Suspicion

[Ylena]

I've been talking to my girlfriend at work this morning.

She was paying bills last night and found two motel charges on a credit card statement. They were the only charges for the month, and they were for two motels close to where her husband works.

He claims that the card must have been stolen, and was indignant that she questioned him about it.

She says she hasn't noticed anything different about his behavior recently, but is seriously questioning why a stolen card would only have two motel charges on it.

He called her this morning and told her that he reported the card stolen, they're issuing a new one, and the charges will be reversed.

Would you believe him?

[Augie]

I would go to the motel and ask to see records for the charges for that date. You can see who checked in to the hotel and the signature. Have her explain that she's questioning possible fraudulent charges with her credit card company and needs to see proof.

Once she gets the folio in front of here, there should be some sort of signature on file. She can compare that to her husband's signature.

Another thing she can do is question the people who work there, have her show a picture and see if they remember seeing her husband there. If it's in the course of a month and the motel isn't that busy, you may remember someone coming in.

Hopefully it's not what she thinks, but those are the first things I would do if I were in that situation.

Edited to add: How can he claim that card must be stolen without actually knowing? What was he doing with the card that only THAT one was missing? What about his other cards? Why did he wait until he was questioned to suddenly decide to report it? I mean if I lose one of my credit cards, you bet your ass I'm going to know about it right then and there.

[Edited on 1-4-2006 by Augie]

[CrystalTears]

The hotel won't show you a thing if you weren't the one who checked in. It's against hotel policy and a security risk to show other people information that they had nothing to do with.

Personally, if you're not believing his word and are investigating, there is already a problem and what he did is not the issue anymore.

[Jolena]

I have to disagree to an extent, CT.

Suddenly seeing two odd charges for a motel close to the area where your husband works without any reasoning behind it until you question him is just suspicious. No matter how good your relationship is with your husband or significant other. If your husband didn't tell you about two motel charges, I would think any sane woman would question what it was about and the questions that Augie is asking are very valid.

Trust goes both ways in a relationship and if he is making charges on a credit card (which you assume he did without knowing that it was 'stolen'), that both of you pay for, and not telling you is not being honest.

[Alfster]

Being male, I would not believe him.

Instead, I'd slap him for being a dumbass and using a card his wife could potentially see.

[Wezas]

Stolen credit card - 95% of people go for high price items that they can either keep for themselves or re-sell.

Two seperate motel charges near his work? You can't get much more smoking gun than that.

[Alfster]

Being male, I would not believe him.

Instead, I'd slap him for being a dumbass and using a card his wife could potentially see.

[Aaysia]

Originally posted by Augie
Edited to add: How can he claim that card must be stolen without actually knowing? What was he doing with the card that only THAT one was missing? What about his other cards? Why did he wait until he was questioned to suddenly decide to report it? I mean if I lose one of my credit cards, you bet your ass I'm going to know about it right then and there.

[Edited on 1-4-2006 by Augie]

I was thinking most of these things when I read the story. But.. why the heck do people have more than one credit card? :?: My one and ONLY one is more than enough.

The story seems fishy. If I was in that situation I'd try to believe.. but would have lingering doubts. I'd try to do something similar to what Augie did to ease those doubts.

[Miss X]

He's cheating. He should have used cash. Duh.

[Rowi]

Tell her its fucked its over!! take the same card and all the others MAX em out and leave his arse...........hey happened to me once, just wanna share and spread the pain brother!

Teach his ass to use cash next time, or better yet, dont do it at all......fuckface!

[Brattt8525]

Originally posted by Wezas
Stolen credit card - 95% of people go for high price items that they can either keep for themselves or re-sell.

Two seperate motel charges near his work? You can't get much more smoking gun than that.

Exactly.

LOL@ the maxing of his credit cards then leaving post.

[CrystalTears]

Tell her its fucked its over!! take the same card and all the others MAX em out and leave his arse...........hey happened to me once, just wanna share and spread the pain brother!

Yeah that's a mature response. :rolleyes:

I really should have stayed out of this one because I'm not your average girl who would go ballistic over two motel charges on a card that isn't mine and he denies using in the first place.


Suddenly seeing two odd charges for a motel close to the area where your husband works without any reasoning behind it until you question him is just suspicious.

Exactly. It was sudden. Not something he has done before. Says it was probably stolen. I'd give him that. If it happened AGAIN, however, then I'd be all over it. But for that, nah. Probably not.

[Edited on 1/4/2006 by CrystalTears]

[Skirmisher]

Well one way you will know is if the hotel contests the charges or perhaps has to file a claim for theft of services or the like for having the charges reversed.

My initial guess would be that he's cheating, or some other far less likely thing that requires him to get a hotel room on two seperate occasions and then lie to her about it.

[Fitch]

Just outta Curiousity, were they two seperate times or two days in a row?

personally, I think she knows her husband better than any of us or anyone else for that matter and Guts and instinct is the only thing that can really answer her question. If she truly feels something is there, then she has to confront it. If she doesn't in her heart but is listening to what others say and most people's opinions are gonna be. "is he cheating on you?" .. that could end up making their releationship worse. Bringing negative and doubt in a relationship however unintentional can cause a lot of problems in the long run.

[SpunGirl]

I'd pursue it as aggressively as possible to get to the truth. File a report with the local police department, get the husband to pin down when and where the card was stolen, and demand some kind of investigation by the credit card company.

That should nail the truth, one way or another.

-K

[Snapp]

Like Wezas said, seems like an odd thing to buy with a stolen credit card. There were no other odd charges on it? I would want to believe him, but I would have to have doubts. I trust my boyfriend, but I wouldn't be a total fool ignoring obvious shit like that.

[CrystalTears]

I don't think anyone is saying to ignore it. But getting the police involved? A huge investigation? Just seems a bit much, especially since we don't know what his reaction was, if he was defensive, if he was upset about it, if he's hostile or just being flippant about it. I think only she can see the true signs of lying or not.

The only thing I can think of, if the card wasn't used for anything else, is that he WANTED to get caught somehow. I know some people can be stupid about covering up, but that would be REALLY retardo to not even mingle the charges with other insignificant ones. It was just done too blatant for me to immediately think it was an affair. Maybe I am just weird. Heh.

[Warriorbird]

Alternately he could be buying or selling drugs. Her suspicions may be the wrong suspicions.

[CrystalTears]

Oh sure, add to the worry, WB! Nice going! :P

[Warriorbird]

I find people tend to think that the wrong things are wrong quite a lot, actually.

[Tromp]

Originally posted by Wezas
You can't get much more smoking gun than that.

Something is smoking and I wouldn't say it is just a gun.

I'd have him get the signature for the card and compare it to the sales receipt. If the card is reported stolen the CC company is going to do this anyhow. Plus most hotel/motel have cameras in the lobby. If you get the police to actually investigate the crime you can find out.

[HarmNone]

If the credit card is jointly held, she can call the credit card herself and check on those charges. She has every right to ask for the signed receipts, since her name is on the credit card account.

[Celephais]

Occam's Razor - He's cheating.

[Skeeter]

police aren't doing investigation over something as trivial as that, give me a fucking break.

The guy's banging the secretary and he's too stupid to use cash.

If you don't want to believe this one, just wait, a guy this dumb will do something even more obvious, like banging the baby sitter on the couch.

CT I wish my wife was as guillable as you. Instead I get this :rock:

[Czeska]

I can see a card going missing... you use it at a store and leave it there by accidet, not realizing it cause you haven't used it since.

That aside, What HN said is best. If her name's on it.. request the receipt.

[CrystalTears]

Not gullible, I just choose my battles. I've already stated that if he wants to get his knob polished by some chick, have at it. Quite frankly when you're allowed, you're less likely to do the deed. Even if he did, the allowance is out there and I can't get mad for letting him do it.

Now, I expect him to upfront and be honest about it. I don't want him to scurry around behind my back. If I found this type of thing once and he didn't tell me about it, denies it, cancels his cards as a stolen stint, then fine. That's one. If I see that again, then it's over. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.

Heh, this is probably why I don't do the accounting. I let the accountant do it. If he's being sly, I don't know about it. Then again, he's so good to me I have no reason to suspect him even if he was getting some everyday during lunch. I just don't feel the need to ruin the best relationship of my life over a couple of senseless lays in a motel room. I'll worry when it continues and puts more importance for them than me.

As for this particular situation, since he's already said that he's called them in as stolen and says it wasn't him, why not just let it go for now? The problem is that if you continue to question everything he says and does now, the relationship won't get any better. If you see something suspicious again, then call attention to it.

[Tsa`ah]

Originally posted by Celephais
Occam's Razor - He's cheating.

Doesn't really apply to this situation as there are a few equally simple explanations.

The card was stolen.
He's cheating.
He's a user or dealer.

Cheating is the most likely explanation, but it is not the simplest explanation.

If the account is a joint account, then yes ... she has every right to request/demand to see the folio registration cover, receipt, pre-auth, and authorizations.

Were the guy smart, he would have had his fuck buddy sign.

Considering the nature of the hotel business, no one will recognize his photo unless he frequents the establishment regularly.

It is possible the card was stolen, but two motel charges for the month being the only clue ... not very probable. The assumption that a card thief will stay at the most expensive place a bit flawed to begin with simply because it's potentially out of their element and produces suspicion. Also, the hotel won't contest anything because, stolen or not, they get their money so long as the card was verified and they have a signature on record. Card providers protect the consumers and the businesses that accept their product.

The police won't bother with an investigation unless the provider comes to them with a cards and a purchasing trend that suggests a single person or connected ring of individuals.

The other alternative that was mentioned and also probable would be drug use or dealing. If he's stupid enough to cheat and use a credit card, the alternative is also likely. He's dumb enough to use/deal and use a credit card to do so.

It has to be determined that he's lying before any assumption can be made. That means calling the hotel and requesting copies (that include signatures) ... then go from there.

[Ylena]

Well, those of you who voted for not trusting were right. He finally 'fessed up.

[Sean of the Thread]

Originally posted by Ylena
Well, those of you who voted for not trusting were right. He finally 'fessed up.

Sucks to be her. Wonder what she did to drive him to do it.

Even tho the card is not stolen due to these new details I still vote you/her kill someones cat and smash their laptop.

[Celephais]

HAHA, teh razor wins again! ... er I mean... sorry to hear about that. The guy is an idiot...

wonder if he actually reported the cards stolen... A credit card fraud indictment would add nicely to his punishment.

[Sylvan Dreams]

Originally posted by CrystalTears
The hotel won't show you a thing if you weren't the one who checked in. It's against hotel policy and a security risk to show other people information that they had nothing to do with.

Personally, if you're not believing his word and are investigating, there is already a problem and what he did is not the issue anymore.

March his ass over there and make him ask right in front of you. If he's not hiding anything, he'll do it.

I think it's shady that he didn't 'know' that the card was stolen up until those two 'mysterious' charges appeared on the statement.

[Skeeter]

plz reed in tire thrd b4 tiping

[Caramia]

Originally posted by Skeeter
If you don't want to believe this one, just wait, a guy this dumb will do something even more obvious, like banging the baby sitter on the couch.

You mean like saving logs of cybering on the communal computer?

Keeping graphic emails in the drawer where the checks and envelopes for bill-paying are, as well as love cards?

Telling me it's over, but still accepting her calls, cards, flowers, and a video of her at her wedding to her current husband at the office?

Sneaking off to do errands and laundry that should have taken 15 minutes, but spending an hour on secret phone calls?

Should I even include the night when we were having a couple's skiing weekend at Aspen and he snuck off to get sucked off in the stairwell while I was sleeping?

Oh and the best one is duplicating the cassette of "our songs" and sending them to her with the same poems and dedications.

Idiot. No, I'm not bitter. I got someone better. I pity his new girlfriend, or worse yet, his wife, if he hasn't developed a backbone and stopped being a coward. His excuse was that he loved me but was confused about what direction his life was moving in. I should have told him that if he couldn't find his way with me, he should leave before he treated me with such utter disrespect.

[Skirmisher]

Originally posted by Ylena
Well, those of you who voted for not trusting were right. He finally 'fessed up.

Ah that's too bad Ylena.

I was hoping my gut feeling was wrong.

The big dummy.

Ah well he must have wanted to get caught if he did something so dense, hopefully they can work things through.

[Wezas]

Originally posted by Caramia
<Angst ridden post>

Where have you been?

We've missed them...err... you.

http://www.forum.gsplayers.com/images/upload/Caramia/374.jpg

[Back]

This all reminds me of that episode of Rome, when Pullo went to Octavian to discuss Niobi and Lucius' relationship.

And Octavia of the Juilii's tits.

[HarmNone]

Heh. Sorry, but any guy who's dumb enough to boink some broad in a hotel room near his work, and charge the room on a credit card for which his wife will be paying the bill...well, this guy is certainly dumb enough to bring home a fatal case of cooties. No thanks! :S

[CrystalTears]

Heh, well I did say that the possible reason for doing that was specifically to get caught. And he did.

Geez, people, there are easier ways to break up with someone. Such as, "This isn't working. We need to break up." Sneaking off to boink someone in a nearby motel, make it the sole charge on the card so that it sticks out like a sore thumb, and then lie about it when confronted takes a special kind of mongoloid. Good riddance.

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

Originally posted by Caramia I should have told him that if he couldn't find his way with me, he should leave before he treated me with such utter disrespect.

You should have, and the guy that started this topic is obviously cheating.

I hate cheaters. Get balls and say "it's over, I don't love you", then both folks can move on.

[Jorddyn]

Originally posted by CrystalTears
Geez, people, there are easier ways to break up with someone. Such as, "This isn't working. We need to break up."

Ah, but in the minds of some, that is hurting the other person. It is much less painful to screw some blonde backstage at a George Clinton concert on your SOs birthday with her best friend nearby, and claim you didnt just break it off because you didnt want to hurt them.

Because that doesnt hurt.

Jorddyn

[Rowi]

Run the cards to max!! U gotta love the BK laws now itll fuck em ferever!

then knock his ass out!

[radamanthys]

ya, you're legal to fuck mr. bigDick now... have yerself a good time and blame it on a stolen card!

shitty if he did, shitty if he didn't... good time regardless as above

[Amber]

Just for the record, it's about impossible to check into a hotel without a valid photo id. They also request make, model, color, and license plate of your car. I'd think that'd make it a tad tricky to use a stolen credit card to get into a hotel.

[Sylvan Dreams]

Originally posted by Amber
Just for the record, it's about impossible to check into a hotel without a valid photo id. They also request make, model, color, and license plate of your car. I'd think that'd make it a tad tricky to use a stolen credit card to get into a hotel.

I've never been asked to provide a photo ID upon checking in, or for even my credit card. They do ask for the car information though for the parking lot.

[CrystalTears]

Originally posted by Sylvan Dreams

Originally posted by Amber
Just for the record, it's about impossible to check into a hotel without a valid photo id. They also request make, model, color, and license plate of your car. I'd think that'd make it a tad tricky to use a stolen credit card to get into a hotel.

I've never been asked to provide a photo ID upon checking in, or for even my credit card. They do ask for the car information though for the parking lot.

Then they screwed up somewhere. You're not allowed to rent a hotel room unless you're at least 18 years old. They also won't take a credit card if the name doesn't match the name you are checking in with.

[Amber]

Originally posted by Sylvan Dreams


I've never been asked to provide a photo ID upon checking in, or for even my credit card. They do ask for the car information though for the parking lot.

How odd. I spend at least half the year in hotels and I'm always asked for both. Even when the room is being paid for by a sponsoring corporation, I'm asked for my credit card as well.

[Tsa`ah]

It depends on the hotel and greatly depends on the state the hotel resides in.

Most hotels don't bother with an ID. If the card is reported stolen, it will decline. If it is stolen and not reported until after the check in, the hotel nor the card owner will lose anything.

I've only been asked for an ID twice in all of the years I've traveled for work. If I had to put a percentage on it, it would be less than .3%. Hell, Enterprise and Avis no longer ask me for an ID ... and that kind of scares me.

Asking for a plate number, make and model is actually a hold over from the 50's - 70's motor inn days. Few hotels actually bother with it anymore ... but again, it depends on the state and the hotel.

[Rowi]

I havent seen a midnite clerk go out and check the plate and model either, just make em up if you wanted to.

[Augie]

When I used to work night audit, all we would verify was a photo ID and the credit card and make sure they matched. We never did ask for license plate info.

Most hotels will request a photo ID, but it depends on how cheesy and sleazy this motel is, what their policy is, if they know the cheatin sob etc.

[Tsa`ah]

Again, this varies by state and hotel.

I've stayed at a number of chain hotels that didn't bother to check my ID and only asked for my credit card when it wasn't verified in their system ... and these weren't cheesy or sleazy hotels. Unless of course you consider Hamptons, Ramadas, Holidays, and Drurys flop houses of course.

The only places I have been that check ID every time were those outside of US borders.

"Most" is not an accurate expression to use in this conversation.

[Caiylania]

I worked as a desk clerk and night audit as well, we had to check ID, credit card, and upon check in get their car information as well. This often came in very handy if someone left their lights on, illegally parked, blocked someone, etc...

One of my extra duties as night auditor was to go through every rooms records every night and mark down any that didn't have car information so they could collect it the next day. My hotel took it very seriously.

[xtc]

long story short, the dumbass is cheating.

1. Who steals a credit card and then uses it at a motel?

2. If the card was stolen wouldn't he have told his wife? If you loose a credit card don't you look everywhere and ask everyone in the house, have you seen my credit card? Who waits until a credit card comes in with a motel charge from a motel close to work and says, oh yeah I lost my credit card and those charges aren't mine.

For the record there are lots of motels that won't ask for ID, most charge by the hour.

This is an open and shut case of cheating.

[Sean of the Thread]

Why is this thread still alive?

Break down.

1.Bitch sucked at being a wife/girlfriend.
2.Prolly didn't give enough head.
3.Prolly became way overweight.
4.Prolly didn't shower enough.
5.Prolly didn't try to do shit to keep her man happy.
6.Man found his happy.
7.Man is happier for finding his happy.
8.Man is faking regretting after he had to confess/got caught.
9.Man will end up happy.


That is a solid 9 step program for any person.

[Caramia]

Originally posted by Xyelin
Why is this thread still alive?

Break down.

1.Bitch sucked at being a wife/girlfriend.
2.Prolly didn't give enough head.
3.Prolly became way overweight.
4.Prolly didn't shower enough.
5.Prolly didn't try to do shit to keep her man happy.
6.Man found his happy.
7.Man is happier for finding his happy.
8.Man is faking regretting after he had to confess/got caught.
9.Man will end up happy.


That is a solid 9 step program for any person.

What an ignorant post.

With regard to my own situation: I was a great girlfriend, he admitted as much when he'd done me wrong and got caught at it. I gave him head everytime we had sex, which was often -- I never once said "no" or had a headache. I'm not way overweight, matter of fact, I lost weight while we were together -- but did I complain because he added on 50+ pounds? No. I showered every morning, and sometimes just before he came home and I slipped into my sheer babydolls. He, on the other hand, could sit in those rank-ass shorts for weeks on end. Let's see... frequent sex, bought him expensive stuff, cooked gourmet meals... nah, I didn't do enough to keep him happy. He didn't find his happy. He admitted it was a mistake and it was just a tryst. He was much more miserable with his life after cheating on me, even though I forgave him. He stayed. He wasn't faking anything, he went into counseling for depression caused by his hurting the one thing that meant the most to him. He didn't end up happy -- he ended up fatter, alone, and wishing that when I finally kicked him to curb that he'd never strayed.

[Fallen]

Likely the opposite, then. For some reason, most people like to be treated like crap in a relationship. If you are always nice to someone, they get bored, and will look for someone who will treat them like crap instead.

Usually it is just females that i've noted who have had this problem, but apparently men are capable of being that thick as well.

Edited to add: Here is your grain of salt to take with my post.

[Edited on 1-8-2006 by Fallen]

[SpunGirl]

If anyone thinks they can guess a reason why a specific person cheated, they are retarded.

People cheat for millions of different reasons. The end.

-K

[Tsa`ah]

Originally posted by Caramia
What an ignorant post.

Heh ... look who posted it.

[Fallen]

If anyone thinks they can guess a reason why a specific person cheated, they are retarded.

People cheat for millions of different reasons. The end.

-K >>

Yes, if someone truly believed they can guess why any one person cheated at any one time with absolute certainly, then they may very well be mentally deficient. Otherwise, that was one hell of a blanket statement.

[Latrinsorm]

I recognize that this guy was in fact cheating.

An alternative, plausible explanation: he was helping out a buddy who had nowhere else to sleep and who his wife was extremely not fond of. Using a card whose statements she could see would not be terribly bright in this situation, but we've already established we're not dealing with Mentok the Mind-taker here.

[Landrion]

One of the best lines Ive ever heard about cheating came from Chris Rock:

A man is about as faithful as his options.

[CrystalTears]

"There are only three condoms... this is a package of four. Where is the other condom?!"

Heh, :heart: Chris Rock

[Alfster]

Originally posted by Caramia

With regard to my own situation: I was a great girlfriend, he admitted as much when he'd done me wrong and got caught at it. I gave him head everytime we had sex, which was often -- I never once said "no" or had a headache. I'm not way overweight, matter of fact, I lost weight while we were together -- but did I complain because he added on 50+ pounds? No. I showered every morning, and sometimes just before he came home and I slipped into my sheer babydolls. He, on the other hand, could sit in those rank-ass shorts for weeks on end. Let's see... frequent sex, bought him expensive stuff, cooked gourmet meals... nah, I didn't do enough to keep him happy. He didn't find his happy. He admitted it was a mistake and it was just a tryst. He was much more miserable with his life after cheating on me, even though I forgave him. He stayed. He wasn't faking anything, he went into counseling for depression caused by his hurting the one thing that meant the most to him. He didn't end up happy -- he ended up fatter, alone, and wishing that when I finally kicked him to curb that he'd never strayed.

I call dibs.

[Sean of the Thread]

rofl you can have the drama queen psycho. Buy yourself lots of bandages because I'm sure she takes broken bottles to her arms in her spare time.

[Alfster]

Originally posted by Xyelin
rofl you can have the drama queen psycho. Buy yourself lots of bandages because I'm sure she takes broken bottles to her arms in her spare time.

Psycho's make the best lovers, freak nasty shit

[Caramia]

Originally posted by Xyelin
rofl you can have the drama queen psycho. Buy yourself lots of bandages because I'm sure she takes broken bottles to her arms in her spare time.

Drama queen? Unlikely. Blunt and direct about all things in my life, very much so!

I'm not into candy-coating things or traumatic scenes, and I'm definitely not into cutting myself, as you posit.

But since you don't know me at all, I'll just chalk it up to you probably being ditched a few times and betting you always called the girl a psycho out of habit, as an acceptable excuse. Touché?

;)

[Edited on 1/12/2006 by Caramia]

[Alfster]

Hey, you forgot about me.

[Warriorbird]

Agh. The Alfster ditching Xyelin image was distressing.

[Caramia]

I wanted to add some advice for Ylena's friend. Tell her:

1.) Not to jump back into having sex right away with her husband, at least, not without condoms and a battery of AIDS and STD tests over the next six months. If she couldn't trust him to remain fidelitous to the relationship, she shouldn't trust him to have taken care to protect him, and her, to exposure. Plus, they definitely don't want to breeding until he's proven himself worthy of trust again.

2.) Get counseling despite any protests he doesn't need it, if only to aid her self-esteem and improve their communication. She might see she doesn't really need him to be happy if he proves himself to be a scoundrel.

3.) He needs to discontinue contact with the slut that had no respect for him, herself, the wife, or the marriage. No cards, calls, emails. All cards, photos, emails, letters, gifts, etc., need to be burnt, trashed, or deleted. If the need to hold onto such reminders is that important, then there's a serious issue here.

4.) He needs to make a deeper commitment towards the relationship. I don't know how many years they've been married, but if the status of things doesn't improve within a year, I would say to cut him loose. There's just no future there.

5.) Here's the toughest one. He needs to be totally honest about why the affair/tryst happened. She deserves to know why.

6.) Personally, I'd confront the slut, but there's no guarantee it'll ever go the way you imagine it could go, in your favor, when playing the scenarios in your head. It could totally backfire. I toyed around myself with making my ex's affairette's husband aware of the situation, but backed off because I thought it was bad karma. On the other hand, I was pissed for a long, long time that she had no regrets, no respect, and was still in a "blissful" marriage with a husband who was none the wiser, while the ex and I were hurting.

[Caramia]

I wanted to add some advice for Ylena's friend. Tell her:

1.) Not to jump back into having sex right away with her husband, at least, not without condoms and a battery of AIDS and STD tests over the next six months. If she couldn't trust him to remain fidelitous to the relationship, she shouldn't trust him to have taken care to protect him, and her, to exposure. Plus, they definitely don't want to breeding until he's proven himself worthy of trust again.

2.) Get counseling despite any protests he doesn't need it, if only to aid her self-esteem and improve their communication. She might see she doesn't really need him to be happy if he proves himself to be a scoundrel.

3.) He needs to discontinue contact with the slut that had no respect for him, herself, the wife, or the marriage. No cards, calls, emails. All cards, photos, emails, letters, gifts, etc., need to be burnt, trashed, or deleted. If the need to hold onto such reminders is that important, then there's a serious issue here.

4.) He needs to make a deeper commitment towards the relationship. I don't know how many years they've been married, but if the status of things doesn't improve within a year, I would say to cut him loose. There's just no future there.

5.) Here's the toughest one. He needs to be totally honest about why the affair/tryst happened. She deserves to know why.

6.) Personally, I'd confront the slut, but there's no guarantee it'll ever go the way you imagine it could go, in your favor, when playing the scenarios in your head. It could totally backfire. I toyed around myself with making my ex's affairette's husband aware of the situation, but backed off because I thought it was bad karma. On the other hand, I was pissed for a long, long time that she had no regrets, no respect, and was still in a "blissful" marriage with a husband who was none the wiser, while the ex and I were hurting.

[Caramia]

Alfster, I didn't forget about you, precious.

Your icon is how I like it best.

I'm not sure I'd call myself freaky, but I'd admit to aggressive and willing to please or accomodate.

A little B&D or S&M play is all well and fine, that's why the candles and silkscarves are conveniently handy in the nighttable next to the bed. But I don't need to a consistent diet of being bound, demoralized, or subservient to have a good orgasm.

[Kainen]

Originally posted by Xyelin
Why is this thread still alive?

Break down.

1.Bitch sucked at being a wife/girlfriend.
2.Prolly didn't give enough head.
3.Prolly became way overweight.
4.Prolly didn't shower enough.
5.Prolly didn't try to do shit to keep her man happy.
6.Man found his happy.
7.Man is happier for finding his happy.
8.Man is faking regretting after he had to confess/got caught.
9.Man will end up happy.


That is a solid 9 step program for any person.

Bullfuckingshit to all that. There is NO reason EVER aceptable for cheating. It is ALWAYS the cheaters fault.. no exceptions. If he hated it that BAD.. break it off, get divorced.. whatever. Your "it was her fault" attitude is the sign of someone who has to blame others for their own bullshit. I paused in reacting the FIRST time you posted that line of bullshit but, I cant stay silent a second time. Grow up.

[CrystalTears]

Originally posted by Caramia
6.) Personally, I'd confront the slut, but there's no guarantee it'll ever go the way you imagine it could go, in your favor, when playing the scenarios in your head. It could totally backfire.

OMFG why? If I hear one more woman who's been cheated on say this I may go postal.

What does this prove? What does this accomplish? She isn't the one who vowed to be faithful to you (the wife, you). I don't, nor probably will I ever, understand the mindset of getting back at the woman for something the man did wrong. That's like making dinner for your husband but he eats at McDonald's instead. You gonna go beat up Ronald?

Sorry but that line of reasoning always bugs the shit out of me. Carry on.

[Jennaen]

Bullfuckingshit to all that. There is NO reason EVER aceptable for cheating. It is ALWAYS the cheaters fault.. no exceptions. If he hated it that BAD.. break it off, get divorced.. whatever. Your "it was her fault" attitude is the sign of someone who has to blame others for their own bullshit. I paused in reacting the FIRST time you posted that line of bullshit but, I cant stay silent a second time. Grow up.

Amen! If you are done with a relationship, then suck it up and admit to it, so all participants can move on with their lives. There really is no excuse for cheating on one's spouse.

[Caiylania]

Originally posted by CrystalTears

Originally posted by Caramia
6.) Personally, I'd confront the slut, but there's no guarantee it'll ever go the way you imagine it could go, in your favor, when playing the scenarios in your head. It could totally backfire.

OMFG why? If I hear one more woman who's been cheated on say this I may go postal.

What does this prove? What does this accomplish? She isn't the one who vowed to be faithful to you (the wife, you). I don't, nor probably will I ever, understand the mindset of getting back at the woman for something the man did wrong. That's like making dinner for your husband but he eats at McDonald's instead. You gonna go beat up Ronald?

Sorry but that line of reasoning always bugs the shit out of me. Carry on.

I agree. Even if the woman knew he was married, HE still chose to do the wrong thing.

[Latrinsorm]

Assuming consentual cheatersex:

If she didn't know he was married (or otherwise spoken for) then she did nothing wrong (in a cheater sense).

If she did know, she is equally at fault.

If she did know and actively worked to tempt him, she is more at fault.

This applies with the opposite pronouns for dudes and wives.

[Sean]

You assume a lot.

[CrystalTears]

Regardless of how much this woman knew, she still did not vow to be faithful to his wife. The end.

[xtc]

I guess if your friend still isn't 100% convinced her husband is cheating, she could contact the TV show cheaters, just let us know when the episode will air.

http://www.cheaters.com/

[DeV]

Originally posted by CrystalTears
Regardless of how much this woman knew, she still did not vow to be faithful to his wife. The end. Game, set, and match. The person he or she cheated with is not accountable to you(general), however the person you thought you were committed to should in fact be the primary party assuming that accountability as well as bearing the brunt of the responsibility.

[Latrinsorm]

Originally posted by Tijay
You assume a lot. Well if it wasn't consentual, the guy's a rapist and automatically loses 100%. I don't think it's too much to assume that the guy's not a rapist.
Originally posted by CrystalTears
Regardless of how much this woman knew, she still did not vow to be faithful to his wife. The end. Knowingly assisting a person in doing something wrong is wrong. Overtly encouraging him or her to do so is even worse. If I sell a person I know full well is a murderous terrorist 30 pounds of dynamite, I am very much to blame if he goes out and blows up a bunch of people. It's entirely possible, even probable that he could have gotten an explosive somewhere else. That doesn't change the fact that he got it from me.

[CrystalTears]

So you're saying she forced him to have the affair. You really wanna go with that rationale to absolve him of basically fucking up his marriage? All because he had no will of his own to say, "No, sorry, I'm married."? He's STILL the one at fault here.

Understand I'm not saying that the woman is always the innocent victim here. What I'm saying is that HE was the one who chose to be unfaithful, not her, and HE chose the path to take, not her.

Unlike murders where the accomplices are also to blame, that is not the case as far as marriages and its vows are concerned.

[Edited on 1/12/2006 by CrystalTears]

[Latrinsorm]

Originally posted by CrystalTears
So you're saying she forced him to have the affair.Uh, no? Assisting and encouraging are hardly forcing.
You really wanna go with that rationale to absolve him of basically fucking up his marriage?I said "If she did know, she is equally at fault." Equally, not totally. I also said "If she did know and actively worked to tempt him, she is more at fault." More, still not totally.

[Caramia]

I guess until it's happened to you, you just can't really understand. On paper and in theory, it's all well and fine to consider yourself mature and enlightened and say you'd not blame the other woman for tempting the man to violate his vows or commitment to another.

But wait until you're the person that got hurt, feels betrayed, and was utterly disrespected. I noticed that you conveniently ignored where I said I refrained from going to the bitch and making her life miserable because I did feel it was bad karma. I was miserable, the boyfriend was miserable, her husband had no clue what had happened and their marriage was intact. I didn't think that was quite fair at the time, but hey, I resisted lowering myself to baser impulses!

I've never understand the whole open relationship thing myself because I've never seen it work in the long-run -- let me repeat that -- I've NEVER seen it work in the long-run. Someone always winds up falling in love with the more exciting piece of ass, and the one who blithely gave permission often ends up hurt and alone. If you're the exception, hey, glad to hear it. Talk to me in another 5-10 years and tell me if you're still with the same guy.

[SpunGirl]

I confronted "the slut" once when I was cheated on, because she happened to be a "good" (hah) friend of mine. She owed me more than that, and I think I had good reason to go tell her fiance exactly what she'd done.

-K

[CrystalTears]

Way to assume that I've never been cheated on just because of my beliefs. I've NEVER blamed the woman, no matter how much she knew I existed.

In fact, my ex-husband cheated on me with his ex-lover/roommate. When we were dating, she threatened to beat me up for taking him away from her, and then tried to befriend me when we got married. I STILL didn't blame her because he SWORE to me that he loves me, not her, and would never hurt me because they are only friends.

HE betrayed me. HE lied to me. She never promised to be faithful to me so her going after him actually didn't surprise me. He was the weak one to not say no to her. If he can't stop thinking with his dick, that's not my problem and I'm not going to stop being open minded with people just because some people can't handle the commitment and freedom I allow without abusing it.

And no I didn't ignore the part that you said it would be bad karma. However the fact that it was even considered and mentioned as a possible action still amazed me, sorry.

[Edaarin]

I can never watch Cheaters...I swear the people on that show make the lowlifes on COPS look like Donald Trump.

[Latrinsorm]

Originally posted by CrystalTears
If he can't stop thinking with his dick, that's not my problem and I'm not going to stop being open minded with people just because some people can't handle the commitment and freedom I allow without abusing it.I don't quite follow here. What exactly does "freedom I allow" entail? Or is it that the lying alone is the betrayal?

[Rowi]

Originally posted by CrystalTears
If he can't stop thinking with his dick,


Thats the whole story in a fruit basket!!
Men think alot with that head, but hey what kinda awful life would it be without it!

[Caiylania]

If both people agree to monogamy- the cheater is in the wrong.

If its an open relationship and one takes advantage of that but is honest- that is between the two in the relationship and not cheating.

If its an open relationship but one lies and hides things anyway- thats just wrong and stupid.

The woman or man who sleeps with a married/engaged/otherwisetaken person knowingly is in the wrong as a person... not to the one being cheated on.

In regards to Caramia's point... I would have done nothing to the woman physically herself. To be honest though, I would have told her husband. I sure as hell would want to know, he deserved to know as well.

The above are all my own opinion and not the official stance of the PC and its proprieties. :D

[CrystalTears]

Originally posted by Latrinsorm

Originally posted by CrystalTears
If he can't stop thinking with his dick, that's not my problem and I'm not going to stop being open minded with people just because some people can't handle the commitment and freedom I allow without abusing it.I don't quite follow here. What exactly does "freedom I allow" entail? Or is it that the lying alone is the betrayal?

I'm not controlling and don't try to change anyone. He can go anywhere he wants with anyone he wants, as long as he's honest with me about where he is going.

As long as I continue to be #1 in his life and doesn't hold other people or activities above me, it's all good. Being neglected and lied to bothers me way more than a possible one night stand.

My breakup with my ex was more about lies, betrayal and being neglected than anything else. Our relationship was doomed pretty early on since he basically lied about his intentions, but that's a long story.

In a nutshell, his affair was just the straw that broke the lying camel's back. He would make plans with her but wouldn't meet ours. He would have lunch with her often, yet I was too far to travel to for lunch with me. Bullshit like that.. aside from other crazy bullshit he put me and my family through.

I'm not a typical girl, that's obvious. I'm not one to destroy items we bought together, trash things that were presents to me, destroy photos and memories. I'm not vindictive and try to sabotage his other aspects in life like family and work. It's just not my style. I certainly can't even begin to imagine others being that way.

It's just ironic to me, maybe a little sad, that my way of thinking is the crazy kind by many. :shrug: I'm happy with myself and my choices and I don't regret anything or anyone in my past. It's made me who I am today and helped me find my soulmate who is everything I've always wanted in a partner. I'm a very lucky girl.

[deck]

Guys don't cheat for no reason. there's a few things that will MAKE a guy cheat, one is having the same sex over for multiple years. It gets boring.

There's two ways to handle this.

1.If you don't want to be with that person anymore.
make a big deal of it, even if you stay together your relationship will be different from now on, no matter what "clean slates" get drawn. even if it turns out the card was stolen this will build a rift of dis-trust.

2. If you do still love the guy, mention it to him (as it appears she did) and he deny's it, be gullible and completely believe him and drop it. Things will be alittle shakey for awhile until the guy believes you forgot about it. Now's the time when you should say, "Lets do somthing new and exciting"

People in relationships have a way of forgetting that they're two different people, successful marrages come from understanding the differences between them both, and addressing needs/wants individual basis, the marital bliss happends, when you both end up enjoying somthing. One of the best ways I've found is to ask the significant other, "What would you like our daily life to be" Which really is a hard quesiton to answer, but in answering the question you'll find out way more about a person than you would being "polite" and letting the marrage decay.

Remember as always, Be Open! you don't have to be on guard 24/7 to someone elses needs. it's not a battle, it's enjoying eachothers company.


I myself am completely against cheating, however I have told my wife on several occasions when things got boring, that we need to try somthing new, and it works we both enjoy trying new things, some bad some awsome. If your relationship isn't open enough to talk about these things, then it really should be and I'd fare to say you don't know your significant other nearly as well as you'd think.

[Edited on 1-13-2006 by deck]

[Latrinsorm]

Originally posted by CrystalTears
It's just ironic to me, maybe a little sad, that my way of thinking is the crazy kind by many.Now you know how I feel whenever there's a religious discussion on the PC. :saint:
My breakup with my ex was more about lies, betrayal and being neglected than anything else.I get it now.

[SpunGirl]

I agree with you, deck, that people should always be up for trying new things and keeping each other interested. I'm glad you, at least, are willing to take the initiative to tell your wife, "let's do this." But what if the guy in question in this case didn't? What if the wife didn't realize there was an issue? Does that make it her fault for not giving him something he never asked for?

-K

[Caramia]

Let's make sure everyone understands that women in closed relationships that demand fidelity and commitment from the man they are involved with/living with/married or engaged to aren't necessarily controlling. If that's how you equate a monogamous relationship, then I feel pity.

I'm not trying to be a sexist pig here, but OF COURSE men will always stray when given the chance or opportunity. What guy wouldn't love that? That's just the way their hardwired. If they have permission or are aggressively pursued and tempted, the little head will do the thinking. Mind you, I have no issues with that, either, as I just don't believe that monogamy is natural and I do think it's rougher to be monogamous if you're a man.

That said, it doesn't make it right for men, or women, to disrespect each other, lie, cheat, or hurt someone else they supposedly profess to love, and an open relationship is neither the answer or panacea for cheating. If you're that bored with the relationship -- or with the sex in the relationship -- that you have to go elsewhere to get satisfied, if you have that little respect for the one you're with (or yourself), then have enough human qualities to get out before someone gets hurt.

Like my previous post said, open relationships look good on paper, but when you've been with the same guy for five or six years and he goes elsewhere to get it sucked or stroked, there is something significant going on there. It's so easy to give permission to go out and play, it requires much more to make a commitment to work on a solid relationship with one person, and keep it growing and interesting enough to make it viable and valuable through the years.

That's based on my own personal experience. Five years of promises and talking about a life together. I could be wearing the ring, but where were the heartfelt vows? By the way, he was never neglected, although in retrospect, I certainly was. Sex was never dull and boring on my end, as I am pretty damn inventive, but it was always the same method with him despite telling, showing, and suggesting. I wasn't the one who strayed, but I was the one who was lied to and betrayed. I'm going with Deck and Spun on this one, for the win.

Oh, and I never said I would do anything physically to her or trash any items she gave/sent him -- I'm not a destroyer, but perhaps you said it because you have in the past? I don't recall anyone else here suggesting they would do as you implied. But I did say that -- out of respect for me -- I didn't want those things in the house, so they either got trashed (his choice) or boxed, taped up, and put in storage... no keeping them at work, either. When he moved out, I hope the box served him as a reminder of everything he'd lost, and the cost of what he'd ruined, instead of providing him with a nice pleasant little fantasy that could be imposed between us.

Spun's right. The woman's husband/boyfriend/significant other/lover does deserve to know what happened as well. In this situation it's all about R-E-S-P-E-C-T. Open relationships aren't an automatic guarantee of that.

[Latrinsorm]

Originally posted by Caramia
I'm not trying to be a sexist pig hereThat's a shame, you did a remarkably good job of it. You neglected to mention that all women are ready to spread their legs for any muscle-bound stud that wanders along though. It's just the way they're hardwired. :rolleyes:

[HarmNone]

I don't think it's true that "men will always stray". That's too broad a statement. Some men will stray whether they have reason, or not. Some women will do the same thing. Then, there are those who won't stray even if given a reason. It's a mistake, in my opinion, to paint with too broad a brush.

[CrystalTears]

My views on sex and relationships are obviously very different from the norm, so I'll leave it that we'll have to agree to disagree, especially since you misread almost everything I said. I clearly can not explain myself well.

[deck]

\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
I agree with you, deck, that people should always be up for trying new things and keeping each other interested. I'm glad you, at least, are willing to take the initiative to tell your wife, "let's do this." But what if the guy in question in this case didn't? What if the wife didn't realize there was an issue? Does that make it her fault for not giving him something he never asked for?
\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\

well, I can't say I have all the answers, I mean people are people. unpredictable, hard to anticipate and generally impossible to completely plan for, that's kinda why I just go for the open approach with an open mind. I mean if the other person gets that you're being completely open with your every-day life. then they'll hopefully appreciate it and give it back.. kind of what the dating was all about I should hope (after sex that is)

[deck]

What if the wife didn't realize there was an issue? Does that make it her fault for not giving him something he never asked for?
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

sorry, I didn't answer your question.

well, thats a hard situation to read if you don't know the people involved personally.. I would think that had the communications line been open(with open minds). he may have suggested it, (or if it had to be another women suggested at least a threesome) and handle it from there...

[Warriorbird]

I'm not trying to be a sexist pig here, but OF COURSE men will always stray when given the chance or opportunity.

Uhm...no. I see marriage as a commitment. I don't think I'm alone in the world in that.

[Edited on 1-15-2006 by Warriorbird]