Time to start 2xing Ambush again :(

[StrayRogue]

In reviewing a recent bug report regarding low level ambushers vs. high level defenders, a problem was found that extends beyond just Player vs Player combat.

The formula for the amount of stance reduction is based on the attacker's ambush ranks vs. the defender's level, and is adjusted for the defender's Perception skill, and Intuition bonus. However, the combat code is currently reading incorrect information for the target's starting condition, treating all targets' initial stances as full offensive. So when attacked from hiding, regardless of the attacker's relative skill, the resultant effective stance is full offensive.

Clearly, this is a problem that must be remedied. While the ambushing system in GS4 is intended to reduce a target's defenses to simulate that the target is surprised when attacked from hiding, it is not supposed to do so in the manner it currently is today.

When the bug is fixed, it will result in a substantial change for some characters. Those who use Ambushing will find that they will no longer knock their target's defenses down so drastically and with such consistency. As noted above, the degree and consistency with which a defender's defenses are reduced will vary depending on the attacker's Ambush training, the defender's level, Perception skill, and Intuition bonus.

Due to the nature of this bug fix, every player will be granted two FIXSKILLS in the coming week. The bug fix will be implemented tomorrow evening. All players will be granted a FIXSKILLS tomorrow, and on Saturday, June 11th, every player will be granted another FIXSKILLS. Remember, if you already have an unused FIXSKILLS, additional FIXSKILLS do not accrue. If you have not used the yearly FIXSKILLS released on May 20th, you will still only have one when this bug-related FIXSKILLS is released.

This message was originally posted in Hunting and Game Design Discussions, All About Skills. To discuss the above follow the link below.

[Drew]

shit shit crap crap

[Drew]

DAMNIT, you have to be kidding me

[Asha]

Yey!
:hump:
Fixskills too
:hump:
:hump:

[Drew]

I can't begin to imagine if this hurts any class more than rangers.

[Amaron]

So if I already double in ambush... I am fully trained in it I should be ok....?

J

[StrayRogue]

You'll be fine hun.

[Fallen]

Depends. You WILL be less proficient in amushing like level/higher level creatures, and pushing like/higher level players into full offensive. How much more? We wont know until the changes roll in.

[Edited on 6-6-2005 by Fallen]

[Drew]

Originally posted by Fallen
Depends. You WILL be less proficient in amushing like level/higher level creatures, and pushing like/higher level players into full offensive. How much more? We wont know until the changes roll in.

[Edited on 6-6-2005 by Fallen]


It's not like ambush was paticularly powerful now.

[Gan]

Ganny will be ok with his 2x ambushing so WHEW.

I also read this as if you want less of a DS pushdown in defending against ambushing then you'll want to bump up your preception skill ranks as well as ensure your intuition stat is in good shape.

Yay for the fixskill, I need to do some more tweaking on my empath. Boo in that I need to scare up some points for more perception.

[Fallen]

I may start doubling perception, actually. It will be amusing when dealing with uppity rogues.

[StrayRogue]

It won't effect me too much. I can generate a stable hunting AS well over the defensive DS of folk my level. Not that I'm designed around PvP. All I need to do is hit the target, heh.

[Gan]

I intend to beef up my empath's perception drastically and see what it does in OTF against the Ithzir scouts.

I'll post some results if I see anything drastic.

[Soulpieced]

Wa wa wa, it wasn't working like it was supposed to. I always figured something was wrong since stupid scouts have a 100% chance of forcing me into offensive.

[Drew]

Originally posted by StrayRogue
It won't effect me too much. I can generate a stable hunting AS well over the defensive DS of folk my level.


That's Chiv's problem, the stuff he hunts has a DS of about 290 in defensive and his base AS is about 255.

[StrayRogue]

It might give me a reason to use swiftkick again. We'll see.

[StrayRogue]

From Ildran:

You'll probably see your effectiveness drop some. Against like-leveled targets, you'll still drop their stance a significant amount (generally 60% or more), but not down to full offensive every time. Against higher level targets, you'll be noticably less effective than a 2xer.


And by the looks of it SP it might not effect critter ambushing. Well Ildran doesn't know if it does or does not yet. I'll keep ya posted.

[AnticorRifling]

From Anticor: HAHAHA Take that you fucks!

From my rogue: This is bullshit but I'm fully 2x in ambush so it doesn't matter much to me.

From your mom: Damn Wayne is a sexy beast.

[AnticorRifling]

If all players get the fixskills I'm gonna burn one real fast and see if I can't swing faster w00t.

[Syberus]

I wonder how much of a difference perception will make as far as 0x-1x and then from 1x-2x. I may also find it worthwhile to start working towards 2x if the benefit isn't too bad with diminishing returns.

[AnticorRifling]

FYI 100 air lore ranks does infact let you swing a second faster but I think I give up too much to be able to go from 3 second lance RT to 2 second lance RT:

Anticor (at level 64), your current skill bonuses and ranks (including all modifiers) are:
Skill Name | Current Current
| Bonus Ranks
Armor Use..........................| 111 27
Combat Maneuvers...................| 166 66
Polearm Weapons....................| 165 65
Physical Fitness...................| 105 25
Harness Power......................| 163 63
Elemental Mana Control.............| 93 21
Elemental Lore - Air...............| 200 100
Perception.........................| 120 30
Climbing...........................| 120 30
Swimming...........................| 120 30

Spell Lists
Major Elemental....................| 33

Spell Lists
Minor Elemental....................| 64

Spell Lists
Wizard.............................| 30

It's fun but on the 11th I'll be going back to my old plan heh.

[AnticorRifling]

You thrust with a sinuous black ora pike at a lesser griffin!
AS: +351 vs DS: +194 with AvD: +33 + d100 roll: +73 = +263
... and hit for 165 points of damage!
A mighty blow cleaves a swath through the lesser griffin's back, taking the spine with it.
The lesser griffin crashes to the ground, motionless.
Roundtime: 7 sec.
Roundtime changed to 2 seconds.

[Syberus]

Now you just need to learn how to mstrike.

[AnticorRifling]

Haste > mstrike

I can swing at 3 creatures 1 time in 6 seconds with haste. No way I could do that with mstrike with a lance.

[Amaron]

OK so my rogue 2.5x in perception and fully 2x in ambush should be ok just have to watch up hunting...

I wish they would give a stat fix along with it as some folks might need to tweak their intuition.

I should be ok but would be a nice option.

J

[Amaron]

OK so my rogue 2.5x in perception and fully 2x in ambush should be ok just have to watch up hunting...

I wish they would give a stat fix along with it as some folks might need to tweak their intuition.

I should be ok but would be a nice option.

J

[Fallen]

I still see the option available when I check into the Inn. Has anyone tried to recently adjust their stats?

[Sean of the Thread]

YES... FIXSKILLS!!! Since I was drunk as shit and forgot to use mine before the yearly!!! YES.1!!

[Miss X]

So.... Will this effect critters too? Does it mean if I have more perception, the scouts ambush will not push my DS down as much?

Also, if I use my may fixskills today to try out a runestaff, I can re-change it tomorrow and still get a fixskills on sat? Wow if I read that correctly it rocks!

[Sean of the Thread]

Originally posted by Miss X
So.... Will this effect critters too? Does it mean if I have more perception, the scouts ambush will not push my DS down as much?

Also, if I use my may fixskills today to try out a runestaff, I can re-change it tomorrow and still get a fixskills on sat? Wow if I read that correctly it rocks!

I'd like to know about the perception crunch with critters as well. ASAP this week.. before I fixskills.

That is the way I read it.. I'm pumped to go brawling/shield and ditch the runestave... if I hate it buh bye.

I've always 2x'd in ambush.

It's nice swinging, like, a crowbill and getting head crits.

[Gan]

Originally posted by Miss X
So.... Will this effect critters too? Does it mean if I have more perception, the scouts ambush will not push my DS down as much?

Also, if I use my may fixskills today to try out a runestaff, I can re-change it tomorrow and still get a fixskills on sat? Wow if I read that correctly it rocks!

You've read it correctly.

I'm running a 604 DS-guarded/461 DS-ambush-offensive; wearing all spells including wizards and a statue at 8.5:1 runestaff and zero perception training. Offensive DS and Ambush DS are the same at this point when being ambushed by an Ithzir scout.

I'm adding 100 ranks of perception and pushing my runestaff/magic to 9.97:1 and will compare the guarded/ambush DS this evening after work once they give us fixskills today. I'm expecting a jump in overall DS but will compare the ambush DS to offensive DS to make sure I'm seeing any differences that might be from perception training.

[Miss X]

Well with all wizard spells and a small statue, my DS is about 640 with brawl/shield. I was going to test out my DS with a runestaff to see if there is a difference, then switch back tomorrow if I hate it. I only have 30 perc ranks at the moment though and I'm pwnd by scout ambush a lot.

[fallenSaint]

Originally posted by Miss X
Well with all wizard spells and a small statue, my DS is about 640 with brawl/shield. I was going to test out my DS with a runestaff to see if there is a difference, then switch back tomorrow if I hate it. I only have 30 perc ranks at the moment though and I'm pwnd by scout ambush a lot.

From the way I read it you should get a greater advantage by training up some percep ranks to counter their ambush. And talk to kit for the whole runestaff training thing his take on it seems to work rather well.

[Edited on 6-6-2005 by fallenSaint]

[Fallen]

I don't think the Ambush changes have gone through yet, have they?

[stfu]

It's tonight, the 6th, that the "bug fix" is supposed to go into place.

[StrayRogue]

I'd like to know who has said it would effect GM's. The last time I asked Ildran said he didn't know. That hasn't changed.

[Sean of the Thread]

Now I'm confused?? What you saying?

[AnticorRifling]

He's british. It happens.

[StrayRogue]

Originally posted by Xyelin
Now I'm confused?? What you saying?

I'm saying that NO ONE official has said that these changes would in anyway effect creatures in respect to their ambushing.

[Gan]

I interpreted it to mean more than PvP and possibly critter ambushes and ambushing against critters by reading the following line.

<In reviewing a recent bug report regarding low level ambushers vs. high level defenders, a problem was found that extends beyond just Player vs Player combat. >

I cant confirm that it will effect our Ambush DS or that perception will effect it either; however, since I've got 2 fixskills coming up this week I'm going to do some testing from the ambushee perspective and see if it makes a difference.

[Edited on 6-6-2005 by Ganalon]

[StrayRogue]

I guess we'll have to see. It better effect critters...

[TheRoseLady]

Announcement: We will be rolling in the ambush bug fix referenced in NEWS 2 39 in one hour. The first free FIXSKILLS will be granted at the same time.

[AnticorRifling]

Announcement: We will be rolling in the ambush bug fix referenced in NEWS 2 39 in one hour. The first free FIXSKILLS will be granted at the same time.

[isebumples]

Announcement: The ambushing bug fix is now active, along with the first free FIXSKILLS. Please see NEWS 2 39 for more information.

[Gan]

Originally posted by Ganalon

You've read it correctly.

I'm running a 604 DS-guarded/461 DS-ambush-offensive; wearing all spells including wizards and a statue at 8.5:1 runestaff and zero perception training. Offensive DS and Ambush DS are the same at this point when being ambushed by an Ithzir scout.

I'm adding 100 ranks of perception and pushing my runestaff/magic to 9.97:1 and will compare the guarded/ambush DS this evening after work once they give us fixskills today. I'm expecting a jump in overall DS but will compare the ambush DS to offensive DS to make sure I'm seeing any differences that might be from perception training.


Ok, after getting PWNND 3 times tonight due to some of the most fiesty'est Ithzir I've seen in a long time, I've come to the following conclusion about being the ambushee and perception ranks. This was tested with the same 4x runestaff, same 3.5x FGB, and the same spells worn (empath+wizard+small statue).

My DS Guarded jumped from 604 to 627 (probably due to increasing magical skills ration from 8.5:1 to 10:1)

My Ambushed DS (from guarded stance) jumped from 461 to variable scores ranging from 523 to 604. (I think this is due to either variable genned levels or variable skill placement of genned scouts, or both)

My Offensive DS changed from 461 to 483. (Again probably due to magical ratio increasing - see above).

The most glaring thing is the difference between my new Offensive DS and my new Ambushed DS. This leads me to believe that the 100 ranks of perception I added actually helped defend against ambushing by Ithzir scouts which are within 10 trainings of my empath (91+ vs. 100).

As a side note, I decreased FA training from 302 ranks to 200 ranks, and noticed NO difference in damage with bone shatter being cast. I'll try 1110 tomorrow and see if I notice a difference. I also increased my manipulation ranks from 20 to 56 and noticed significant increases in one cast crit/kills with 1106.

[FinisWolf]

I wanted to share some lower level testing that I did. Discuss if you wish ~LONG~

==============================================

(at level 29 - Ranger), your current skill bonuses and ranks (including all modifiers) are:
Skill Name | Current Current
| Bonus Ranks
Armor Use..........................| 120 30
Shield Use.........................| 160 60
Edged Weapons......................| 160 60
Ambush.............................| 120 30
Physical Fitness...................| 105 25
Dodging............................| 99 23
Harness Power......................| 120 30
Spirit Mana Control................| 105 25
Survival...........................| 120 30
Stalking and Hiding................| 160 60
Perception.........................| 160 60
Climbing...........................| 105 25
Swimming...........................| 25 5

Spell Lists
Ranger.............................| 29

[vs. train 64 Rogue - 3x perception/1X ambush/1x cman/2x hide]

HIDE:

You leap from hiding to attack!
You swing a sugar maple hafted grey waraxe at Promotay!
AS: +245 vs DS: +375 with AvD: +29 + d100 roll: +45 = -56
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 6 sec.

Camouflage:

You leap from hiding to attack!
You swing a sugar maple hafted grey waraxe at Promotay!
AS: +275 vs DS: +375 with AvD: +29 + d100 roll: +80 = +9
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 6 sec.

ATTACK:

You swing a sugar maple hafted grey waraxe at Promotay!
AS: +245 vs DS: +375 with AvD: +29 + d100 roll: +36 = -65
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 5 sec.

[vs. train 33 Cleric - 10 ranks perception/0 ambush/0 cman/0 hide]

HIDE:

You leap from hiding to attack!
You swing a sugar maple hafted grey waraxe at Beauxyeux!
AS: +245 vs DS: +319 with AvD: +29 + d100 roll: +65 = +20
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 6 sec.

Camouflage:

You leap from hiding to attack!
You swing a sugar maple hafted grey waraxe at Beauxyeux!
AS: +275 vs DS: +323 with AvD: +29 + d100 roll: +58 = +39
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 6 sec.

ATTACK:

You swing a sugar maple hafted grey waraxe at Beauxyeux!
AS: +245 vs DS: +390 with AvD: +29 + d100 roll: +85 = -31
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 5 sec.

[vs. train 38 wizard - 25 ranks perception/ 0 ambush/0 cman/0 hide]

HIDE:

You leap from hiding to attack!
You swing a sugar maple hafted grey waraxe at Filswolf!
AS: +245 vs DS: +301 with AvD: +29 + d100 roll: +44 = +17
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 6 sec.

Camouflage:

You leap from hiding to attack!
You swing a sugar maple hafted grey waraxe at Filswolf!
AS: +275 vs DS: +313 with AvD: +29 + d100 roll: +46 = +37
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 6 sec.

ATTACK:

You swing a sugar maple hafted grey waraxe at Filswolf!
AS: +245 vs DS: +357 with AvD: +29 + d100 roll: +69 = -14
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 5 sec.

[vs. train 53 paladin - 0 ranks perception/ 0 ambush/90 cman/0 hide]

HIDE:

You leap from hiding to attack!
You swing a sugar maple hafted grey waraxe at Finiswolf!
AS: +245 vs DS: +421 with AvD: +32 + d100 roll: +36 = -108
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 6 sec.

Camouflage:

You leap from hiding to attack!
You swing a sugar maple hafted grey waraxe at Finiswolf!
AS: +275 vs DS: +421 with AvD: +32 + d100 roll: +37 = -77
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 6 sec.

ATTACK:

You swing a sugar maple hafted grey waraxe at Finiswolf!
AS: +245 vs DS: +421 with AvD: +32 + d100 roll: +72 = -72
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 5 sec.
Roundtime changed to 3 seconds.

================================================== =====================

(at level 27 - Rogue), your current skill bonuses and ranks (including all modifiers) are:
Skill Name | Current Current
| Bonus Ranks
Armor Use..........................| 114 28
Shield Use.........................| 156 56
Combat Maneuvers...................| 156 56
Edged Weapons......................| 156 56
Thrown Weapons.....................| 156 56
Ambush.............................| 158 58
Physical Fitness...................| 117 29
Dodging............................| 117 29
Harness Power......................| 50 10
Stalking and Hiding................| 158 58
Perception.........................| 158 58
Climbing...........................| 105 25
Swimming...........................| 20 4
Pickpocketing......................| 158 58

[vs. train 64 Rogue - 3x perception/1X ambush/1x cman/2x hide]

HIDE:

You leap from hiding to attack!
You swing a scarlet hilted vultite falchion at Promotay!
AS: +278 vs DS: +375 with AvD: +27 + d100 roll: +78 = +8
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 6 sec.

OPEN AMBUSH:

You swing a scarlet hilted vultite falchion at Promotay!
AS: +278 vs DS: +375 with AvD: +27 + d100 roll: +30 = -40
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 6 sec.

ATTACK:

You swing a scarlet hilted vultite falchion at Promotay!
AS: +278 vs DS: +375 with AvD: +27 + d100 roll: +54 = -16
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 5 sec.

[vs. train 33 Cleric - 10 ranks perception/0 ambush/0 cman/0 hide]

HIDE:

You leap from hiding to attack!
You swing a scarlet hilted vultite falchion at Beauxyeux!
AS: +278 vs DS: +291 with AvD: +34 + d100 roll: +44 = +65
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 6 sec.

OPEN AMBUSH:

You swing a scarlet hilted vultite falchion at Beauxyeux!
AS: +278 vs DS: +390 with AvD: +34 + d100 roll: +92 = +14
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 6 sec.

ATTACK:

You swing a scarlet hilted vultite falchion at Beauxyeux!
AS: +278 vs DS: +390 with AvD: +34 + d100 roll: +68 = -10
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 5 sec.

[vs. train 38 wizard - 25 ranks perception/ 0 ambush/0 cman/0 hide]

HIDE:

You leap from hiding to attack!
You swing a scarlet hilted vultite falchion at Filswolf!
AS: +278 vs DS: +294 with AvD: +34 + d100 roll: +57 = +40
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 6 sec.

OPEN AMBUSH:

You swing a scarlet hilted vultite falchion at Filswolf!
AS: +243 vs DS: +321 with AvD: +34 + d100 roll: +52 = +8
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 6 sec.

ATTACK:

You swing a scarlet hilted vultite falchion at Filswolf!
AS: +278 vs DS: +321 with AvD: +34 + d100 roll: +60 = +16
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 5 sec.

[vs. train 53 paladin - 0 ranks perception/ 0 ambush/90 cman/0 hide]

HIDE:

You leap from hiding to attack!
You swing a scarlet hilted vultite falchion at Finiswolf!
AS: +278 vs DS: +421 with AvD: +32 + d100 roll: +78 = -33
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 6 sec.

OPEN AMBUSH:

You swing a scarlet hilted vultite falchion at Finiswolf!
AS: +278 vs DS: +421 with AvD: +32 + d100 roll: +29 = -82
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 6 sec.

ATTACK:

You swing a scarlet hilted vultite falchion at Finiswolf!
AS: +278 vs DS: +421 with AvD: +32 + d100 roll: +79 = -32
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 5 sec.

==============================================

I hope sharing this might help.

Finis

...edited to add the cross-post...

~CROSS-POSTED~ (http://www.play.net/forums/messages.asp?forum=102&category=4&topic=24&page=10 )

[Edited on 6-7-2005 by FinisWolf]

[Syberus]

Looks like level is playing a pretty substantial roll now.

[FinisWolf]

My own observations:

There should of been at least some pushdown on the sucessful ambushes by both the ranger and the rogue vs. the rogue and the paladin. I am not saying alot, but some. The way it looks, if te ambusher is 20 trains under the ambushee, then there will be no pushdown. this MAY change if you have a 2x hide / 2x perception / 2x ambush char.

From the side of the older chars, they are basically untouchable ..., which will put back into this game something it lost with GS3, and thats snerts going back to fearing the older chars ~as it should be ~ [FLIP-SIDE: Older chars get fearless and power happy]

I think they balanced it rather well. There is a difference on the pushdown between 1X and 2x, and it looks good to me.

One last thing that should be added. Both my ambushers had to swing at least 30 times to get the number swing on my older rogue, and about 20 times on the paladin.

Finis

[Drew]

The biggest change is in evades and dodges when hunting creatures. And yeah, older characters are basically untouchable.

[StrayRogue]

Heh, atleast I got a reason to use subdue and swiftkick now. I've yet to fully test it with my 1x ambusher though.

[Insodus]

Normally I would love to stat crunch and fuck around with this kind of change, but I don't have time right now. Can someone tell me if this will effect me at all. 51 rogue hunting illistim glacier (level 52-56 critters)

(at level 51), your base skill bonuses, ranks and goals are:
Skill Name | Actual Actual
| Bonus Ranks Goals Time to Goal
Armor Use..........................| 172 72 72
Shield Use.........................| 153 53 53
Combat Maneuvers...................| 206 106 106
Edged Weapons......................| 206 106 106
Ambush.............................| 206 106 106
Multi Opponent Combat..............| 70 15 15
Physical Fitness...................| 204 104 104
Dodging............................| 204 104 104
Harness Power......................| 5 1 1
Stalking and Hiding................| 214 114 114
Perception.........................| 205 105 105
Climbing...........................| 90 20 20
Swimming...........................| 90 20 20

[AnticorRifling]

You're fine carry on. 2x ambusher will still be good to go. 1x'ers will just have issues uphunting (to a point).

Like I said on the officials:

This is a fix to correct the problem that is; if you 2x in ambushing you are basically spending more points to ambush as well as someone that 1x. Now with the expenditure of points you will see a better ambush thus providing a benefit to spending the points. 1x is not unviable it is just not as good, as it should be, when compared to the 2x.

Time to go do arms w00t.

[Lord Dainslef]

>amb shri
You leap from hiding to attack!
You swing a diamond-hilt ebon bladed wakizashi at a shrickhen!
AS: +372 vs DS: +368 with AvD: +24 + d100 roll: +39 = +67
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 5 sec.

followed by my going splat...grrr.....

[Gan]

You leap from hiding to attack!
You swing a faenor-edged gold vultite handaxe at a shrickhen!
AS: +383 vs DS: +279 with AvD: +32 + d100 roll: +9 = +145
... and hit for 42 points of damage!
Mighty swing separates head from shoulders.
A shrickhen's arms, legs and head separate from her torso as the dissimilar parts finally fall still.
A shrickhen glances around, looking a bit less confident.
The brilliant luminescence fades from around a shrickhen.
The bright luminescence fades from around a shrickhen.
Roundtime: 7 sec.


I love 2x ambush!

[Gan]

Gods the Irony...

Just after I posted the above...

A shrickhen screams furiously and traces a line of cold blue fire in the air!
A wave of formless black ripples moves outward from a shrickhen.
A moulis is buffeted by the formless black waves and is knocked to the ground.
... 35 points of damage!
Bones in leg crack and blood vessels burst!
The moulis is stunned!
You are buffeted by the formless black waves, and knocked to the ground.
You are pinned in place, unable to move.
You are forced out of hiding.
Roundtime: 19 sec.
... 30 points of damage!
In a massive display of gore, your neck explodes violently!
Your SIGN OF SHIELDS is no longer effective.
Your SIGN OF WARDING is no longer effective.
Your SIGN OF DEFLECTION is no longer effective.
Your SIGN OF STAUNCHING is no longer effective.
Your SIGN OF DEFENDING is no longer effective.
Your SIGN OF SMITING is no longer effective.
You feel your extra strength departing.
The glowing specks of energy surrounding you suddenly shoot off in all directions, then quickly fade away.
Your SIGN OF STRIKING is no longer effective.
Your SIGN OF SWORDS is no longer effective.
The brilliant luminescence fades from around you.
The silvery luminescence fades from around you.
The deep blue glow leaves you.
The light blue glow leaves you.

It seems you have died, my friend. Although you cannot do anything, you are keenly aware of what is going on around you...

[StrayRogue]

Originally posted by Lord Dainslef
>amb shri
You leap from hiding to attack!
You swing a diamond-hilt ebon bladed wakizashi at a shrickhen!
AS: +372 vs DS: +368 with AvD: +24 + d100 roll: +39 = +67
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 5 sec.

followed by my going splat...grrr.....

I wouldn't suggest uphunting, if you are. My AS is pretty much exactly the same in my mid 50's.

[Edited on 25-6-05 by StrayRogue]

[Gan]

DS or AS?

[StrayRogue]

Well spotted Ganalon.

[AnticorRifling]

Originally posted by Ganalon
Gods the Irony...

Just after I posted the above...

A shrickhen screams furiously and traces a line of cold blue fire in the air!
A wave of formless black ripples moves outward from a shrickhen.
A moulis is buffeted by the formless black waves and is knocked to the ground.
... 35 points of damage!
Bones in leg crack and blood vessels burst!
The moulis is stunned!
You are buffeted by the formless black waves, and knocked to the ground.
You are pinned in place, unable to move.
You are forced out of hiding.
Roundtime: 19 sec.
... 30 points of damage!
In a massive display of gore, your neck explodes violently!
Your SIGN OF SHIELDS is no longer effective.
Your SIGN OF WARDING is no longer effective.
Your SIGN OF DEFLECTION is no longer effective.
Your SIGN OF STAUNCHING is no longer effective.
Your SIGN OF DEFENDING is no longer effective.
Your SIGN OF SMITING is no longer effective.
You feel your extra strength departing.
The glowing specks of energy surrounding you suddenly shoot off in all directions, then quickly fade away.
Your SIGN OF STRIKING is no longer effective.
Your SIGN OF SWORDS is no longer effective.
The brilliant luminescence fades from around you.
The silvery luminescence fades from around you.
The deep blue glow leaves you.
The light blue glow leaves you.

It seems you have died, my friend. Although you cannot do anything, you are keenly aware of what is going on around you...

You should probably wear some more spells sissy.

[Gan]

pffffft.


I'm just pretending I'm a wizard.

[Edited on 6-25-2005 by Ganalon]

[Gan]

Originally posted by StrayRogue

Originally posted by Lord Dainslef
>amb shri
You leap from hiding to attack!
You swing a diamond-hilt ebon bladed wakizashi at a shrickhen!
AS: +372 vs DS: +368 with AvD: +24 + d100 roll: +39 = +67
A clean miss.
Roundtime: 5 sec.

followed by my going splat...grrr.....

I wouldn't suggest uphunting, if you are. My AS is pretty much exactly the same in my mid 50's.

[Edited on 25-6-05 by StrayRogue]

As seen earlier, my AS with a 4x blessed blade isnt much higher. But thats because I reset my stats for max TP's which has set my STR around the mid 70's. The nice thing is that its a fast moving stat so it grows almost proportionately to my levels gained, which will set me where it needs to be at cap. In the interim I've offset it with a 10x blade and 2x ambushing makes what strikes I do land, quite critical.

[Heshinar]

Well my 10 Train Rogue that is doubled in Ambush, Stalking and Hiding, Perception gets this.

A lesser orc swings a short sword at you!
AS: +108 vs DS: +175 with AvD: +33 + d100 roll: +77 = +43
A clean miss.

-----------
Not Hiding
-----------

>stance off
ambush orc left leg
You are now in an offensive stance.
>You swing a bolt-etched ornate vultite scimitar at a lesser orc!
AS: +130 vs DS: +46 with AvD: +30 + d100 roll: +5 = +119
... and hit for 10 points of damage!
Slash to the lesser orc's left leg hits high!
Kinda makes your knees weak, huh?
Roundtime: 6 sec.


attack
You are now in an offensive stance.
>You swing a bolt-etched ornate vultite scimitar at a lesser orc!
AS: +130 vs DS: +46 with AvD: +30 + d100 roll: +36 = +150
... and hit for 16 points of damage!
Blow raises a welt on the lesser orc's right arm.
Roundtime: 5 sec.

------------
Hiding
------------

>hide
Roundtime: 3 sec.
You attempt to blend with the surroundings and feel confident that no one has noticed your doing so.
>stance off
ambush orc left leg
You are now in an offensive stance.
>You leap from hiding to attack!
You swing a bolt-etched ornate vultite scimitar at a lesser orc!
AS: +130 vs DS: +45 with AvD: +30 + d100 roll: +11 = +126
... and hit for 15 points of damage!
Nice shot to the head gouges the lesser orc's cheek!
The lesser orc is stunned!
Roundtime: 6 sec.


Any thoughts.

Heshinar

[StrayRogue]

The orc was already in offensive stance.

[Heshinar]

Okay so try it before waiting on it to go offense.

I am a bit of a newbie when it comes to this stuff. I usually just play and do my best but lately I have been trying to understand mechanics and learn how to fight better.

After testing some I found that from ambush it was pushing the DS down.

I will do more extensive to make sure I didnt miss something.



[Edited on 7-11-2005 by Heshinar]

[Gan]

You should see the results you're after if you ambush before they can attack you... if you have to, sneak around from room to room then ambush one you come across.

The only stupid question is the one not asked. The PC Forum has lots of knowledgeable folks who can help you.

[Jolena]

heh I wonder if the FIXSKILLS we got on the 6th for this is still active if we didn't use it up. Although my rogue doesn't need to use it I could sure use it on a few others.

BTW, SOOOO glad I 2x ambush and perception.

[Gan]

If you havnt used the latest award of FIXSKILLS then you still should have it... it wont stack ontop of another unused one, but 1 option should still be remaining.