shut the fuck up.
Sweetie I'm going off the information released just as you are, and stated my views on it. When i see more info about it my opinion may change, as it is, I say kill the fucking people who point guns at you and threaten you, dont surrender.
Hulkein
03-23-2007, 08:20 PM
Is this a contest to see who can drop more condescending pet names on the other? Haha
Is this a contest to see who can drop more condescending pet names on the other? HahaYes, yes it is.
Fallen
03-23-2007, 08:33 PM
I should know the answer to this, seeing as how I put in my 4...
But what is the Armed Force's stance on surrendering in a situation like this? By this situation, I mean not actively at war. I have a feeling you aren't supposed to.
Sweetie I'm going off the information released just as you are, and stated my views on it. When i see more info about it my opinion may change, as it is, I say kill the fucking people who point guns at you and threaten you, dont surrender.Ok, sugarplum, and I said that was great to know. I never once asked you to shut up. I said that was good to know and it is. You stated it more than once and I'm not really sure if you were looking for additional agreement than that which you initially received from Sean2 and a few others.
If everyone agreed with you and said yeah they should have let the bastards have it then we'd be having a completely different conversation right now, obviously. Everyone gave an opinion initially in case you'd forgotten. What more do you want at this point when you are just as clued in as everyone else, but still have no problem putting your fellow soldiers down because of their actions as opposed to "how you think you would have handled the situation"?
Oh and I take it we were all supposed to be in complete agreement when you asserted that we should start killing Persians. Yes, lets! You first though.
I do agree that this is getting a bit silly, until more light is shined on the matter I'll reserve any additional opininon I may have about this situation. Of course, I shouldn't have to tell you that it doesn't mean you have to stop sharing yours, but I'll do so just in case you can't figure that out all by yourself. By all means, proceed...
Artha
03-23-2007, 08:48 PM
But what is the Armed Force's stance on surrendering in a situation like this? By this situation, I mean not actively at war. I have a feeling you aren't supposed to.
I read another article that said they followed all the proper protocols and suchlike, so I'm guessing it's ok if the other option is death or possibly WWIII.
People didn’t state that they disagreed snookums, they attacked me personally. Nien, kept questioning me, and i kept responding with what I said in the first place to try to get it in her head, which is why it was restated over and over and over. I hope that addresses your problem with me repeating what i said initially.
Skirmisher
03-23-2007, 09:04 PM
Thats enough of the personal attacks people.
From everybody.
People didn’t state that they disagreed snookums, they attacked me personally. I don't even have a comeback for that one, but like I said before this is getting silly.
Nien, kept questioning me, and i kept responding with what I said in the first place to try to get it in her head, which is why it was restated over and over and over. I hope that addresses your problem with me repeating what i said initially.
It wasn't a problem for me. Basically, I didn't tell or ask you to shut up. I am however asking that you continue working on your reading and comprehension so I don't have to spell that simple bit out for you in a long drawn out back and forth exchange next round. We don't need you to restate the same dumb shit over and over and over. I said, we got it, and we did, we can even quote you if for some strange reason we still didn't get it. Rest assured though, it was gotten.
Let's kill some Persians.
Nieninque
03-23-2007, 09:32 PM
People didn’t state that they disagreed snookums, they attacked me personally. Nien, kept questioning me, and i kept responding with what I said in the first place to try to get it in her head, which is why it was restated over and over and over. I hope that addresses your problem with me repeating what i said initially.
ROFL
You make out you were trying to progress some highly intellectual debate but were being thwarted in your tracks by the hordes of ignorant peasants.
What kind of response did you think you were going to get after basically calling out the Marines for being some kind of fucktards that surrendered, then saying about anyone that disagreed with you :
"I just noticed they are all women so their views make a bit more sense, prior to that i could not fathom it."
..as if gender has anything to do with it.
Okay, but it can outrun most "large" vessels. If shots were even fired i would take that into account. No shots were fired.
Ok Dav, I could not resist...
CUT & RUNZ!!!!!!!!
But seriously. I think you are best off just kissing and making up with all these passionate women.
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