Yay for Rush Limbaugh

[RichardCranium]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15408508/

Limbaugh mocks Michael J. Fox political ad

Conservative talk show host accuses actor of faking Parkinson's disease


Possibly worse than making fun of someone's disability is saying that it's imaginary. That is not to mock someone's body, but to challenge a person's guts, integrity, sanity.


To Rush Limbaugh on Monday, Michael J. Fox looked like a faker. The actor, who suffers from Parkinson's disease, has done a series of political ads supporting candidates who favor stem cell research, including Maryland Democrat Ben Cardin, who is running against Republican Michael Steele for the Senate seat being vacated by Paul Sarbanes.


"He is exaggerating the effects of the disease," Limbaugh told listeners. "He's moving all around and shaking and it's purely an act. . . . This is really shameless of Michael J. Fox. Either he didn't take his medication or he's acting."


Limbaugh, whose syndicated radio program has a weekly audience of about 10 million, was reacting to Fox's appearance in another one of the spots, for Missouri Democrat Claire McCaskill, running against Republican Sen. James M. Talent.


But the Cardin ad is similar. It is hard to watch, unless, for some reason, you don't believe it. As he speaks, Fox's restless torso weaves and writhes in a private dance. His head bobs from side to side, almost leaving the video frame.


"This is the only time I've ever seen Michael J. Fox portray any of the symptoms of the disease he has," Limbaugh said. "He can barely control himself."



'A shameless statement'
Later Monday, still on the air, Limbaugh would apologize, but reaction to his statements from Parkinson's experts and Fox's supporters was swift and angry.


"It's a shameless statement," John Rogers said yesterday. Rogers, Fox's political adviser, who also serves on the board of the Parkinson's Action Network, added: "It's insulting. It's appallingly sad, at best."


"Anyone who knows the disease well would regard his movement as classic severe Parkinson's disease," said Elaine Richman, a neuroscientist in Baltimore who co-wrote "Parkinson's Disease and the Family." "Any other interpretation is misinformed."


Fox was campaigning yesterday for Tammy Duckworth, a congressional candidate, outside Chicago, when he alluded to Limbaugh's remarks. "It's ironic, given some of the things that have been said in the last couple of days, that my pills are working really well right now," he said, according to a report on the CBS2 Web site.


After his apology, Limbaugh shifted his ground and renewed his attack on Fox.


"Now people are telling me they have seen Michael J. Fox in interviews and he does appear the same way in the interviews as he does in this commercial," Limbaugh said, according to a transcript on his Web site. "All right then, I stand corrected. . . . So I will bigly, hugely admit that I was wrong, and I will apologize to Michael J. Fox, if I am wrong in characterizing his behavior on this commercial as an act."


Then Limbaugh pivoted to a different critique: "Michael J. Fox is allowing his illness to be exploited and in the process is shilling for a Democratic politician."



'Hope to millions of Americans'
Limbaugh's shock at Fox's appearance is a measure of the disease's devastation, advocates say. Contrary to the charge that Fox might not take his medicine to enhance his symptoms, the medicine produces some of the uncontrolled body movements.


"Stem cell research offers hope to millions of Americans with diseases like diabetes, Alzheimer's and Parkinson's," Fox says in the Cardin ad. "But George Bush and Michael Steele would put limits on the most promising stem cell research."


Fox has appeared in ABC's "Boston Legal" this season. In his scenes, taped over the summer, Fox does not shake or loll his head as he does in the Cardin commercial, but does appear to be restraining himself, appearing almost rigid at times.


A source with direct knowledge of Fox's illness who viewed the Cardin ad said Fox is not acting to exaggerate the effects of the disease. The source said Fox's scenes in "Boston Legal" had to be taped around his illness, as he worked to control the tremors associated with Parkinson's for limited periods of time.

[Ilvane]

My grandfather had Parkinsons and it's true that they can try to control the tremors for a short time, but then it goes out of control. It's a horrible disease to watch, as they twitch and turn with that pain of the disease.

I mean, did we really think Rush Limbaugh was a decent man, anyway?

Angela

[RichardCranium]

It's ironic to watch a man with chronic foot-in-mouth syndrome make fun of another's disease.

[Back]

What did you expect from someone addicted to oxy?

[ElanthianSiren]

What did you expect from someone addicted to oxy?

Maybe he's jealous MJF can get all kinds of fun drugs and probably pain killers!!! for a wasting disease that's destroying him. In general though, it's prettty normal for stem cell opponents to attack the proponents, rather than the issue, because all they have to stand on is religious rhetoric. Go California and MJF. :heart: :heart: :heart:

-M

[Sean of the Thread]

MJF put the open season sign around his neck the minute he stepped into the circle so I say fair game.

His movements DID look extremely exaggerated... I mean he is an actor after all. Perhaps they just kept the crew on call for when he had a meltdown moment?

[Hulkein]

You built a time machine out of a Delorean?

[Ilvane]

Parkinsons people don't exactly have control over when the muscles twitch, for those of you who don't know.

My grandpa would literally sit there rocking trying to stop himself from the tremors.

It's nothing to mess around with, seriously.

Rush is a shit. And I'm sorry, I disagree MJF should be attacked because he "stepped his foot into the ring."

Imagine if they took a person in a wheelchair who was paralyzed, who was for stem cell research, and then made fun of them and said they could really walk, and how do we know this person isn't acting..who would put up with that?

:smirk:

Angela

[Some Rogue]

Parkinsons people don't exactly have control over when the muscles twitch, for those of you who don't know.


Angela


O rly?

Did you not read the article? Apparently he can control it sometimes.

"Fox has appeared in ABC's "Boston Legal" this season. In his scenes, taped over the summer, Fox does not shake or loll his head as he does in the Cardin commercial, but does appear to be restraining himself, appearing almost rigid at times.
A source with direct knowledge of Fox's illness who viewed the Cardin ad said Fox is not acting to exaggerate the effects of the disease. The source said Fox's scenes in "Boston Legal" had to be taped around his illness, as he worked to control the tremors associated with Parkinson's for limited periods of time."


I'm not sticking up for Rush here but would it be the first time someone exaggerated and/or made up something for a political gain? Also, consider the fact that up until that commercial aired, most people had not seen MJF that much out of control of his movements.

[Daniel]

I'm not sticking up for Rush here but would it be the first time someone exaggerated and/or made up something for a political gain? Also, consider the fact that up until that commercial aired, most people had not seen MJF that much out of control of his movements.

So how's the MJF twitch watch going?

I mean, you do monitor all of his movements at least daily right?

[Numbers]

Also, consider the fact that up until that commercial aired, most people had not seen MJF that much out of control of his movements.

Really?

http://youtube.com/watch?v=rkA1aN1osVk

[Some Rogue]

Really?

http://youtube.com/watch?v=rkA1aN1osVk


Have you seen the commercials? He's much much worse in the commercial.

[Jazuela]

My Aunt had Parkinson's and died from related illnesses (I was young, but I think I remember some mention of her heart finally giving out from being overstressed). I do remember distinctly, her twitches, and how when she held a cup of tea, she would hold it perfectly still. I always thought that was so strange. There were no meds for this disease then, you just got it, got worse, and died. But even to the very end, until she was put in Hospice, she would hold her teacup without a single tremor of that arm - while the rest of her body would twitch and tremor.

So I think it is very possible for someone's neurological system to "remember" certain things, even in the midst of debilitating illnesses, and react "appropriately" to those external things - such as keeping all those muscles of a single arm still while holding a cup of tea.

It doesn't mean they have control over the rest of their body, or even that they always have control over that one part. I would have to guess Fox experiences something similar. That his acting is only captured on film during his "good" moments, and because he wanted to demonstrate why he feels so strongly about stem cell research (and the pro-research candidates) he allowed himself to be taped when he knew he was unable to keep control.

I think it's a very brave thing for someone to purposely demonstrate their disability to the world and shame on Rush for "accusing" Fox of exploiting it.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

Rush is just a shit head-- and no matter the type of criticism you open yourself up for to help lobby for something, it doesn't change the fact that it was an utterly tasteless and "grabbing at straws" move for Limbaugh.

Parkinson's has moments of restraint but those are not constant or lengthy periods of time.

I have no problem with MJF NOT trying to show restraint in the commercial-- if that's the way it is normally for him then that needs to be known. The rest of us don't have to force ourselves rigid in order to not twitch or tremor. To me it's like criticizing a cancer patient who takes a wig off their head and exposes the ugly truth behind cancer treatment.

I don't think that someone would lobby for something that could help an illness by pretending they have an illness. ESPECIALLY not an actor who doesn't actually NEED to lobby for anything/get sympathy/get pity for his condition. I think Rush just needs to take the dildo out of his ass.

[Some Rogue]

So how's the MJF twitch watch going?

I mean, you do monitor all of his movements at least daily right?


No not every day smart guy, but I have seen interviews and Boston Legal commercials where he looked to be in better condition than he does in this recent commercial.

[Sean of the Thread]

Why is it Bush's place to VETO God's will? PRAISE THE LORD!

[HarmNone]

The symptoms of Parkinsonism, or Parkinson's disease, can be controlled for short periods of time. However, the effort required to do so is huge; particularly, when the disease has progressed to the point of really troublesome spontaneous movements as are shown in this commercial. Additionally, these efforts are only effective for short periods of time. They cannot be sustained indefinitely. Sometimes, they can only be sustained for minutes at a time; sometimes, no matter how much effort is expended the movements continue.

[HarmNone]

My Aunt had Parkinson's and died from related illnesses (I was young, but I think I remember some mention of her heart finally giving out from being overstressed). I do remember distinctly, her twitches, and how when she held a cup of tea, she would hold it perfectly still. I always thought that was so strange. There were no meds for this disease then, you just got it, got worse, and died. But even to the very end, until she was put in Hospice, she would hold her teacup without a single tremor of that arm - while the rest of her body would twitch and tremor.

So I think it is very possible for someone's neurological system to "remember" certain things, even in the midst of debilitating illnesses, and react "appropriately" to those external things - such as keeping all those muscles of a single arm still while holding a cup of tea.

It doesn't mean they have control over the rest of their body, or even that they always have control over that one part. I would have to guess Fox experiences something similar. That his acting is only captured on film during his "good" moments, and because he wanted to demonstrate why he feels so strongly about stem cell research (and the pro-research candidates) he allowed himself to be taped when he knew he was unable to keep control.

I think it's a very brave thing for someone to purposely demonstrate their disability to the world and shame on Rush for "accusing" Fox of exploiting it.

One thing that happens is that the person suffering puts all effort into controlling that one body part. In doing so, they lose control of other body parts. It's a pretty devastating disease and very, very difficult to deal with.

[Sean of the Thread]

I think it's very obvious he was not holding back for the political advert.. who gives a shit really? It's a political ad and they're all shit.

[Daniel]

No not every day smart guy, but I have seen interviews and Boston Legal commercials where he looked to be in better condition than he does in this recent commercial.

So, in other words you've seen him in a controlled envrioment. Therefore, you have absolutely no basis to make any sort of determination on his condition. So, basicly. You're talking out of your ass.

Got cha.

[ElanthianSiren]

He's also given congressional testamony off his meds. There were a few snippets on e true hollywood additionally, so this isn't the first time people have seen him sick.

I find it funny that pharm cos can find all these new life support treatments but they can't find a cure to chronic conditions. That one always makes me chuckle. Anyway, I doubt MJF allowed himself to be taped so people could mock him. He's also showing the world what happens to people who can't access the medications that they need, which is a growing number around the world and in the US. The fact that he's an 80s icon, however, makes people take notice more than the average person would.

-M

[Ilvane]

They have even said that they had to do special shots to get him at his best..and that his tremors were bad then too.

Poor thing, I really think he's great for doing the ads, honestly.

Angela

[StrayRogue]

Parkinson's fucking sucks.

[HarmNone]

That it does, Stray. That it does. :(

[Ilvane]

From an article on Rush's comments and on MJF faking it:

Dr. John Boockvar, a neurosurgeon and assistant professor at Weill Cornell Medical Center at New York's Presbyterian Hospital, called Limbaugh's claim "ludicrous." Boockvar said those with Parkinson's have "on" and "off" spells.

"If there is one single disease that has the highest potential for benefit from stem cell research," Boockvar said Tuesday, "it's Parkinson's."

~~

I watched a bit of the ad on AP, and it reminds me of my grandpa and how bad it was when he had it.

Angela

[Keller]

Rush's first premise: MJF has parkinson's
Rush's second premise: MJF can control his parkinson's
Stimulus: MJF appears in advertisment and doesn't control his parkinson's
Rush's Conclusion: MJF is acting.

Yup. Rush is a fucking moron. Acting is what MJF did on Boston Legal when he controled his movement in order to get a fucking paycheck. Not-acting is what MJF is doing in this advertisment in favor of stem-cell research. MJF is NOT acting, and Rush says he is acting. What the fuck?

[Some Rogue]

So, in other words you've seen him in a controlled envrioment. Therefore, you have absolutely no basis to make any sort of determination on his condition. So, basicly. You're talking out of your ass.

Got cha.

Hmm, he's in one interview talking about the same fucking disease and yes, he does show his symptoms but not as severe. Then, he does a political ad (also a controlled envrionment) discussing the same topic but now he looks in much worse condition. Though I may not agree with calling him out, I can see why some would question it. Of course, this is a topic you don't want to see the other side of because you agree with him. Gotcha.


Parkinson's fucking sucks.

Agreed.

[Daniel]

Hmm, he's in one interview talking about the same fucking disease and yes, he does show his symptoms but not as severe. Then, he does a political ad (also a controlled envrionment) discussing the same topic but now he looks in much worse condition. Though I may not agree with calling him out, I can see why some would question it. Of course, this is a topic you don't want to see the other side of because you agree with him. Gotcha.



Lol. Yea. I mean, he'd have absolutely no reason whatsoever to try and control himself on national television. I mean, because I'm sure he's not self conscious about twitching uncontrollably, and I'm sure there is absolutely no one that would ridicule him for it.

I mean, I'm sure we'd see you on national television embarassing the fuck out of yourself when you had absolutely no reason to.

[CrystalTears]

Rush can kindly shove it. Doesn't he have anything else to wager with than to attack someone's disease?

He's an actor, yes. He saves his control of his twitches for his acting, which is his bread and butter. When he's advocating for stem cell research, why SHOULD he control himself? This is how he is on a normal basis, he shouldn't have to control anything to prove a point of how serious his disease is.

Rush has truly sunk to an all-time low. Fucking asshat.

[HarmNone]

Another thing to be noted: Parkinson's is chronic AND progressive. What a stricken individual could do last week, that same individual may not be capable of doing this week. This disease doesn't just come to a certain point and stop. It keeps getting worse.

[Daniel]

HN,

Lets stop with all these so called "facts". We all know, the most important issue at hand is that Michael J Fox, would DARE use this condition to solicit support against it.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

Hmm, he's in one interview talking about the same fucking disease and yes, he does show his symptoms but not as severe. Then, he does a political ad (also a controlled envrionment) discussing the same topic but now he looks in much worse condition.


Pretty much your answer is what HN noted.

[Atlanteax]

I think most Republicans don't really take Rush Limbaugh seriously (thankfully), but continue to listen to him for "news updates" on political issues, and for a bit of entertainment.

I'm pretty certain that there's a growing realization, along the same lines, that Rush lacks class (nevermind that it's obvious to most on these Forums).

[HarmNone]

HN,

Lets stop with all these so called "facts". We all know, the most important issue at hand is that Michael J Fox, would DARE use this condition to solicit support against it.

Hee! I'll try to control myself. May the gods forbid that actual, meaningful information be propagated! My bad. :(

[ElanthianSiren]

Hmm, he's in one interview talking about the same fucking disease and yes, he does show his symptoms but not as severe. Then, he does a political ad (also a controlled envrionment) discussing the same topic but now he looks in much worse condition. Though I may not agree with calling him out, I can see why some would question it. Of course, this is a topic you don't want to see the other side of because you agree with him. Gotcha. .


Do you understand what a degenerative disease is? It means the disease gets progressively worse over time. What you're saying pretty much is that my eye doctor (who I go to every year) should be telling me that there's nothing wrong with my vision because, though I have borderline high pressure in my right eye (a symptom of glaucoma) related directly to my diabetes 1, two years ago the pressure in my eyes was great. AKA Fox doesn't have real symptoms because at another point in time he wasn't as bad. I hope you're playing devil's advocate. I really do.

-M

[Sean]

I'd say theres a pretty significant distinction between illustrating the reality/effects of your disease by not focusing on controlling it and acting.

I wouldn't argue against the concept that he most likely allowed himself to be filmed in a bad state to convey a message. But who wouldn't? Who would take an ad seriously if he just stood there and said, "This is normally where I would break out into tremors or become rigid but right now I'm focusing all my will to control my actions."

On another note, when did Michael J. Fox become relevant again? Do you know anyone who is going to swing their vote because Michael J Fox thinks stem cell research could help people with Parkinson's down the line?

[Gan]

I think most Republicans don't really take Rush Limbaugh seriously (thankfully), but continue to listen to him for "news updates" on political issues, and for a bit of entertainment.

I'm pretty certain that there's a growing realization, along the same lines, that Rush lacks class (nevermind that it's obvious to most on these Forums).


:yeahthat:

[Numbers]

Have you seen the commercials? He's much much worse in the commercial.

The date of the video on the YouTube link I posted was July 19th, so that interview was over three months ago. Parkinson's is extremely degenerative, and gets worse over time. So, it doesn't surprise me in the slightest that he's worse in the commercial.

[Parkbandit]

So, in other words you've seen him in a controlled envrioment. Therefore, you have absolutely no basis to make any sort of determination on his condition. So, basicly. You're talking out of your ass.

Got cha.


What the fuck is a commercial if it's not a controlled environment?

You're talking out of your ass.

[Back]

Didn’t you guys know? MJF is part of the overt Hollywood liberal media conspiracy to make GWB look bad just because of an irrational hatred for him. C’mon now, pay attention!

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

Didn’t you guys know? MJF is part of the overt Hollywood liberal media conspiracy to make GWB look bad just because of an irrational hatred for him. C’mon now, pay attention!

Poor Rush is just a victim of people brainwashed by the Damn Liberals.

[Hulkein]

Parkinsons people don't exactly have control over when the muscles twitch, for those of you who don't know.

My grandpa would literally sit there rocking trying to stop himself from the tremors.

It's nothing to mess around with, seriously.

Rush is a shit. And I'm sorry, I disagree MJF should be attacked because he "stepped his foot into the ring."

Rush is basing this off the fact that MJFox is on TV shows not shaking like he is on the commercial, though. Your grandfather or any other Parkinsons patient is irrelevant.

Not defending what he said, just pointing that out.

[Parkbandit]

I actually have nothing against the political commercial. MJF has become this cause and I applaud his efforts. I actually agree with his stand and disagree with the President on this. If I had this disease, I hope I would be able to put forth a fraction of the effort Fox is.

[Methais]

I don't see what the big deal is about stem cell research. I say let them do all the research they want, if it could lead to a cure of all kinds of things.

[Daniel]

What the fuck is a commercial if it's not a controlled environment?

You're talking out of your ass.

You're absolutely correct. However, that is not the point at all.

The point is that you have no basis whatsoever to make a determination if whether or not the commercial is him "naturally" or not. To suggest that him being filmed for a TV show, or in another interview is an accurate representation of how he is on a daily basis is ridiculous.

Furthermore, Rush Limbaugh, or Some Rogue have absolutely no cause to suggest that he would somehow be "Faking" other than the fact that they do not support their position.

So, in all actually they are the ones talking out of their ass. "They" includes you, since you decided to do the predictable and jump into the foray with absolutely no considering of the topic at hand, besides what political side is being touted.

[Daniel]

I don't see what the big deal is about stem cell research. I say let them do all the research they want, if it could lead to a cure of all kinds of things.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFWH76oEGL8

[Hulkein]

There is no fuss about stem cell research, it's embryonic stem cell research that people don't want being rushed into with wreckless abandon.

[Sean of the Thread]

There is no fuss about stem cell research, it's embryonic stem cell research that people don't want being rushed into with wreckless abandon.

Oh I thought everyone was on the same page with that. Some of the major problem with the MJF political ad is because it's about embryonic.. when it's the adult stem cell part that has hope for parkinsons.

[Some Rogue]

HN,

Lets stop with all these so called "facts". We all know, the most important issue at hand is that Michael J Fox, would DARE use this condition to solicit support against it.

Actually, I don't have a problem with him raising money. I'm appalled that politicians would use someone and exploit their condition for political gain.


The date of the video on the YouTube link I posted was July 19th, so that interview was over three months ago. Parkinson's is extremely degenerative, and gets worse over time. So, it doesn't surprise me in the slightest that he's worse in the commercial.

Yes, it gets worse over time. But, how long ago was he diagnosed? 15 years? This is why some people found it hard to believe. For at least 10 years it was hardly noticeable, then in the last 3 months it's all of a sudden effecting him severely.


Do you understand what a degenerative disease is? It means the disease gets progressively worse over time. What you're saying pretty much is that my eye doctor (who I go to every year) should be telling me that there's nothing wrong with my vision because, though I have borderline high pressure in my right eye (a symptom of glaucoma) related directly to my diabetes 1, two years ago the pressure in my eyes was great. AKA Fox doesn't have real symptoms because at another point in time he wasn't as bad. -M

Oh I am sure I don't understand it as well as you do. I mean you have to point out your medical history in every thread possible whether it applies or not.

And actually, no, that's not what I am saying at all. What I am saying is, for 10 years+ his symptoms were barely noticeable, then within the last 6 months or so, as he starts campaigning for stem cell research, his Parkinson's has progressed to a very severe level.



I hope you're playing devil's advocate.
-M

Bingo! We have a winner.

[Gan]

I actually find myself laughing more at Rush than with him when I happen to be listening to the talk stations in the car.

In my opinion I think he's as bad as every other pundit vying for your 15 minutes of attention.

Listening to what issues are of topic on shows like his is one thing. Just make sure you remember to form your own opinion of whats happening in politics... not a pre-mixed opinion from a paid-for pundit.

[Daniel]

I doubt MJF feels "exploited".

[DeV]

If MJF were doing a Viagra commercial I doubt the loud mouth conservative would have shit to say.

[Gan]

Or Vicodin (oxycontin).

next 15 minutes please...

[Parkbandit]

You're absolutely correct. However, that is not the point at all.

The point is that you have no basis whatsoever to make a determination if whether or not the commercial is him "naturally" or not. To suggest that him being filmed for a TV show, or in another interview is an accurate representation of how he is on a daily basis is ridiculous.

Furthermore, Rush Limbaugh, or Some Rogue have absolutely no cause to suggest that he would somehow be "Faking" other than the fact that they do not support their position.

So, in all actually they are the ones talking out of their ass. "They" includes you, since you decided to do the predictable and jump into the foray with absolutely no considering of the topic at hand, besides what political side is being touted.

Actually.. you are stupid.

TV Series = controlled environment
TV Commercial = controlled environment

Your point is that maybe during the TV series he can control the effects of his disease, but in his political commercial he doesn't try. Sorry, it's the same exact thing. While I don't believe he is purposely shaking.. I do believe that it is in his power to shake less, but because it wouldn't have the same effect.. he chooses not to.

And seriously.. don't give me this "OMG U R FOR BUSH SO U R AGAINST MJF!" I've posted my opinion on this subject before and in this very thread (#43) So take your fucking touting the political side line and shove it up your liberal ass. Unlike you and most of your pals here.. I don't agree or disagree with individual topics to side where the political line is. I agree or disagree with what MY opinion is. I could give a rats ass if it agrees or disagrees with the Republican Party or George W. Bush.

So feel free to drone on.

[DeV]

Who the fuck cares what kind of environment it's in. Seriously, that is so ridiculous it's beyond me.

Secondly, if you don't agree with what he is campaigning for then disagree with it without making light of an illness you have don't have a clue about.

That just makes you stupid. You, being a generalized term. If you feel offended, then you must be one of the dumbasses that cares more about how much MJF was shaking and less about the fact that you don't have to live with the disease, he does.

[CrystalTears]

DeV for President.

[DeV]

Heh, I'd much rather work under you. Rush would be promptly deported.

:rah:

[HarmNone]

Heh, I'd much rather work under you. Rush would be promptly deported.

:rah:

First, you'd have to find a country to take him ... :banghead:

[TheEschaton]

It's much different, PB. In a TV series, MJF plays a character. None of whom I ever recall having Parkinson's. ALthough he played a doctor once on Scrubs who had OCD, and he let his little twitches show through a bit more to lend itself to the character.

On a TV commercial, he is MJF. He's not pretending to be someone without Parkinson's. He's himself, and he happens to have a disease which makes him shake.

-TheE-

[Parkbandit]

It's much different, PB. In a TV series, MJF plays a character. None of whom I ever recall having Parkinson's. ALthough he played a doctor once on Scrubs who had OCD, and he let his little twitches show through a bit more to lend itself to the character.

On a TV commercial, he is MJF. He's not pretending to be someone without Parkinson's. He's himself, and he happens to have MJF.

-TheE-


Seriously.. I give up trying to explain anything to you.

[Sean of the Thread]

First, you'd have to find a country to take him ... :banghead:

First she would have to find a country that would elect a Black Lesbian Woman because it's not gonna happen here anytime soon... now a White Lesbian Clinton is a possibility.

The answer to Rush is simple for me... I CHOOSE not to listen to him.. funny how that works.

[DeV]

First she would have to find a country that would elect a Black Lesbian Woman.No shit, Capt. Obvious. Secondly, she would have to be interested in attaining such a position. Since she isn't we will all CHOOSE to ignore your comment since ct's was obviously made in jest.


I CHOOSE not to listen to him.. I'm guessing most on the boards follow that example. Doesn't mean we can't talk about how much of a dickhead he is when he decides to speak stupidly.

[Sean of the Thread]

No shit? The comments were made in jest?

[DeV]

Comment, singular? Yes?

[Daniel]

Actually.. you are stupid.

TV Series = controlled environment
TV Commercial = controlled environment

Your point is that maybe during the TV series he can control the effects of his disease, but in his political commercial he doesn't try. Sorry, it's the same exact thing. While I don't believe he is purposely shaking.. I do believe that it is in his power to shake less, but because it wouldn't have the same effect.. he chooses not to.


I'm glad you can grasp the point PB. If you took the time to step up and read what was being written, then you'd realize thats what I said in the first place.


So take your fucking touting the political side line and shove it up your liberal ass. Unlike you and most of your pals here.. I don't agree or disagree with individual topics to side where the political line is. I agree or disagree with what MY opinion is.

So, you're saying my "Liberal ass" is incapable of disagreeing or acting on positions that are against the party lines?

Damn. I wish someone would have told me that before I served a tour in Iraq, and before I volunteered for a second one.

...


Talk about fucking stupid.

[Sean of the Thread]

Comment, singular? Yes?

Oh was including my comment made in jest in addition to yours and ct's... PLURAL.

[DeV]

Oh was including my comment made in jest in addition to yours and ct's... PLURAL.Since there is truth to your comment I refrained from labeling it "in jest". There was a tad too much elaboration there. Use an emoticon next time or something.

[CrystalTears]

WTF?! All this because I said DeV for President? If I had a choice from anyone of the fuckers on these boards that have been posting in this thread, yeah, she would win my vote. You people have lost your fucking minds. :lol:

[Sean of the Thread]

I would seriously vote for Backlash.. that would be one hell of a ride.

[Back]

WTF?! All this because I said DeV for President? If I had a choice from anyone of the fuckers on these boards that have been posting in this thread, yeah, she would win my vote. You people have lost your fucking minds. :lol:

heh, I’ve also been wondering who pissed in people's Cheeriors today.


I would seriously vote for Backlash.. that would be one hell of a ride.

Now I know for certain that you are absolutely bat-shit insane. Thanks for the compliment though.

[xtc]

I haven't seen the commercial but will be looking for it. I have seen Mj Fox in numerous interviews and what is evident is that stress causes his symptoms to flare up, even if he took the medication right before the interview.

It wouldn't surprise me if Fox didn't take his medication before the ad so his symptoms would be more exaggerated. The question becomes, is this is a political ploy or an honest attempt to show people how people are with Parkinson’s who aren't on their medication?

When Fox took a stand on the issue he became a political target. Having a disability doesn't & shouldn't give you immunity from criticism. He should be subject to the same criticism as any other Hollywood star who weighs in on the issue.

For the record I am for stem cell research but against embryonic stem cell research. I wouldn't purposefully destroy an innocent life to support another.
It is important to point out that those who are against embryonic stem cell research are in favour of all other kinds of stem cell research both adult stem cells and those from the fallopian tube. Those of MJ Fox's ilk fail to make that very important point.

[CrystalTears]

When Fox took a stand on the issue he became a political target. Having a disability doesn't & shouldn't give you immunity from criticism.
This is such bullshit. If anyone else in the political arena had a disease and was criticized for it in anyway, people would be having a hissy fit. It's not excusable and it's a weak argument because they have nothing else to go with. People like Rush, who have nothing else brilliant to say on the subject, should stay with their mouths shut.

[DeV]

I could also see if someone else with the same disease made critical remarks similiar to what Rush Limbaugh said. Alas, that didn't happen and in essence Rush should take a cue and refrain from criticizing a man for shaking "too much" or "too little". Criticize the issue... not the person championing a cause who happens to be afflicted with the disease in question.

This is not just a "issue" for MJF. It's a lifetime ailment.

[Sean of the Thread]

This is such bullshit. If anyone else in the political arena had a disease and was criticized for it in anyway, people would be having a hissy fit. It's not excusable and it's a weak argument because they have nothing else to go with. People like Rush, who have nothing else brilliant to say on the subject, should stay with their mouths shut.

You mean like Rush's disease of addiction?

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

This is not just a "issue" for MJF. It's a lifetime ailment.

To me, this is the root of the issue with people saying POLITICAL PLOY OMG.

MJF has absolutely nothing to gain except for relief from his disease. He's not using this to get himself votes for something or other things "political". Therefore, no, this was not a "political" ploy. This was someone supporting people on an issue that is near and dear to him for the exact reason that he made clear. Even if people don't agree with him I find it amusing that a lot can't just respect that. What? Do they like having lying lobbyists? Seems like even if a politician or someone lobbying is being honest, no oneis going to listen or believe them anyway. So why bother?

[xtc]

This is such bullshit. If anyone else in the political arena had a disease and was criticized for it in anyway, people would be having a hissy fit. It's not excusable and it's a weak argument because they have nothing else to go with. People like Rush, who have nothing else brilliant to say on the subject, should stay with their mouths shut.

I don't think Rush criticised Fox for having Parkinson's. He criticised him for "exagerating his disability as a political ploy". If this is what he did.

Obviously Fox is trying to impact November's elections. As such he is a legitimate political target.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

I don't think Rush criticised Fox for having Parkinson's. He criticised him for "exagerating his disability as a political ploy". If this is what he did.

Obviously Fox is trying to impact November's elections. As such he is a legitimate political target.

Then he should be attacked based on his political moves, not based on his disease.

Therefore, Rush should have attacked how Fox went about trying to get his voice heard, not accuse him of being a "faker" about a very serious illness.

[Parkbandit]

Talk about fucking stupid.

Almost as fucking stupid as someone claiming I always toe the party line.

Almost.

[ElanthianSiren]

Rush has since recanted at least one of his statements. Damn flip flopper.

Sean, the stem cells you're speaking of don't help in the case of many ailments because they need to morph into nearby tissues. Here we go again.

-M

[CrystalTears]

I don't think Rush criticised Fox for having Parkinson's. He criticised him for "exagerating his disability as a political ploy". If this is what he did.
Same thing, imo.

[Hulkein]

First, you'd have to find a country to take him ... :banghead:

I can think of a few Muslim countries that seem to cater to outrageous hardliners like him.

Hell, if he changes his hard line tune from what it is now to radical Islamic, he can probably become a Cleric and weild some official power.

[Some Rogue]

Sean, the stem cells you're speaking of don't help in the case of many ailments because they need to morph into nearby tissues. Here we go again.

-M


Since you've obviously devoted so many years of your life to stem cell research, perhaps you can tell us what we CAN do with those cells. Also, please look into your crystal ball and tell us what we might possibly do in the future with them.

[ElanthianSiren]

Since you've obviously devoted so many years of your life to stem cell research, perhaps you can tell us what we CAN do with those cells. Also, please look into your crystal ball and tell us what we might possibly do in the future with them.

Actually, stem cell research is my area of training, so you're not very far off the mark with that statement, albeit sarcastic.

I already explained the scientific demerits of using adult stem cells in another thread many times over. I encourage you to read it. Quoth wezas, "don't be that guy".

-M

[Keller]

Since you've obviously devoted so many years of your life to stem cell research, perhaps you can tell us what we CAN do with those cells. Also, please look into your crystal ball and tell us what we might possibly do in the future with them.


I remember chatting with Melissa on AIM like, oh, 4 years ago and that was her area of active research. Depending on your definition of "so many years" perhaps she's satisfied that criteria? Maybe a little less sarcasm and your foot wouldn't be so far down your throat.

[Gan]

I tuned in Rush on the way to lunch and he's now stating that MJF admits to over-medicating the day of the commercial.

This isnt verified nor does it adress the intent of overmedicating. Only that the symptoms from under medicating and over medicating are pretty much the same with regards to the physical appearance of the person taking the drugs.

Something smells fishy. It will be interesting to see if its Rush's backpedaling or if he's actually onto something with regards to how the commercial was setup.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

It will be interesting to see if its Rush's backpedaling or if he's actually onto something with regards to how the commercial was setup.

Rush is full of shit. That is all.

[DeV]

Does MJF allegedly "faking" it on a commercial make his illness or his passion to find a cure for the illness any less serious?

What the hell.

[CrystalTears]

Does MJF allegedly "faking" it on a commercial make his illness or his passion to find a cure for the illness any less serious?

What the hell.
Well yes! because he's obviously not really that bad all the time, so the illness is obviously not that serious enough to campaign help for. Pft. /sarcasm

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

Well yes! because he's obviously not really that bad all the time, so the illness is obviously not that serious enough to campaign help for. Pft. /sarcasm

Woah, you mean that the people in the commercials for genital herpes are ACTUALLY paid actors. That means genital herpes does not exist, and is not truly a problem! Someone should sue the medical company for making a fake medication to such a mundane little health problem!

[Gan]

Does MJF allegedly "faking" it on a commercial make his illness or his passion to find a cure for the illness any less serious?

What the hell.

Because its for a political endorcement (?) rather than for a centric commercial for Parkensons as his earlier commercials have been, I think some would view it as cheapening the message.

It would be disappointing to know that he chose to do this with a political ad, in my opinion.

[xtc]

Then he should be attacked based on his political moves, not based on his disease.

Therefore, Rush should have attacked how Fox went about trying to get his voice heard, not accuse him of being a "faker" about a very serious illness.

If Fox didn't take his medication before filming the ad, that would be a political motive.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

If Fox didn't take his medication before filming the ad, that would be a political motive.

No, it's not.

If everyone with Parkinson's faked having it and it didn't really exist, and then a political group tried to use that issue as a spring board when the issue didn't exist, that would be a political motive/move.

For Fox to show WHAT it is to have Parkinson's and not be able to afford treatment, or just what it's like without treatment, is honesty. He didn't actually say in the commercial "It's this bad right now even with treatment" so you can't even nail him for lying or being dishonest in the ad.

It's like I said before, this to me is like accusing a cancer patient who appears on TV for an ad about cancer treatment who is rail thin and hairless from Chemo of "spinning" and having a political motive-- how dare they show the utter truth of what it's like to have such a disease and undergo such a treatment!

[CrystalTears]

If Fox didn't take his medication before filming the ad, that would be a political motive.
So fucking what if he didn't? What exactly is the harm in showing what the full effect of his condition is like during this commercial? It's not like he doesn't have Parkinson's and is faking having it at all. He's had it for years, dealing with it daily. Tell me exactly why he has to hide it.

[ElanthianSiren]

Because its for a political endorcement (?) rather than for a centric commercial for Parkensons as his earlier commercials have been, I think some would view it as cheapening the message.

It would be disappointing to know that he chose to do this with a political ad, in my opinion.

Tour a diabetes health meeting sometime, and ask people there what their sugars have been. You'd be flabbergasted to find that a large number of people who have complications so often associated with the disease (neuropathy, kidney problems, heart problems, seizures), take their meds as directed. They have, consistently decent ha1c levels (6-7). The plain fact of the matter is that even with good control, juvenile diabetics get complications 50% of the time. For instance, my sugars are great, and I have on my wrist diabetic necrobiosis (skin leisons) and high pressure in one eye (right).

What people have to understand is that the medications put out by the pharm cos for chronic conditions are not cures, and they don't do much except slow the progression of complications that will happen eventually because chronic diseases are not just the symptoms of those diseases (high sugar, degradation of brain tissue) but deeper problems in the physiology of a human body. People with chronic conditions understand that the problem is at the cellular level, which is why they advocate for cellular treatment.

Is it wrong to show the world the real face of Parkinsons, even if MJF didn't take his medicine to do it? Is it wrong to show the world what his family sees, or do you think that his family sees him in a well medicated state constantly? Parkinsons, as a condition, requires different levels of medication. It's not steady, so I promise MJF's med levels probably fluctuate based on necessity.

Chronic diseases devestate sufferers, but they're also excruciating for friends and family. Does it bother us then more that we have to see it in someone as famous as Fox on something as public as television? I feel that's the real discontent with the issue. Sick people make healthy people uncomfortable, especially with spontaneous chronic diseases because 1. you might have it 2. our response to them is historically piss poor, and 3. they tend to be of the wasting varieties.

-M

[Skirmisher]

I agree 100% Siren.

Just because people normally only get to see MJF or most people with similarly debilitating diseases on their best days does not mean the other days do not exist. No one likes to have people see them at their worst and for him to be willing to show that takes courage.

It is his and every person's right to try to do what they can to better their chances of survival as long as it is legal, and I am sure that making an ad that they think will help a party they find more helpful to finding any such treatment/cure is definitely legal.

He is not pushing for some act or purchasing contract for his financial gain. He is not using his connections to get zoning approval for some outlandish renovations to his hollywood mansion. He is pushing for the party he thinks will best help him and those suffering with him through research.

I find it horribly unfair and in fact politicaly motivated for anyone to find him "cheap" or "disapointing" in doing all he can to live.

[TheEschaton]

Ganalon, it's refreshing after a long day of classes to see your fatherly "I'm disappointed in him" type morality. It reassures me that the world is still working.

Thanks. :)

-TheE-

[Gan]

Amazing how I'm not the only one who has stated that this 'could' be for political blame in this thread and yet I'm the focus. That makes me feel loved.

You're welcome TheE. Although my post's sentiment really wasnt aimed at you, so put your vanity aside. In fact, I've always been a fan of MJF. I have his book on the shelf opposite of my desk at home, which is an excellent read in itself.

I understand and support his advocacy for finding a cure for Parkinsons. I'm just disappointed that he has boarded the Democratic crazy train for political benefits that he will never see, regardless of what they tell him.

[DeV]

I'm just disappointed that he has boarded the Democratic crazy train for political benefits that he will never see, regardless of what they tell him.I believe Arnold Schwarzenegger boarded that Democratic crazy train long ago.

[Gan]

He's married to a Kennedy. Resistance is futile...

[Apathy]

Rush, your medium is dying. Fewer and fewer people are listening to talk radio. The upcoming generations even go out of their way to avoid it. Your credibility has been seriously hurt in recent years. Your ratings are down. We need you to give people a reason to listen again.

Got you.

[Hulkein]

Rush, your medium is dying. Fewer and fewer people are listening to talk radio. The upcoming generations even go out of their way to avoid it. Your credibility has been seriously hurt in recent years. Your ratings are down. We need you to give people a reason to listen again.

Got you.

Rush's ratings are still making him more money than you'll ever make, I seriously doubt that is a reason why he said what he said. He's just a hypocritical asshole.

[Stanley Burrell]

Before I go back to sleep, there are different stages in neurological illnesses.

I'm working with MS patients and you'd be surprised at the extreme differences in physical symptoms between individual to individual.

I think, though, that he (Rush) will be prone to a premature heart attack or possibly a stroke, so I am not overly upset about his comments I guess.

[ElanthianSiren]

Rush's ratings are still making him more money than you'll ever make, I seriously doubt that is a reason why he said what he said. He's just a hypocritical asshole.

I believe apathy was making a point that to folks like Rush, and other people in the media, all attention is good. It gets their name out. That was how I took it anyway.

-M
edit: hence the "got you" at the end. Kind of socratian dialogue style. Next time use quotes!!!

[DeV]

Agreed. I'm doubting anyone on this forum cares about how much money Rush makes. He's a rich douche. Nothnig new there.

[Parkbandit]

I believe Arnold Schwarzenegger boarded that Democratic crazy train long ago.


He's a typical politician.. moving towards the polls during an election period to get re-elected. Hopefully, he will move back towards the Republican agenda once he wins.

[DeV]

He's a typical politician.. moving towards the polls during an election period to get re-elected. Hopefully, he will move back towards the Republican agenda once he wins.

... Ok. And MJF isn't a typical politician, in fact he's not one at all.

Anyway, that was stated due to Gan's "Democratic crazy train" comment. Obvisiouly, Democrats aren't the only ones suffering from "crazy train" syndrome. That was the point.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

He's a typical politician.. moving towards the polls during an election period to get re-elected. Hopefully, he will move back towards the Republican agenda once he wins.

Those are my thoughts (On Arnold too), minus the hopefully. Though I think it would be awesome if Arnold could maintain a balance and be permanently a more "middle road" fixture.

[ElanthianSiren]

According to his Couric interview, he did take his meds, and the meds themselves are what caused the rocking. BTB he wasn't looking too stellar in the Couric interview either. The words are coming out very steadily, but as he's speaking, his legs are all over the place. Just reminded me what HN said earlier.

-M

[Hulkein]

Agreed. I'm doubting anyone on this forum cares about how much money Rush makes. He's a rich douche. Nothnig new there.

You're wrong, I care tremendously and so do 34 other people who have Private Messaged me about how much they care!

In all seriousness, I didn't say that. Whoever it was alluded to the fact that he said this because his medium is dying and his ratings are down. I don't even think that's true, first of all, and second of all, he is still making a ton of cash from his still amazingly high listening base, so it doesn't matter.

He said what he said because he felt that way.

[Gan]

(CBS/AP) Responding to criticism by conservative pundit Rush Limbaugh, actor Michael J. Fox defended his appearance in a political campaign ad, saying he wasn't acting or off his medication.

In fact, at the time he was over-medicated for his Parkinson's disease, Fox said Thursday in an exclusive interview with CBS Evening News anchor Katie Couric.

"The irony is that I was too medicated. I was dyskinesic (http://www.ninds.nih.gov/disorders/tardive/tardive.htm)," Fox told Couric. "Because the thing about … being symptomatic is that it's not comfortable. No one wants to be symptomatic; it's like being hit with a hammer."

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/10/26/eveningnews/main2128188.shtml