Ranger vs Bard (post cap)

[Asha]

I know this will probably not be straight forward but I wanted to ask which is most lethal against single target, multiple targets, best DS and AS, manoeuvres etc etc.

Just which is best basically. Because I’m considering changing my profession and I have zero, literally zero experience with bards and I’ve done nothing but hunt as a ranger.

The thing I’m most worried about is losing hide, snipeysnipe.
Hiding gives you protection from getting smashed by an unfair manoeuvre as soon as you enter a room. That is almost priceless to me. I hear bards don’t give a fuck though and aren’t that badly affected by manoeuvres.

[Methais]

Pure bard just spam 1030 forever and win.

[Izzy]

Pure bard just spam 1030 forever and win.

Until the bard review gets back on the table. Which may be never, in fairness. But if it does RIP 1030/1035

[Asha]

Awesome. I’ve heard that kind of thing before about bards. I know they got some kind of nerf recently? Or I thought they did. Glad it hasn’t changed.

[Methais]

Awesome. I’ve heard that kind of thing before about bards. I know they got some kind of nerf recently? Or I thought they did. Glad it hasn’t changed.

Those nerfs went away when Divergence went away. Because Divergence was full blown AIDS.

[drumpel]

Until the bard review gets back on the table. Which may be never, in fairness. But if it does RIP 1030/1035

Hopefully it happens sooner than later because until it does (along with the Wizard and I think two other professions reviews) they aren't touching Ascension and we'll be stuck with the stale ass state that it's in.

[Methais]

Hopefully it happens sooner than later because until it does (along with the Wizard and I think two other professions reviews) they aren't touching Ascension and we'll be stuck with the stale ass state that it's in.

I hope it never happens because Simu dev is stupid and will ruin both classes.

[drumpel]

I hope it never happens because Simu dev is stupid and will ruin both classes.

Knowing them they'll probably put enchanting through the mixer again and it'll be the 4th (maybe 5th???, I can't remember anymore) iteration of the spell in the past 10 years.

I'm just hoping that they fix things properly with lores on spells, like removing the shitty summation chart crap and have bonuses build up from skill and not a system that punishes people with diminishing returns.

On the other hand I don't want them to jump in and fix much because I guarantee we'll see wizard spells make a big shift to a lot of them utilizing SMR.

[Mobius1]

Bards are mostly top tier because 1030/1035 is just so good. But they do have weaknesses. They have the lowest TD in the game, for one. They also got kind of nerfed by ewave going SMR2 (and least from my personal experience. If someone has had a better time of it than me, please let me know!).

Honestly both classes are really damn good. I assume bard service will make more money than ranger service. But rangers complete bounties much faster, which is something I value.

If you want my personal opinion, you should be making this choice 100% based on RP, if this is your main.

[Methais]

Knowing them they'll probably put enchanting through the mixer again and it'll be the 4th (maybe 5th???, I can't remember anymore) iteration of the spell in the past 10 years.

I'm just hoping that they fix things properly with lores on spells, like removing the shitty summation chart crap and have bonuses build up from skill and not a system that punishes people with diminishing returns.

On the other hand I don't want them to jump in and fix much because I guarantee we'll see wizard spells make a big shift to a lot of them utilizing SMR.

They're still hung up on this whole pile of shit with "slowing down combat" because they're stupid. So I expect most if not all bard/wizard changes to be nerfs with their goal being to make everyone equally mediocre and boring and even more tedious than before due to things being slower.

Or like 99% will be nerfs, and then they'll do something like buff Weapon Fire from being useless to almost useless and be like "Why are you guys mad? Look what we gave you!"

Hopefully I'm wrong, but I doubt it.

[Ramrod]

I know this will probably not be straight forward but I wanted to ask which is most lethal against single target, multiple targets, best DS and AS, manoeuvres etc etc.

Just which is best basically. Because I’m considering changing my profession and I have zero, literally zero experience with bards and I’ve done nothing but hunt as a ranger.

The thing I’m most worried about is losing hide, snipeysnipe.
Hiding gives you protection from getting smashed by an unfair manoeuvre as soon as you enter a room. That is almost priceless to me. I hear bards don’t give a fuck though and aren’t that badly affected by manoeuvres.

I have a 10M Exp Ranger and a 30M Exp Bard. The ranger is a better hunter in almost every scenario you listed.

The ranger hunts 100% with spike and almost never dies because 616 isn't a warding spell. 1030 is susceptible to Slippery Mind so the bard will get caught here and there. 616 doesn't have that problem.

I think the Bard class is more fun, but the Ranger is definitely a better hunter.

[Asha]

thanks a lot. Thats all really encouraging. Ive been maining Ranger and love it. I just always heard amazing things about bards after cap. I do think bards sounds quite interesting though so I might just give it a try. Can always swap back. Thanks again!

[Ramrod]

They're still hung up on this whole pile of shit with "slowing down combat" because they're stupid. So I expect most if not all bard/wizard changes to be nerfs with their goal being to make everyone equally mediocre and boring and even more tedious than before due to things being slower.

Or like 99% will be nerfs, and then they'll do something like buff Weapon Fire from being useless to almost useless and be like "Why are you guys mad? Look what we gave you!"

Hopefully I'm wrong, but I doubt it.

I don't think they're trying to slow down combat as much as they're trying to force customers of a hack and slash game into an RPG. The problem, besides the fact that you can't advance without hunting, is that bulk of the revenue is coming from the hack and slash players (scripters, MA crews, etc) rather than the RPG people. The RPG people will probably get exactly what they're screaming for, but I doubt they realize what that means - A slightly more populated version of Plat minus most of the revenue. If the MA crews and scripters get run off, you'll end up with 100-200 characters logged in on average? Besides the subscription, the hack and slash players are the ones dropping the money at events. The people that logon for 5 hours/week on their one prime account to hang out and hunt once or twice aren't dropping $3k in BS at DR.

[Ramrod]

thanks a lot. Thats all really encouraging. Ive been maining Ranger and love it. I just always heard amazing things about bards after cap. I do think bards sounds quite interesting though so I might just give it a try. Can always swap back. Thanks again!

The bard is more fun outside of hunting because I like the stupid things like purifying gems, loresinging, etc. A spike ranger definitely out hunts a 1030 bard though. 1030 is great, but it's honestly not any different than any of the other warding builds - Cleric, Wizard, Sorc, etc. You just trade more dodge ranks for less TD.

[Asha]

what is 635 like compared to 1030, i have never played a Bard. I hear nothing but 1030 being god tier.
I like the sound of a bard because of not having to hide for safety. Being able to tank out in the open is really enticing. I know rangers can tank too but theyre designed to hide. A bard isnt so I feel like theyre more used to being face to face and might have some boons for that rangers dont.

Also purifying gems is cool, singing my own items is cool and i really love the alters you can put on sonic stuff. Oh and singing your gear, that rocks too.

I know it sounds like ive decided to be a bard but im so on the fence due to just how powerful my ranger feels sometimes that i dont know if ill get buyers remorse.
Youve all helped a lot though, before i was uncertain, now I'm less uncertain. Uncertainless.

[Ramrod]

what is 635 like compared to 1030, i have never played a Bard. I hear nothing but 1030 being god tier.
I like the sound of a bard because of not having to hide for safety. Being able to tank out in the open is really enticing. I know rangers can tank too but theyre designed to hide. A bard isnt so I feel like theyre more used to being face to face and might have some boons for that rangers dont.

I don't really use 635 tbh. 1030 is great, but it's not a lot different than 317 or 616 (I mostly play ranger/bard/cleric). You kill everything in 1-3 casts (usually 1-2), which is the same as 616/317. Sit in guarded in the open, wrack for extra mana, complete hunts incredibly quickly.



Also purifying gems is cool, singing my own items is cool and i really love the alters you can put on sonic stuff. Oh and singing your gear, that rocks too.

I know it sounds like ive decided to be a bard but im so on the fence due to just how powerful my ranger feels sometimes that i dont know if ill get buyers remorse.
Youve all helped a lot though, before i was uncertain, now I'm less uncertain. Uncertainless.

You might want to try fixskilling into a Spike Ranger and see how you like it before you commit to a profession change pot. My ranger is training is about 1.25x in Ranger spells and then just 2x OHE/Shield and casts in the open. It will give you a good idea of how hunting goes as a bard.

[Mobius1]

I really think you should make the decision based on RP reasons. Mechanically there's just not enough justification to switch, in my opinion. Bards are really good, but so are rangers.

[Ramrod]

I really think you should make the decision based on RP reasons. Mechanically there's just not enough justification to switch, in my opinion. Bards are really good, but so are rangers.

If you're only doing RP in a hack and slash game, then roll up a lvl 0 character of whatever you want. If you're trying to advance in a hack and slash game, then it only makes sense to go with what suits your hunting style best.

[Mobius1]

If you're only doing RP in a hack and slash game, then roll up a lvl 0 character of whatever you want. If you're trying to advance in a hack and slash game, then it only makes sense to go with what suits your hunting style best.

I'd include "what suits your hunting style" as part of "RP reasons" that I was referring to.

Basically, I think the choice should be more about what you think is cool, think is fun, think is the image you want for your character, etc..

[Sean]

But the question was framed as a mechanics question so sure RP is great but it's not really an answer to what was asked.

I have a capped bard and ranger and while hunting with the bard is simple I find it incredibly dull because of the lack of set ups and variety it's literally just 1030 and renew. Compared to my capped cleric the cleric changes tactics from hunting ground to hunting ground and creature to creature so while ultimately yes it's not radically different from 317'ing everything I do find it more enjoyable. But on the topic of bard vs ranger I just find hiding, sniping, using barrage/volley/pindown, etc. to be so much more fun than the bard but it's just my personal experience.

[Mobius1]

Lol, I care about mechanics more than most people, and yet in this case I stand by my recommendation. If the classes were too disparate, I'd perhaps be able to give a more mechanical based reason for one over the other, but they are so close that it essentially comes down to an "RP" based decision, in my opinion.

[Winter]

Until the bard review gets back on the table. Which may be never, in fairness. But if it does RIP 1030/1035

Has anyone heard anything about this? was it cancelled indefinitely?

[Methais]

Has anyone heard anything about this? was it cancelled indefinitely?

I'm gonna guess it was reprioritized to RSN.

[onurb]

My pure bard and pure ranger are arguably my two strongest characters out of all the classes I play. They both wreck swarms pretty easily. I'd say the bard's 1030 is a bit more lethal than the ranger's 635, but not by much. The ranger's defense is a bit better than the bard's.


Shield Use.........................| 302 202
Combat Maneuvers...................| 201 101
Brawling...........................| 302 202
Multi Opponent Combat..............| 176 76
Physical Fitness...................| 201 101
Dodging............................| 201 101
Arcane Symbols.....................| 201 101
Magic Item Use.....................| 201 101
Harness Power......................| 201 101
Elemental Mana Control.............| 201 101
Mental Mana Control................| 201 101
Elemental Lore - Air...............| 201 101
Mental Lore - Manipulation.........| 175 75
Perception.........................| 302 202
Climbing...........................| 201 101
Swimming...........................| 201 101

Spell Lists
Minor Elemental....................| 75

Spell Lists
Bard...............................| 127


Armor Use..........................| 30 6
Shield Use.........................| 302 202
Combat Maneuvers...................| 201 101
Brawling...........................| 302 202
Multi Opponent Combat..............| 201 101
Physical Fitness...................| 201 101
Dodging............................| 221 121
Arcane Symbols.....................| 201 101
Magic Item Use.....................| 201 101
Harness Power......................| 201 101
Spirit Mana Control................| 201 101
Spiritual Lore - Summoning.........| 201 101
Perception.........................| 302 202
Climbing...........................| 302 202
Swimming...........................| 302 202

Spell Lists
Minor Spiritual....................| 42

Spell Lists
Ranger.............................| 160