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Fallen
08-21-2006, 06:25 PM
In my studies over the years of the spells commonly available upon scrolls, I often puzzle over the various facets of a seemingly neglected system. Many spells which used to be found on scrolls have seemingly disappeared from the system, while others were never added since the spell's inception. In this post, I will attempt to outline which spells I believe have been improperly removed from the system, and give my opinion as to why the spells in question should be (re)instated back into the general scroll population. Afterwards, I will post my ideas on creating a means to reintroduce high level spells onto scrolls, as well as an entirely new concept in item design for the treasure system, or auction quality releases.

Onto the current level 1-19 Scroll Exempt List:

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Sorcerer - Two spells exempt, one logical (Scroll Infusion)

Dark Catalyst (719) - As far as I can tell, Dark Catalyst cannot be found upon scrolls. There is no reason why this spell should be exempt. It works just as any other warding based attack spell, albeit a powerful one.

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Ranger - Four spells exempt, one logical (Imbue)

Whispering Willow (605) - This is an excellent and highly useful spell in select situations, though I do not believe it to be so much so that it should be classified as a niche ranger spell. The Lore bonus upgrades more than cover the issue of rangers remaining the most proficient users of this spell.

Camoflauge (608) - This is a spell that would prove useful in only rare situations, though certainly more than many of the utility/combat based spells commonly found upon scrolls such as Vibration Chant or Slow.

Spike Thorn (616) - Like Boil Earth, this spell would be useful only when under-hunting or for a ranger conserving mana. However, as Boil Earth IS found upon scrolls, why not Spike Thorn? I actually DO hunt with Boil Earth from time to time, as it is a fun change of pace, and it is an offensive spell that can be utilized when out of mana and spirit.

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Paladin - *7* spells exempt

Dauntless (1606) - Why is this spell exempt? It is no different from many other spells that aid with AS. Bravery, Heroism, Benediction, ect. It is a highly useful spell.

Divine Shield (1609) - Much like the spell 1605, or Arm of the Arkati, this spell would provide an excellent, though albeit limited, bonus to those who hunt in groups with shields. I wouldn't consider this to be an overpowered release as most areas higher in level have spell burst limitations, and this would be a difficult choice above a pure defensive spell.

Higher Vision (1610) - A standard defensive spell. No tricky bonuses. No odd clauses. Why is this spell exempt?

Patron's Blessing (1611) - This is a rather complicated spell, so I can see why it could possibly be exempt from the scroll lists. However, the benefits are quite interesting if a bit lackluster at their base level. Still, is there any specific reason why this spell is exempt?

Champion's Might (1612) - A very interesting and powerful spell. However, the spell is effectively limited due to its duration, even if the spell is stackable. To be cast more than an infrequent amount, the spell would have to be unlocked and infused, which is certainly difficult to do when dealing with the Paladin Circle. Still, I see no reason why this spell should not show up on scrolls.

Divine Vengeance (1613) - Due to the nature of this spell, I can understand it being kept as exempt. It is intrinsic to the Arkati/Paladin professional relationship, and seems to be a "niche" spell.

Guard of the Meek (1618) - This spell would be an excellent addition to the commonly generated scroll lists due to the fact that it would never actually raise the caster's DS. It is not unbalancing in any way, due to the fact that the bonus is not terrifically large, and there are many other spells that provide aid to only those that are in the caster's group. It would promote grouping, and would be limited by spell burst in later areas.

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Empathic Circle - One spell Exempt

Empathic Focus (1109) - This is a spell that once did appear on scrolls, though can no longer be found. It is also one of my pet peeves. The duration for this spell is quite short, which would provide an adequate balance to those wishing to make constant use of its benefits. There is NO reason in my mind why this spell should be exempt. If we can use Strength of will, and Arm of the Arkati..why not Empathic Focus? Please place this spell BACK on the normally found scroll list.

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Bardic Circle - Many spells Exempt due to the nature of bardic magic

Stunning Shout (1008) - A spell that could work well enough due to the nature of its use. No reason to be exempt.

Song of Unraveling (1013) - Many bard spells are useless on scrolls due to the way their magic works. However, this spell would be perfectly fine in its limited lore-free capacity should it be found upon scrolls. It would not be terribly overpowering, though would certainly be beneficial from time to time.

Song of Depression (1015) - Though not terribly useful, there is no reason for this spell to be exempt.

Song of Rage (1016) - Again, this spell would work just as well as any other non-self cast warding based spell, such as frenzy. Please allow for the spell to generate upon scrolls.

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Wizard Circle - Three Exemptions, One logical (Charge Item)

Rapid Fire (515) - This is a spell that can be of definite use in combat scenarios, though only lasts a short while. It did once generate upon scrolls, although it no longer does. Is there any reason why? The spell's duration limits it from constant use, even from an unlocked scroll. Due to its high mana costs, no scroll would hold out for long with its recharging. This spell should be added back into the general scroll population.

Immolation (519) - Another in a relatively long list of odd spell exemptions. This spell was also once found upon scrolls, though seemingly no longer gens. Immolation requires a warding roll so isn't useful to most non-wizards. However, it CAN be of use to some, including wizards who wish to conserve mana. Why not allow it? I see absolutely no reason.

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Major Spiritual - Three exemptions, Two logical (Living Spell, Spirit Servant)

Mass Interference (217) - A definite oddity to the exempt list, so much so that I believe it may just be my poor luck in never coming across this spell. I can see no reason at all why this spell would be exempt from the scroll generator.
(See Following Post for Part Two)

Fallen
08-21-2006, 06:26 PM
In my opinion, there is no reason why high level spells should not be found on commonly generated scrolls. This statement holds especially true for the Major and Minor Open Circles. The spells of Lesser Shroud, Call Lightning, Spirit Guide, and Wall of Force could all easily be found on normally generating, albeit rare scrolls. These spells are not unbalancing, and are definitely useful in niche situations. Other high level spells which would be appropriate for mass release are Elemental Targeting, Elemental Barrier, Major Elemental Wave, Major Sanctuary, Transference, Spirit Slayer, Stone Skin, Meteor Swarm, and Temporal Reversion.

Many of these spells used to be normally found upon scrolls. These relics surface from time to time, though are so rare none are willing to use them. As such, they usually collect dust at the bottom of some rich merchant's locker. I am not suggesting that these spells start flooding treasure chests. Instead, I believe that these scrolls could add an entire tier to the treasure system. The drop rate should be slightly more rare than spells like Raise Dead, Self Control, Mobility, and the like. They would be coveted items in the hands of few, though certainly not unbalancing due to the fact that a scroll can hold only so many charges before it is gone, and a new one must be sought. Added depth to the treasure system, as well as to the economy should always be sought after.

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The Closed Circle Spells I believe appropriate for rare release into mass scroll circulation are: Implosion, Call Familiar, Familiar Gate, Nature's Fury, Wall of Thorns, Judgement, Divine Intervention, Divine Word, Sympathy, Troll's Blood, Intensity, Empathic Dispel, Commune, Song of Sonic Disruption, Song of Tonis, Troubadour's Rally, and Stone Skin.

Closed Circle spells are a contentious issue for some due to the belief that only characters of the profession should have access to the spell. To this, I say nonsense. A scroll will never equal that of a character capable of casting the same spell. A character with a scroll or magical item containing implosion is not an insult to my sorcerer. Why? He has a limited number of charges with the spell, must rely on an outside source to summon the magic, and likely isn't anywhere near as proficient with the spell as I. However, Lore and skill training often associated with these spells renders their outside use as minimal, to defunct. This leads me to my next suggestion...

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Enhancive Scrolls

Many of our high level spells are accompanied by an extensive skillset requirement to ensure the spell works to any tangible degree. I believe that scrolls that contain both a high level spell, as well as the skills required for their use should be found as extremely rare, to uniquely generated items.

For instance, the spell of Resist Nature requires sufficient training in Spiritual Lore: Blessings to be of use. A scroll placed into the treasure system would both contain the spell of Resist Nature, along with either a randomized amount of spirit lore: Blessings, or a set amount to bring this spell on par with the average ranger's training regimen. These scrolls would be limited to but a few uses, perhaps only one, and the enhancive benefit the scroll provides would have a very small amount of charges, and not be able to be recharged.

Spells appropriate for the enhancive scroll system would be: Resist Nature, Assume Aspect, Minor Summoning, Animate Dead, Stone Skin, Troubadour's Rally, Spirit Servant, Holy Receptacle, Scroll Infusion, Planar Rift, and Enchant Item.

Fallen
08-21-2006, 06:31 PM
So, for those that do not wish to read through all of that, here is a brief summary.

There are a good number of spells (level 1-19) which either no longer generate upon commonly found scrolls, or never did. They are 719, 605, 608, 616, 515, 519, 1606, 1609, 1610, 1611, 1612, 1613, 1618, 1109, 1008, 1013, 1015, 1016, and 217.

Further, Level 20+ spells which used to generate on scrolls no longer do, and I believe they should be returned to commonly occuring, albeit rare mass release scrolls. These scrolls should include spells from both Open and Closed(Professional) SpellCircles.

Finally, I proposed a new item, Enhancive Scrolls, which would act as both a scroll with a rare/unavailable spell, and also provide the needed skills in the form of an enhancive item in which to make use of them.

Thoughts, criticisms, and blatant trolling are more than welcome.

Evarin and his Mis'ri

TheEschaton
08-21-2006, 07:39 PM
I think commune must be restricted to clerics only. The idea that the essence of what a communee is can be reduced and put on paper is insulting. If you say "Fine, the one on paper is not as effective" there's little point as most flippin' communes cast by clerics fail.

-TheE-

Ignot
08-21-2006, 11:55 PM
I used to find alot of COS scrolls, now i can't find them at all. I can understand how they do not want other professions gaining access to high level spells, however, i do not see a problem with the minor circle's.

I know this issue came up in the officials when someone started bitching about another person having a call familiar item that wasnt a wizard. One of the GM's (Naos?) kinda made it clear that anything over 19th spell slot isnt going on scrolls anymore. I could understand, some people would feel cheated if non magic users were walking around throwing up Song of Tonis and Temporal Reversion.

I for one would love to see the high end spells on scrolls, even if they made the occurance of these spells rare. Or maybe require a butt load of AS to use it.

Either way, they need to make more fucking 712 scrolls.

Fallen
08-22-2006, 12:03 AM
I used to find alot of COS scrolls, now i can't find them at all. I can understand how they do not want other professions gaining access to high level spells, however, i do not see a problem with the minor circle's. >>

They still gen. Fairly common too, for the protection they offer.

Stanley Burrell
08-22-2006, 12:15 AM
I don't really get the jist of any bard spells being cast by a non-bard. This is because they (teh jaunty bards) are magically operatic mystic beings with arcane mnemonics unleashed from the physical potential of one's vocal cords. And then voice. A sort of set-in-stone boundary, if you will.

If you won't, I guess that what with lore bonuses being the way they are, that those being shared by multiple professions (i.e. spiritual spells listed) could provide somewhat of an unfair beefiness if strewn haphazardly about the masses via scrolls.

Ignot
08-22-2006, 12:19 AM
Give me all the COS scrolls then!

Stanley Burrell
08-22-2006, 12:21 AM
KAY.

Ignot
08-22-2006, 12:24 AM
Having a wizard sing songs off a scroll does not make a whole lot of sense now that I think about it.

StrayRogue
08-22-2006, 04:28 AM
I have a scroll with Whispering Willow and Camo on. Weird.

AestheticDeath
08-22-2006, 08:56 AM
Why is it that you think bards are the only ones who can sing? I can pick up a piece up paper with verses on it, and sing it all I want. I may not be as good as someone who was taught to sing properly, or has that 'special' voice/sound quality. But I can still sing. That is isnt as good is reflected by the fact that it wouldnt have the additional bonus coming from the bards lore circles. Unless of course you trained in that lore. But who would train cross profession lores just for scrolls?

Bard spells on scrolls make alot more sense to me than magic items. Though, being magical, they could somehow impart a knowledge of the verse in your thoughts.

Anyhow Im not going to argue for or against the inclusion of certain spells on scrolls. Just that the possibility is there, and the only reason not to is game balance, and having some professional uniqueness. Im not against either of those things.

Fallen
08-22-2006, 06:03 PM
Care to sell the scroll, Strayrogue? It is rather rare.

StrayRogue
08-22-2006, 06:11 PM
Heh, thats why I bought em. That and Whispering Wind is one of the coolest spells ever.

Fallen
08-22-2006, 07:11 PM
Whispering Willow.

StrayRogue
08-22-2006, 07:18 PM
I'LL CALL IT WHATEVER I LIKE BITCH.

ITS MY SCROLL.

GS4Khistian
08-23-2006, 02:23 AM
Evil eye and torment can also not be found on current scrolls I believe. Has anyone been finding Kia's song scrolls aswell? I haven't seen one in the longest time.

Fallen
08-23-2006, 06:16 PM
I believe I have seen both of those spells on scrolls, Khistian. The problem is, every now and then someone clears out a bunch of old scrolls from their lockers and you will see them, thinking they still gen.

crb
08-27-2006, 09:12 AM
I really should go through my scroll collection, I got atleast around a dozen rapid fire scrolls stored, and god knows what else.

Fallen
08-27-2006, 01:00 PM
See my related thread on purchasing rare scrolls. I am something of a collector.