Help an old rogue.

[Tellistto]

So...when I went to sleep in 2008 my rogue, Tellistto, could do much of whatever he wanted to do. Was 99 trains and could hunt plane five by himself. I do believe before I slept I knew the end was coming, in that cmans were going to ruin everything for a rogue. I had a sheet set up for him to be an MOC at 30 type rogue. I slept before any of that happened.

Armor Use..........................| 201 101
Shield Use.........................| 201 101
Combat Maneuvers...................| 278 178
Edged Weapons......................| 302 202
Ambush.............................| 265 165
Multi Opponent Combat..............| 26 5
Physical Fitness...................| 206 106
Dodging............................| 302 202
Arcane Symbols.....................| 90 20
Magic Item Use.....................| 95 21
Harness Power......................| 50 10
Elemental Mana Control.............| 15 3
Disarming Traps....................| 403 303
Picking Locks......................| 403 303
Stalking and Hiding................| 267 167
Perception.........................| 221 121
Climbing...........................| 136 38
Swimming...........................| 130 35

Spell Lists
Minor Elemental....................| 6

This...does not work as a capped hunter. I took him out CoL and put him into GoS, and honestly that was a mistake of all proportion because as it stands now he has NO hope of every completing a warparty mission.

Ambushing just plain sucks when you would hit but don't because some spell or another stops you, not to mention parries.

So I'm somewhat stuck, with a lot of OLD knowledge and not enough new knowledge to actually hunt this character.

He's got an 8x falchion that isn't weighted, a 7x khopesh the same. +32 MBP not padded. I have a set of 6x plate sitting around that is somewhere close to 50 pounds. I also have near 6x FGB.

So there are choices here, but honestly warding/cman defense/ability to not get beat to death is an issue. I'm tempted to unlearn all his picking(cries a little bit) and just go whole hog on the physical and stick him into plate and go all warriorish on things, but that's somewhat lame given that he won't have berserk which is what makes that whole thing work for them.

So, I'm hoping there is some wisdom for me out there to help me make this character viable again as a rogue. Or maybe it's just the player, who knows? This character has been many things, was a Blades wannabe back in the day before fixskills. When all that happened is when he starting picking.

Fixskill is available, not fixstats, which he could benefit from a bit.

He's a brand new Fister, and can't finish his first task without dieing multiple times. Twice to date trying that.

Bandits are a no go as well unless he's with a group.

[Derex]

Your probably going to want to drop picking to 2x and raise cman and physical fitness to 2x as well as ambush and get more moc

[Nordred]

Trap disarm is a little excessive right now, you could cut that back to 285 ranks not miss a beat. I also think 250 rank in stalking and and hiding would be plenty, it’s gotten me by with no trouble. Whirling dervish stance is quite useful to.

[Tellistto]

Dropping to 2x picking could be a possibility. I honestly really dislike the idea of MoC for rogues, but I do understand the necessity.

I'd be fine if I can disarm everything I see and wedge open what I can't pick, so say 250 ranks of disarm and 2x picking could work. That would be using lore on high end boxes to make sure I see those trap.

I finally was able to finish the first task for GoS, and promptly picked up the same task of course.

A lot of is me the player not being in the groove, not doing the proper strategy, being spoilt by that damn wizard that has no problem hunting whatever he was while never being caught in offensive.

So, it's more about singling out targets, not getting caught in a crowd, moving or hiding away from the damn caster you can't ward. It's strategy. Yes, it's me.

I'm interested in more if anyone has thoughts.

[rolfard]

Sacrifice 2 spell ranks, 11 ranks MOC, some? Armor ranks (if you stay in brig), 50+ disarm/pick ranks, 50+ dodging ranks for more offense

[Nordred]

I guess since you are shield, no point in dervish stance. Some reason I was thinking twc and your shield so that suggestion won't help at all now.

[Tellistto]

Well, I suppose that is because I listed those two weapons. I hadn't considered that option, the 7x khopesh wasn't always his but since other characters have moved to pure he's inherited it.

So...would this sort of build be viable?

Armor 50
OHE 202
TWC 202
CM 180
MOC 30
PF 182
Dodge 202
AS/MIU 20 each
HP 10
4 spells for lore.
Disarm 250
Picking 200
S&H 167
Per 121

That would maximize the items I have, could steal that FGB from the ranger and put him into something else.

I just would like a solid base to build from for the post cap era.

[Tellistto]

With that build, his PER could be 150 with the left over mental points, which is something I'd like to have given the stupid bandit traps.

[kutter]

I moved my UAC wizard from Voln to GoS at 60 and it was not any fun, I went through a lot of deeds. Warcamps are a royal pain without MOC and still a pain with it. For my paladin, warcamps did not get easier, not easy just easier, until he had 25 ranks of MOC. That being said you do not need any at all; there are two groups, one in the Landing and one in Vaalor that run at least one warcamp weekly, so you can get 4 in two weeks, you can also get any of the other warcamp bounties you need done. For the most part, if it was not a flag bounty in a warcamp, I would trade it and just hunt hated foes until the timer reset for all but my 5.

So my 77 train rogue picks for my capped wizard and he has 240 ranks in pick and disarm and 141 in perception. I have never not seen a trap but there are some, not a lot, maybe 1 in 15 or so, that he cannot disarm yet. I have to wedge some as well since Nelemar has produced some over 1250, so I would think you can sacrifice some skills there as well, at least for now. My rogue is in chain, mostly because I have a good hauberk and enhancive greaves for him, and he does just fine in that with 80 ranks in armor.

Lastly, I have been told but never tested that you can hide and sneak around and kill in a waramp, but maybe someone else can chime in with about that.

[Nordred]

Well, I suppose that is because I listed those two weapons. I hadn't considered that option, the 7x khopesh wasn't always his but since other characters have moved to pure he's inherited it.

So...would this sort of build be viable?

Armor 50
OHE 202
TWC 202
CM 180
MOC 30
PF 182
Dodge 202
AS/MIU 20 each
HP 10
4 spells for lore.
Disarm 250
Picking 200
S&H 167
Per 121

That would maximize the items I have, could steal that FGB from the ranger and put him into something else.

I just would like a solid base to build from for the post cap era.

That would work. MOC numbers there would give room for dervish stance and you don't have to use it from the open and mstriking to benefit. The ability from it to kill one target ambushing and the second attack to jump to another to kill gives you some small crowd control measures. Overall you have a good balance to start post cap with that.

[Tellistto]

Something I don't quite understand, because I believe it's new, is the whole dervish stance thing.

I've seen others with these stances, is it a cman thing that can be learned with certain skill builds or what?

[Nordred]

Dervish stance lets unused attacks that would go wasted because a target died move to target the next available enemy in the room. It works well with twc and or with ambushing, and then you add in multi-ops you can have some serious carry over on attacks. It is a cman skill, use it and the stance lasts 4 hours.

[Deadelf]

Something I don't quite understand, because I believe it's new, is the whole dervish stance thing.

I've seen others with these stances, is it a cman thing that can be learned with certain skill builds or what?

Here's a link to the wiki about it.

https://gswiki.play.net/Whirling_Dervish

Hope that helps. It's interesting.

[Tellistto]

Thanks a bunch, everyone. I picked that up, have only been doing bandits so far. Only thing now is have to be more cognizant of the stance I'm in since the brig doesn't mitigate the damage as much as the old MBP did. The offensive ability and the extra Physical Fitness helps. Going to work on Perception and PF until PF is capped and then switch over to trying to max CM and then work on ambush/hiding to 2x/2.5x.

Feeling a lot better about the ability to kill stuff now.