Arrest made in the Ramsey case

[ElanthianSiren]

Man arrested in death of JonBenet Ramsey

BOULDER, Colo. - A man suspected in the slaying of 6-year-old beauty queen JonBenet Ramsey was arrested Wednesday in Thailand in a surprise breakthrough in one of the nation's most lurid murder cases — a decade-old crime some feared would never be solved.

District Attorney Mary Lacy said the arrest followed several months of work. She would not disclose any details about the suspect, but the Ramsey family's attorney in Atlanta said the man was a schoolteacher who once lived in nearby Conyers, Ga.

Federal officials, speaking on condition of anonymity, identified the suspect as John Mark Karr, a 42-year-old American, and said he was already being held in Bangkok on unrelated sex charges. CBS reported he will be brought back to the United States this weekend.

The Ramsey family attorney, Lin Wood, refused to say if the Ramseys knew the suspect and said he knew nothing else about the man. JonBenet was born in Atlanta in 1990, and the Ramseys lived in the Atlanta suburb of Dunwoody for several years before moving to Colorado in 1991. The couple moved back to Atlanta after their daughter's slaying.

Wood said the arrest was vindication for JonBenet's parents, John and Patsy Ramsey, who had come under suspicion in the slaying. The attorney said the Ramseys learned about the suspect a least a month before Patsy Ramsey's death on June 24 after a long battle with ovarian cancer.

"It's been a very long 10 years, and I'm just sorry Patsy isn't here for me to hug her neck," Wood said.

JonBenet was found beaten and strangled in the basement of the family's home in Boulder on Dec. 26, 1996. Patsy Ramsey reported finding a ransom note demanding $118,000 for her daughter.

The image of blonde-haired little JonBenet in a cowgirl costume and other beauty pageant outfits has haunted TV talk shows ever since, helping feed myriad theories about her killer.

Investigators said at one point that JonBenet's parents were under an "umbrella of suspicion" in the slaying. But the Ramseys insisted an intruder killed their daughter, and no one was ever charged.

In the months after the slaying, Patsy Ramsey went before the cameras, vigorously defending herself and her husband, chastising the media and blasting local law enforcement as incompetent.

Over the years, some experts suggested that investigators had botched the case so thoroughly that it might never be solved.

In a statement Wednesday, John Ramsey said: "Patsy was aware that authorities were close to making an arrest in the case and had she lived to see this day, would no doubt have been as pleased as I am with today's development almost 10 years after our daughter's murder."

Lib Waters of Marietta, Ga., visited the gravesites of Patsy and JonBenet Ramsey in the Atlanta suburb immediately after hearing news reports about the arrest.

Waters, who described herself as a longtime friend of the Ramsey family, taped a piece of notebook paper to JonBenet Ramsey's headstone that read: "Dearest Patsy, Justice has come for you and Jon. Rest in peace."

In 2003, a federal judge in Atlanta concluded that the evidence she reviewed suggested an intruder killed JonBenet. That opinion came with the judge's decision to dismiss a libel and slander lawsuit against the Ramseys by a freelance journalist, whom the Ramseys had named as a suspect in their daughter's murder. The Boulder district attorney at the time said she agreed with the judge's declaration.

Wood said Wednesday's arrest further vindicated his clients.

"I am sure there were still doubts in the minds of individuals whose thinking had been poisoned against this family because of the years of false accusations," Wood said.

"Today is additional vindication of the family, but I think that knowledgeable individuals familiar with the evidence in the case have known for many years that this family was falsely accused, that they were innocent and that what they lived through in the last 10 years was an American tragedy."

Wood said he and the Ramseys "have been totally amazed and impressed with the professionalism of law enforcement" under Lacy's direction. Lacy became district attorney in 2001.

KUSA-TV of Denver, citing no sources, reported that the suspect has confessed to certain elements of the crime.

Bob Grant, a former Adams County district attorney who worked on the case, said there was never enough evidence to convince him that any potential suspect could be successfully prosecuted.

"I wasn't convinced it was an inside job, nor was I convinced it was an outside job," he said. "All the outside suspects were cleared after exhaustive investigation, and there were a whole lot of outside suspects."
__________________________________________________ _____________


If he's guilty, I hope they Dahmer him.

[LMingrone]

Didn't Mr. Ramsey used to do alot of business in Thailand? hmmmm

[TheEschaton]

Little kids get killed all the time. I remember, at the time, being pissed that the little blonde haired, blue eyed all American girl got 24 hour news cycles dedicated to her.

-TheE-

[Ilvane]

That's so sad. That poor family has gone through so much and were under suspicion, now this creep confesses to knowing stuff about the scene..eeww.

Sicko should fry.

Angela

[Gan]

According to the news blurb I just heard in the car this afternoon: This guy had been sending the Ramsey's taunting emails where he would divulge details of the crime.

This guy has been a suspect for a while, and the police made Mrs. Ramsey aware of his 'interest' level by the authorities before she died.

It will be interesting to see how this plays out.

[LMingrone]

http://czern.homeip.net/aolsearch/index2.php

1. Go there
2. Put 59920 in the search field and search

That the killer maybe?

[Sean of the Thread]

http://czern.homeip.net/aolsearch/index2.php

1. Go there
2. Put 59920 in the search field and search

That the killer maybe?


w t f IS THAT all about? That's some fucked up shit... and how did you come across that?

[Who me]

It's a shame. The mother died I believe last month. After being a suspect in the media for so long, it would have been nice for him to have been caught before she passed.

[Jolena]

The suspect admitted he committed the crime, but says its an accident. Details here: http://www.comcast.net/news/index.jsp?cat=GENERAL&fn=/2006/08/17/457428.html&cvqh=itn_jonbenet

[Ilvane]

Yeah, an accidental strangling??

WTF.

Angela

[Snapp]

Little kids get killed all the time. I remember, at the time, being pissed that the little blonde haired, blue eyed all American girl got 24 hour news cycles dedicated to her.

-TheE-
Agreed. Why should her case be so much more important? :shrug:

[TheEschaton]

Wow, that dude looks like a pedophile.

-TheE-

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

I have a feeling this guy was "just" going to sexually abuse her, and did accidently strangle her, perhaps trying to get her to be quiet? That's the only way I can wrap my head around the idea of this guy, "Loving her" and it being an "accident" heh.

In response to the E-- be mad at the media for that but not the Ramsey's.. they've been the victims of bad media as well as incompetent police investigators who became so caught up in the whirlwind that they really fucked up the case. While yeah, a lot of children are killed, her family didn't ask for the coverage and a lot of it was pretty horrible and accusatory towards the family. Hopefully, with this coming to a conclusion it'll serve as a warning to the media and to police forces about crossing certain lines.

[DeV]

"Autopsy results showed JonBenet received a massive blow to the head and was strangled with a rope that the killer tightened by twisting an attached paintbrush handle."

That doesn't appear to be the work of someone who accidently strangled another person, let alone a little child, imo.

As for what TheE said, completely agreed. Blame the editors though, not the media as a whole. It boils down to not only race, but also gender, and the target audience and its emotional appeal.

[Mighty Nikkisaurus]

"Autopsy results showed JonBenet received a massive blow to the head and was strangled with a rope that the killer tightened by twisting an attached paintbrush handle."

That doesn't appear to be the work of someone who accidently strangled another person, let alone a little child, imo.

As for what TheE said, completely agreed. Blame the editors though, not the media as a whole. It boils down to not only race, but also gender, and the target audience and its emotional appeal.

Yeah, I don't believe he actually killed her on accident.. I mean, come on, heh. It seemed way too methodical.

Definitely agree with blame the editors.. I just hate it when people blame the Ramsey's themselves (even though nobody here did) when they were the biggest victims in this whole thing.

[Shalla]

>>> Suwat said. "He said he loved this child, that he was in love with her. He said she was very pretty, a pageant queen. She was the school star, she was very cute and sweet." <<<


Eew.

[Gan]

There's only one cure for people like that.


A .357 to the head.

[zhelas]

There's only one cure for people like that.


A .357 to the head.

Castration with a rusty dull knife followed by a lynching comes to mind.

[ElanthianSiren]

I wouldn't blame the editors or the media. I don't think a child being murdered or abused is excusible, regardless of finacial situation/race/creed/so on. Sure, lots of little kids are murdered and abused, and the media doesn't cover it, but my anger toward the subject is the same, regardless of the victim. I can't understand feeling otherwise.

When a child molester/rapist etc is arrested, I tend to just always say a little "thank you, law enforcement - I hope you die painfully, child molester/rapist" and be glad he/she can't go on to hurt more kids. It's one of those areas where I'm not very liberal minded and don't believe in remediation.

-M
edit: Celts had a great system for dealing with it called thrice killing. It consisted of garrotting, slitting the throat, then busting the back of a skull with a maul. After which, the person was thrown in a peat bog and completely forgotten.

[zhelas]

If I were her father, I don't know how calm I would be. Greatful that he was caught. Again greatful if infact he was the killer and it was proven without a shadow of doubt in a court of law.

BUT!

He killed my daughter. I am sorry when it comes to family, I am extremely protective. John Grisham's book comes to mind "A Time to Kill". I would die to protect my kids.

[DeV]

I wouldn't blame the editors or the media.I do, especially when I can't recall in the back or front of my mind the last time a white boy, black girl, or black boy were given such worldwide media attention after their death and/or disappearance.

Your other feelings on the matter I have to wholeheartedly agree with. I hope he meets the same fate as Jeffrey Dahmer.

[zhelas]

AUGUST 17--This is the JonBenet Ramsey autopsy report released by the Boulder County coroner on August 13, 1997. While a Thailand immigration official has said that John Karr, who was arrested yesterday in Bangkok for the girl's murder, reportedly claimed to have drugged the child before raping her, the autopsy notes that a "blood drug screen" was negative. (9 pages)

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/jonbenet/jonbenet_casefile.html

Whether or not this guy killed this little girl, he is still sick.

[Chelle]

If it were my child he killed, oh my GOD the guy wouldn't last two seconds. Makes my blood boil just thinking about it.

I think the reason Jon Bonet is getting so much media is because she was forced to live this strange lifestyle that regular kids don't. I mean the child always looked like a miniture 25 year old woman.

As for boys, I do recall Adam Walsh getting lots of media coverage.

[Satira]

I, almost always, feel that anyone who does sick things to children should just be killed. They're fucked up in the head. You can't fix that shit.

[Back]

Putting him in jail is far worse punishment.

[Satira]

If they actually keep him in jail, I'd agree with you.

Which I'm sure they would in this case. I just wouldn't want to see him end up in a cushy nut house or anything.

[ElanthianSiren]

AUGUST 17--This is the JonBenet Ramsey autopsy report released by the Boulder County coroner on August 13, 1997. While a Thailand immigration official has said that John Karr, who was arrested yesterday in Bangkok for the girl's murder, reportedly claimed to have drugged the child before raping her, the autopsy notes that a "blood drug screen" was negative. (9 pages)

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/jonbenet/jonbenet_casefile.html

Whether or not this guy killed this little girl, he is still sick.


I'm not sure, but I think that the base/routine tox scan doesn't cover everything that he could have drugged her with. It's interesting though, definitely.

-M

[Back]

Am I a cold heartless bastard for not giving two flying fucks about this?

[TheEschaton]

It's 10 years in the past. From the news cycle today, you woulda thought that the murder happened yesterday, and that the fucking President of the Universe was killed.


-TheE-

[Gan]

Am I a cold heartless bastard for not giving two flying fucks about this?

Yea, she's not a Republican, in the Bush administration, or was killed in Iraq. WTF do you care?

[Back]

Yea, she's not a Republican, in the Bush administration, or was killed in Iraq. WTF do you care?

Actually, she kind of did look like a puppet.

People are going to curse me to hell for that statement.

[Gan]

:rofl:

And I'll be there beside you for laughing at your reply.

And to think there was a reality show spawned off of the lifestyle of little JonBenet about mothers and child beauty pageants.

[zhelas]

http://cbs4denver.com/topstories/local_story_240154509.html

This guy is sick in the head. Someone said he might not be charged for giving a false confession since he confessed in another country.

[Ilvane]

Just because the DNA didn't match doesn't mean he didn't do it.

DNA is not infallible.

Edited to add: I want to know how he knew so much about the scene and what happened if he didn't have anything to do with it.

Angela

[zhelas]

There seems to be too many holes in his story and with out the DNA he most likely will not be charged.

They guy is still sick. If you say a lie enough times in your head you will believe it to be the truth over time.

[Sean of the Thread]

The guy made it up so the US would pull him from there and he could dodge the charges he was facing there all the time knowing the dna would set him free.

[Bobmuhthol]

<<DNA is not infallible.>>

You're stupid.

[Ilvane]

I know you know everything, Bob..but..considering in this case they took it off of evidence that was very OLD and pretty imperfectly preserved, it's not infallible.

Angela

[Bobmuhthol]

...

That implies that DNA changes over time, and you're calling evidence that originated 10 years ago OLD evidence, which makes very very little sense in terms of DNA evidence.

[Ilvane]

"Investigators have said that some DNA was too degraded to use as evidence, but that some was of sufficient quality to give the FBI in 2003."

So yeah. This guy is a sicko regardless. I was hoping they had caught the killer, myself though.

[Artha]

Haha her mom still did it.

[Bobmuhthol]

<<"Investigators have said that some DNA was too degraded to use as evidence, but that some was of sufficient quality to give the FBI in 2003.">>

DNA degrades when something makes it degrade. Time plays a smaller role than contaminants. That also has nothing to do with claiming the infallibility of DNA (which doesn't make sense in the first place), as the DNA did not change to become another person's, it just degraded like all other degradable matter would.

<<So yeah. This guy is a sicko regardless.>>

John Karr rules.

<<Haha her mom still did it.>>

Yes.

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

I do, especially when I can't recall in the back or front of my mind the last time a white boy, black girl, or black boy were given such worldwide media attention after their death and/or disappearance.


Precious Doe anyone?

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

I, almost always, feel that anyone who does sick things to children should just be killed. They're fucked up in the head. You can't fix that shit.

I'm with you on this, but I got a step further and apply it to people who torture animals as well.

[El Burro]

They should give him back to thailand.

[Bobmuhthol]

They should give him to California because he's wanted for 5 counts of child pornography.

[Stanley Burrell]

They should give him to California because he's wanted for 5 counts of child pornography.

QFT!

I'm thinking his retirement plan involves a footnote regarding the Neverland Ranch...

[Tsa`ah]

DNA degrades when something makes it degrade. Time plays a smaller role than contaminants. That also has nothing to do with claiming the infallibility of DNA (which doesn't make sense in the first place), as the DNA did not change to become another person's, it just degraded like all other degradable matter would.

Time is a key factor when it comes to matching DNA to a specific person. DNA is organic. Unless a sample is frozen in the most pristine manner, it will degrade over time. Contaminants play the smaller role since time is the decisive factor in how badly any contaminant can degrade a given sample.

Her statement was absolutely true, DNA is not infallible.

Regarding the actual case ... the guy claimed to have drugged and raped her. Autopsy reports show neither happened. He also claimed he kidnapped her after school ... she came up missing during Christmass break.

I gave up watching the coverage about the time that his ex wife claimed he wasn't even in CO when it happened and a brother claimed to have proof that his claims were false.

I'm sorry, the parents did it.

[StrayRogue]

Looks like some people in this thread will be eating humble pie tonight.

[DeV]

Precious Doe anyone?A case in which the community as a whole played a much bigger role than the media at large, but a decent example nonetheless.


This guy is still a sick ass perv who has some other charges to face in CA. A man who'd confess to such a heinus crime must have some other skeletons in his closet waiting to be discovered.

[Skirmisher]

Just throw him in jail now as a pre-emptive strike.

If he didnt molest her, he did someone else or will.

He's a freak.

I have spoken.

[Gan]

I also think that the media, then and now, needs a reality check in how they headline popular topics/stories.

I cant help but get the feeling that many folks, including me, were only fed information in the news reports, that would incite or inflame opinion as to this guys guilt. That bothers me. :(

[StrayRogue]

Just throw him in jail now as a pre-emptive strike.

If he didnt molest her, he did someone else or will.

He's a freak.

I have spoken.

Gotta love the logical, innocent before guilty concept of America. Gotta love it.

[Ilvane]

That guy is not an innocent man..he's a sicko.

Anyone who could obsess about a girl like he did is sick.

:shiver:

Angela

[DeV]

Not to mention he ADMITTED to committing the crime before anyone ever jumped on a bandwagon condemning him for doing so. Who would admit to doing something that sick, wtf.

[Skirmisher]

Stray...please troll someone else.

[Latrinsorm]

Not to mention he ADMITTED to committing the crime before anyone ever jumped on a bandwagon condemning him for doing so. Who would admit to doing something that sick, wtf.Obviously someone who doesn't need mental help of any kind. Obviously someone who we should just throw into a cage somewhere. Obviously someone we should punish via a disgusting end-run around the 8th amendment.

[Parkbandit]

Gotta love the logical, innocent before guilty concept of America. Gotta love it.


Yea.. let's just send him to England and let them deal with it.

Innocent? Innocent would be the police going after him for a crime he didn't commit... instead he went after the police for a crime he supposedly didn't commit.

He's a fucking sick fucking piece of human trash that this planet would be much better off without. I can only hope that he is raped so much in jail that his bowels fall out of his ass and he dies a slow, miserable and painful death.

[DeV]

Obviously someone who doesn't need mental help of any kind. Obviously someone who we should just throw into a cage somewhere. Obviously someone we should punish via a disgusting end-run around the 8th amendment.I think you are just the man for the job. :yes:

[StrayRogue]

Stray...please troll someone else.

Trust me, if being retarded was a criminal offense, you'd have been locked up long ago.

[Skirmisher]

Trust me, if being retarded was a criminal offense, you'd have been locked up long ago.

And trust me, I give your opinion every bit of weight it deserves.