Brawl/Thrown Style

[Maerit]

I've been toying around with a new F2P rogue after the RECOVER changes to thrown weapons, and I have to say it works quite well now.

2x brawling
2x thrown weapons
2x combat maneuvers
2x two-weapon combat
3x dodge
2x perception

As many points as you can until 2x armor use.

With some creative scripts, you can hunt pretty easily with 4-6 weapons. I have been using ebladed fist-scythes, and they shred my targets easily. The RT for this is only 5s with throwing 2 weapons at the same time. I think I'd have similar speeds with hammers too, which would ultimately be stronger DF, but you'd want to only equip them right before hurling to avoid having a DS penalty.

In the end, throwing two flaring weapons with 5s RT is pretty strong. The recover hurl is less annoying than gathering arrows too. I'll have to try the thrown sniper tactic too to see how it compares.

[Archigeek]

I've been toying around with a new F2P rogue after the RECOVER changes to thrown weapons, and I have to say it works quite well now.

2x brawling
2x thrown weapons
2x combat maneuvers
2x two-weapon combat
3x dodge
2x perception

As many points as you can until 2x armor use.

With some creative scripts, you can hunt pretty easily with 4-6 weapons. I have been using ebladed fist-scythes, and they shred my targets easily. The RT for this is only 5s with throwing 2 weapons at the same time. I think I'd have similar speeds with hammers too, which would ultimately be stronger DF, but you'd want to only equip them right before hurling to avoid having a DS penalty.

In the end, throwing two flaring weapons with 5s RT is pretty strong. The recover hurl is less annoying than gathering arrows too. I'll have to try the thrown sniper tactic too to see how it compares.

With more dex/agi you can likely get that down to 4 seconds. That's the case for axes, and I can't imagine it's worse for first scythes. I suppose it could be, since they aren't a thrown weapon or customary hybrid, but seems unlikely.

[Zarston]

EDIT: I re-read your post and realized you were throwing brawling weapons. The following advice would only be worth taking if you were holding thrown weapons, i.e. javelins. I'll leave it up just to give you an additional training option to consider.

If you want to free up some TPs for more armor or hiding/ambush, you can consider dropping down brawling to 1x or even .5x. The only time you're ever relying on it for parry defense is when you're in an offensivish stance after you've thrown your weapons. If you look at the parry DS formula, you'll see that weapon ranks are only part of the formula. If you're in offensive, each weapon rank is only offering you like .2 DS.

Let's say your character is around 30, and has 60ish weapon ranks. 2x brawl parry offensive DS would be 6 higher than 1x at the cost of 180/60 TPs. When you're higher level and your armor use needs have been met, you can then start working back towards 2x brawling.

[Maerit]

That is some great tips Zarston! I kept brawling at 2x so I wouldn't have to get blessed hurling weapons for undead, and I can just UAC the undead since they're less susceptible to the value of thrown weapons (crit kills). If I ever decide to maintain a 2nd bandolier of blessed weapons, it would be better for my training plan to drop to 1x brawl just for defense, and focus on throwing weapons that are more suited for the task.

Also, I was using the fist-scythes for hamstring at one point, which did put me into RT while having the weapons equipped. I could carry a pair of them for hamstring/feint (if I stick with those CMANs), and then swap before I throw though.

[Mobius1]

Seems like an interesting build. What made you choose fist scythes?

[Maerit]

Seems like an interesting build. What made you choose fist scythes?

Originally, I was using fist-scythes in order to use hamstring as my opener and maintain DS with brawling because I would have a brawling weapon equipped while in RT. Hamstring them with 2 weapons (was pretty nice), then hurl. I have recently been tweaking this build a ton, and have landed on a more sustainable (less outside help needed) setup.

2x shield use
2x dodge

= medium shield for defense

1x brawling
2x thrown weapons
2x combat maneuvers
2x perception
2x physical fitness
2x ambush
3x stalking & hiding

He hurls e-bladed handaxes from hiding (sniper style), and kills targets in 1-3 hits usually at just level 11 (no society or outside spells). With the TWC hurling style, you can hurl two handaxes from the open with just 5s RT, or you can hurl 1 handaxe from hiding with 4s RT (aimed). Either style is deadly. The problem is that carrying the # of handaxes you need to finish a target with TWC was heavy, and even with a warrior weapon harness and 95 STR stat, he was experiencing minor encumbrance. Switching to ambushing with a single weapon reduced the # of weapons to carry before having to "RECOVER HURL", and subsequently was easier to manage.

Dropped down from carrying 10 e-bladed fist-sythes to 4 e-bladed handaxes (which all fit in the warrior made harness). If the target somehow survives three thrown hits, I do a quick recovery and return to stealth.

With the above setup, I have great DS, enough to up-hunt without much issue while also being able to stay hidden for most attacks. It's probably a little slower, but a lot safer.


Now they just need to make an Erinthian merchant that sells throwing stars and kunai.

Also very disappointed that throwing nets don't have a guaranteed grapple flare when you successfully hit the target. I mean, they suck for damage, so why don't they always flare!?

[Mobius1]

I've wondered how well throwing Sais to the eye would work!

[IorakeWarhammer]

sounds great, but um..

logs or it didnt happen

[Maerit]

Here's a couple examples a level 11 hunting level 15 ogres.


>get handaxe from my harness
You remove a handaxe from in your weapon harness.
>hide
Roundtime: 3 sec.
You attempt to blend with the surroundings, and feel confident that no one has noticed your doing so.
The ogre sniffs around looking for something.
A large ogre looks frustrated.
>stance offensive
You are now in an offensive stance.
>hurl ogre head
With a quick flick of your wrist, you deftly send a handaxe into flight.
You throw a handaxe at a large ogre!
AS: +169 vs DS: +55 with AvD: +30 + d100 roll: +76 = +220
... and hit for 91 points of damage!
Horrible slash to the large ogre's head! Brain matter goes flying!
Looks like it never felt a thing.
The large ogre falls to the ground and dies.
The scintillating red light surrounding the handaxe fades some.
Bad angle. The handaxe fails to stick in a large ogre.
[Use the RECOVER HURL command while in the appropriate room to regain your item.]
Roundtime: 4 sec.

>get handaxe from my harness
You remove a handaxe from in your weapon harness.
>hide
Roundtime: 3 sec.
You attempt to blend with the surroundings, and feel confident that no one has noticed your doing so.
>stance offensive
You are now in an offensive stance.
>hurl ogre head
With a quick flick of your wrist, you deftly send a handaxe into flight.
You throw a handaxe at a large ogre!
AS: +169 vs DS: +85 with AvD: +30 + d100 roll: +22 = +136
... and hit for 17 points of damage!
Cut over the large ogre's right eye.
The scintillating red light surrounding the handaxe fades some.
Momentum carries a handaxe past a large ogre to land nearby.
[Use the RECOVER HURL command while in the appropriate room to regain your item.]
Roundtime: 4 sec.
>get handaxe from my harness
You feel fully energetic again.
You remove a handaxe from in your weapon harness.
>hurl ogre head
With a quick flick of your wrist, you deftly send a handaxe into flight.
You throw a handaxe at a large ogre!
AS: +169 vs DS: +82 with AvD: +30 + d100 roll: +59 = +176
... and hit for 48 points of damage!
You broke the large ogre's nose!
The large ogre is stunned!
** As you hit, your handaxe flares with a burst of fire! **
... 5 points of damage!
Minor burns to right leg. That hurts a bit.
The scintillating red light surrounding the handaxe fades some.
Momentum carries a handaxe past a large ogre to land nearby.
[Use the RECOVER HURL command while in the appropriate room to regain your item.]
Roundtime: 4 sec.
>get handaxe from my harness
You remove a handaxe from in your weapon harness.
>hurl ogre head
With a quick flick of your wrist, you deftly send a handaxe into flight.
You throw a handaxe at a large ogre!
AS: +169 vs DS: +51 with AvD: +30 + d100 roll: +42 = +190
... and hit for 69 points of damage!
Gruesome slash opens the large ogre's forehead!
Grey matter spills forth!
The large ogre falls to the ground and dies.
The scintillating red light surrounding the handaxe fades some.
The handaxe is deflected to one side, sailing to the ground.
[Use the RECOVER HURL command while in the appropriate room to regain your item.]
Roundtime: 4 sec.
>recover hurl
...wait 3 seconds.
[hurl]>recover hurl
...wait 1 seconds.
>stance defensive
>recover hurl
You are now in a defensive stance.
You come out of hiding.
You spy a handaxe and recover it.
>put handaxe in my harness
You need a free hand to pick that up.
You put a handaxe in your weapon harness.
>recover hurl
You know a handaxe is around here somewhere, but you don't see it.
>recover hurl
You spy a handaxe and recover it.
>put handaxe in my harness
You put a handaxe in your weapon harness.
>recover hurl
You know a handaxe is around here somewhere, but you don't see it.
>stance offensive
You are now in an offensive stance.
>recover hurl
You spy a handaxe and recover it.
You stand back up.
>put handaxe in my harness
You put a handaxe in your weapon harness.
>recover hurl

[Donquix]

it's certainly a tempting idea. i've been toying with the idea of forging a bunch of spears (hell, with the fest right now could get most of them lightened without having to waste notes!) and trying a hurling build with a warrior. Ora is easy enough to find someone who can eblade it for you.

[Mobius1]

I'd get crit weighting if I was going to hurl. Give yourself some sort of edge over archery.

[Orthin]

Hmm I may have to try some kind of build like this with my baby warrior. Could be fun to toy with for sure with a shield out

[Donquix]

I'd get crit weighting if I was going to hurl. Give yourself some sort of edge over archery.

enough decent enchant weighted stuff is not THAT hard to come by but 6x flaring superior stuff i could make in a day (also specifically for spears, not as readily available as handaxes which are probably the real best mechanical option, or a hammer).

i actually considered loading up on several things from Dark and Dangerous (SWCW shop) at DR for this exact purpose. But that's all limited availability now, hope it restocks. But this did give me an idea....


>'@rat You have dishonored my clan.
Speaking to a giant rat, you say, "You have dishonored my clan."
>get kat
With deliberate poise, you draw the vultite katana from your scabbard, bringing it up, gripped in both hands, into a ready position.
>hurl rat
With deliberate force, you hurl a kelyn-hilted vultite katana!
You throw a kelyn-hilted vultite katana at a giant rat!
AS: +121 vs DS: -40 with AvD: +39 + d100 roll: +92 = +292
... and hit for 136 points of damage!
Strong slash to the giant rat's right leg!
Muscles exposed!
Not a pretty sight.
The giant rat collapses to the ground, emits a final squeal, and dies.
Bad angle. The vultite katana fails to stick in a giant rat.
[Use the RECOVER HURL command while in the appropriate room to regain your item.]
Roundtime: 5 sec.
>bow rat
You bow to a giant rat.
>recover hurl
You spy a kelyn-hilted vultite katana and recover it.
>put kat in my vat
With a fluid movement, you slide your katana into dream agate and ivory scabbard with a barely audible *snick!*

[Leigo]

What is the calculation for hurl RT? And for double throw hurl RT? This thread makes me want to build a wizard thrower, trying to figure out the race min/max for it with celerity, I am leaning dwarf if I can hit 1 second aimed head shots throwing hammers.

[Tenser]

I have read it is based on strength (1 second reduction/10 str bonus as ranged), so no disadvantage being a dwarf if that is true.

[Leigo]

Messed around with a wizard hurling, only lvl 3 so far trying to use brawling weapons for the in-between-throw parry DS, so far very underwhelming but again im only level 3. Feels like you want to be able to 2x weapon for a real heavy hurling AS.

[Tenser]

This is typical for any pure trying to use weapons. Until you get AS boosting spells you fall behind on AS. Then once you get them you catch back up (at least somewhat). The key for the wizard will be celerity 1 second throws and getting 425.

[Maerit]

Messed around with a wizard hurling, only lvl 3 so far trying to use brawling weapons for the in-between-throw parry DS, so far very underwhelming but again im only level 3. Feels like you want to be able to 2x weapon for a real heavy hurling AS.

I tried the hurling thing on my warmage on the test server, capped, and it was terrible compared to his normal brawling style because he lost like 100DS (though AS was within the standard range, and with hurling the DS of targets is usually lower than normal weapons). Also, you'd have to carry around a lot more weapons doing the warmage style since it will be a lot of 1s RTs with low damage, and weapons that can't be recovered. A hurling warmage would probably need around 10-12 weapons to throw.

If you were going for the 1s RT hurling, a bard would be ideal. Shield Using, thrown weapons trained bard with 75 ranks in air lore, and hurling hammers with 1s RT. It would probably work very well.