Ambush RT - couple of questions

[karnamm]

Greetings all -

Having a blast playing my Rogue. Love Two Weapon Combat and have really enjoy Sunfist.

So One thing I just am struggling with and can't quite get.

I have Brig and am approaching 30 ranks. But even when I had 30 ranks before I still had an additional penalty to my ambushing time. It is currently at 7 RT but that of course includes 2 weapons.

With that being said, is there an armor I should train towards where I can get that second back or should I just stop at 30 ranks and keep brig because it only gets worse?

Also, I don't see myself training in spells - so eventually, redux will be strong for me. (have another account with minor elemental that can take care of this)

(another game mechanic question)

Stamina - is there a cap for stamina? it seems to go up a couple of points every level currently for me.

[petroglyph]

Armor is not the only factor in your RT. What weapon classes are you swinging? What is the weight of your weapons?

The TWC RT formula is here: https://gswiki.play.net/Melee_roundtime
The stamina formula is here: https://gswiki.play.net/Stamina

I wear chain and like it, but plenty of rogues prefer the ease of hiding in rigid leather.

[Gelston]

My rogue is in MBP because it looks hawt.

[rolfard]

Armor doesnt apply to hiding. Armored stealth gains more bonus in lower armors but it's ridiculous to train armor and not wear it.

Rogues in full plate with 3x hiding (post-cap) hide perfectly well and shrug off hits if they are caught in the open.

My rogue went brig + twc, hauberk + snipe, and now plate + uac. Fun class with a lot of flexibility.

[Gelston]

Yeah, I personally wouldn't skimp on armor just because of better effect from armored stealth or evasion or what not. Full plate is #1.

[Nordred]

My first thought is you are using two heavy class rated OHE weapons, but 7 seconds is an odd spot to end at so you are either using a strange combo or you are having a huge brain fart and forgot to check you encumbrance level.

[karnamm]

@Nordred

I am using a falchion and a longsword. The Longsword does add a second round time in my left hand. If it is in my right hand, it turns to 9 seconds. Both are under 4 pounds (I think Longsword is 4 and Falchion is 3).

I always thought it was the Brig causing my RT to go up. I just have some basic 4x Brig.

I am almost up to 2 mil so I may start buying some better equipment. Also, at 27 trainings in armor.

[petroglyph]

Okay, so the formula for TWC RT, as noted on the page I linked above, is:

TWCBaseSpeed = RightBaseSpeed + min(LeftBaseSpeed - 2, 0) + min(WeightPenalty, 0)

The base speed of a falchion is 5. The base speed of a longsword is 4. So that's (5 + (4-2)) = 7 right there. I'd need to see your stats to know exactly what's factoring into your final RT, but you probably have AGI and DEX giving you a speed offset to bring you down to 6, and then ambush is bringing you right back up to 7 again.

tl;dr: if you want to swing faster, replace your longsword with a short sword.

[karnamm]

http://forum.gsplayers.com/showthread.php?115715-Looking-for-some-feedback-thoughts-on-my-Level-19-Rogue-before-I-train-in-20&p=2031225#post2031225

Above is a link to my level 20 stats. I will start looking for a short sword. Is there any way or at any point this with drop down to 5.....Sorry I am lacking a little intelligence in this.

[petroglyph]

Dropping ambushing RT down to 5 is going to be difficult, because no matter what your stats are there are minimum speeds for all weapon types. You would need to have a TWC base RT of 3 seconds or less to manage it. That means a right-hand weapon with a base RT of 3 or less (short sword, main gauche, rapier, dagger) and a left-hand weapon with a base RT of 2 or less (main gauche, rapier, dagger).

[Ososis]

Okay, so the formula for TWC RT, as noted on the page I linked above, is:

TWCBaseSpeed = RightBaseSpeed + min(LeftBaseSpeed - 2, 0) + min(WeightPenalty, 0)

The base speed of a falchion is 5. The base speed of a longsword is 4. So that's (5 + (4-2)) = 7 right there. I'd need to see your stats to know exactly what's factoring into your final RT, but you probably have AGI and DEX giving you a speed offset to bring you down to 6, and then ambush is bringing you right back up to 7 again.

tl;dr: if you want to swing faster, replace your longsword with a short sword.

This math is a bit off. The offhand won't add RT to base if your STR is high enough to compensate the weight. You can swing two falchions at 5RT pretty easy.

Roundtime is calculated based on the base roundtime of each weapon, the weight of the off-hand weapon, and the user's strength. Swinging two weapons at once is far faster than swinging each of the weapons individually, but only fast off-hand weapons add no penalty whatsoever to swing speed. For the lowest roundtime, the weapon in the off hand should be at least as fast as the weapon in the right hand and should not be very heavy. To use an off-hand weapon without penalty, you must have the following strength bonuses:

Off-hand Weight Minimum Strength Bonus
3 pounds +5
4 pounds +20
5 pounds +35

[petroglyph]

If you think the formula in the Wiki is wrong, I recommend correcting it! I didn't write it.

Also, you seem to be missing that he's asking specifically about ambushing, which will add to the minimum RT. If you can ambush with two falchions in 5 seconds, I'd like to see the log.

[Ososis]

If you think the formula in the Wiki is wrong, I recommend correcting it! I didn't write it.

Also, you seem to be missing that he's asking specifically about ambushing, which will add to the minimum RT. If you can ambush with two falchions in 5 seconds, I'd like to see the log.

You are being pretty snotty for being a wrong about base weapon speed. Obviously ambush takes more time, but if you’re math is putting a falchion and longsword at 6rt, then your math is off. Maybe some agi-decent is needed, maybe more strength or lighter off hand weapon weapon, but it’s pretty easy to swing two falchions at base 5 speed.

[Ososis]

Also, the idea that a Main gauche should EVER be a Main hand weapon is pretty appalling.

[Nordred]

@Nordred

I am using a falchion and a longsword. The Longsword does add a second round time in my left hand. If it is in my right hand, it turns to 9 seconds. Both are under 4 pounds (I think Longsword is 4 and Falchion is 3).

I always thought it was the Brig causing my RT to go up. I just have some basic 4x Brig.

I am almost up to 2 mil so I may start buying some better equipment. Also, at 27 trainings in armor.

Fal and longsword not a common combo, at least in my neck of the woods. Weapon weight really isn't an issue ever unless it's 8 lbs or higher I've found and only then it's minimal, if being held. You armor is fine. But that other guy is right, it is your weapon combo that's got your rt at that.

[karnamm]

Weird, randomly my RT has dropped. I am not sure if it was the beginning of this level or if it was during this level. Either way, it is now down to 6 second which I think is expected.

[Nothing]

Someone might have cast 509 on you, your stats went up and you're just now noticing the different RT, or you've been hunting slightly encumbered and put something in a locker/received a lightening service/etc.... or maybe you cleared the AIM verb and aren't actually aiming at any particular body part when you AMBUSH [critter]

[karnamm]

@nothing it must have been a stat that went up. Because nothing else has changed - I always keep pretty light. I always have 509 on me. I have to ambush cyclops legs to get them on the ground before I can cut off their hears. Either way, as you can imagine, I am thrilled about it!