New style enchanting

[Nothing]

I have two razern weapons (+10, lightly weighted) and one vaalorn weapon (+18) I'd like to have brought up to +20 in the next couple days. I can meet in RR, the Landing, or Mist Harbor. Whether you can do one of them or all three, Discord is the easiest way to get my attention (Starchitin#9989), though I do check my inbox here regularly as well. Please let me know the total cost for what you can do in your message.

Willing to pay silvers or BS, but I don't do cash.

[Nothing]

Still looking, this is prolly more a job for a lower level wizard.... I know why the near/post cap wizards have quoted what they did and I'm not trying to short change anyone, but there's honestly nothing about these blades that justifies paying for that level of skill to get them to +20.

[drumpel]

Still looking, this is prolly more a job for a lower level wizard.... I know why the near/post cap wizards have quoted what they did and I'm not trying to short change anyone, but there's honestly nothing about these blades that justifies paying for that level of skill to get them to +20.

It's not the difficulty of the weapons that's probably in question, but the amount of enchanting essence required for all of it.

A +10 item to +20 is 14,500 essence (which is almost a full week's worth. 1 week max is 16,000 essence you can earn).

In all, you're in need of:
Weapon 1: +10 to +20 = 14,500
Weapon 2: +10 to +20 = 14,500
Weapon 3: +18 to +20 = 3,700
Total essence = 32,700
You're looking at just over 2 weeks of essence build up from a single wizard.

Most folks will be selling essence on a similar price as necro energy - which is usually around 3mil a week for higher-end folks (or 187.5 silver per essence).

The change over in enchanting did a couple of things:
1) Outright limited the low end enchanting spectrum - sure, the cost to enchant under +25 is fairly cheap in terms of required essence, but everyone is now limited by how much essence they can earn and store, so low end enchants will cost you more - unless you find that nice wizard doing it for really cheap. Whereas under the old enchanting system, anything under +20 could be done without being hindered, you only had to wait the temper times.
2) Rate at which essence is acquired. My level 74 wizard, he's decently trained for enchanting and has skills more geared towards it than your average wizard. Him, hunting like level creatures takes around 10-11 hours to max his weekly essence. Higher leveled wizards should be looking at more towards 4-6 hours to cap essence. Younger wizards that can't train up in skills as high as capped will be more hindered at the speed they build essence and will be looking at 15-20+ hours a week of hunting.

With that said, any wizard (capped or not) will value their essence based on how they need to use it and on how easily they can build it back up. Myself, 10-11 hours might not seem like much in terms of hunting, but some weeks I just don't want to hunt him that much. I found that it takes roughly 4 kills for him to earn 100 essence (around 25 essence a kill). 16,000 essence means he has to kill around 640 like level creatures to max his weekly essence. It's a fucking grind - plain and simple - if I want to be able to enchant with him.

By my small amount of testing, it's not just run around and blast as many creatures, as fast as I can and go rest. It's 4 or 5 kills a pulse, then repeat. I do this until I've exhausted all my mana (which includes wracking and mana leech) or I'm too encumbered to safely hunt. Going over 5 kills (getting 6 or 7 before the next pulse) didn't seem to build up my essence any faster so I figure I was wasting mana because my pool to hold essence was full or near full, that 4-5 kills was ideal. Wait for pulse, kill 4-5, wait for pulse and so on. So far for this week's essence, I'm about 1/3 of the way to maxing and sitting around a total of 5000 essence right now (he was completely empty when the week started). He's got another 6 hours of hunting to get through still....it's not fun, it feels like a chore now.

Anyway, what I'm getting at is the cost may not be what you want to pay and you may find it horribly overpriced from some folk - but the cost they're giving is the cost they feel is worth their time and effort for the service. As it stands, low end enchants are just going to cost more (at least for a while) because of how enchanting now requires essence and essence is time and money for most folks.

[Maerit]

I'd pay a scaling difficulty rate. Comparing to ensorcell is fine, but 3mil per week usually is a capped sorcerer for an item that isn't necessarily easy. You can get simple T1s done at 1mil per week from young sorcerers (I've even seen a level 35 sorcerer offer them for 500k per week). IMO, this should be the same for enchant. Paying someone 5mil for a +1 bonus to get from 34-35 on a vanilla item any level 30-40 wizard with 25-30 ranks in wizard spells can manage seems a bit excessive (as an example).

From my perspective, just about anyone can enchant the items the OP is asking for enchanting, and they're easy to enchant. I wouldn't pay 3mil per wizard week for these items to be enchanted to 4x... No way.

OP, ask around and find young (35ish) train wizards who aren't spending their energy on their own gear, and you will probably find this can be done for a lot less than 3mil per week.

[adred]

The main issue is that a level 25 wizard can do 6x enchants on higher quality items.. for example, 4x dcp triple resist armor to +30.. and also they have almost no shot at actually getting 16000 essence per week.. so low enchants like that will always have an opportunity cost aspect.. I haven't taken less than 3m a week for essence and a couple times was able to use a level 32 wizard alt to do part of it... I also have a pretty hefty enhancive set which skews things but I still think the general point is valid

[Maerit]

Well, tonight a level 36 sorcerer offered to do T1s for 500k. That's kind of my point. Setting the value of enchanting at 3mil per week -- period -- means enchanting is too expensive. Going from 4x-7x is 167,000 essence. That's 10+ weeks of energy, so you're suggesting plain jane 4x-7x should cost 30 million silvers, which is absurd considering... At the rates you're suggesting, everyone either needs a pocket wizard to do their basic vanilla enchants, or expect the value of 7x items to go to at least 25mil in resale (gonna take a loss at that price, but it's similar to taking a loss on ensorcell). That sounds unlikely.

People are rarely spending that kind of coin on ensorcells because they know better. Get your T1 and T2 for 1mil or less, then up to 2-2.5mil for T3, 3mil for T4-T5. You're spending around 10mil for a T5 ensorcell if you do it right unless the item you're ensorcelling requires a major mutant. You'll get 6-7mil back from that in resale.

Enchanting is not some super special thing. In most cases its actually requires less stats/skills than ensorcelling. I asked this level 36 sorcerer tonight to ensorcell my 7x UAC item. He couldn't do it. Vanilla 7x item, required a miracle for him. I can do 7x enchants with a wizard who only has 30 ranks in wizard spells (mid 40s). Seems like paying 3mil a week is a rip off for anything that doesn't require a capped wizard. If that is going to remain a consistent price, I'm definitely cashing in on both my capped wizards who can farm the essence in less than 12 hours of hunting (which is 4 more than it takes for me to burn my lumnis).

Add to the supply and demand, wizards being the #1 played profession in this game - OP, don't pay 3mil per 16,000 essence on the gear you can have any wizard with 25 ranks in wizard spells to enchant.

[Nothing]

Don't worry, I never had any intention of paying 3mil perweek of essence for any of these items. I'm well aware there plenty of difficult items that justify that price and I don't begrudge anyone trying to get what they think their essence is worth, if this was a difficult to enchant item I'd happily pay what most of those that have contacted me have quoted.

As for comparing it to ensorcelling, Maerit's correct in stating that 3mil/week is not a standard price... esp for T1 or T2. That's the price that sorcerers who are multiple times post-cap and can ensorcell the most difficult items are able to command... and I'd bet that few other then the 3-4 sorcerers regularly posting on these forums to offer their services are able to get rate for their services. What most sorcerers get (including mine) is 1mil/week of necrojuice and there are several that offer it at a lower rate.

The most vocal and skilled wizards have declared what they think the price of enchanting should be under the new system, but not every wizard is going to be able to do projects that justify that price... just like not every sorcerer is able to ensorcell items that justify 3mil/week for necrojuice.

Also keep in mind, without a sorcerer there is no getting your items ensorcelled, that's not true with enchanting. It would be much cheaper getting this work done with PP then what two of the people that contacted me quoted.

[adred]

There is no point comparing sorcerers to wizards... had fresh lummis on 303 sorc and a 252 wiz rank starting today... sorc is necro capped and wizard is 25% cap

[Maerit]

There is no point comparing sorcerers to wizards... had fresh lummis on 303 sorc and a 252 wiz rank starting today... sorc is necro capped and wizard is 25% cap

Most folks have been doing the comparison since the beginning. You posted your spell ranks, but not the ranks for skills that actually help you cap your energy.

My freshly capped wizard, less than 8mil XP, has 103 MjE, 75 MnE and 60 Wiz. None of that matters for essence absorption. The key stats are HP/Water Lore & EMC. My wizard had 100 HP and 50 Water Lore. Which determines the pool size for essence, and 202 EMC, which determines how much he absorbs per pulse. With these combined stats, my wizard can cap his energy faster than my 13mil XP sorcerer who is 3x spells w/ 100 ranks in necromancy (and it's the necro lore that makes you cap faster as a sorcerer). BTW - Today was my freshly capped wizard's lumnis. I burned through all his lumnis today and capped his energy already. One day... it's not hard.

Comparisons can definitely be made. My capped warmage maxs his energy out 2 hours after my sorcerer does. They hunt simultaneously every week (though I don't hunt them together). He's a warmage though, and his abilities are weak compared to my pure mage - yet I can cap his energy in 1 day.

In the end, if a wizard is training properly for the sake of enchanting, they can maximize their energy in a week. Same with a sorcerer. It's just as hard for a level 35 sorcerer to cap their necro energy as it is for a level 35 wizard - I wouldn't pay the wizard more to enchant than the sorcerer to ensorcell since they can both do very easy projects. Also, as the OP pointed out, this crazy expectation that every single wizard should get 3mil per 16,000 essence means it's cheaper to pay PPs to enchant than it is to buy it from a player...

Taking a vanilla 4x item to 7x, according to the suggestion being made, would cost 30 million silvers. That price only makes sense for difficult to enchant items, not for something a level 30 wizard can bring to 6x, and a level 40 can finish to the last +5.

Hell, it would be cheaper, and more profitable, to level your own wizard to 40 for your vanilla enchanting projects at those rates. Which I assume will happen soon since there's always 2-3x as many wizards online as any other profession.

[adred]

Sorry.. sorc is 303 sorc ranks with 0 necro lore (only skill that affects necro gather), wizard is 252 wizard base with 1x hp, 2x emc, 30 water lore ranks, and like 26 fire lore and 30 something air lore, also group hunting in sos... sorc just spams 702 and wizard casts nothing but major acid... sorc capped in 2 hours of hunting and wizard is only 25%

[Maerit]

Sorry.. sorc is 303 sorc ranks with 0 necro lore (only skill that affects necro gather), wizard is 252 wizard base with 1x hp, 2x emc, 30 water lore ranks, and like 26 fire lore and 30 something air lore, also group hunting in sos... sorc just spams 702 and wizard casts nothing but major acid... sorc capped in 2 hours of hunting and wizard is only 25%

That is the only advantage a sorcerer has is group hunting. If the sorcerer uses 709, they'll get full credit towards energy for all targets. Wizards get only partial credit. It's faster for a wizard to solo hunt for energy. As mentioned, I farm my wizard in 12 hours (in SoS) solo. My sorc is usually 14 solo in nelemar. I'm very skeptical that you actually cap in 2 hours on a 0 lore sorcerer...

In the end, from my experience, a wizard is no worse at farming energy than a sorcerer and their energy gains dont qualify them to charge massive enchant fees compared to a sorc. The fact that your wizard is a capped mutant makes them eligible to charge 3mil, per week, because you can do very difficult enchants and sacrificed a lot for that (including killing power since your bolt AS must suck without decent MjE or MnE). Frankly, I suspect the slow energy gains have more to do with how little you land your bolt spells in SoS since you probably barely have 400 bolt AS with that setup. You might earn more by using 917 as it will outright 1shot pretty much everything in SoS with 254 wiz ranks save monstrosities.

My warmage has 35 wizard ranks. He cant even enchant 4x parasite or Sprite weapons, but I capped his energy in a day. Should he charge as much as your mutant charges?

[drumpel]

I find it funny you guys are so lively about this.

Things changed when enchanting shifted and folks jumped to the new system. Plain and simple. How you want to price your time and efforts, that's your own preference and to see you guys arguing back and forth and getting nowhere is humorous.

Old system:
1) removed item from use for X amount of time until the project was finished
2) had some shitty failures that added a lot of time should you run across one
3) you could do as many 1x-4x projects as you wanted, no limit
4) only 1 major project - 5x and up - allowed per account
5) enchanting items is significantly more difficult under the older system. my level 74 wizard has about a 50% to do a temper step on a 6x, lightning flaring weapon with 5CER of weighting. Under the new system he can't fail a cast and that's even without using a pre-temper flaring potion to reduce the difficulty

In a workshop with familiar:
Casting 925 on 6x, lightning flaring weapon with 5CER = you can only fail to enchant it if you are horribly unlucky.
Casting 925 holding zorveneh potion with same item = this enchantment will be very difficult

New system:
1) Instant enchants - no item removal
2) Shitty failures were removed, now you just take a small hit to your essence pool if you fail a cast
3) You're restricted on how many enchants a week you can do by your essence, capped 16k a week or full pool is 64,000 (4 full weeks).
4) A lot easier to enchant higher items (as of now, who knows if things with shift once the "final" revision of the spell is released - if that ever happens).

It's a helluva lot easier to enchant items up in terms of past difficulties under the new system. It's not easier to enchant them in a timely fashion (meaning, you have to build up a lot of essence over time to get items up to a full 7x). I'd venture to guess a good portion of wizards are still taking advantage of the new system and easily enchanting their things that were a lot more difficult under the old system.

As you guys have pointed out a few times that it's easier for a low level wizard to enchant up to 7x, perhaps that's what they're all doing with their own essence - getting their items to 7x.

Now you're a spot where things get murky.
Folks are taking advantage of the easier to enchant items and working on their own things, so this means their essence is tied up as they build it for higher level casts.
Currently not a lot of mages are offering their essence for enchanting - at least not a lot based on what I've seen. I rarely see anyone mention on lich their services and only a few folks have posted on PC offering their services.

With that in mind, why is not okay for any mage that can easily enchant to 7x not charge a premium price, even if the person looking for enchanting work is needing a low level enchant? Sure, the mage offering their service may only be a mid level mage, but enchanting difficulty is a lot less than it was before, so why is their essence worth less over a capped mage?

You guys are wanting to compare rates of sorcerers and wizard earn their essence/energy?
I've a level 54 sorcerer, 55 ranks in necro lore, hunting 2 levels under him - takes around 10 hours to cap his weekly energy. Were I to over hunt by a few levels I could probably trim that time down to around 8.5 hours.
I've a level 74 wizard, 129 ranks HP, 81 ranks EMC, 89 ranks EL:A, 63 ranks EL:W, hunting him like level - takes around 10-11 hours to cap his weekly essence. I've sunk more TPs in my wizard to have a similar time to build his essence as compared to my sorcerer, plus my wizard has 20 more levels on my sorcerer. I've put more time and work into my wizard to be at the same level of speed to build enchanting as a sorcerer 20 levels under him.

Granted my sorcerer can only get plain 5x items to T3 (T1 and T2 are easy, T3 is about a 60% chance for him), but if you move him up 20 more levels he'd be doing T4 on the same item with relative ease and would struggle with T5.

If you don't like what a mage is asking for a cost to enchant something - you need to remember the changes that happened. Just because you can instantly enchant something up +1 doesn't mean a low level wizard will be willing to part with their essence over a capped wizard. In the end, enchanting difficulty has dropped and it takes a low level wizard a lot longer to build up essence to save to do their own items....and time is money/silvers.

Would you be better off trying to create a pocket mage of your own? Maybe. I guess it depends on how fast you can get up to level 35 or so and how easily you can build your essence once you hit that level. Or would you be better off paying more out of pocket to get some easier, lower level enchants now than waiting it out a lot longer (6/12/18+ months) for the new enchanting system to balance out with pricing?

[Maerit]

With that in mind, why is not okay for any mage that can easily enchant to 7x not charge a premium price, even if the person looking for enchanting work is needing a low level enchant?

Anyone can charge anything they want for services/items. Whether its reasonable is subjective is based on the buyer and the demand for the service. The problem here is setting a "precedent" that all wizard enchants are equally valuable. They aren't. Just like all sorcerer ensorcells are not equally valuable. A T5 ensorcell cast on a 10x item requires substantially more skill to accomplish than a T5 ensorcell cast on a 4x vanilla item. The OP requested pricing for getting very simple items enchanted that any wizard of any level with 25 ranks in wizard spells could enchant, and the response was "that'll be 3 million silvers per week of essence!".

Prior to the change to newstyle enchanting, all but the +18 item would have been free to enchant to 4x because it didn't lock the wizard out of their major enchant projects, and it was just the cost of a potion. Probably would have taken a week or less to finish.

New system, most responders, and apparently folks who PM'd the OP, are suggesting he pay over 6 million silvers for a couple of 4x weapons. That doesn't compute, and that expectation shouldn't be established. The system is new, it'll take a while to level off. I'd pay Adred's wizard 3mil per week, but only because it's be one helluva difficult enchant to get done, and he's setup for some of the hardest enchanting projects. Otherwise - premium points are cheaper than 99% of the wizards enchanting basic gear at this point.

Should you expect free? Not at all! My sorcerer leveled up after ensorcell was introduced from around 48-100. During the early years of ensorcelling on him, I charged between 1.5 and 2mil per necroweek of energy. If I were to try and sell my warmage's essence with only 35 ranks in wizard spells, I'd probably charge no more than 1.5mil per week of energy because (even though he's capped) he can't do the difficult projects. The other wizard, with 60 ranks, still has some limits, but I'd probably go up to 2mil on him.

Unfortunately, like you mentioned, I'm getting a few items finished to 7x before I switch to full sale mode on my wizards.

[Nothing]

Well, in addition to the discussion my post started, I got want I wanted. Someone with a level 30ish wizard PMed me last night and offered to do the weapons for free and they followed through this morning. Apparently they'd maxed out their essence and wanted to burn it off so they can start earning more.

I asked a couple times if they were sure they didn't want anything and even offered to forge a perfect for them (which I'll still do if they change their mind), but they were just happy to put the essence to good use. It wasn't the outcome I was expecting and don't expect it to repeat it's self, but I'm more then thrilled with it.