Possibly returning

[JaTrRm]

I left the lands a number of years ago. I started playing the game back when it was GS3, and we paid a silly amount to log in per hour on AOL to play.
I recently got the “return free for 60 days” advert a couple days ago and it got the nostalgia going. My question is; how is the game these day? Is it still often the case of one person playing a group of silent alts, script steam rolling thru hunting areas? Has it sort of died off or has life picked up in the lands?

[Taernath]

Is it still often the case of one person playing a group of silent alts, script steam rolling thru hunting areas?

Yes.

If you have a returner code just come back and see for yourself.

[Fierna]

It's actually even more script hunty especially with the advent of Lich and scripts like BigShot. In fact, they released what are known as "gifted creatures" in order to combat the problem. If you played last since GSIII, the game has gone through enormous changes. But above all, the single biggest change would have to be how the company monetizes it's product, and that's through microtransactions.

On the otherhand, if you don't care about item chasing then the game might actually be even better than before. What were once valuable items are now more readily available and getting to level 100 is even easier and faster than before. The RP opportunities have grown imho but that may vary between players.

[Tosk]

It's actually even more script hunty especially with the advent of Lich and scripts like BigShot. In fact, they released what are known as "gifted creatures" in order to combat the problem. If you played last since GSIII, the game has gone through enormous changes. But above all, the single biggest change would have to be how the company monetizes it's product, and that's through microtransactions.

On the otherhand, if you don't care about item chasing then the game might actually be even better than before. What were once valuable items are now more readily available and getting to level 100 is even easier and faster than before. The RP opportunities have grown imho but that may vary between players.

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQ6vDBawP-_lhbqSHB1MqFcbq6qDdtlN1SY5vo1bA6_S_UM2TAf

[Donquix]

It's cute that some of you still think there was any sort of plan for gifted creatures beyond "i played diablo once"

[Gelston]

Those minibosses did nothing to stop scripting in anyway. Just, now people also have LTE.

[GSIV Rogue]

My opinion:

As a previous GS III player who has played on and off since 1998-1999 the game has become far less challenging and there is far less in game interaction overall. There is an increase in scripting, alts, afk scripting, "pay to win" etc. This has been a trend that has been going on for at least 20 years from my observation.

I would recommend rolling up a F2P character and getting it to about level 20 and then subscribing at the basic account level if you can find the motivation to pay for the game at that point. At best, the game is worth $14.95 a month minus whatever silver / items you can sell to supplement the cost.

[JaTrRm]

I left in late 2011 so I believe the worst of the unsupervised scripting was already well under way, but I wasn’t aware of any cash shops, f2p or any “boss” mobs.

[GSIV Rogue]

I left in late 2011 so I believe the worst of the unsupervised scripting was already well under way, but I wasn’t aware of any cash shops, f2p or any “boss” mobs.

Welcome to GSIV 2019. You can even pay cash to be spelled up by an army of level 100 characters at any time.

[Taernath]

Welcome to GSIV 2019. You can even pay cash to be spelled up by an army of level 100 characters at any time.

You make it sound like Dreavenings are emblematic of GS' problems. The dude does it for free every four hours for whoever shows up. Dreavenings are one of the few good things about GS.

[GSIV Rogue]

[Dreavening]-GSIV:Dreaven: "I like money, you like spells, let's make each other happy: please consider becoming a patron to help fund these amazing services. https://www.patreon.com/LordDreaven"
[Dreavening]-GSIV:Dreaven: "If you prefer to make a one time payment with PAYPAL send me a private message to discuss what tier you would like to receive and for how many months."
[Dreavening]-GSIV:Dreaven: "In order to keep Dreavenings around forever I'm thinking of charging a small fee for non-patrons, like 20k per spellup, free to whatever tier patron I'll think about. What you all think? Good idea? Bad idea? Gonna be the end of Dreavenings as we know it?"
[Dreavening]-GSIV:Dreaven: "Okay, I've read all of the feedback and I think I'll go to my original idea of free scheduled Dreavenings with extra Dreavenings having a fee."

I simply stated a fact.

[Gelston]

[Dreavening]-GSIV:Dreaven: "I like money, you like spells, let's make each other happy: please consider becoming a patron to help fund these amazing services. https://www.patreon.com/LordDreaven"
[Dreavening]-GSIV:Dreaven: "If you prefer to make a one time payment with PAYPAL send me a private message to discuss what tier you would like to receive and for how many months."
[Dreavening]-GSIV:Dreaven: "In order to keep Dreavenings around forever I'm thinking of charging a small fee for non-patrons, like 20k per spellup, free to whatever tier patron I'll think about. What you all think? Good idea? Bad idea? Gonna be the end of Dreavenings as we know it?"
[Dreavening]-GSIV:Dreaven: "Okay, I've read all of the feedback and I think I'll go to my original idea of free scheduled Dreavenings with extra Dreavenings having a fee."

I simply stated a fact.

He doesn't require money. It is a donation. You made it seem like he required you to pay him. He doesn't.

[Taernath]

I simply stated a fact.

No, you stated a half-truth by leaving out that he also regularly does it for free for whoever shows up.

If you don't like them that's fine, but they are undeniably popular with the community.

[GSIV Rogue]

He doesn't require money. It is a donation. You made it seem like he required you to pay him. He doesn't.

Correct, he doesn't require money to attend the free Dreavenings. However, in order to be spelled up by his army at "any time" - you need to pay.

This was given as another example of the overall trend of GS as a whole for the OP.

[Gelston]

The code HALLOWEEN2019GS will get you 90 days of free premium if your account hasn't been active in the last 90 days. So check that out.

[GSIV Rogue]

No, you stated a half-truth by leaving out that he also regularly does it for free for whoever shows up.

If you don't like them that's fine, but they are undeniably popular with the community.

Perhaps there is a misunderstanding. I stated in my first post that you could pay cash to be spelled up "any time" by an army of level 100 characters. To further clarify my point, I made a second post on the subject where I clearly showed that Dreavenings are also offered for free - by posting a log of Dreaven themselves talking on lnet. These are both facts.

Nowhere did I say I liked or disliked anyone. Popularity with the community is irrelevant to the original query.

[Neveragain]

You make it sound like Dreavenings are emblematic of GS' problems. The dude does it for free every four hours for whoever shows up. Dreavenings are one of the few good things about GS.

This is the truth. There has been multiple occasions where I have had dreaven just snatch up one of my characters and drag them off to get spells. I didn't even know he took donations, though, other than being dragged to Dreavening by Dreaven or some other player I never attended them. Not for any dislike of dreaven/ings just always had at least my own pocket wizard.

[Neveragain]

I left the lands a number of years ago. I started playing the game back when it was GS3, and we paid a silly amount to log in per hour on AOL to play.
I recently got the “return free for 60 days” advert a couple days ago and it got the nostalgia going. My question is; how is the game these day? Is it still often the case of one person playing a group of silent alts, script steam rolling thru hunting areas? Has it sort of died off or has life picked up in the lands?

In all honesty, you will have fun for at least that 60 days. I'm usually pretty critical of simu because they fucking suck and suck at doing what could make things really cool, but. It will still be fun for you and there is role play, mostly in the elven nations though and it's mostly about the fucking elves, which is gay, but.

It's worth returning, at minimum you may have some item you can pull a few hundred off of and call it a day.

[Neovik1]

My opinion:

As a previous GS III player who has played on and off since 1998-1999 the game has become far less challenging and there is far less in game interaction overall. There is an increase in scripting, alts, afk scripting, "pay to win" etc. This has been a trend that has been going on for at least 20 years from my observation.

I would recommend rolling up a F2P character and getting it to about level 20 and then subscribing at the basic account level if you can find the motivation to pay for the game at that point. At best, the game is worth $14.95 a month minus whatever silver / items you can sell to supplement the cost.

I feel like this is a bit inaccurate and your other statement about paying an army of 100s for spell ups is even more inaccurate.

You don’t have to pay to win in GS. You can even participate in the paid events by buying in with silvers where you usually come out ahead. I bought books from players last DR and didn’t spend a dime when it came to real money.

I would give the free trial they are offering to returning players. Not much to lose and can always cancel before it is up. Not quite sure why you would need a f2p if you have a free trial offer.

[fireorlime]

Some people script, but a lot of people don’t. I think the game is much more fun than I remember it being a long time ago. Give it a shot.

Also, listen to the podcast.

[Askip]

Welcome back!

I would at least give it a shot, there is plenty of action and interaction if that is what you want.

If F2P gets access to the official forum, check out the Cities/Towns folders. There is also the Town Crier https://gswiki.play.net/Category:TownCrier and Discord channels.

It all depends on what you want from the game.

Good luck and have fun,
Askip :D

[gemstonefella]

I would recommend rolling up a F2P character and getting it to about level 20 and then subscribing at the basic account level if you can find the motivation to pay for the game at that point. At best, the game is worth $14.95 a month minus whatever silver / items you can sell to supplement the cost.


Why would he roll up a FTP character when he has a code for 2 free months?

[Hightower]

If the last time you played was after Lich became a thing, then likely not much will have changed as far as pervasiveness of scripting goes.

As others have mentioned, monetization has changed. There's a cash shop with various perks and more pay events than before on top of the usual subscription fee. But it's still difficult to call GS pay-to-win because, strictly speaking, you don't really "win" anything. Further, the price of high end gear typically doesn't reflect the additional benefit it provides so much as the impact of the various methods employed to control supply (e.g. restrictions upon enchants above 7x, arbitrary pricing for certs from the HESS, etc.). Don't get me wrong. There are some whales out there who have made themselves practically invincible with their expensive gear. But average Joe with treasure system drops, crafted and player-serviced gear can still kill all of the same stuff without spending a dime beyond the subscription fee.

As far as the community goes, I'd say it's in pretty good shape. It's difficult to tell if the population has truly grown, since F2P and alts make it appear larger than it probably is in terms of active, long-term player population. But going by number of simultaneous players at peak hours, the game has actually grown over the past few years and seems pretty stable.

Roleplaying and general player interaction really hasn't changed much as far as the players go, but it seems like there are pretty constant RP events going on at any given time somewhere in the world if you're into that. And lots of players are willing to interact if you get the ball rolling, in my experience. But yes, you'll still see plenty of players who keep to themselves and might be running a script.

I'd give it a go if I were you. I recently returned for the 3 months of free premium over the summer. It just ended, but I paid for another month. I'm sure I'll get bored or frustrated with something sooner or later and find another game to play for awhile. But I always end up coming back eventually. I think a lot of players are like that.

~Taverkin

[GSIV Rogue]

I feel like this is a bit inaccurate and your other statement about paying an army of 100s for spell ups is even more inaccurate.

You don’t have to pay to win in GS. You can even participate in the paid events by buying in with silvers where you usually come out ahead. I bought books from players last DR and didn’t spend a dime when it came to real money.

I would give the free trial they are offering to returning players. Not much to lose and can always cancel before it is up. Not quite sure why you would need a f2p if you have a free trial offer.

I'm happy we can celebrate a difference of opinion - and I'm glad you are enjoying your time in the lands.

I've also found motivation to continue playing.

I'm not quite sure what you're referring to when you say that any statements I made about Dreaven & Co. are inaccurate - however - to each their own. :)

@F2P - I believe the F2P experience made me a more creative and effective Gemstone player, and would highly recommend it to anyone - especially those returning from a long absence. Quite frankly, I would recommend F2P in addition to a trial premium account - just to compare and contrast the differences, and give persons a more accurate overall picture of GSIV 2019.

[audioserf]

The great thing about GS is you can do whatever you want. If you want to play like it's 2001 you can. You don't have to use Lich, attend Dreavenings, whatever. The game is what you want it to be. You lose nothing by trying it out for a couple of months on a free promo. Lich doesn't mean you have to go full automated afk scripting, either - just having access to go2 and Lnet (you can ;untune Lnet and just use the Prime/Help/Merchant/TownCrier/whatever channels if you aren't feeling the Lnet vibe) alone are well worth setting Lich up in my opinion.

[Murrandii]

Game is different from gs3 cause time has passed and people have changed too.

No longer big crowds at the small park where a thief stealing someone was a player based event and sometimes it brought up some nice interactions.

People in gs4 now are like people in 2019: opportunities are: fast food fast reward events and they're more often than not, now, related with GMs being ingame and playing this or that NPC. Welcome RPAs!

Of course, you have the purist but they're rare.

To enjoy this game in 2019, you need to stop looking at it with your 2003's glasses.

[Mobius1]

Mechanically speaking, the game is light years beyond what GS3 was. There are so many new systems that have improved the game, that it is certainly a better experience in most ways.

As was said, the pay 2 win issue is certainly upsetting to some, myself included, but in the end, if you play for the RP, then that stuff doesn't really matter anyways, and you should have a good time.

What class do you play as?

[GSIV Rogue]

I think that this is a great thread - it's interesting to hear everyone's perspective.

I've always enjoyed the roll-playing aspect of GS.

I agree with some of what all the last 3 posters have said:

The great thing about GS is that you can do whatever you want.

GSIV 2019 and the people therein have changed and are indicative of the overall times. You have to look at GSIV as it is today in order to enjoy the game.

GSIV is lightyears ahead of GSIII in terms of mechanics (the changes are too many to list).

From a roll-playing / mechanics mastery standpoint I enjoyed the following about GSIII vs GSIV:

- Less forgiving and more rewarding for min-maxers (No fixstats, fixskills, etc.)
- No level cap
- If you can cap a character in GSIV the game just gets easier - since you can hunt the same creatures over and over again getting the same amount of experience and pick up more skills as you go with the added ability/option to fixstat / fixskill your character.

From my observation, the game has always been set up to incentivize players to spend cash to make things easier on themselves - and less inclusive and more difficult for those who don't. For me, this is what *all* of the changes made over the course of the last 20+ years boil down to. In this way, I feel that GSIV is more challenging than GSIII and is what I personally enjoy about it.

I would be very interested to hear from anyone who has rolled up a character on just a basic account and leveled it from 0-100 in GSIV on their own merits without spending more than $14.95 per month for a basic subscription. This is the challenge I've given myself and would really like to hear from anyone else who is doing / has done the same.

[Vishnell]

I would be very interested to hear from anyone who has rolled up a character on just a basic account and leveled it from 0-100 in GSIV on their own merits without spending more than $14.95 per month for a basic subscription. This is the challenge I've given myself and would really like to hear from anyone else who is doing / has done the same.

Guilty! I've never had a premium account, only basic since 1997 since it went to the web. I took a lot of breaks, life happens: 1998-2003, 2005-2013, and 2015-2017. Gemstone always calls back. Main has always been a sorcerer (alt on same account was an empath i barely play). When i came back in Dec 2017, i was determine to CAP finally. I was level 50 at the time. I finally capped last month! I only play enough to gain 200k exp/month, so it took a bit.

I never felt that i was missing out being a standard account. As a sorc, i always had silvers coming in with ensorcelling, and was able to afford pretty good gear. I never had an issue with hunting, was always able to hunt self spelled or with easy to find scrolls i charged up. I can't justify $40 per month for what i would get for it.

Sent from my LG-G710 using Tapatalk

[GSIV Rogue]

Guilty! I've never had a premium account, only basic since 1997 since it went to the web. I took a lot of breaks, life happens: 1998-2003, 2005-2013, and 2015-2017. Gemstone always calls back. Main has always been a sorcerer (alt on same account was an empath i barely play). When i came back in Dec 2017, i was determine to CAP finally. I was level 50 at the time. I finally capped last month! I only play enough to gain 200k exp/month, so it took a bit.

I never felt that i was missing out being a standard account. As a sorc, i always had silvers coming in with ensorcelling, and was able to afford pretty good gear. I never had an issue with hunting, was always able to hunt self spelled or with easy to find scrolls i charged up. I can't justify $40 per month for what i would get for it.

Sent from my LG-G710 using Tapatalk

Congrats on capping your sorc! What's your character's name?

Is there anyone out there who's been able to cap a character only playing during GSIV in this way? (basic $14.95 account, no other cash spent on game, etc.)

[Gelston]

Congrats on capping your sorc! What's your character's name?

Is there anyone out there who's been able to cap a character only playing during GSIV in this way? (basic $14.95 account, no other cash spent on game, etc.)

Methais claims to have only ever had a basic account.

[GSIV Rogue]

Methais claims to have only ever had a basic account.

I didn't know you could have a house with a basic account.

Anyone who has been able to cap a character in GSIV? The entire 0-100 in GSIV - $14.95 a month only. On their own merits. Even if you and a buddy shared accounts - as long as you personally didn't spend more than the basic subscription on your account, you owned the character the entire time - and the character was rolled up in GSIV. Really curious if anyone has actually done this.

[Fierna]

I didn't know you could have a house with a basic account.

Anyone who has been able to cap a character in GSIV? The entire 0-100 in GSIV - $14.95 a month only. On their own merits. Even if you and a buddy shared accounts - as long as you personally didn't spend more than the basic subscription on your account, you owned the character the entire time - and the character was rolled up in GSIV. Really curious if anyone has actually done this.

Short of some older players playing their original characters on AOL dial up, the majority of players probably capped on basic accounts. I don’t understand why Premium would affect you being able to cap?

[Gelston]

I didn't know you could have a house with a basic account.

Anyone who has been able to cap a character in GSIV? The entire 0-100 in GSIV - $14.95 a month only. On their own merits. Even if you and a buddy shared accounts - as long as you personally didn't spend more than the basic subscription on your account, you owned the character the entire time - and the character was rolled up in GSIV. Really curious if anyone has actually done this.

He has a private property, not a premium property. You don't need a premium for that.

[GSIV Rogue]

Short of some older players playing their original characters on AOL dial up, the majority of players probably capped on basic accounts. I don’t understand why Premium would affect you being able to cap?

I'm just very interested to meet anyone who has played a basic account in GSIV from level 0-100 and never spent more than the subscription amount on the game for any reason. A player who has a character that was rolled up and created from the time Gemstone IV went live only - and played from level 0-100 by one person who never spent more than $14.95 a month for any reason - and had no outside help of any kind other than what they were able to get out of the game on that character.

Premium in GSIV has a very large effect on treasure drop - among many other "perks" that make the game quite a bit easier and more convenient.

I'm not saying that it isn't possible, but it is quite challenging - I am currently attempting it. I've seen it stated by many people how easy this is, but I haven't met or heard from a single person who has done it.

[Mobius1]

I've boycotted all pay services since I first played GS, so I went zero to well beyond cap on nothing but a basic sub. Post cap I did get alt accounts though, that are basic subs. I will never go premie for the same reason I boycott pay events. I did accidentally go premie for a short bit when I returned 8 months ago, because I didn't realize it was part of the promo - got screwed big time on that because I didn't avail myself of anything, because I didn't even know I was premie. I cancelled it the moment I noticed, and spent my points on the premie titles. So yeah, I won't count that as premie.

In fact, I got all the way to cap with 4x gear. (Plus my character was always more disadvantaged than many, since he was a brawler and there was no UAC yet.).

But then again, I always cared more about RP, the Rogue Guild, and CvC, to worry too much about gear. The bulk of my money went toward alters and such for my character's image (which is one big reason I like this game.).

PvE combat in GS has always been a joke to me. It was always just a means to an end. I mean, not that I don't care about PvE balance, but ultimately it's one of the worst parts of the game for me, so it has absolutely nothing to do with what draws me to the game. Whatever PvE challenges I had, were more like inconveniences than actual challenges. What about PvE actually requires any skill whatsoever to be good at?

[GSIV Rogue]

PvE combat in GS has always been a joke to me. It was always just a means to an end. I mean, not that I don't care about PvE balance, but ultimately it's one of the worst parts of the game for me, so it has absolutely nothing to do with what draws me to the game. Whatever PvE challenges I had, were more like inconveniences than actual challenges. What about PvE actually requires any skill whatsoever to be good at?

The parts of the game that make people feel the need to buy alts, gear, spell-ups from level 100 armies, subscribe to premium, etc.

Or do those people just like spending extra money to have their character be as invulnerable as possible to PvE for role-playing reasons - since the game is so easy?

[Neveragain]

I'm just very interested to meet anyone who has played a basic account in GSIV from level 0-100 and never spent more than the subscription amount on the game for any reason. A player who has a character that was rolled up and created from the time Gemstone IV went live only - and played from level 0-100 by one person who never spent more than $14.95 a month for any reason - and had no outside help of any kind other than what they were able to get out of the game on that character.

Premium in GSIV has a very large effect on treasure drop - among many other "perks" that make the game quite a bit easier and more convenient.

I'm not saying that it isn't possible, but it is quite challenging - I am currently attempting it. I've seen it stated by many people how easy this is, but I haven't met or heard from a single person who has done it.

The vast majority of my leveling was done on a basic sub. The only reason I ever went premium was for a home and they pretty much suck.

[Mobius1]

The parts of the game that make people feel the need to buy alts, gear, spell-ups from level 100 armies, subscribe to premium, etc.

Or do those people just like spending extra money to have their character be as invulnerable as possible to PvE for role-playing reasons - since the game is so easy?

Yes, that is correct.

Gemstone's idea of "difficult" combat, is more about throwing in cheesy deaths, than really testing your skill in any meaningful way.

But if you really get down to it, dying in GS is also pretty inconsequential, so even if your cheapo gear results in more deaths, what are you really losing? Time? Most people probably spend more time earning money for their good gear, than someone in cheapo gear spends in death downtime.

What I also find funny, is it seems like the majority of people that I talk to that are looking for a "challenging" PvE experience, are some of the best geared characters.

But hell, take all I am saying worth a grain of salt. If you enjoy the PvE experience, more power to you. What keeps me here is the ability to create a unique character like nowhere else, and roleplay them.

[Murrandii]

I'm just very interested to meet anyone who has played a basic account in GSIV from level 0-100 and never spent more than the subscription amount on the game for any reason. A player who has a character that was rolled up and created from the time Gemstone IV went live only - and played from level 0-100 by one person who never spent more than $14.95 a month for any reason - and had no outside help of any kind other than what they were able to get out of the game on that character.

Premium in GSIV has a very large effect on treasure drop - among many other "perks" that make the game quite a bit easier and more convenient.

I'm not saying that it isn't possible, but it is quite challenging - I am currently attempting it. I've seen it stated by many people how easy this is, but I haven't met or heard from a single person who has done it.

I capped 4 characters basics

with my path to cap and just wizard spells, It's damn easy.

You focuse only on one thing: exp

[Neovik1]

Yes, that is correct.

Gemstone's idea of "difficult" combat, is more about throwing in cheesy deaths, than really testing your skill in any meaningful way.

But if you really get down to it, dying in GS is also pretty inconsequential, so even if your cheapo gear results in more deaths, what are you really losing? Time? Most people probably spend more time earning money for their good gear, than someone in cheapo gear spends in death downtime.

What I also find funny, is it seems like the majority of people that I talk to that are looking for a "challenging" PvE experience, are some of the best geared characters.

But hell, take all I am saying worth a grain of salt. If you enjoy the PvE experience, more power to you. What keeps me here is the ability to create a unique character like nowhere else, and roleplay them.

Yeah, you won't really get that any where else. I just picked up a shimmer trinket for the first time at last DR and have enjoyed making my character more unique with it.

For the most part I've been a basic account until I capped. I upgraded for REIM and was going to eventually go back to basic... but now I have a 3 room shop that I'm reluctant to downgrade.... but will have to eventually do it to go back to basic. Just need to sell some crap...

[Fierna]

By the way, don’t confuse basic with F2P. F2P you’re fucked after level 20 and I don’t even think it’s possible to get to level 50 much less cap.

[Mobius1]

By the way, don’t confuse basic with F2P. F2P you’re fucked after level 20 and I don’t even think it’s possible to get to level 50 much less cap.

Yeah, the whole F2P experience is a joke, if you ask me. I understand that you shouldn't feel entitled to have a free experience, but the restrictions are magnitude worse than any other F2P model I have ever seen. It's like they wanted to be able to slap a F2P logo on their adds (Wait, what adds? :P ), but didn't want to actually have anyone use it.

And yeah, shimmer trinkets are my favorite thing Gemstone has ever had, hehe. I'd literally trade every item I own for one, if it was the only way I could get one.

[Vishnell]

Premium in GSIV has a very large effect on treasure drop - among many other "perks" that make the game quite a bit easier and more convenient.

I know that FTP treasure drops suck, but didn't know there was a difference between standard sub treasure drops and premium sub treasure drops. Can anyone verify this?

Sent from my LG-G710 using Tapatalk

[Taernath]

That's news to me. I had a premium and basic sub at one point, never noticed a difference. He might be referring to the boosts, but those are hardly what I'd call a "very large effect".

Really the only reason I had a premium sub at all was for the character slots.

[BriarFox]

I don't believe there's a difference in treasure drops between basic and premium. The GMs have long promised that premium status doesn't fundamentally change the game experience.

[beldannon5]

it should for $25 more :)

[GSIV Rogue]

Thanks for all the responses everyone. If and when someone accomplishes this, I'd be happy if you would post here or PM me. I would love to discuss your GS experience. Best of luck in GSIV 2019.

[Hightower]

I think that this is a great thread - it's interesting to hear everyone's perspective.

I've always enjoyed the roll-playing aspect of GS.

I agree with some of what all the last 3 posters have said:

The great thing about GS is that you can do whatever you want.

GSIV 2019 and the people therein have changed and are indicative of the overall times. You have to look at GSIV as it is today in order to enjoy the game.

GSIV is lightyears ahead of GSIII in terms of mechanics (the changes are too many to list).

From a roll-playing / mechanics mastery standpoint I enjoyed the following about GSIII vs GSIV:

- Less forgiving and more rewarding for min-maxers (No fixstats, fixskills, etc.)
- No level cap
- If you can cap a character in GSIV the game just gets easier - since you can hunt the same creatures over and over again getting the same amount of experience and pick up more skills as you go with the added ability/option to fixstat / fixskill your character.

From my observation, the game has always been set up to incentivize players to spend cash to make things easier on themselves - and less inclusive and more difficult for those who don't. For me, this is what *all* of the changes made over the course of the last 20+ years boil down to. In this way, I feel that GSIV is more challenging than GSIII and is what I personally enjoy about it.

I would be very interested to hear from anyone who has rolled up a character on just a basic account and leveled it from 0-100 in GSIV on their own merits without spending more than $14.95 per month for a basic subscription. This is the challenge I've given myself and would really like to hear from anyone else who is doing / has done the same.

I think I just paid for my first month of premium subscription ever (it was an accident, just forgot to switch to standard after my premium trial ran out!) and I'm about 3x cap. I've also never had a second subscription.

I don't understand why you seem to think having a premium subscription makes leveling any easier. None of the benefits of a premium subscription really make your character any more effective in combat.

~Taverkin

[Mobius1]

I think I just paid for my first month of premium subscription ever (it was an accident, just forgot to switch to standard after my premium trial ran out!) and I'm about 3x cap. I've also never had a second subscription.

I don't understand why you seem to think having a premium subscription makes leveling any easier. None of the benefits of a premium subscription really make your character any more effective in combat.

~Taverkin

Well, actually that's not really true. You get access to premie point bonuses, and more merchants (There are premie only WPS merchants, right?). And probably other boosts I don't know about, because I've never been premie.

Whatever the case, Premie must be doing SOMETHING for people, otherwise why would people pay so much for it? I doubt it's just for fluff bonuses?

[petroglyph]

When I paid for it, it was for the extra locker space for cyberbarbie and the extra character slots. So, yes, essentially fluff bonuses.

[Realk]

I've capped a few characters on just a standard 1 character sub, and a couple more on a premium acct.. The main bonus for me with a premium acct was the ability to have all the character slots, and change up whom I played on a whim.. FWI is nice to have access too no racial penalty for buying and selling.. The ability to meet up to buy and sell things with players, or get healing and locksmiths is pretty nice. The extra merchant is typically just GALD crap so not that is not a big deal. I ended up selling my PP's but eventually getting the ability to enchant something you might not to otherwise is cool..

Fluff bonuses = spell of the month item, the premium transport, ability to have a premium home..

[Hightower]

The parts of the game that make people feel the need to buy alts, gear, spell-ups from level 100 armies, subscribe to premium, etc.

Or do those people just like spending extra money to have their character be as invulnerable as possible to PvE for role-playing reasons - since the game is so easy?


I think it's true that the GS combat system is prone to those "cheap"-feeling deaths. It's a side-effect of the lack of 3D space, the critical system, and the extreme duration of disabling effects. Walking into a room and instantly being killed or rendered unable to act for a significant period of time while enemies chip away at you is how many of us die. And why not? We do the same thing to them. Which is probably why players load up on gear intended to prevent those cheap deaths, while simultaneously lamenting the fact that GS combat lacks challenge and any element of skill.

The way the combat system works, handicapping yourself with cruddy gear doesn't actually add much in the way of skill-based challenges, but likely does increase the frustration!

~Taverkin

[Hightower]

Well, actually that's not really true. You get access to premie point bonuses, and more merchants (There are premie only WPS merchants, right?). And probably other boosts I don't know about, because I've never been premie.

Whatever the case, Premie must be doing SOMETHING for people, otherwise why would people pay so much for it? I doubt it's just for fluff bonuses?

True. Premium points and exclusive merchant services can improve your gear, which is relevant to combat. But in the context of day to day leveling, I don't think these benefits amount to much.

I suspect premium is attractive to many players due in large part to the additional character slots, locker space, and exclusive merchants. It's what? $2 per character slot? And you don't even get 1 for free, right? The difference between a standard account and a premium account isn't that much if you have several characters you like to play. At that point, those other benefits just seem like an even sweeter deal.

~Taverkin

[leifastagsweed]

I left in late 2011 so I believe the worst of the unsupervised scripting was already well under way, but I wasn’t aware of any cash shops, f2p or any “boss” mobs.

PC is not a great place to discuss whether people like or don't like Gemstone. This site has sadly degraded into a complaint forum where people snipe at each other for various reasons, particularly this issue.

And FYI - you were still buying/selling in late 2012 according to your PC posts.

That said, I share some of your views from that time period and had those concerns when I returned to game a few months after a few years break myself. I am pleasantly surprised to find the community in good shape, the game quite active, and the staff more attentive and engaged than I've seen in decades. I feel proud of the game and my involvement in it.

I really love that one commentor mentioned and others echoed that you can do what you want in Gemstone, make it your own experience. That is absolutely accurate. GSWiki, Towncrier, and Discord have opened up doors to learning tips and tricks for playing that were quite challenging in the past. I'm realizing more than ever how deeply enriching this game can be and the idea of being able to continue learning inspires me to play and immerse all the more.

I do hope you've taken an opportunity to join the GS community Discord server and engage people who are actively playing. If you're looking for community or have any questions, reach out directly and let's find the right fit for you!

Best of luck, JaTrRm.

~ Leifa Ar'Anya Faendryl (IG)
discord - Leifa#5351

[GSIV Rogue]

Well, actually that's not really true. You get access to premie point bonuses, and more merchants (There are premie only WPS merchants, right?). And probably other boosts I don't know about, because I've never been premie.

Whatever the case, Premie must be doing SOMETHING for people, otherwise why would people pay so much for it? I doubt it's just for fluff bonuses?


All correct. Easier access to better gear and other conveniences impact a player's ability, desire, and willpower to be able to grind through gaining experience - which as you have stated - is one of the worst parts of the game for you.

The point I've been trying to make is that the way the PvE combat, leveling, and experience systems are set up is beyond horrendous. The fact that the game is optimized at every turn to try and squeeze every penny out of the player is just another slap in the face.

I don't enjoy PvE anymore than the next player, but when I can see something is designed to pressure me into doing something I don't want to do - I see it as a challenge - and enjoy conquering it. From my perspective (I enjoy mechanics and leveling), GSIV has been made as unenjoyable as possible for anyone who's not willing to spend a lot of money on it - unless, like me, you are just trying to prove a point.

The fact that there have been so few, if any, players who have successfully been able to play through the game from 0-100 in GSIV with a single basic subscription and nothing more - ever - is indicative to me of how non-inclusive the GSIV community has become overall to both new players, and casual gamers. The way Simutronics and/or Stillfront Group is going about trying to maximize profits will put Gemstone out of existence. Ultimately, this is the biggest reason why I believe in investing as little money as possible into the game. If and when it's gone - we're going to inevitably lose thousands or tens of thousands of hours of effort - losing a large amount of real money on top of that for me would be unacceptable. The fact that Simutronics has sold out majority control over the past few years to Stillfront Group (larger parent company) - only hastens this eventual conclusion.

[GSIV Rogue]

I think it's true that the GS combat system is prone to those "cheap"-feeling deaths. It's a side-effect of the lack of 3D space, the critical system, and the extreme duration of disabling effects. Walking into a room and instantly being killed or rendered unable to act for a significant period of time while enemies chip away at you is how many of us die. And why not? We do the same thing to them. Which is probably why players load up on gear intended to prevent those cheap deaths, while simultaneously lamenting the fact that GS combat lacks challenge and any element of skill.

The way the combat system works, handicapping yourself with cruddy gear doesn't actually add much in the way of skill-based challenges, but likely does increase the frustration!

~Taverkin

I believe that there is a large amount of skill and willpower involved in getting a character to cap without spending more than the basic $14.95 a month to do so. Many "cheap deaths" can be prevented with proper stat placement, training choices, race selection, careful planning, and hunting strategies. I will concede that it is *extremely* frustrating - but it would be even more frustrating to me to lose a significant amount of real life money after showing up one day to see that the game no longer exists.

[Mobius1]

Like 4 people already said they went from 0-100 on basic accounts. Your also asking the current playerbase, which consists of more premie per capita than probably any other time in GS history. Us basic folks tend to have less invested in the game, so those that have stuck around all this time are more likely to be the premie types. It's not that not many have done it - just that they don't play right now.

Not sure why GSIV 0-100 is your criteria, either. I know that my leveling experience in GS3 was far worse, especially without bounties and UAC/brawling weapons that could actually kill with ambush.

Sure, there was symbol of dreams, but the advguild makes up for that. Plus pretty good gear is much more affordable these days, and most if not all of the classes are stronger now than they were in GS3.

[Gelston]

There is a level 60 something F2P player right now too. That is way worse than a basic account.

[Methais]

Is there anyone out there who's been able to cap a character only playing during GSIV in this way? (basic $14.95 account, no other cash spent on game, etc.)

Yes.


Methais claims to have only ever had a basic account.

Yes.


I didn't know you could have a house with a basic account.

Premium Homes and Private Homes are completely different. Private homes don't care about your account type as long as you're dropping 75k silver in the rent box every month.

Anyone who has been able to cap a character in GSIV? The entire 0-100 in GSIV - $14.95 a month only. On their own merits. Even if you and a buddy shared accounts - as long as you personally didn't spend more than the basic subscription on your account, you owned the character the entire time - and the character was rolled up in GSIV. Really curious if anyone has actually done this.[/QUOTE]

No.

I did do all that in GS3 though when the soft cap was 160 and exp was a lot slower and Lumnis, bounties, etc. didn't exist yet.

Outside of my sub, the only thing I've ever spent money on was Hunt For History 2, which was a complete garbage event, and RtCF back in 2012 or whenever that was, which I made a killing off of and came out way ahead.

Premium vs. Basic means absolute shit in regards to leveling up anyway.

[Mobius1]

Yes.
I did do all that in GS3 though when the soft cap was 160 and exp was a lot slower and Lumnis, bounties, etc. didn't exist yet.


GS3. Doesn't count.

[Winter]

Premium in GSIV has a very large effect on treasure drop -.

Does it? How do you know that?

[Gelston]

GS3. Doesn't count.

GS3 was harder to cap in. It very much counts.

[malmuddy]

GS3 was harder to cap in. It very much counts.

This. Things like the Adventurer's Guild, fixed weekly bonus experience (versus time-based), off-line experience absorption, long-term experience boosts, and daily log-in boosts make it easier to cap now ever than before. And I'm sure there are other things included in a basic account that I'm forgetting.

[Mobius1]

GS3 was harder to cap in. It very much counts.

Yeah, but you can't tell me of one person that did it in GS4. So clearly you are wrong.

And damn, someone is 60 on F2P? Do they spend Simucoins?

[Gelston]

Yeah, but you can't tell me of one person that did it in GS4. So clearly you are wrong.

And damn, someone is 60 on F2P? Do they spend Simucoins?

Uh wut? There are several people who have 0-100 in GS4. I know a guy that did it in under 7 months.

[Mobius1]

Uh wut? There are several people who have 0-100 in GS4. I know a guy that did it in under 7 months.

Geez, you fell neck deep into my sarcasm.

[Gelston]

Geez, you fell neck deep into my sarcasm.

Sorry, couldn't tell from you.

[Mobius1]

Sorry, couldn't tell from you.

Maybe my earlier post about it was a good enough hint?

[Winter]

Uh wut? There are several people who have 0-100 in GS4. I know a guy that did it in under 7 months.

Was it Bard? I remember hearing about a bard doing it 6 or 7 months. I also remember Leafiara did it very quickly.

[Gelston]

Was it Bard? I remember hearing about a bard doing it 6 or 7 months. I also remember Leafiara did it very quickly.

Nah it was a sorc. This was back when we had mentor events almost weekly and Paersi gave out those huge RPAs to everyone attending, so he never missed one.

[GSIV Rogue]

Like 4 people already said they went from 0-100 on basic accounts. Your also asking the current playerbase, which consists of more premie per capita than probably any other time in GS history. Us basic folks tend to have less invested in the game, so those that have stuck around all this time are more likely to be the premie types. It's not that not many have done it - just that they don't play right now.

Not sure why GSIV 0-100 is your criteria, either. I know that my leveling experience in GS3 was far worse, especially without bounties and UAC/brawling weapons that could actually kill with ambush.

Sure, there was symbol of dreams, but the advguild makes up for that. Plus pretty good gear is much more affordable these days, and most if not all of the classes are stronger now than they were in GS3.

So then the game is being supported by a small number of people who are willing to spend big $$$ - and has alienated or run off new and old players who are not? I'll concede the point that there are people who have done what I asked - even though I haven't met them, they aren't playing right now, or haven't appeared here.

GSIII is not part of my criteria for many reasons - chiefly because for all of its experience and leveling advantages - GSIV is even less inclusive to people who don't spend a lot of $$$.

I have sold off, over time, any assets and previous characters I acquired or created in GSIII or GSIV in the past 2 decades - the last of which was just over a month ago. All said and done, I made back 2 times what I spent on GS in the past 5 years. I've watched the game degenerate into its current state, and kept up as the company got sold and added to an asset class of a large corporation that can be restructured at any time.

With nothing invested and nothing to lose, I rolled up a F2P character and got him to 21 (Eleftheros) without using Simucoins of any kind - before subscribing at the basic level. If I was a new player, without a mastery of mechanics, and ability to navigate the game - I'd have quit based on the impression I got from that experience. After thinking on it - I decided that I am ultimately ok with losing $14.95 a month when the game disappears.

I'm not knocking anyone who does whatever makes them happy so long as it doesn't infringe upon others - if you enjoy spending a lot of money on your hobbies, gaming, Gemstone - whatever - then more power to you. I am, however, saying that I don't believe GS is going to survive much longer in its current state. The real game changer is Simutronics selling out to Stillfront Group. If you don't understand why, I'd suggest reading up on mergers and acquisitions.

[GSIV Rogue]

Does it? How do you know that?

2015 Posts
Category: Game Design Discussions
Topic: Treasure System
Message #: 810
Author: GS4-COASE
Date: 01/23/2015 04:51 PM EST
Subject: Treasure Update!
With the release of several items in our SimuCoin shop, we want you, the players, to have a chance to earn some of those rewards in game. We are introducing drops of our Enhancive Pauses, Urchin Guide Tokens, and Locker Runner Contracts. How can you find these new items? Simple! Just hunt like you normally would for a chance at one of these rewards. Premium subscribers have a daily boost to their chances at finding their first drop each day, but do not fret, if you have a basic account, you will also have the ability to find this loot, should you be lucky enough!
Coase

2017 Posts
Category: Paid Events: Adventures, Quests, and SimuCoins
Topic: The Settlement of Reim
Message #: 714
Author: SIMU-WYROM
Date: 04/12/2017 03:27 PM EDT
Subject: Re: Hunting pressure?
I think there is a misunderstanding here. Everything in this game has hunting pressure. The only reason why Reim didn't have it was because it was on a new realm (Reim's personal realm) and Retser made a new creature profile similar to bandits/Grimswarm. We generally re-skin a lot of our creatures, so this isn't something that comes up often. But the Necropolis, Night at the Academy, Troubled Waters, etc all have hunting pressure. The loot that is being harvested from Reim that is affected by hunting pressure is what we call incidental loot. The true meat and potatoes of Reim was never the incidental loot. Now we certainly understand the area is being farmed heavily from organized groups, but from the design point of the area, this isn't something that was ever intended.
As for other things that act similar. We have bandits and Grimswarm who both are affected by levels 0 to 100. The difference being they are spread across multiple realms. Warcamps are excluded, since their loot (the supply chest) is done differently. Over 70% of all Reim entries are the daily Premium uses, so Reim has been balanced with that in mind. Hunting pressure also self monitors the situation as well. Loot, for example, resets a lot differently than perceived. There are a lot of factors at play, and it requires a lot of research on the player side. Not just with Reim, but just general game play. We use to have a larger community who participated in this area years ago.
Reim still has a lot going for it. A to-scale undead hunting area available all the time. Premium users can enjoy it for 2 hours a day. There are achievements, scrip, unique titles, boss battles with extra loot, puzzles, and plenty of extras that come along with the Reim energy and reputation system. The fact that we've had 6 months of uncapped loot gains in the area is being seen as a negative, but there has been a pretty large benefit to those who have been farming it so heavily. The current pressure drop isn't that severe, when you look at places like OTF and Nelemar. Asking to allow us to remove game balance and some of the core mechanics of the game aren't something we'll change though. Fixing a mistake with allowing a mistake isn't good game design.

[Taernath]

I am, however, saying that I don't believe GS is going to survive much longer in its current state.

People have been saying this for literal decades.

[GSIV Rogue]

Hmm...


The real game changer is Simutronics selling out to Stillfront Group. If you don't understand why, I'd suggest reading up on mergers and acquisitions.

[Taernath]

Just "stating facts".

[GSIV Rogue]

Just "stating facts".

While we're doing that, here are a few more:

https://www.simutronics.com/news/stillfront-acquires-majority-stake-in-simutronics

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/stillfront-group-ab-stillfront-increases-144602382.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mergers_and_acquisitions

[BriarFox]

This guy is a weird and unfunny troll. Two thumbs down.

[Mobius1]

So then the game is being supported by a small number of people who are willing to spend big $$$ - and has alienated or run off new and old players who are not? I'll concede the point that there are people who have done what I asked - even though I haven't met them, they aren't playing right now, or haven't appeared here.

GSIII is not part of my criteria for many reasons - chiefly because for all of its experience and leveling advantages - GSIV is even less inclusive to people who don't spend a lot of $$$.

I have sold off, over time, any assets and previous characters I acquired or created in GSIII or GSIV in the past 2 decades - the last of which was just over a month ago. All said and done, I made back 2 times what I spent on GS in the past 5 years. I've watched the game degenerate into its current state, and kept up as the company got sold and added to an asset class of a large corporation that can be restructured at any time.

With nothing invested and nothing to lose, I rolled up a F2P character and got him to 21 (Eleftheros) without using Simucoins of any kind - before subscribing at the basic level. If I was a new player, without a mastery of mechanics, and ability to navigate the game - I'd have quit based on the impression I got from that experience. After thinking on it - I decided that I am ultimately ok with losing $14.95 a month when the game disappears.

I'm not knocking anyone who does whatever makes them happy so long as it doesn't infringe upon others - if you enjoy spending a lot of money on your hobbies, gaming, Gemstone - whatever - then more power to you. I am, however, saying that I don't believe GS is going to survive much longer in its current state. The real game changer is Simutronics selling out to Stillfront Group. If you don't understand why, I'd suggest reading up on mergers and acquisitions.

Hey, I'm usually the first to decry the issues with Simu and the Stillfront acquisition, and how the pay2win is killing the game.

Simu has fallen to the worst depths of greed, with essentially no morality, as far as I am concerned, preying on the worst part of the human psyche, to get people to literally spend thousands of dollars on the game.

Hell, I felt it was immoral back when I started in the 90's, thus my boycott of pay events.

But even so, GS isn't anywhere near dead. Thankfully, the only reason why their immoral greed hasn't sunk the ship, is because as I said earlier - the PvE system is stupid anyways, and there is no real balance, so it's easy to keep the wheels turning. They may be square wheels, but they still work, lol.

My best encouragement to anyone, is to focus less on completing PvE challenges, and more on making friendships, roleplaying, and making your character more unique. Otherwise you'll probably just burn yourself out.

As for GS3 being less challenging that GS4? Like the others here, I just have to disagree. It admittedly took me a while to adjust to symbol of dreams changing, but the game has come quite a ways since then, giving you access to more skills/spells/items/XP. Don't forget gift of Lumnis, either. Plus if you really want to push things, you can get +LOG enhancives (and all manner of enhancives to make combat easier.). There's the mobile smithy, and so on. I could probably list 1000 things that have improved over GS3 if I really wanted to think about it.

I got very far in GS3 with Voln Fu (Undead gap and all), so my 0-100 experience should sure as hell count. :D

[GSIV Rogue]

Hey, I'm usually the first to decry the issues with Simu and the Stillfront acquisition, and how the pay2win is killing the game.

Simu has fallen to the worst depths of greed, with essentially no morality, as far as I am concerned, preying on the worst part of the human psyche, to get people to literally spend thousands of dollars on the game.

Hell, I felt it was immoral back when I started in the 90's, thus my boycott of pay events.

But even so, GS isn't anywhere near dead. Thankfully, the only reason why their immoral greed hasn't sunk the ship, is because as I said earlier - the PvE system is stupid anyways, and there is no real balance, so it's easy to keep the wheels turning. They may be square wheels, but they still work, lol.

My best encouragement to anyone, is to focus less on completing PvE challenges, and more on making friendships, roleplaying, and making your character more unique. Otherwise you'll probably just burn yourself out.

As for GS3 being less challenging that GS4? Like the others here, I just have to disagree. It admittedly took me a while to adjust to symbol of dreams changing, but the game has come quite a ways since then, giving you access to more skills/spells/items/XP. Don't forget gift of Lumnis, either. Plus if you really want to push things, you can get +LOG enhancives (and all manner of enhancives to make combat easier.). There's the mobile smithy, and so on. I could probably list 1000 things that have improved over GS3 if I really wanted to think about it.

I got very far in GS3 with Voln Fu (Undead gap and all), so my 0-100 experience should sure as hell count. :D


I agree with almost 100% of this post. The main thing I disagree with is that I believe Gemstone is on its death bed. It doesn't make me happy to say so (I actually hope I'm wrong!), but I have to look at the facts. It's not a question of morality (although they are *extremely* immoral) - it's just bad business for years that will eventually do them in.

I have 1 really good friend here who I enjoy communicating with (most others have left or rarely play), without that - and just the sheer challenge of going from 0-100 with crappy gear and no outside spells - I'd probably quit.

The main thing I feel makes GSIV more challenging than GSIII is that, because of how self-sufficient almost everyone has become with their own private army of alts, super gear, paying persons charging cash and in game silver for spell-ups, etc. - there's a lot less need to interact - so although there are a myriad of new in game systems, huge advantages to absorbing experience, and many more viable training paths - it's a lot tougher to develop those friendships and hunting partnerships with people for those who are just trying to play the game with 1 character. As you said before - the per capita player base of GSIV is almost exclusively made up of people who are premium / spend a lot of $$$ - so they just don't need the help. As a F2P person, or basic subscriber with 1 character - there is a huge feeling of just being completely left out in the cold. As I stated before, had I been a new player in 2019, I'd have quit after my first impression of the game after 1-2 months. I emphatically believe that Simutronics / Stillfront Group is doing absolutely nothing to attract new customers to GSIV - which is a tremendous problem for the game. I also don't think that they care, since it appears that their attention is diverted elsewhere in terms of their overall business development strategy. A wise businessman once told me many years ago - "You're either growing, or you're dying - it's impossible to remain the same (referring to business). I've found this time and again to be true.

I will also agree that making it very far with Voln Fu in GSIII is/was very impressive.

[Fierna]

I agree with almost 100% of this post. The main thing I disagree with is that I believe Gemstone is on its death bed. It doesn't make me happy to say so (I actually hope I'm wrong!), but I have to look at the facts. It's not a question of morality (although they are *extremely* immoral) - it's just bad business for years that will eventually do them in.

I have 1 really good friend here who I enjoy communicating with (most others have left or rarely play), without that - and just the sheer challenge of going from 0-100 with crappy gear and no outside spells - I'd probably quit.

The main thing I feel makes GSIV more challenging than GSIII is that, because of how self-sufficient almost everyone has become with their own private army of alts, super gear, paying persons charging cash and in game silver for spell-ups, etc. - there's a lot less need to interact - so although there are a myriad of new in game systems, huge advantages to absorbing experience, and many more viable training paths - it's a lot tougher to develop those friendships and hunting partnerships with people for those who are just trying to play the game with 1 character. As you said before - the per capita player base of GSIV is almost exclusively made up of people who are premium / spend a lot of $$$ - so they just don't need the help. As a F2P person, or basic subscriber with 1 character - there is a huge feeling of just being completely left out in the cold. As I stated before, had I been a new player in 2019, I'd have quit after my first impression of the game after 1-2 months. I emphatically believe that Simutronics / Stillfront Group is doing absolutely nothing to attract new customers to GSIV - which is a tremendous problem for the game. I also don't think that they care, since it appears that their attention is diverted elsewhere in terms of their overall business development strategy. A wise businessman once told me many years ago - "You're either growing, or you're dying - it's impossible to remain the same (referring to business). I've found this time and again to be true.

I will also agree that making it very far with Voln Fu in GSIII is/was very impressive.

The problem here is if they make the game any easier to get to 100 they will invariably have to make actual endgame content which is not profitable for them. It just gets the volunteer staff to move away from Pay Fests like Dusk and Ebon and into something more labor intensive like endgame raids or whatever the endgame in Gemstone may look like if it existed.

Here’s my prediction, I don’t think GemStone will ever truly die. I think what will eventually get it in the end though is corporate mismanagement on StillFront’s end which will ultimately lead it to sell off parts of their business leaving Simu in a bind. I also think half the revenue of Gemstone comes from 4 or 5 players.

[Realk]

rofl at 4-5 players.. some spend quite a bit more than others, but the player base isn't nearly as small as the sky is falling crowd makes it out to be.

[GSIV Rogue]

The problem here is if they make the game any easier to get to 100 they will invariably have to make actual endgame content which is not profitable for them. It just gets the volunteer staff to move away from Pay Fests like Dusk and Ebon and into something more labor intensive like endgame raids or whatever the endgame in Gemstone may look like if it existed.

Here’s my prediction, I don’t think GemStone will ever truly die. I think what will eventually get it in the end though is corporate mismanagement on StillFront’s end which will ultimately lead it to sell off parts of their business leaving Simu in a bind. I also think half the revenue of Gemstone comes from 4 or 5 players.

It's difficult to say with 100% accuracy one way or the other without being on the inside. Like Gordon Gekko said in Wall Street, "I don't throw darts at a board. I bet on sure things."

[Realk]

This is where your theory is going a little bit wonky, even at 15$$ a month or even 40$$ a month that's not a significant amount of income for most people. The time value maybe, ROI I could see that too. However very few successful people with disposable income count on that for their "hobbies".
I know many people who don't cancel their accounts simply cause they might get 20 minutes 2-3 months down the road and want to go play around. It's not a huge investment, I don't understand why you act like you are planning retirement over the price of if you get to watch a hulu show this month.

[Gelston]

I hope that the game sticks around for awhile longer - but I'm just not willing to gamble more than $14.95 a month on it.

Jesus fucking Christ, then don't. The game is doing better now than it was 10 years ago. It has dumbass pay mechanics but you don't need to pay shit to have the same classic experience.

[Ricer]

Jesus fucking Christ, then don't. The game is doing better now than it was 10 years ago. It has dumbass pay mechanics but you don't need to pay shit to have the same classic experience.

I'm honestly confused about how this thread is still taken seriously. This guy is just self indulging at this point.

[GSIV Rogue]

Some people place a higher value on their time than others.

[Realk]

Some people place a higher value on their time than others. Incidentally, I've been planning my retirement since I was a teenager - I'll be doing that likely sometime next year at the age of 37. When I budget, I try to do so down to the penny if at all possible. I also don't pay for Hulu or Netflix - opting instead to watch streaming movies for free online if I'm so inclined. Every little bit helps. ;)


So we have cheap and stupid, you'd rather spend your time working slower and harder on f2p but obviously have the time to spend doing it..(and value your time just as much) odd. Yet you have enough time to have the finances of Simu/Stillfront ready and waiting. We've made many a thread about cutting the cord.. but to say that you aren't going to invest 15.-- because your time is valuable.. I'll straight up call you a joke.

[Gelston]

Thanks for the advice, I appreciate your time - though I suppose "better" is subjective in this case.

You're a fucking trolling idiot, Scintilon. Fuck off.

[GSIV Rogue]

To each their own.

[Taernath]

You're a fucking trolling idiot, Scintilon. Fuck off.

lol is this Scintillon?

[GSIV Rogue]

lol is this Scintillon?

I am the player of the original Scintillion.

[Gelston]

lol is this Scintillon?

Yep

[Ricer]

I wasn't around here when this Scintillon was, but I can smell horse shit and this guy reeks

[Taernath]

Yep

Everything makes sense now.

[GSIV Rogue]

You know who I am - but I've never heard of any of you.

Current player of: Eleftheros

Who are you all?

[Realk]

Ryan if you'd like to continue this conversation I think the best idea is to move it out of this OP's thread and start your own.

[Murrandii]

I'll repeat my old rhetoric:

As long as you acknowledge the state of the game, you're fine to return and play without being mucho frustration.

And that implies

1) P2W is highly encouraged. You don't need it to "win" at gemstone, but this game is not about skill, it's about mechanics, formulas. So the more you enhance your stats or skills, the more you're "stronger". And to achieve such strength in gemstone is tied with p2w UNLESS you're a veteran that can minmax everything (i.e. take a cheap perfect weapon and build it with silvers to become 7x t5 and add weight after and so on).

2) You got a paradoxe with RP and p2w: The purists crap on scripts that are killing the RP while simu is allowing EVERYTHING to be taken from simustore. Why seek a cleric when you die when you can rub it for 1$. Why seek spells when there's spell up pills. Et cetera.

3) Veterans Multi-accounts. Why? Self reliance. Why is it important? Cause in the end, you save time and time is money.

4) 2019 in gaming industry is about time. Time time time. We all know business models are aimed to install rigid wall in gaming and shine that little bypass for a low cost. Gemstone is perfectly aligned with that philosophy being a VERY grinding game.

5) Point 3 and 4 are perfectly in opposite and are, in my opinion, the reaction of players to Simu'S p2w from a lot of veterans: You want to milk us? Fine, try while I play by my "rules" ---> People sells assets for money, silvers and so on, buy stuff, profit, invest, increase their cash and so on.

6) As long as players care and do point 5, game is alive. When those key players will stop, the game is DEAD (dead like dragonrealms, just an empty shell).

[Wrathbringer]

I'm a weird and unfunny troll with two thumbs up my butthole.

This is correct.

[Wrathbringer]

I'll repeat my old rhetoric:

As long as you acknowledge the state of the game, you're fine to return and play without being mucho frustration.

And that implies

1) P2W is highly encouraged. You don't need it to "win" at gemstone, but this game is not about skill, it's about mechanics, formulas. So the more you enhance your stats or skills, the more you're "stronger". And to achieve such strength in gemstone is tied with p2w UNLESS you're a veteran that can minmax everything (i.e. take a cheap perfect weapon and build it with silvers to become 7x t5 and add weight after and so on).

2) You got a paradoxe with RP and p2w: The purists crap on scripts that are killing the RP while simu is allowing EVERYTHING to be taken from simustore. Why seek a cleric when you die when you can rub it for 1$. Why seek spells when there's spell up pills. Et cetera.

3) Veterans Multi-accounts. Why? Self reliance. Why is it important? Cause in the end, you save time and time is money.

4) 2019 in gaming industry is about time. Time time time. We all know business models are aimed to install rigid wall in gaming and shine that little bypass for a low cost. Gemstone is perfectly aligned with that philosophy being a VERY grinding game.

5) Point 3 and 4 are perfectly in opposite and are, in my opinion, the reaction of players to Simu'S p2w from a lot of veterans: You want to milk us? Fine, try while I play by my "rules" ---> People sells assets for money, silvers and so on, buy stuff, profit, invest, increase their cash and so on.

6) As long as players care and do point 5, game is alive. When those key players will stop, the game is DEAD (dead like dragonrealms, just an empty shell).

You're retarded, bro macgyver.

[GSIV Rogue]

I'll repeat my old rhetoric:

As long as you acknowledge the state of the game, you're fine to return and play without being mucho frustration.

And that implies

1) P2W is highly encouraged. You don't need it to "win" at gemstone, but this game is not about skill, it's about mechanics, formulas. So the more you enhance your stats or skills, the more you're "stronger". And to achieve such strength in gemstone is tied with p2w UNLESS you're a veteran that can minmax everything (i.e. take a cheap perfect weapon and build it with silvers to become 7x t5 and add weight after and so on).

2) You got a paradoxe with RP and p2w: The purists crap on scripts that are killing the RP while simu is allowing EVERYTHING to be taken from simustore. Why seek a cleric when you die when you can rub it for 1$. Why seek spells when there's spell up pills. Et cetera.

3) Veterans Multi-accounts. Why? Self reliance. Why is it important? Cause in the end, you save time and time is money.

4) 2019 in gaming industry is about time. Time time time. We all know business models are aimed to install rigid wall in gaming and shine that little bypass for a low cost. Gemstone is perfectly aligned with that philosophy being a VERY grinding game.

5) Point 3 and 4 are perfectly in opposite and are, in my opinion, the reaction of players to Simu'S p2w from a lot of veterans: You want to milk us? Fine, try while I play by my "rules" ---> People sells assets for money, silvers and so on, buy stuff, profit, invest, increase their cash and so on.

6) As long as players care and do point 5, game is alive. When those key players will stop, the game is DEAD (dead like dragonrealms, just an empty shell).

Very good post!

[Vishnell]

1) P2W is highly encouraged. You don't need it to "win" at gemstone, but this game is not about skill, it's about mechanics, formulas. So the more you enhance your stats or skills, the more you're "stronger". And to achieve such strength in gemstone is tied with p2w UNLESS you're a veteran that can minmax everything (i.e. take a cheap perfect weapon and build it with silvers to become 7x t5 and add weight after and so on).

I don't think you need to be a veteran to get decent gear. When i came back in 2017, i was level 50 with a 4x staff and 4x armor, and maybe 2 mil silvers. Vanilla and basic. By the time i capped 21 months later, i was able to get that same 4x armor up to 7x/T5 and added 160 services of crit padding (got 20 services most periods except maybe 2). I was able to upgrade to a 6x/6x nervestaff added T1 through T5 and have enough BS to get another acuity cert on it next DR. I've never bought silvers for $, I've been able to afford this all through silver i get directly from the game. It's not hard to get decent gear for a poor player. It's not uber 10x armor of a demon god, but it's great for me.


Sent from my LG-G710 using Tapatalk

[GSIV Rogue]

I don't think you need to be a veteran to get decent gear. When i came back in 2017, i was level 50 with a 4x staff and 4x armor, and maybe 2 mil silvers. Vanilla and basic. By the time i capped 21 months later, i was able to get that same 4x armor up to 7x/T5 and added 160 services of crit padding (got 20 services most periods except maybe 2). I was able to upgrade to a 6x/6x nervestaff added T1 through T5 and have enough BS to get another acuity cert on it next DR. I've never bought silvers for $, I've been able to afford this all through silver i get directly from the game. It's not hard to get decent gear for a poor player. It's not uber 10x armor of a demon god, but it's great for me.


Sent from my LG-G710 using Tapatalk

I believe when he says veteran he is just referring to a player who has been in the lands a long time and is able to figure out ways to utilize mechanics more easily.

[Methais]

I agree with almost 100% of this post. The main thing I disagree with is that I believe Gemstone is on its death bed. It doesn't make me happy to say so (I actually hope I'm wrong!), but I have to look at the facts. It's not a question of morality (although they are *extremely* immoral) - it's just bad business for years that will eventually do them in.

I have 1 really good friend here who I enjoy communicating with (most others have left or rarely play), without that - and just the sheer challenge of going from 0-100 with crappy gear and no outside spells - I'd probably quit.

The main thing I feel makes GSIV more challenging than GSIII is that, because of how self-sufficient almost everyone has become with their own private army of alts, super gear, paying persons charging cash and in game silver for spell-ups, etc. - there's a lot less need to interact - so although there are a myriad of new in game systems, huge advantages to absorbing experience, and many more viable training paths - it's a lot tougher to develop those friendships and hunting partnerships with people for those who are just trying to play the game with 1 character. As you said before - the per capita player base of GSIV is almost exclusively made up of people who are premium / spend a lot of $$$ - so they just don't need the help. As a F2P person, or basic subscriber with 1 character - there is a huge feeling of just being completely left out in the cold. As I stated before, had I been a new player in 2019, I'd have quit after my first impression of the game after 1-2 months. I emphatically believe that Simutronics / Stillfront Group is doing absolutely nothing to attract new customers to GSIV - which is a tremendous problem for the game. I also don't think that they care, since it appears that their attention is diverted elsewhere in terms of their overall business development strategy. A wise businessman once told me many years ago - "You're either growing, or you're dying - it's impossible to remain the same (referring to business). I've found this time and again to be true.

I will also agree that making it very far with Voln Fu in GSIII is/was very impressive.

GS won't die until the handful of whales that throw all their money at them die irl.

[Vishnell]

I agree with that. I was able to utilize PC to find customers for pricing/selling loot and my ensorcelling services. Also familiar enough with mechanics to max my skills/stats for optimal ensorcelling and juice accumulation for my play time (almost full necro cause i only have so many hours to play each week). Newer players may not be willing/able to use PC or decipher the wiki.

Sent from my LG-G710 using Tapatalk

[Fierna]

Some people place a higher value on their time than others. Incidentally, I've been planning my retirement since I was a teenager - I'll be doing that likely sometime next year at the age of 37. When I budget, I try to do so down to the penny if at all possible. I also don't pay for Hulu or Netflix - opting instead to watch streaming movies for free online if I'm so inclined. Every little bit helps. ;)

This is more of an aside and doesn’t really pertain to the main conversation. But I actually know people like you and as a mellenial what you’re doing is probably the correct thing to do. Boomers don’t have a clue how unimaginably rocky the road is now and going forward and thus 15 or 40 bucks a month is trivial to them but for us it’s not so much. And a lot us are absolutely blind to this fact. What with a roaring economy and our paper mill degrees a good chunk of us have this invincibility mentality and waste money with little thought.

But for us saving every penny is crucial, even 15 bucks a month is another 180 dollars a year that could be used to generate passive income, it sounds miserly even banal but it does WORK! I’ve two good friends who’ve both retired on passive income by 40. One is starting her dream career as a writer and another is traveling through Asia making websites, traveling, and learning how to cook cultural dishes. I couldn’t do what they did. :(

*Also, you have to realize there are a lot of people here that don’t spend a single cent for their premium or basic accounts. They may even make a profit off the game after the costs for an account(s). They mostly sell silvers for RL money.

[Methais]

Thanks for the advice, I appreciate your time - though I suppose "better" is subjective in this case.

GS was better before you got Haste and wasp nests nerfed by having Darckwizard following you around Teras 24/7 keeping you permahasted back when you could have 0 RT while you bragged about how much fame you were getting like it was some skill based accomplishment. :lol:

[Neveragain]

another is traveling through Asia making websites, traveling, and learning how to cook cultural dishes.

I didn't realize that there were any deeply hidden secrets to cooking dog. :shrug:

[Methais]

So we have cheap and stupid, you'd rather spend your time working slower and harder on f2p but obviously have the time to spend doing it..(and value your time just as much) odd. Yet you have enough time to have the finances of Simu/Stillfront ready and waiting. We've made many a thread about cutting the cord.. but to say that you aren't going to invest 15.-- because your time is valuable.. I'll straight up call you a joke.

https://i.imgur.com/Wl0PSXU.png


Pardon me folks, but you seem to have me at a disadvantage. You know who I am - but I've never heard of any of you.

Sure you have.


I believe when he says veteran he is just referring to a player who has been in the lands a long time and is able to figure out ways to utilize mechanics more easily. I agree that you can grind silvers out of the game and upgrade your gear over time. It's one reason why this time around I chose to play a pure ranger - killing very quickly at higher levels leads to massive silver generation (I prefer to just sell silver for $$$ vs. upgrading gear, though). However, I'm just not sure that a brand new player would have the fortitude to do the same with a basic account - the sheer amount of information and misinformation out there is overwhelming, and I believe the gaming environment / PC boards can feel quite hostile and isolated at times for someone just starting out.

Good luck doing that with a F2P account and its nerfed treasure and cancerous exp rate. The time saved, especially if your plan is to sell silvers, is worth a lot more than that $15 a month you're unwilling to spend. Basic math will back this up because again...

https://i.imgur.com/Wl0PSXU.png


However, I'm just not sure that a brand new player would have the fortitude to do the same with a basic account

Since you still seem to think that Basic vs. Premium makes a difference with leveling up or treasure generation, please list the specific advantages you get with a Premium account over a Basic account in this regard.

[malmuddy]

I can confirm the increased treasure generation on a premium account. I just did a kobold hunt on my basic account and pulled in 800 silvers in coins and gems. I then did a similar kobold hunt on my premium account, and pulled a 10x T5 sigil staff with rotflares, 9x ECP T4 Voln full leathers, and about 2.4M in silver and gems (I lost count after selling my thirtieth uncut diamond). Totally worth that extra $25 a month.

[Methais]

I can confirm the increased treasure generation on a premium account. I just did a kobold hunt on my basic account and pulled in 800 silvers in coins and gems. I then did a similar kobold hunt on my premium account, and pulled a 10x T5 sigil staff with rotflares, 9x ECP T4 Voln full leathers, and about 2.4M in silver and gems (I lost count after selling my thirtieth uncut diamond). Totally worth that extra $25 a month.

https://media1.giphy.com/media/ToMjGpnXBTw7vnokxhu/source.gif

[Fortybox]

I'll repeat my old rhetoric:

As long as you acknowledge the state of the game, you're fine to return and play without being mucho frustration.

And that implies

1) P2W is highly encouraged. You don't need it to "win" at gemstone, but this game is not about skill, it's about mechanics, formulas. So the more you enhance your stats or skills, the more you're "stronger". And to achieve such strength in gemstone is tied with p2w UNLESS you're a veteran that can minmax everything (i.e. take a cheap perfect weapon and build it with silvers to become 7x t5 and add weight after and so on).

2) You got a paradoxe with RP and p2w: The purists crap on scripts that are killing the RP while simu is allowing EVERYTHING to be taken from simustore. Why seek a cleric when you die when you can rub it for 1$. Why seek spells when there's spell up pills. Et cetera.

3) Veterans Multi-accounts. Why? Self reliance. Why is it important? Cause in the end, you save time and time is money.

4) 2019 in gaming industry is about time. Time time time. We all know business models are aimed to install rigid wall in gaming and shine that little bypass for a low cost. Gemstone is perfectly aligned with that philosophy being a VERY grinding game.

5) Point 3 and 4 are perfectly in opposite and are, in my opinion, the reaction of players to Simu'S p2w from a lot of veterans: You want to milk us? Fine, try while I play by my "rules" ---> People sells assets for money, silvers and so on, buy stuff, profit, invest, increase their cash and so on.

6) As long as players care and do point 5, game is alive. When those key players will stop, the game is DEAD (dead like dragonrealms, just an empty shell).

You’re just mad that Simu is doing what you want. And what do you want? You want to monetize off of a game.

Simu should step up its game and shrink the secondary market as much as possible. People like macguyver here would go away and the game would be better for all.

[Fortybox]

PC is not a great place to discuss whether people like or don't like Gemstone. This site has sadly degraded into a complaint forum where people snipe at each other for various reasons, particularly this issue.

And FYI - you were still buying/selling in late 2012 according to your PC posts.

That said, I share some of your views from that time period and had those concerns when I returned to game a few months after a few years break myself. I am pleasantly surprised to find the community in good shape, the game quite active, and the staff more attentive and engaged than I've seen in decades. I feel proud of the game and my involvement in it.

I really love that one commentor mentioned and others echoed that you can do what you want in Gemstone, make it your own experience. That is absolutely accurate. GSWiki, Towncrier, and Discord have opened up doors to learning tips and tricks for playing that were quite challenging in the past. I'm realizing more than ever how deeply enriching this game can be and the idea of being able to continue learning inspires me to play and immerse all the more.

I do hope you've taken an opportunity to join the GS community Discord server and engage people who are actively playing. If you're looking for community or have any questions, reach out directly and let's find the right fit for you!

Best of luck, JaTrRm.

~ Leifa Ar'Anya Faendryl (IG)
discord - Leifa#5351

The PC is one of the few places people can get an honest, straight up answer about the game without Wyrom controlling the narrative. Plenty of people also actively play on PC as well.

Discord is NOT the place to have any balanced dialogue, again because Simu controls it. Simu also removed balanced feedback from its forum a couple years ago as well.

[Methais]

The PC is one of the few places people can get an honest, straight up answer about the game without Wyrom controlling the narrative. Plenty of people also actively play on PC as well.

Discord is NOT the place to have any balanced dialogue, again because Simu controls it. Simu also removed balanced feedback from its forum a couple years ago as well.

This is correct.

[Fortybox]

[Dreavening]-GSIV:Dreaven: "I like money, you like spells, let's make each other happy: please consider becoming a patron to help fund these amazing services. https://www.patreon.com/LordDreaven"
[Dreavening]-GSIV:Dreaven: "If you prefer to make a one time payment with PAYPAL send me a private message to discuss what tier you would like to receive and for how many months."
[Dreavening]-GSIV:Dreaven: "In order to keep Dreavenings around forever I'm thinking of charging a small fee for non-patrons, like 20k per spellup, free to whatever tier patron I'll think about. What you all think? Good idea? Bad idea? Gonna be the end of Dreavenings as we know it?"
[Dreavening]-GSIV:Dreaven: "Okay, I've read all of the feedback and I think I'll go to my original idea of free scheduled Dreavenings with extra Dreavenings having a fee."

I simply stated a fact.

The fact is Dreaven routinely offers free spell ups to anyone multiple times a day. He asks for donations but it is not a requirement. During prime time playing, most players can stay spelled up all evening simply because of his free services. As a result, one could argue Dreaven is helping with retention efforts for this game.

Perhaps if you’d stop bleaching your teeth and trim your eyebrows you’d notice that instead of painting him in the bad light you did.

[Methais]

[Dreavening]-GSIV:Dreaven: "I like money, you like spells, let's make each other happy: please consider becoming a patron to help fund these amazing services. https://www.patreon.com/LordDreaven"
[Dreavening]-GSIV:Dreaven: "If you prefer to make a one time payment with PAYPAL send me a private message to discuss what tier you would like to receive and for how many months."
[Dreavening]-GSIV:Dreaven: "In order to keep Dreavenings around forever I'm thinking of charging a small fee for non-patrons, like 20k per spellup, free to whatever tier patron I'll think about. What you all think? Good idea? Bad idea? Gonna be the end of Dreavenings as we know it?"
[Dreavening]-GSIV:Dreaven: "Okay, I've read all of the feedback and I think I'll go to my original idea of free scheduled Dreavenings with extra Dreavenings having a fee."

I simply stated a fact.

OH NO HE'S THINKING ABOUT CHARGING 20K SILVERS FOR A SPELLUP WHICH HAPPENS TO BE THE GOING RATE FOR JUST WIZARD SPELLUPS FOR YEARS NOW OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG

Dreaven will still spell anyone up for free regardless, and he does more for the community than most people have in GS history, which is a lot more than just spellups.

[Gelston]

OH NO HE'S THINKING ABOUT CHARGING 20K SILVERS FOR A SPELLUP WHICH HAPPENS TO BE THE GOING RATE FOR JUST WIZARD SPELLUPS FOR YEARS NOW OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG

And you get like, every possible spell too, not just weakass wizard bullshit.

[Methais]

And you get like, every possible spell too, not just weakass wizard bullshit.

If you factor in the deed money saved from not getting pwned, it pays for itself!!!!!!!!!!!11111

[GSIV Rogue]

Methais - I never heard of you until you made it onto the fame list.

[Taernath]

Just who is this Methais anyway? He must be nouveau famous. How droll.

[Methais]

Incidentally, I never heard of you until you made it onto the fame list. I believe the wizard you were referring to was Crazyfinger. He wasn't mine - I hunted and leveled him for a friend in exchange for getting access to the character. As to my fame, I was pretty proud of being able to hit 1 billion fame in GSIII prior to level 50 (something I still believe was never duplicated)- even after people had been haste/fame hunting wasp nest years before I was doing it. Also, I converted my F2P account to basic a few weeks back as I stated earlier.

IIRC I was on the fame list before you even showed up. Was near the bottom, but still on it. :lol:


Crazyfinger

Close enough.


As to my fame, I was pretty proud of being able to hit 1 billion fame in GSIII prior to level 50 (something I still believe was never duplicated)- even after people had been haste/fame hunting wasp nest years before I was doing it.

I once used a Game Genie to beat Battletoads. It was cool that I beat Battletoads, but I still used a Game Genie.

Most people didn't fame hunt wasps. They'd go fry in like 10 seconds and then go to town to rest because fame is useless as fuck.

I'm currently at the top (I'd be at 14 billion by now if they didn't nerf fame and critter fame values down to 10% years ago) and it's pretty worthless. It was cool when I hit 1b just because, but that's mostly due to running out of shit to do and needed a new goal.

Buff fame plz thx

[Methais]

Just who is this Methais anyway? He must be nouveau famous. How droll.

I heard he's the PM. And the head of dev but has been forced to recuse himself from all wizard development.

[Gelston]

I heard he's the PM. And the head of dev but has been forced to recuse himself from all wizard development.

He is a hick pig farmer from the South.

[Gelston]

I heard he's the PM. And the head of dev but has been forced to recuse himself from all wizard development.

He is a hick pig farmer from the South.

[Methais]

He is a hick pig farmer from the South.

Reported


He is a hick pig farmer from the South.

Reported 2x

[Fierna]

Methais, tell him how much you’re making off your silvers. I don’t think he undersrands the game can be played for absolutely free including all the bells and whistles like Premium and pay events, and then some.

[Methais]

Methais, tell him how much you’re making off your silvers. I don’t think he undersrands the game can be played for absolutely free including all the bells and whistles like Premium and pay events, and then some.

I think people already explained this to him. If not, I think you just did.

[GSIV Rogue]

Methais, tell him how much you’re making off your silvers. I don’t think he undersrands the game can be played for absolutely free including all the bells and whistles like Premium and pay events, and then some.

I understand how the game works. I've been playing the game since 1998. I apologize if I didn't make this clear.

[Fortybox]

Fortybox - thanks for noticing my teeth and eyebrows, that's the second time you've commented on them. I appreciate the advice. Also, it wasn't my intention to paint anyone in any light specifically - merely pointing out some observations.

Any observer would see that Dreaven's services primarily service a base through free methods but I'm pretty sure your "observations" were obstructed by your eyebrows and massive glare from your teeth.

[Fortybox]

OH NO HE'S THINKING ABOUT CHARGING 20K SILVERS FOR A SPELLUP WHICH HAPPENS TO BE THE GOING RATE FOR JUST WIZARD SPELLUPS FOR YEARS NOW OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG

Dreaven will still spell anyone up for free regardless, and he does more for the community than most people, including Simu dev, have in GS history, which is a lot more than just spellups.

FTFY

[Tgo01]

Also just to clarify I don't spell people up "at anytime." Extra Dreavenings are just fee based Dreavenings inbetween the regular free Dreavenings.

There is a perk on my Patreon to be spelled up at anytime (well as I specify on my Patreon page: "anytime" being anytime I happen to be at my computer) but that's like 5 anytime Dreavenings per month.

[GSIV Rogue]

Thanks for clarifying. Sorry for any confusion.

[Fortybox]

It's quite possible. I told the dentist I wanted my teeth to blind the haters.

You need a new dentist...and a Gilette eyebrow trimmer.

[Fierna]

Among other things it has been my contention that the game is no longer worth having any significant money invested into it at any given time - I apologize if I didn't make this clear.

Explain further.

Do you see an imminent collapse in Gemstone items or silvers? Or do you mean more on entertainment value in general? or other?

[Hightower]

IIRC I was on the fame list before you even showed up. Was near the bottom, but still on it. :lol:



Close enough.



I once used a Game Genie to beat Battletoads. It was cool that I beat Battletoads, but I still used a Game Genie.

Most people didn't fame hunt wasps. They'd go fry in like 10 seconds and then go to town to rest because fame is useless as fuck.

I'm currently at the top (I'd be at 14 billion by now if they didn't nerf fame and critter fame values down to 10% years ago) and it's pretty worthless. It was cool when I hit 1b just because, but that's mostly due to running out of shit to do and needed a new goal.

Buff fame plz thx

I'm pretty sure the designers of that game (Battle Toads) were thinking: "Let's design a game that is fun, hilarious, and all-around awesome, but make it completely impossible to beat without cheating!"

Even with game genie there was at least one level I never completed! And you'd have to be some kind of freak to get through it on 3 lives and no cheats!

~Taverkin

[GSIV Rogue]

Winning is winning. I saw an opportunity (without paying for it) and took advantage of it. The fame list is a high score list and provides no mechanical value.

[Methais]

Also just to clarify I don't spell people up "at anytime." Extra Dreavenings are just fee based Dreavenings inbetween the regular free Dreavenings.

There is a perk on my Patreon to be spelled up at anytime (well as I specify on my Patreon page: "anytime" being anytime I happen to be at my computer) but that's like 5 anytime Dreavenings per month.

Fuck that, step out of the line for X ride on your Disney vacation and SPELL ME UP RIGHT NOWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Murrandii]

You’re just mad that Simu is doing what you want. And what do you want? You want to monetize off of a game.

Simu should step up its game and shrink the secondary market as much as possible. People like macguyver here would go away and the game would be better for all.

I pretty much enjoy the game more the less I have interaction with people like you on lnet in fact.

What I want or not is irrelevant here. Your opinion doesn't matter too.

People like Methais, Zaoloo, Nuad, Ryjex, Goat, Yfirup and me are playing this game with its rules to advantage our own agenda. Remove the secondary market and you pretty much make this game an empty shell like dragonrealms. Whether I agree with any of these individuals or not, the way they do their merchanting, their control or not of the market has NOTHING to do with it.

We are keeping this game alive.

Saying otherwise is being a simu fanboy.

[Methais]

Winning is winning.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/content/dam/cycling/2017/06/30/TELEMMGLPICT000001956961_trans_NvBQzQNjv4Bqp-SFu3xIvvexbcb9BaXwmzEPzs0gYSbkgl7gtjwm7tI.jpeg?imw idth=450


I saw an opportunity (without paying for it) and took advantage of it. The fame list is a high score list and provides no mechanical value - you are correct.

It's a fun personal goal, sure. I always wished they gave it some sort of meaning or reward, way before I ever made it onto the list.


Hard to compare GSIII to GSIV fame - even though I used a haste wizard I did it all 100% manually with macros only, plus, since I didn't pay for the wizard - I had to hunt him for someone else in a completely different area (also manually).

Well yeah, GS3 was a lot "harder." But let's be real, GS3 and GS4 are both easy as fuck unless you're literally brain dead, scripts or no scripts.


and finally - hunting or underhunting the same thing over and over again (on a script) while continuing to get more skills for their character - while staying at the same level

If you're talking about GS3, doing this was impossible unless there was some bug I never heard of that was being exploited, since you only gained TPs when you'd level up, and you couldn't gain skills without TPs. If you're talking about GS4, then this is also impossible, since even with max death sting, you'll just level slower but you can't force yourself to stay at a certain level unless you just don't do anything that gives exp.


Congrats for being at the top currently. ;)

Hot chicks swarm me everywhere I go now ever since I hit 1b, begging for my righteous seed.

[GSIV Rogue]

GS3 was a lot "harder."

For some of us the game is easier than others.

What I was referring to is the level cap in GSIV. At level 100, your character still gains the same amount of exp. and fame (provided you are hunting the same things), while continuing to gain skills to make hunting easier.

[Fortybox]

I pretty much enjoy the game more the less I have interaction with people like you on lnet in fact.

What I want or not is irrelevant here. Your opinion doesn't matter too.

People like Methais, Zaoloo, Nuad, Ryjex, Goat, Yfirup and me are playing this game with its rules to advantage our own agenda. Remove the secondary market and you pretty much make this game an empty shell like dragonrealms. Whether I agree with any of these individuals or not, the way they do their merchanting, their control or not of the market has NOTHING to do with it.

We are keeping this game alive.

Saying otherwise is being a simu fanboy.

You're wrong as usual (not surprised). You are not special and most certainly not keeping this game alive.

The reality is you are monetizing off of the game with really low returns. You could work at McDonald's with a better paycheck than what you're making playing this game all day long while supposedly being a remote-based "business analyst" :lol:.

Simu should ramp up efforts to centralize the transactions. It would be entertaining watching you freak out (like you did when Goat cornered the market) because you're so invested in protecting crumbs relative to what you could do if you got up out of your chair and had a real job.

[Murrandii]

You're wrong as usual (not surprised). You are not special and most certainly not keeping this game alive.

The reality is you are monetizing off of the game with really low returns. You could work at McDonald's with a better paycheck than what you're making playing this game all day long while supposedly being a remote-based "business analyst" :lol:.

Simu should ramp up efforts to centralize the transactions. It would be entertaining watching you freak out (like you did when Goat cornered the market) because you're so invested in protecting crumbs relative to what you could do if you got up out of your chair and had a real job.

We heard you, fake chief of departement (LOL), father of 5 kids (LOLOLOL) with 1 or 2 master degree (LOLILOLILOLILOLI). How about you having a wife (LOLLOLOLOL)?

The reality that pisses you off is you KNOW I do the same as your idol Methais (that you mimic everytime you can), yet you only troll those controversial (like nuad and me) because you can have support from other losers like you, you poor piss vinegar frustrated little boy. You always like to crap on others instead of trying to increase value in this game, for the community, for others. I started the bro fad and it was fun, yet, you joined only to crap on it whenever you can. You're so negative man YET I tried to be friendly with you. You crapped on me, I acted as if it was "friendly" and you kept on continuing. I even created a little voln guide to path to give you credit, I named you my second in command and so on in the bro fad moments. You just keep on crapping. I started to ignore you to avoid further escalation and BANG, you are starting AGAIN the macguyver stupidity. And you claim to be a chief of departement, father of 5 kids, LOL.

Whatever.

We (dedicated merchants) are keeping this game alive because

1) Secondary market creates secondary offers and demands
2) Secondary market make the pill (high $$$ to play this game) easier to swallow since you can "even" it out. Unregular merchants like Peam does it as well for sporadic reasons I just gave
3) Secondary market is, in my opinion, aligned with ;lich with a player-BASED "control" on the game that FORCES Simu to be careful with their dev. I throw Dreaven in that point as well. That point is critical in my analysis:
i. As long as players keep some control in this game, they'll be able to operate outside of the Simustore market
ii. As long as players care, game will flourish from INSIDE. People care = people finds more ways to increase value = benefits for the game and simu
iii. As long as players do so, they'll create alts, creating needs for more gear = secondary market ++++

[Methais]

LOL - heh. Well, I'll take it, but the powers that be at the time nerfing wasp nests *AND* haste seemed a little bit overblown - since nothing I was doing was against any rule (Unlike LA), and wasn't hurting anyone. Making it to the top of a high score list with no value or reward other than bragging rights hardly hindered anyone's ability to play the game.

Simu doesn't like when people have fun. See the Elemental Lore Review from 2015.


Surely the hot chicks swarming you everywhere you go begging for your seed is a reward in itself.

Well yeah, but I meant something in game. Like text sluts swarming me every time I walk into Helga's or something.


What I was referring to is the level cap in GSIV. At level 100, your character still gains the same amount of exp. and fame (provided you are hunting the same things), while continuing to gain skills to make hunting easier.

End game issues plague every MMO. The difference with GS is Simu does literally nothing meaningful about it, unless you consider P2W snail's pace gear progression as end game that will usually require years and thousands of dollars to max out one item. People have been screaming for a post-cap reward system for years, but Simu is too busy working on new ways to rip off the mental illness crowd in the P2W market.


To duplicate a similar effect in GSIII you'd have to literally die and decay to stay the same level (however you'd lose out on exp. and hunting would never get easier). Now you get fame, exp., and more skills to boot - for continuing to hunt the same mobs over and over again ad nauseam.

You're not actually gaining exp though. When you decay in GS3 you lose 10k exp, so you're really just earning that back. You're still not getting more skills either, because you keep losing exp and having to play catch up, and you only gain TPs in GS3 when you gain a level. You can still gain fame, sure, but you'll gain more fame by killing higher level stuff since fame values are based on the critter's level.

I'm pretty sure you could also just not check in at the inn when you're ready to level up instead of decaying and you'll stop gaining exp until you do check in, but the end result would still be the same.


The result is there's been a huge amount of fame (and exp.) gained during GSIV because capped characters are able to kill with greater speed and efficiency - but still gain the same amount of exp. / fame as when they first hit cap (from the same mobs).

There's been a huge amount of fame (and exp.) gained during GSIV because the game is 30 years old, and the GSIV conversion is now 16 years old. The game has been GS4 for longer than it was GS3 at this point.

This type of things tends to happen when a game originally designed for level 20 on a pay-per-hour setup is still around 3 decades later.


Think of a wizard with 8 mil exp. vs. Methais 40mil+. Although both should be able to hunt with great success at level 100, the extra exp. your wizard has will allow him to learn skills that make his ability to kill faster, hunt longer, etc. - greater. So, you should be able to gain fame, exp. and treasure faster and faster as you go along. Bottom line is, once you hit cap, the game just gets easier.

Past probably 12-15m exp or whatever it costs to max out your core skills (spells, EMC, AP, lores, etc.) most of the rest is useless stuff that will never get used unless you're just out fucking around, with some exceptions like MoC and Dodging, which at great to have, but not by any means necessary to be effective as a wizard.


Level: 328 Deeds: 12
Experience: 46481869 Death's Sting: None
Exp. to next TP: 631 Recent Deaths: 2
Physical TPs: 2852 Mana: 149/503 max
Mental TPs: 0 Fame: 1471873504
Exp to next: 20631

Methais (at level 100), your current skill bonuses and ranks (including all modifiers) are:
Skill Name | Current Current
| Bonus Ranks
Armor Use..........................| 70 15
Combat Maneuvers...................| 201 101
Ranged Weapons.....................| 201 101
Thrown Weapons.....................| 217 117
Polearm Weapons....................| 201 101
Brawling...........................| 201 101
Multi Opponent Combat..............| 201 101
Physical Fitness...................| 201 101
Dodging............................| 201 101
Arcane Symbols.....................| 302 202
Magic Item Use.....................| 302 202
Spell Aiming.......................| 302 202
Harness Power......................| 403 303
Elemental Mana Control.............| 302 202
Spirit Mana Control................| 70 15
Elemental Lore - Air...............| 187 87
Elemental Lore - Earth.............| 160 60
Elemental Lore - Fire..............| 90 20
Elemental Lore - Water.............| 130 35
Survival...........................| 201 101
Disarming Traps....................| 201 101
Picking Locks......................| 302 202
Stalking and Hiding................| 201 101
Perception.........................| 302 202
Climbing...........................| 201 101
Swimming...........................| 201 101
First Aid..........................| 302 202
Trading............................| 302 202
Pickpocketing......................| 201 101

Spell Lists
Major Elemental....................| 127

Spell Lists
Minor Elemental....................| 75

Spell Lists
Wizard.............................| 101


^ Looks cool at first, but in reality most of those skills will never get used for anything more than for just fucking around, if at all.


Back to point #3 where Simu does what they do best - and nerfs fame - rather than giving a reward for folks who have stuck it out and had the fortitude to continue to play and support the game.

I don't remember the specifics, but fame got nerfed due to some sort of technical reason. I remember Tarakan had super high fame and literally broke the fame list at around 3.5b IIRC (350m fame post nerf), and then the nerf wasn't very long after. The level cap was a technical issue too, because apparently if/when someone hit level 300 in GS3, the game would implode over some divide by 0 issue that I don't remember much else about.


TLDR: Simu needs to implement meaningful post-cap goals already.

[Mobius1]

The biggest problem is all the inflation from the silver sellers.

And he's not wrong - I had a small stint trying to sell silvers. I was making about 2 mil every 8 hours, and when I stopped and thought about how that's only 80 cents an hour, I realized how silly it was. I can see selling chunks of silvers if you just have it and don't need it. But farming it for cash seems like a waste of my time.

I don't know how much most people can make farming silvers, but I'd be very surprised if it was more than I was!

But I don't exactly see an easy fix for the problem. If Simu just straight up monetized silvers, would that solve anything? Or just put more money in Stillfront's pockets? At least the farmers mean a few more players being around, lol. I think some people can't even pay their subs without selling junk every month (Though honestly, these people would be better off not playing GS, and focusing on improving their life.).

[Fortybox]

We heard you, fake chief of departement (LOL), father of 5 kids (LOLOLOL) with 1 or 2 master degree (LOLILOLILOLILOLI). How about you having a wife (LOLLOLOLOL)?

The reality that pisses you off is you KNOW I do the same as your idol Methais (that you mimic everytime you can), yet you only troll those controversial (like nuad and me) because you can have support from other losers like you, you poor piss vinegar frustrated little boy. You always like to crap on others instead of trying to increase value in this game, for the community, for others. I started the bro fad and it was fun, yet, you joined only to crap on it whenever you can. You're so negative man YET I tried to be friendly with you. You crapped on me, I acted as if it was "friendly" and you kept on continuing. I even created a little voln guide to path to give you credit, I named you my second in command and so on in the bro fad moments. You just keep on crapping. I started to ignore you to avoid further escalation and BANG, you are starting AGAIN the macguyver stupidity. And you claim to be a chief of departement, father of 5 kids, LOL.

Whatever.

We (dedicated merchants) are keeping this game alive because

1) Secondary market creates secondary offers and demands
2) Secondary market make the pill (high $$$ to play this game) easier to swallow since you can "even" it out. Unregular merchants like Peam does it as well for sporadic reasons I just gave
3) Secondary market is, in my opinion, aligned with ;lich with a player-BASED "control" on the game that FORCES Simu to be careful with their dev. I throw Dreaven in that point as well. That point is critical in my analysis:
i. As long as players keep some control in this game, they'll be able to operate outside of the Simustore market
ii. As long as players care, game will flourish from INSIDE. People care = people finds more ways to increase value = benefits for the game and simu
iii. As long as players do so, they'll create alts, creating needs for more gear = secondary market ++++

Wow - someone's triggered.

Sorry this may hurt your fee fees but you're not really affecting anything and in fact most likely are negatively affecting things (lots of people do not like you).

[audioserf]

I can't imagine why anyone would make up 5 kids as some kind of flex

[Methais]

The biggest problem is all the inflation from the silver sellers.

And he's not wrong - I had a small stint trying to sell silvers. I was making about 2 mil every 8 hours, and when I stopped and thought about how that's only 80 cents an hour, I realized how silly it was. I can see selling chunks of silvers if you just have it and don't need it. But farming it for cash seems like a waste of my time.

I don't know how much most people can make farming silvers, but I'd be very surprised if it was more than I was!

But I don't exactly see an easy fix for the problem. If Simu just straight up monetized silvers, would that solve anything? Or just put more money in Stillfront's pockets? At least the farmers mean a few more players being around, lol. I think some people can't even pay their subs without selling junk every month (Though honestly, these people would be better off not playing GS, and focusing on improving their life.).

Only real reason it works for me is because I'm able to play GS all day at work where I'm already making money. Anyone looking to do it as a "career" or as their primary source of income is gonna have a bad time.

On an unrelated note, anyone who is expecting to be retiring at 37 should have zero interest in any of this in the first place, as it would pretty much be a fart in the wind. Like Andy Dufresne when he escaped Shawshank.

[Murrandii]

Exactly

You work from home AND profit from gemstone? win-win

[Taernath]

Only real reason it works for me is because I'm able to play GS all day at work

Shouldn't you be supervising your kids rope climbing or something?

[Methais]

Exactly

You work from home AND profit from gemstone? win-win

Almost. I remote into my PC at home from my desk at work and do all my pwning that way.


Shouldn't you be supervising your kids rope climbing or something?

https://i.imgur.com/sLjrZOO.gif

[Methais]

I don't know how much most people can make farming silvers, but I'd be very surprised if it was more than I was!

Meant to add...when the Confluence first came out, I was able to pull in like 1m worth of gems per hour before purifying. It was so ridiculous that my bard couldn't purify fast enough to keep up with the supply of new gems I was bringing in. Almost nobody could hunt the place without getting wrecked, so loot was always super top tier, frequently dropping 2-3 gems per kill.

This was before they added plinites, and before the ELR nerf, so I just went nuts in there spamming Rapid Fire 502 and swarms (it also swarmed a lot) would be wiped out instantly and it was super mana efficient. I think coins were going for about $10 per at the time, so I was making tons of money on the side.

Then all that got nerfed and now everything is gay again, but I always have a backup plan for pwnage.

[Fierna]

On an unrelated note, anyone who is expecting to be retiring at 37 should have zero interest in any of this in the first place, as it would pretty much be a fart in the wind. Like Andy Dufresne when he escaped Shawshank.

Anyone with ambitions to retire when still in their 30's would probably never have touched GemStone in the first place.


Huh,come to think of it, said retiree could have played for a couple weeks, enjoyed it, put a mental bookmark vowing to return, worked his ass off trying to retire before 40 and then came back to playing GemStone full time as a retired person selling silvers to us chumps on the PC.
https://i.redd.it/xmpgh7k7e0r01.jpg

[Stumplicker]

Almost. I remote into my PC at home from my desk at work and do all my pwning that way.

Artist's rendition:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/55/King-Size_Homer.png

[Fierna]

Artist's rendition:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/55/King-Size_Homer.png

The saddest part, that computer in the picture could actually run Gemstone.

[Methais]

Artist's rendition:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/55/King-Size_Homer.png

https://i.chzbgr.com/full/8475484160/hCDC17203/

[Gelston]

I'm glad we were able to make a new player feel so welcome with 16 pages of retardation.

[Methais]

It really helps to have cheap hobbies. I always liked Gemstone and debating with people here so I figured why not - it's something to do. I like talking to intelligent people and unfortunately, I don't get a lot of that IRL. I do feel a lot like Andy Dufresne escaping Shawshank.

I don't think a lot of people have a good idea of what financial independence looks like. Sure, there are people who have inherited great wealth, had super high paying careers, made a fortune in the stock market, or hit the lottery. For my wife and I it was literally saving every penny - avoiding debt at all costs whenever possible, never, ever eating out, buying a 600 square foot foreclosed condo that was unlivable and fixing it up, sharing a vehicle, never going on vacation, working multiple horrible jobs at a time for low pay (at our peak we were working a combined 150+ hours a week), not having kids, rolling our own cigarettes, and finally - enjoying cheap and/or free entertainment. It's not glamorous, but for us free time has higher value than anything. Both my wife and I have worked for years at horrible jobs. Neither of us had high paying careers - we both work in the food industry.

When I say retire - we will not just do nothing (Even if/when we make it to social security age - we both still plan to work at least a few days a week). We are retiring from our "careers" to work in different industries, part time, for lower pay - because we can now afford to do so. We will not be buying a second home, moving to Florida, or playing golf all day (I also don't think most people have an accurate picture of retirement). What we will have, however, is about 40% more free time and a lot less stress. Over time, we will reduce the amount of time we work even more.

Back to what I like about GS - the game doesn't technically end, and is a great pastime (which is why I hope they don't shut the lights out on us - even though I think there's a good chance of it happening at any moment). Although the monetary rewards aren't super, I've always been able to monetize my time here in some way and enjoyed the challenge of doing so. I realize it may seem bizarre / extremist to analyze a $14.95 per month investment or do extensive financial research on a company who owns said investment - but that's the mindset that it's taken us to escape Shawshank. I also enjoy reading and doing research - another pastime of mine. To each their own.

There's nothing wrong with any of that. My point was that if part of that retirement plan is to sell GS silvers like you said earlier in this thread IIRC, then you're doing it wrong. Illegal immigrants working in the field probably make more per hour.

If it's just shit you're doing as a side effect of playing GS, which I would assume you'd be playing regardless but isn't part of your master retirement plan, then that's completely different.


I realize it may seem bizarre / extremist to analyze a $14.95 per month investment or do extensive financial research on a company who owns said investment - but that's the mindset that it's taken us to escape Shawshank. I also enjoy reading and doing research - another pastime of mine. To each their own.

If you can make and sell at least 3m silvers in a month, then GS pays for itself. That's really all that matters as far as analyzing your $14.95 per month "investment."

I think you misunderstood my Shawshank reference though. The Shawshank part didn't matter, that was just a reference to the warden getting all pissed off and saying Andy vanished overnight like a fart in the wind after he escaped. Had nothing to do with the actual escape, or Shawshank, or even really Andy Dufresne. The acutal point was that money from GS silvers should be a drop in the bucket to someone retiring at 37, at least when I still thought you were talking about "real" retirement.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xPlavncXPKQ

[Methais]

Heh, I think maybe you misunderstood me. Selling GS silver is not part of a retirement plan. It's just something I plan to do as part of my time here. If I can play for free or make a tiny profit from a hobby, that's great. If not, I can live with that, too. Incidentally, before I sold Scintillion, I tried to sell 4 million GS silvers for a $14.95 GOA (a lot cheaper than the going rate) and wasn't able to do so. Perhaps I just had bad luck at the time. Instead, I kept the silvers, sold the character, doubled my money - and started over. I'm still curious to know what people make at the high end selling silvers per week, per month, per year, etc.

We look at everything we spend money on (which we trade hours of our life for) as an investment with ROI - from a pair of socks to a home.

I'm not sure what you mean by "real" retirement. If you mean never having to work doing anything ever again - then no. I think this is where most people don't have an accurate picture. Even if you're able to retire from your main career working full time (like we are next year), and live from passive income - that passive income is still going to require management - so you're still going to have to work in some way, no matter what. For us, we've been able to gradually reduce the amount of time we spend working over time, from careful budgeting and smart investments. We would prefer to work part time at easy jobs (low stress) to managing passive investments (high stress) in our retirement from our full time careers. We haven't figured out a way to completely eliminate all bills (if anyone does - let me know!), and we like to always have our income stream be higher than our expenses. I think too many people are wanting to just reach a finish line where they can sit in a rocking chair all day doing nothing and waiting for their social security check to hit. Not only is this just simply not going to be a reality for most people - it isn't very desirable for us.

"Real" retirement to me is being done with work life and not having to worry about a job, regardless of how one gets there.


I think too many people are wanting to just reach a finish line where they can sit in a rocking chair all day doing nothing and waiting for their social security check to hit. Not only is this just simply not going to be a reality for most people - it isn't very desirable for us.

I don't see why it wouldn't be desirable. I've never met one person ever who didn't have something they'd rather be doing instead of being at work, unless they're a porn star and their job is to bang hot sluts all day, but I don't know any of them personally.


I am still curious to know what people are able to make at the high end.

It's nothing compared to what people used to be able to make, like back in GS3 when Dissipate and his army of halfling clerics and high mana share empaths could crank out multiple 8x+ enchants all day when silvers were selling for like $35 per.

I don't keep track of my numbers so I can't really accurately say I average X amount per month, but it's noticeably less than it was even just a few years ago before nerfs and when silvers were still staying steady at $8 per. Sometimes they sell really fast, sometimes it takes a while. But they always sell.

Pretty sure the current $4.5-5 per is as low as they're going to get though, other than retards selling for 3.xx during Duskruin. Because they're stupid.

[Fierna]

"Real" retirement to me is being done with work life and not having to worry about a job, regardless of how one gets there.



I don't see why it wouldn't be desirable. I've never met one person ever who didn't have something they'd rather be doing instead of being at work, unless they're a porn star and their job is to bang hot sluts all day, but I don't know any of them personally.



It's nothing compared to what people used to be able to make, like back in GS3 when Dissipate and his army of halfling clerics and high mana share empaths could crank out multiple 8x+ enchants all day when silvers were selling for like $35 per.

I don't keep track of my numbers so I can't really accurately say I average X amount per month, but it's noticeably less than it was even just a few years ago before nerfs and when silvers were still staying steady at $8 per. Sometimes they sell really fast, sometimes it takes a while. But they always sell.

Pretty sure the current $4.5-5 per is as low as they're going to get though, other than retards selling for 3.xx during Duskruin. Because they're stupid.

I don’t know, I think Wyrom has a sweet gig. I think he makes around 50k a year with incentive bonuses based on profits.

[Methais]

I don’t know, I think Wyrom has a sweet gig. I think he makes around 50k a year with incentive bonuses based on profits.

He also regularly works like 12-16+ hour days from what I've heard, often 7 days a week, and pretty much around the clock during big events.

If you break it down per hour, it's probably not nearly as good as it sounds, but I guess that would depend on what the P2W bonuses look like too.

But he does have the option to sit around at work naked and beat off on the clock if he wanted to, which has to be worth something.

I don't pretend to know what it's like on that side of things, but I'd imagine it's pretty fucking stressful, and that's before factoring in all the players complaining about various forms of bullshit, most of which are probably justified and have been since like '94 or whatever.

[Methais]

I met Ron Jeremy in Key West back in 2009 - he didn't seem very happy to me at all. I believe when you take something you're passionate about and use it to make a living - it takes something away from it.

Ron Jeremy isn't exactly in his prime anymore either. Not for like 30-40 years.


The last time I was able to farm and sell silvers successfully was back in 2008 with Vrannar - and they were selling for about $8 per IIRC at that time. If there was a chart that existed for the cash prices of everything (characters, items, silver, etc.) in GS which began in the 1990s and came to present day - it would show a consistent year over year loss of value in all categories (another reason why I don't think the game is healthy). The only things which have remained stable are subscription fees.

There are a multitude of reasons for this, some to do with Simu being retards over the years, some to do with how the gaming market has evolved over the years, and 48329043287 other factors.

GS didn't have a whole lot of competition back in the day and was probably considered cutting edge as far as multiplayer games go. I still remember my mind being blown when I first stared, all like "WOW ALL THESE NAMES ARE REAL PEOPLE PLAYING IN REAL TIME OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG!!!!!!"

Now the MMO market is flooded as fuck, text games are a niche genre, and the video game market as a whole is hugely different.

It's a miracle in its own right that GS has lasted this long. That alone should say something about the health/stability of the game.

Let's also not forget that people have been screaming doom & gloom for GS since the mid-late 90s, and here we are still kicking in 2019.

Hero's Journey could have been incredible if it ended up being a graphical version of GS or something close to it, but Simu's gonna Simu, and Simu Simu'd like Simu Simus.

[GSIV Rogue]

Ron Jeremy isn't exactly in his prime anymore either. Not for like 30-40 years.



There are a multitude of reasons for this, some to do with Simu being retards over the years, some to do with how the gaming market has evolved over the years, and 48329043287 other factors.

GS didn't have a whole lot of competition back in the day and was probably considered cutting edge as far as multiplayer games go. I still remember my mind being blown when I first stared, all like "WOW ALL THESE NAMES ARE REAL PEOPLE PLAYING IN REAL TIME OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG!!!!!!"

Now the MMO market is flooded as fuck, text games are a niche genre, and the video game market as a whole is hugely different.

It's a miracle in its own right that GS has lasted this long. That alone should say something about the health/stability of the game.

Let's also not forget that people have been screaming doom & gloom for GS since the mid-late 90s, and here we are still kicking in 2019.

Hero's Journey could have been incredible if it ended up being a graphical version of GS or something close to it, but Simu's gonna Simu, and Simu Simu'd like Simu Simus.

I agree with all this...I never got a chance to play Hero's Journey, but I've heard it mentioned many times. Now that I finally have the time, I plan to enjoy GS as long as it's around. It would be very cool if there was a graphical version of GS - I just don't know that it would be possible to duplicate the complexity of it. I was having this discussion with a friend and mentioned the fact that I still know people who are playing table top D&D in my area (younger than me IRL!), so I believe there is market for GS for new players, but as you said about Simu...;)

[Fierna]

yeah, I don’t think GS is going anywhere. Even D&D is just hitting it’s high mark what with it going mainstream and people from Stephen Colbert to the Russo bros. of Avengers Infinity War fame all “coming out”.

The only way this ride ends is if StillFront decides to end it for some reason.

[Fierna]

yeah, I don’t think GS is going anywhere. Even D&D is just hitting it’s high mark what with it going mainstream and people from Stephen Colbert to the Russo bros. of Avengers Infinity War fame all “coming out”.

The only way this ride ends is if StillFront decides to end it for some reason.

[Methais]

I agree with all this...I never got a chance to play Hero's Journey, but I've heard it mentioned many times. Now that I finally have the time, I plan to enjoy GS as long as it's around. It would be very cool if there was a graphical version of GS - I just don't know that it would be possible to duplicate the complexity of it. I was having this discussion with a friend and mentioned the fact that I still know people who are playing table top D&D in my area (younger than me IRL!), so I believe there is market for GS for new players, but as you said about Simu...;)

No one ever got a chance to play Hero's Journey. Simu sold the Hero Engine to Bioware, it got used for Star Wars: The Old Republic, and Dave Whatley fucked over a bunch of people who worked on building the engine and they never got paid or something like that.

[Gelston]

No one ever got a chance to play Hero's Journey. Simu sold the Hero Engine to Bioware, it got used for Star Wars: The Old Republic, and Dave Whatley fucked over a bunch of people who worked on building the engine and they never got paid or something like that.

I play Hero's Journey IRL everyday.

[Methais]

I play Hero's Journey IRL everyday.

My bad, I forgot to mention that only gay people have access to Hero's Journey.

[Gelston]

My bad, I forgot to mention that only straight people have access to Hero's Journey.

ftfy

[Methais]

ftfy

https://media1.giphy.com/media/6mjwQOegXDvaw/giphy.gif

[Fierna]

Dave Whatley fucked over a bunch of people who worked on building the engine and they never got paid or something like that.

Wait, you serious? Did he use “volunteers” to build an entire game engine from scratch? Holy shit? Dude can sell god sand if they were both in the desert.

[Gelston]

Wait, you serious? Did he use “volunteers” to build an entire game engine from scratch? Holy shit? Dude can sell god sand if they were both in the desert.

No. Everyone that worked on HJ was a paid coder.

[Fortybox]

I don’t know, I think Wyrom has a sweet gig. I think he makes around 50k a year with incentive bonuses based on profits.

50K a year is not a sweet gig. Making a couple grand an even is not a sweet gig either. :lol:

[GSIV Rogue]

The only way this ride ends is if StillFront decides to end it for some reason.

That was more or less what I've been trying to say. Even though the game is profitable, has potential to be more profitable, longstanding player base - whatever - the fact that it's now part of a larger corporation that is publicly traded and Simutronics itself has no real control or final say so over its future means that it can be "restructured" on a whim for whatever reason. If Stillfront thinks that there is a way to monetize off of any assets - including staff - currently being used on GSIV (or Simutronics) in any way beyond what is currently being done (or sees any potential liability) - then it'll be gone with no warning. Also, the fact that David Whatley allowed the majority share of the company to be absorbed - and then sold even more of it a year later - appears from the outside as if at best there is very poor communication and management going on - or at worst - Simutronics as a whole is struggling to remain solvent. From experience in corporate America anything is possible - and people very rarely sell profitable small businesses - or even explore the option to do so unless they are in some kind of financial bind.

[Fortybox]

That was more or less what I've been trying to say. Even though the game is profitable, has potential to be more profitable, longstanding player base - whatever - the fact that it's now part of a larger corporation that is publicly traded and Simutronics itself has no real control or final say so over its future means that it can be "restructured" on a whim for whatever reason. If Stillfront thinks that there is a way to monetize off of any assets - including staff - currently being used on GSIV in any way beyond what is currently being done - then it'll be gone with no warning. Also, the fact that David Whatley allowed the majority share of the company to be absorbed - and then sold even more of it a year later - appears from the outside as if at best there is very poor communication and management going on - or at worst - Simutronics as a whole is struggling to remain solvent. From experience in corporate America anything is possible - and people very rarely sell profitable small businesses - or even explore the option to do so unless they are in some kind of financial bind.

Do you even read what you post? I mean don't get me wrong, it's entertaining but good grief...

[Fortybox]

Yes. I am glad I can entertain you - I thought that was the point of all this anyway.

https://media.giphy.com/media/HRNqHqiwbfrIQ/giphy.gif

[Fortybox]

Exactly

You work from home AND profit from gemstone? win-win

At least you are admitting to AFK scripting finally. There's no way you can effectively be a "business analyst" and pay attention to the game.

[Murrandii]

At least you are admitting to AFK scripting finally. There's no way you can effectively be a "business analyst" and pay attention to the game.

You poor bored person, I pity you. Methais, Dalabrac is saying you are AFK scripting too, I'm so reporting you

[Fortybox]

You poor bored person, I pity you. Methais, Dalabrac is saying you are AFK scripting too, I'm so reporting you

Nice deflection. Only a matter of time before you're caught and banned.

[Murrandii]

Nice deflection. Only a matter of time before you're caught and banned.

You heard the man, Methais. We're watching you ;)

[Fortybox]

You heard the man, Methais. We're watching you ;)

It would just be easier if you admit to it. There is no way you can effectively be a "business analyst" and run multiple accounts in GS. You're either screwing over your employer or you are screwing over the rules from Simu.

[Murrandii]

It would just be easier if you admit to it. There is no way you can effectively be a "business analyst" and run multiple accounts in GS. You're either screwing over your employer or you are screwing over the rules from Simu.

You heard the man, MEthais. Dalabrac is saying you are a fraud, that you can't work and "play" remotely" your gs accounts.

[Stumplicker]

Or...you just report the time that you're working rather than hunting, because not everyone has a shift manager at the gas station making sure they're working from 10 AM to 7 PM on the timeclock.

[Murrandii]

lol

[Stumplicker]

I'm working right now. And playing Gemstone. I'll be doing so for the next 9 or 10 hours. And then I'll report 4 hours of time worked on Monday because that's about how much work I'll have gotten done.

[audioserf]

You two should just fight IRL

[Stumplicker]

Or kiss.

[Murrandii]

I have nothing against him.

He started the macguyver stuff.
He is always on my back when I talk on lnet, help, merchant, whatever. Whenever I give advices, he ALWAYS jumps in to say the contrary.
When I was feed up of this crap, I brought him in the bro fad, gave him credit, gave him attention and even went friendly with him. He always tried to start crap again but was hiding behind "humor".
Now that I totally ignore him on lnet, he continues here.

Dalabrac is a good example of "divide and conquer" troll. He tries to isolate people he "doesn't like" and justify himself cause he's bored. That's his fun. He doesn't care about impacts of his behavior, it's online and he's bored!

He's on my back accusing me of stuff yet he ideolize people (methais) that does the SAME.

The minute he just stops always picking on me, it will stop.

[Fortybox]

You heard the man, MEthais. Dalabrac is saying you are a fraud, that you can't work and "play" remotely" your gs accounts.

Wrong (again, as usual). I have no idea what Methais does for a living, nor does it matter, but I know about business analysts (I hire them all the time). There is no way you can actually do your work and manage 4+ accounts.

[Fortybox]

I have nothing against him.

He started the macguyver stuff.
He is always on my back when I talk on lnet, help, merchant, whatever. Whenever I give advices, he ALWAYS jumps in to say the contrary.
When I was feed up of this crap, I brought him in the bro fad, gave him credit, gave him attention and even went friendly with him. He always tried to start crap again but was hiding behind "humor".
Now that I totally ignore him on lnet, he continues here.

Dalabrac is a good example of "divide and conquer" troll. He tries to isolate people he "doesn't like" and justify himself cause he's bored. That's his fun. He doesn't care about impacts of his behavior, it's online and he's bored!

He's on my back accusing me of stuff yet he ideolize people (methais) that does the SAME.

The minute he just stops always picking on me, it will stop.

It's obvious that you do. I'm just pointing out your BS.

[Fortybox]

You two should just fight IRL

At Simucon?

[Murrandii]

It's obvious that you do. I'm just pointing out your BS.

I know you'd like that. You are bored.

[Methais]

Wait, you serious? Did he use “volunteers” to build an entire game engine from scratch? Holy shit? Dude can sell god sand if they were both in the desert.

I’ve only read things here and there about it, but no they weren’t volunteers. They just got fucked when it was time to pay up. Not sure if it was all of them or just some, I just remember reading it and thinking that’s totally something Dave would do.

[Methais]

You poor bored person, I pity you. Methais, Dalabrac is saying you are AFK scripting too, I'm so reporting you

How did I get dragged into this? Or do you just still not know how to use forums?

[Methais]

He's on my back accusing me of stuff yet he ideolize people (methais) that does the SAME.

Well for one, I’m way cooler, and unless you’re a gigantic bowl of old cunt gravy, I’m cool to everyone else.

And second, I work in IT and on an average day have a lot of downtime. TeamViewer and Chrome Remote Desktop have become my favorite programs in the universe over the years. You can even GS from your phone if you really need to.

And third, I’m way cooler. Just needed to reiterate that because it’s super important.

[Murrandii]

Well for one, I’m way cooler, and unless you’re a gigantic bowl of old cunt gravy, I’m cool to everyone else.

And second, I work in IT and on an average day have a lot of downtime. TeamViewer and Chrome Remote Desktop have become my favorite programs in the universe over the years. You can even GS from your phone if you really need to.

And third, I’m way cooler. Just needed to reiterate that because it’s super important.

I know you're so much cooler, Dalabrac is in AWE about you, he mimics everything you do like your signature, your "style" and so on.

I trully hope, though, he won't start to report you since you sell silvers for money and you play at your job (and therefore, you must be AFK). He despises people doing so, bro.

Sorry :(

[Methais]

I know you're so much cooler, Dalabrac is in AWE about you, he mimics everything you do like your signature, your "style" and so on.

I trully hope, though, he won't start to report you since you sell silvers for money and you play at your job (and therefore, you must be AFK). He despises people doing so, bro.

Sorry :(

Just wait until they catch onto my super elaborate script that makes me talk on LNet and have real time conversations with people including you, as well as meeting up in game for coin sales while I’m super afk at work! :(

AFK SILVER TRANSACTION SCRIPTS ARE WHERE IT’S AT IN 2019


I know you're so much cooler

Quoting for extra emphasis.

https://media1.giphy.com/media/62PP2yEIAZF6g/giphy.gif

[Fortybox]

I know you're so much cooler, Dalabrac is in AWE about you, he mimics everything you do like your signature, your "style" and so on.

I trully hope, though, he won't start to report you since you sell silvers for money and you play at your job (and therefore, you must be AFK). He despises people doing so, bro.

Sorry :(

Why are you so obsessed about me over a supposed obsession over someone else? That's weird.

[Fortybox]

Well for one, I’m way cooler, and unless you’re a gigantic bowl of old cunt gravy, I’m cool to everyone else.

And second, I work in IT and on an average day have a lot of downtime. TeamViewer and Chrome Remote Desktop have become my favorite programs in the universe over the years. You can even GS from your phone if you really need to.

And third, I’m way cooler. Just needed to reiterate that because it’s super important.

My guess is you probably aren't running 500 separate accounts and chatting about Poutine on LNET from 8am to 12 midnight.

[leifastagsweed]

https://static01.nyt.com/images/2015/10/27/dining/27COOKING-VEGANGRAVY1/27COOKING-VEGANGRAVY1-articleLarge.jpg