Training Empath

[Cucumber]

So what are people's plans for training their empath once GS4 comes out?

[Miss X]

ok....So I have re-allocated my empath over and over in beta and I hate the results every time. I know the critters havnt been changed over yet but dying 11 times in 20 mins is crazy. I also found that she cant dodge a boil, ever! I did some research, and thought id worked out a pretty good training plan for her but I didnt have enough TP for it to work.
Does anyone have a basic training idea for an empath that I can work around? Oh...also the lores are really freaking me out, I dont seem to have enough TP to 1x in mental and spiritual for life!
Any help would be really appriciated.
Thanks
V

[Fabled]

I also did the same thing and was unable to train in basic things like Mana Control, Lores, etc... With my latest reallocation I dropped weapons, shield, armor and trained in all mental skills and picked up a stave. I did quite well, but if I wanted a sorcerer I would have rolled one up. :(

[CrystalTears]

I'm a little confused about the whole stave bit. Does that mean you train in a weapon or not at all? I just don't get it. I'd like to know what to train my fat empath into, and she's not THAT much of a hunter, but I wouldn't want her to be a complete waste out there.

Help!

[StrayRogue]

You don't train in weapons, you train in Magical skills.

[CrystalTears]

You're going to make me read those godforsaken official boards to know exactly what you mean, aren't you? :cry:

[StrayRogue]

Noooo.

Basically Stave effectiveness keys off your skill in magical abilities. Basically, the more MIU, Arcane Lore, Spells, Lores and such you have, the better your Stave DS. No weapon skill is required to actually use one, however your skill in magic determines how well you can use it.

[CrystalTears]

Ok so... I guess my question is... why would an empath do it that way since they don't have that many offensive spells? Or are there more than I realize since I haven't played her in oh so long?

[StrayRogue]

You have two new offensive spells in your arsenal: Bone Melt or whatever its called, and 111, Fire Spirit. 102 now does not hinder bolting (Clerics have a two bolt spells, so is this a shock to anyone? Nope, didn't think so). Plus, the magical stave route is cheaper TP wise.

[CrystalTears]

Interesting. I'll have to look into trying that out.

[CrystalTears]

Oh by the way. Has anyone mentioned where people will be able to purchase said staves?

[StrayRogue]

At the moment, in GS4, you can acquire them in the hut just outside the Landings north gate. In the actual game...I dunno. Weapon shop?

[CrystalTears]

I suppose my empath can just be a spellcaster. She sucked as a sword swinger, and wasn't much of a hunter anyway. I guess the thought of not training in any weapons freaks me out. After all, she's really the only spellcaster I have, so I'm not used to the concept.

[Nindy]

I've had two or three different training paths for Nindy.

First, stats:
Starting Stats:
86 Strength (STR) 73 Aura (AUR)
69 Constitution (CON) 62 Logic (LOG)
80 Dexterity (DEX) 51 Intuition (INT)
80 Agility (AGI) 50 Wisdom (WIS)
49 Discipline (DIS) 60 Influence (INF)

Stats at 84:
Strength (STR): 98 (24) ... 98 (24)
Constitution (CON): 93 (21) ... 93 (21)
Dexterity (DEX): 97 (28) ... 97 (28)
Agility (AGI): 97 (33) ... 97 (33)
Discipline (DIS): 84 (12) ... 84 (12)
Aura (AUR): 96 (23) ... 96 (23)
Logic (LOG): 95 (22) ... 95 (22)
Intuition (INT): 82 (16) ... 82 (16)
Wisdom (WIS): 95 (22) ... 95 (22)
Influence (INF): 95 (27) ... 95 (27)

On to a training path or two...

The one I like better:
(at 84)
1x edged, shield, CM, mental lore, mana control
10 spiritl lore ranks
.5x survival
31 armor ranks
23 fitness ranks
25 ranks of scrolls and MIU
2x spells and first aid
1.5x harness power
30 climb ranks
10 swim ranks

The biggest problems I have with that path are a) I'm lucky Nindy's old and b) it'll become useless once we lose the MaS Circle.

So I think I'm gonna go the "pure" route:

Nindy (at level 84), your skill bonuses and ranks are:
Skill Name | Bonus Ranks Goals Time to Goal
Armor Use..........................| 130 35 35
Shield Use.........................| 185 85 85
Edged Weapons......................| 185 85 85
Multi Opponent Combat..............| 25 5 5
Physical Fitness...................| 99 23 23
Arcane Symbols.....................| 149 30 30
Magic Item Use.....................| 149 30 30
Spell Aiming.......................| 270 170 170
Harness Power......................| 202 102 102
Mental Mana Control................| 143 43 43
Spirit Mana Control................| 142 42 42
Spiritual Lore - Blessings.........| 50 10 10
Mental Lore - Manipulation.........| 143 43 43
Mental Lore - Transformation.......| 142 42 42
Survival...........................| 227 127 127
Perception.........................| 105 25 25
Climbing...........................| 120 30 30
Swimming...........................| 50 10 10
First Aid..........................| 227 127 127

Spell Lists
Major Spirit.......................| 60 60
Minor Spirit.......................| 50 50
Empath.............................| 60 60


I've had problems with that plan, too. It's not quite enough mental skills for a staff and I'm not certain it's mana efficient to hunt. I've had to stop mid-hunt on the rift several times because I run out of mana.

Overall, I like the first path better because I can bind and crush heads with an ambush. I already know I'll be pissed when it becomes a totally ineffective path in phase II. Granted, I could use this until we get to re-reallocate, but I'd like to pick something that works and stick with it. This has been uber-stressful already and, frankly, I don't want to do it again. The second path I've had moderate success with. Nilven said that he envisioned us hunting 'til half fried and then coming to town and healing (with what mana I've no idea) for the fry. If that's the case, I'm a little ahead of schedule. Plus, I've heard updates have been put in for 1106, so that may be a plus. That said, I like what someone previously posted, "if I'd wanted a sorcerer, I would've rolled one up."

[Drew2]

Off the top of my head.. in GS4 right now I have Tayre as

1x Spiritual Lore
2x (3x when I can) spells
2x spell aiming
I don't remember how much MIU and Scroll.. I think somewhere around .5x-.75x
1x PT
1x FA I think
2x harness power

Erm... that's all I can remember. But anyway... I can still hunt Glacei/wraiths/bears with little problems, self cast only. Mana runs out quickly, but I think if I get some bolt wands gathered that won't be so much of a problem. All in all, I'm content... I only wish his CS was higher. But I lose 4 levels (after the +2) so I guess that's to be expected.

[CrystalTears]

Yey! Nindy's back! ::passes Nindy an ale::

[Nindy]

Originally posted by Lady Daina
What if, in your second plan, you dropped the edged/shield and increased your magickal skills so as to get the staff? I'm curious how it works out for an oldie. :P

Yeah, that would probably work, but I've grown attached to my blades. I've had my falchions scripted, altered and inscripted with a name.

Really, though, I think I'd have more luck with weapons because I can swing well with it if something is stunned/bound/etc. I've been having a helluva time not running out of mana as it is, and I'd imagine not swinging would make it worse.

Still, I may give it a try just to see.

[Varsus]

Name: Rimlin Hellkicker Race: Half-Elf Profession: Empath (not shown)
Gender: Male Age: 1221 Expr: 4005539 Level: 65
Normal (Bonus) ... Enhanced (Bonus)
Strength (STR): 72 (11) ... 72 (11)
Constitution (CON): 89 (19) ... 89 (19)
Dexterity (DEX): 72 (16) ... 72 (16)
Agility (AGI): 78 (24) ... 78 (24)
Discipline (DIS): 84 (12) ... 84 (12)
Aura (AUR): 89 (19) ... 89 (19)
Logic (LOG): 86 (18) ... 86 (18)
Intuition (INT): 75 (12) ... 75 (12)
Wisdom (WIS): 100 (25) ... 100 (25)
Influence (INF): 100 (30) ... 100 (30)
Mana: 104 Silver: 0
> Rimlin (at level 65), your skill bonuses and ranks are:
Skill Name | Bonus Ranks Goals Time to Goal
Armor Use..........................| 140 40 40
Shield Use.........................| 167 67 67
Edged Weapons......................| 167 67 67
Physical Fitness...................| 180 80 80
Arcane Symbols.....................| 120 30 30
Magic Item Use.....................| 120 30 30
Harness Power......................| 200 100 100
Mental Mana Control................| 167 67 67
Spirit Mana Control................| 167 67 67
Spiritual Lore - Summoning.........| 150 50 50
Mental Lore - Transformation.......| 130 35 35
Survival...........................| 150 50 50
Perception.........................| 167 67 67
Climbing...........................| 105 25 25
Swimming...........................| 105 25 25
First Aid..........................| 200 100 100

Spell Lists
Major Spirit.......................| 50 50
Minor Spirit.......................| 50 50
Empath.............................| 40 40

[Nindy]

You see Nindy the Master Healer.
He appears to be a Half-Elf from Ta'Ardenai.
He appears to be young and taller than average. He has clouded ale-brown eyes and golden brown skin. He has short, chestnut brown hair brushed with subtle highlights amidst tight curls. He has a straight nose and tucked pointed ears. Barely discernable across his right eyebrow is a thin bone-white scar.
He has a black gecko tattoo on his neck, and a wave-edged tattooed golden sunburst on the back of his right hand.
He is in good shape.
He is wearing a sun-shaped gold stud earring, a vaalin chain, a gold-whorled black diamond amulet, an aloeas stem talisman, a jet black spidersilk cloak edged with silver silk trim, some deep black ringmail-lined brigandine, a black spidersilk backpack, a black elven-forged shield, a worn ale-stained satchel, an antique silver armband inset with a rolaren star, a frosted eahnor solitude band, a black leather gem pouch, a veniom-worked first aid kit, a soft dark silk coin pouch, a handsome black kilt, and some black leather boots.

Name: Nindy Nindians Race: Half-Elf Profession: Empath (Post name shown as: Master Healer)
Level: 85 Gender: Male Age: 75

Nindy (at level 85), your skill bonuses and ranks are:
Skill Name | Bonus Ranks Goals Time to Goal
Armor Use..........................| 130 35 35
Shield Use.........................| 186 86 86
Edged Weapons......................| 186 86 86
Physical Fitness...................| 99 23 23
Arcane Symbols.....................| 146 46 46
Magic Item Use.....................| 146 46 46
Spell Aiming.......................| 272 172 172
Harness Power......................| 202 102 102
Mental Mana Control................| 15 3 3
Spirit Mana Control................| 186 86 86
Spiritual Lore - Blessings.........| 50 10 10
Mental Lore - Manipulation.........| 187 87 87
Survival...........................| 230 130 130
Perception.........................| 120 30 30
Climbing...........................| 120 30 30
Swimming...........................| 90 20 20
First Aid..........................| 230 130 130

Spell Lists
Major Spirit.......................| 50 50
Minor Spirit.......................| 50 50
Empath.............................| 74 74

Name: Nindy Nindians Race: Half-Elf Profession: Empath (shown as: Master Healer)
Gender: Male Age: 75 Expr: 5996940 Level: 85
Normal (Bonus) ... Enhanced (Bonus)
Strength (STR): 98 (24) ... 98 (24)
Constitution (CON): 93 (21) ... 93 (21)
Dexterity (DEX): 98 (29) ... 98 (29)
Agility (AGI): 98 (34) ... 98 (34)
Discipline (DIS): 84 (12) ... 84 (12)
Aura (AUR): 96 (23) ... 96 (23)
Logic (LOG): 95 (22) ... 95 (22)
Intuition (INT): 82 (16) ... 82 (16)
Wisdom (WIS): 95 (22) ... 100 (25)
Influence (INF): 95 (27) ... 100 (30)
Mana: 279

~N

[Drew2]

Only problems I see with Nindy is I would have traded blessings for Summoning, as it has more personal benefits, and Dropped Survival to .5x or dropped it completely and 1x'd Physical Fitness, as it helps with a wide variety of things now, and especially since he gave up a lot of magic for OHE/Shield, and Brig.

Also, 30 ranks in Perception was a waste. And I would have gone for either more Harness power or more Mana Control.

That being said, I doubt Nindy has much problem hunting with his high DS and high manipulation/empath ranks.

[Edited on 12-6-2003 by Tayre]

[MaryJane]

Ok, so this is what my 39th level empath looks like. I found that I prefer her swinging to relying on the spells, but she can still hit with Bone shatter pretty well. I did have more ranks in lots of stuff, but I found that I really missed Mstrike so I had to sacrifice to add it back in.

>skill
Lylonna (at level 39), your skill bonuses and ranks are:
Skill Name | Bonus Ranks Goals Time to Goal
Armor Use..........................| 130 35 35
Shield Use.........................| 140 40 40
Edged Weapons......................| 141 41 41
Multi Opponent Combat..............| 25 5 5
Physical Fitness...................| 138 39 39
Arcane Symbols.....................| 93 21 21
Magic Item Use.....................| 90 20 20
Spell Aiming.......................| 155 55 55
Harness Power......................| 143 43 43
Spirit Mana Control................| 120 30 30
Spiritual Lore - Summoning.........| 35 7 7
Mental Lore - Manipulation.........| 140 40 40
Survival...........................| 82 18 18
Perception.........................| 86 19 19
Climbing...........................| 70 15 15
Swimming...........................| 62 13 13
First Aid..........................| 140 40 40

Spell Lists
Major Spirit.......................| 25 25
Minor Spirit.......................| 30 30
Empath.............................| 25 25


>info
Name: Lylonna Deathblooms Race: Giant Profession: Empath (shown as: Nurse)
Gender: Female Age: 29 Expr: 1693403 Level: 39
Normal (Bonus) ... Enhanced (Bonus)
Strength (STR): 93 (36) ... 93 (36)
Constitution (CON): 62 (16) ... 62 (16)
Dexterity (DEX): 90 (15) ... 90 (15)
Agility (AGI): 77 (8) ... 77 (8)
Discipline (DIS): 71 (10) ... 71 (10)
Aura (AUR): 82 (11) ... 82 (11)
Logic (LOG): 61 (0) ... 61 (0)
Intuition (INT): 82 (16) ... 82 (16)
Wisdom (WIS): 92 (21) ... 92 (21)
Influence (INF): 96 (28) ... 96 (28)
Mana: 136 Silver: 0