Dwarven archer.

[Ilvane]

I'm looking for some advice on re-rolling a dwarven archer. What professions do you think would be the best for this, and do you recommend anything for this character at the beginning?

-A

[The Ponzzz]

Do you want to be a sniping archer, or out in the open?

[fallenSaint]

Id have to lay vote to Rogue for Dwarven Archer ... and advise for beginning ... swing a sword until your 30 day reallocation is up? ;)

[Drew]

IMO rangers make the best archers, rogues following closely behind. All other archery professions are a bit more mutant.


If you don't want to snipe from hiding though some other professions make for interesting choices, warriors for instance.

[Gizmo]

Originally posted by Drew
IMO rangers make the best archers, rogues following closely behind. All other archery professions are a bit more mutant.


If you don't want to snipe from hiding though some other professions make for interesting choices, warriors for instance.

I'll personally have to disagree with you on that one Drew. I for one, feel Rogues make the best Archers, if you train them correctly. Not only can a Rogue Archer out-hide a Ranger, but the vast amount of cmans a Rogue Archer could have outweighs anyone a Ranger could use. Along with usefuness in Guild and the ability to cast as well, I think if you took a serious Rogue Archer and pit him against a like level Ranger, the Rogue would win.

Granted, Spikethorn would most likely pwn that Rogue if he were stupid, I'd still have to go with a Rogue. Simply based on seeing a training path such as mine pull out ahead of a Ranger's training.

But to all, it's always a matter of personal likes and dislikes, among who swings..Or in this case, shoots first.

[Artha]

Not only can a Rogue Archer out-hide a Ranger
What rogue can beat an instant hide with a bonus on AS until you're revealed?

[Trinitis]

Originally posted by Artha

Not only can a Rogue Archer out-hide a Ranger
What rogue can beat an instant hide with a bonus on AS until you're revealed?

One that has an entire guild full of skills, plus a CM list 3 times as large?

Honestly though, a "instant hide" is not that big of a deal. Adding in the fairly small AS bonus (which means little in the grand scale) don't sway much to the Ranger side.

Rogues can 3x hiding fairly easy. Rogues also have skills from guild to help keep hidden.

And as stated before, the Ranger CMans list suck, horribly.

[Makkah]

How is +30 to AS "small?"

[Trinitis]

Originally posted by Makkah
How is +30 to AS "small?"

For an ambushing class, AS is rarely an issue. Thats the whole point of the pushdown system. +30 AS is not really that big of an issue.

[Gizmo]

Originally posted by Trinitis

Originally posted by Makkah
How is +30 to AS "small?"

For an ambushing class, AS is rarely an issue. Thats the whole point of the pushdown system. +30 AS is not really that big of an issue.

Agreed. And the fact that my Rogue has 7 spell ranks at 20 trains. Goes to show his plans for spells...425/120...Possibly 130 if I feel like it.

Having that list, would pretty much negate silly "Camo". Besides, what's not to stop a rogue from finding a recharger with Camo in it, or what not?

IMO, Rogues still hold strong as Archers. Just not maybe to the "Image" of one.

[Artha]

Archery does not have a pushdown.

That +30 is the same as kneeling with a crossbow, and added to it you've got Phoen's Strength to make you shoot faster and a variety of other spells that make an archer's life easier.


Besides, what's not to stop a rogue from finding a recharger with Camo in it, or what not?
That's money/time that a ranger never has to spend.

What's to stop a ranger from finding a recharger or self-mana item with 425 in it? Not to mention a ranger will spend a heck of a lot less points getting 117/120...which are, sure, available to rogues, but at a much greater cost.


IMO, Rogues still hold strong as Archers.
No doubt, but they're not the best.

[Edited on 12-21-2005 by Artha]

[Gizmo]

Originally posted by Artha
Archery does not have a pushdown.

That +30 is the same as kneeling with a crossbow, and added to it you've got Phoen's Strength to make you shoot faster and a variety of other spells that make an archer's life easier.

What Arth says is true, there is no DS pushdown with ambushing and Archery, due to the fact you are not "Ambushing" The DS pushdown is more commonly referred to as a Ranged or Bolt DS for that critter. The +30 holds true to kneeling with crossbows as well, shame it's no longer the +50 as before.

Along with Phoens, Surge helps with firing RT. +10 STR Bonus = 1 second of RT shaved off. My Gnome, once maxed in Surge will fire his longbow in 4 seconds from the open.

The only thing I see, that swings in a Rangers Favor as an Archer, compared to a Rogue are two spells.

Wall of Thorns, and Companion. Other than that, I'd take a Rogue over a Ranger.

[Gizmo]

What's to stop a ranger from finding a recharger or self-mana item with 425 in it? Not to mention a ranger will spend a heck of a lot less points getting 117/120...which are, sure, available to rogues, but at a much greater cost.

A self mana 425 item, I'd imagine would be ALOT more costly than a Camo item. Same would go for even a Recharge. You know it would be harder to activate a 425 item, than a what, 608 item would be right? As I said before, It's all really a matter of preference really. Some prefer Rangers, I prefer Rogue.

I'm for one, not arguing with anyone here that they are wrong, I respect Archers overall and have a like for both Professions. You however, will never see me as a Ranger. Personally, I'm enjoying this topic of discussion, no matter how many times it's been brought up.

As to stay slightly on topic, a Dwarven Archer would make for a rather odd spectacle to see. I always try to keep my archer types to a more gnimble of race.

[Laccon]

dwarves are the devil...short and stubby, short and stubby!

P.S. rogue archers pwn, they the bestest, but rangers are decent cause they can spike thorn as well.

[Edited on 12-21-2005 by Laccon]

[The Ponzzz]

There is NO pushdown for ranged combat...

And, Rangers make great archers. But rogues have an over all better chance of hiding. Seeing CMANs aren't a huge issue for a sniping archer, rangers take the cake...

[Edited on 12-21-2005 by The Ponzzz]

[Gizmo]

Originally posted by The Ponzzz
There is NO pushdown for ranged combat...

And, Rangers make great archers. But rogues have an over all better chance of hiding. Seeing CMANs aren't a huge issue for a sniping archer, rangers take the cake...

[Edited on 12-21-2005 by The Ponzzz]

I have no idea what a "Seeing CMAN" is that Ponzz is referring to :)

Unless he's referring to CMANs like dirtkick, which at one point is also pretty much an autohide for a Rogue. But case in point, this battle holds true the same rules as any..First strike pretty much wins.

If a Rogue gets off the cutthroat first, game set match more than likely.

IMO, just go with what you want, RP Wise. Neither class is a "Bad" Archer.

[Makkah]

Ponzzz just worded it dumbly. He meant:

"Seeing as how CMAN aren't a huge issue with archers..."

[Ilvane]

I am leaning towards rogue, but I wasn't entirely sure that ranger might not be viable as well. I'd rather come from hiding as well, if that helps.

-A

[The Ponzzz]

Thanks, I generally am a fucktard half the time when I type...

[Trinitis]

Originally posted by Ilvane
I am leaning towards rogue, but I wasn't entirely sure that ranger might not be viable as well. I'd rather come from hiding as well, if that helps.

-A

I reccomend you look beyond you being an archer for this class selection. What, besides an archer, do you want/see this dwarf doing? Is it fitting for him/her to be more nimble, and a locksmith/thief? Or would he/she be more of a nature type? Pet(s), spells, etc.

Purely from my point of view, I tend to shy away from heavy contact with others in games. So I would normally lean twords rogue, as they are more self reliant. But rangers can make quick friends with spells and wands, to be sure. What fits the dwarf best?