27 yr old Female teacher charged with sleeping with male students

[xtc]

27 year old female teacher is charged with 15 counts of sexual battery against a 13 year old male student she slept with.

Where were these teachers when I was 13?


http://www.geocities.com/ianfca/pamelaturner.jpg

CNN Article (http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/02/09/teacher.charged.ap/index.html)

[StrayRogue]

I'd hit it.

[Kainen]

I hope they treat her like any other child molester.

[CrystalTears]

Are you sure that it was 15 counts for sexual battery and not because they weren't related? :D

I know I'll be a bad parent because all I could think of was high-fiving my son for scoring such a hot chick.

[Iriscience]

Damn I went to the wrong school

[Keller]

:clap:

[Makkah]

McMinnville is bum-fuck. I think it's like the original home of the KKK. Either there or cookeville. Anyways... McMinnville is like an hour from Chattanooga <3

[The Korean]

dude, that just put the kid on like exalted status in his school.

[Chadj]

Why the FUCK don't we have those in Canada?

[Kainen]

A teacher molests a child and it's cool? I don't get that. Way to promote double standards people.. would you think the same if a MALE teacher fucked a 13 yr old female student?

[Bobmuhthol]

Because no matter how much you want to argue about it, males > females. And because I doubt any of us boyz that posted care at all about the morale of it. I like to call it humor.

[Makkah]

That teacher dont even look 27...

[Hips]

Originally posted by Bobmuhthol
Because no matter how much you want to argue about it, males > females.

And you wonder why your ex wouldn't sleep with you? :lol:

:-O

If she was a redhead, they should have let her walk.

[Parkbandit]

Sorry.. I can't help it.

If a male teacher even looked at my 13 year old daughter.. he would be eating through a straw... best case senario.

If that hot teacher got it on with my 13 year old son.. I'd be giving him high 5's.

Sorry.. call me a doublestandardusingbastard.. but it's the truth.

[Bobmuhthol]

Originally posted by GS3 Michiko

Originally posted by Bobmuhthol
Because no matter how much you want to argue about it, males > females.

And you wonder why your ex wouldn't sleep with you? :lol:

I'm sorry for stating a simple fact. White males have always had the most power in the United States.

And my ex wouldn't sleep with me because I'm like 17 inches. She needed to practice on a smaller target first.

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by Bobmuhthol

Originally posted by GS3 Michiko

Originally posted by Bobmuhthol
Because no matter how much you want to argue about it, males > females.

And you wonder why your ex wouldn't sleep with you? :lol:

I'm sorry for stating a simple fact. White males have always had the most power in the United States.

And my ex wouldn't sleep with me because I'm like 17 inches. She needed to practice on a smaller target first.

Ok.. who forgot to tell Bob that it's his pee pee that get's put into the girls "special" place?

Bob.. gimme your Dad's number and I'll give him a heads up it's time for "THE Talk".

[Kainen]

Sad that people would find child molestation, regardless of the circumstance, cool in any way. After dealing with someone who molested one of my family members.. I can't say that I find it in myself to brand any form of it cool.

[CrystalTears]

Yes, it was wrong for her to have sex with him being so young. However you have to stop and think... 15 counts?? That's alot of times. After a couple that just had to be consensual. 15 times and the parents had no idea? We don't know what kind of relationship they had, who filed charges and why. Too many unanswered questions here.

[Bobmuhthol]

It's not molestation if the kid knows what's going on. And obviously he was fucking 15 bitches a day so he wasn't being exposed to anything traumatic. Good for him, I say. He got some before the Bobmeister.

[Kainen]

Originally posted by Bobmuhthol
It's not molestation if the kid knows what's going on. .

Oh so a 13 yr old girl that is being and KNOWS that she is being molested, isn't? What you said didn't make sense. I don't think that you realize that when kids are molested it often happens many more times than just once. The fact that you (and a few others) are trying to say "way to go 15 yr old boy" is rather sickening. The focus here really should be on the fact that a grown woman had sex with a minor asnd should have the same fate as any other sick fuck child molester.

[Hulkein]

I don't really think it's molestation.

Kind of different if the kid was for it, knew what to do, and was enjoying it. It's not like the standard molestation which is sickening.

[CrystalTears]

If it took the kid 15 times to realize he was being molested at the age of 13, he's a dumbfuck and shouldn't be screwing anything but a nail into a wall until he's in his 20's. :D

[Kainen]

Sorry.. it IS the same.. it's against the law.

[Bobmuhthol]

<<Oh so a 13 yr old girl that is being and KNOWS that she is being molested, isn't? What you said didn't make sense.>>

By knows what's going on, I didn't mean knows they're being molested. In fact, I presumed that it was NOT molestation and was very much consentual, due to the child KNOWING THAT THEY'RE BANGING THEIR TEACHER.

[Kainen]

Originally posted by CrystalTears
If it took the kid 15 times to realize he was being molested at the age of 13, he's a dumbfuck and shouldn't be screwing anything but a nail into a wall until he's in his 20's. :D

Tell that to a little girl who's daddy says that its ok because he loves her. That people are making light of what happened (especially parents) astonishes me. I think that I will just leave this subject alone after this.

[Bobmuhthol]

<<Sorry.. it IS the same.. it's against the law.>>

There's good crimes (possession of marijuana) and then there's bad crimes (possession of a dead hooker). If we were debating law, I'd totally agree. But we're not.

[Bobmuhthol]

<<Tell that to a little girl who's daddy says that its ok because he loves her.>>

That's not an aware child. In this instance, evidence shows that the child was very aware.

[CrystalTears]

My smilie faces at the end aren't working apparently. Humor ain't conveying well.

I've already said that it was wrong what she did. I just think it shouldn't be that serious of a charge when I have a gut feeling it was all consensual.

Besides I think there's a difference between a 13 year old having the hots for his sexy teacher, than a father who forces himself on his daughter.

[Miss X]

You know what? A 27 year old women sleeps with my 13 yr old son? I don't even think eating through a straw would be an option.

Children need to be protected, I don't care if they are 5 or 15, if they are below the age of consent then that means they cannot give their consent and have it mean anything. A 27 year old woman should know better, I cant understand how a 13 year old CHILD is attractive to a grown woman.

Just like others have said, if it was a male teacher and a 13 year old girl everyone would be saying how disgusting it was. If you are in a position of authority as this woman was you have to know where to draw the line about what type of contact is acceptable and what isnt. You also need to be aware of the laws of the country you live in and the code of conduct for your place of work. I hope she gets locked up for a long time and goes on the sex offenders register if you guys have one in the US.

[Bobmuhthol]

<<I cant understand how a 13 year old CHILD is attractive to a grown woman.>>

I'd do plenty of 27-year-olds.

<<Just like others have said, if it was a male teacher and a 13 year old girl everyone would be saying how disgusting it was.>>

Then it would be. Don't make a new situation. What happened happened. Nothing else.

[DeV]

She's a hot child molester who will become somebody's wife in jail for a while. As a parent if it were my daughter, I'd be in jail for murder. If it were my son, I'd tell him to fuck with bitches his own age.

There is a double standard. That's just the way it is.

[Miss X]

Bob, I wasn't saying that a 13 year old boy wouldn't want to fuck a 27 year old woman. I was saying that as a grown woman myself I do not understand how a 13 year old boy is sexually attractive. Hell, I would have trouble sleeping with someone under 20 without feeling weird!

Also, I think I would feel pretty disgusted with myself if I had a 13 year old child who was having sex, boy or girl.

[Hulkein]

Originally posted by Kainen
Sorry.. it IS the same.. it's against the law.

Yeah it's against the law, it's not the same though.

[HarmNone]

Originally posted by Bobmuhthol
<<I cant understand how a 13 year old CHILD is attractive to a grown woman.>>

I'd do plenty of 27-year-olds.


That's not the issue, Bob. Of course, most 13-year-old kids would "do" a 27-year-old they found attractive. However, the opposite is not true under normal circumstances. Most 27-year-olds would NOT "do" a 13-year-old kid, since most take their responsibilities as adults more seriously than that.

[Latrinsorm]

Originally posted by Miss X
I hope she gets locked up for a long time and goes on the sex offenders register if you guys have one in the US. We do have one, and I would be extremely surprised if "sexual battery of a minor" isn't one of the things that gets you on there.

I really don't think it's consentual, and here's why:

Sexual battery
Sexual battery is unlawful sexual contact with a victim by the defendant or the defendant by a victim accompanied by any of the following circumstances:
Force or coercion is used to accomplish the act;
The sexual contact is accomplished without the consent of the victim and the defendant knows or has reason to know at the time of the contact that the victim did not consent;
The defendant knows or has reason to know that the victim is mentally defective, mentally incapacitated or physically helpless; or
The sexual contact is accomplished by fraud.

If the only problem was that the kid was too young, then it would be statutory rape.

[StrayRogue]

At 13, if a hot older women offered me sex, I'd have said YES. Just my point of view.

[Bobmuhthol]

Yeah I read attractive as attracted, my bad.

[HarmNone]

Heh. I've done that myself, Bob. Sometimes, our minds rearrange the written word for us, and without asking our permission to do so. ;)

[HarmNone]

Originally posted by StrayRogue
At 13, if a hot older women offered me sex, I'd have said YES. Just my point of view.

I imagine that would apply to most 13-year-olds, Stay. At that age, most are unable to discern the obvious inequities in such a relationship, and they're left very vulnerable to being hurt emotionally and, at times, physically. It's sad that such things take place, and the onus of guilt must be borne by the adult in these situations.

It is a double standard. She is hot. The kid is a hero. He is not scarred. He got lucky. Now shut the fuck up and stop being stupid.

- Arkans

[HarmNone]

Originally posted by Arkans
It is a double standard. She is hot. The kid is a hero. He is not scarred. He got lucky. Now shut the fuck up and stop being stupid.

- Arkans

WHAT is a double standard, Arkans, and who, exactly, are you accusing of stupidity?

In all honesty, disagreeing with you does not automatically equate to stupidity.

The double standard is this...

If it was a male teacher with a female student, he would be a sick fuck and the girl would be a victim. Not only that, but everyone would love to see that teacher behind bars.

It is not the case with a hot teacher and a male student. The kid is lucky and the teacher is hot. I'd go for it in his position and so would any normal, straight, male student. It is just the way it goes. The only mental anguish that might be going on is the fact that this kid isn't getting any more ass.

I am accusing Kainin on his/her first post really for being ticked at a double standard. Well, news flash, it is. It's just the way we are culturally.

So... VIVA LA TEACHER!

- Arkans

[HarmNone]

Welp, as far as I'm concerned, the female teacher is just as much a "sick fuck" as a male teacher, caught in the same idiocy, would be. No double standard that I can see. A "sick fuck" is a "sick fuck". Gender is irrelevant.

As to the child (again, regardless of gender) suffering ill effects, when you have garnered considerable experience in dealing with the results of situations like this, I'll be fascinated to hear your opinions. Until then, I shall continue to chuckle for a moment, then yawn.

While you are entitled to your opinions, whether educated or not, those opinions do not necessarily indicate the way of things. They simply indicate your idea of the way of things. Others might hold differing opinions. I certainly do.

Vive la teacher spending a considerable amount of time behind bars considering her less than intelligent choices. :)

[DeV]

Yeah. Let's be realistic here. Yes, the kid is going to be revered by his friends and his social status will increase greatly or maybe not. Look at the kid Mary Kate fucked with. He is literally that, fucked up and left with two kids to care for in the end and no real life to speak of.

So, in essense, the teacher is HOT <-- we got that one established and very much the object of sexual desire by any normal sexually charged male(and female in some cases), regardless of age. But, she also has a sickness and you have to wonder why she couldn't find another hot 20-27 year old guy to ruffle her feathers.

[Brattt8525]

Of course there is a double standard when it comes to a boy/girl having sex. If the boy is having sex the dad will high five him, if it is his daughter, the guy banging his daughter better hire a bodyguard. We have established the fact that the guys here are all woohooing and stating they would bang her as well at that age. Point taken.

My concern is with first the child, because he is just that no matter how well he can get his dick up. Second is the pretty woman who feels the need to fuck little boys, that in itself is distrubing. As another poster said, why is such a pretty woman preying on young boys? She needs help and needs to not be allowed to be in situations with any child again, period.

[Latrinsorm]

Originally posted by Brattt8525
We have established the fact that the guys here are all woohooing and stating they would bang her as well at that age.Just like all the chicks here said they would love to get eaten out by the teacher.

[DeV]

Originally posted by Latrinsorm

Originally posted by Brattt8525
We have established the fact that the guys here are all woohooing and stating they would bang her as well at that age.Just like all the chicks here said they would love to get eaten out by the teacher. Eh, all what chicks said that?

I must have missed something.

[Brattt8525]

Originally posted by DeV

Originally posted by Latrinsorm

Originally posted by Brattt8525
We have established the fact that the guys here are all woohooing and stating they would bang her as well at that age.Just like all the chicks here said they would love to get eaten out by the teacher. Eh, all what chicks said that?

I must have missed something.

I missed it too, must have been his wishful thinking? :D

[Makkah]

Yea, I'll admit it's probable the kid will grow up fucked up in the head...

[SpunGirl]

I can see why the kid was into it if it was, in fact, consensual (and it looks like it was). The teacher is still a fucking pervert, though. You'd think a chick that hot could get an adult guy who actually knew what he was doing instead of some adolescent five second lovah.

-K

[HarmNone]

A child of 13 is not emotionally capable, much less legally qualified, to consent to sexual relations. I don't care if it happens once, or 50 times, the child is not old enough to have the emotional experience to make the decision to consent. It's really as simple as that.

[Flurbins]

You gotta feel bad for this chick's husband, having her cheat on him with a little kid.

[Insodus]

It is rather humorous. My only beef is that she get a punishment equal to her crime. I mean, how much is that kid really hurt by this? Not at all probably. The only thing hurting him now is all this media coverage going to his head. Charging her with that many counts she's probably going to jail for a long time, and its just unnecesary. I say a year in mimimum, tops.

[crazymage]

i'll punish her, send her to my house.

[SpunGirl]

Originally posted by HarmNone
the child is not old enough to have the emotional experience to make the decision to consent. It's really as simple as that.

I agree with you, HN, but there are kids doing it with each other where neither of them is old enough (IMO) to make that decision. We might argue that Bob isn't old enough to know what he's getting into, but he certainly doesn't see it that way. It doesn't mean the teacher should take advantage of that, which is why it's good that she was punished. She should be there to encourage learning, not sex.

-K

[HarmNone]

I think that's the point that needs to be made, Spun. Whether or not kids get involved in activities for which they are not emotionally prepared is a moot point. They're gonna do it. They've been doing it for years. They survive, as long as an adult doesn't get involved in the mix. Once an adult does get involved in the mix, the anti goes up exponentially, and there is a much greater chance of emotional damage to the child...lasting emotional damage.

[Bobmuhthol]

<<We might argue that Bob isn't old enough to know what he's getting into, but he certainly doesn't see it that way.>>

I'm getting into 15 bitches a day.

Argue all you want, I'm old enough to know that when the clothes come off, I am a master of my domain.

[HarmNone]

Bob, sometimes I just can't suppress the giggles. :rofl:

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by Makkah
Yea, I'll admit it's probable the kid will grow up fucked up in the head...

:?:

How do you figure? If I banged my hot teacher at age 13.. I wouldn't all of a sudden be 'fucked up' later on in life because of it.

Certainly, she should be prosecuted because what she did was against the law.. but she gets time off for just being hot.

[Warriorbird]

So you don't think little girls who get banged by their teachers will end up fucked up later?

Not making any moral judgements, but that's a damn large double standard.

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by Warriorbird
So you don't think little girls who get banged by their teachers will end up fucked up later?

Not making any moral judgements, but that's a damn large double standard.

I KNOW it's a complete double standard... please see my post on the first page.

I don't know why I think like that.. but yea, I think a girl would somehow be fucked up if she was molested by an older teacher.. but a boy who banged a hot teacher? Since I can't put myself in the place of the girl.. but can completely relate to the boy, I guess that is where my double standard comes from.

It's sort of like how I think lipstick lesbian love is great.. but if you put two really attractive guys together... ew.

Call me flawed.

[Warriorbird]

Eh, I don't think it's really on the same level. Lipstick lesbians vs. hot looking gay guys is something you'd use for arousal purpouses. This is someone's life, here.

[Allycat]

Originally posted by HarmNone
Welp, as far as I'm concerned, the female teacher is just as much a "sick fuck" as a male teacher, caught in the same idiocy, would be. No double standard that I can see. A "sick fuck" is a "sick fuck". Gender is irrelevant.

As to the child (again, regardless of gender) suffering ill effects, when you have garnered considerable experience in dealing with the results of situations like this, I'll be fascinated to hear your opinions. Until then, I shall continue to chuckle for a moment, then yawn.

While you are entitled to your opinions, whether educated or not, those opinions do not necessarily indicate the way of things. They simply indicate your idea of the way of things. Others might hold differing opinions. I certainly do.

Vive la teacher spending a considerable amount of time behind bars considering her less than intelligent choices. :)


From the beginning of this post, til this one, I kept on thinking.. Why the fuck are some of these people so absolutely disturbed? I got it.. because you are just as sick as this teacher, if you think it was "ok" for this to happen. It angers me that people live in this world that would applaud/^5 their child for getting it on with an adult. I personally do not believe that if you have children, you deserve to have them if you view it this way. Even if their is a double standard.. 13 is a child.

I have a 13 yr old daughter and if the situation were reversed, just as someone had said prior.. I'd be going to jail for murder. I don't care if she was a boy, same thing would apply.

I applaud Harmnone for saying basically what I would have said. The teacher is a "sick fuck" and deserves to go to jail. I saw her husband interviewed the other night on Larry King and he was quite attractive, so not sure what the issue was in their life or not, happy or not.. she should not have turned to a CHILD.

-Ally

[Wezas]

Originally posted by Bobmuhthol
<<I cant understand how a 13 year old CHILD is attractive to a grown woman.>>

I'd do plenty of 27-year-olds.


But how many hot 27 year olds have wanted to do you? :smilegrin:

[Axhinde]

The double standard derives from the two sexes' emotional process, in this case concerning sex. A young woman's "first" is a very tender, impressionable, and soemtimes binding emotional feeling that shapes her view on each sexual experience. A young male's view on sex changes with each individual partner. I hardly judge the last chick I fucked based on my first, in fact I don't judge them at all. As long as I get them in the sack, victory is mine.

I don't condone this teacher's actions at all. As a teacher and an adult she should have the capability to know what she did was wrong, and I believe she does. But a lot of people just don't understand that some people are just plain fucked up. It's the way of the world, not everything and everybody is honky dorey. It really makes me wonder why people never venture out of the shell they call life.

[Jadewolff]

Not every young man is like that. There are tons of cases of younger men being "emotionally" obsessed with older women that are just screwing them. And i'm not only talking about 13 year olds either.

Men/boys are just as sensitive and CAN fall for the hot teacher and therefore, be emotionally disturbed. Not all men are about getting as much sex as possible regardless of what shit comes out of their mouth. They are affected.

Yes, it's a double standard to an extent. But by saying the guy, in no way, will be emotionally affected is naive.

[Bobmuhthol]

Says the chick who is not a man.

[Jadewolff]

I may not be a man...but I have "known" men :D

[Warriorbird]

And Bob... can you seriously tell me that all 13 year olds are as mature (perhaps jaded) and intelligent as you?

[xtc]

Originally posted by HarmNone
A child of 13 is not emotionally capable, much less legally qualified, to consent to sexual relations. I don't care if it happens once, or 50 times, the child is not old enough to have the emotional experience to make the decision to consent. It's really as simple as that.

In Canada a child can consent at age 14, however the law in Canada uses a graduated scale. A 14 year old can consent to having sex with someone up to the age of 16, anyone older than that then it is a crime. At 16 you have free to screw whoever you choose.

If the sex was consenual and the boy is not mentally deficient in anyway then I highly doubt the kid is scarred. At 13 I would have love to have got me some why a hot teacher. That said one does have to wonder what a 27 year old attractive women sees in a 13 year old boy. From that perspective it is creepy.

[Edited on 2-10-2005 by xtc]

[Axhinde]

:lol:

Just so there aren't any disillusions about this whole thing, IF a man does become emotionally affected by sex, it's usually for a short period of time or until he bangs his next broad. I hate to use those terms, but that's how it is. Men are primal in that sense, please don't ever think otherwise.

[Tsa`ah]

Originally posted by Bobmuhthol
Says the chick who is not a man.

And neither are you.

A 13 year old boy has just as much of a chance of developing sociological and psychological issue through sexual contact with a "mature" adult as a 13 year old girl.

The girl actually has a better chance coming out of it in better shape than a boy due to emotional maturity that like aged boys lack.

The boy was molested, be it via consent (that no 13 year old child has the maturity to give) or rape.

[Tsa`ah]

Originally posted by Axhinde
:lol:

Just so there aren't any disillusions about this whole thing, IF a man does become emotionally affected by sex, it's usually for a short period of time or until he bangs his next broad. I hate to use those terms, but that's how it is. Men are primal in that sense, please don't ever think otherwise.

And you would be very much incorrect.

[Bobmuhthol]

<<And Bob... can you seriously tell me that all 13 year olds are as mature (perhaps jaded) and intelligent as you?>>

I've been labelled immature and unintelligent on more than one occasion, so it's hard for me to regard myself higher than my peers.

[DeV]

Originally posted by Tsa`ah

Originally posted by Axhinde
:lol:

Just so there aren't any disillusions about this whole thing, IF a man does become emotionally affected by sex, it's usually for a short period of time or until he bangs his next broad. I hate to use those terms, but that's how it is. Men are primal in that sense, please don't ever think otherwise.

And you would be very much incorrect. Case in point.. the boy Mary Kate was with.


Believe it or not men have a greater capacity for romantic love than women in general. The wham bam thank you ma'am image is not as widespread as one would think.

[Warriorbird]

"I've been labelled immature and unintelligent on more than one occasion, so it's hard for me to regard myself higher than my peers. "

Which is precisely what seperates you from the typical. I was called both those things a lot.

[Edited on 2-10-2005 by Warriorbird]

[Tsa`ah]

I was referring to the fact that sexually active children (10-16) have a higher rate of suicide. 3x higher for girls, 8x higher for boys.

Boys exhibit far more problems at that age (while sexually active) than girls.

Poor academic performance/attendance, social anxiety, aggression, co-dependent ... a huge list.

[Parkbandit]

I can only go on how I think I would have reacted if that fucking hot teacher let me bang her when I was 13. I'm pretty damn sure I wouldn't be any worse off than I am today.

:spin:

[Tsa`ah]

I'd bet you would be wrong.

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by Tsa`ah
I'd bet you would be wrong.

I think I know myself better than anyone.. and I can completely assure you I'd be fine.

In fact, I could argue that this encounter would have given me a story to tell in College.. which would further propel my popularity and would no doubt get me laid even more.

I feel that I have actually been HURT by not getting seduced by a hot teacher. Who can I sue for that?

[xtc]

Originally posted by Tsa`ah
I was referring to the fact that sexually active children (10-16) have a higher rate of suicide. 3x higher for girls, 8x higher for boys.

Boys exhibit far more problems at that age (while sexually active) than girls.

Poor academic performance/attendance, social anxiety, aggression, co-dependent ... a huge list.

Just a question. Is this the study done by the Heritage Foundation the conservative think tank?

[DeV]

Originally posted by Parkbandit
I can only go on how I think I would have reacted if that fucking hot teacher let me bang her when I was 13. I'm pretty damn sure I wouldn't be any worse off than I am today.

:spin: I think it's actually more normal for you to have those feelings at age 13 of wanting to be with a hot older woman.
We all experience it at some point or another. To have acted on it ... that's a completely different ball game.

[Tsa`ah]

Haha

The person you are today was defined by your reactions leading up to today.

Had you banged your hot teacher at 13 years old, chances are you would be considering going back to college at this stage in life ... community college.

If you were married at this point, chances are it would be no less than your second marriage.

Chances are you would marry someone who is likely to molest other 13 year old children. Chances are you would marry someone who you know, deep down, is going to disappoint you.

Chances are you would have attempted suicide at least once.

Chances are, with poor academic performance and habits; you would be in debt to your ears and considering another bankruptcy.

Chances are you would live in a trailer park ... or with mom and dad assuming you never married.

[Tsa`ah]

Originally posted by xtc
Just a question. Is this the study done by the Heritage Foundation the conservative think tank?

National Center for Health Statistics.

Compiled findings.

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by Tsa`ah
Haha

The person you are today was defined by your reactions leading up to today.

Had you banged your hot teacher at 13 years old, chances are you would be considering going back to college at this stage in life ... community college.

If you were married at this point, chances are it would be no less than your second marriage.

Chances are you would marry someone who is likely to molest other 13 year old children. Chances are you would marry someone who you know, deep down, is going to disappoint you.

Chances are you would have attempted suicide at least once.

Chances are, with poor academic performance and habits; you would be in debt to your ears and considering another bankruptcy.

Chances are you would live in a trailer park ... or with mom and dad assuming you never married.

You would be incorrect on all counts. You can't use your statistical basis to determine how an individual would react. Your predictions were more absurd than mine.. and I was kidding.

Just because I didn't get to bang Mrs. Grainger back in the 6th grade didn't make me so I think suicide is stupid. Nor did my not getting it on with Mrs. Norwood in my highschool health class make it so I would not live in a trailer.

Thing is.. it would affect different people differently. In my case, I contend that I would have no negative impact on my future if I got laid by my hot teacher. It would not define who I became later on as I simply do not see sex as that tramatic.

[Warriorbird]

More fun role reversal. Would you have been okay if Mrs. Grainger had been Mr. Grainger? Or both of them?

[DeV]

The person you are today is definied by your prior actions.

I'd be more keen to believe the statistical data than your one account of what *may* have happened had you taken advantage of the opportunity to sleep with your 6th grade teacher. Those statistics are from kids who have done it and not just thought about or wondered about doing it and it never happened.

I see your point though... but in any case how do you know for certain you would have turned out the normal, well adjusted man you are today? Hell, I don't know how different of a person I would be had I slept with the guy who tried to get in my pants at 16. Those are such impressionable ages to begin with.

Eh, who knows.

[Jadewolff]

Just to clarify, I was not at all saying the boy is or has been affected by this. I said he "can" be affected by it and by saying he is or isn't is pure speculation since NONE of us know him personally.

And going along with that, it is a crime (and does not have to be a double standard) because he could have been regardless of whether he was or not.

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by Warriorbird
More fun role reversal. Would you have been okay if Mrs. Grainger had been Mr. Grainger? Or both of them?

I've already admitted to having a huge double standard on this and other issues. If Mr. Grainger tried to molest me? I would tell my father.. and my father has a worse temper than I do. Mr. Grainger would be dead and I would still be visiting my father in prison.

[Miss X]

Yeah, and jail is where you would be visiting me if some 27 year old female pervert put her hands on my 13yr old son.

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by DeV
The person you are today is definied by your prior actions.

I'd be more keen to believe the statistical data than your one account of what *may* have happened had you taken advantage of the opportunity to sleep with your 6th grade teacher. Those statistics are from kids who have done it and not just thought about or wondered about doing it and it never happened.

I see your point though... but in any case how do you know for certain you would have turned out the normal, well adjusted man you are today? Hell, I don't know how different of a person I would be had I slept with the guy who tried to get in my pants at 16. Those are such impressionable ages to begin with.

Eh, who knows.

Because I know me. I know for a FACT that I would not be any different today if it did happen. I'm sorry, because obviously I cannot provide proof.. I just know how I react to things.

I've been asked how I would feel if I killed a burglar who broke into our home. I KNOW that I would lose zero sleep over it and I've never killed a human being in my life. I would have zero guilt for doing so. I just know me... I know how I am wired. I know that if I killed someone due to my incompetence.. I would have a very tough time and it would affect me and my life, but a burglar that broke into my home? Nope.

[CrystalTears]

I don't see how that role reversal would apply since I'm almost sure that if ANY male would take advantage of another male like PB, teacher, father, brother, uncle, friend.. whatever... they'd be offended by it.

[DeV]

At 13 most boys are just learning the ropes on how girls function emotionally and sexually(if they get that far) and how they can get their hands/dick up a girls shirt or down her pants. A situation like this is what, one in a million. I think it happens more than we are aware because not everyone who goes after teens are careless and get themselves caught.

PB, I believe you, but I also know your perceived reactions wouldn't be the norm in that type of situation.

[xtc]

Originally posted by Tsa`ah

Originally posted by xtc
Just a question. Is this the study done by the Heritage Foundation the conservative think tank?

National Center for Health StatisticsI was referring to the fact that sexually active children (10-16) have a higher rate of suicide. 3x higher for girls, 8x higher for boys.

Boys exhibit far more problems at that age (while sexually active) than girls.

Poor academic performance/attendance, social anxiety, aggression, co-dependent ... a huge list

Compiled findings.

I went the National Center for Health Statistics and was unable to find any study. This doesn't mean it doesn't exist, just that their compiled statistics are rather large.

I did find this study which does and doesn't support Tsa'ah's claims. The study was done by the Heritage Foundation which may be looking for reasons to dissuade teen sex.

They concluded that teens having sex are more likely to commit suicide than those abstaining. However the percentage of suicides in sexually active boys is quite a bit lower than the percentage of suicide in sexually active girls. But the rate of increase in suicide in those who had sex, as opposed to those who abstained, was greater in the boys than the girls.

SEXUALLY ACTIVE

14.3 % of teenage girls who were sexually active attempted suicide while

only 6% of teenage boys who were sexually active attempted suicide.

NOT SEXUALLY ACTIVE

5.1 % attempted suicide rate in girls who weren't sexually active

0.7% attempted suicide rate in boys who weren't sexually active.


In the study girls also had a higher rate of depression than the boys both in those who are sexually active and those who were not.

http://www.heritage.org/Research/Family/cda0304.cfm

[Edited on 2-10-2005 by xtc]

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by Miss X
Yeah, and jail is where you would be visiting me if some 27 year old female pervert put her hands on my 13yr old son.

Can you get it right please? She's a 27 year old HOT female pervert.

[HarmNone]

Originally posted by Parkbandit

Originally posted by Miss X
Yeah, and jail is where you would be visiting me if some 27 year old female pervert put her hands on my 13yr old son.

Can you get it right please? She's a 27 year old HOT female pervert.

I think I sense the ferret of facetiousness running around in this thread. Is that you, Parkbandit? ;)

HarmNone, playing flip the ferret

:axe:

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by HarmNone

Originally posted by Parkbandit

Originally posted by Miss X
Yeah, and jail is where you would be visiting me if some 27 year old female pervert put her hands on my 13yr old son.

Can you get it right please? She's a 27 year old HOT female pervert.

I think I sense the ferret of facetiousness running around in this thread. Is that you, Parkbandit? ;)

HarmNone, playing flip the ferret

:axe:

I'm not sure what you just said.. but it sounded dirty.

Daddy like.

:smilegrin:

[HarmNone]

Dictionary.com is your friend! :D

I'm not sure about this topic. Is there any further info available. Like, how close was the kid to turning 14, and had the teacher JUST turned 27 or anything? Then it wouldn't be quite so bad...:D

[HarmNone]

Originally posted by Warriorbird
So you don't think little girls who get banged by their teachers will end up fucked up later?

Not making any moral judgements, but that's a damn large double standard.

I don't think anyone is saying that little girls aren't left with emotional baggage to tote when this kind of thing happens to them. They most certainly are.

The problem arises when people arbitrarily decide, based on what they determine they would have felt, but using adult thinking to do so, that little boys aren't going to suffer any adverse effects. That is just not the case the majority of the time.

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by Tea & Strumpets
I'm not sure about this topic. Is there any further info available. Like, how close was the kid to turning 14, and had the teacher JUST turned 27 or anything? Then it wouldn't be quite so bad...:D

LOL

[Methais]

Originally posted by Kainen
Sad that people would find child molestation, regardless of the circumstance, cool in any way. After dealing with someone who molested one of my family members.. I can't say that I find it in myself to brand any form of it cool.

So to you it's molestation solely based on the fact that he's 13, but had he been 18 and the circumstances were exactly the same otherwise, it wouldn't be?

You know if you were in that kid's shoes you'd be nailing your teacher too. I can think of several teachers in school I wanted to lay down some pipe with, and if any of them ever gave it up for me, I'd hardly call it molestation.

Catholic priest + altar boys = molestation

Sexually charged flaring hornonal teen kid that wants to get laid + horny teacher consentually getting it on with each other = not molestation.

mo·lest ( P ) Pronunciation Key (m-lst)
tr.v. mo·lest·ed, mo·lest·ing, mo·lests

1. To disturb, interfere with, or annoy.
2. To subject to unwanted or improper sexual activity.

Obviously it wasn't unwanted, and "improper" is a matter of opinion, and obviously both of their opinions didn't feel it was improper or he wouldn't have been banging her to begin with.

As far as "it's against the law" goes... oral sex in certain states/counties is also against the law. You gonna tell me you've turned down a blowjob because it was technically against the law?

"What are you doing dear?"

"I'm about to give you head so incredible that your eyeballs will explode."

"No dear, we can't do that. It's against the law."

[HarmNone]

1. To disturb, interfere with, or annoy.
2. To subject to unwanted or improper sexual activity.

Obviously it wasn't unwanted, and "improper" is a matter of opinion, and obviously both of their opinions didn't feel it was improper or he wouldn't have been banging her to begin with.

Improper is the key word, regardless of "their" opinions on the matter. Serial killers don't find killing people "improper". While that may be a touch of circular reasoning, it's applicable in this case. It is definitely improper for an adult to engage in sexual activity with a minor, for myriad reasons, the most important of which is that the minor is not really capable of making sound decisions as to what is age-appropriate behavior and what is not.

All kinds of excuses can be made for such behaviors on the part of the teacher, and all kinds of rationalizations can be advanced as to why this is not a major issue. When you have dealt with the results of events such as this, it isn't too difficult to sort the wheat from the chaff.

[Methais]

Who is to decide (besides those fatass lawmakers that have their heads up their asses anyway so who really gives a shit about half of the pointless laws they make) at what age you're old enough to make sound decisions? The law says when you turn 18 you're capable of making these decisions, but not a day earlier while you're still 17? On the contrary, by your logic, age shouldn't matter if the 27 year old wasn't able to make a "sound decision as to waht is age-appropriate behavior", so really what does age have to do with how capable you are? Age is just a number. I know plenty of stupid people 18+ and I know plenty of people under 18 that are way smarter and more capable than a lot of 18+ people.

The difference between a serial killer and a 27 chick and 13 year old guy getting it on is that murder is illegal worldwide. Granted all this happened in the States where the legal age of consent is 18 (which is stupid if you ask me), but the fact that it's "improper" in this country doesn't mean that it's carved in stone by God himself as being improper.

<<Serial killers don't find killing people "improper">>

The difference is that in this case, neither person felt it was improper. I'm sure the guy getting killed by the serial killer would find being murdered as improper. And if for some reason they didn't, more power to the serial killer for finding consenting victims.



It's more a matter of WHERE they were fucking than a matter of whether it was improper or not due to age. If they were in Spain getting it on, nobody here would find anything wrong with it because the legal age of consent in Spain is 13.

http://www.ageofconsent.com/ageofconsent.htm

All that being said, I think the whole story is a hoax. Everybody knows that female PhysEd teachers are dykes. :lol:

[Edited on 2-10-2005 by Haashek]


[Edited on 2-10-2005 by Methais]

[Parkbandit]

I won't defend her by saying the laws are stupid.. because a 27 year old teacher shouldn't be having sex with her 13 year old student. Period.

That does not mean I wouldn't hit it if I were in his shoes... and I certainly wouldn't feel molested in any way.

[HarmNone]

There is no doubt that some 13-year-olds are more mature than many 20-somethings. :whistle:

However, a line must be drawn somewhere. In this country that line is drawn above the age of 13. This did not occur in Spain.

Who are you to say that this particular 13-year-old was capable of making informed decisions with regard to adult situations, Methais? Considering the norm, it's more apt that he was not.

[Bobmuhthol]

Once my uncle's cousin's brother raped me. You know what I didn't do about it? Cry or kill myself. I took that ass pounding like a man.

In all seriousness, the kid's fine.

[HarmNone]

I really do understand what you guys are saying, and I'm not trying to be argumentative, nor to invalidate your thoughts/opinions. However, I have dealt with the results of things like this. They don't always show themselves immediately. Sometimes, it takes years for the damage to begin to eat away at the individual's trust and self-esteem, often leaving them with issues that render them unable to function to their potential in the adult world. In short, it is certainly not to be taken lightly.

[Jonty]

Originally posted by HarmNone
The problem arises when people arbitrarily decide, based on what they determine they would have felt, but using adult thinking to do so, that little boys aren't going to suffer any adverse effects. That is just not the case the majority of the time.

But when a teenager says the same thing, using a teenage mind, people tell them they're too young to know what they're talking about.

[DeV]

What 13 year old wouldn't want to take advantage of that given the chance.

She (the hot chick) is sick in the head. Period.

[Parkbandit]

Originally posted by DeV
What 13 year old wouldn't want to take advantage of that given the chance.

She (the hot chick) is sick in the head. Period.

Yea, but she's hot so it's like a wash.

[DeV]

lol

It's weird though. After that, how can a girl your age even come close.

[HarmNone]

Originally posted by Jonty

Originally posted by HarmNone
The problem arises when people arbitrarily decide, based on what they determine they would have felt, but using adult thinking to do so, that little boys aren't going to suffer any adverse effects. That is just not the case the majority of the time.

But when a teenager says the same thing, using a teenage mind, people tell them they're too young to know what they're talking about.

If you mean when a teenager says something like: "This isn't going to hurt me, ever. I know what I'm doing and I understand all the possible consequences.", it's not that they don't know what they're talking about. They do. They simply don't know as much about the possible consequences as they think they do. Much knowledge comes from experience.

[Vad]

A guy I was in tech school with at Keesler AFB had the exact same thing happen to him. He had even saved a newspaper with the article and her picture. He thought it was awesome. I'd have to agree, she was hot.

He's now an ICBM maintainer here at Minot with a top secret clearance (Obviously no history of therapy, poverty, attempted suicide, or any other immediately disqualifying factors) and happily married for several years.

Oops. There goes that theory..

-V

[HarmNone]

One exception does not a theory invalidate, Vad. There are exceptions to everything.

[Bobmuhthol]

<<One exception does not a theory invalidate, Vad.>>

One exception does, in fact, a theory invalidate.

<<There are exceptions to everything.>>

Is there an exception to this?

[Tsa`ah]

Originally posted by Bobmuhthol
<<One exception does not a theory invalidate, Vad.>>

One exception does, in fact, a theory invalidate.

<<There are exceptions to everything.>>

Is there an exception to this?

So you're saying that one person not dying of lung cancer after years of smoking disproves that smoking in fact causes lung cancer?

Spam boy ... you have logic issues.

[Bobmuhthol]

<<So you're saying that one person not dying of lung cancer after years of smoking disproves that smoking in fact causes lung cancer?

Spam boy ... you have logic issues.>>

The theory "if you smoke, then you will get lung cancer" is disproved when one person does not. You have logic issues. I have margin of error issues. Logic is on my side.

[Tsa`ah]

If by logic you mean retardation ... then ya.

You can believe what you want, even that you are correct, that doesn't make it so.

[Bobmuhthol]

So you have nothing in the way of an actual argument, and fail to acknowledge that you can not supercede logic. Good to know.

You can shut up any time.

[Warriorbird]

Oddly sounds sort've like the arguments used by me, you, and several other members of this site upon occassion.


So, Methais... if a girl or a boy consented to a male teacher, it'd be a problem, but if a boy consents to a female teacher, it isn't a problem.

Funny.

[Tsa`ah]

Originally posted by Bobmuhthol
So you have nothing in the way of an actual argument, and fail to acknowledge that you can not supercede logic. Good to know.

You can shut up any time.

No, you wish to argue against logic and site logic (that doesn't support your argument) as supportive.

It is known that smoking increases one's risk of cancer. It's damned near a solid conclusion to one's life.

The exceptions do not disprove the dangers of smoking, just as those that turn out "normal" after molestation do not disprove the inherent psychological damage caused by the act.

You chose the same route you always chose and claim the facts and logic are incorrect. Your claims do not make it so.

So let's hear some more "logic" spam boy.

[Tsa`ah]

What I'm curious about, and honestly so, is how those hi-fiving their 13 year old sons after statutory rape and molestation would react when their son contracted and STD or became a father to be.

What is your reaction at that point?

Since it is no longer a "positive" experience do you sue?

You boy, who bagged a hot teacher, is going to be a daddy ... or die of AIDS.

Hi-fives for that?

Originally posted by Tsa`ah
What I'm curious about, and honestly so, is how those hi-fiving their 13 year old sons after statutory rape and molestation would react when their son contracted and STD or became a father to be.

What is your reaction at that point?

Since it is no longer a "positive" experience do you sue?

You boy, who bagged a hot teacher, is going to be a daddy ... or die of AIDS.

Hi-fives for that?

That would sucketh.

[HarmNone]

Actually, Bob is right. One exception does, in fact, invalidate a theory. Remind me not to post when I'm running late. ;)

What I should have said is:

The fact that one person, or several people, or hundreds of people, do not suffer a common consequence related to a specific event in their lives does not invalidate the experience of the majority of people who are exposed to that same event; nor, does the failure of those few to suffer said consequence mean that others will not suffer it. The probability remains that the event will result in said consequence(s).

[Bobmuhthol]

<<Actually, Bob is right. One exception does, in fact, invalidate a theory.>>

HEY TSA`AH, SHUT THE FUCK UP YOU STUPID FUCK. I WIN AGAIN. FUCK YOU.

[HarmNone]

That, Bob, was totally unnecessary. I am the one who made the error, because I was in a rush. Nevertheless, while an exception does invalidate a theory, the fact that some people don't suffer ill effects from trauma such as that being discussed doesn't change the fact that the majority, regardless of gender, do. That fact still holds true, and that is the matter that Tsa`ah (and I, despite having misstated) was addressing.

[Edited on 2-11-2005 by HarmNone]

[Bobmuhthol]

He was wrong. He needs to shut the fuck up and stop being a complete dickhead. It was absolutely necessary. How can he possibly expect to be taken seriously when 100% of his posts directed at me have "spam boy" in them?

When Tsa`ah takes a razor to his wrists for being so fucking stupid I'll be happy. Until then, I'll continue being right. Which means I'll post any way I please involving that worthless sack of shit.

[Keller]

Originally posted by Bobmuhthol
He was wrong. He needs to shut the fuck up and stop being a complete dickhead. It was absolutely necessary. How can he possibly expect to be taken seriously when 100% of his posts directed at me have "spam boy" in them?

When Tsa`ah takes a razor to his wrists for being so fucking stupid I'll be happy. Until then, I'll continue being right. Which means I'll post any way I please involving that worthless sack of shit.

Not a morning person, are you?

[Edited on 2-11-2005 by Keller]

[Bobmuhthol]

:)

I woke up less than 3 minutes from the first post. But now I have a 2 hour delay so I feel a lot better. No geometry quiz, no English class. <3 <3 <3. :heart:.

[Nieninque]

I love how (some) people are celebrating the fact that this 13 year old boy got off with his 27 year old teacher.

The same people would be likely to be the ones bemoaning feminism and the women's movement, saying that women have it better than men now and men are the oppressed ones.

Strange world innit?

[HarmNone]

Oddly enough, Bob, you are not right all the time, either. I realize this will come as a shock, but I know you have the strength to bear it. ;)

[Bobmuhthol]

But I was completely right this time.

[HarmNone]

Yes, Bob. In the case of one exception invalidating a theory, you were right. Being right in that case achieved nothing in light of the subject being discussed. However, your statement in my quote above assumes knowledge that you do not have. You do not know whether or not the kid's fine.

To quote Tsa`ah: "The exceptions do not disprove the dangers of smoking, just as those that turn out "normal" after molestation do not disprove the inherent psychological damage caused by the act." In this case, Tsa`ah is 100% correct. He is also correct about the topic at hand, and not about something that is, really, irrelevant to the topic at hand.

[Bobmuhthol]

Maybe so, but I wasn't arguing against a correct statement. Me: Undefeated, Tsa`ah: 1-1.

[Tsa`ah]

You ... are an idiot.

You argue symantics when you don't have an argument.

[Warriorbird]

I wouldn't say idiot. Young politician, maybe.

[Edaarin]

You know what's going to happen? Probably nothing. The teacher is going to get probation and a suspended sentence, and if she's not retarded like LeTourneau she's not going to break the conditions of that probation to go back and bang people barely old enough to be called teenagers.

I don't see the teacher getting sued in a civil court, but if she does and lands even a half reasonable judge, she's screwed.

If I hear about a book deal coming out of this whole fiasco I'm taking a flamethrower to the publisher. Some people in this country make me absolutely sick.

[DeV]

Originally posted by Edaarin
The teacher is going to get probation and a suspended sentence, and if she's not retarded like LeTourneau she's not going to break the conditions of that probation to go back and bang people barely old enough to be called teenagers.
That, she already is, sadly enough. I'm guessing she'll have to complete some type of therapy/rehabilitation program as well.

[xtc]

The Heritage Institute study says that teenage boys have a greater risk of comitting suicide if they have sexual relations.

However the study wasn't complete. There was no mention if the girls were hot or not. Maybe the increase in suicide is due to sleeping with ugly chicks and then having your friends find out.

I am posting this as I know Bob or Arkans would sooner or later.

Shit, definatly beat me to the punch. It begs for further discussion though.

There is no excuse for any red blooded male to kill himself over screwing a hot girl. There is a reasonable excuse to snuff it for screwing an Orca. Ugly girls may need love too, but not from the general population.

- Arkans

[Latrinsorm]

Originally posted by Brattt8525
I missed it too, must have been his wishful thinking? :D My wish was actually that you wouldn't imply I supported pedophilia. I got a little upset (because it's awfully impolite), so I posted some gibberish. :shrug:

[Keller]

Originally posted by Nieninque
I love how (some) people are celebrating the fact that this 13 year old boy got off with his 27 year old teacher.

The same people would be likely to be the ones bemoaning feminism and the women's movement, saying that women have it better than men now and men are the oppressed ones.

Strange world innit?

To me it's like my kid was the starting quarterback for Notre Dame at 13. You just have to be a little proud. That sort of fame and physical abuse on a 13 year old would take it's toll as well, but would as many people be so upset over it?

No, but women do need to STFU about some things. They sound like a broken record that is over played.

- Arkans

[CrystalTears]

Originally posted by Keller
To me it's like my kid was the starting quarterback for Notre Dame at 13. You just have to be a little proud. That sort of fame and physical abuse on a 13 year old would take it's toll as well, but would as many people be so upset over it?

If the players were secretly screwing the kid during half time, then this would make more sense for this situation.

Sure I kid around that I would give him a high-five, but I wouldn't actually do it. I would be secretly proud a little bit, but I would still have to think of my child having sex at such a young age and thinking of protection, both pregnancy and disease-wise, and speaking to him of emotional repercussions of such things.

I wouldn't shrug it off as a sexual victory, but I wouldn't consider him a complete victim either. Then again MY child would more than likely be a sexual deviant like I was I may as well think of these things now anyway. :D

[Warriorbird]

I guess it comes down to family values in the end.

[HarmNone]

Originally posted by Arkans
Shit, definatly beat me to the punch. It begs for further discussion though.

There is no excuse for any red blooded male to kill himself over screwing a hot girl. There is a reasonable excuse to snuff it for screwing an Orca. Ugly girls may need love too, but not from the general population.

- Arkans

The same would apply to ugly men. :barf:

[Tsa`ah]

Originally posted by Tsa`ah
What I'm curious about, and honestly so, is how those hi-fiving their 13 year old sons after statutory rape and molestation would react when their son contracted and STD or became a father to be.

What is your reaction at that point?

Since it is no longer a "positive" experience do you sue?

You boy, who bagged a hot teacher, is going to be a daddy ... or die of AIDS.

Hi-fives for that?

I though the question needed some replay.

[CrystalTears]

If it were like this instance, I wouldn't sue. Unless my child were actually molested and violated (which I still don't think happened in this situation), then I would take action, with or without the addition of AIDS or pregnancy.

At 13 I'm hoping that I would have already covered sex and the responsibility that comes with it, and I would work with the woman to take care of things (no soup or allowance for you, young man!).

I can't honestly say for sure since I don't have kids, I admit that. But I still feel that I wouldn't be so hard on the child or the woman who put him up to it. :shrug:

[Tsa`ah]

Do you honestly think a 13 year old boy is mature enough or responsible enough to request a condom?

No, I don't buy it.

I want to know ... are you still hi-fiving a 13 year old boy, who bagged a hot teacher, when he'll be a father before he's legal to drive.

Do you hi-five a 13 year old with an STD?

Are you still proud?

[Bobmuhthol]

<<Do you honestly think a 13 year old boy is mature enough or responsible enough to request a condom?>>

Yes.

[Brattt8525]

I can't honestly say for sure since I don't have kids, I admit that. But I still feel that I wouldn't be so hard on the child or the woman who put him up to it.
CT

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

You wouldn't be hard on the 27 year old freak who is attracted to your 13 year old boy? Wow. The boy no I wouldn't be hard on him, he is afterall a male, but her? I would damn sure make it my business to see she isn't able to do that to another little boy or girl for that matter.

[Tsa`ah]

Originally posted by Bobmuhthol
<<Do you honestly think a 13 year old boy is mature enough or responsible enough to request a condom?>>

Yes.

Bob, you're not mature enough to keep your room clean.

[Mistomeer]

Originally posted by Tsa`ah
Do you honestly think a 13 year old boy is mature enough or responsible enough to request a condom?


Don't they pass out condoms in most schools now starting at 13?

[DeV]

Most schools tend to go the complete abstinence route. They need to pass out condoms at a majority of them though.

[Sephoria]

Originally posted by Methais

Originally posted by Kainen
Sad that people would find child molestation, regardless of the circumstance, cool in any way. After dealing with someone who molested one of my family members.. I can't say that I find it in myself to brand any form of it cool.

So to you it's molestation solely based on the fact that he's 13, but had he been 18 and the circumstances were exactly the same otherwise, it wouldn't be?

You know if you were in that kid's shoes you'd be nailing your teacher too. I can think of several teachers in school I wanted to lay down some pipe with, and if any of them ever gave it up for me, I'd hardly call it molestation.

Catholic priest + altar boys = molestation

Sexually charged flaring hornonal teen kid that wants to get laid + horny teacher consentually getting it on with each other = not molestation.

mo·lest ( P ) Pronunciation Key (m-lst)
tr.v. mo·lest·ed, mo·lest·ing, mo·lests

1. To disturb, interfere with, or annoy.
2. To subject to unwanted or improper sexual activity.

Obviously it wasn't unwanted, and "improper" is a matter of opinion, and obviously both of their opinions didn't feel it was improper or he wouldn't have been banging her to begin with.

As far as "it's against the law" goes... oral sex in certain states/counties is also against the law. You gonna tell me you've turned down a blowjob because it was technically against the law?

"What are you doing dear?"

"I'm about to give you head so incredible that your eyeballs will explode."

"No dear, we can't do that. It's against the law."

Say that when your 13 year old daughter winds up pregant by her married teacher or what not.

[Bobmuhthol]

What's up with all the people talking about chicks? The kid is very much not female. People support the death penalty for murderers, and you sure as hell won't see me saying, "We'll see how much you like the death penalty when an innocent is killed!"

[CrystalTears]

Originally posted by Tsa`ah
Do you honestly think a 13 year old boy is mature enough or responsible enough to request a condom?

Depends on the boy. There are ADULT MEN who aren't responsible enough to request a condom.


I want to know ... are you still hi-fiving a 13 year old boy, who bagged a hot teacher, when he'll be a father before he's legal to drive.

In this type of case, if she got pregnant by my 13 year old son, that's her problem, not his, since she was the consenting adult who knows better, and he isn't.


Do you hi-five a 13 year old with an STD?

Geez do you? Does anyone feel good about finding a child has any kind of disease? If the woman KNOWINGLY had AIDS and had sex with my child, she's hanging. That's endangering a minor. If she didn't know, sure I'll want to make sure that she pays for that, but sue? No, I'm sorry I don't think I would.

Now here's one for your. If your 13 year old child had $100 and solicited a prostitute for sex and got AIDS, what do you do then? That woman is going to jail for prostitution now anyway, what now?

[Artha]

I think she should be given a medal. Unless she's ugly, then jail's ok.

[Tsa`ah]

Originally posted by CrystalTears
Depends on the boy. There are ADULT MEN who aren't responsible enough to request a condom.

This isn't about irresponsible men, there are plenty of those ... though I wouldn't call them men.


In this type of case, if she got pregnant by my 13 year old son, that's her problem, not his, since she was the consenting adult who knows better, and he isn't.

There is no doubt it is her problem, but way to teach responsibility. It sets up a psychological precedent that will follow the child into adulthood.

The point is that being proud of a 13 year old boy because he banged a teacher is neither healthy nor psychotically promising for the future of the child in question.


Geez do you? Does anyone feel good about finding a child has any kind of disease? If the woman KNOWINGLY had AIDS and had sex with my child, she's hanging. That's endangering a minor. If she didn't know, sure I'll want to make sure that she pays for that, but sue? No, I'm sorry I don't think I would.

That's not the point at all. Again, there is no question concerning the responsibility of these women as adults. Showing pride, even hiding that pride, is extremely irresponsible as a parent in this case. You would be setting up a very poor view of sexuality.


Now here's one for your. If your 13 year old child had $100 and solicited a prostitute for sex and got AIDS, what do you do then? That woman is going to jail for prostitution now anyway, what now?

That would indicate a failing as a parent to educate a child. The questions raised by my children have always been answered.

What you are describing is the opposite scenario. Yes the prostitute should not be accepting children as clients, but a child should also be educated about sex.

To the subject at hand, if you have any question about how this child's future looks, or the other case after the Letourneau case hit the media, take a look at the life of Vili Fualaau.

[Warriorbird]

Just entrenched double standards, Tsa'ah. Fortunately the law somewhat favors the opposite.

[Sephoria]

Originally posted by Bobmuhthol
What's up with all the people talking about chicks? The kid is very much not female. People support the death penalty for murderers, and you sure as hell won't see me saying, "We'll see how much you like the death penalty when an innocent is killed!"

Nope, the kid isn't a female, but it's STILL a kid and it doesn't make it any less disgusting just because it's a male.

What's weird about the whole thing is it shows the stark contrast as to how times have changed.

For example, in prehistoric times, hairy ape-like men, would callously pick a young, just turned fertile tiny woman-creature for their sexual appeasing, because this is what was accepted at the time. They threw sticks and bones at giant monoliths and shouted in primitive tongue. Then, great monastaries were formed by the mentally advanced pseudo-sapiens, in which documents, recorded on modern "papyrus" were kept.

It is actually through this paper-pushing bureaucracy (some which many hate) that we have essentially evened out the "roles," of age, gender and what this implies in the act of solidifying the great Poonani.

May we all light fire on the candelabra, in not a testament, but a rememberence to the overcoming of these horrible acts perpetrated by the hairy-men, so that we may learn never to repeat them.

[Tsa`ah]

It has more to do with life span Stan.

Consider that Romeo and Juliet (the sexual interaction, the age, the time) was indicative of the time ... Romeo and Juliet we of marrying age then and would just be young teenagers now.

When 30 years is considered "about to die of old age", the times dictate that you should be breeding by 12.

And it is to this FACT, that I hope whether it be truly physical, or just mental, that we may all live long lives, as to bloom and blossum like the slow-growing flower whose beauty is a testament to its patience, unlike the weed, which seeks to rapidly deteriorate the magnificence of the garden.

[HarmNone]

By the Grove, Stanley! If you're going to wax poetic, at least spell blossom properly! I oughta thwap ya! :axe:

oof.

:P

Edited to Add: If it were done when 'tis done, then 'twere well It were done quickly.

::anticipating the "thwap"::

[Edited on 2-12-2005 by Stanley Burrell]

[DeV]

Originally posted by Tsa`ah
To the subject at hand, if you have any question about how this child's future looks, or the other case after the Letourneau case hit the media, take a look at the life of Vili Fualaau. Exactly. I don't know if this kid, now a man should I say, is an example of the worst case senerio or what. He is an example nonetheless and a fairly sad one at that. This mentally impaired attractive woman really fucked up this kids life in a majority of ways. The kids mother is a prime example of what NOT to do if your 13 year old son is ever found to be shagging a much older woman. Don't do nothing about it because you might just end up taking care of your kids kid 9 months down the road. I guess condoms weren't an option for the true blue love birds.

[Bobmuhthol]

<<Nope, the kid isn't a female, but it's STILL a kid and it doesn't make it any less disgusting just because it's a male.>>

The people who post talking about "what if it was your daughter" are being retarded. You're right, he is a kid. There's still a 0% chance he's female.

[Ben]

I got groped by a fat female teacher when I was in 5th grade. It was fucking sick.

[CrystalTears]

You keep making the assumption that I would actually TELL the child "good for you" or actually high-five him. I said that in a joking manner and then said later that I would be secretly proud in a strange sort of way but not state so. Don't put words in my mouth that I would be praising his efforts and not instilling any values in my child.

Perhaps my phrasing didn't state it correctly, but don't assume that I would actually DO it. I secretly think my boss is an insufferable asshole, it doesn't mean I would actually say or do anything about it. Give me some credit.

Just out of curiousity. If your 13 year old child got a older woman pregnant, you would make him care for the child? Deal with it? Is that what you're saying that I should instill responsibility? I thought that he was the victim here. Now you're punishing him for it? Make up your mind.

[CrystalTears]

Originally posted by Tsa`ah

Now here's one for your. If your 13 year old child had $100 and solicited a prostitute for sex and got AIDS, what do you do then? That woman is going to jail for prostitution now anyway, what now?

That would indicate a failing as a parent to educate a child. The questions raised by my children have always been answered.


If the child really had questions or problems about what was going on, don't you think he would have gone to someone, anyone... another teacher, a parent, a friend... before it happened at least 15 TIMES before questioning it all? So does that mean these parents failed because they never knew that their child was hiding an affair with his teacher in his own home?

How many times did you as a teen have sex [with anyone] and your parents never knowing about it? How many times as a teen did you do ANYTHING that your parents didn't know about that was against their beliefs or values? If you really wanted to do something, you would have found a way to do it secretly. That's not bad parenting, that's just life.

Edited to clarify one of my questions.

[Edited on 2/12/2005 by CrystalTears]

[Bobmuhthol]

<<Don't put words in my mouth>>

If you said it, how is anyone putting words in your mouth?

<<Perhaps my phrasing didn't state it correctly, but don't assume that I would actually DO it.>>

Your phrasing is 100% off if by saying you'd do it you meant you wouldn't. Don't blame others for interpreting something correctly.

[CrystalTears]

Sure I kid around that I would give him a high-five, but I wouldn't actually do it.

I'm sorry if that was too vague. :rolleyes:

[Bobmuhthol]

<<How many times did you as a teen have sex [with anyone] and your parents never knowing about it?>>

15 times a day (jk 0). And I'm older than the kid. This is a bad analogy.

<<How many times as a teen did you do ANYTHING that your parents didn't know about?>>

This is just generally dumb. My parents didn't know I drank a can of Coca-Cola Classic a few hours ago.

[Burning Scorpion]

I don't think the kid will be very scarred by this either, depending on whether or not he was truly molested against his will or just fooling around with an older woman and his parents insisted it must be rape because their darling child would never behave like that willingly.

Now, don't jump to conclusions; this isn't just an unthinking double standard that's taking over my opinion. Also keep in mind that the below is very general reasoning and I know there are exceptions and different circumstances.

I think it comes down to the basic nature of sexual plumbing. Heterosexually, males will always be the invaders and females the invaded. Right off the bat, that makes us women more vulnerable on a very basic level. A man does not walk down the street, get whistled at by a bunch of construction workers, and wonder if he'll get dragged into an alley and gangraped. Men are secure in their position as the traditional sexual aggressors. They just don't often think about what it might mean if they were not.

Even if the child were unwilling, which we don't know, if he were having sex with an older woman he'd still be in the position of power as the active role instead of the receiving role of a woman. And I don't mean different sexual positions. This would probably psychologically bolster him in a way that a female getting raped would never experience. A woman's body is a castle keep getting battered down. A man's body will always be the battering ram. Ahem. Traditionally.

This leaves out all the kinkier things she could have done to him. Given that she's already proven herself to be a sick fuck by being attracted to a 13-year-old, I think there's a good chance she might be sick in other ways. If the boy were suddenly put in a receiving role by her, a traditionally passive participant, I think the psychological damage could be immense.

But we really have no idea what happened, so we can only speculate. Just my opinion of why the double standard of males not being as hurt by rape by a female as females getting raped by a male is generally applicable.

As a parent, I'd want to hurt her in a very serious way even though the child in question is male. Just engaging in an act that might hurt my child is unacceptable. Especially in a teacher, a supposed role of guidance and safety. Just awful, despicable. She is a wretched, selfish creature.

(I'd like to reiterate that I know my reasoning doesn't apply to everyone and there are differing circumstances. Don't flame me, I've got delicate skin.)

[Bobmuhthol]

<<Even if the child were unwilling, which we don't know, if he were having sex with an older woman he'd still be in the position of power as the active role instead of the receiving role of a woman.>>

God damn that's a dumb thing to say.

[Burning Scorpion]

Expand, Alex.

[Tsa`ah]

Originally posted by CrystalTears
You keep making the assumption that I would actually TELL the child "good for you" or actually high-five him. I said that in a joking manner and then said later that I would be secretly proud in a strange sort of way but not state so. Don't put words in my mouth that I would be praising his efforts and not instilling any values in my child.

I'm not and it wasn't specifically directed at you, rather a group that stated they would be proud. Only you have bothered to reply.


Perhaps my phrasing didn't state it correctly, but don't assume that I would actually DO it. I secretly think my boss is an insufferable asshole, it doesn't mean I would actually say or do anything about it. Give me some credit.

I do, I got the jest.


Just out of curiousity. If your 13 year old child got a older woman pregnant, you would make him care for the child? Deal with it? Is that what you're saying that I should instill responsibility? I thought that he was the victim here. Now you're punishing him for it? Make up your mind.

Oh absolutely. If I had a 13 year old son that got a woman or like aged girl pregnant ... my child is as responsible for that child as I am. That kid is going to learn how to take care of a child and know what it is to be a parent. At that point my boy would cease being a kid and start being an adult.

At 16 that very same son would have a job. At 18 years old my son now has full responsibility as a father and recieves little to no help from mom or dad except to see that the grandchild is provided for so long as the effort by the father is genuin.

[Tsa`ah]

Originally posted by CrystalTears
If the child really had questions or problems about what was going on, don't you think he would have gone to someone, anyone... another teacher, a parent, a friend... before it happened at least 15 TIMES before questioning it all? So does that mean these parents failed because they never knew that their child was hiding an affair with his teacher in his own home?

As a parent one needs to know the where abouts of a child at all times. The parent needs to know what is going on, and the parent needs to use common sense.

There is no way in hell a responsible parent would not notice changes in behavior, the poor attempts to hide, or not question where little Billy has been for so long.


How many times did you as a teen have sex [with anyone] and your parents never knowing about it?

My parents knew pretty much everything I did without me telling them.

They knew when I had been drinking, they knew I had smoked pot, and they knew when I was sexually active. There are signs of everything if a parent is observant enough. Every parent should be observant enough.


How many times as a teen did you do ANYTHING that your parents didn't know about that was against their beliefs or values? If you really wanted to do something, you would have found a way to do it secretly. That's not bad parenting, that's just life.

Absolutely right. Then again we're talking about sneaking a cookie, or sneaking out after dark once in a while, or saying our homework is done. With repetition and habit ... those things gain notice.

This wasn't a one time thing with the kid, it happened many times.

[Bobmuhthol]

<<Expand, Alex.>>

A woman can very easily rape a man; bind him and have her way. Woman on top, the man doesn't have to lift an effing finger (or penis for that matter) for the chick to ride him. Where's the position of power then?

[Bobmuhthol]

<<There is no way in hell a responsible parent would not notice changes in behavior>>

Since when does everyone change their behavior when they have sex?

[CrystalTears]

Originally posted by Tsa`ah

Just out of curiousity. If your 13 year old child got a older woman pregnant, you would make him care for the child? Deal with it? Is that what you're saying that I should instill responsibility? I thought that he was the victim here. Now you're punishing him for it? Make up your mind.

Oh absolutely. If I had a 13 year old son that got a woman or like aged girl pregnant ... my child is as responsible for that child as I am. That kid is going to learn how to take care of a child and know what it is to be a parent. At that point my boy would cease being a kid and start being an adult.


This just sounds like you're contradicting yourself here, hon. You say that a 13 year old doesn't know how to behave or act like an adult, that he wouldn't know common sense for something as adult as having sex. So the act that was supposedly against his will, which has caused a pregnancy through no fault of his own (since he didn't instigate the act) is now his responsibility as well?

Don't you think that it's going to confuse the child more that he was forced to do something against his will AND has to pay for the consequences he probably wasn't completely aware of?

[CrystalTears]

Originally posted by Bobmuhthol
<<There is no way in hell a responsible parent would not notice changes in behavior>>

Since when does everyone change their behavior when they have sex?

If it was the first time he has experienced it (either first time in general or with someone new), there usually is some kind of emotional, let alone psychological, change.

[Edited on 2/13/2005 by CrystalTears]

[Tsa`ah]

Originally posted by CrystalTears
This just sounds like you're contradicting yourself here, hon. You say that a 13 year old doesn't know how to behave or act like an adult, that he wouldn't know common sense for something as adult as having sex. So the act that was supposedly against his will, which has caused a pregnancy through no fault of his own (since he didn't instigate the act) is now his responsibility as well?

There are instances you have to distinguish between. What happened, by every moral and legal definition, is molestation and statutory rape. There is the forceful, indicating that the child did not have a choice, and the consensual, indicating the child was willing. The later indicates a failing as a parent.

I would agree about the responsibility were this forced, but it was not. Every child needs to learn that there are consequences involved in every decision made. In this consensual setting, it would set a very bad precedent concerning responsibility. It tells the child, you're responsible for your actions so long as the consequence is small, if it's big ... you're off the hook.


Don't you think that it's going to confuse the child more that he was forced to do something against his will AND has to pay for the consequences he probably wasn't completely aware of?

Except you're pointing out pure unarguable rape and molestation of an unwilling child. This argument has been about a willing child. It's still rape, it's still molestation ... but it comes down to poor judgment by a child and an adult capitalizing on that.

Now if you were talking about a young boy that was forcefully raped ... then no. That child has zero responsibility. We're not however and said child has a responsibility like it or not. If we make exception for the big things, he'll go through life expecting exceptions where none are given.

[Bobmuhthol]

<<If it was the first time he has experienced it (either first time in general or with someone new), there usually is some kind of emotional, let alone psychological, change.>>

Following the pattern of people who say, "But you don't know what really happened," you don't know if this is true or not.

[Bobmuhthol]

<<Now if you were talking about a young boy that was forcefully raped ... then no. That child has zero responsibility. We're not however and said child has a responsibility like it or not.>>

And if he was brainwashed?

[Tsa`ah]

If a 13 year old child is sexually active, there is a change in personality traits exhibited.

/end discussion

[Bobmuhthol]

<<If a 13 year old child is sexually active, there is a change in personality traits exhibited.

/end discussion>>

I won't say it didn't happen in this case. I'm not able to know this. However, neither are you. You don't know if there was or not, and I hope to God you don't actually believe that a change occurs every time with no possible exceptions.

If any hot chicks want to have sex with me, I'll gladly prove to Tsa`ah that I will not be any different.


edit:

I'm still interested in your allocation of responsibility if the kid was not forcibly raped, but rather coaxed into it.

[Edited on 2-13-2005 by Bobmuhthol]

[Tsa`ah]

You're also not 13.

I would also be willing to bet that there would be some very noticeable behavioral changes in you.

[Bobmuhthol]

Yeah, there's a world of difference between the typical 13-year-old and the typical 14-year-old.

[Tsa`ah]

Yes ... there is. Not much, but yes.

Again, the behavior displayed by you would change noticeably.

[Bobmuhthol]

Until I get some (excluding the 15 bitches I fuck any given day), there will be no way to tell.

[Tsa`ah]

So your arguing the unknown against the proven?

That's smart.

[Bobmuhthol]

<<So your arguing the unknown against the proven?

That's smart.>>

I'm sorry, I didn't realize that the unprovable was proven.

[Tsa`ah]

What's hasn't been proven? That young, sexually active children do not exhibit behavioral changes? Sorry ... but you're wrong.

[Bobmuhthol]

<<What's hasn't been proven? That young, sexually active children do not exhibit behavioral changes? Sorry ... but you're wrong.>>

If you're telling me that it WILL happen, you must have some way to prove that there's no way that it won't.

You can't.

[Tsa`ah]

Again, straw argument on your part.

[Bobmuhthol]

Again, it's still right.