Archery Attack Strength

[CaptContagious]

level 28
Dark Elf
rogue

Current AS is 248 with 4x bow and 5x arrows.
Is this decent? or have a completely botched the training some how?

[Gan]

If you've maxed out on your ranged attack skill then I dont see how you could botch the training aspect. The only other factors overall archery AS are the ET of the arrow, ET of the bow, and any spells/signs that enhance your AS.

You can add 50(?)AS onto that if you use a crossbow from the kneeling position. Just dont expect to live long if you're hunting multiple critters.

I'd say that 248 for a level 28 rogue (less any signs/spells) is a decent AS for archery-bow using.

[Asha]

Double Perception, maybe double ambush or triple if you're desperate for AS.
Double Ranged and you're as good as you're likely to be, going on training I know of.
AS numbers at 28 I can't compare though.
Seems alright.

[Drakam]

not to mention capping your dex. thats the key to Ranged AS

[CaptContagious]

Hmm, its sounds like maybe i am over training then.. here is my rogues info.

critque(sp?) me please?

Race: Dark Elf Profession: Rogue (shown as: Highwayman)
Gender: Male Age: 31 Expr: 931881 Level: 28
Normal (Bonus) ... Enhanced (Bonus)
Strength (STR): 100 (25) ... 100 (25)
Constitution (CON): 64 (2) ... 64 (2)
Dexterity (DEX): 99 (34) ... 99 (34)
Agility (AGI): 100 (30) ... 100 (30)
Discipline (DIS): 74 (2) ... 74 (2)
Aura (AUR): 76 (23) ... 76 (23)
Logic (LOG): 63 (6) ... 63 (6)
Intuition (INT): 64 (12) ... 64 (12)
Wisdom (WIS): 64 (12) ... 64 (12)
Influence (INF): 44 (-8) ... 44 (-8)
Mana: 7 Silver: 369
(at level 28), your current skill bonuses and ranks (including all modifiers) are:
Skill Name | Current Current
| Bonus Ranks
Armor Use..........................| 120 30
Combat Maneuvers...................| 145 45
Ranged Weapons.....................| 160 60
Brawling...........................| 99 23
Ambush.............................| 160 60
Physical Fitness...................| 124 32
Arcane Symbols.....................| 35 7
Disarming Traps....................| 169 69
Picking Locks......................| 169 69
Stalking and Hiding................| 190 90
Perception.........................| 190 90
Climbing...........................| 70 15
Swimming...........................| 70 15
Pickpocketing......................| 160 60

[AestheticDeath]

There are no real problems with your training.

But why are you training in brawling?

- wisdom prolly should been higher too

[Numbers]

Dump your Cman training. It's worthless for an archer.

[Jolena]

Eh..I have CMAN training for my archer and she uses it to gain shadowmastery and other skills.

[AestheticDeath]

No its not.. Specially if you have the spare points.
Rogues get wspec, for 11 AS
surge for lower RT
shadow mastery
combat mobility
feint

Here is my rogue
Merric (at level 26), your current skill bonuses and ranks (including all modifiers) are:
Skill Name | Current Current
| Bonus Ranks
Armor Use..........................| 114 28
Combat Maneuvers...................| 140 40
Ranged Weapons.....................| 156 56
Ambush.............................| 156 56
Physical Fitness...................| 114 28
Dodging............................| 184 84
Arcane Symbols.....................| 50 10
Disarming Traps....................| 150 50
Picking Locks......................| 150 50
Stalking and Hiding................| 156 56
Perception.........................| 156 56
Climbing...........................| 50 10
Swimming...........................| 20 4
cman info
Merric, your Combat Maneuver training is as follows:

Skill name Mnemonic Ranks
Specialization I wspec1 4
Surge of Strength surge 4
50 in pick and disarm will get all his boxs for a long time to come, for what I plan on hunting. And it should make lock mastery easier too, finding the right boxs and stuff

[CaptContagious]

the brawling was for Voln-fu. I get enough points.. I will reset and go back to COL. Or stay in voln and just not use voln-fu. As it currently stands. they are in migration to ZERO, 3 more days on that. As for the CMANS he also is a very decent pick pocket. so Smastery is at 4. Surge is at 4 and I will get wspec ASAP. My biggest question is the lock picking. I do enjoy being a locksmith. But I am wondering if I should lose it and put the points toward dodging, more CMANs and maybe some magic Item use. His DS could be better and I am sure the Dodging ranks will help. But with the Smastery and his maxed perception and ambushing. He can't quite snipe eyes every time but he can snipe a leg and hit the head without a problem.

so heres the question. Locksmith/Archer or Full Archer?

[TheEschaton]

lockpicking as an archer is not that common...at least not for me. The Dodge is much more important IMO. And the CMANs in not that important, I'd focus on the Dodge first since you're 0x in it, which I can't really comprehend. The problem is, if archer's get hit, they're A) more likely to get hit hard, as ranged doesn't count towards redux (though I guess less relevant now that it's based on PT?) B) they're more likely to be unable to fire, as you only need a relatively minor injuries before you can't fire. That's why the dodge is important.

-TheE-

[Drakam]

my archer 1x in CM and love it. he can sweep, and feint most equivalent train critters that are of concern.

[Kenn]

My ranger used to be Voln Fu, and at times I regret switching to CoL. The trade off for me was CM's / brawling. As a sniper I love having shadow mastery, as a ranger I can't feint things my level that easily with only 1x in CM. Running up against things immune to puncture (golems) or hard skin (constructs) give me troubles. I kinda wish I had Voln Fu to deal with them.

Although it can be a little annoying, I haven't run into any huge problems not having a secondary weapon skill. If I run into something I can't kill easily in 1 shot, I just move on. As a rogue, I'd drop the brawling and go 2x CM's for shadow master, weapon spec, surge, etc. You can already learn sweep and cheap shot from the guild.

Here's my archer at 80:
Armor Use..........................| 170 70
Combat Maneuvers...................| 182 82
Ranged Weapons.....................| 271 171
Ambush.............................| 182 82
Physical Fitness...................| 182 82
Dodging............................| 182 82
Magic Item Use.....................| 120 30
Harness Power......................| 182 82
Spiritual Lore - Summoning.........| 78 17
Survival...........................| 182 82
Stalking and Hiding................| 264 164
Perception.........................| 264 164
Climbing...........................| 120 30
Swimming...........................| 120 30
First Aid..........................| 151 51

Skill name Mnemonic Ranks
Shadow Mastery smastery 5
Feint feint 4

Available Combat Maneuver Training Points: 8

[StrayRogue]

lockpicking as an archer is not that common...at least not for me. The Dodge is much more important IMO. And the CMANs in not that important, I'd focus on the Dodge first since you're 0x in it, which I can't really comprehend. The problem is, if archer's get hit, they're A) more likely to get hit hard, as ranged doesn't count towards redux (though I guess less relevant now that it's based on PT?) B) they're more likely to be unable to fire, as you only need a relatively minor injuries before you can't fire. That's why the dodge is important.

-TheE-


Dodge? You don't really need lots of dodge as an archer. Just keep 2xing Ambush and Perc. I 1x dodge and do fine as an archer. I also train in spells (one every 5 levels), and 2.5x in picking/disarming.

To answer the initial question: At 18, my archer's AS is 238. Thats with COL, 4x bow and 4x arrows.

[Goretawn]

Kenn,

What is the summoning for?

[Numbers]

(at level 43), your current skill bonuses and ranks (including all modifiers) are:
Skill Name | Current Current
| Bonus Ranks
Armor Use..........................| 130 35
Ranged Weapons.....................| 188 88
Brawling...........................| 194 94
Ambush.............................| 144 44
Physical Fitness...................| 144 44
Dodging............................| 144 44
Harness Power......................| 144 44
Survival...........................| 144 44
Stalking and Hiding................| 188 88
Perception.........................| 188 88
Climbing...........................| 70 15
Swimming...........................| 66 14
First Aid..........................| 74 16

Spell Lists
Minor Spirit.......................| 4

Spell Lists
Ranger.............................| 40


No cmans, and I do fine. If I was a rogue, it might be different, but I'd most likely be using guild skills to replace cmans were that the case.

No need for smastery, as I just use Camo to pop into hiding for the added sniping AS. If I need to drop a creature to the ground, I use 610. If I need to just lower its DS, I use 607.

With Voln Fu, I can uphunt by a substantial amount. The brawling is 2x; those additional ranks are from the off-the-shelf brawling vambraces from Ebons.

[Vimp]

He's a ranger, boosts many aspects of different spells.

[Goretawn]

He's a ranger, boosts many aspects of different spells.

Didn't see any spell listings. Assumed he was a rogue.

Edited: Should have read it further. He did state he was a Ranger, huh? Doh!

[zhelas]

You don't really need lots of dodge as an archer. Just keep 2xing Ambush and Perc.


Archers can do several things in order to better their Attack Strength (AS). Firstly, training in the Ranged Weapon skill is a necessity. Other Character Manager skills that increase an archer’s strength bonus include Perception and Ambush training beyond the first 40 ranks. Perception’s benefits, however, max out at 200 ranks. The AS bonus is: +1 AS per 2 ranks each of Perception and Ambush over 40. This means that 2 ranks of perception and 2 ranks of ambush would equal +1 AS. Perception benefits cap at level * 2.

The Dexterity stat and certain spells also help with overall strength

Personally I don't see any reason to do more than 2x in perception.

2x Range
2x Ambush
2x Perception
Find a 5x bow and fletch arrows or a 6x bow and eblade your arrows- a cheap 10x weapon.

Voln? Personal choice. Do you want to snipe or fu. My Ranger was an Archer/brawler/voln fu. I ended up using Fu a lot more than archery.
Went to COL and I never looked back.
Cmans for rogues are a hell of a lot better than Rangers and you will need them when you get older.
Rogues can get Surge I think. Will help reduce your RT
Someone mentioned Weapon Specialization for Arrows(Not sure if that works)
Shadow Mastery (if that is the style you are looking for)

[Kenn]

He's a ranger, boosts many aspects of different spells.

Yup. Shooting for 36+ ranks by cap. Mostly I like whispering to people with 605. 36 ranks gives the ability to whisper to anyone anywhere in game. Not to mention my sounds will have a pretty good chance to interupt casters, my WoT will poison more often with Aspect of the Porcupine, my Tangle Weed will poison, and I'll get extra damage cycles from Thorns and Nature's Fury.

[Gan]

As relating to the original question about a rogue archer.

My rogue archer is 84, hunts the aquaducts very easily. And is a 3x picker (because I have a capped Empath who also pulls boxes from OTF) (max lock/trap -1205/-479).

The only magic I wear into the ducts are 400's and 100's up to 107, plus a statue. Surge does not affect my archery AS, and I only have 1 rank in it to help when I need the extra bonus to STR for encumbrance.

My normal AS is ~440's with a 4x longbow and ebladed arrows. As of this morning I'm now maxed in perception, locks/traps, ambush, stalking/hiding, and archery. I'm a little over 1x in dodging, PT, and CM. I also have up to 404 on spells and some additional magical ranks for the ability to wear spells in OTF. And am trained to wear MBP.

I really have no issues with hunting this way as it is very successful. Being an archer and having the perception allows me to fire from the open with as much accuracy as in hiding, and allows the cross benefit of having the additional perception for lockpicking. Plus I like being able to see when folks hide, stalk, or are using the ranger stealth movement.

At post cap I'll probably start adding either magical ranks past 404 or add OHE training as a second form of combat.

[zhelas]

Dodge? You don't really need lots of dodge as an archer.

For a Rogue
1x is good if you snipe. If you are out in the open 2x in dodge. Creatures will find you when you hide the extra dodge will help.

For Rangers
1x Dodge is good enough. Your Mobilies will make your dodge fantastic.

[zhelas]

What is the summoning for?

For Archer Rangers in my personal opinion, Lores are fluff and can be added at cap. Cmans such as sweep and shadow mastery will be more beneficial before cap.

[AestheticDeath]

I am surprised you guys are saying 1x or 2x dodge is enough. I triple and still dont have enough DS unless I want to stance dance or get outside spells.

[zhelas]

I am surprised you guys are saying 1x or 2x dodge is enough. I triple and still dont have enough DS unless I want to stance dance or get outside spells.

True it is easy for Rogues to 3x in dodge.

2x Dodge for Rangers is expensive.

My ranger has to stance dance unless he has outside spells.

[Gan]

I've never had enough DS being a rogue archer period. I dont see anything offsetting that ability if you hunt in an area that limits the protective spells you can wear based on your own innate magical ability.

I offset this with heavier armor. So if I do get hit, which is an inevitability, I can still recover to continue fighting or get to safety.

[zhelas]

I offset this with heavier armor. So if I do get hit, which is an inevitability, I can still recover to continue fighting or get to safety.

Agreed. Archers should have heavier armor in my opinion. At least double chain to protect their arms or some incredibly awesome crit padded brig if metal armors are not your style.

[Kenn]

As a ranger, if I want to utilize my spells, I can really only go up to augmented chain reliably. Rogues should easily get MBP for hunting. I guess I am kinda spoiled, I have my own wizard on a second account. I current rock a DS of around 450 in offensive at level 80. :)

I once toyed around with the idea of making an archer rogue, just because the only spell I really use while hunting is 608. As a rogue, I'd shoot for:

2x ranged
2x CM
2x dodge
1x armor (until MPB is trained off asap)
2 - 3x hiding
2x perception
2x pick pocketing
1x physical fitness (for stamina points)

As far as combat manuvers go... shadow mastery, wspec with arrows, surge for lower sniping roundtime, groin kick (because it's funny as hell) and maybe garrote. As you level, you can work in harness power for mana to use CoL signs, Arcane Symbols, MIU, etc. That's just my opinion.

[zhelas]

<<Kenn's Post :thumbup:

Rangers are the ultimate bounty hunters and mine wears augmented chain so he can cast spells. I have a 27th trained rogue who is sitting on the shelf. I have thought about making him a sniper as well and have a similar plan you just posted. However, I am having too much fun with my War Mage at the moment.

[mgoddess]

lockpicking as an archer is not that common...at least not for me. The Dodge is much more important IMO. And the CMANs in not that important, I'd focus on the Dodge first since you're 0x in it, which I can't really comprehend. The problem is, if archer's get hit, they're A) more likely to get hit hard, as ranged doesn't count towards redux (though I guess less relevant now that it's based on PT?) B) they're more likely to be unable to fire, as you only need a relatively minor injuries before you can't fire. That's why the dodge is important.

For me, Dodging is just as important as CMans are. My rogue 2x's Dodging and is just over 1x in CMans (and I want more).

Ranged does count towards redux, just like every other weapon skill.

As for not being able to fire after injuries, carry around some ephlox, ambrominas, calamia, and cactacae. Easy enough to eat some during a hunt if you get hit. *shrug*

Oh, and here's my rogue...

At 32:
Skill Name | Current Current
| Bonus Ranks
Armor Use..........................| 150 50
Combat Maneuvers...................| 126 33
Ranged Weapons.....................| 166 66
Brawling...........................| 70 15
Ambush.............................| 166 66
Physical Fitness...................| 126 33
Dodging............................| 166 66
Arcane Symbols.....................| 105 25
Harness Power......................| 40 8
Disarming Traps....................| 166 66
Picking Locks......................| 166 66
Stalking and Hiding................| 166 66
Perception.........................| 166 66
Climbing...........................| 90 20
Swimming...........................| 90 20
Trading............................| 70 15

Spell Lists
Minor Elemental....................| 4

Cman Info:
Skill name Mnemonic Ranks
Combat Mobility mobility 1
Surge of Strength surge 5
(Had Multi-Fire, got rid of it for Surge, to snipe with a comp. bow in 3 seconds. Looking to up mobility to 2 ranks, get shadow mastery, cutthroat, and disarm to 5 ranks by cap.)

She's able to pick anything in River's Rest (1-45-ish) & she can uphunt about 5 levels. The brawling is going up to 1x for DS and the brawling bracers sold at EG. She'll also be going up to Aug. Metal Breastplate (MBP + bracers).

[zhelas]

Ranged does count towards redux, just like every other weapon skill.

1x PF for life anything lower will make you want to cry.

[complac3ncy]

You'll find yourself at higher levels hiding less and less. There are quite a few creatures that still point me out, especially in OTF... Even with a few stealth bonuses from colors, sneaking, 2x hide, etc.
I used to have 50 ranks in CM just for smastery. I dumped it, because I wasn't using it enough. To me the biggest advantage was the 1 sec sneak round time, but it really depends on where you hunt. In otf, where the critters swarm the majority of the time, I dont need to sneak from room to room to find 1 critter and kill it, say as you would probably do in the rift.
I upped my mana pool and lores and also helped my spellburst a little by tweaking my training to be able to wear more outside spells while hunting. Mostly for TD purposes, and the extra -1 to rt, I wear all 3 guards, thurfels and stregth, including all my ranger spells. With the extra lores, i've found my spike thorn has gotten better, usually on a spike, I send the critter onto the ground with a stun, where I can easily finish it off with an arrow. If it swarms, well mass calm or natures fury helps.
I tell people all the time, train the way that you hunt, or the way you want to kill things. Sure, theres a little bit more style in sniping or attemping to snipe, or hiding and such, but I found myself honestly not needing to do it, with being maxed in perception I can hit just as well in the open, and find myself still 1 shot critting on 150 end rolls with my longbow that isn't weighted or anything, which I think is pretty good. I even tanked my first aid and survival because it wasn't helping me get a full head, or do much at all really, there isn't too much to skin for me that is really worth it. I've found running around with heavier armor, a 1x in dodge, 2x ambush/percept, and spells, keeping up Assume aspect is pretty killer, and at 84 I shoot close to 470 with the wolf aspect. With the next fixskills, I may even drop all my hiding, who knows.

If I was a rogue archer honestly, just looking at rogue buddys of mine, I'd probably 2x ambush, ditch the picking, (choose if you want to pick or if you want to be a more lethal hunter, it really comes down to that), and I'd train up the spell circles as far as you can, a rogue archer with up to 430+ is pretty deadly, your gonna get pretty nice AS/DS spells from that circle, not to mention eblade your own arrows, and keep everything pinned down with ewave if your smart with it.

CM for archers? Eh, I'm not so much a beleiver for rangers, we have utility spells that will compensate for having those few helpfull manuever abilities. Ditch it and keep your harness power up to snug so you have mana, get into augmented chain, screw the brig, once you go chain, you won't go back.
Rogues get more CM's than rangers, and I can't speak on them really, they are alot cheaper to train in than rangers also.
Everyone develops diffrent hunting habits, experiment for yourself and tweak accordlingly.

-Tenalin

[zhelas]

Rangers are so well balanced.

Best bounty hunters in the lands.

[Hilts]

brawling doesnt help DS anymore i thought?

[Hilts]

wow these are old posts.. nevermind im way late on this lol