Smite vs. bane.

[fireorlime]

What does everybody think about smite vs. bane? Is one clearly better than the other for non-RP reasons? I've heard that smite can be better given that there are more living critters than undead.

Also curious to know how you RP a cleric aligned with an evil deity if you went the bane route.

[Methais]

Smite's better vs. undead, bane is better vs. living. That's literally what it boils down to. Eventually you'll be using 317 as your primary kill spell anyway, and 317 doesn't give a shit what its target is.


Also curious to know how you RP a cleric aligned with an evil deity if you went the bane route.

Before raising someone, you make sure to tell them in no uncertain terms that you're not raising them to help them and that you're only doing it for phat xp.

Be sure to always speak with a dark tone too.

[Gelston]

Be sure to always speak with a dark tone too.

No, ;random is what you should use.

[Taernath]

Having to make a virtually permanent choice between living and undead is a bad mechanic.

[Maerit]

I frankly find going with Bane is mechanically better for Clerics since they have other powerful tools to use vs the undead. Especially if you train in spell aiming. 301 + 306 is a powerful combination to "handle" undead while reserving 302 for living (and there tend to be more living creatures than undead). Also there is at least one Deity for each Smite and Bane that is not of the general "good" or "evil" alignment. There are also many neutral deities to pick from for RP purposes.

[peam]

You should just Holy Bolt until like level 55. That spell is a motherfucker and incorp undead tend to be underhunted thus rich.

[fireorlime]

I’d read / heard that spell aim wasn’t really worth it at early levels. I’m only 21. Can someone weigh in?

[fireorlime]

Before raising someone, you make sure to tell them in no uncertain terms that you're not raising them to help them and that you're only doing it for phat xp.

Be sure to always speak with a dark tone too.
This made me laugh.

[Vusit]

i am smite aligned, and at my current lvl 37, rhet seems to not want to give me bounties for undead. i lack the mana to hunt with 312/317. So i am kinda wishing i had went bane currently.

[Taernath]

I’d read / heard that spell aim wasn’t really worth it at early levels. I’m only 21. Can someone weigh in?

It's another tool for your toolbox. Some people don't like it because clerics aren't spectacular bolters, but it's good for wanding stuff to death and contributes to runestaff DS. My pures are all 2x in spell aim.

[Maerit]

I’d read / heard that spell aim wasn’t really worth it at early levels. I’m only 21. Can someone weigh in?

I trained a cleric with zero spell aim and didn't miss it from 0-25, but I didn't care about hunting undead much either. If you look at the number of critters in the game, there are probably only 20% of them in the undead category (if that), which makes Bane have more value overall. However, if you want to make a character that is designed around the concept of releasing undead for RP you should definitely get Smite. At the same time, over-training in your Cleric spell circle and bypassing spell aiming will make your 302 hit more frequently and for more damage.

The main problem clerics face is being boring. You can still use Bane on undead and Smite on living - they just don't deal as much damage. Bane is still more advantageous from a purely mechanical perspective due to there being more living hunting options. My warmage went from 0-67 without ever hunting undead until very recently when I decided to switch from GoS to Voln. Never a problem finding something to slay!

There are also areas in the game with very little undead and it makes it very easy to get bounties for living if you go that route (i.e. you won't get an undead bounty on Teras until your late 40s).

[fireorlime]

I trained a cleric with zero spell aim and didn't miss it from 0-25, but I didn't care about hunting undead much either. If you look at the number of critters in the game, there are probably only 20% of them in the undead category (if that), which makes Bane have more value overall. However, if you want to make a character that is designed around the concept of releasing undead for RP you should definitely get Smite. At the same time, over-training in your Cleric spell circle and bypassing spell aiming will make your 302 hit more frequently and for more damage.

The main problem clerics face is being boring. You can still use Bane on undead and Smite on living - they just don't deal as much damage. Bane is still more advantageous from a purely mechanical perspective due to there being more living hunting options. My warmage went from 0-67 without ever hunting undead until very recently when I decided to switch from GoS to Voln. Never a problem finding something to slay!

There are also areas in the game with very little undead and it makes it very easy to get bounties for living if you go that route (i.e. you won't get an undead bounty on Teras until your late 40s).
Super helpful, thanks!

Are there areas in the game that are super undead heavy if you want to try to get undead bounties?

[Maerit]

Super helpful, thanks!

Are there areas in the game that are super undead heavy if you want to try to get undead bounties?

For undead bounty consistency, you will have to move around a lot between level ranges. TV gives good undead bounty rates for low 20s (but you'll still get some living ones). The 30s will be mixed, but you can get mostly undead bounties in Zul (though you'll get bat and krynch once in a while). In the 40s, it's hard to find a stable undead place, but Icemule has the brambles so you'll be getting bramble patches, and frozen corpse bounties mingled with a few living bounties for giants. Solhaven will gives mostly undead bounties from 50-55. RR will give you almost all undead bounties from levels 55-65 (citadel). Then you go into the dead zone from 65+ where undead bounties are rare because there's a gap and only one critter (lvl 67 spirit recently introduced) will fill the gap. Getting bounties for that specific critter in the Red Forest is very uncommon, but once you're in the early 70s, you can try to get bounties for undead in the Rift.

However, if you want to be a bounty hunter - you want Bane. Bandits / Escort bounties do not activate anything undead, so you're going to have to kill living creatures for those bounties. Clerics are actually pretty decent at these bounties also once they have 319 (still not super great, but better than a lot of pures).

This is why I prefer to go with Bane and living. It's a bit easier to find living bounties in most areas, and the few times you get undead ones you just abandon them for something more accessible. Teras is a great example where you will get living bounties almost the entire time you level there because only Banshess (lvl 50) are undead until you are too old to hunt the level 71 fire mages. Once you're past fire mages, you have to leave the island for a bit.

[khorpulent]

Smite actually has a slightly higher DF than bane against their respectively aligned targets. It's not a huge difference, but it's worth considering.

My cleric is a bane cleric, and while I was happy with bane for quite a while, I eventually found myself wishing I'd gone with smite once I got into my 70s, and especially my 80s. I found myself wishing I had smite to use for rift hunting. While clerics do have 312 and 317 to use against undead, they're kind of mana intensive (well, 312 isn't so much, it's just slow). I had originally planned on hunting in the bowels in my 80s with 302/317, but I forgot that both of those spells get you blown up because they're plasma. I guess that's kind of an oddly specific reason to prefer smite, but I just feel like as a cleric, you might as well be good at hunting undead, and it's annoying not having 302 in your toolbox.

Of course, the real bottom line is that clerics are boring as shit to hunt, and you'll be doing nothing but casting 302 well into your 80s.