Lockpicking?

[DrZaius]

So, I've started a little rogue to help pick my boxes. He's 8 now, 3x'd in Picking and Disarm, and 2x'd in perception. I'm just curious what train boxes he'll be able to get at 8, 12, 15, and 20. I've never really played a locksmith before (Most of my rogues have been pure hunters), so I'm pretty much in the dark here. Obviously the box is dependant on what type of creature it's from (i.e. spectral fisherman boxes are a heck of a lot harder than lesser orcs); but just a general guideline would be great.

[Stretch]

Assuming you have 27 ranks, you can use a kelyn lockpick (vaalin requires 50 ranks), which provides a 2.4 modifier on your skill.

Your max lock with a copper lockpick (1.0 modifier) is going to be your lockpick skill + DEX bonus. So for you, 111 + DEX bonus. Your max lock with a kelyn lockpick will be (111 + DEX bonus) * 2.4. So I'd say it would be safe to shoot for boxes below -250, that you can get fairly reliably.

Same basic formula for max trap, disarm skill + DEX bonus. Locks and traps generally are in the same range of difficulty, except for scales traps. I would say you should be set for traps around -80 or so, which is at the low end of things.

Not sure what locks are like on low level things now, but as a tripler, you should very much be able to pick your own shit for a long time, and above your head as well. At level 20, assuming 63 ranks, your max lock would be -408, plus whatever your DEX bonus is. More than enough for arch wights and such.

[DrZaius]

Thanks- so the lockpick you can use is based on your ranks, not your level? What would you reccomend picking with; just a copper to start, and maybe a glaes or a kelyn if the box is tougher?

[drigore]

This is the list from QRS. Just something quick to give you start.

Lockpick Modifier Ranks Price Quality Strength Bonus
Copper 1.00 0 100 Crude Poor Worst
Brass 1.00 0 250 Crude Very Weak Poor
Steel 1.10 1 500 Common Average Average
Ivory 1.20 1 750 Common Above Average Average
Gold 1.20 3 2000 Common Weak Average
Silver 1.30 3 2500 Common Average Average
Ora 1.55 5 5000 Good Strong Average
Mithril 1.45 5 6000 Good Very Strong Average
Glaes 1.60 8 9500 Good Incredible Above Average
Laje 1.75 12 17000 Good Average Very Good
Alum 2.30 16 23000 Prof. Very Weak Excellent
Vultite 1.80 20 30000 Prof. Average Above Average
Rolaren 1.90 20 36000 Prof. Very Strong Excellent
Veniom 2.20 25 50000 Superb Excellent Excellent
Kelyn 2.40 25 62000 Superb Excellent Incredible
Invar 2.25 35 75000 Superb Incredible Excellent
Golvern 2.30 40 95000 Superb Highest Excellent
Vaalin 2.50 50 125000 Superb Incredible Highest

Not posted in the best form, but you get the idea.

[mgoddess]

For the record, my level 26 rogue who 2x's in Picking/Disarming/Perception is able to pick 95% of the boxes from critter's in River's Rest (the oldest there being hags at 42)....this is with self-cast lore, which seems to help tons.

[AestheticDeath]

Doesn't wisdom factor into picking or disarming somewhere?

[Alfster]

Doesn't wisdom factor into picking or disarming somewhere?

not since gs4

[DrZaius]

Yeah, I'll have self lore by 21, so I imagine that's gonna help a lot with 3x picking. Plus, he's *competent* at hunting, so I'm liking him so far. Also, he's a dwarf :)

[Drew]

This is the list from QRS. Just something quick to give you start.

Lockpick Modifier Ranks Price Quality Strength Bonus
Copper 1.00 0 100 Crude Poor Worst
Brass 1.00 0 250 Crude Very Weak Poor
Steel 1.10 1 500 Common Average Average
Ivory 1.20 1 750 Common Above Average Average
Gold 1.20 3 2000 Common Weak Average
Silver 1.30 3 2500 Common Average Average
Ora 1.55 5 5000 Good Strong Average
Mithril 1.45 5 6000 Good Very Strong Average
Glaes 1.60 8 9500 Good Incredible Above Average
Laje 1.75 12 17000 Good Average Very Good
Alum 2.30 16 23000 Prof. Very Weak Excellent
Vultite 1.80 20 30000 Prof. Average Above Average
Rolaren 1.90 20 36000 Prof. Very Strong Excellent
Veniom 2.20 25 50000 Superb Excellent Excellent
Kelyn 2.40 25 62000 Superb Excellent Incredible
Invar 2.25 35 75000 Superb Incredible Excellent
Golvern 2.30 40 95000 Superb Highest Excellent
Vaalin 2.50 50 125000 Superb Incredible Highest

Not posted in the best form, but you get the idea.


What does the ranks section mean? How many ranks of picking skill you need to use the pick effectively?

[AestheticDeath]

to use it at all i believe, try getting someone with less then 50 ranks to use a vaalin pick

[Drew]

to use it at all i believe, try getting someone with less then 50 ranks to use a vaalin pick



I tried with someone with 5 ranks to use Alum and it snapped and said you feel you can't full use this lockpick. Mithril didn't give that message.

[AestheticDeath]

yeah mithril only needs 5 ranks, and alum is very weak.

[mgoddess]

You can use any lockpick at any level. The ranks in the QRS chart is how many picking ranks you need to get the full bonus. (For instance, when my rogue went from 3x picking to 2x picking, she was used to using vaalin. After the change, she couldn't use it to it's fullest bonus for a train or two...she still did use it, she just didn't get as much of a modifier from it.)

[Gan]

Assuming you have 27 ranks, you can use a kelyn lockpick (vaalin requires 50 ranks), which provides a 2.4 modifier on your skill.

Your max lock with a copper lockpick (1.0 modifier) is going to be your lockpick skill + DEX bonus. So for you, 111 + DEX bonus. Your max lock with a kelyn lockpick will be (111 + DEX bonus) * 2.4. So I'd say it would be safe to shoot for boxes below -250, that you can get fairly reliably.

Same basic formula for max trap, disarm skill + DEX bonus. Locks and traps generally are in the same range of difficulty, except for scales traps. I would say you should be set for traps around -80 or so, which is at the low end of things.

Not sure what locks are like on low level things now, but as a tripler, you should very much be able to pick your own shit for a long time, and above your head as well. At level 20, assuming 63 ranks, your max lock would be -408, plus whatever your DEX bonus is. More than enough for arch wights and such.

Great formula, do you have the adds for lores?

[Gammit]

Is there a list anywhere that has rough correspondence of creatures to box difficulty?

As far as that goes, is there a comprehensive and relatively up-to-date lockpicking guide anywhere, or have they all disappeared into the ether?

[Gan]

?locks on psinet has lock range info but not coorelated with critter levels.

Porcell had a good add to one of the info scripts (I'll see if I can dig it up) and there are a few up to date locksmith guides on dedicated gemstone websites out there.

http://www.ladytaylir.netfirms.com/lockpick.html

http://www.ladytaylir.netfirms.com/trap.html

.qrs locks
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Lock Description (IC) Lock Rating (OOC)
Primitive .................. -5 to -35
Rudimentary ............... -40 to -75
Very Basic ................ -80 to -115
Easy ..................... -120 to -155
Simple ................... -160 to -195
Fairly Simple ............ -200 to -235
Tricky ................... -240 to -275
Somewhat Difficult ....... -280 to -315
Moderately Difficult ..... -320 to -355
Difficult ................ -360 to -395
Very Difficult ........... -400 to -435
Intricate ................ -440 to -475
Very Intricate ........... -480 to -515
Extremely Difficult ...... -520 to -555
Absurdly Difficult ....... -560 to -595
Extremely Complicated .... -600 to -635
Amazingly Well-Crafted ... -640 to -675
Masterfully Crafted ...... -680 to -715
Incredibly Intricate ..... -720 to -755
Masterfully Intricate .... -760 to -795
Amazingly Difficult ...... -800 to -835
Unbelievably Intricate ... -840 to -875
Astoundingly Complex ..... -880 to -915
Unbelievably Complicated . -920+

.qrs picks
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Lockpick Modifier Ranks Price Quality Strength Bonus Location
Copper 1.00 0 100 Crude Poor Worst WN/Ice/Teras
Brass 1.00 0 250 Crude Very Weak Poor SH
Steel 1.10 1 500 Common Average Average WN/Ice/Teras
Ivory 1.20 1 750 Common Above Average Average SH
Gold 1.20 3 2000 Common Weak Average WN/Ice
Silver 1.30 3 2500 Common Average Average SH/Teras
Ora 1.55 5 5000 Good Strong Average WN/SH/Ice
Mithril 1.45 5 6000 Good Very Strong Average WN/SH/Ice/Teras
Glaes 1.60 8 9500 Good Incredible Above Average WN/SH/Ice/Teras
Laje 1.75 12 17000 Good Average Very Good SH
Alum 2.30 16 23000 Prof. Very Weak Excellent WN/Ice/Teras
Vultite 1.80 20 30000 Prof. Average Above Average Teras
Rolaren 1.90 20 36000 Prof. Very Strong Excellent WN/Ice
Veniom 2.20 25 50000 Superb Excellent Excellent Teras
Kelyn 2.40 25 62000 Superb Excellent Incredible WN
Invar 2.25 35 75000 Superb Incredible Excellent WN/Ice/Teras
Golvern 2.30 40 95000 Superb Highest Excellent Merchant Only?
Vaalin 2.50 50 125000 Superb Incredible Highest Guilds

.qrs picks1
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Max Lock = (lockpick skill + wisdom bonus + lore bonus) * modifier
Lock Lore Bonus = Level/2 + Skill Bonus/10 + (Dex Bonus + Wisdom Bonus)/4
If not self-cast, base off caster's skill, divide by 2.
Max Trap = disarm skill + wisdom bonus + lore bonus
Trap Lore Bonus = Level/2 + Skill Bonus/10 + (Ref Bonus + Dis Bonus)/4
Divide this by 2 if not Self Cast (& base it off the casters skill or your own if from an imbed).

**I dont know how up to date those formulas are.

>?locks
You focus your mind and search for "locks" on the PsiNet Library.
[=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=]
Article "Locks" [AID #509]
Range Rating
5-35 Primitive
40-75 Rudimentary
80-115 Extremely Easy
120-155 Very Easy
160-195 Easy
200-235 Very Basic
240-275 Fairly Easy
280-315 Simple
320-355 Fairly Simple
360-395 Fairly Plain
400-435 Moderately Well-Crafted
440-475 Well-Crafted
480-515 Tricky
520-555 Somewhat Difficult
560-595 Moderately Difficult
600-635 Very Well-Crafted
640-675 Difficult
680-715 Extremely Well-Crafted
720-755 Very Difficult
760-795 Fairly Complicated
800-835 Intricate
840-875 Amazingly Well-Crafted
880-915 Very Complex
920-955 Impressively Complicated
960-995 Amazingly Intricate
1000-1035 Extremely Difficult
1040-1075 Extremely Complex
1080-1115 Masterfully Well-Crafted
1120-1155 Amazingly Complicated
1160-1195 Astoundingly Complex
1200-1235 Incredibly Intricate
1240-1275 Absurdly Well-Crafted
1280-1315 Exceedingly Complex
1320-1355 Absurdly Difficult
1360-1395 Unbelievably Complicated
1400-1435 Masterfully Intricate
[=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=]

[Gammit]

Awesome! Thanks.

[fallenSaint]

http://www.tsoran.com/locks.html

[Gammit]

I just failed with 48 (148 bonus) ranks of disarm and a 23 dex bonus on a -113 trap at the well. Are the rolls open-ended, or is there another factor (for instance, is the well poorly lit)?

[stonegonad]

those pick bonuses still accurate?

[DaCapn]

Is there a list anywhere that has rough correspondence of creatures to box difficulty?

There's not very good correlation here in the first place. You can make rough guesses but level is sort of convoluted with how crafty the creature is (i.e. spellcasting undead usually have harder locks/traps than giants of the same level). I've picked near cap grimswarm boxes and they were qualitatively on par with seekers. And of course, there's the fact that you might get a box from the rift with a -5 lock.