Socerer's uniqueness

[Valgaav]

I'm finding it harder and harder to see what makes a sorcerer unique.
In unique I mean something that defines the sorcerers class
first lets take out the attack spells and defense spells as those are things every class has. Attack and Defense is something that every class in the game possesses evenly now. Since the conception of GSIV there has been a general thought that every class should have equal killing power.

In the past I felt that sorcerers were unique in our ability to kill fast in maybe two , three cast at most. But now thats something every spell casting class can do, even empaths.

So other then killing what else do sorcerers do? Scroll infusion? A skill similiar to the wizards charge item.

eye spy now thats something we have thats unique. but isnt that all just another pet spell. one of three that we have now.

pet spells are something I find practically useless in it's current form, as our pets cant drag or be used to open portals, perserve our dead bodies and send for help.

sure we have animate dead but thats another pet spell after the last pet spell we gotten. two in a row. and it seems our next one is going to be a major pet spell. but in all truthfulness how useful are pets.I find them more of a silver drain then of any true use.

now the new spell, the intra/inter realm travel spell. I tell you, other then RR and Teras I can get anywhere I need to go in the game in 10 minutes script running. And really do I really need to pay 50k to teleport to RR in a second and come back? Whats there that I can't wait for the boat?This spell is like animate dead.Limited Usefullness. True its a nifty skill, but its just pretty fluff like minor demons.

Sure all the changes to phase,corrupt essense,blood burst, and limb disruption were nice but in the end the changes were fluff.

We've become a fluff class.

When every class becomes equal in killing power we lose our uniqueness. What made a sorcerer unique was his power to destroy alot and destroy fast.
In the beginning every class had their uniqueness that helped everyone else

Warrior to assess.(only way to accurately have game tell you weighting/padding)
Rogue to pick(only way to get some boxes opened)
Bard to sing(only way to accurately have game tell you the magical properties
of an item)
Ranger to skin,forage(only one with the spell making them the potential best)
empath to heal(only ones with this skill)
clerics to raise(only one with this skill)
wizards to enchant(may not be a skill but only player spell that permanently adds to AS/DS qualities of an item)

but the sorcerer was always the one left out in that club
the sorcerer only had the skills to destroy.

with everyone on equal grounds in the skills to destroy now, the sorcerer class is forced to find new ways to become a unique beneficial member of GSIV society. And currently we've become a pet class with alot of fluff.

Edit:I realized I spelled sorcerer in the title wrong, but this was very early in the morning for me and I cant edit the title

[Asha]

There's been many many times I've felt this way too. Many of our spells have no cast description, just '' you gesture at critter/player '' thus giving them no dramatic effects.
When empaths were upgraded to master hunters alongside the other professions, they seemed to have spells which were more sorcererous in essense. Such as Empathis Assault with it's double strike over two tables in one cast. It's ability to tap into the creature and destroy it from the inside.
I could go on about how empaths really have stepped up to stand beside sorcerers on the hunting effectiveness scale, but that's not the issue entirely.
The issue is we've been given too many utility typed spells.
And I know Jesse or Fallen will probably slap my ass for saying this.. but these utility spells do not add to any destructive power and therefore do not create fear.
Sorcerous teleportation with 740 is great when I want to travel damn far for 50k. Maybe I'll cast that once a week?.
I haven't used 702 or 710 for about 20 trains and probably never will again.
I have never, used 716 in the hunt, same as 725 and 730.
Sure 725 and 730 are awesome RP tools, but they're nothing to be feared are they.
Long story short...
Sorcerers are not meant to be awesome and frightening anymore. The only way you can inspire that in other players is by making them unbelievably too powerful, and as you say have them kill many things in one cast.
But that reality was shattered when the nerfings of our spells began. You just can't have a profession who're so powerful anyone will shit themselves in their presence.

[Medri]

I remember an introduction to Gemstone III back in the AOL days. I was a lowly thief running around Wehnimer's under about 5 levels. I stumbled across a heavy backpack that was on the ground and picked it up... and ran with it =D

the next thing I remember is being chased around town by a Sorceress who blew up one of my legs, stunning me, then blew up my arm.

I was scared of Sorc's after that - they still instill this eerie demonic tone for me whenever I encounter one ... and I -never- want to piss one off, again.

That's how sorcerors are unique to me.

[Fallen]

Think Scroll Infusion.


I will add my thoughts to this thread in detail ASAP.

[Daniel]

Wow. SHUT THE FUCK UP YOU PUSSY.

[Numbers]

I agree with you in some ways, and disagree in others.

When I started playing, Sorcerers were very rare. Only about a dozen titled ones in the game. Why? They were an absolute pain in the ass to level up during the early levels. Limited mana supply, twisted wands didn't exist yet. A Sorcerer was essentially a sword/boar user until level 12 or so. That sounds low now, but remember that this was back when level 20 was considered high, and level 50 was considered god-like.

Also back then, most of our spells were worthless. We essentially had two reliable attack spells: Mana Disruption and Dark Catalyst. But in general, it was all we needed, since they were incredibly powerful. MD could crit almost anything, and DC could destroy almost anything. The trade-off for this was that, aside from Imbed, we had no utility whatsoever. We were a pure hunting class, which I was fine with. But, we were also a cookie-cutter class. Very little diversity between training plans.

Then Growing Pains hit, and Warden puked all over the game. Sorcerers were deemed too powerful, and they got nerfed hardcore. Warden wanted MD changed to be on par with 903, DC was changed to return less mana, do no damage on creatures with no mana, and have fewer flares. In the meantime, we were given nothing in return. Little by little new things were added. Disintegrate, focused maelstrom and implosion, targetted limb disruption, beefed up torment and nightmare. It couldn't replace the old MD and DC, but it at least let us hunt. But not nearly as efficiently as we could.

Then we got our utility spells. This is where a lot of opinions vary. Minor summoning is all but worthless RP fluff. The ONLY useful demons are abyran'sa (for breaking sancts) and aishan (for finding invisible people.) Other than that, there's no point to them, they're about 500 silver per summon, and they require hundreds of hours in guild skill work just to be able to bring into town. Animate dead seems to be more trouble than it's worth. First you need to collect the water, the troll blood, the moonflowers, and then make the crystals. Then, unless you're doubled in Necromancy, before you go out hunting, you need to go to a lower level area to animate something within your MAL, which costs a good gem. Then you go out to your hunting area where you could have probably killed things more efficiently than without the animate. Hunting with an animate requires you to change your strategies, going for knockdowns rather than quick kills. And you'll be lucky if the animate lasts longer than one hunt.

Scroll infusion is a good spell, but very expensive to use, and very unpredictable. Planar shift I think is an excellent spell, but partially situational. For me, the only inter-realm transports I'd ever make would be to and from Teras (if I was in a rush of some sort) or to the Nations and back (again, only if I was in a rush.) Other cities I can just script to and be there within 1 to 5 minutes. Many Sorcerers are hopping back and forth between the Nations and the Landing several times a day, which I'm sure is great for such wealthy people. But this game has an incredibly large discrepancy in wealth. The cost of the high quality chalk is high enough for me to not want to waste it needlessly, as I'm sure it is for a majority of other Sorcerers.

In any case, while we're not as efficient in hunting as we used to be, the profession is far more fleshed out and diverse than it once was. In most cases, Sorcerers require strategy to hunt now instead of running around casting the same spell at a creature (focused imploders excluded.) While I think that's a good thing and all, there are plenty of times where I miss the old DC. That was the primary reason why I originally struggled through the lower levels; for that instant cast DC we got at level 25. In ways, the changes have made me find hunting far more tedious than I'd like it to be, which is probably why I rarely hunt with my Sorcerer anymore.

[Daniel]

When I started playing, Sorcerers were very rare. Only about a dozen titled ones in the game
^

When the fuck was this?

[Necromancer]

Having started in the sorcery heyday and played through all of the phases up until today, I can definitely say that sorcery is far better than it ever was.

But let's address this issue of being unique. Basically the first poster boiled everything down to attack spells, defense spells, pet spells, and then utility (fluff) spells. The very start of your analysis already defeated any chance for the profession to come across as vibrant and unique. What kind of spell would fall outside of these categories?

So let's complicate things, shall we? Attack spells. Yes, every pure has them now. Empaths have two attack spells on their empath list. In fact, they have more attack spells on their secondary lists than on their primary. And the odds of having a high enough CS to use web (like anyone would use that anyway) or unbalance seems unlikely. They will go their entire hunting lives focusing mainly on bind, empathic assault, empathic link (utility), and bone shatter. Not a very interesting hunting life, if you ask me. Plus these spells are highly constrained in which creature types they work on.

Clerics have smite/bane, holy bolt, fervant reproach, divine fury, and divine wrath, so they're really in a better boat than empaths. All of these spells will allow them to do damage, but only two of them are universal. The other three are highly constrained in which creature types they can be used on.

Wizards have a full arsenal of attack spells. Lucky them. Most of them are bolt spells, however, which means they're just variations on an identical theme.

Sorcerers have mana disruption, disintigrate, pain infliction, energy maelstrom, evil eye, blood burst, torment, dark catalyst, and implosion to do damage. Only two of these spells are constrained (BB and DC), but by the last 50 levels of the game a good 2/3 of your creatures can be DC'd and about as many can be BB'd. The end result, however, is a full arsenal of unique killing and damaging spells. And, of course, no profession can light a candle to a sorcerer's disabling spells: Corrupt Essence (which every profession would kill for), Mind Jolt (likewise), Limb Disruption, Quake, Nightmare (has its uses), Curse (really six spells in one), and Evil Eye (disabler and killer). Also, to note, sorcerers are the only profession in the game that can kill you from another room or can kill in a sanctuary.

You simplify attack spells far too much. What makes a sorcerer unique in this regard is that their attack spells are so diverse that they can find at least one appropriate and effective attack spell for any given situation. (that has not been made specifically sorcerer proof)

Defense spells in your post were all put in the same bland category. And yes, there is no defensive spell quite like Cloak of Shadows in Gemstone. Certainly wizards have stone skin, which affords moderate damage padding. And of course Rangers have Wall of Thorns, but without the appropriate Assume Aspect and/or lore training, the poison of the thorns is too slow acting to be of much use. Cloak of Shadows, however, allows you to disable or even kill an attacking creature , effectively saving your life. And if you know how to use it, it does save your life often over a lifetime. This is a unique aspect of sorcery, the defense spell that is also a highly effective attack spell.

You say blood burst lore modifiers are fluff. There are only three professions in the game that can heal themselves. Empaths, Paladins, and Sorcerers. Among these, only sorcerers can heal themselves while simultaneously damaging another creature/player. This is a unique quality of the profession.

Phase. Phase allows a sorcerer to crit kill an undead creature. Only two professions can claim this, clerics (a 5% chance with every 302 cast) and sorcerers (which allows crit potential using any of their attack spells). It also allows a sorcerer to effectively overcome encumbrance, which is a direct factor in your ability to survive combat maneuvers. No other pure can claim this except for the wizard profession, and disks cannot be used to reduce encumbrance from items of value (you would never leave 1/4 of your inventory in a disk unless you really loved risk).

Scroll Infusion is nothing like charge item, incidently. Scrolls are much more common, for one. And infusing scrolls is much easier at higher levels. This spell basically gives you access to almost every level 1-20 spell in the game. That's nothing to sneeze at. I'd highly suggest learning how to use this.

And really, don't combine all pet spells together. Demons, Animates, Swords, Companions, Familiars, and Eyes are very different from one another. If you know how to use Animates and Demons correctly, they're incredibly powerful. In fact, I suggest hunting a claidh-wielding animate with a ranger and their companion just to see the shame on the ranger's face as your animate wipes the floor with everything, and their companion plinks away. And if you know your local wildlife, you can use this spell to get unlimited spellups with useful spells like strength, mobility, thurfel's ward, etc without having to spell beg like everyone else.

Plus Animate Dead lets you walk a body back to wherever you need. This isn't a "pet" spell that copies any other spell. Its utility AND combat power outdo any other pet spells that combine the two.

I could go on. But the point is that when you start looking at the details. Sorcery is quite different from other professions. We're quite unique. And, frankly, we're more powerful than ever. Especially against other professions.

[Sean of the Thread]

AD= not worth the trouble or training.

Sorc Guild = joke (see demons)

Scroll Infusion = great if your a pure fucking magically trained sorc.. but forget it if you're not a staff wielder.

Transport = silver sink. Prolly switching up the travel paths recently had something to do with that as well.

Demons = not worth it (guild also not worth it because of this)

Cloak of shadows = requires high training in lore to not be a threat to yourself or ensure working correctly all the time.. training points better off spent in a more useful area.


I would love to see ensorcell.

[Numbers]

When the fuck was this?

Early 90's.

[Makkah]

ROFL @ this thread...

As Daniel wholeheartedly stated:

STFU PUSSY

[zhelas]

I agree with Necromancer. I stepped away from the game when it was going through growing pains. After talking to some of my friends, they convinced me to come back. I think the Sorcery profession is much richer and complete then it was 5 to 6 years ago. Sure improvements can be done. I love Animate Dead. I have no issues in the collection of Moonflowers, trolls blood and sea water. Making the crystals is easy. I do it when i get back from a hunt. There is nothing more satisfying than bringing in an animate into town and getting the looks from others. Or having a corpse follow its Master wanting the gift of life from the wench Lorminstra.

[Fallen]

Someone start a thread about whatever the hell Makkah cares about so we can shit all over it.

[Apathy]

I think it's nice not to see every sorcerer as a triple trained dark elf with a bunch of fash'lo'nae fluff crap all over their body.

The only thing I miss about old sorcery is Romulus.

[Drew]

Sorcerers also still have the most ridiculously overpowered spell in the game in implosion.

[Fallen]

Sadly, I never have time anymore to give threads that catch my interest the attention they deserve. I will instead respond to the concerns of the originator of the thread. If I echo someone else's thoughts already posted in a later response, I apologize.

----

Your worries and concerns have been repeated by many others on the official boards, to the actual inclusion of some GMs. Many believe that sorcerers used to be defined as, "The masters of Destruction". This was their sole sphere of influence, and they most certainly were capable of living up to it.

However, with Growing Pains and other changes, this ideal became less and less true. While we maintained our ability to hunt effectively, our "Overkill factor" became ever less apparent. Further, all other profession have reached a point where they are completely viable hunters, where once this was simply not the case. Some of these professions' powers increased so much so that they rival, if not surpass sorcerers in sheer killing speed, style, and efficiency.

That being said, what has been done to correct this problem? The first real bone that was thrown our way was and still is Focused Implosion (well, Focused Maelstrom too). This secures our ability to kill nearly anything quickly, and somewhat efficiently. However, using that spell alone almost seems like cheating, and because of that, it becomes a nonfactor at times when judging the strengths/weaknesses of the profession.

Next, and to this day, the utlilities have been piled on. Sacrifice, Scroll infusion, Minor Summoning (+ Illusions), Animate Dead, and now Planar Shift. As others have commented, some of these additions are met with great success, and some are truly lacklaster. I could expound upon each of these in turn, though others have already done so, and opinions will vary.

The point remains, do any of the above spells truly define our craft? No. Some of these abilities still need tweaking, Animate Dead and Minor Summoning coming in at the most lacklaster. Steps have already been made in this regard, with Animates actually being able to use maneuver attacks (Only BCS, and some are still broken), and Demons becoming refreshable and allowed permits.

My opinion of the situation is this: If you come to know and master EVERY SINGLE aspect of the sorcerous profession, you can truly have a uniquely powerful character type that is simply a joy to play. As I said, no single spell or ability of ours defines us, though when our abilities are combined, we as a class can do amazing things.

Things still to come:

AD Tweaks
True Demonic Summoning
Disease Bolt (hopefully)
Enscorcell (sp)

Other than Demonic Summoning, none of those abilities have the potential to become our ONE defining characteristic.

Although anyone can successfuly level a sorcerer, Sorcery itself is not for the casual player. I believe takes a firm mastery of the art to truly find the essense of the Craft.

Evarin and his Mis'ri

[Asha]

Don't forget the manouver dodge that phase (704) will eventually bring.
That's gonna be hot.

[Fallen]

Don't forget the manouver dodge that phase (704) will eventually bring.
That's gonna be hot. >>

Sorcerers are already BAMFs (Thanks Mekthros, Dane) in all combat situations due to Scroll infusion and CoS, This will simply make us that much more powerful. Add to this an actual in-house Bolt spell? ::Shrug::

I think we are doing pretty damn good.

[Necromancer]

Doubt we're getting Ensorcell. Nilven said on the officials that he wanted us to have one post 20 spell with no components. That would pretty much preclude ensorcell. Fortunately, alchemy can very well takes its place, and it won't use up a spell slot.

Oh, and for those who missed the logical leap I made, remember that 750 is going to have components.

[zhelas]

Those Sorcery workshops have been helpful too. Cheers to the folks who organized them.

[Sean of the Thread]

Sorcerers also still have the most ridiculously overpowered spell in the game in implosion.


HAHAHAH @ overpowered.

[zhelas]

Common don't you like blasting things into tiny bits and not get any loot??

[Sean of the Thread]

Common don't you like blasting things into tiny bits and not get any loot??

And only when fully trained for it at that.

[Back]

Although anyone can successfuly level a sorcerer, Sorcery itself is not for the casual player. I believe takes a firm mastery of the art to truly find the essense of the Craft.

Evarin and his Mis'ri

You know, I read this last part then suddenly...

lightning bolt! lightning bolt! lightning bolt!

popped into my head. Random thought processes I cannot control.

[Daniel]

Early 90's.

Then you're obviously on crack. Sorcerors have *always* been the easiet profession to level through hunting. Always.

The only professor that has had it easier is Empaths, and thats because they could sit on their asses and heal.

There might have been only a few dozen of Sorceror lords in the early 90's than you can bet your ass that there were far less of every other professor.

You are completely full of shit. Sorcerors crying about their position in gemstone is like a Kennedy crying because of unfair nepotism.

[Sean of the Thread]

Then you're obviously on crack. Sorcerors have *always* been the easiet profession to level through hunting. Always.

The only professor that has had it easier is Empaths, and thats because they could sit on their asses and heal.

There might have been only a few dozen of Sorceror lords in the early 90's than you can bet your ass that there were far less of every other professor.

You are completely full of shit. Sorcerors crying about their position in gemstone is like a Kennedy crying because of unfair nepotism.

Personally I'd have to disagree here.. first 20 levels or so are a major pain in the ass for sorcs.. and I've played all but cleric past that point.

Back in the early 90's to late 90's becoming lvl 20 was the bomb... and 50 was holy shit that guy is pwning. Getting "Lord" was truly an achievement you looked forward to.

[Asha]

What Xyelin said.
Sorcerers definately have not always been the 'easiet' to level through hunting.

[Makkah]

I've taken a rogue, bard, wizard, paladin, ranger, [and sorcerer] to at least 25 thus far. The sorcerer being the most recent. The sorcerer being the easiest (read as... no deaths yet, no need for outside spells, no need for trans-character coins, etc.)

[Daniel]

Lol okay. Compared to Rangers, Bards, Warriors, Rogues, Clerics (except undead) , empaths they were.

[Numbers]

Then you're obviously on crack. Sorcerors have *always* been the easiet profession to level through hunting. Always.

The only professor that has had it easier is Empaths, and thats because they could sit on their asses and heal.

There might have been only a few dozen of Sorceror lords in the early 90's than you can bet your ass that there were far less of every other professor.

You are completely full of shit. Sorcerors crying about their position in gemstone is like a Kennedy crying because of unfair nepotism.

You really don't have a clue what you're talking about.

Back then, when levelling up in the early levels, Sorcerers had to use sword and board. Sorcerers also generally had low strength stats, which means they didn't have the highest AS when swinging. And, since our only attack spell during those levels was Mana Disruption, and we weren't able to cast that without any prep time until level 7 (six second prep time until you were three levels above a spell, where it would turn to three, and then to zero seconds when you were six levels above a spell), and even then would usually not have enough mana to get through a whole hunt using solely mana disruption (3 mana per level). This meant that Sorcerers couldn't use magic to hunt until level 10 to 13.

And remember, back then, level 20 was considered high. This was back in the $3 an hour days. Not that many people reached level 20. Even fewer ever hoped of reaching 50.

Wizards had wands. Sorcerers didn't train in spell aiming back then, so couldn't use those wands. Empaths didn't hunt. Clerics were normally swingers back then anyway.

You can say I'm full of shit all you want, but I'm quite positive that I'm correct in this matter.

Today Sorcerers are easy to level, definitely. But, that really has nothing to do with my first post, does it?

[Makkah]

Now I'm curious when non-AS wands (namely the old slates and twisteds) were added to that game?

[Numbers]

Twisteds were added in the mid- to late-90's, if I remember. Old slates existed back when I started, but were relatively rare, at least compared to iron, silver, metal, and gold wands, which dropped liked candy.

And the slate wands were also very wonky, much like Disintegrate was when it was first implemented. The damage seemed to have very little to do with the endroll, so you could have an endroll of +198 and wind up doing 20 damage. Conversely, you could have an endroll of +102, and end up getting a full disintegration crit.

[Makkah]

Okay, I'll actually add a constructive post. Aside from the stereotypical RP associated with sorcerers and their constant fucking whining, I've actually been impressed with sorcerers as a profession. They have, in my opinion, the most creative (albeit most complicated going by the components) spells available in the game. I'm currently striving for level 30 so I can get animate dead since my sorcerer is a Necromancer, but I can only imagine how neat that spell will be, EVEN IF IT DOESN'T OFFER THE MOST IMPRESSIVE COMBAT BONUS. So... yea, they may need some work; what profession doesn't? It doesn't limit their niche in the Elanthian society.

rht

PS: My main is a bard, and with that... I can say that I fucking hate you guys for getting a creative AND useful 40th level spell :(

[Asha]

PS: My main is a bard, and with that... I can say that I fucking hate you guys for getting a creative AND useful 40th level spell :(

ROFL @ RHETT!!1

[Sean of the Thread]

I've taken a rogue, bard, wizard, paladin, ranger, [and sorcerer] to at least 25 thus far. The sorcerer being the most recent. The sorcerer being the easiest (read as... no deaths yet, no need for outside spells, no need for trans-character coins, etc.)


May very well be true now in the days of no consequence. Back when I started my sorc I couldn't plan ahead on reallocations or changing stat placement etc.. rolling a viable sorc from start to finish and playing thru 20 levels as such was truly a fucking bitch.

[Jolena]

Personally I'd have to disagree here.. first 20 levels or so are a major pain in the ass for sorcs.. and I've played all but cleric past that point.

Back in the early 90's to late 90's becoming lvl 20 was the bomb... and 50 was holy shit that guy is pwning. Getting "Lord" was truly an achievement you looked forward to.

I definitely agree with this statement. Before there was reallocation, stats being redone, and Lumnis gift, it was very much an achievement. Granted, I didn't play as much when I first started as I do now, but getting to level 20 was a huge deal. People would announce it on the amunet, throw parties for each other in celebration, and generally clap each other on the back at titling. Hitting 50 and seeing "High Lord" was something that most of us just sat back in awe of. It's much *much* easier now.

[Daniel]

High lord is a relatively new thing. The fact is that sorcerors have always been a balanced profession, even if they had to use sword and shield (like every other profession did). Whereas others haven't been.

[Makkah]

To be fair... i've yet to migrate, reallocate, or redistribute statistics...

[Sean of the Thread]

To be fair... i've yet to migrate, reallocate, or redistribute statistics...


But you plan on it I bet? If I was able to lay out my training and stats based on obtaining Lord and not the lvl 100 cap my stats would be based on melee.

Well that would be the smart power level thing to do..

[Numbers]

High lord is a relatively new thing. The fact is that sorcerors have always been a balanced profession, even if they had to use sword and shield (like every other profession did). Whereas others haven't been.

I never said they were unbalanced.

In fact, I'd even say that old-style Sorcerers were overpowered. They could DC almost anything and kill it in one shot for only 6 mana (most everything above level 25 would return 13 mana.)

However, that power was earned for all the shit a Sorcerer had to slog through for the first 15 levels. In fact, I don't know if you ever noticed, but all professions ended up taking that same pattern. Professions that were easier during the early levels (squares) were far weaker at higher levels than professins that were difficult to level (pures, semis.)

These days, I'd say that the game has achieved a pretty nice level of balance. Almost every profession has something that people consider overpowered, and sure, some professions pull ahead of others, but not to the extremes that they used to.

In any case, my point remains that, in the timeframe I originally mentioned, Sorcerers were (by a fairly wide margin,) one of the most difficult professions to level, for reasons I have already stated.

[Sean of the Thread]

I think Chica's face shatter is overpowered.

[Makkah]

<<But you plan on it I bet?>>

Nope. I don't play that way. I'm not one of those douchebags that plays the first 30 levels different then flips shit just to get a headstart. I'm sticking with his training.

[Necromancer]

Yeah, things were definitely harder in the old days. Querthose used a sword and shield exclusively until level 15. As in, I never bothered to cast 702 until that point. And the hump from 15-25 wasn't pretty. But after that, it became smooth sailing. Things are easier now though. TD is a bit more fair and no prep time makes a huge difference.

[Necromancer]

Oh, and thank you for the kudos for the workshops. Lots of people are involved in making them happen. I like to point out to them when I've heard good things. Next one will be April 25th, Sunday 9PM EST. It'll focus on 740, and there will be 40 prizes given out. 20 for level 1-39 and 20 for level 40+

[zhelas]

Oh, and thank you for the kudos for the workshops. Lots of people are involved in making them happen. I like to point out to them when I've heard good things. Next one will be April 25th, Sunday 9PM EST. It'll focus on 740, and there will be 40 prizes given out. 20 for level 1-39 and 20 for level 40+

Great that will help a lot in order to get these mind numbing illusion reps done.

[Shalla]

I don't think I ever slugged with my sorcerer. I think it really depends on what you're hunting. I'm always uphunting 5-10 trains over me, even now. from 1-20 I was a war-sorcerer and my AS was pretty high, and it was before mana disrupt was nerfed in gs3. Maneuvers right now is what kills me, and maybe because I'm way younger than the ithzirs. We'll see how I do when I'm like level.