New Max Mana fix...

[mgoddess]

Argh.

New Max Mana fix bases base max mana on starting stats....and never goes up.

*mutters*

All stats (HP, Mana, Stamina, and Spirit) should go up with stat bonus increases or none should!

Arrrrggghhh..

[Amber]

agreed

[Trinitis]

Yeh, this sucks. Hoorah Squares get to min/max! But you Semi's and pures! FUCK NO!

[Tsunami]

We're glad you're enjoying your experience with Simutronics, if there's anything else we can do to annoy your ass, please send it to feedback. Thank you.

[Doyle Hargraves]

That's retarded. If they do it across the board (health, etc.) that'd be one thing, but to single out just mana isn't just beef wellington, it's BEEF - IT'S WHAT'S FOR DINNER wellington.

What is it with MMO games always PWNING casters and buffing melees?

[Edited on 7-30-2005 by Doyle Hargraves]

[mgoddess]

Originally posted by Tsunami
We're glad you're enjoying your experience with Simutronics, if there's anything else we can do to annoy your ass, please send it to feedback. Thank you.

Exacto-fucking-loutely...

[Dwarven Empath]

Whats the big deal in loosing 3 or 4 mana? Sheesh

[Kitsun]

I lost 8 mana. Need to gain 107k exp to regain them. Thats a pain in my ass.

[Miss X]

Yeah exactly. It's a bug fix, the GM's are not out to take away your enjoyment! If you're really bothered by it, post on the official boards and ask for a one time stat reallocation. I think that would be a good way to balance out the fix for those that are really affected by it. :)

[Drew]

Lost 5 mana. It's like a resturant who made a two dollar mistake in your favour sending you the bill through the mail.

[Nakiro]

Lost 5 mana, of a previous total of 420. It really won't hurt me at all, and I'm willing to say it won't hurt most of you either.

[mgoddess]

*cough* I'm not all that angry about it...and yes, it's any easy fix.

But, the fact that they are making it so Mana is the *only* thing that doesn't take into account stat bonus increase over time (like HP, Stamina, and Spirit do)....just doesn't sit right with me.

(And for the record, yes I have posted on the officials about it. My warrior lady lost a whole 3 mana (went from 15 to 12), which is a big deal for her, since she's CoL. My youngin sorceress went from 69 mana to 64 (two and a half shots of 702, enough mana to get her fried). )

[Sylvan Dreams]

I went from 10 mana to 8, which is annoying since after using CoL signs, I was using exactly 10 mana. 1 rank of harness power bumped me up to 14, but it's still irritating.

[Edited on 7-30-2005 by Sylvan Dreams]

[Doyle Hargraves]

Originally posted by Drew
Lost 5 mana. It's like a resturant who made a two dollar mistake in your favour sending you the bill through the mail.

Simu's done that too.

[TheRoseLady]

Originally posted by Nakiro
....and I'm willing to say it won't hurt most of you either.

So why did they do it if the losses are neglible?

[Parker]

So am I completely confused, and miscounted, or did my empath actually gain mana?

[Tsunami]

The pain is, a lot of people had trained themselves to have just the amounts of mana they needed. And some losses were more significant than others. My worst lost 25 mana. Just another Simu blunder, there will be more.

[Chadj]

My bard lost 12 mana.

[Anailea]

Originally posted by Sylvan Dreams
I went from 10 mana to 8, which is annoying since after using CoL signs, I was using exactly 10 mana. 1 rank of harness power bumped me up to 14, but it's still irritating.

[Edited on 7-30-2005 by Sylvan Dreams]

Eventually, Simu will get around to fixing this new bug that they created with the most recent bug fix. Lots of people are getting more mana per new rank of HP then they should be.

It would be really cool it the bug-fixes that they released were bug-free. :shrug:

Anailea

[hectomaner]

Originally posted by Celember
Whats the big deal in loosing 3 or 4 mana? Sheesh

each of my older wizards lost 21-23 mana

[Shalla]

I can't remember how much mana I had, so I don't know whether I lost any. How much mana you have is based on how much base aura stat you have from the level 0 right?

[Syberus]

I lost 14 mana.. and then calculated what my mana should be, using the formula they gave us, and they fucked it up and took too much away. So now i get to sit here in the assist queue for 10 years to be told they don't know how to fix it.

[Terminator X]

I am almost positive that they did, or soon will add CON's initial Maximum HP bonus to this latest slew of improvements.


Yeh, this sucks. Hoorah Squares get to min/max! But you Semi's and pures! FUCK NO!

Playng both a square who has been affected by stuff and a pure who has been affected by stuff too, I disagree so sincerely with your complainant sarcasm in the above statement that it isn't even funny.

I need to spend 40 PTs now so that I can use CoL after this most recent fix, *hint-hint* I don't play a pure or semi.

[hectomaner]

Originally posted by Syberus
I lost 14 mana.. and then calculated what my mana should be, using the formula they gave us, and they fucked it up and took too much away. So now i get to sit here in the assist queue for 10 years to be told they don't know how to fix it.

i dont believe you. if you used the stat bonus, at level 0, or average of stat bonus', at level 0, then hp ranks * 3, up to level, then 1 mana per rank over level, you will come up with the amount you currently have

[Drew]

Originally posted by Shalla
I can't remember how much mana I had, so I don't know whether I lost any. How much mana you have is based on how much base aura stat you have from the level 0 right?

Put it this way, almost everyone who had mana lost it.

[Drew]

Originally posted by hectomaner

Originally posted by Syberus
I lost 14 mana.. and then calculated what my mana should be, using the formula they gave us, and they fucked it up and took too much away. So now i get to sit here in the assist queue for 10 years to be told they don't know how to fix it.

i dont believe you. if you used the stat bonus, at level 0, or average of stat bonus', at level 0, then hp ranks * 3, up to level, then 1 mana per rank over level, you will come up with the amount you currently have


Nope they shorted us:


>info start
Level 0 Stats for *******, Human Ranger

Strength (STR): 85
Constitution (CON): 60
Dexterity (DEX): 93
Agility (AGI): 91
Discipline (DIS): 52
Aura (AUR): 40
Logic (LOG): 66
Intuition (INT): 95
Wisdom (WIS): 58
Influence (INF): 20



So that's a 4 bonus for wisdom.


>skills

Harness Power......................| 142 42



42 x 3 = 126 + 4 = 130



>mana
Mana Points: 128 Remaining: 128

[Drew]

Apparently you are supposed divide your mana stat bonus by 2. ::shrug::

[Miss X]

Yep, you either add the bonuses of your two mana stats (at level 0) together, get the mean average and divide by two, or half the bonus (at level 0) if you only have one mana stat. That will give you your starting mana, then as others have said, 3 mana for every hp rank to your level and 1 mana for every hp rank after your level. :)

It's taken me a while to get the dividing thing too... So.. if you have two mana stats, you add the bonuses together, divide by two, then take the result of that calculation and divide by two again? :?:

[Edited on 31-7-05 by Miss X]

[Syberus]

So I guess it was right. I only divided by two twice instead of the mandatory four thousand three hundred and eighty times necessary to make sure the number was only 1 starting mana. Silly me

[AnticorRifling]

I went from 201 to 192. I always came back from a hunt after using gate with 30+ mana so I'm not worried about it. Even though it doesn't cause me much grief or issues I can say this is a poor change and stat growth should give you a higher base mana. It's as was stated earlier....pures can't min/max now but squares can.

Don't give me the but I'm in COL bitch either. Training up 1-2 HP ranks is less painful than being forced to raise a starting stat.

[Syberus]

Running the numbers.. It's going to take me 187k or so experience to get back to where I was a day or two ago. Hardly "no big deal"

[Soulpieced]

I think I lost 15 mana... Why the fuck does the formula use bonuses anyway?!

[Artha]

Running the numbers.. It's going to take me 187k or so experience to get back to where I was a day or two ago. Hardly "no big deal"
That's a lot of experience, but why does it matter? Are you unable to fry off a hunt with 12 less mana or whatever?

[Trinitis]

Originally posted by Terminator X
I am almost positive that they did, or soon will add CON's initial Maximum HP bonus to this latest slew of improvements.


Yeh, this sucks. Hoorah Squares get to min/max! But you Semi's and pures! FUCK NO!

Playng both a square who has been affected by stuff and a pure who has been affected by stuff too, I disagree so sincerely with your complainant sarcasm in the above statement that it isn't even funny.

I need to spend 40 PTs now so that I can use CoL after this most recent fix, *hint-hint* I don't play a pure or semi.

Tell ya what, I'll trade you.

The point I was making is pures cannot min/max their stats anymore. I normally took a hit on mana in the start, so that I could beef my Strength a bit, allowing me to carry more then a sheet of paper before my back was aching. If we want our max mana, we can't do that anymore, and I call bullshit.

Yes I know, most people lost between 12-24 mana. But looking at what pures are expected to do to hunt creatures their level, it's a painful loss.

As pures, we are expected to struggle with manuv attacks. Our only hopes of avoiding said attacks (in like level) was staying light, and using non-leathal attack spells to keep them from doing so. Now we are missing mana, and cannot beef our stats to help with weight. So what the fuck do we do now?

Edit to add : Also, do please keep in mind that TP's are unlimited, while mana is capped.



[Edited on 7-31-2005 by Adredrin]

[Syberus]

Originally posted by Artha

Running the numbers.. It's going to take me 187k or so experience to get back to where I was a day or two ago. Hardly "no big deal"
That's a lot of experience, but why does it matter? Are you unable to fry off a hunt with 12 less mana or whatever?


No, I can still fry... however the fact remains that I am no longer as well off as I was a few days ago. Another important reason for having more mana that immedietly comes to mind is using 714, which sucks a ton of mana. I'd imagine recharge does the same.

[hectomaner]

Originally posted by Drew

Originally posted by hectomaner

Originally posted by Syberus
I lost 14 mana.. and then calculated what my mana should be, using the formula they gave us, and they fucked it up and took too much away. So now i get to sit here in the assist queue for 10 years to be told they don't know how to fix it.

i dont believe you. if you used the stat bonus, at level 0, or average of stat bonus', at level 0, then hp ranks * 3, up to level, then 1 mana per rank over level, you will come up with the amount you currently have


Nope they shorted us:


>info start
Level 0 Stats for *******, Human Ranger

Strength (STR): 85
Constitution (CON): 60
Dexterity (DEX): 93
Agility (AGI): 91
Discipline (DIS): 52
Aura (AUR): 40
Logic (LOG): 66
Intuition (INT): 95
Wisdom (WIS): 58
Influence (INF): 20



So that's a 4 bonus for wisdom.


>skills

Harness Power......................| 142 42



42 x 3 = 126 + 4 = 130



>mana
Mana Points: 128 Remaining: 128

you obviously didnt read the announcement, or what i said, or you would know you are wrong

(4/2) + (42*3) = 128

[Latrinsorm]

Originally posted by Miss X
So.. if you have two mana stats, you add the bonuses together, divide by two, then take the result of that calculation and divide by two again?Yes.

Losing 14 out of 140 mana hurts much less than losing 3 out of 13. I'm a little surprised anyone can argue the contrary.

Of course you were better off when you had more mana. That doesn't mean bugs shouldn't be fixed.

[Terminator X]

<<AnticorRifling's post>>

Squares cannot debate whether they wish to use major claidhmore or cone of katars as they begin to put on the levels. Getting spells at every single train, or any single train, is an impossiblity for a rogue or warrior. I mean, a warrior might get 401 or 101... as some kind of joke, maybe.

The fact that squares have to mini-max so that they can accumulate a whopping maximum of +3 to their AS per level (if you just want to swing hard and out in the open) speaks for itself.

I guess that squares might have the right to bitch, though, if their guild skills became stamina-taxed and empaths and wizards could start learning feint... :oops:



Don't give me the but I'm in COL bitch either. Training up 1-2 HP ranks is less painful than being forced to raise a starting stat.

Horseshit. However I do, in fact, agree that with something as poorly-thought out as this recent mana-vasectomy, it would be nice, especially for PCs who have not had the oppurtunity to roll in with any sort of stat-reallocation, to be provided with the oppurtunity to do so.

Right now I'm waiting for my +15/+15 to come back, but I guess that if Simutronics decided to give me an insta-Voln-Master-freebie, maybe then I wouldn't have the right to complain as I actually do right now.

[Drew]

Originally posted by hectomaner

you obviously didnt read the announcement, or what i said, or you would know you are wrong

(4/2) + (42*3) = 128



Actually I read exactly what you said and then did my calculation.




Originally posted by hectomaner
if you used the stat bonus, at level 0, or average of stat bonus', at level 0, then hp ranks * 3, up to level, then 1 mana per rank over level, you will come up with the amount you currently have



You never mentioned anything about dividing by two. But apparently you didn't read the post below that one where I corrected myself.

[Drew]

Originally posted by Terminator X
I mean, a warrior might get 401 or 101... as some kind of joke, maybe.



Actually Megaladon knows how to cast 117, in full plate, with minimum hinderance.



-Being pedantic

[Gan]

Ha!

My empath gained 2 mana and my rogue gained 5 mana off the deal. I havnt checked the others yet, but since all stats were done with the same theory in mind (max TP's) I'm sure I gained on them as well.

:bouncing:

[Terminator X]

Originally posted by Adredrin
Also, do please keep in mind that TP's are unlimited, while mana is capped.

When I'm actually able to get around, say, 0.3% of the mana bonus a level 100 capped HP-tripler has, maybe then we will actually be even.

Fortunately for me, I rolled with 5 mana originally, so this recent fix has not been a huge deal, but it is problematic as everyone has been elaborating on. What I'm mostly concerned about right now is a mid-trained CoL square, who has to spend 160 PTPs to make their smiting, defending, striking and warding last the duration of a quick hunt because of the new max mana fix.

Believe it or not, certain professions probably should, in fact, avoid rolling with a STR of 100. All I can say, is that no matter how much a swinging haste-hunter wizard or shieldless OH-swinging empath complains about the mechanics of this recent fix, I'd hate to actually see how upset they'd be if the case had been that their STR bonuses had been nerfed.

Anyway...

Amount of critters that I've deliberately hunted that utilize a maneuver attacks = 1.. maybe..

Amount of critters that I've deliberately hunted that utilize an AS attack in addition to a possible CS attack free of maneuver attacks = More than 1.

.

If I am krag dweller age and hunt krag dwellers, or I am minotaur age and hunt minotaurs, I am asking for trouble if I am not utilizing one-hit kills.

In short, those who have rogues and especially those who have warriors in CoL are now going to suffer due to the fact that they have to unnecessarily butcher another stat in order to invest in, say, WIS, or spend 120-160 PTPs.

- The Termite

[OreoElf]

Damnit they screw something else up yet again.

[Heshinar]

I am not trying to get mana and probably wont ever. BUT

They fix something like this yet they ignore the problems such as lag during invasions. I think they need priorities and to see that things like LAG are more important. Especially when the lag is most likely a memory leak in the code. ALSO who is the brain dead idiot who cannot see the LOSS of players over the years due to these changes.

I think I went from 8 mana to 3 mana now. Not like I am going to get any spells anytime soon.

BTW should it cost me 67 points to get a spell?

[hectomaner]

Originally posted by Drew

Originally posted by hectomaner

you obviously didnt read the announcement, or what i said, or you would know you are wrong

(4/2) + (42*3) = 128



Actually I read exactly what you said and then did my calculation.




Originally posted by hectomaner
if you used the stat bonus, at level 0, or average of stat bonus', at level 0, then hp ranks * 3, up to level, then 1 mana per rank over level, you will come up with the amount you currently have



You never mentioned anything about dividing by two. But apparently you didn't read the post below that one where I corrected myself.


you are right, i said average of the stats. its really stat/2, or if 2 stats factor in (stat/2)/2

i am sorry, i was wrong in this case

[mgoddess]

Originally posted by Heshinar
BTW should it cost me 67 points to get a spell?

If you're playing a rogue, yeah. 67 MTP's per spell rank for rogues. 120 MTP's per spell rank for warriors. 17 MTP's per spell rank for semi's (rangers, paladins, bards). And of course, pures get 'em for cheap.

[AnticorRifling]

Thought it was 16 MTPs (or 32 PTPs) for a pure...

[GSLady17]

Originally posted by Heshinar
I am not trying to get mana and probably wont ever. BUT

They fix something like this yet they ignore the problems such as lag during invasions. I think they need priorities and to see that things like LAG are more important. Especially when the lag is most likely a memory leak in the code. ALSO who is the brain dead idiot who cannot see the LOSS of players over the years due to these changes.

I think I went from 8 mana to 3 mana now. Not like I am going to get any spells anytime soon.

BTW should it cost me 67 points to get a spell?



I agree with you on this 100%. Just recently I was getting frustrated because it was a pain in the butt to hunt with all the lag due to the invasion.

My boyfriend and I got in an argument about it. I thought that they should find a way to support all the people dying. He said it was hard on the game when you have that many dying and just kind of laughed at me.

I was upset that my Warrior was in Voln and not COL since all my other characters are in COL. I missed the extra AS. Then I realized that with Strength, Sym of Courage, and especially the Combat Maneuver- Surge of Strength, she did very well. In fact, I don't even use the Symbol of Courage. Not to mention War cries that I also don’t use to boost AS (Need to be in a group I believe) or to lower the creature’s defense.

Here are some examples that I had wish I had seen before I almost ditched Voln and went with COL. The defense is lowered due to hiding and ambush. But you can lower it even more with other guild skills.

Here is Nothing: AS: +421 vs DS: +282 with AvD: +36 + d100 roll: +79 = +254

Here is with just Symbol of Courage: AS: +447 vs DS: +221 with AvD: +32 + d100 roll: +82 = +340

Here is just with Surge: AS: +441 vs DS: +243 with AvD: +32 + d100 roll: +6 = +236


Here is courage and Surge: AS: AS: +467 vs DS: +243 with AvD: +32 + d100 roll: +96 = +352

Throw in a Blue Crystal (Which I now give away or leave on the ground due to so many): AS: +542 vs DS: +243 with AvD: +32 + d100 roll: +83 = +414

As for defense, I have no clue on that. I don’t hunt with a shield so that the treasure goes right to my hand but unless I fall asleep and am discovered in hiding by a creature or my mind is else where, I get a scratch at the most.

I won't say that it isn't an inconvenience for some players with the lack of Mana. But having 4 characters ranging from 22-89 that don't cast at all, I almost think that they should not depend on Mana at all.

Rogues and Warriors get really neat Guild Skills and CM maneuvers. Should they also get Mana too? Why not give the casters something?

Someone mentioned not having enough Mana to fry. There are always wands. That's what my little wizard did until she was around 15 trains. And then she had enough Mana to fry easy.

Many Wizards have a hard time frying when young. Many professions have a hard time when young. Healers, can't heal well until they are older, Clerics can't raise; Locksmiths have a hard time picking and so on.

It is a pain in the ass, but it does make the game more of a challenge. If a game was easy as cake, what would be the point in playing? Challenges are what make it fun!

I'm not saying stop crying or anything. I do understand it can be hard. But with any profession, when you title, it can become easier.

[Latrinsorm]

Originally posted by GSLady17
Why not give the casters something?70 spells isn't good enough?

[GSLady17]

No, that is their bonus.

I always imagined the Warriors walking around with big swords. Their sword, almost being a best friend. That's what they should depend on.

Then Casters, depend on their mana.

I just can't see why you would need a square to depend on Mana is all.

[Artha]

Not everyone has 18 accounts so that they can make sure they've got every sharable spell on.

[Dwarven Empath]

:sleep: lmfao

[GSLady17]

I understand this. But when I hunt with my rogue, all she wears is strength and does fine. She doesn't even need that except I like to stay out until there is not an inch of room on her to hold a box.

She just hides and ambushes, so spells are really not that needed. She doesn't give the creatures a chance to hit her.

I’m not saying it’s not hard. I’m just saying although a square may depend on some spells, they shouldn’t fully depend on spells or Mana.


Strength, is easy to get as well there are many crystals around. I would also be happy to imbed that, or anything else needed for anyone who wishes. I can also recharge crystals. Lord knows I have over 50 Blue ones, so if anyone would like a dozen charged blue crystals, give me a yell. I need to get rid of some.

I understand not everyone has spells on hand like I do, but I am always willing to share the spells with anyone that wishes. And yes, it can be a pain to find some one to get spells all the time. This is why I offer to charge crystals and imbed for free.

[cajunlady]

I actually posted in another topic in role-play in an assist I reqiested regarding this "fix". Just as it is pretty damn expensive for a caster to reain in combat manuevers, its expensive as well for someone like say, a rogue to train in harness power, and even more so to train in either the minor or elemetal circle. I was told recently as my rogue when she complained that damn it was a lot to train in arcane i think it was *not a Lady yet*, rogues aren't attuned to magic, of course it will be more difficult to learn. After this "fix" she went from 3 to 0, and she was sure she'd caught some ailment when it never returned. She forgot she didn't have any, as she rarely uses it, and tried to sign of thought and OUCH what a damn headache she got. But I'll train her in harness once and be done with it, so she can use her signs. I miss what I had only because I had it to begin with. Could be worse.

[GSLady17]

It is very expensive. But if you can pull it off, then what an accomplishment!

Teeoncy is trained 30 times in harness power and 24 in Elemental share. I'm guessing to get spells off other players, since she can not send to Kataleena.

I wanted to get rid of it, but my boyfriend talked me out of it. Then when I started to think about it, it is nice to have something trained in for a Warrior that has to do with magic. With that, she can wear spells and avoid spell burst which will come in handy if she decides to hunt the Barrier full time.

[Rainy Day]

Originally posted by Terminator X[In short, those who have rogues and especially those who have warriors in CoL are now going to suffer due to the fact that they have to unnecessarily butcher another stat in order to invest in, say, WIS, or spend 120-160 PTPs.

- The Termite

A lot of exaggeration going on. My rogue is in COL so put a higher Aura anyway so wouldn't have to worry about spirit. With that and 3 ranks of HP I have 19 mana after the change. It's plenty.

Where is this having to spend 120-160 TPs coming from?! If you start with 0 mana 5 ranks of HP costs 45 MTP and gives you 15 mana.

For pures, it's all exaggerated too. If optimal stats at cap is all fired important, then what in hell difference does 12 mana make when you get there? You think you NEED to redo your stats for that?

RD

[GSLady17]

Originally posted by Rainy Day

Originally posted by Terminator X[In short, those who have rogues and especially those who have warriors in CoL are now going to suffer due to the fact that they have to unnecessarily butcher another stat in order to invest in, say, WIS, or spend 120-160 PTPs.

- The Termite

A lot of exaggeration going on. My rogue is in COL so put a higher Aura anyway so wouldn't have to worry about spirit. With that and 3 ranks of HP I have 19 mana after the change. It's plenty.

Where is this having to spend 120-160 TPs coming from?! If you start with 0 mana 5 ranks of HP costs 45 MTP and gives you 15 mana.

For pures, it's all exaggerated too. If optimal stats at cap is all fired important, then what in hell difference does 12 mana make when you get there? You think you NEED to redo your stats for that?

RD

For a warrior, that should be enough for COL, and not that expensive at all.

[Edited on 8-2-2005 by GSLady17]

Originally posted by Artha

That's a lot of experience, but why does it matter? Are you unable to fry off a hunt with 12 less mana or whatever?

I guess what I don't like about the change is that it's really pointless. All that was accomplished was another minor game change that manages to piss off a portion of their customers.

I agree that it doesn't have much impact on gameplay, but I just think the ill-will generated by these kind of weekly game tweaks is never taken into account.

I swear, sometimes it seems like it's just one character/skill downtweak after another. GS3 was a much better game. :D

[Landrion]

Originally posted by Tea & Strumpets

Originally posted by Artha

That's a lot of experience, but why does it matter? Are you unable to fry off a hunt with 12 less mana or whatever?

I guess what I don't like about the change is that it's really pointless. All that was accomplished was another minor game change that manages to piss off a portion of their customers.

I agree that it doesn't have much impact on gameplay, but I just think the ill-will generated by these kind of weekly game tweaks is never taken into account.

I swear, sometimes it seems like it's just one character/skill downtweak after another. GS3 was a much better game. :D

That does confuse me sometimes. I dont know what the point of a fix like this was. It's small enough to not be much of a balance difference but big enough to really irritate someone who got hit by it.

I dont think it would have been such a big deal to change the rule so that growth was incorporated. Why this stubborn attatchment to "starting" stats when nothing else works that way is beyond me.

Who would have bitched if the formula took current stats instead? Most people would have gained a few points and been happy.

Like I said on the officials, its 11 mana, I'll live. It just could have been done better.

[GSLady17]

If you have to clean the Kitchen, you might bitch. (Perhaps a spouse, sibling, roommate should be doing it)

Then you have to clean the bathroom. Same above applies.


This goes on until every room in your house is clean.

Compared to a house, 1 room is small. But when you clean/fix them all, you now have a whole house clean.

Little things can add up in time to be much more.

Yes, I need to sleep, I am sorry.


I do disagree with all the minor changes pissing everyone off. There have been minor changes that I have loved. Rewards and Challenges! Without them, the game would be very dull in my opinion.

[Trinitis]

For pures, it's all exaggerated too. If optimal stats at cap is all fired important, then what in hell difference does 12 mana make when you get there? You think you NEED to redo your stats for that?


Just because casters can kill and fry with a single spell at lower levels, does not mean they can do the same at higher levels.

If I go to the rift, I've got to curse each creature before I kill it, use forget to keep them from dispelling me, dispell them sometimes, and use crowd control. All of which are non-leathal mana sinks. 20 mana may not seem like a lot too some, but when I'm already having to use sacrifice, symbol of mana, and a rod with mana leech in it, it hurts.

Edit to add: And to jump the gun before someone brings it up, yes I could hunt someplace else. Lets see.. How about the tower in EN?

Manuver attacks, so I've got to use crowd control/anti-manuver spells. Casters who can ward me, so I need to keep forget handy. It's basicly the same thing.

And don't even get me started on Illoke..



[Edited on 8-2-2005 by Adredrin]

[StrayRogue]

And squares don't have to worry about these things too? Crowd control is much easier as a pure than it is as a square. We have much less stamina, which are more intensive cost wise and have a greater chance of failing.

[Trinitis]

Originally posted by StrayRogue
And squares don't have to worry about these things too? Crowd control is much easier as a pure than it is as a square. We have much less stamina, which are more intensive cost wise and have a greater chance of failing.

True true. But squares can also take a hit or two. It has been a while since I was in GS, but I remember Adredrin's DS being around 340 or so. In a sudden swarm, his DS drops to about...oh..110. A single hit on Adredrin = death. No questions asked. It's either an instant kill, or a stun. Stuns are death anyways, so the fact is moot.

I'm not implying that this change has only effected pures. I am implying this change was basicly pointless. I see no purpose for the change. There was no reason for it to be done. Was the game broken because people had 20 more mana? It did more hurt then it did good.

[Edited on 8-2-2005 by Adredrin]

[GSLady17]

Originally posted by Adredrin


For pures, it's all exaggerated too. If optimal stats at cap is all fired important, then what in hell difference does 12 mana make when you get there? You think you NEED to redo your stats for that?


Just because casters can kill and fry with a single spell at lower levels, does not mean they can do the same at higher levels.

If I go to the rift, I've got to curse each creature before I kill it, use forget to keep them from dispelling me, dispell them sometimes, and use crowd control. All of which are non-leathal mana sinks. 20 mana may not seem like a lot too some, but when I'm already having to use sacrifice, symbol of mana, and a rod with mana leech in it, it hurts.

Edit to add: And to jump the gun before someone brings it up, yes I could hunt someplace else. Lets see.. How about the tower in EN?

Manuver attacks, so I've got to use crowd control/anti-manuver spells. Casters who can ward me, so I need to keep forget handy. It's basicly the same thing.

And don't even get me started on Illoke..



[Edited on 8-2-2005 by Adredrin]



How many trains are you? A recent Sorcerer who had just turned 70 was in the tower and I went around with him killing things.

He kicked ass. Not only did he kick ass, but I sent him mana (could never get it all through because he was full) and offered that if I was ever around, the mana was his all he had to do was ask since as a warrior, I don't use it.

He replied, "I never have a problem with mana here."

He also, was not using rods or scrolls or any of that sort of thing.

Same thing as the Rift or not, it has to be better. Doesn't the Rift suck mana from you? The tower doesn't.

[StrayRogue]

I agree that Pure DS sucks. I recently played a 63 sorc who had something like a 430 DS. Stay's is hovering around that unspelled at 55. And yeah, it was a pointless change indeed.

[Trinitis]

I guess this other sorcerer is just plain better then me then. I can't hunt tower without running out of mana. The last time I was there, I was there with Chica and she had to feed me all her mana, plus wrack and do it again to fry me.

[GSLady17]

Hm. How odd.

It is nice for a Warrior though, I walk around the tower without my shield out so that the treasure flys right to my hand.

Go full plate! Go Redux!

But personally, I enjoy pures more.

[Miss X]

Awww, but I didnt mind cos I love ya! :heart:

Rift is just SOOO much better than the tower anyway.

[GSLady17]

Guess it all depends on how you hunt. Tower is dark, very easy to hide.

[Trinitis]

I must say, this change just piles onto the other changes that have been passed out in GS lately that just upset me.

They already removed invasions as something I can do with Adredrin. Now they are making hunting even harder. Next thing you know, they are going to make the same change to HP, Stamina, and AS (strength).

They are making this game less and less fun for a more "realistic" aspect, and it's just fucking dumb.

[Edited on 8-2-2005 by Adredrin]

[Trinitis]

Originally posted by Miss X
Awww, but I didnt mind cos I love ya! :heart:

Rift is just SOOO much better than the tower anyway.

You may :heart: me. But that Chica gives Adredrin nothin but a hard time. :lol:

[Latrinsorm]

Originally posted by Adredrin
They already removed invasions as something I can do with Adredrin.Yeah, if they had any sense they would have let you train in a skill to reduce or eliminate those effects.

[Heshinar]

I know this is a side thought but...

If it costs me 67 points as a Rogue to get 1 spell. How much does it cost a Sorc/wiz to get lockpicking and disarm?

The balance is what I am wondering.

[StrayRogue]

2/6 and 2/4.

[Heshinar]

Hrmm so it costs me 0/67 to get even one spell and a mage can do my job almost as cheaply as I can.


Also how are the Critters calculated for Mana? A age 16 Grey Orc that can fight hard wtih a Edged weapon and cast multiple gas clouds.

Is that calculated for mana?

[Rainy Day]

Originally posted by Heshinar
Also how are the Critters calculated for Mana? A age 16 Grey Orc that can fight hard wtih a Edged weapon and cast multiple gas clouds.

Is that calculated for mana?

The new style creatures can run out of mana. (They even blow their nerves.) I don't think the old ones that aren't converted yet do.

RD

[Gridlock]

:deadhorse:

[StrayRogue]

Originally posted by Heshinar
Hrmm so it costs me 0/67 to get even one spell and a mage can do my job almost as cheaply as I can.




Haha no. A mage cannot come even close to picking locks like a rogue can. As a trade off a rogue can never manage the magical based attacks that a mage can.

[Heshinar]

Don't get me wrong I wasnt complaining I wanted to know the state of things in this case.

I am not that fond of the Magic Classes other than Cleric and Bard.

Otherwise I am quite content as a Rogue.

[Heshinar]

Okay been trying to figure out this mana thing.

Bard
6 Minor Elemental
19 Bard Ranks
24 Ranks of HP
Wis Bonus 8

Mana - 81

Formula that I saw here if I understand it right
(8/2) + (24*3) = 76

What did I miss? Where did that extra 5 mana come from and my mana was re-done when I logged in.

I am trying to figure out cost of mana to hunt and such.

I run with
1003
1006
1007
1010
1019

I just watched the renewal cost - 36

I am in trouble in the wild if I stay out too long.

Any Ideas would be helpful.

[Edited on 8-11-2005 by Heshinar]

[Edited on 8-11-2005 by Heshinar]

[Latrinsorm]

Bard's mana stats are Aura and Influence (because they are Elemental/Mental hybrids). Wisdom is for Spiritual guys and gals.

[Heshinar]

Okay

Aura - 100(25)
Influence - 100 (30)




Still

(24*3) = 72

Aura bonus 25/2 = 12.5
Influence bonus 30/2 = 15

So if I am doing the math right shouldnt it either be
84.5 probably rounded down to 84
or
87?

[Latrinsorm]

It's your STARTING stats for Aura and Influence.

[Heshinar]

Hrmmmm

Starting was
Aura - 91
Inf - 93


Would that be as much as 4-5 points difference between stats?

Interesting.