Hugo Chavez: Hero or Villain

[Back]

Hugo Chavez (http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=Hugo+Chavez) google search results for a broad spectrum of information.

I recall hearing about him in the news in the past, that he was a dangerous man making close ties to Cuba and Castro. The more I read about him, however, I wonder if he is such a danger.

He should have the US by the balls with control of 1/5 of the oil that gets imported. His policy of using oil wealth for social programs has angered the upper and middle classes but has given him the support of the 80% of the poor population.

What impresses me is that he is using the counrties natural resources for the people. In a sense, aren’t we all entitled to a piece of the pie when our nation’s resources are tapped and sold?

Its interesting to see how the US reacts to him and what will be the outcome of his bold policies.

[DeV]

Originally posted by Backlash
Its interesting to see how the US reacts to him and what will be the outcome of his bold policies. It will be very interesting, considering this is a man who's unabashedly called our fair leader an asshole and one of our country's biggest criticizers.

He is now attempting to stengthen political ties with China, Iran, and Russisa instead of the United States. A very bold move on his part.

[xtc]

He seems a character, of course having Fidel Castro sing your praises isn't a good thing.

He seems to have made some wide power grabs and stolen land. I guess like most socialists he is promising the poor something for nothing.

He has made noise in the past about claiming land in certain parts of Guyana. If he decides to make a move we can always defend Guyana invade Venezuela install a puppet government and control the oil there as well.

On a serious note the man is playing a dangerous game.

[Tsa`ah]

And I'm sure he should follow the Venezuelan model of allowing US based companies to set up shop and pay sub-bargain basement wages to employees that will refine and produce oil and plastic resins.

The man may be a character, he may play a dangerous game, but when you think of your country and its people first .... the US will always be pissed and plotting.

[hectomaner]

he is soooo my hero


and on another note, Fidel Castro is now Cuba's Prime Minister.

[xtc]

Originally posted by Tsa`ah
And I'm sure he should follow the Venezuelan model of allowing US based companies to set up shop and pay sub-bargain basement wages to employees that will refine and produce oil and plastic resins.

The man may be a character, he may play a dangerous game, but when you think of your country and its people first .... the US will always be pissed and plotting.

He first came to power through a coup and has since been elected. He has changed the constitution to give himself more power. He has stolen land. There was a national strike to protest him in 2002. He has been accused of funding terrorist organisations in Colombia.

Under Chavez's changes someone can come onto your land and grow what they want. You have no say. He has stolen land from farmers and given it to others.

All scenes of violence against anti-chavez protesters can't be shown in the press.

If Bush tried this shit you would be screaming.

[Back]

Originally posted by xtc
He first came to power through a coup and has since been elected. He has changed the constitution to give himself more power. He has stolen land. There was a national strike to protest him in 2002. He has been accused of funding terrorist organisations in Colombia.

Under Chavez's changes someone can come onto your land and grow what they want. You have no say. He has stolen land from farmers and given it to others.

All scenes of violence against anti-chavez protesters can't be shown in the press.

If Bush tried this shit you would be screaming.

Suprised at this response. Its like you were reading right from the FOX website.

Take a look at Venezuelanalysis.com (http://www.venezuelanalysis.com/).

Or, take a sample from a google search like the one I posted in the first post.

BBC has a much less critical profile of him.

Wikipedia has quite a detailed entry.

[Edited on 2-22-2005 by Backlash]

[Edited on 2-22-2005 by Backlash]

[xtc]

Originally posted by Backlash

Originally posted by xtc
He first came to power through a coup and has since been elected. He has changed the constitution to give himself more power. He has stolen land. There was a national strike to protest him in 2002. He has been accused of funding terrorist organisations in Colombia.

Under Chavez's changes someone can come onto your land and grow what they want. You have no say. He has stolen land from farmers and given it to others.

All scenes of violence against anti-chavez protesters can't be shown in the press.

If Bush tried this shit you would be screaming.

Suprised at this response. Its like you were reading right from the FOX website.

Take a look at Venezuelanalysis.com (http://www.venezuelanalysis.com/).

Or, take a sample from a google search like the one I posted in the first post.

BBC has a much less critical profile of him.

Wikipedia has quite a detailed entry.

[Edited on 2-22-2005 by Backlash]

[Edited on 2-22-2005 by Backlash]

Fox News is not on my radar.

You asked the question is he a hero or a villian.

I was guessing most here would support him. I wanted to point out that he has done alot of questionable things. He claims he is a man of the people yet he has taken land away from farmers. He also allows anyone to farm on anothers land. He has given himself sweeping powers. He supports a group in Colombia that is trying to over through a democratically elected government. In America we never would have allowed Bush or any other President to do what Chavez has done. I am aware that he is popular among the poor in Venezuela. I am concerned that he will become a dictator.

http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/005/177yckaw.asp

[Alarke]

I'm sorry, I am 100% with xtc here. Look at his party, can you really say you would support the ideas of the Movement of the Fifth Republic (MVR). He took over power by coup, as was said, and was finally elected in 98 by 56.2%... He was then removed from office, due to some bullshit excuse the petition that was drawn up was unusable. Those that signed the petition were usually blacklisted from jobs and sometimes even killed. He was reelected in 2000 and has since changed the constitution to prolong his stay in power, he created new restrictions on the media, created the Judicial Emergency Committee, which gives him the ability to remove ANY judge without consulting any branch of the government, created a new Labor Union referendum, changed the government to a Unicameral Assembly (one legislative chamber) and created "Rule by Decree," which allows him to make laws with NO legislative process!!

His Venezuelan-Arab Friendship Assosciation is on a small island just off of the coast that is a freaking fortress, with armed guards and is known as the "fortress." He allows groups such as FARC and ELN as well as columbian drug lords to enter freely.

Yes, the poor love him because he needed them to win the election. He's taking money out of the elites hands and giving the poor programs. He's sending cuba 63,000 barrels of oil in return for 50,000 teachers and healthcare professionals, he's allowing the poor to head these wonderful new programs he's started because he thinks they know what they need better than anyone. He's creating this facade to make them so damn happy they dont notice he can now pass laws without anyone stopping him, will stay in power until he deems it time for a new election and has total control of the country. Great man this Chavez...

[Back]

Originally posted by xtc
http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/005/177yckaw.asp

If we are going to throw out sources, we can easily find pros and cons of what he is doing. The source above tries to link Chavez with FARC, but ultimately does not. The Weekly Standard is owned by News America Incorporated. It is not a Venezuelan source.

Try VHeadline.com (http://www.vheadline.com/main.asp) and see what it says. Of course, people will claim Chavez runs it. (This article (http://www.vheadline.com/readnews.asp?id=25820) about Chavez switching to euro is very interesting. Oddly, its missing from American media)

Now, all that said, I’m still watching, waiting to see how it plays out. It seems to me the trend is, as with NATO, with Russia, with the rest of the globe, people are fed up with America and are finding ways to do things without us no matter how loudly we protest.

[Back]

Originally posted by Alarke
stuff...

Here is a BBC Timeline of Venezuela (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/country_profiles/1229348.stm). He was democratically elected president after two fail coup attempts. The two presidents who were in power at the time were ultimately convicted of corruption.

There have been protests. Indeed. And from what I’ve read, where there are 100,000 against, there are double that for.

In your post you made it sound like helping the poor (80% ets. of Venezuela) with the countries natural resources is a bad thing. Venezuela has already started talks with Columbia and has close ties with Brazil. Unless he has some crazy idea about dominating the world, I think he is not dangerous. Just trying to carve some fairness out of the world.

[longshot]

The "coup" was a CIA operation.

While I believe he truly sucks, the demonization of him by the American media is simply because he won't play our empire game that we play with all of the Americas.

The "danger" is that he will not sell out...

[Tsa`ah]

Originally posted by longshot
The "coup" was a CIA operation.

While I believe he truly sucks, the demonization of him by the American media is simply because he won't play our empire game that we play with all of the Americas.

The "danger" is that he will not sell out...

Much like, and to the praise of, Castro.

[Hulkein]

Fidel is the man.

[Alarke]

Originally posted by Backlash

Originally posted by Alarke
stuff...

Here is a BBC Timeline of Venezuela (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/country_profiles/1229348.stm). He was democratically elected president after two fail coup attempts. The two presidents who were in power at the time were ultimately convicted of corruption.

There have been protests. Indeed. And from what I’ve read, where there are 100,000 against, there are double that for.

In your post you made it sound like helping the poor (80% ets. of Venezuela) with the countries natural resources is a bad thing. Venezuela has already started talks with Columbia and has close ties with Brazil. Unless he has some crazy idea about dominating the world, I think he is not dangerous. Just trying to carve some fairness out of the world.
To clarify the first petition to throw him out of power had slightly over 3 million votes... so your number of 100,000 is horribly wrong. Secondly using the poor in order to gain support to create a dictatorship IS crappy. Look at the big picture. Little picture = helping the lower class is good! Big picture = helping the lower class to blindfold them from the corruption you're going to use from the power they give you is bad!

[Hulkein]

BUT HE IS EMBRACING SOCIALIST IDEALS ... THAT IS ALL THAT MATTERS