What will Simu do without the whales?

[Methais]

This is from the bloodscrip auction yesterday. Simu’s gonna be fucked if like 3 people quit. I knew things had gotten pretty ridiculous but holy fuck, people dropping like $20k on one item and shit :lol:


https://i.imgur.com/tzEo0eT.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/WECmRP7.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/aekdYp0.jpg

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1PYfK08mvSFVcu5aQQGzswdLjnO5946M5-dn1cuO5daQ/htmlview

[Astray]

Seeing this is pretty depressing.

[Dhuul2]

Part of me wants to say I told you so. A very large part. Remember, I'm the turd that petulantly called for a boycott of such milkings (http://forum.gsplayers.com/showthread.php?10213-Storms-of-Fortune-Secrets-of-the-Wavedancer&p=278442#post278442). Looking back, Wavedancer seems like a helluva bargain compared to this fleecing.

Anyway, it makes people "happy."

Obviously, I am concerned about the gambling addiction part. Do you know that in some states there is a registry for gambling addicts? You can put yourself on it and then security can kick you out. Here in IL no such registry exists for the strip mall slot machines that have recently appeared.

[Sile]

It is crazy, sad thing is, this is probably what is keeping GS profitable at this point, since those BS was earned with people spending simucoins.

It basically gave Simu a way to legally sell currency for real money, while still having plausible deniability, since they technically sell access to a 'mini-game' not the bs itself.

I don't fault people with buying what they want, if they can afford it.

I kind of got drawn into this, had a huge stock of BS I paid a lot for, what I wanted didn't show up. So maybe I'm luckier that way.

[Taernath]

lmao, and I felt dirty when I took a parasite weapon up to tier 2.

[Fryinhades]

Well what's blatantly obvious about the frenzy last night is that warclaidh paid 330k bs (essentially 330m depending on conversion) for a t1 ensorcell. Unless the item was absolutely impossible to ensorcell, I couldn't imagine ever having to pay that much.

[Sile]

Well what's blatantly obvious about the frenzy last night is that warclaidh paid 330k bs (essentially 330m depending on conversion) for a t1 ensorcell. Unless the item was absolutely impossible to ensorcell, I couldn't imagine ever having to pay that much.

There are many high end or very old items that cannot be ensorcelled through players. Warclaidh owns quite a few of them.

[Methais]

Well what's blatantly obvious about the frenzy last night is that warclaidh paid 330k bs (essentially 330m depending on conversion) for a t1 ensorcell. Unless the item was absolutely impossible to ensorcell, I couldn't imagine ever having to pay that much.

I remember when Simu said ensorcell would never be offered as P2W and people believed them. :lol:

Those Rift boots are massive P2W.

This game is fucked when these retards eventually quit.

[Sile]

My biggest grip, is the price of even the 'mundane' items.

Look at the spell combiner, went for what? 300k+ in open auction? When it should of just been a pay per service to anyone who bought 1x a day items. Why because balance? All for what is essentially a QOL item.

[time4fun]

My biggest grip, is the price of even the 'mundane' items.

Look at the spell combiner, went for what? 300k+ in open auction? When it should of just been a pay per service to anyone who bought 1x a day items. Why because balance? All for what is essentially a QOL item.

Actually there are mechanical benefits to combing x/day items.

[Sile]

Actually there are mechanical benefits to combing x/day items.

There are, which not a lot of people realize, but I don't think its that big of a mechanical benifit, sure it recharges faster. Still I think it's over priced.

[Archigeek]

There are, which not a lot of people realize, but I don't think its that big of a mechanical benifit, sure it recharges faster. Still I think it's over priced.

10x per day for a spell caster = more than they can use in a 24 hour day, with a recharge every 2.4 hours. That is a pretty big mechanical benefit for the right spell for fashionably late's gift, which is what 2 people used it for.

There were a couple of really cool items that went out. So that was cool.

[Maerit]

People combined 10x 1750 items, which means they're going to be able to cast a ton of spells in a 24hr period. You could feasibly keep up to 3 or 4 spells going for 8-12 hours a day using that item...

In the end though, this is a clear demonstration of people destroying even Simu's expectations. Wyrom was floored by the 6 and 7 mil bloodscrip sales. The highest previous sale of any single item in the past was 1 mil bloodscrip (which also greatly exceeded expectations).

What is going to really suck is when the whales set the standard in GS, and folks realize they'll never accrue enough BS as inflation continues to rise to get anything out of the event. I'm just glad I could stock up on enchanting potions this run. Might even go back and buy a few more.

[audioserf]

The most stupidly priced item at DR might actually surprise you, but it's 100% the Chainspear certificate at 300k BS.

Like, what?

Chainspears aren't even mechanically GOOD. They are novelty fun weapons. They used to cost 60m silvers before showing up at HESS for the equivalent of 300m. And on top of that, you have to provide your own spear to be turned into a chain spear. Meanwhile if you buy ANY kind of ore, for much less BS, they forge you a fresh weapon.

I will continue to be both mad and LOL at this indefinitely.

[Gelston]

I'd say you don't need any of this shit, but if it becomes common enough they'll start gearing newer hunting grounds to it.

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

How many people are spending 20K IRL dollars at this event?!

[Gelston]

How many people are spending 20K IRL dollars at this event?!

One is too many. When I win the Powerball and buy GS from Stilfront I'm going to MGGA.

[azim17]

I do wonder about how this ties into game balance, or if they really even worry about it? It seems to me that there are tons of new player abilities, uber items, etc. Is the company worried about the content being too easy or just mindlessly plowed through? Or is the priority to make the game easier and the players feel more powerful? I dont really have a dog in the fight either way, I enjoy the challenge and grind of GS for fun, but Im sure others feel differently.

[Taernath]

What is going to really suck is when the whales set the standard in GS, and folks realize they'll never accrue enough BS as inflation continues to rise to get anything out of the event.

New currency in 3... 2...

[Gelston]

I do wonder about how this ties into game balance, or if they really even worry about it? It seems to me that there are tons of new player abilities, uber items, etc. Is the company worried about the content being too easy or just mindlessly plowed through? Or is the priority to make the game easier and the players feel more powerful? I dont really have a dog in the fight either way, I enjoy the challenge and grind of GS for fun, but Im sure others feel differently.

They are concerned about making money.

[Methais]

I do wonder about how this ties into game balance, or if they really even worry about it? It seems to me that there are tons of new player abilities, uber items, etc. Is the company worried about the content being too easy or just mindlessly plowed through? Or is the priority to make the game easier and the players feel more powerful? I dont really have a dog in the fight either way, I enjoy the challenge and grind of GS for fun, but Im sure others feel differently.

Game balance consists of nerfing peoples’ spells and abilities and then selling it back to idiots in the P2W shop.

[Methais]

They’re in full P2W mode now though with shit like these Rift boots that went for like $20k:

>Lahke says, "Okay, I have a pair of interesting boots. They are NOT unarmed combat."
J>Lahke says, "These boots were once owned by an assassin for hire who demanded payment for services in the form of magical blessings. They eventually passed hands after the assassin met an untimely demise, but these boots will benefit those who hunt in The Rift. These boots will not only prevent you from spellburst on entry, they will protect you from the random spell strips. There is a chance they can protect you from spirit loss, as well. They will prevent coin loss on exit from the area, but an alternative offering will suffice. Ice patches can be destroyed, as well as phylacteries, without any limit on usage."
J>Lahke says, "7mil."
J>Lormaek says, "Bid."

[Taernath]

They’re in full P2W mode now though with shit like these Rift boots that went for like $20k:

>Lahke says, "Okay, I have a pair of interesting boots. They are NOT unarmed combat."
J>Lahke says, "These boots were once owned by an assassin for hire who demanded payment for services in the form of magical blessings. They eventually passed hands after the assassin met an untimely demise, but these boots will benefit those who hunt in The Rift. These boots will not only prevent you from spellburst on entry, they will protect you from the random spell strips. There is a chance they can protect you from spirit loss, as well. They will prevent coin loss on exit from the area, but an alternative offering will suffice. Ice patches can be destroyed, as well as phylacteries, without any limit on usage."
J>Lahke says, "7mil."
J>Lormaek says, "Bid."

I absolutely cannot WAIT to see the usual suspects act like that's not a huge p2w issue.

[Donquix]

People combined 10x 1750 items, which means they're going to be able to cast a ton of spells in a 24hr period. You could feasibly keep up to 3 or 4 spells going for 8-12 hours a day using that item...

In the end though, this is a clear demonstration of people destroying even Simu's expectations. Wyrom was floored by the 6 and 7 mil bloodscrip sales. The highest previous sale of any single item in the past was 1 mil bloodscrip (which also greatly exceeded expectations).

What is going to really suck is when the whales set the standard in GS, and folks realize they'll never accrue enough BS as inflation continues to rise to get anything out of the event. I'm just glad I could stock up on enchanting potions this run. Might even go back and buy a few more.

Except this is total bullshit and it shocks me at this point anyone would believe Wyrom saying obvious bullshit like this.

Warclaidh bought the relic on the first offer Wyrom made and he didn't even flinch. Now he has what at this point, over 100k worth of items on his character. He walks into the auction with what, 15m? 20m in bloodscrip on his person? maybe more? Wyrom knows all this. Puts up arguably the best possible item for a redonkulous post cap physical character, which said whale is...and he bids insanely for it? Oh my stars who could have seen this coming. Feigned ignorance and shock at this point is hilarious.


The most stupidly priced item at DR might actually surprise you, but it's 100% the Chainspear certificate at 300k BS.

Like, what?

Chainspears aren't even mechanically GOOD. They are novelty fun weapons. They used to cost 60m silvers before showing up at HESS for the equivalent of 300m. And on top of that, you have to provide your own spear to be turned into a chain spear. Meanwhile if you buy ANY kind of ore, for much less BS, they forge you a fresh weapon.

I will continue to be both mad and LOL at this indefinitely.

Indeed. The chainspear, unlock TIERS for ithzir and voln armors, etc. To me those insanely priced items are WAY more hilarious than the top end shit at the auction. If someone wants to collect gemstone items to the point it breaks the game instead of cars fine. Spending a fuck ton of money on gemstone is NOT new, the only new part is simu seizing the means of production. Shit like the unlocks on those items that were supposed to be ATTAINABLE over time for normal players and putting it behind a 500 dollar paywall i'm just like ok.....fuck off.

[Maerit]

The most stupidly priced item at DR might actually surprise you, but it's 100% the Chainspear certificate at 300k BS.

Like, what?

Chainspears aren't even mechanically GOOD. They are novelty fun weapons. They used to cost 60m silvers before showing up at HESS for the equivalent of 300m. And on top of that, you have to provide your own spear to be turned into a chain spear. Meanwhile if you buy ANY kind of ore, for much less BS, they forge you a fresh weapon.

I will continue to be both mad and LOL at this indefinitely.

I dunno, I think the 1.8mil fully unlocked Karma armor is probably up there for ridiculous prices. New, "interesting", and very fluffy, but not mechanically that amazing for that much.

[Methais]

I wonder what Estild will nerf between now and the next DR and how much he’ll charge for the items that he puts said nerfed abilities into in their pre-nerf state or some equivalent.

If Simu has any integrity, which we all know they don’t, now would be the time to completely separate P2W dev GMs from core game dev GMs.

Estild probably jerked off like 10 times last night over Warclaidh, Meb, and Lormaek.

[Donquix]

I dunno, I think the 1.8mil fully unlocked Karma armor is probably up there for ridiculous prices. New, "interesting", and very fluffy, but not mechanically that amazing for that much.

People freak out about this one but i don't think it was ever intended you fully unlock the entire thing. I mean, you can. Players are obsessive idiots so we will. But if you read what Quillic's comments i genuinely believe he saw something like that in a book, thought it was cool, made an item. Didn't think people would think they could /should/would put in the money to unlock ALL of it.

But it's too late now he has seen the light and the p2w hooks are in him. All premium storylines now cost 100k bloodscrip to enter.

[Sile]

I love when people mention balance though. The only balance Simu cares about at this point is how to balance fleecing the whales while still keeping them interested without pissing them off.

[Methais]

I love when people mention balance though. The only balance Simu cares about at this point is how to balance fleecing the whales while still keeping them interested without pissing them off.

Using game balance as an excuse for anything at all in this game now is laughable as fuck. Items like the Rift boots just say “Cash > game balance” and anyone at Simu who even tries to claim otherwise is a lying sack of shit.

Every nerf Simu does is with P2W in mind.

It would at least be somewhat respectable if Simu would quit pretending that game balance still matters to them when it’s beyond obvious that they don’t as is only used as an excuse to nerf shit in order to push more P2W.

This game has the overall most retarded player base in the universe.

[Tgo01]

Jesus Christ. No wonder the GMs no longer bat an eye at people quitting this game. 20k for one item is 111 basic subscriptions for an entire year.

[Neveragain]

Guild got our first Nefarian kill last night.

https://i.imgur.com/ttQmOX5h.jpg

Fun group of people. We're always looking to add more to the guild.

[Sile]

Funny thing is... at this point I would be willing to crowd fund a gs4 clone that basically restricted items to gs3 levels of power creep.

Also with no ... micro transactions.

It was a simpler and better time when 5x flaring was considered high end.

[Methais]

Guild got our first Nefarian kill last night.

https://i.imgur.com/ttQmOX5h.jpg

Fun group of people. We're always looking to add more to the guild.

Imagine killing Nefarion but you have to pay $1000 to activate any loot you get. In tiers. For $1000 each. Spread out over several years.

[Sile]

Methais I wish I listened to you more when I came back. And paid heed to your warnings. I was thinking it cant be that bad...

[Donquix]

The troubling thing for me is the few things that were priced sensibly for a low/mid range are being axed.

resistance armors, dark and dangerous being retired. GEF cert was the best thing in HESS, and while it (may?) still exist also at EG adding the has to already flare requirement either severely limits the scope of items or is just a blanket 20k+ price increase.

[Sile]

The troubling thing for me is the few things that were priced sensibly for a low/mid range are being axed.

resistance armors, dark and dangerous being retired. GEF cert was the best thing in HESS, and while it (may?) still exist also at EG adding the has to already flare requirement either severely limits the scope of items or is just a blanket 20k+ price increase.

Totally agree... there isnt much left over for casuals today. Or even the full timers who think their subscription fee alone will cut it.

I mean before, with events like the jug ... you could find good gear for prices that anyone could of easily farmed. 4x hcw two handed axes were at the jug for like 300kish silvers. Or about 5 bucks at silver exchange rate then. Now they would charge like 200k worth of blood script for that.

[Neveragain]

Imagine killing Nefarion but you have to pay $1000 to activate any loot you get. In tiers. For $1000 each. Spread out over several years.

I'm not even sure why people are dropping that kind of cash. Logged into GS last weekend, it was worse than watching paint dry.

What they have done with GS seems criminal. It's certainly a giant fuck you to what used to be their "mission statement". It's also surely corrupted when that kind of money is on the table.

[Methais]

Methais I wish I listened to you more...

If I had a nickel every time I heard that...I still wouldn’t spend it on Simucoins.

[Taernath]

Imagine killing Nefarion but you have to pay $1000 to activate any loot you get. In tiers. For $1000 each. Spread out over several years.

More like 'pay $1000 to avoid the Onyxia Scale Cloak requirement and Shadowflame DoT'... per every raid member.

[Methais]

I'm not even sure why people are dropping that kind of cash.

It’s primarily because they’re idiots.


What they have done with GS seems criminal. It's certainly a giant fuck you to what used to be their "mission statement". It's also surely corrupted when that kind of money is on the table.

I can’t wait until Estild nerfs whatever is next on his list and then say they did it to preserve game balance. Just before offering it in HESS on the next DR run.

[Methais]

More like 'pay $1000 to avoid the Onyxia Scale Cloak requirement and Shadowflame DoT'... per every raid member.

Everyone has to pay $5 just to enter Blackwing Lair too. And when the raid wipes, be ready to spend another $5 to try again.

[Neveragain]

More like 'pay $1000 to avoid the Onyxia Scale Cloak requirement and Shadowflame DoT'... per every raid member.

Added bonus, we give everyone a free Ony cloak that raids Black Wing Lair with us.

[Murrandii]

People combined 10x 1750 items, which means they're going to be able to cast a ton of spells in a 24hr period. You could feasibly keep up to 3 or 4 spells going for 8-12 hours a day using that item...

In the end though, this is a clear demonstration of people destroying even Simu's expectations. Wyrom was floored by the 6 and 7 mil bloodscrip sales. The highest previous sale of any single item in the past was 1 mil bloodscrip (which also greatly exceeded expectations).

What is going to really suck is when the whales set the standard in GS, and folks realize they'll never accrue enough BS as inflation continues to rise to get anything out of the event. I'm just glad I could stock up on enchanting potions this run. Might even go back and buy a few more.

I think here it's just like in real life where the 1% get richer and buy crazy stuff while the rest of the 99% struggle to have this or that.

Eventually, according to economical concepts, we all get richer since the 1% don't use this tier and said tier become available for people less rich.

A good example is most people can get their hands on "cheap" 7x perfect or nervestaves or 10 crit padding armor.

A couple of years ago, those items wouldn't be available.

Smart people profited from this DR and bought DnD gear and 8-9-10X pots and will have nice stuff. See me coming? Smart people will have 8-9-10x gear now. That's what matters.



It's totally unbelievable that the boots went for 28,000$. But, if it's good for SIMU and good for the player, who cares.

[Methais]

I think here it's just like in real life where the 1% get richer and buy crazy stuff while the rest of the 99% struggle to have this or that.

Eventually, according to economical concepts, we all get richer since the 1% don't use this tier and said tier become available for people less rich.

A good example is most people can get their hands on "cheap" 7x perfect or nervestaves or 10 crit padding armor.

A couple of years ago, those items wouldn't be available.

Smart people profited from this DR and bought DnD gear and 8-9-10X pots and will have nice stuff. See me coming? Smart people will have 8-9-10x gear now. That's what matters.



It's totally unbelievable that the boots went for 28,000$. But, if it's good for SIMU and good for the player, who cares.

Except it’s horrible for the game and is going to be the direct cause of its eventual downfall, despite the fact that this game has already lived way longer than anyone expected it to.

And that’s the thing, P2W isn’t why this game has lasted for so long. Quite the opposite. But it will be what kills this game because eventually the small handful of whales that Simu depends on caters to and exploits are either going to get bored or run out of bullshit to buy, and once they quit it’s probably over because Simu isn’t creative enough to do anything other than nerf professions and Monty Hall themselves into oblivion.

[Sile]

It's totally unbelievable that the boots went for 28,000$. But, if it's good for SIMU and good for the player, who cares.

The problem is the game has evolved where it focuses more on the 1% crowd and less on the casuals. The business model works for maximum revenue in shortest amount of time, but has a higher risk of catastrophic collapse.

[AnOrdim]

Quilic came out and was doing really inventive (for Prime) storytelling that engaged a large group of people to allow them to shape the details of the premium storyline. It wasn't perfect but it was more than just listening to GM NPCs spit story at you. Completely shut down because one or two people complained about it. So now its back to the only storylines that are going to be "stand around and watch the NPCs talk at you" and then disperse. I guess that is a step up from entire towns where the GM is still absent and unable to come up with even the most basic of storylines to generate interest.

RP is dead in gemstone and its all just whale watching now.

This level of whaling only works when you have a constant flow of new fresh blood into the game to replace when the big whales leave. Gemstone doesn't have anything even close to approaching that.

[Orthin]

What are rift boots?

[Astray]

What are rift boots?

Some shit a loser paid way too much for.

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

It's totally unbelievable that the boots went for 28,000$. But, if it's good for SIMU and good for the player, who cares.

do you think SIMU will put 28k into dev, or just take the profit and make another boot next year?

[malmuddy]

Some shit a loser paid way too much for.

Although I really enjoyed this answer, I thought it would be nice to provide the mechanical benefits you get for $20K.

Lahke says, "These boots were once owned by an assassin for hire who demanded payment for services in the form of magical blessings. They eventually passed hands after the assassin met an untimely demise, but these boots will benefit those who hunt in The Rift. These boots will not only prevent you from spellburst on entry, they will protect you from the random spell strips. There is a chance they can protect you from spirit loss, as well. They will prevent coin loss on exit from the area, but an alternative offering will suffice. Ice patches can be destroyed, as well as phylacteries, without any limit on usage."

[Astray]

Although I really enjoyed this answer, I thought it would be nice to provide the mechanical benefits you get for $20K.

Lahke says, "These boots were once owned by an assassin for hire who demanded payment for services in the form of magical blessings. They eventually passed hands after the assassin met an untimely demise, but these boots will benefit those who hunt in The Rift. These boots will not only prevent you from spellburst on entry, they will protect you from the random spell strips. There is a chance they can protect you from spirit loss, as well. They will prevent coin loss on exit from the area, but an alternative offering will suffice. Ice patches can be destroyed, as well as phylacteries, without any limit on usage."

Sponsored by Nike.

Just do it.

[Merzbow]

It's also worth saying that Lormaek apparently has a custom title of "Rift Adjudicator" or something similar. I have no idea how he got that, but likely his char's entire identity is built around the Rift. Those boots would then arguably be a must-have once-in-a-lifetime purchase.

[Methais]

It's also worth saying that Lormaek apparently has a custom title of "Rift Adjudicator" or something similar. I have no idea how he got that, but likely his char's entire identity is built around the Rift. Those boots would then arguably be a must-have once-in-a-lifetime purchase.

Until another set appears at the next DR.

I’m pretty sure those boots are the most pay-to-win item I’ve seen so far. Being immune to spell stripping in the Rift is pretty huge before even taking the item’s other properties into account.Unnecessary as fuck as long as you’re not brain dead, but still.

$28,000 for text boots though lolololololol

Welcome to Paystone IV.

https://media2.giphy.com/media/u31fedwl4J7G0/giphy.gif


I predict that once these whales get bored and/or the BS market implodes from insane hyperinflation, assuming the whales aren’t completely retarded and actually draw a line somewhere (50/50 shot at best), Simu will start flat out selling exp. Not even RPA orbs, just instant exp. And probably some x per day items that grant access to the HEALME verb from the test server, which will be scooped up first by morons who barely have a grasp on the game’s general mechanics as it is, and will continue to get pwned all day despite sporting like $300k worth of gear and items or whatever.

[Tgo01]

Will sling spells for Rift Boots.

[Murrandii]

Methais, gemstone 4 is in its end of life. That's a fact. You know it, I know it, they know it.

By end of life, I mean it can't evolve more than its core design as it is. They can't do a gsV move, it'd be too taxing their efforts.

Instead of that, in IT, we do a massive milking of the product until we hit a line where it costs more than it earns then BANG, you sell assets or migrate to another model. As part of the board / Direction, you analyze those things like that, it's simple and we'd do it too if we had salaries/shares in their stock.

Simu can't migrate, so all they do is milking and milking and milking.

The next breaking point is NOT another currency released, it's when a whale will leave, you are right.

We, as players, are in a tough situation: wait or do something.

Waiting = being passive and "undergo" the impacts of it (drastic decrease of the worth of our assets/characters), whining about it on an obscure forum and being salty in our butthole.

Do something = being active and tries to push more "something" so SIMU won't pull the plug.

How? I know a couple of people that farmed DR. I did. 3,3k runs (66 books). That's what, 3,300$ worth? I profited, of course. Other guy did too, guy that sold books too et cetera. That ecosystem, in a way, is benefic for US and THEM. BANG. That's one action. There's a lot of others we can do and make that game still living.

Forget about meaningful dev. We got spiffy and we all know he'll go to p2w soon. We'd do it too.

Let's be reactive players instead of old frustrated grannies

[SHAFT]

Methais, gemstone 4 is in its end of life. That's a fact. You know it, I know it, they know it.

By end of life, I mean it can't evolve more than its core design as it is. They can't do a gsV move, it'd be too taxing their efforts.

Instead of that, in IT, we do a massive milking of the product until we hit a line where it costs more than it earns then BANG, you sell assets or migrate to another model. As part of the board / Direction, you analyze those things like that, it's simple and we'd do it too if we had salaries/shares in their stock.

Simu can't migrate, so all they do is milking and milking and milking.

The next breaking point is NOT another currency released, it's when a whale will leave, you are right.

We, as players, are in a tough situation: wait or do something.

Waiting = being passive and "undergo" the impacts of it (drastic decrease of the worth of our assets/characters), whining about it on an obscure forum and being salty in our butthole.

Do something = being active and tries to push more "something" so SIMU won't pull the plug.

How? I know a couple of people that farmed DR. I did. 3,3k runs (66 books). That's what, 3,300$ worth? I profited, of course. Other guy did too, guy that sold books too et cetera. That ecosystem, in a way, is benefic for US and THEM. BANG. That's one action. There's a lot of others we can do and make that game still living.

Forget about meaningful dev. We got spiffy and we all know he'll go to p2w soon. We'd do it too.

Let's be reactive players instead of old frustrated grannies

Nah, everyone dumping money into GS is being taken for a ride. This auction is just another sign to sell your shit and gtfo while you can.

Imagine being left with a $10k-100k+ bag of items in a text based game and you can’t get your money back.

[Gelston]

Nah, everyone dumping money into GS is being taken for a ride. This auction is just another sign to sell your shit and gtfo while you can.

Imagine being left with a $10k-100k+ bag of items in a text based game and you can’t get your money back.

Everyone knows that is going to happen eventually, but then again, you can't really take anything with you when you expire either. Could the money be spent on better things? Definitely.

I know I've probably spent thousands on GS over the years. Would I ever spend 28 grand on some text boots though? No. I doubt I'd spend that on real boots.

[Neveragain]

I doubt I'd spend that on real boots.

:lol:

[SHAFT]

Everyone knows that is going to happen eventually, but then again, you can't really take anything with you when you expire either. Could the money be spent on better things? Definitely.

I know I've probably spent thousands on GS over the years. Would I ever spend 28 grand on some text boots though? No. I doubt I'd spend that on real boots.

28k on 1 item takes it to a whole different level.

Good luck with that.

[Methais]

28k on 1 item takes it to a whole different level.

Good luck with that.

And pretty much guarantees that core game dev is going to be even more dead outside of nerfs and meaningless bullshit.

Split dev GMs into P2W GMs and core game GMs and make them exclusive to each. Assuming there still are any left who would give a shit about doing any core game dev when they can potentially flip 1 item for tens of thousands instead. You’ll be seeing all kinds of 1206’s happening.

It’s cool that GS has so far lasted 31 years, but this is some shark jumping and I don’t see how that bubble isn’t going to be on the verge of popping soon.

[Sile]

See the big problem is this game is promoting very unhealthy behaviors. \

It was drawing me in, I was chasing the whales, while not at the 24k level, but still near the 10k level since I came back. Can I afford it, sure, but thats not the point.

I am a gambling addict. And I've blown way more than 24k in my life. Probably more than 10x that. No matter if I can afford it or not, that is not healthy.

GS was replacing the same feeling to me. And I don't doubt it affects some people the same way. I'm not saying that everyone that spends huge amount of monies on items in this game have a problem, but I'm sure a few of them do.

I would survive even if I lost all I invested in the game, problem is, I can see the writing on the wall. If I stick in, I'll spend more.

I honestly feel the way Simu is set up now, it exploits this in people.

I have to add, for the most part, the population now is very respectable. It seems the scammers have long left the game, which is what I most love about the game. Is the playerbase. While we do have our tiffs on LNet, even some of the craziest and most called out people on there, are good in game.

That, is rare with an online game.

[Idalias]

Is +/- $28k a new all-time record for a single GS IV item? Hard for me to imagine anything ever selling for more.

[Gelston]

Is +/- $28k a new all-time record for a single GS IV item? Hard for me to imagine anything ever selling for more.

If you take into account inflation, probably not. Highest number? Probably.

[Sile]

Is +/- $28k a new all-time record for a single GS IV item? Hard for me to imagine anything ever selling for more.

For one item, I can't think of anything that has came close. Hell even Roblars axe would move for about half of that, which is arguably the best weapon in GS currently.

The Fire Ebow, which is probably the most sought after weapon in the game recently sold for 8k ish, which now seems like a steal.

[SHAFT]

Is +/- $28k a new all-time record for a single GS IV item? Hard for me to imagine anything ever selling for more.

I’ve seen some 5-10k items in the past, but holy fuck on 28k. I wouldn’t be shocked if it was.

[Astray]

When are we going to see "Ass-less Chaps of the Rift"? It'll come with a reach around and buttfuck RP from Wyrom himself. Estild would do it but he's busy huffing paint thinner and ruining shit.

[Taernath]

I predict that once these whales get bored and/or the BS market implodes from insane hyperinflation, assuming the whales aren’t completely retarded and actually draw a line somewhere (50/50 shot at best), Simu will start flat out selling exp. Not even RPA orbs, just instant exp. And probably some x per day items that grant access to the HEALME verb from the test server, which will be scooped up first by morons who barely have a grasp on the game’s general mechanics as it is, and will continue to get pwned all day despite sporting like $300k worth of gear and items or whatever.

Items that allow you to bypass mechanics are now going to be a Thing, so I'm predicting gnomish goggles that let you 'see' maneuver attacks before they happen and rings that completely nullify a particular element's damage (collect them all!).




I doubt I'd spend that on real boots.

I'll sell you a pair of Red Wings that prevent spell stripping IRL for $20k.

[Leafiara]

I predict that once these whales get bored and/or the BS market implodes from insane hyperinflation, assuming the whales aren’t completely retarded and actually draw a line somewhere (50/50 shot at best), Simu will start flat out selling exp. Not even RPA orbs, just instant exp. And probably some x per day items that grant access to the HEALME verb from the test server

Last DR actually legit had 1x/day tokens for 150k that you could wave at yourself or others to basically do a HEALME.

Edit: Oh, I didn't even fully read your post, but I mean, they've basically sold exp too with the Rings of Lumnis brooch.

Generally, I'm with you. This might eventually be what kills the game, but I'm gonna :popcorn: it out as long as it lasts.

[Gizmo]

This was an awesome read

[SHAFT]

New currency in 3... 2...

I lost interest in GS when bloodscript became nearly or as more valuable than silvers.

That and the ability to add nearly every type of weapon or armor enhancements to a single item.

So blatant and obvious they’re just milking this.

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

Man when I cashed out I was out with like 20K TOTAL. I cannot imagine 28K for a single item. That's redunk. I guess if I had a shitton of dispossible income and this was my hobby... I guess I'd do it.

But not as your average middle class DINK. My wife would slaughter me (and I would too). That's like 2 or 3 worldwide trips in very nice hotels.

[Taernath]

I lost interest in GS when bloodscript became nearly or as more valuable than silvers.

That and the ability to add nearly every type of weapon or armor enhancements to a single item.

So blatant and obvious they’re just milking this.

For me it was after I bought that T2 parasite cert.

As soon as the bloodscrip left my pocket, space and time unfolded before me and I received a series of visions. In the first, I had finally capped after 25 years, but there was a strange hollowness to it. I looked down, and my equipment was a mix of Duskruin gear I couldn't recall buying. In the next, I killed a war griffin with a glance while riding a magnificent e-steed. From somewhere I heard the faint sound of a child crying, and a woman angrily shouting. I ignored it as I gleefully looted the beast for its 100 silver. The visions continued with increasing speed and intensity. I now strode Elanthia like a god, laying waste to the strongest storyline NPCs and out-RPing the best RPers there had ever been.

Finally, I stood in a strangely silent TSC, waiting expectantly for the next peon to come and admire my exquisite outfit and spammy room items. It seemed as though there were fewer and fewer admirers with each passing day. Instead, I was greeted by the sound of slow clapping. I spun around, and Wyrom stood before me, sneering. "Well done, Lord Taernath. You have finally... beat Gemstone." he mockingly said. "Thank you for your contributions, but Simutronics has decided to move on." I was disconnected, and in a flash found myself destitute, living in a cardboard box outside a library, leeching off its free wifi. Wyrom's laughter echoed in my mind, until the vision ended and I found myself once again in the present day.

[AnOrdim]

For me it was after I bought that T2 parasite cert.

As soon as the bloodscrip left my pocket, space and time unfolded before me and I received a series of visions. In the first, I had finally capped after 25 years, but there was a strange hollowness to it. I looked down, and my equipment was a mix of Duskruin gear I couldn't recall buying. In the next, I killed a war griffin with a glance while riding a magnificent e-steed. From somewhere I heard the faint sound of a child crying, and a woman angrily shouting. I ignored it as I gleefully looted the beast for its 100 silver. The visions continued with increasing speed and intensity. I now strode Elanthia like a god, laying waste to the strongest storyline NPCs and out-RPing the best RPers there had ever been.

Finally, I stood in a strangely silent TSC, waiting expectantly for the next peon to come and admire my exquisite outfit and spammy room items. It seemed as though there were fewer and fewer admirers with each passing day. Instead, I was greeted by the sound of slow clapping. I spun around, and Wyrom stood before me, sneering. "Well done, Lord Taernath. You have finally... beat Gemstone." he mockingly said. "Thank you for your contributions, but Simutronics has decided to move on." I was disconnected, and in a flash found myself destitute, living in a cardboard box outside a library, leeching off its free wifi. Wyrom's laughter echoed in my mind, until the vision ended and I found myself once again in the present day.

Please don't spoil the revised CoL storyline.

[Astray]

For me it was after I bought that T2 parasite cert.

As soon as the bloodscrip left my pocket, space and time unfolded before me and I received a series of visions. In the first, I had finally capped after 25 years, but there was a strange hollowness to it. I looked down, and my equipment was a mix of Duskruin gear I couldn't recall buying. In the next, I killed a war griffin with a glance while riding a magnificent e-steed. From somewhere I heard the faint sound of a child crying, and a woman angrily shouting. I ignored it as I gleefully looted the beast for its 100 silver. The visions continued with increasing speed and intensity. I now strode Elanthia like a god, laying waste to the strongest storyline NPCs and out-RPing the best RPers there had ever been.

Finally, I stood in a strangely silent TSC, waiting expectantly for the next peon to come and admire my exquisite outfit and spammy room items. It seemed as though there were fewer and fewer admirers with each passing day. Instead, I was greeted by the sound of slow clapping. I spun around, and Wyrom stood before me, sneering. "Well done, Lord Taernath. You have finally... beat Gemstone." he mockingly said. "Thank you for your contributions, but Simutronics has decided to move on." I was disconnected, and in a flash found myself destitute, living in a cardboard box outside a library, leeching off its free wifi. Wyrom's laughter echoed in my mind, until the vision ended and I found myself once again in the present day.

5/10, not enough sharts or boobs or tacos.

[Archigeek]

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Taernath again.

[BriarFox]

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Taernath again.

+1

[Tgo01]

But not as your average middle class DINK.

Don't you have a million dollars in stocks?

[Tgo01]

For me it was after I bought that T2 parasite cert.

As soon as the bloodscrip left my pocket, space and time unfolded before me and I received a series of visions. In the first, I had finally capped after 25 years, but there was a strange hollowness to it. I looked down, and my equipment was a mix of Duskruin gear I couldn't recall buying. In the next, I killed a war griffin with a glance while riding a magnificent e-steed. From somewhere I heard the faint sound of a child crying, and a woman angrily shouting. I ignored it as I gleefully looted the beast for its 100 silver. The visions continued with increasing speed and intensity. I now strode Elanthia like a god, laying waste to the strongest storyline NPCs and out-RPing the best RPers there had ever been.

Finally, I stood in a strangely silent TSC, waiting expectantly for the next peon to come and admire my exquisite outfit and spammy room items. It seemed as though there were fewer and fewer admirers with each passing day. Instead, I was greeted by the sound of slow clapping. I spun around, and Wyrom stood before me, sneering. "Well done, Lord Taernath. You have finally... beat Gemstone." he mockingly said. "Thank you for your contributions, but Simutronics has decided to move on." I was disconnected, and in a flash found myself destitute, living in a cardboard box outside a library, leeching off its free wifi. Wyrom's laughter echoed in my mind, until the vision ended and I found myself once again in the present day.

So it was all worth it in the end.

[gilchristr]

"I was disconnected, and in a flash found myself destitute, living in a cardboard box outside a library, leeching off its free wifi..."

Crazy lady, livin' in a bag
Eatin' outta garbage pails, used to be a fag hag

[rolfard]

Now selling a soulstone wand for 28k.

[Astray]

Now selling a soulstone wand for 28k.

Sold for 28k silver.

[Dhuul2]

100% agree that the community is the best part of GS. We should look out for each other here a bit more.

I am disappointed that management might knowingly prey upon some of our members in this way, which is not a reflection on everyone who works and has worked hard to make the game better.

[Neveragain]

100% agree that the community is the best part of GS. We should look out for each other here a bit more.

I am disappointed that management might knowingly prey upon some of our members in this way, which is not a reflection on everyone who works and has worked hard to make the game better.

The best part is when they will roll out the free event now with the same generic shit they always have. This will be their attempt at smoothing things out with the Proles.

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

Don't you have a million dollars in stocks?

Yes, I do.

[drumpel]

Items that allow you to bypass mechanics are now going to be a Thing, so I'm predicting gnomish goggles that let you 'see' maneuver attacks before they happen and rings that completely nullify a particular element's damage (collect them all!).





I'll sell you a pair of Red Wings that prevent spell stripping IRL for $20k.


We'll see a knock off of Thanos's gauntlet that allows the wearing to obtain 5 gems you can socket to significantly boost your defenses against all elemental damage types. Once you gather all 5 gems you get a permanent boost to your TD of +50, SK 1711/1705 and 1x a day you can simply SNAP GAUNTLET to instantly kill 1/2 of everything in the lands.

[Neveragain]

I guess that is a step up from entire towns where the GM is still absent and unable to come up with even the most basic of storylines to generate interest.

RP is dead in gemstone and its all just whale watching now.


There should be a headstone placed at the RR drawbridge that reads "This was once a beloved and vibrant town, then Xayle happened."

She literally spent months "adding fishing" without knowing there was already fishing and a bait and tackle shop in place since GSIV was released.

[time4fun]

I just think it's hilarious that people are acting like a pair of boots that protect you from some of the negative effects of there Rift and which give you a spell once an hour are Pay2Win.

Seriously- were you losing to the Rift before? Is it the only hunting ground you've ever heard of? If so, I have great news for you....

[Methais]

Last DR actually legit had 1x/day tokens for 150k that you could wave at yourself or others to basically do a HEALME.

https://media.giphy.com/media/Smy6cRzJLzZPW/giphy.gif


they've basically sold exp too with the Rings of Lumnis brooch.

https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-1-JTtbuOUe4/WCDpFganneI/AAAAAAAAQVk/yN2HD4hYzmkMBRdBFq0QszVC-CM80VdqACLcB/s1600/DocRiversInDisbelief.gif

[Methais]

Don't you have a million dollars in stocks?

Don’t you mean 333 million bloodscrip?

[Methais]

I just think it's hilarious that people are acting like a pair of boots that protect you from some of the negative effects of there Rift and which give you a spell once an hour are Pay2Win.

Seriously- were you losing to the Rift before? Is it the only hunting ground you've ever heard of? If so, I have great news for you....

Way to completely miss the point just like you always do.

[Fortybox]

I just think it's hilarious that people are acting like a pair of boots that protect you from some of the negative effects of there Rift and which give you a spell once an hour are Pay2Win.

Seriously- were you losing to the Rift before? Is it the only hunting ground you've ever heard of? If so, I have great news for you....

You really do have a blind spot when it comes to Wyrom...and well pretty much life (plz see my sig gif below because that is pretty much you). Those boots were totally p2w.

Anyhoo, I actually don’t think we have an inflation problem with BS. This DR saw a ton of scrip get used up across the board.

I think people just need to realize this is the new state of the game and Simu will cater to where the demand and opportunities are. The player base basically just accepted p2w in its entirety this last event.

Based on the participation I observed, I actually think adoption/participation is up. You could argue the game has a better chance for a more sustainable outlook.

[Methais]

Based on the participation I observed, I actually think adoption/participation is up. You could argue the game has a better chance for a more sustainable outlook.

Until 1 or 2 whales quit, then it's panic time at Simu.

[Taernath]

I absolutely cannot WAIT to see the usual suspects act like that's not a huge p2w issue.



I just think it's hilarious that people are acting like a pair of boots that protect you from some of the negative effects of there Rift and which give you a spell once an hour are Pay2Win.

Seriously- were you losing to the Rift before? Is it the only hunting ground you've ever heard of? If so, I have great news for you....

lol

[Fortybox]

Until 1 or 2 whales quit, then it's panic time at Simu.

You’re missing my point. I think when you account for WPS plus enchant potions, 1x a day year, DnD, etc. the amount of BS out the door by many consumers will show that this event was highly successful.

I’m sure Wyrom will say 999 trillion BS was spent though. No way to know the official number.

[Methais]

You’re missing my point. I think when you account for WPS plus enchant potions, 1x a day year, DnD, etc. the amount of BS out the door by many consumers will show that this event was highly successful.

I’m sure Wyrom will say 999 trillion BS was spent though. No way to know the official number.

Stillfront: Show us the numbers, Wyrom.

Wyrom: This DR was pretty good, we pulled in about $23,000 this run.

Stillfront: ..........

Wyrom: ???

Stillfront: WHAT THE FUCK DUDE WHERE ARE THESE 28k SINGLE ITEM SALES LIKE LAST TIME? GET YOUR FUCKING SHIT TOGETHER OR THAT'S IT!!!!!! I THOUGHT YOU GUYS WERE MAKING PROGRESS BUT THANKS FOR LETTING US DOWN AGAIN ASSHOLES! TELL ESTILD TO GET HIS FUCKING SHIT TOGETHER AND NERF SOME MORE SHIT OR SOMETHING TOO!!!!!!!!!11

Wyrom: Yes sir.

Stillfront: FUCKING NOOB

Wyrom:
https://media.giphy.com/media/c6DIpCp1922KQ/giphy.gif

[Tgo01]

I just think it's hilarious that people are acting like a pair of boots that protect you from some of the negative effects of there Rift and which give you a spell once an hour are Pay2Win.

Seriously- were you losing to the Rift before? Is it the only hunting ground you've ever heard of? If so, I have great news for you....

A one of a kind item that is only obtainable via spending an ungodly amount of real life money that makes the game much easier to play by allowing the owner of said boots to avoid mechanics that are detrimental to people hunting in said area and are the ONLY way to avoid said mechanics?

Yeah, that’s literally what pay2win means. You can argue you don’t think it’s a big deal, but 99.9999999999% of the world would recognize that these boots are the literal definition of pay2win.

[Methais]

A one of a kind item that is only obtainable via spending an ungodly amount of real life money that makes the game much easier to play by allowing the owner of said boots to avoid mechanics that are detrimental to people hunting in said area and are the ONLY way to avoid said mechanics?

Yeah, that’s literally what pay2win means. You can argue you don’t think it’s a big deal, but 99.9999999999% of the world would recognize that these boots are the literal definition of pay2win.

time4fun thinks that pay to win means you buy an item for cash and a big banner flashes across your screen that says YOU WIN!!!!!!

And everyone else sees:

* time4fun has won Gemstone!

It's because she's so very very smart.

https://image.spreadshirtmedia.com/image-server/v1/compositions/T812A2PA3140PT17X39Y45D10051814FS8533/views/1,width=650,height=650,appearanceId=2,backgroundCo lor=dfdfdf/pro-wrestling-on-the-nes.jpg

[Parkbandit]

They are concerned about making money.

I can't get over the fact that people actually pay a monthly subscription for a text based "roleplaying" game still.

Stormfront should thank their lucky stars that there are still dumb people in this world.

[Neveragain]

A one of a kind item that is only obtainable via spending an ungodly amount of real life money that makes the game much easier to play by allowing the owner of said boots to avoid mechanics that are detrimental to people hunting in said area and are the ONLY way to avoid said mechanics?

Yeah, that’s literally what pay2win means. You can argue you don’t think it’s a big deal, but 99.9999999999% of the world would recognize that these boots are the literal definition of pay2win.

Ungodly doesn't even begin to describe how fucking absurd this shit is.

If there is any truth to Freuds theories...................

https://media1.tenor.com/images/4be1e02ead937a44fee2bd391a2d8b12/tenor.gif?itemid=5676595

[Neveragain]

I just think it's hilarious that people are acting like a pair of boots that protect you from some of the negative effects of there Rift and which give you a spell once an hour are Pay2Win.

Seriously- were you losing to the Rift before? Is it the only hunting ground you've ever heard of? If so, I have great news for you....

Spending 20k on some text based item has nothing to do with hunting the Rift.

https://thepsychologist.bps.org.uk/sites/thepsychologist.bps.org.uk/files/freud.jpg

[Donquix]

I mean, the entire event was p2w. All of DR since its inception has been. It's dumb to not call the boots that, but it's also dumb to single them out as if they're somehow more p2w than SK haste, 10x a day <any spell in the game>, adding another fusion slot for your +XX orb (that you'll continue to pay to boost its bonus, then pay again for the enhancive charging potion to keep it working), etc.

[time4fun]

Spending 20k on some text based item has nothing to do with hunting the Rift.

https://thepsychologist.bps.org.uk/sites/thepsychologist.bps.org.uk/files/freud.jpg

Correct. Which hopefully explains why my post was about Pay2Win, not paying lots.

And if people want a good example of Pay2Win, go check out Spellbound.

100k BS there does FAR more than those silly boots. But no one wants to talk about that because they can actually afford Spellbound, and they don't want to have to give up their own Pay2Win strategy.

[Tgo01]

Correct. Which hopefully explains why my post was about Pay2Win, not paying lots.

And if people want a good example of Pay2Win, go check out Spellbound.

100k BS there does FAR more than those silly boots. But no one wants to talk about that because they can actually afford Spellbound, and they don't want to have to give up their own Pay2Win strategy.

"THIS isn't p2w...THAT is..."

It's all fucking p2w. These boots are just the most noticeable example because of how much they went for and the most egregious example because it allows the owner to completely bypass mechanics that negatively affects your character.

I don't keep up with all of the latest and greatest shit the GMs are pushing out, but I don't think anything else compares to these boots in terms of breaking mechanics.

Are there 10x superly duperly crit weighted weapons out there? Sure, but even crit weighting has its limits with randomization and all of that, not to mention anyone and everyone has access to crit weighted weapons, just maybe not as strong.

Are there 10x DB shit out there? Again, sure, but people are still subjected to DS rolls.

What about be completely mechanics breaking is if there was a one of a kind weapon out there that was exempt from crit randomization or a one of a kind cloak out there that made someone completely immune to DS rolls, then those would be on par with these boots.

But the GMs have been pushing out so much game breaking shit lately there probably are already items out there that do what I just described but I just haven't heard about them, or perhaps I'm just giving them ideas for their next 25k+ item.

[Neveragain]

Correct. Which hopefully explains why my post was about Pay2Win, not paying lots.

And if people want a good example of Pay2Win, go check out Spellbound.

100k BS there does FAR more than those silly boots. But no one wants to talk about that because they can actually afford Spellbound, and they don't want to have to give up their own Pay2Win strategy.

I couldn't give 2 shits about P2W. I do have some major concerns about a business that targets their long term customers that have some major mental disorders. If I was a family member I would have some major concerns about my family being bilked for $20,000.

[drumpel]

I can't get over the fact that people actually pay a monthly subscription for a text based "roleplaying" game still.

Stormfront should thank their lucky stars that there are still dumb people in this world.

I suppose it's no worse than stupid people that dump hundreds and hundreds, if not thousands of dollars into a mobile game...
Or a subscription based MMO - such as WoW.....
Or pay to have "what used to be normal game play under their old pay subscription model" MMO such as SWTOR (if you don't pay, you get reduced benefits - like GSIV F2P).

People pay for what they enjoy and they justify it by those means.

Do I find it strange as hell to drop $28K USD equivalent in BS on a text item? Damn right I do. Would I do it? No. Personally, I don't have that kind of time/money to put towards it and I don't think it would be a good investment of my resources. Clearly other people that play game don't feel the same as I do and as many other do.

[Maerit]

What is more crazy is that these two purchases could actually make the list (if bloodscrip was give an equivalent monetary value) of highest video game purchases ever made. Assuming either player farmed their entire bankroll of bloodscrip via purchased booklets, they spent over $20,000.00 each on individual items. According to documented purchases (and there's probably plenty of undocumented ones), this would rank these purchases in the 4th and 5th slots for "most expensive virtual goods ever sold".

https://www.fraghero.com/10-most-expensive-virtual-goods-ever-sold/

And it happened in a 24 year old text-based video game. Insane is the correct term.

[Methais]

"THIS isn't p2w...THAT is..."

It's all fucking p2w. These boots are just the most noticeable example because of how much they went for and the most egregious example because it allows the owner to completely bypass mechanics that negatively affects your character.

I don't keep up with all of the latest and greatest shit the GMs are pushing out, but I don't think anything else compares to these boots in terms of breaking mechanics.

Are there 10x superly duperly crit weighted weapons out there? Sure, but even crit weighting has its limits with randomization and all of that, not to mention anyone and everyone has access to crit weighted weapons, just maybe not as strong.

Are there 10x DB shit out there? Again, sure, but people are still subjected to DS rolls.

What about be completely mechanics breaking is if there was a one of a kind weapon out there that was exempt from crit randomization or a one of a kind cloak out there that made someone completely immune to DS rolls, then those would be on par with these boots.

But the GMs have been pushing out so much game breaking shit lately there probably are already items out there that do what I just described but I just haven't heard about them, or perhaps I'm just giving them ideas for their next 25k+ item.

Apparently P2W items already exist that basically give you access to the HEALME verb from the test server. :lol:

I'm sure time4fun doesn't consider that P2W either.

Zero people are shocked that she doesn't doesn't get it though.

P2W wouldn't even be an issue is core game dev didn't constantly take a back seat because all the dev GMs want to work on P2W stuff and nerf existing mechanics in order to make P2W stuff more attractive and/or not develop core stuff that might make some P2W stuff seem less attractive.

I expect 1206 type bullshit to happen much more frequently now.

Shortly after Estild wrecked wizards with the ELR nerfs, he teased a 940 spell that was a multi cast spell. What did he do instead? He Created P2W sigil staves that are basically that.

The GMs who work on pay-to-win stuff should not be allowed to work on core game dev, and vice versa.

[Maerit]

How come there was no SK 240 item? Woops... next DR. Then you can get a sorcerer with SK 515/240 who basically becomes the next GS overlord.

[audioserf]

I actually sort of agree that Spellbound is a bigger unbalancing/P2W factor than the 28 rack Rift boots.

There is ONE pair of those. Granted they are insane and completely nullify almost all of the challenges of a capped hunting area (!)

But Spellbound has pumped an untold number of 1x/day 215 items into the game for not that much BS in the grand scheme of things. Plenty of people picked up enough of those to fuel an 8+ hour GS shift having Heroism up literally the entire time. To me, that's a far larger indictment of the P2W stuff because it's so widespread.

The Rift boots are the headline but stuff like the 215 pins are the meat of the story, imo. That kind of buff proliferation can change game dev (pretending for a moment that there was ever going to be a new hunting area again).

[audioserf]

How come there was no SK 240 item? Woops... next DR. Then you can get a sorcerer with SK 515/240 who basically becomes the next GS overlord.

515/240 don't work together

[Merzbow]

The scary thing is that the 'mania is turning out to be NOT the biggest drain in this DR. It's those damn spellbooks. I think once word got out that in subsequent DRs they might be subject to the 2-service limit people are panic-buying. I've had an F2P sitting in HESS for no more than two days and I counted this:

https://i.imgur.com/MnGuLRR.png

105 purchases at 200k each = 21m BS. Be aware that this is an underestimate to some degree, because the HESS clerk was nerfed and you can no longer see him delivering purchases; you can only see players putting stuff in their bag. Anyone who didn't want their purchases to be public can just come in and out multiple times and buy two items each time, have alts to do the same, and so on. And there were probably people who bought lots of spellbooks before two days ago. If I had to guesstimate I'd say the real number would be 50% more, so maybe 30m drained by this one item. (And Meb, bless his soul, is apparently responsible for at least 44 of those for 8.8m BS. Damn son.)

(BTW who owns Monit and Spoilz and do they ever share their info? Pretty sure Alastir owns one of them.)

[Taernath]

I can't get over the fact that people actually pay a monthly subscription for a text based "roleplaying" game still.

Stormfront should thank their lucky stars that there are still dumb people in this world.

I would probably keep a sub rolling if it weren't for their inane recurring character slot fee and constant fixation on p2w. $15/mo isn't much, but if the only thing you get out of it is a single character they can go pound sand.

[Methais]

I actually sort of agree that Spellbound is a bigger unbalancing/P2W factor than the 28 rack Rift boots.

There is ONE pair of those. Granted they are insane and completely nullify almost all of the challenges of a capped hunting area (!)

But Spellbound has pumped an untold number of 1x/day 215 items into the game for not that much BS in the grand scheme of things. Plenty of people picked up enough of those to fuel an 8+ hour GS shift having Heroism up literally the entire time. To me, that's a far larger indictment of the P2W stuff because it's so widespread.

The Rift boots are the headline but stuff like the 215 pins are the meat of the story, imo. That kind of buff proliferation can change game dev (pretending for a moment that there was ever going to be a new hunting area again).

Simu's on record saying that P2W will never influence core game dev. Not that anyone actually believes that, but they've said it before.

[Astray]

Simu's on record saying that P2W will never influence core game dev. Not that anyone actually believes that, but they've said it before.

Savants, RSN.

[Sile]

Savants, RSN.

I can see Savants being released as soon as Wyrom can figure out a way to charge for it.

Maybe offer a class change for simucoin before actual release. So we will have lvl 100 quadruple capped savants before actual release.

[Astray]

I can see Savants being released as soon as Wyrom can figure out a way to charge for it.

Maybe offer a class change for simucoin before actual release. So we will have lvl 100 quadruple capped savants before actual release.

Nah, they'll likely never introduce another class again. Purely because it's too much of a hassle and it's much easier to sink "development" into RNG and slot machines.

[audioserf]

Within the past 12 months, Wyrom mentioned in discord that because of how poorly Paladins and later Monks were received the Savant project had been indefinitely shelved. It's never going to happen.

[Tgo01]

P2W wouldn't even be an issue is core game dev didn't constantly take a back seat because all the dev GMs want to work on P2W stuff and nerf existing mechanics in order to make P2W stuff more attractive and/or not develop core stuff that might make some P2W stuff seem less attractive.

Exactly. Typically p2w just means you pay more money to get the benefit now, while everyone else has to devote time before they get the same benefit. But with these items lately there is no "Oh you'll get it someday, little guy!" It's more like "Okay these are the select few we have decided to cater to. Everyone else can piss off and hope they can receive an RPA someday, maybe."

[Gelston]

How poorly they were received? Paladins were received pretty greatly. I remember people gushing over them. Then it became boring as people realized it was just a weaker warrior with subpar spells. The spells are better now, but it was still highly played when they came out. Any "poor reception" of monks or paladins was 100% because of Dev, not excitement for them. Put out a feature complete class, and people will fucking love it.

[Luntz]

https://media1.giphy.com/media/8iI61XILaGkUM/giphy.gif

[Gelston]

Exactly. Typically p2w just means you pay more money to get the benefit now, while everyone else has to devote time before they get the same benefit. But with these items lately there is no "Oh you'll get it someday, little guy!" It's more like "Okay these are the select few we have decided to cater to. Everyone else can piss off and hope they can receive an RPA someday, maybe."

That is what n00bs call P2W. Real P2W is in competitive games where you literally can't lose when you fight against someone who pays less. GS doesn't really have shit to win, so really, it is just pay to lose here.

[sfmatthias0]

I bought the boots. My custom title for a while has been Rift Adjudicator, and yes my char is completely based around the rift. I'd rather own them than a mid-low end BMW. They bring me far more joy on the daily. I regret nothing.

P2W... lol. there is an entire list of legendary items and far more than those that are unlisted. Some items are powerful because they are bugged, some have sick synergy with another item, and many were created by GMs before there was much item oversight and sold. Since then, lower profile whales have bought and sold them for at least 20k, often more. Far fewer items like these boots go out now. They completely restrict advantage to this one of numerous capped hunting zones. But yes, the sky is falling. It's not like there were already four sk 506 items (far more mechanically powerful) dating back over a decade or anything.

Speaking of winning, how exactly do you win gemstone? Do you kill critters faster than the person next to you? DEAR GOD we cannot have that. But wait, we already do, and you don't have to pay for it. Watch a stock bard blow shit up in vanilla 5x gear with impunity if you don't believe me. If killing stuff is winning (it's not), here's the crazy part, you don't even have to buy any gear! Ever see me put up a chunk of silvers for sale? That's cause I don't. I'm not farming. I play my char with good gear because i want to. It has zero effect. I'm not singlehandedly depressing the loot tables, and even if i did, the people in other hunting grounds would just see more loot. Am I stealing dev resources over a pair of custom coded boots? lol k.

I also love the soft paternity regarding gambling being expressed. There was no probability. The boots came up for sale and I bought them. You wouldn't spend that much? cool story?

This post is built on a shitton of salt and fearmongering. If Warclaidh quit TOMORROW do you think his shit wouldnt be instantly scooped up by a score of thirsty whales?

This game is F2W (yes, free to win, be a new player, roll a bard and ask any whale for some 5x gear and they'll hand it to you). What you might be mad about is that certain builds and items kill stuff better than the ones you want to use or for a price you dont want to pay, nor do you have to.

[Gelston]

a "used"mid-low end BMW.

FTFY. You aren't finding any new low-mid BMWs at 28k.

[vantho]

I for one have decided that it ruins my life that now you fry in 2 minutes 36 seconds instead of 2 minutes 42 seconds pre-boots.

[Neveragain]

I bought the boots. My custom title for a while has been Rift Adjudicator, and yes my char is completely based around the rift. I'd rather own them than a mid-low end BMW. They bring me far more joy on the daily. I regret nothing.

P2W... lol. there is an entire list of legendary items and far more than those that are unlisted. Some items are powerful because they are bugged, some have sick synergy with another item, and many were created by GMs before there was much item oversight and sold. Since then, lower profile whales have bought and sold them for at least 20k, often more. Far fewer items like these boots go out now. They completely restrict advantage to this one of numerous capped hunting zones. But yes, the sky is falling. It's not like there were already four sk 506 items (far more mechanically powerful) dating back over a decade or anything.

Speaking of winning, how exactly do you win gemstone? Do you kill critters faster than the person next to you? DEAR GOD we cannot have that. But wait, we already do, and you don't have to pay for it. Watch a stock bard blow shit up in vanilla 5x gear with impunity if you don't believe me. If killing stuff is winning (it's not), here's the crazy part, you don't even have to buy any gear! Ever see me put up a chunk of silvers for sale? That's cause I don't. I'm not farming. I play my char with good gear because i want to. It has zero effect. I'm not singlehandedly depressing the loot tables, and even if i did, the people in other hunting grounds would just see more loot. Am I stealing dev resources over a pair of custom coded boots? lol k.

I also love the soft paternity regarding gambling being expressed. There was no probability. The boots came up for sale and I bought them. You wouldn't spend that much? cool story?

This post is built on a shitton of salt and fearmongering. If Warclaidh quit TOMORROW do you think his shit wouldnt be instantly scooped up by a score of thirsty whales?

This game is F2W (yes, free to win, be a new player, roll a bard and ask any whale for some 5x gear and they'll hand it to you). What you might be mad about is that certain builds and items kill stuff better than the ones you want to use or for a price you dont want to pay, nor do you have to.

Here is the next big item for you:

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn%3AANd9GcQXsbEgfG8zhZc0_fKcnOuiLNc4tNJ DmeGaahQ1t7L1Q-75ENk1

Rub it 1x a day to increase the size of your obviously tiny penis.

Opening bids at $100,000

[Taernath]

I bought the boots. My custom title for a while has been Rift Adjudicator, and yes my char is completely based around the rift. I'd rather own them than a mid-low end BMW. They bring me far more joy on the daily. I regret nothing.

P2W... lol. there is an entire list of legendary items and far more than those that are unlisted. Some items are powerful because they are bugged, some have sick synergy with another item, and many were created by GMs before there was much item oversight and sold. Since then, lower profile whales have bought and sold them for at least 20k, often more. Far fewer items like these boots go out now. They completely restrict advantage to this one of numerous capped hunting zones. But yes, the sky is falling. It's not like there were already four sk 506 items (far more mechanically powerful) dating back over a decade or anything.

Speaking of winning, how exactly do you win gemstone? Do you kill critters faster than the person next to you? DEAR GOD we cannot have that. But wait, we already do, and you don't have to pay for it. Watch a stock bard blow shit up in vanilla 5x gear with impunity if you don't believe me. If killing stuff is winning (it's not), here's the crazy part, you don't even have to buy any gear! Ever see me put up a chunk of silvers for sale? That's cause I don't. I'm not farming. I play my char with good gear because i want to. It has zero effect. I'm not singlehandedly depressing the loot tables, and even if i did, the people in other hunting grounds would just see more loot. Am I stealing dev resources over a pair of custom coded boots? lol k.

I also love the soft paternity regarding gambling being expressed. There was no probability. The boots came up for sale and I bought them. You wouldn't spend that much? cool story?

This post is built on a shitton of salt and fearmongering. If Warclaidh quit TOMORROW do you think his shit wouldnt be instantly scooped up by a score of thirsty whales?

This game is F2W (yes, free to win, be a new player, roll a bard and ask any whale for some 5x gear and they'll hand it to you). What you might be mad about is that certain builds and items kill stuff better than the ones you want to use or for a price you dont want to pay, nor do you have to.

Quoted for posterity

[drumpel]

Within the past 12 months, Wyrom mentioned in discord that because of how poorly Paladins and later Monks were received the Savant project had been indefinitely shelved. It's never going to happen.

So, Dev drops the ball on new professions released and people don't enjoy some of the aspect of them and it's the player's fault that the professions weren't well received.

....Hmmmm....Yep, sounds like Wyrom thinking to me - not Dev's fault. Players suck. Screw what they want and add things to the P2W aspect.

[Amerek]

I am excited people love this game enough to spend money on it. I am convinced the only reason Simu doesnt publicize it more is that events like DR would be instantly ruined by Chinese farming bots and kill the goose

[Sile]

I am excited people love this game enough to spend money on it. I am convinced the only reason Simu doesnt publicize it more is that events like DR would be instantly ruined by Chinese farming bots and kill the goose

The farmers are already here. They may not be chinese but they still exist. Look at some of them panicking and selling bs for as low as 3.3 per k this run. Wasnt a lot at that rate, but some did hit it.

[Neveragain]

Quoted for posterity

Imagine this guy not getting first priority.

The raging /gquit message would be epic.

[Fortybox]

Stillfront: Show us the numbers, Wyrom.

Wyrom: This DR was pretty good, we pulled in about $23,000 this run.

Stillfront: ..........

Wyrom: ???

Stillfront: WHAT THE FUCK DUDE WHERE ARE THESE 28k SINGLE ITEM SALES LIKE LAST TIME? GET YOUR FUCKING SHIT TOGETHER OR THAT'S IT!!!!!! I THOUGHT YOU GUYS WERE MAKING PROGRESS BUT THANKS FOR LETTING US DOWN AGAIN ASSHOLES! TELL ESTILD TO GET HIS FUCKING SHIT TOGETHER AND NERF SOME MORE SHIT OR SOMETHING TOO!!!!!!!!!11

Wyrom: Yes sir.

Stillfront: FUCKING NOOB

Wyrom:
https://media.giphy.com/media/c6DIpCp1922KQ/giphy.gif

:lol:

[Fortybox]

Imagine this guy not getting first priority.

The raging /gquit message would be epic.

No doubt in my mind that the whales have an inside track to what is being sold.

[Fortybox]

I bought the boots. My custom title for a while has been Rift Adjudicator, and yes my char is completely based around the rift. I'd rather own them than a mid-low end BMW. They bring me far more joy on the daily. I regret nothing.

P2W... lol. there is an entire list of legendary items and far more than those that are unlisted. Some items are powerful because they are bugged, some have sick synergy with another item, and many were created by GMs before there was much item oversight and sold. Since then, lower profile whales have bought and sold them for at least 20k, often more. Far fewer items like these boots go out now. They completely restrict advantage to this one of numerous capped hunting zones. But yes, the sky is falling. It's not like there were already four sk 506 items (far more mechanically powerful) dating back over a decade or anything.

Speaking of winning, how exactly do you win gemstone? Do you kill critters faster than the person next to you? DEAR GOD we cannot have that. But wait, we already do, and you don't have to pay for it. Watch a stock bard blow shit up in vanilla 5x gear with impunity if you don't believe me. If killing stuff is winning (it's not), here's the crazy part, you don't even have to buy any gear! Ever see me put up a chunk of silvers for sale? That's cause I don't. I'm not farming. I play my char with good gear because i want to. It has zero effect. I'm not singlehandedly depressing the loot tables, and even if i did, the people in other hunting grounds would just see more loot. Am I stealing dev resources over a pair of custom coded boots? lol k.

I also love the soft paternity regarding gambling being expressed. There was no probability. The boots came up for sale and I bought them. You wouldn't spend that much? cool story?

This post is built on a shitton of salt and fearmongering. If Warclaidh quit TOMORROW do you think his shit wouldnt be instantly scooped up by a score of thirsty whales?

This game is F2W (yes, free to win, be a new player, roll a bard and ask any whale for some 5x gear and they'll hand it to you). What you might be mad about is that certain builds and items kill stuff better than the ones you want to use or for a price you dont want to pay, nor do you have to.

Score of thirsty whales

:lol:

[drauz]

Correct. Which hopefully explains why my post was about Pay2Win, not paying lots.

And if people want a good example of Pay2Win, go check out Spellbound.

100k BS there does FAR more than those silly boots. But no one wants to talk about that because they can actually afford Spellbound, and they don't want to have to give up their own Pay2Win strategy.

EXCEPT YOU CAN'T USE THEM IN THE RIFT UNLESS YOU HAVE THESE BOOTS

[Sile]

Imagine this guy not getting first priority.

The raging /gquit message would be epic.

Imagine being pretty much the main reason Simu is still solvent and being despised/ mocked by the majority of the player base.

[Taernath]

I am excited people love this game enough to spend money on it. I am convinced the only reason Simu doesnt publicize it more is that events like DR would be instantly ruined by Chinese farming bots and kill the goose

We already have the equivalent of Chinese farming bots in GS. Just post an alt up outside the arena or sewers and log the names - some of them are there 24/7. Will the goose ever die? I don't know, but it has stage IV cloaca cancer and doesn't eat very healthy.


Imagine this guy not getting first priority.

The raging /gquit message would be epic.

I think he'd try to play it off. 'You're just jealous I dropped almost 30k on GS! Next time I'll drop 40k just to show you!' Oh no, don't do that. Anything but that. :loser:

[Fortybox]

p2w is where a consumer pays $ for an in-game advantage. Those boots are the very definition of p2w. So is pretty much everything at DR, the Simucoin store, etc.

[Sile]

We already have the equivalent of Chinese farming bots in GS. Just post an alt up outside the arena or sewers and log the names - some of them are there 24/7.



I think he'd try to play it off. 'You're just jealous I dropped almost 30k on GS! Next time I'll drop 40k just to show you!' Oh no, don't do that. Anything but that. ��

Yeah... I love how he justified it's nothing to them, I found many reasons to justify dropping 70k at a casino one weekend. Could.i afford it, sure. Was it fun , yeah.

Was it a stupid decision, absafuckinglootly

[Fortybox]

Imagine this guy not getting first priority.

The raging /gquit message would be epic.

He immediately bid on the item. There was no way he didn’t know that this was being auctioned beforehand.

[Sile]

He immediately bid on the item. There was no way he didn’t know that this was being auctioned beforehand.

Funny thing is there was at least two people I know of waiting for it to hit 6m

[sfmatthias0]

Glad I bought at 7 then ;)

[Sile]

Glad I bought at 7 then ;)

Glad you enjoy it really.

This just showed me in glaring lights that Gemstone is far from.what I fondly remember. And is what is driving me away for good.

But all the power to you, to ride the rollercoaster on the front cart right to the end

[Tgo01]

Yeah... I love how he justified it's nothing to them, I found many reasons to justify dropping 70k at a casino one weekend. Could.i afford it, sure. Was it fun , yeah.

Was it a stupid decision, absafuckinglootly

That's crazy. I'll sell you my entire Dreavening team for just 65k.

[RichardCranium]

That's crazy. I'll sell you my entire Dreavening team for just 65k.

Dreavening is p2w. Reported.

[sfmatthias0]

I'm more surprised at the lack of P2W (cause you can win gemstone...) howling over sk 506 and 515 given this hyperfocus on a unique item limited to one hunting ground.

[Tgo01]

He immediately bid on the item. There was no way he didn’t know that this was being auctioned beforehand.

I would bet money a GM created these boots specifically for him and gave him a heads up about them and figured they could get him to bid a lot of scrip for it.

Which is even more sad if you think about it: in a normal game with a small community such as GS you would think a GM would create special boots such as these for a particular player and maybe have them go on some sort of quest to find them, a special little something for the dedicated players.

But instead a GM probably specifically targeted him knowing how much he apparently likes the Rift (since he said he had that custom title for a while now) and I'm sure he's on a list somewhere of big spenders, so they decided to create an item specifically for him to milk more money out of him.

[Sile]

That's crazy. I'll sell you my entire Dreavening team for just 65k.

Are you going to give me free food, hotel rooms, and neck massages whenever I want?

[Tgo01]

Dreavening is p2w. Reported.

:O


Are you going to give me free food, hotel rooms, and neck massages whenever I want?

For 65k for one weekend? Sure.

[sfmatthias0]

I'd saved up for sk 506, but cool story bro

[Sile]

I'm more surprised at the lack of P2W (cause you can win gemstone...) howling over sk 506 and 515 given this hyperfocus on a unique item limited to one hunting ground.

People would be talking about any item that sold for the most. People are focusing on your item because one, it sold for the most, and two it circumvents mechanics that had no way of before.

The fact that your character is designed around the rift, these boots are tailor made for the rift, and that you bid on them at first bid, makes it seem likely these were a create your own item under a different name.

None of us are mad you did it, most of us are pissed this is what gs has became.

[Sile]

:O



For 65k for one weekend? Sure.

I could still make it a net loss for you.

[Tgo01]

I could still make it a net loss for you.

How much food do you eat?

[Tgo01]

I'd saved up for sk 506, but cool story bro

Dude, I don't think anyone is angry at you or think you have destroyed GS because you bought this item. I think it's more like people are angry at Simu and think they have destroyed GS because this is what they do with most of their dev time now.

[Sile]

How much food do you eat?

I didnt say I'd eat it all, just that you gave it to me.

[sfmatthias0]

So, lets follow through this logic.. A gm tells me about these boots, i amass 12 mil bloodscrip, which they would know about, then they open it up at 7, with at least one other person that I know about holding more than 10 as well at the time. Do they hate money now?

[Sile]

So, lets follow through this logic.. A gm tells me about these boots, i amass 12 mil bloodscrip, which they would know about, then they open it up at 7, with at least one other person that I know about holding more than 10 as well at the time. Do they hate money now?

So are you admitting they told you about the boots before hand? When it wasnt on the list of publically known teasers?

That is special treatment and exactly why people are bashing Wyrom and Co

[sfmatthias0]

your reading comprehension is... special. I'm saying that version of events is insane

[audioserf]

I can't tell if this is the most or the least self aware thread on this forum

[Sile]

your reading comprehension is... special. I'm saying that version of events is insane

I asked a question to clarify, and have not once thrown an insult at you.

Except now,

You are going through a lot.of effort to show us you dont care.

Let me be crystal clear. None of us care if you spend 28k or even 100k on an item. We care Simu is setting it up for you to. Very important distinction

[sfmatthias0]

Your answer is no, I had no idea. At all. And you can believe it because if a gm had been colluding to extract profit they'd have known they could get a lot more money

[Astray]

I can't tell if this is the most or the least self aware thread on this forum

Schrodinger's bullshit

[Tgo01]

So, lets follow through this logic.. A gm tells me about these boots, i amass 12 mil bloodscrip, which they would know about, then they open it up at 7, with at least one other person that I know about holding more than 10 as well at the time. Do they hate money now?

Your hypothetical is confusing me, did they start the opening bit at 7 mil? Are you saying the fact that they didn't start at 12 mil knowing you have 12 mil proves they weren't just trying to milk money out of people?

[Sile]

Your answer is no, I had no idea. At all. And you can believe it because if a gm had been colluding to extract profit they'd have known they could get a lot more money

Take a step back and view it from the outside in, then you can see how it would be highly suspect. Valid or not.

I dont fault you for spending your money how you want. And never will.

But I dont think anyone here thinks you are the problem. More a symptom of the problem.

[Parkbandit]

I can't tell if this is the most or the least self aware thread on this forum

time4fun taught a college course in self awareness, so obviously it's the most.

[sfmatthias0]

It's fairly strong evidence, or are you saying they dont care about that extra 10k dollars in profit (3 mil bloodscrip i saved when it opened at 7? But believe what you want, you've already made up your mind, I don't know why im bothering to point out the obvious

[Donquix]

So, Dev drops the ball on new professions released and people don't enjoy some of the aspect of them and it's the player's fault that the professions weren't well received.

....Hmmmm....Yep, sounds like Wyrom thinking to me - not Dev's fault. Players suck. Screw what they want and add things to the P2W aspect.

yeah i mean monks and pallies were both bad at their respective releases (paladins were at least mechanically OK but they were boring). on top of that the (still) persisting issue that neither has any out of combat utility contributes quite a bit. A lot of people like their characters to be useful other than smashing stuff so if you wanna DO anything both are basically ruled out.

But they also aren't entirely wrong. Adoption of the characters would obviously have been a lot higher with better design out of the gate but this isn't WoW where you can cap a new class in a month. When you're game is on a timeline of years not weeks and people are already invested in builds/personas they've sunk thousands of hours and potentially thousands of dollars into, it's harder to get that buyin to a completely new thing.

Don't get me wrong, it's fucking ridiculous to me that we could go this long between new classes to keep things fresh for people who are interested. I'm very pro Savant, personally, (also some kind of elemental / mental hybrid) but it is a comparative lot of work for i dunno, the 10 people who would play it.

[Sile]

Do you honestly believe all that 'profit' you made them is going back into the game?

It appeares to the 99% of us, they are focused on milking the 1%. Why would they spend money on dev at this point that dont have the same returns. At best a week of dev(being very generous) for a 28k item.

It's probably closer to 2to 4 hrs of dev.

The 506 sk was probably 10 minutes of dev.

Again you do you, and this behaviour is realistically why the game is still alive at this point, but I and many others still think it sucks

[Roblar]

The goal of this event is to drain bloodscrip, massively so if possible. The scrip had already been paid for by that point and it is about removing them from the game (or face customer backlash about the perceived value of same currency)

It protects against inflation for future events and the broader playerbase, satisfies the customers who bought in for the alternative virtual currency by giving them something they presumably want or will enjoy, and overall drives more sales and participation next time around.

Overall, it did its job and the people who bought in (not gambled as someone posted before) prove the demand, regardless of anyone's personal opinion. While it is a crazy high number, it is supply and demand and he is correct that there were others that planned and prepared to spend just as much, as you can see from other sales there. None of this was really a shock, the stockpiles being purchased were known to me at least. SK 506 would likely have been the highest item had he not already owned one!

TLDR: Glad you enjoy the item and I highly doubt you knew about it beforehand. As shocking as this is, it is not the only venue for services or items nor truly that new to the game (just more apparent and more funds going to Simu). Big silver drain is likely next, which nets them nothing much.

[Murrandii]

TABARNAK

[Sile]

The goal of this event is to drain bloodscrip, massively so if possible. The scrip had already been paid for by that point and it is about removing them from the game (or face customer backlash about the perceived value of same currency)

It protects against inflation for future events and the broader playerbase, satisfies the customers who bought in for the alternative virtual currency by giving them something they presumably want or will enjoy, and overall drives more sales and participation next time around.

Overall, it did its job and the people who bought in (not gambled as someone posted before) prove the demand, regardless of anyone's personal opinion. While it is a crazy high number, it is supply and demand and he is correct that there were others that planned and prepared to spend just as much, as you can see from other sales there. None of this was really a shock, the stockpiles being purchased were known to me at least. SK 506 would likely have been the highest item had he not already owned one!

TLDR: Glad you enjoy the item and I highly doubt you knew about it beforehand. As shocking as this is, it is not the only venue for services or items nor truly that new to the game (just more apparent and more funds going to Simu). Big silver drain is likely next, which nets them nothing much.

I brought up the gambling, because spending more in the game was triggering the same feelings gambling did for me. It was unhealthy. That is on me.

I didnt point at any one person and say ahah you have a gambling problem. I said there is a good chance that someone is buying in has a problem. Which odds are in my favor (gambling again lol)

Never ment to be a personal attack.

[Tgo01]

It's fairly strong evidence, or are you saying they dont care about that extra 10k dollars in profit (3 mil bloodscrip i saved when it opened at 7? But believe what you want, you've already made up your mind, I don't know why im bothering to point out the obvious

I mean...don't you think it would have been a little TOO obvious if they started the bidding at 11,999,999 knowing you had 12 million?

I'm gonna give Simu SOME credit on this one.

[Roblar]

Do you honestly believe all that 'profit' you made them is going back into the game?

This is the question.

I don't think all of course, but still hope for some of it :)

[Sile]

This is the question.

I don't think all of course, but still hope for some of it :)

Yeah, as cynical as I am, I really hope I am wrong.

As I mentioned earlier, the best part of GS is the community. And they deserve to be supported

[Luntz]

Roblar the only reasonable person in a whirlwind of gaylords hahaha

Also Sfmatthias, fuck the haters, what is this Stalinist Russia? You earn your money and have the freedom to spend it how you want, go back to Russia if you want something different.

[time4fun]

I couldn't give 2 shits about P2W. I do have some major concerns about a business that targets their long term customers that have some major mental disorders. If I was a family member I would have some major concerns about my family being bilked for $20,000.

You're running under the implicit- and likely incorrect- assumption that dumping that much money into the game requires them to take money away from something else they need or want. (Also that if they *are* diverting funds, they're not diverting it from something more problematic- like actual gambling)

Personally, I don't have $20k to throw around on a video game. But I know for a fact that a couple of people in this game do.

What's crazy for one person is just another day in the life for another.

[Parkbandit]

Do you honestly believe all that 'profit' you made them is going back into the game?

It appeares to the 99% of us, they are focused on milking the 1%. Why would they spend money on dev at this point that dont have the same returns. At best a week of dev(being very generous) for a 28k item.

It's probably closer to 2to 4 hrs of dev.

The 506 sk was probably 10 minutes of dev.

Again you do you, and this behaviour is realistically why the game is still alive at this point, but I and many others still think it sucks

If it weren't for the 1% though.. you wouldn't have a game to play.

[beldannon5]

As for people running 24 hours a day. It maybe true in the arena but there were many times really early morning that I was the only one in the sewers. And I got at least 6 hours of sleep a day during duskruin. I know that wasnt the point but still. Lol

[vantho]

Making money for their corporate overlords is what simu is supposed to do. Being able to tap into their customer base with above average discretionary spending is good for business, and they would be negligent to ignore such opportunities. It's something of a balancing act, as keeping the wider player base happy is also good for business.

I feel that this DR was a successful event in that they were able to provide interesting offerings over a wide price range.

It's fair to be concerned that the success of pay events like this might draw more dev time at the expense of general game development, but hopefully they realize that pushing forward with general development pleases both big spenders and average players, and keeping a greater number of people interested and engaged through progress with basic subscription content goes hand in hand with pay event success by allowing them to cast a wider net.

[Tgo01]

keeping the wider player base happy is also good for business.

Yeah but that's sort of the point. Whales only spend so much money on a game because they have a lot of people to defeat in combat (in those types of games, not saying GS is one of those), or they have a lot of people to brag to. Whales really aren't going to be impressed for too long with just bragging to one another.

This is why the sorts of games with whales also spend a lot of time working on shit that benefits everyone, whales and non-whales alike. Simu seems to have missed that memo along the way.

[Sile]

If it weren't for the 1% though.. you wouldn't have a game to play.

And I've said as much.

[Methais]

That is what n00bs call P2W. Real P2W is in competitive games where you literally can't lose when you fight against someone who pays less. GS doesn't really have shit to win, so really, it is just pay to lose here.

P2W is a broad term that's just widely used to describe any kind of bullshit microtransactions. Or in the case of $28,000 GS items, macrotransactions.

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

Roblar the only reasonable person in a whirlwind of gaylords hahaha

Also Sfmatthias, fuck the haters, what is this Stalinist Russia? You earn your money and have the freedom to spend it how you want, go back to Russia if you want something different.

Exactly. I said before I wouldn't do it, but hey, if it's your thing, go for it. We aren't a socialist country yet. But if Bernie gets elected, I want my 2 days a year usage of those community boots.

[Methais]

I bought the boots. My custom title for a while has been Rift Adjudicator, and yes my char is completely based around the rift. I'd rather own them than a mid-low end BMW. They bring me far more joy on the daily. I regret nothing.

P2W... lol. there is an entire list of legendary items and far more than those that are unlisted. Some items are powerful because they are bugged, some have sick synergy with another item, and many were created by GMs before there was much item oversight and sold. Since then, lower profile whales have bought and sold them for at least 20k, often more. Far fewer items like these boots go out now. They completely restrict advantage to this one of numerous capped hunting zones. But yes, the sky is falling. It's not like there were already four sk 506 items (far more mechanically powerful) dating back over a decade or anything.

Speaking of winning, how exactly do you win gemstone? Do you kill critters faster than the person next to you? DEAR GOD we cannot have that. But wait, we already do, and you don't have to pay for it. Watch a stock bard blow shit up in vanilla 5x gear with impunity if you don't believe me. If killing stuff is winning (it's not), here's the crazy part, you don't even have to buy any gear! Ever see me put up a chunk of silvers for sale? That's cause I don't. I'm not farming. I play my char with good gear because i want to. It has zero effect. I'm not singlehandedly depressing the loot tables, and even if i did, the people in other hunting grounds would just see more loot. Am I stealing dev resources over a pair of custom coded boots? lol k.

I also love the soft paternity regarding gambling being expressed. There was no probability. The boots came up for sale and I bought them. You wouldn't spend that much? cool story?

This post is built on a shitton of salt and fearmongering. If Warclaidh quit TOMORROW do you think his shit wouldnt be instantly scooped up by a score of thirsty whales?

This game is F2W (yes, free to win, be a new player, roll a bard and ask any whale for some 5x gear and they'll hand it to you). What you might be mad about is that certain builds and items kill stuff better than the ones you want to use or for a price you dont want to pay, nor do you have to.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I wouldn't give the first fuck about P2W in GS if the core game being largely ignored outside of nerfing shit or creating spells just to flip as SK P2W items wasn't its biggest side effect. Spend millions on GS for all I care. I don't care what the players are doing. I care what Simu is doing and where their priorities lie. I mean I get it, they have to reach certain numbers because of Stillfront. If the only way to accomplish that is to largely ignore core game dev, just come out and say so.


I'm more surprised at the lack of P2W (cause you can win gemstone...) howling over sk 506 and 515 given this hyperfocus on a unique item limited to one hunting ground.

Make no mistake, those are massive bullshit too, especially 515.

Simu loves to give away wizard spells regularly though, so I can't really say it surprised me.

The boots stand out because nothing like them have existed before, not that I know of anyway.


None of us are mad you did it, most of us are pissed this is what gs has became.

^


Dude, I don't think anyone is angry at you or think you have destroyed GS because you bought this item. I think it's more like people are angry at Simu and think they have destroyed GS because this is what they do with most of their dev time now.

^^

I've heard all sorts of juicy rumors flying around today though.

Anyone notice that Coase is no longer on Discord? Yeah.

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

So not having played in 15 years. Bloodscript is new currency. Can you only get it by paying cash for it? Or could you buy it with silvers? Or is it literally a cash for game currency for high end item only?

That reads funny. My question is, short of selling silvers for cash or other items for cash, can you get bloodscript just playing as a normal character?

[time4fun]

Exactly. I said before I wouldn't do it, but hey, if it's your thing, go for it. We aren't a socialist country yet. But if Bernie gets elected, I want my 2 days a year usage of those community boots.

Ugh he has GOT to stop calling himself a democratic socialist. He's not. He's a proponent of social democracy.

Drives me crazy.

[Tgo01]

Anyone notice that Coase is no longer on Discord? Yeah.

Well what's the rumor? :O

[Tgo01]

So not having played in 15 years. Bloodscript is new currency. Can you only get it by paying cash for it? Or could you buy it with silvers? Or is it literally a cash for game currency for high end item only?

That reads funny. My question is, short of selling silvers for cash or other items for cash, can you get bloodscript just playing as a normal character?

From what I understand you can only get bloodscrip via buying SimuCoins to do whatever it is people do in Duskruin, and you can only get SimuCoins by spending in real money.

I believe you buy tickets via SimuCoins but these tickets aren't soulbound so you could theoretically buy the tickets with silvers from a player and then use those tickets to earn bloodscrip, but ultimately the tickets come from spending real life money.

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

I'd stick with Silvers I think then. Ultimately, everything sells for silvers right? When the owners want something new/different. Like I think I saw Methais selling 650M silvers or something crazy? That's cash you can use to buy bs I suppose.

[Sile]

If you are premium you get so many free simucoin a month. So it will get you a few runs, not a huge amount.

The most common exchange I've seen is people selling the 50 count book for silvers or bs. But there is no way to get the books without spending simucoins. Though they did a raffle for 2, 250 count books.

Cost per 'event' is roughly $1 if you dont factor in bonus simucoins bonus for larger purchases or premium bonus. This goes down to roughly 60c per run if you buy the 1k usd simucoin pack on premium

I flipped $1k of books for silvers and bs. 28 in total, and it only took me about 3 hours to sell them. At pretty high rates.

[Gelston]

I'm more surprised at the lack of P2W (cause you can win gemstone...) howling over sk 506 and 515 given this hyperfocus on a unique item limited to one hunting ground.

The only reason your item is being mentioned is because of the retarded price it went for. Yes, other items are acknowledged as P2W. The ridiculous price you paid is only going to serve for them to see that it is a good idea to expand stupid shit like that, but even more powerful items. Hell, I imagine a GM slot is for sale next. Only 100k.

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

If you are premium you get so many free simucoin a month. So it will get you a few runs, not a huge amount.

The most common exchange I've seen is people selling the 50 count book for silvers or bs. But there is no way to get the books without spending simucoins. Though they did a raffle for 2, 250 count books.

Cost per 'event' is roughly $1 if you dont factor in bonus simucoins bonus for larger purchases or premium bonus. This goes down to roughly 60c per run if you buy the 1k usd simucoin pack on premium

I, personally, would simply rather they had in game gear auctions for silvers, and then if you bought it you have the option of paying x$ per 1M silvers in terms of cash. Fuck this dig, dig dig, maybe get whatever, grind grind grind. Just make it real cash/silvers for gear. Then it's all out there and everyone is on the same page. You either pay a lot in cash, or grind alot to get silvers, or somewhere in between. Or you don't get something. Seems very capitalist to me.

[Sile]

I, personally, would simply rather they had in game gear auctions for silvers, and then if you bought it you have the option of paying x$ per 1M silvers in terms of cash. Fuck this dig, dig dig, maybe get whatever, grind grind grind. Just make it real cash/silvers for gear. Then it's all out there and everyone is on the same page. You either pay a lot in cash, or grind alot to get silvers, or somewhere in between. Or you don't get something. Seems very capitalist to me.

I suspect the convoluted system is really set up to give them plausible deniability to being accused or even charged for selling virtual currency for real.life money.

Which at the least would have huge tax implications, at the worst it breaks a lot of laws.

Imagine if every silver sale had to be reported to the IRS.

Way It is set up they can say they are only selling access micro transactions... not items with real life value, as they dont participate in the black market and it is beyond their control.

[wetsand]

From what I understand you can only get bloodscrip via buying SimuCoins to do whatever it is people do in Duskruin, and you can only get SimuCoins by spending in real money.


My question is, short of selling silvers for cash or other items for cash, can you get bloodscript just playing as a normal character?

I'm most likely in the minority here but I've never spent any cash on simucoins. I do enjoy running the arena so I bank all my simustore login rewards (150 coins per month) and buy tickets with those. Once I had a decent amount of BS, I started purchasing books with BS. But its becoming increasingly difficult to generate enough BS in the quantity needed to purchase items. Prices have absolutely skyrocketed in the last few runs, its ridiculous and impossible to acquire items with this strategy anymore. In the past I bought one of those 6x/6x T4 nervestaves and the 6x HCP drama armor entirely with self generated "free" BS.

With prices now, I can barely put enough BS together to purchase even a single mid range item. But hey it was fun and profitable while it lasted. Now its just about getting to sit around with my head at "saturated".

[Leafiara]

Prices have absolutely skyrocketed in the last few runs, its ridiculous and impossible to acquire items with this strategy anymore. In the past I bought one of those 6x/6x T4 nervestaves and the 6x HCP drama armor entirely with self generated "free" BS.

With prices now, I can barely put enough BS together to purchase even a single mid range item.Ehhhhh. If drama armor and nervestaves are your price range for midrange, the 1x/day 215, 1x/day 606, Naijin's vambraces, and T0 twin weapons were all there this run, plus Retser's past creations at T0 or T1. Oh, and T2 sigil staves after Estild's changes this run.

The top end is going insane (and, sure, it's very, very insane), but midrange still looks pretty rounded out to me. Off the top of my head, only the karma armor pricing seemed way out of whack to me in the normal shops.


Edit: though like audioserf said, there might be serious implications to mass 215 x/days being all over the place now. So I'm not even saying this is a good or bad thing, just it is what it is.

[Donquix]

Ehhhhh. If drama armor and nervestaves are your price range for midrange, the 1x/day 215, 1x/day 606, Naijin's vambraces, and T0 twin weapons were all there this run, plus Retser's past creations at T0 or T1. Oh, and T2 sigil staves after Estild's changes this run.

The top end is going insane (and, sure, it's very, very insane), but midrange still looks pretty rounded out to me. Off the top of my head, only the karma armor pricing seemed way out of whack to me in the normal shops.


Edit: though like audioserf said, there might be serious implications to mass 215 x/days being all over the place now. So I'm not even saying this is a good or bad thing, just it is what it is.

i dunno if i'd include the vambraces in there. as neat as they are without the 200k parry unlock they don't do a ton for you. super neat though.

the x/day are real nice but realistically even at 200 MIU you need at least a couple to be really good putting it out of what i would consider a "low" end type offering (even 20k is pushing it)

T0 twin i agree are a great value even ots, but it's a comparatively niche set of builds

Overall i agree, i think there are good, not insane, OTS things. I think they fail in the middle ground quite a bit. 125k+ to unlock most of those thing things a little crazy for what they wanna call a "mid", 75-100k seems better to me for engaging people on farming to the "top" end of those. I like the idea with sigil staves being pretty good, then getting (now) amazing, then a BIG jump to make it that truly crazy tier. The HESS prices for some of the older stuff like voln armor, and ithzir are dumb as fucking rocks.

[Winter]

I'm more surprised at the lack of P2W (cause you can win gemstone...) howling over sk 506 and 515 given this hyperfocus on a unique item limited to one hunting ground.

I think the main gripe is that the devs are concentrating on projects like this instead of focusing on the rest the game and as a result everyone including the whales are losing out.

[time4fun]

I think the main gripe is that the devs are concentrating on projects like this instead of focusing on the rest the game and as a result everyone including the whales are losing out.

For the most part it's different GMs working on events vs actual game dev (Estild being one of the exceptions). Mostly you've just got folks like Haliste and Retser who taught themselves to code so they could go make neat things for people. I have a hard time faulting someone for that.

And giving your dev GMs a chance to go create passion projects instead of updating verbs is probably pretty key to retention.

[time4fun]

Also it feels worth pointing out that they introduced the Trove- which let people have a chance at winning some really nice items without having to earn 300k bloodscrip to do it. They really have expanded the event out in a lot of ways to help accommodate different levels of investment in simucoin purchases.

[Tgo01]

For the most part it's different GMs working on events vs actual game dev (Estild being one of the exceptions). Mostly you've just got folks like Haliste and Retser who taught themselves to code so they could go make neat things for people. I have a hard time faulting someone for that.

And giving your dev GMs a chance to go create passion projects instead of updating verbs is probably pretty key to retention.

This is right up there with "We can't hire a full time programmer! It wouldn't be fair to the other GMs!!!!1111"

That is to say Simu tells you there are "event" GMs and "game dev" GMs therefore when they create their one billionth paid event you shouldn't think it is detracting away from game dev because there are two totally different sets of GMs! And people fall for it every time.

Here's an idea: move some of those event GMs to the game development side of things.

https://specials-images.forbesimg.com/imageserve/1005439086/960x0.jpg?fit=scale

[Winter]

For the most part it's different GMs working on events vs actual game dev

Exactly, it's the perceived allocation of resources which is the issue.

[Wrathbringer]

Ugh he has GOT to stop calling himself a democratic socialist. He's not. He's a proponent of social democracy.

Drives me crazy.

Yeah. Because he himself doesn't know what he is, but you, who have never even met him, do. You're a retarded retard.

[Methais]

Yeah. Because he himself doesn't know what he is, but you, who have never even met him, do. You're a retarded retard.

:lol:

[Voldemort]

As I predicted years ago they are in shutdown mode, the main hint was actually a couple of months ago when they started offloading key F2P items for like 1/8th the price or something insane like that.

I asked Wyrom as OG MacGyver years ago when he was on these boards if he would ever do a massive 1 day firesale on weekly Lumnis and society contracts etc. (this was when I went nuts about how F2P sucked and you all jumped on me) He flat out told me if he ever did that it would be if and “when the game dies.”

Just my two cents from a diehard F2per. It was fun while it lasted and many of you are correct, it’s about the friends we make along the way. Hope we all cross roads again!

[Suppa Hobbit Mage]

As I predicted years ago they are in shutdown mode, the main hint was actually a couple of months ago when they started offloading key F2P items for like 1/8th the price or something insane like that.

I asked Wyrom as OG MacGyver years ago when he was on these boards if he would ever do a massive 1 day firesale on weekly Lumnis and society contracts etc. (this was when I went nuts about how F2P sucked and you all jumped on me) He flat out told me if he ever did that it would be if and “when the game dies.”

Just my two cents from a diehard F2per. It was fun while it lasted and many of you are correct, it’s about the friends we make along the way. Hope we all cross roads again!

Dunno who you are, but you just sold out your buddy (if true). Don't hope we cross roads again.

[Methais]

Well what's the rumor? :O

Supposedly Coase, who is/was the head dev GM, got fired.

Which imo, good, fuck him and his stealth nerfs, like when he nerfed the Confluence and literally hid the code in core systems to where it took me like a year of hitting up Wyrom asking if the Confluence got nerfed or was bugged, because shit was all different in there, but Wyrom didn't notice any changes. Eventually he dug a little deeper and found a huge nerf hidden in core systems, whatever the fuck that is, other than not being where shit like that goes unless you're hiding it.

I'm curious what other bullshit Coase had been doing over the years under the radar.

[Gelston]

I'm curious what other bullshit Coase had been doing over the years under the radar.

He fingerbanged your girlfriend and you pet pig.

[Methais]

He fingerbanged your girlfriend and you pet pig.

https://chris.hindefjord.se/Blandat/Clue/Clue_52_WeAllMakeMistakes.gif

[Avaia]

Supposedly Coase, who is/was the head dev GM, got fired.

Guess who is head of DEV now, Methais. Your favorite GM EVAR!







..it's Estild.

[drauz]

Guess who is head of DEV now, Methais. Your favorite GM EVAR!







..it's Estild.

Honestly, I think he was just the voice of the dev team and just saying what Coase was telling him. If you've seen the good dev thats come out recently I'm betting its linked to Estild. Coase didn't just quit/fired yesterday, hes been off the main discord server for a while now but people have just started to notice.

Estild had specifically said that 520 flares didn't make it past dev review and now we have flares on 520.

[drumpel]

>Estild had specifically said that 520 flares didn't make it past dev review and now we have flares on 520.

Uh oh....

We used to have flares on 520 when it was Stone Skin....think about it.

Estlid is slowly trying to move 520 back to what it was before Mage Armor, then he can put out P2W items in DR that mimic the more beneficial Mage Armor while wizards are left running around in reactive flaring stone skin that shatters when anything hits you.

It sounds plausible. I wouldn't put it past him to nerf more wizard spells and then flip items on DR.

[Fortybox]

Supposedly Coase, who is/was the head dev GM, got fired.

Which imo, good, fuck him and his stealth nerfs, like when he nerfed the Confluence and literally hid the code in core systems to where it took me like a year of hitting up Wyrom asking if the Confluence got nerfed or was bugged, because shit was all different in there, but Wyrom didn't notice any changes. Eventually he dug a little deeper and found a huge nerf hidden in core systems, whatever the fuck that is, other than not being where shit like that goes unless you're hiding it.

I'm curious what other bullshit Coase had been doing over the years under the radar.

Good riddance. Hope Estild gets the boot too.

[drauz]

>Estild had specifically said that 520 flares didn't make it past dev review and now we have flares on 520.

Uh oh....

We used to have flares on 520 when it was Stone Skin....think about it.

Estlid is slowly trying to move 520 back to what it was before Mage Armor, then he can put out P2W items in DR that mimic the more beneficial Mage Armor while wizards are left running around in reactive flaring stone skin that shatters when anything hits you.

It sounds plausible. I wouldn't put it past him to nerf more wizard spells and then flip items on DR.

You realize they are offensive flares when they cast spells?

[drumpel]

You realize they are offensive flares when they cast spells?

Yep, doesn't mean it won't happen though if Estlid thinks he flip for cash doing it.

[time4fun]

As I predicted years ago they are in shutdown mode

*eye roll*

[Methais]

Guess who is head of DEV now, Methais. Your favorite GM EVAR!







..it's Estild.

That's the thing...if some of the shit I'm hearing is true, it's quite possible that I may have been blaming the wrong person for a lot of this bullshit over the past few years.

It wouldn't surprise me. The more I hear about Coase, the more shady he sounds.

So uhhhhh....sorry Estild. Maybe. I think. But I'm not sure. Yet. :lol:

[Methais]

>Estild had specifically said that 520 flares didn't make it past dev review and now we have flares on 520.

Uh oh....

We used to have flares on 520 when it was Stone Skin....think about it.

Estlid is slowly trying to move 520 back to what it was before Mage Armor, then he can put out P2W items in DR that mimic the more beneficial Mage Armor while wizards are left running around in reactive flaring stone skin that shatters when anything hits you.

It sounds plausible. I wouldn't put it past him to nerf more wizard spells and then flip items on DR.

Coase was apparently what was blocking Ensorcell service from being offered at events too.

The DR that just ended offered Ensorcell service.

520 reactive flares were stupid anyway.

[Leafiara]

Hm, yeah, the Ensorcell thing is definitely interesting now that you mention it. Made me remember this and dig it up from Discord:


Estild10/21/2018
There will never be an Ensorcell service/NPC.
Revon10/21/2018
Why not? Most other player services have NPCs.
Puppymonkeyietius10/21/2018
Oh, give it 5 or 10 years.
changing elemental attunement was never going to happen either :smile:
Estild10/21/2018
Sure, maybe after Coase and I are gone, it could happen.

[Donquix]

I don't know why ensorcell is as locked down as it was, as a service i mean. It was always such a weird, arbitrary place to draw a line in the sand. Interestingly, in terms of overly difficult stuff a discussion about enchant was going on the other day and


Re: enchant/ensorcell difficulty, I don't have any issue with the current difficulty, especially with scripts, as that new difficulty is intended to be there. However, I wouldn't be against the idea of allowing a mechanic to allow a sorcerer/wizard to store their necrotic energy/essence over several weeks/months, then releasing it in an attempt to significantly boost their skill for their next ensorcell/enchant attempt.

which is interesting.

Also wasn't Coase a gm for like....ever? 20ish years?

[barbarous]

Quilic came out and was doing really inventive (for Prime) storytelling that engaged a large group of people to allow them to shape the details of the premium storyline. It wasn't perfect but it was more than just listening to GM NPCs spit story at you. Completely shut down because one or two people complained about it. So now its back to the only storylines that are going to be "stand around and watch the NPCs talk at you" and then disperse. I guess that is a step up from entire towns where the GM is still absent and unable to come up with even the most basic of storylines to generate interest.

RP is dead in gemstone and its all just whale watching now.

This level of whaling only works when you have a constant flow of new fresh blood into the game to replace when the big whales leave. Gemstone doesn't have anything even close to approaching that.

Is Quilic no longer going to do the story line? I thought he was just on a break due to DR

[Luntz]

https://media.giphy.com/media/xT8qB4HFqftRrLUpkQ/giphy.gif

[Luntz]

https://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/592/360/ea9.gif

[Luntz]

As I predicted years ago they are in shutdown mode, the main hint was actually a couple of months ago when they started offloading key F2P items for like 1/8th the price or something insane like that.

I asked Wyrom as OG MacGyver years ago when he was on these boards if he would ever do a massive 1 day firesale on weekly Lumnis and society contracts etc. (this was when I went nuts about how F2P sucked and you all jumped on me) He flat out told me if he ever did that it would be if and “when the game dies.”

Just my two cents from a diehard F2per. It was fun while it lasted and many of you are correct, it’s about the friends we make along the way. Hope we all cross roads again!

https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/642/238/cca.gif

[AnOrdim]

Is Quilic no longer going to do the story line? I thought he was just on a break due to DR

He's going to continue doing storylines but they won't be anything like the Nazhor Chronicles was. There was a metric fuck ton of player input during that storyline and direct discussion with players outside of the normal story. The story quickly had a subplot of two different player factions working towards different goals that run side by side with the greater storyline. These two threads were very much spun together and included things like "our group would like to work towards X in the long term" and then RP'd out during events and highlighted in "Vignettes" on the forums. I would like to think the vast majority enjoyed the added depth and detail that was added by combining frequent player-driven "events" outside the normal Quilic story time along with Vignettes on the forums that not only added to individual player characters insights but also helped shape the direction of the story.

What seems to have happened is that one or more people finally managed to complain the right way to make it such that any sort of planning or discussed RP is now verboten.

I likened it to the difference between a DnD GM running a "Story module" campaign that has very strict story that goes from a to b to c and finally concluding compared to a free form campaign where the player can tell the GM "Hey, my character sympathizes with the main villian and wants to help them" and the GM running with that and altering some of the story to accomdate that. It had some rocky spots but seemed to be working rather well, at least from a participation stand point. I imagine it was a shit ton of work on Quilic's part but it was greatly appreciated by a lot of people. Look at how active the FWI topic on the forum was in the past few months to see just how much player engagement there was.

At the end of the day, I suppose any storylines going on is better than none, but its hard to go back to the "standard" after having such an involved method.

[Methais]

I don't know why ensorcell is as locked down as it was, as a service i mean. It was always such a weird, arbitrary place to draw a line in the sand. Interestingly, in terms of overly difficult stuff a discussion about enchant was going on the other day and



which is interesting.

Also wasn't Coase a gm for like....ever? 20ish years?

Simu tends to protect empaths and sorcerers for some reason, but gives away wizard (and probably cleric) abilities to everyone.

[barbarous]

He's going to continue doing storylines but they won't be anything like the Nazhor Chronicles was. There was a metric fuck ton of player input during that storyline and direct discussion with players outside of the normal story. The story quickly had a subplot of two different player factions working towards different goals that run side by side with the greater storyline. These two threads were very much spun together and included things like "our group would like to work towards X in the long term" and then RP'd out during events and highlighted in "Vignettes" on the forums. I would like to think the vast majority enjoyed the added depth and detail that was added by combining frequent player-driven "events" outside the normal Quilic story time along with Vignettes on the forums that not only added to individual player characters insights but also helped shape the direction of the story.

What seems to have happened is that one or more people finally managed to complain the right way to make it such that any sort of planning or discussed RP is now verboten.

I likened it to the difference between a DnD GM running a "Story module" campaign that has very strict story that goes from a to b to c and finally concluding compared to a free form campaign where the player can tell the GM "Hey, my character sympathizes with the main villian and wants to help them" and the GM running with that and altering some of the story to accomdate that. It had some rocky spots but seemed to be working rather well, at least from a participation stand point. I imagine it was a shit ton of work on Quilic's part but it was greatly appreciated by a lot of people. Look at how active the FWI topic on the forum was in the past few months to see just how much player engagement there was.

At the end of the day, I suppose any storylines going on is better than none, but its hard to go back to the "standard" after having such an involved method.

I was following it, and was planning on trying to participate on my off days when it began again. The way he was weaving everything together had me interested in participating because he did include everyone who was willing to interact from what I saw, not just the favorites with the mary sue characters. Guess that solidifies my decision to cancel premium (I was struggling with my internal justification in keeping it), as that style of interaction with story lines was last reason I had it. Sadly, I didn't get to participate the last two sections of story lines due to work. I guess I missed the memo on the changes. Thanks for the response on it.

[AnOrdim]

I was following it, and was planning on trying to participate on my off days when it began again. The way he was weaving everything together had me interested in participating because he did include everyone who was willing to interact from what I saw, not just the favorites with the mary sue characters. Guess that solidifies my decision to cancel premium (I was struggling with my internal justification in keeping it), as that style of interaction with story lines was last reason I had it. Sadly, I didn't get to participate the last two sections of story lines due to work. I guess I missed the memo on the changes. Thanks for the response on it.

I'm sure there were more than one or two people who dropped their subscription to standard when it was announced on Discord. There was also at least one other person who said they were about to be pushed over the fence to get a premium account because of the amount/style of activity. The amount of work that Quilic took on to make it work must have been tremendous but he really does love the game and was bringing something unique to prime. I think another year would have worked out some of the problems that were coming up instead of being axed all together. Maybe there were a lot more real complaints I am not aware of, but it seemed to be working well enough. To me, it felt like how the game should be handling storylines given how much freedom you have a text game.

[Voldemort]

As an upside those boots are definitely not worh 7 million scrip. If you need a full dreavening to do any part of the Rift you must suck at the game hard and/or you are a cat with no fingers.

https://i.giphy.com/media/26hiu3mZVquuykwhy/giphy.gif

[Stolis]

Simu tends to protect empaths and sorcerers for some reason, but gives away wizard (and probably cleric) abilities to everyone.

They still haven't done dickall after weakening Dark Catalyst. For a 19 mana spell, it doesn't quite have the pop. I don't think old sorcerers would complain much to have it go back to its old strength, but just leave it at a 19 mana spell. The mana back isn't as important as just wrecking shit with it. Or hell, make it multicast but in its current form. Just something to make me want to use it again.

[drauz]

They still haven't done dickall after weakening Dark Catalyst. For a 19 mana spell, it doesn't quite have the pop. I don't think old sorcerers would complain much to have it go back to its old strength, but just leave it at a 19 mana spell. The mana back isn't as important as just wrecking shit with it. Or hell, make it multicast but in its current form. Just something to make me want to use it again.

The second cast wouldn't do jack cause the first one sucks all the mana.

[Stolis]

The second cast wouldn't do jack cause the first one sucks all the mana.

Which is honestly fine too. I'd spend the 19 mana for it to hit hard again. Though earlier tonight I killed a siren that took two DC's. First one gave 4 mana back, second 13. Kinda stupid.

[time4fun]

They still haven't done dickall after weakening Dark Catalyst. For a 19 mana spell, it doesn't quite have the pop. I don't think old sorcerers would complain much to have it go back to its old strength, but just leave it at a 19 mana spell. The mana back isn't as important as just wrecking shit with it. Or hell, make it multicast but in its current form. Just something to make me want to use it again.

Except it's not a 19 Mana spell, is it? And the crits from DC are pretty amazing from what I've seen. I've only ever been a bystander, but I feel like it almost always kills fully magical creatures.

Also, for the love of God, that nerf was like 20 years ago. If old DC is the defining characteristic of Sorcerers for you, then you really need to update your entire life.

[Fortybox]

Except it's not a 19 Mana spell, is it? And the crits from DC are pretty amazing from what I've seen. I've only ever been a bystander, but I feel like it almost always kills fully magical creatures.

Also, for the love of God, that nerf was like 20 years ago. If old DC is the defining characteristic of Sorcerers for you, then you really need to update your entire life.

Zero...self...awareness

[Murrandii]

Except it's not a 19 Mana spell, is it? And the crits from DC are pretty amazing from what I've seen. I've only ever been a bystander, but I feel like it almost always kills fully magical creatures.

Also, for the love of God, that nerf was like 20 years ago. If old DC is the defining characteristic of Sorcerers for you, then you really need to update your entire life.

Vishra, I am a liberal like you (everyone in Canada is anyway). I'm even prolly more left wing than you.

Still, you need to understand that OPPOSING EVERYTHING the whole majority of quality players (I'm not speaking of the players that agrees to everything SIMU says without even thinking) makes you, de facto a non credible person.

You're becoming a caricature of yourself and people call your point of view BEFORE YOU EVEN COME. You oppose just for the sake of opposing. And the more it goes, the more you polarized the whole thing. And by acting like that, people that likes you start to stop liking you cause you're ALWAYS the source of complicating débats that loop and loop and loop to no end.

It's a behaving problematic that can be addressed easily with some exercice based on accepting the difference of others that won't threaten your core existence. The fact I think differently than you on this topic DOESN'T make us opposite people. Varieties of opinions on subjects make evolution possible . You even begin to understand the best point of view is a kind of consensus between them and us and eventually, the said consensus can be switched a bit in our favor and so on. That is meaningful and works.

Yeah, I know, it's kinda ironic I speak of that with you. But as all people that experienced traumatic things, I sense you crystalized yourself and there's only 2 ways to think: I am right or they are wrong. I know you'll hide behind indifference or not caring. I know. But jusssssssssst maybe, it will trigger a change pattern.

Try some objective approach, you'll see, it works just fine.

Now on the subject:

Sorcerer's 719 is garbage like 519. Thanks

[audioserf]

719 is absolutely better than 519 in their current forms though. That is not a good comparison, lol.

[Gelston]

Except it's not a 19 Mana spell, is it?

It literally is a 19 mana spell.

[Stolis]

719 is absolutely better than 519 in their current forms though. That is not a good comparison, lol.

518 then? There's 950 but that's a way different spell for the cost, I feel. Maybe both our 19th spells need some attention then.

Also, God you're a bitch Vishra.

[Methais]

Here's some pre-nerf GS3 Dark Catalyst:

>Kryblue gestures and utters a phrase of magic.
>Kryblue gestures at a csetairi.
CS: +666 - TD: +489 + CvA: +25 + d100: +74 == +276
Warding failed!
A csetairi is suddenly engulfed in flames of pure essence!
... and hits for 132 points of damage!
... 55 points of damage!
Right arm shattered by an extremely well placed hit!
The csetairi is stunned!
... 55 points of damage!
Icy blast freezes the csetairi's right hand!
... 45 points of damage!
Heavy shock to chest illuminates ribcage. Cool!
... 45 points of damage!
Visible wisps of electricity shoot up left arm. Youch!
... 55 points of damage!
Left arm fractured by an icy blast!
... 50 points of damage!
... 50 points of damage!
Nasty burns to right arm. Gonna need lots of butter.
The csetairi shrieks as she falls to the ground and cradles her mangled right arm!
... 50 points of damage!
... 55 points of damage!
Flames burn hole in chest exposing ribs!
... 45 points of damage!
Burst of flames char chest a crispy black.
... 45 points of damage!
Burst of flames to left eye incinerates eyelid. Gruesome.
... 55 points of damage!
Electric blast goes right to the heart! Fibrillation can be fun.
The csetairi writhes in agony and dies.
The opalescent aura fades from around a csetairi.
The brilliant aura fades away from a csetairi.
The wall of force disappears from around a csetairi.
A csetairi appears less confident.
A dark shadow passes away from a csetairi.



Kryblue gestures at a raving lunatic.
CS: +666 - TD: +473 + CvA: +25 + d100: +53 == +271
Warding failed!
A raving lunatic is suddenly engulfed in flames of pure essence!
... and hits for 110 points of damage!
... 15 points of damage!
Blast of cold air to left knee causes a polar knee cap!
The raving lunatic collapses to the ground in obvious pain, grasping her mangled left leg.
... 10 points of damage!
Burst of flames to right hand fries palm. Ouch!
... 20 points of damage!
Massive strike of icy shards shatters the raving lunatic's skull!
... 10 points of damage!
Near miss! Cool blast to the lower back and the raving lunatic staggers.
... 15 points of damage!
Heavy shock to right leg. Gonna limp for awhile.
... 15 points of damage!
Nasty burns to abdomen, a raving lunatic shrieks in pain!
... 20 points of damage!
Solid blast of ice square to the chest rocks the raving lunatic back on its heels!
... 20 points of damage!
Slivers of ice slice the raving lunatic's throat into ribbons of flesh and blood!
... 10 points of damage!
The raving lunatic's right arm trembles with the cold.
... 10 points of damage!
Burst of flames to right arm toasts skin to elbows.
... 10 points of damage!
The raving lunatic failed to sidestep the chilly blast. Bruised ribs anyone?
... 50 points of damage!
Frigid blast renders the raving lunatic's right hand useless - missing even!
The raving lunatic shrieks as she cradles her mangled right hand!


>Kryblue gestures at a csetairi.
CS: +666 - TD: +514 + CvA: +25 + d100: +69 == +246
Warding failed!
A csetairi is suddenly engulfed in flames of pure essence!
... and hits for 288 points of damage!
... 45 points of damage!
The csetairi's right arm trembles with the cold.
The csetairi is stunned!
... 45 points of damage!
Icy blast to the head and the csetairi is reeling!
... 55 points of damage!
Left arm fractured by an icy blast!
... 55 points of damage!
It is knocked to the ground!
... 55 points of damage!
Nasty shock to left hand stiffens fingers. Nice and painful.
... 55 points of damage!
... 55 points of damage!
Heavy jolt to right eye chars the optic nerve. Now that's pain!
... 55 points of damage!
Strange how the cold can burn.
... 55 points of damage!
Flames incinerate scalp completely and blacken skullcap. Not very fashionable.
... 45 points of damage!
Burst of flames to back fries shoulder blades. Youch!
... 45 points of damage!
Heavy shock to chest illuminates ribcage. Cool!
The csetairi writhes in agony and dies.


>Kryblue gestures at a csetairi.
CS: +666 - TD: +464 + CvA: +25 + d100: +77 == +304
Warding failed!
A csetairi is suddenly engulfed in flames of pure essence!
... and hits for 204 points of damage!
... 45 points of damage!
Burst of flames to back fries shoulder blades. Youch!
The csetairi is stunned!
... 40 points of damage!
... 50 points of damage!
Darn! Frozen ribs take longer to cook, and broken ones to boot!
... 40 points of damage!
... 50 points of damage!
Icy strike to the back scores a direct hit!
... 45 points of damage!
Near miss! Cool blast to the lower back and the csetairi staggers.
... 40 points of damage!
Heavy spark to left hand. Bet that hurts.
... 50 points of damage!
Heavy shock to right arm numbs elbow.
... 40 points of damage!
Burst of flames to chest toasts skin nicely.
... 40 points of damage!
Heavy spark to chest. Bet that hurts.
... 50 points of damage!
Frigid blast rearranges the csetairi's neckbone.
... 45 points of damage!
Hard jolt knocks the csetairi back on its heels.
... 40 points of damage!
Shocking jolt to forehead. Painful.
... 50 points of damage!
Icy bolt to the left eye! Ouch! Ice cream headache!
... 50 points of damage!
Nasty burns to left hand. Gonna need lots of butter.
The csetairi crumples to the ground motionless.


>Kryblue gestures at a raving lunatic.
CS: +666 - TD: +473 + CvA: +25 + d100: +3 == +221
Warding failed!
A raving lunatic is suddenly engulfed in flames of pure essence!
... and hits for 210 points of damage!
... 25 points of damage!
Left arm is shattered by cold blast!
The raving lunatic shrieks as she falls to the ground and cradles her mangled left arm!
... 30 points of damage!
Nasty shock to right arm stiffens joints. Nice and painful.
... 20 points of damage!
Visible wisps of electricity shoot up right leg. Youch!
... 30 points of damage!
Solid blast of ice square to the chest rocks the raving lunatic back on its heels!
... 20 points of damage!
Burst of flames to right arm toasts skin to elbows.
... 30 points of damage!
Flames incinerate right leg to the bone. Not a pleasant sight.
... 20 points of damage!
Heavy shock gives the raving lunatic fits!
... 25 points of damage!
Nasty burns to right leg. Gonna need lots of butter.
... 20 points of damage!
Cold compresses will help the swelling of the raving lunatic's left eye!
... 20 points of damage!
Heavy shock gives the raving lunatic fits!
The raving lunatic writhes in agony and dies.


Kryblue gestures at a csetairi.
CS: +666 - TD: +548 + CvA: +25 + d100: +32 == +175
Warding failed!
A csetairi is suddenly engulfed in flames of pure essence!
... and hits for 108 points of damage!
... 40 points of damage!
Electric shot gives the csetairi a really bad cramp.
The csetairi is stunned!
... 40 points of damage!
The csetairi just got the cold shoulder!
... 35 points of damage!
... 35 points of damage!
... 40 points of damage!
Burst of flames to chest toasts skin nicely.
... 45 points of damage!
Visible wisps of electricity shoot up right arm. Youch!
... 40 points of damage!
Cold blast to the ears. The csetairi should have worn a hat!
... 35 points of damage!
The csetairi winces at the cold blast to the left arm.
... 45 points of damage!
Burst of flames char chest a crispy black.
... 70 points of damage!
It is knocked to the ground!
The air around you crackles with potent energy!


>Kryblue gestures at a csetairi.
CS: +666 - TD: +548 + CvA: +25 + d100: +37 == +180
Warding failed!
A csetairi is suddenly engulfed in flames of pure essence!
... and hits for 160 points of damage!
... 50 points of damage!
Solid blow to the head exposes grey matter on ice!
... 50 points of damage!
Heavy shock to right arm numbs elbow.
The csetairi shrieks as she cradles her mangled right arm!
... 45 points of damage!
... 50 points of damage!
The csetairi writhes in agony and dies.

[Methais]

Vishra, I am a liberal like you (everyone in Canada is anyway). I'm even prolly more left wing than you.

Still, you need to understand that OPPOSING EVERYTHING the whole majority of quality players (I'm not speaking of the players that agrees to everything SIMU says without even thinking) makes you, de facto a non credible person.

You're becoming a caricature of yourself and people call your point of view BEFORE YOU EVEN COME. You oppose just for the sake of opposing. And the more it goes, the more you polarized the whole thing. And by acting like that, people that likes you start to stop liking you cause you're ALWAYS the source of complicating débats that loop and loop and loop to no end.

It's a behaving problematic that can be addressed easily with some exercice based on accepting the difference of others that won't threaten your core existence. The fact I think differently than you on this topic DOESN'T make us opposite people. Varieties of opinions on subjects make evolution possible . You even begin to understand the best point of view is a kind of consensus between them and us and eventually, the said consensus can be switched a bit in our favor and so on. That is meaningful and works.

Yeah, I know, it's kinda ironic I speak of that with you. But as all people that experienced traumatic things, I sense you crystalized yourself and there's only 2 ways to think: I am right or they are wrong. I know you'll hide behind indifference or not caring. I know. But jusssssssssst maybe, it will trigger a change pattern.

Try some objective approach, you'll see, it works just fine.

This is correct.


Sorcerer's 719 is garbage like 519. Thanks

719 still > 519. Maybe not by much, but I can't imagine 719 being as bad as 519 is. Only thing that makes 519 look good is when it's used vs. trolls. It looks like old DC in a troll warcamp, but that's not from the spell being strong, it's from trolls being weak. Which DC would have the same results for any of its fire hits.


Except it's not a 19 Mana spell, is it? And the crits from DC are pretty amazing from what I've seen. I've only ever been a bystander, but I feel like it almost always kills fully magical creatures.

Also, for the love of God, that nerf was like 20 years ago. If old DC is the defining characteristic of Sorcerers for you, then you really need to update your entire life.

Yeah, why would a level 19 spell cost 19 mana when that's literally how every spell in the game works? DC can return some mana to the caster depending on what you're casting at, but the cost to cast it is still 19 mana.

I wanna meet some of the people that were in this logic class you supposedly taught. Which we all know you didn't, but if you did, I would imagine they would make people like Backlash look like a genius.

Stop being a hipster.

[Gelston]

Yeah, why would a level 19 spell cost 19 mana when that's literally how every spell in the game works?

I wanna meet some of the people that were in this logic class you supposedly taught. Which we all know you didn't, but if you did, I would imagine they would make people like Backlash look like a genius.

Stop being a hipster.

She is probably saying that because you get mana back, which generally sits on the low end the first cast and is even worse on subsequent. Try casting it with 18 mana and see what happens though.

The old GS3 719 was fun though. EVERYONE had mana back in GS3, you didn't train for it, it came with level. Doesn't work like that in 4 though. I think that was one of the nerfs to it, as it damaged based heavily on how much mana the target had.

[Methais]

518 then? There's 950 but that's a way different spell for the cost, I feel. Maybe both our 19th spells need some attention then.

950 is awesome and it should be endorsed by Samuel L. Jackson.

950 is so awesome that it has a 60 second cooldown, with earth lore allowing more casts per minute

https://i.imgur.com/AOgsCbp.png


Also, God you're a bitch Vishra.

This is correct.

Vishra would get pwned all day in GS if it weren't for high end gear.

[Methais]

She is probably saying that because you get mana back

That's that time4fun logic at work.

[Fortybox]

That's that time4fun logic at work.

She would rather debate that it’s not a 19 mana spell because of mana return than the actual point which is that the spell in the 19th slot absolutely sucks.

So does 519.

Instead, Simu dev is busy cranking out Rift boots for quick cash instead of addressing fundamental profession, spell list, areas and addition functions/processes that should be updated/fixed.

Edit: please see Vishra using her logic to get out of the room below.

[Methais]

She would rather debate that it’s not a 19 mana spell because of mana return than the actual point which is that the spell in the 19th slot absolutely sucks.

So does 519.

Instead, Simu dev is busy cranking out Rift boots for quick cash instead of addressing fundamental profession, spell list, areas and addition functions/processes that should be updated/fixed.

Edit: please see Vishra using her logic to get out of the room below.

On a successful warding, Mana Leech costs 1 mana instead of 16, but if you miss, it still costs 16.

CONFIRMED VIA VISHRA LOGIC THAT 516 IS A 1 MANA SPELL OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG

[Stolis]

Man that spell was once pretty good. Thanks for the reminder. I guess I just see it as since it's the second most powerful attack spell we have (assuming one is trained for implosion) that it should probably hit like something strong. The mana back isn't as big of a deal as just being able to have a reliably strong spell again.

[time4fun]

It literally is a 19 mana spell.

It's not- it returns Mana on each cast....

[Fortybox]

It's not- it returns Mana on each cast....

Seriously? You spend 19 mana and net a return. Stop being so dumb.

[Murrandii]

It's not- it returns Mana on each cast....

What happens if you fumble or the critter resist the cast?

It's a 2 sequences spell

1) First you pay the price of the spell
2) then, depending of a formula, you get a net return as said by Dalabro

If you want, Vishra, we can share you a pseudo-code formula to make you understand

[Methais]

It's not- it returns Mana on each cast....

And to think, you tried to tell us that you taught a class about logic of all things.

If it's not a 19 mana spell, then how much mana does it cost when...

- The target has no mana
- You fumble
- Armor hindrance
- You don't ward the target

How much mana does the spell cost then?

Fucking idiot. Holy fuck you're dense. And stupid. :lol:

[Tgo01]

Salesman: This car costs 19,000 dollars upfront. Afterwards if you qualify for a dealership rebate you'll get 1000 dollars back. You can also try and qualify for a government rebate of another 1000 dollars. None of these rebates are guaranteed but you can try. Either way we need 19,000 dollars upfront.

time4fun: So I can just give you 17,000 dollars and the car is mine?!

[Taernath]

https://media.giphy.com/media/d7lggWgDINIB2/giphy.gif