Official: Death Changes (DON'T DIE!)

[Fallen]

Death Warmed Over Changes Released · on 9/18/2005 3:37:12 PM 1166


The "Death's Sting" system has been updated with the "Death Warmed Over" changes that were previously announced.

Summarization of changes:

+ DEPART now has greater penalties than just regular decaying.

+ Being restored to life by any means other than resurrection results in a period where the character absorbs experience inefficiently. There is no experience inefficiency in Platinum.

+ No changes were made to the penalties for characters who die with deeds and are resurrected by spells.

+ It is now possible to UNLINK to break preservation.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Upon being restored to life, a character will be in a weakened state, with all stats experiencing a reduction of 40%. The rate of recovery depends on how the character died and was restored to life.

Types Of Death Stat Recovery
Death with Deeds & Resurrection 4% per minute
Death with Resurrection, No Deeds 2% per minute
Decay/DEPART/Spirit Death with Deeds 2% per minute
Decay/DEPART/Spirit Death without Deeds 1% per minute


The Cleric spell, Holy Receptacle (325) - Chrism, can be used to mitigate this weakness, reducing it by up to 50% (to a 20% stat reduction). This will allow characters to prepare for emergencies, like major invasions, and be able to get fallen heroes back into the fray within minutes, if needed, but at a cost of a Chrism gem. Also, characters under level 10 will recover at twice the normal rate.

In addition to the above, the character's Constitution will be reduced, with the amount based on the way that the character died and was restored to life and the number of times the character has died recently. Recent deaths are defined as those in the last 50,000 experience or 30 days, whichever results in fewer recent deaths.

Also, if restored to life by any means other than being resurrected with deeds, the character will absorb experience inefficiently for a while. This inefficiency results in only 25% of absorbed experience being transferred to permanent learned experience, with the remaining 75% being lost. For example, if a character would normally absorb 32 experience in a pulse, the character's field experience would still be decremented by 32 experience, but his permanent experience total would increase by (32 x 0.25) = 8 experience. The period during which a character suffers from experience absorption inefficiency is not affected by recent deaths per se, but if a character dies while under the inefficiency effect, the inefficiency from the current death will extend the inefficiency period by the amount shown in the table below. Characters under level 10 will not be subject to experience absorption inefficiency.

Types Of Death Temporary Constitution Reduction EXP Absorption Inefficiency
Death with Deeds and Resurrection 1 per recent death 0
Death with Resurrection, No Deeds As above, + 3. Reduced health, stamina, spirit, and mana recovery rate for next 2000 experience 500
Decay with Deeds As above, with slightly greater reduction in recovery rate 1000
Decay without Deeds, or DEPART/Spirit Death with Deeds As above, with the reduction in recovery rate for next 5000 experience 2000
DEPART/Spirit Death without Deeds As above, with the reduction in recovery rate for next 10000 experience 4000


The modifier for recent deaths will be capped at 5; even if a character has a chronic death problem, the character will not lose more than 5 Constitution for a normal death with resurrection. The cumulative maximum reduction will be capped at 25. These points will be recouped at a rate of 1 point per 2000 exp gained. The Cleric spell, Holy Receptacle (325) - Chrism, may mitigate this temporary Constitution loss, reducing it by up to 2 points. Characters under level 10 will not lose Constitution for recent deaths.

Characters who are restored to life by any means other than being resurrected will be restored with 1 health point, 1 Spirit Point, and no mana or stamina. Characters will also lose any unabsorbed field experience at the time of resurrection.

There will be a means by which characters can recoup these temporary losses other than gaining experience, but it will be costly (silvers).

This message was originally posted in Game Design Discussions, General Discussion about Gemstone IV. To discuss the above follow the link below.

http://www.play.net/forums/messages.asp?forum=102&category=6&topic=3&message= 1972

[Fallen]

Ladies and Gentleman, death has regained its sting. Let the bitching commence!

[Viridian]

The preservation unlink, awesome! No longer will people keep Hadya's corpse then proceed to torment her.

[Letum]

Lovely. Just got to Teras, minus deeds. Time to run the hell away.

[AnticorRifling]

Sweet.

[Drew]

<Characters who are restored to life by any means other than being resurrected will be restored with 1 health point, 1 Spirit Point, and no mana or stamina.>


So apparently we don't get a full head of mana when we decay? We'll call this the Dionisus change. As far as exp inefficency, does that stack or refresh if you die again?

[Fallen]

My guess is that it stacks, and that was a needed change to mana/health/stamina. Decay should be an absolute last resort, and it should be horrible.

[Drew]

Well, so much for Chiv dying 40 times in an invasion. Or, if he does, it's gonna suck.

[Fallen]

Well, so much for Chiv dying 40 times in an invasion. Or, if he does, it's gonna suck. >>

I feel you. I will still be departing without deeds on every death. These changes were needed, but they are certainly going to slow my leveling by a considerable amount.

But hey, it's better than forced deeds and 10k EXP a pop.

[FinisWolf]

:clap:
:down:
:down:
:down:
:clap:

Some good, some bad, some hey, lets take fun out of the game, some lets force RP (good), some ...bad, some ugly ... I will wait to see how I feel overall until later. Personally, I do TRY not to die, cause dying no matter what sucked ass.

Finis

[Jonty]

+ It is now possible to UNLINK to break preservation.


So, what the hell is the point of the last COL sign now?

[SpunGirl]

Doesn't seem like there is one. Maybe they'll give us another one or something.

-K

Slow xp gain? Jesus, levels already take long enough to get as it is.

- Arkans

[Skirmisher]

Wait, people advance in levels in this game?

[Sean]

Nothing like wasting a bunch of TPs on useless lores to get other people back in the fray quicker...

[Apotheosis]

pwn3d11one!!

[Himmy]

This just in.. the new death changes totally pwned my 3x. I decayed once during my six hours and, despite my normal powerhunting, i only got about 18k experience for my whole triple x. Le suck.

[Drew]

Originally posted by SpunGirl
Doesn't seem like there is one. Maybe they'll give us another one or something.

-K



Yeah, I'm sure they will just as soon as they replace all the nerfed voln symbols.

[Ilvane]

Heh, guess it's time to group hunt huh?

-A

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by Fallen
I feel you. I will still be departing without deeds on every death. These changes were needed, but they are certainly going to slow my leveling by a considerable amount.

But hey, it's better than forced deeds and 10k EXP a pop.

Why?

You don't have to go to the temple to get deeds.. there are more places than just the temple to get deeds. And since no one but you know what deeds you have and don't have, you can now depart with deeds and not have to stymie your leveling progression.

It's a stupid game mechanic in my opinion... forcing an otherwise dark character to do a "good deed".. but there are ways around it in my book.

[Fallen]

Why?

You don't have to go to the temple to get deeds.. there are more places than just the temple to get deeds. And since no one but you know what deeds you have and don't have, you can now depart with deeds and not have to stymie your leveling progression. >>

If your character knows anything of Elanthian Theology(?), they will know that all deeds are handled by Lorminstra. It has been stated numerous times by GMs on the official boards that all dealings with death(Resurrection by spells or otherwise) must go through the White Whore.

The argument of, "You are the only one that will know if you get deeds.", is entirely true. If you wish to keep your character ignorant of you, the player, choosing to get deeds, that is your choice. I choose not to play like that.

[Fallen]

If it will help, I will try to dig up some of the posts from this exact argument on the official boards. I agree 100% that there should be an alternative method of gaining deeds other than bribing Lorminstra, but as it stands now there is not.

[Jolena]

I don't agree that there should be another way to gain a deed without going through Lorminstra, as that is the basis behind Lorminstra existing. Which in turn, is why the Lornon followers and others who just don't like Lorminstra, have such issues with her (insert Luukos argument here). However, I do agree that making death more of a inconvenience was necessary.

Do I want to deal with the horrid consequences of death now? Not really, but to be honest, this change was long overdue. Dying should be something that affects our characters in a really negative way, and as Fallen said, decaying should be a last resort and should be HORRID when it happens. I'm not going to say I didn't enjoy having full mana, etc when decaying however that's not the point of the change and I think the GM's did one hell of a job conveying how bad death truly should be on your character.

[HouseofElves]

._.

Damnit. I don't want to buy deeds. Lorminstra = crackwhore. At least Uni does it with decorum. Hey, that's a good slogan.

I guess I just won't die anymore.

[ElanthianSiren]

Originally posted by Fallen
If it will help, I will try to dig up some of the posts from this exact argument on the official boards. I agree 100% that there should be an alternative method of gaining deeds other than bribing Lorminstra, but as it stands now there is not.

You should have to bow down in the snake shrine on Teras and do a sexual favour innuendo to Ivas, (anyone else want to tongue a snake statue?), who should be made Luukos' consort.

Death changes, annoying. It's good to see multi accounting even more reinforced now. Yay.

-M

[Andreal]

Why should there be an alternative means? Lorminstra is the gate keeper.

[Warriorbird]

The people complained about the old system, so they changed it. Then they changed it again. Then people complained again. Now they changed it again. People will complain again when they regret what they lost. Silly people.

[Lookkin]

I've never gotten a deed once - where / how do you get them. I primarily reside in Solhaven.

Thanks!

Lookkin

[ElanthianSiren]

There's your problem (Solhaven). I have no idea how to get them there either.

IM -- check
RR -- check
EN -- check
WL -- check
TI -- check (plus a large check for being a pain in the ass)
SH -- ??????????????

Oh yea, in response to WB: They have been slowing down exp since 1998 or whenever they made the changes to node hunting. Everytime they find another way to do it, I just do this :rolleyes: .

Makes even more laughable their "Omg, you haven't lost anything really! everyone did!" justification for level compaction of GSIV (hello con bonus, spell stack, and duration). Simu's lucky IMO that interpersonal relationships keep people in GS (FWIW, my played characters always have at least 30 deeds).

-M

[mgoddess]

GSIV Player's Library on Getting Deeds (http://www.gs4.org/index.php?pagename=Getting%20Deeds&op=modload&name =pnPhpWiki&file=index&POSTNUKESID=14a637e9174229a0 0502770194f5a48d)

[Edited on 9-19-2005 by mgoddess]

[ElanthianSiren]

Thanks mgoddess. You are truly a goddess. I will now go read.

-M

[mgoddess]

Welcomes. :)

[Nilandia]

For the record, I believe the deed puzzle in River's Rest is more geared toward Aeia or Imaera than Lorminstra. Or at least that's the feeling I got.

There's also the thought among some Lornonites that getting deeds through Lorminstra is more about sticking it to her than paying homage, since Lorminstra is forced to keep her word, regardless of whether the person with the deed follows Lorminstra or Luukos.

Not to mention the idea that Lorminstra is only looking at the person's sacrifice to award a deed, not the gift itself. Lorminstra's a goddess of death. What's she gonna do with a few silvers or gems?

Nilandia

[Warriorbird]

Well, ES, you can still hunt as fast as before when you count in Triple X... and certain really bizaare hunting practices. But I get your point. Most people don't advance nearly as quickly.

[Andreal]

Doesn't really matter how you get them really. When you die, whats that soothing feeling you get when you have a deed? Or the bad one you get when you don't.

I think of it like the Government. Say Lorminstra is the DMV. Although you love the Fire Dept, to get a license, you go to the DMV, because the FD can't give you a license.

Just the way I see things.. Each Arkati has their own "Department".

[Himmy]

Originally posted by Nilandia
For the record, I believe the deed puzzle in River's Rest is more geared toward Aeia or Imaera than Lorminstra. Or at least that's the feeling I got.

There's also the thought among some Lornonites that getting deeds through Lorminstra is more about sticking it to her than paying homage, since Lorminstra is forced to keep her word, regardless of whether the person with the deed follows Lorminstra or Luukos.

Not to mention the idea that Lorminstra is only looking at the person's sacrifice to award a deed, not the gift itself. Lorminstra's a goddess of death. What's she gonna do with a few silvers or gems?

Nilandia

Lorminstra is The Man. Damn The Man.

[FinisWolf]

Originally posted by Ilvane
Heh, guess it's time to group hunt huh?

-A

Group hunting sucks! For a ga-million reasons.

Finis

Originally posted by ElanthianSiren
Makes even more laughable their "Omg, you haven't lost anything really! everyone did!" justification for level compaction of GSIV (hello con bonus, spell stack, and duration). Simu's lucky IMO that interpersonal relationships keep people in GS (FWIW, my played characters always have at least 30 deeds).

-M

Agreed on all points. I argued heavily against the level compression at the time, but it seemed that it was only the handful of people that were lvl 100 + that gave a crap. Anyone below 30 was like "OMG, I am going to gain a level!!!".

GS4 is far less enjoyable for me (mechanically) than GS3 was. 60 more levels = leveling more often & having a shitload of auxillary skills. I had to lose a ton of skills on the switch to GS4.

[FinisWolf]

Originally posted by mgoddess
GSIV Player's Library on Getting Deeds (http://www.gs4.org/index.php?pagename=Getting%20Deeds&op=modload&name =pnPhpWiki&file=index&POSTNUKESID=14a637e9174229a0 0502770194f5a48d)

[Edited on 9-19-2005 by mgoddess]

Thank you! There are some places there I thought we couldn't get deeds. Thank you for posting this link.

I run chars that do deeds, don't do deeds, do raises, don't do raises ... for my chars that do neither its REALLY going to hurt, but thats a part of their RP.

To say; "O, you are the only one that knows ..." Thats not being true to that character, and if you won't be true to your character, why play it? It's the immersion that makes the character come to life, cheat, and you lose that in my opinion.

Finis

[FinisWolf]

Originally posted by Tea & Strumpets

Originally posted by ElanthianSiren
Makes even more laughable their "Omg, you haven't lost anything really! everyone did!" justification for level compaction of GSIV (hello con bonus, spell stack, and duration). Simu's lucky IMO that interpersonal relationships keep people in GS (FWIW, my played characters always have at least 30 deeds).

-M

Agreed on all points. I argued heavily against the level compression at the time, but it seemed that it was only the handful of people that were lvl 100 + that gave a crap. Anyone below 30 was like "OMG, I am going to gain a level!!!".

GS4 is far less enjoyable for me (mechanically) than GS3 was. 60 more levels = leveling more often & having a shitload of auxillary skills. I had to lose a ton of skills on the switch to GS4.

Overall I am sure you are correct, though I for one was one that was avidly against the compression, and not one of my chars at the time was over 40 ... doubt that helps you feel better, but I am saying this in the hopes that it might.

Finis

[Fallen]

Not to mention the idea that Lorminstra is only looking at the person's sacrifice to award a deed, not the gift itself. Lorminstra's a goddess of death. What's she gonna do with a few silvers or gems? >>

If that were true you would be able to get deeds by releasing undead, or serving in some other method. In the end, more silver = more temples = more power for Lorminstra. The White Whore grows ever richer.

Just say no to deeds.

[FinisWolf]

:lol2:

[Lookkin]

Originally posted by mgoddess
GSIV Player's Library on Getting Deeds (http://www.gs4.org/index.php?pagename=Getting%20Deeds&op=modload&name =pnPhpWiki&file=index&POSTNUKESID=14a637e9174229a0 0502770194f5a48d)

[Edited on 9-19-2005 by mgoddess]

Thanks Goddess!!! That's great info!

:smilegrin:

[mgoddess]

Ouch, this new death's sting sucks balls...

I like! :D

[Tromp]

Originally posted by mgoddess
Ouch, this new death's sting sucks balls...

I like! :D

1st woman who admits to enjoying what us men so thoroughly love!

[Drew]

Kind of off topic but I was all for the level compression. Sure it means you may get less auxillary skills before cap but Gemstone was broke before, they kept slapping more band aids on it. It needed to be fixed.

[Drezzt]

I know I'm in the minority here, but this wont change things for my characters at all. Most of the will still depart confirm.
Even with the sting they can be hunting in under the time it'd take
to find a healer that isnt a vulture and grab a cleric.

But, to each their own. I've always kinda walked my own path.

[Drew]

Also, at least in my case, my characters die less than once a month unless there's an invasion. Even the really hard areas like Stronghold are easy if you are smart, devolop a good battle strategy and stick to it. Good equipment helps too.

[Divinity]

Originally posted by Arkans
Slow xp gain? Jesus, levels already take long enough to get as it is.

- Arkans

This needed repeating. Yeah, I'm starting to wonder if I'm going to even reopen my gs account. :(

[Himmy]

Originally posted by Drezzt
I know I'm in the minority here, but this wont change things for my characters at all. Most of the will still depart confirm.
Even with the sting they can be hunting in under the time it'd take
to find a healer that isnt a vulture and grab a cleric.

But, to each their own. I've always kinda walked my own path.



I would way rather wait 10 minutes to decay without having to depart, or for a cleric to snag me, than I would like to waste the next four hours with 25% exp.

[Himmy]

Originally posted by Drezzt
I know I'm in the minority here, but this wont change things for my characters at all. Most of the will still depart confirm.
Even with the sting they can be hunting in under the time it'd take
to find a healer that isnt a vulture and grab a cleric.

But, to each their own. I've always kinda walked my own path.



I would way rather wait 10 minutes to decay without having to depart, or for a cleric to snag me, than I would like to waste the next four hours with 25% exp.