Does CoL take your soul?

The Poohbah said that the priice you've paid was your soul, and yes, Lorminstra's Priestess recognizes that you are unclean... but does CoL actually take your character's soul?

As is evidence by the messaging for SIGN OF WRACKING, when you expend your spirit for the sign, your life-force is torn and reshaped into the desired effect, meaning you are not making a spiritual sacrifice to a dark deity in exchange for blessings, but rather, you are converting one type of your own energy into another.

No actual soul transfer takes place, and he never directly says, "I got your soul! Hahahaha!"

He says, "You walked, nay, ran down the path of damnation!" But what if you were already evil? Does he still get your soul? If so, why? What justification is there?

I think what the designer of CoL intended was for the player to be seduced into helping the dark side in order to gain these powers and as a result "lose their soul" figuratively.. like you may say a person "lost their soul" when they killed an innocent man thinking he was someone else, etc, etc.

I don't think it was supposed to be literal. What about you?

[Trinitis]

I agree with you there. I think the loss of soul is figuratively, though sometimes I think they should make all COL masters decay on death..it would make the "bad" side of COL stand out more..right now its just a whole lot of power for little work and an RP "oh gosh, your so bad"

-Adredrin

[StrayRogue]

I agree. Its kinda of like selling out in reality (ie, betraying someone for personal gain). No soul is actually taken or lost, as you can quit COL, join Voln and be alright. Definately figurative speaking.

[SpunGirl]

Maybe it means that once your character dies (for good), the soul is forfeit to CoL. Or something.

-K

[StrayRogue]

Maybe. Though I never really thought COL had much sway over the Arkati (Luukoss, Lorminstra, Goseana etc.)

[Vesi]

I was wondering something. I know when my Voln master does symbol of recognition, she just assumes that everyone else is COL that don't respond. Same when my COL master signals. I've found out lots of people don't go into either society. It's sort of a 'knee jerk' reaction my characters have.

Back on topic. I don't consider my COL character's soul lost to them. She's convinced it was lost way before COL. She sees COL as a tool. I agree that a bigger 'sting' with the death of someone in COL might make people think twice about joining.

Vesi

[Bobmuhthol]

Uhh.. yes.. you lose your soul.

* CoLMaster just lost his soul to the demonic!

That doesn't happen to people who aren't in CoL.

Originally posted by Bobmuhthol
Uhh.. yes.. you lose your soul.

* CoLMaster just lost his soul to the demonic!

That doesn't happen to people who aren't in CoL.

You can go demonic at level 1 or if you're a voln member.

[StrayRogue]

I was under the assumption anyone could go demonic.

[Bobmuhthol]

No, sorry, you can't.

[StrayRogue]

Well, I know its the first few levels you have five free deaths before you die. But I have had none-col characters go demonic before. My very first character ever did, and I didn't even know what deeds or COL was back then.

[HarmNone]

CoL always seemed like someone's unfinished project to me. It was born, it grew, and then just sat there. There is nothing really evil about it, and many light characters are part of CoL. I even knew one CoL member who firmly believed that the Poohbah was just a lonely, bitter man who was not evil, only pitiful. She used to go and talk to him at times because she felt sorry for him.

There is not enough associated story-line to give the society the depth it would need to make it believable.

HarmNone's opinion

[StrayRogue]

The same applies to Voln. I can see why you left HarmNone; so many excellent avenue's of RP that are just left to be abused mechanically (although they had that great COL storyline a few years back, when it moved to Sol).

[HarmNone]

As I remember it, one goes demonic if one dies without deeds (the character is lost).

HarmNone, who might misremember

[Bobmuhthol]

I know for a fact you can lose your character and not go demonic.

[HarmNone]

Originally posted by StrayRogue
The same applies to Voln. I can see why you left HarmNone; so many excellent avenue's of RP that are just left to be abused mechanically (although they had that great COL storyline a few years back, when it moved to Sol).

That was a great CoL-related storyline, but it was done for the express purpose of moving CoL to Solhaven. When it was done, it was done. CoL was then left to wither on the vine as it has always done.

HarmNone

[HarmNone]

Originally posted by Bobmuhthol
I know for a fact you can lose your character and not go demonic.

Please tell us how that can happen, Bob. Most of us seem to believe that if a character who has died five times, dies again...without deeds...that character goes demonic, whether Voln or CoL. Please enlighten us. :)

HarmNone is interested

[Bobmuhthol]

Have you ever seen someone die, and die, and die, and die, then stop without going demonic? They lost their character. And I've known a few of them. I knew you didn't necessarily go demonic well over 18 months ago, and I never had to study it, so I can't tell you in detail how and why it happens.

[Bobmuhthol]

I rolled up a character, died/decayed 8-10 times, character was gone. I'd notice if it said I went demonic.

[Skirmisher]

Originally posted by HarmNone
That was a great CoL-related storyline, but it was done for the express purpose of moving CoL to Solhaven. When it was done, it was done. CoL was then left to wither on the vine as it has always done.

HarmNone

I thought that was a poorly done move actually. Opinions will differ though.

As to COL being an unfinished project, I would agree. It should be SO much more than it is. I mean come on! A secret society with relatively easily given powers, it is SO great a role playing possibility.

Ok, one persons thoughts on this would be that those that speak of it out loud should suffer repeated deaths at the hands of the assasins until the error of their ways is made clear to them.

Of course those not allied with Voln who speak openly of it should have to suffer at the least visitations of some sort, perhaps intimidating visions or some such with those actually IN voln recieving some sort of protection from such unpleasantries.

My character in COL feels they are able to control the situation and will in the end use the powers they have been given to help fight against the poohbah and his masters. Try roleplaying with people actually INSIDE col though and you will find only people running in with pelts and such if they are not simply on a script and with no time for silly things like roleplaying.

I remember when I first learned of COL and joined and my friend "saved" me from it and had me do the whole cleansing thing at Voln. I thought it was great and quite symbolic and enjoyed the whole thing even though my char was better able to use the COL abilities while hunting.

I always have remembered being told by someone long ago that COL was one of the things that suffered a form of death with the move from I.C.E. as the concept was rooted on deities from there or some such and it just was unable to translate as it was intended to the "new" gs3. That could be way off of course, but is what I have a recollection of for whatever reason.

[Taernath]

CoL was originally designed as a society for the Unlife. Unlife is not the same as the undead, as in walking corpses, but a powerful force that existed only to destroy everything in creation. Unfortunately with the de-ICEing, the concept of Unlife was removed so CoL is now very much a society with no history.

Originally posted by Taernath
CoL was originally designed as a society for the Unlife. Unlife is not the same as the undead, as in walking corpses, but a powerful force that existed only to destroy everything in creation. Unfortunately with the de-ICEing, the concept of Unlife was removed so CoL is now very much a society with no history.

Unlife wants to destroy everything.

Marlu wants to destroy everything.

Unlife = Marlu.

The Council Serves Marlu. The End.

Originally posted by Bobmuhthol
I rolled up a character, died/decayed 8-10 times, character was gone. I'd notice if it said I went demonic.

Bob's right. Sometimes they don't go demonic.

But it has nothing to do with society affiliations. It just seems to sometimes "miss". I think it only does that with the very young though.

[HarmNone]

I think what you witnessed is some kind of "glitch" in the system, Bob. I have not seen it, but it sounds like something went wonky, to me.

HarmNone

[Taernath]

Originally posted by Demon Lord Kage

Originally posted by Taernath
CoL was originally designed as a society for the Unlife. Unlife is not the same as the undead, as in walking corpses, but a powerful force that existed only to destroy everything in creation. Unfortunately with the de-ICEing, the concept of Unlife was removed so CoL is now very much a society with no history.

Unlife wants to destroy everything.

Marlu wants to destroy everything.

Unlife = Marlu.

The Council Serves Marlu. The End.

No. The Unlife was a force, not a diety or person. They may have had similar goals but that's it.

[HarmNone]

Originally posted by Taernath
CoL was originally designed as a society for the Unlife. Unlife is not the same as the undead, as in walking corpses, but a powerful force that existed only to destroy everything in creation. Unfortunately with the de-ICEing, the concept of Unlife was removed so CoL is now very much a society with no history.

Agreed, Taernath. My feeling was always that it would have taken very little to create a history for CoL. The organization is there. A few story-lines to bring it forward from ICE with new purpose, making only slight revisions to what had been true before, would have been very possible, and not too difficult to do. It is a shame it was not done.

HarmNone...fix what is broken and bring forward that which is left behind

Originally posted by Taernath

Originally posted by Demon Lord Kage

Originally posted by Taernath
CoL was originally designed as a society for the Unlife. Unlife is not the same as the undead, as in walking corpses, but a powerful force that existed only to destroy everything in creation. Unfortunately with the de-ICEing, the concept of Unlife was removed so CoL is now very much a society with no history.

Unlife wants to destroy everything.

Marlu wants to destroy everything.

Unlife = Marlu.

The Council Serves Marlu. The End.

No. The Unlife was a force, not a diety or person. They may have had similar goals but that's it.

Marlu is described as an entity that could not be comprehended, perhaps he'd qualify as a force too.

[StrayRogue]

Ask someone from house Phoenix to explain the Unlife for you Klaive. I have never heard that the Council serve Marlu, and I still don't think it today.

Originally posted by StrayRogue
Ask someone from house Phoenix to explain the Unlife for you Klaive. I have never heard that the Council serve Marlu, and I still don't think it today.

I'm not saying it DOES.

I'm saying it SHOULD.

They're similar enough. If they were Marluvian, the council could have a purpose and meaning again.

[HarmNone]

No, Stray. There is no official statement as to who (or what) the council serves. Nowhere is it said that CoL acts in service of Marlu...except in Klaive's mind. ;)

HarmNone

[StrayRogue]

Good. Stay tries to remain away from any form of servitude towards the Arkati, and I would have to quit if it was Marluvian. And I really love my uber AS with signs...so PHEW.

[HarmNone]

Dog has four legs.
Table has four legs.
Dog = Table.

HarmNone

Originally posted by HarmNone
Dog has four legs.
Table has four legs.
Dog = Table.

HarmNone

Um, no.

Basically as far as Unlife and Marlu go, they share everything in common. The only difference is, Marlu is linked to demons and has been given a name.

If you read his description, very little is actually known about him... so why couldn't they just use him to fill in the holes the Unlife left?

It would be logical and fix the problems associated with CoL

[HarmNone]

Perhaps *they* could, but *they* have not.

Besides, admit it...your *logic* deserved a bit of a dig! :D

HarmNone is playful at times

[SpunGirl]

I think if Voln members try to enter Luukos' temple in Solhaven, the part that requires the Luukos sign, they get thrown back and stunned and a voice tells them they're traitors. I think.

-K

[Ilvane]

It's about time they did something like that.

There are far too many people in Voln saying they worship the Lornon side, that's disgusting enough.

I had a character who mastered col and was horrified by it, because she has always been a pure soul. She always felt she had lost it to Col, after the mastering.

My other character, who is also a col master, thought nothing of it and went on with her life.

Ilvane of course thinks they are all evil..heh.

-A

[Dighn Darkbeam]

Dighn sees COL as a source of power. Like that of the Major and minor spiritual circle, weather that power comes from you or you use something else to harness that power it is still at your command.

In terms of RP I believe COL could be expanded signifigantly. An actual council could come into IG existance run by several GM characters. Obviously these characters would not be around at all times. This council could organize a rank structure of players, or award those that serve the council well through quest as trusted members of the organization.

Roleplay now of the council is few and far between. Dighn takes his oath very seriously, as he sees those that violate what they have sworn to as jeapordizing his power. He will heavily chastize players who take their oath lightly.

Any RP you have involving COL is dangerous as there is no documentation to support you and anything you say could be contradicted should Simu decide to pick up a story. Its a shame as COL is one of the few dark character options open to players, yet few take advantage of anything beyond the mechanics.

Kris na Su'ta

[Neildo]

Having your soul be lost to the demonic is due to dying with 0-1 deeds from a spirit death. Anyone can lose their soul to the demonic, whether in Voln, CoL, or neither.

When having a spirit death with 0-1 deeds using CoL powers, your soul is lost to the demonic because those secret powers stole your spirit/soul. When having a spirit death with 0-1 deeds while in Voln or no society, it's the critter that steals your spirit/soul.

And as far as the CoL signs somehow being bad because it made your soul go demonic, I don't think it means CoL is neccessary evil, it's just that messing with ones spirit/soul is sort of taboo. And by you choosing to do a risky taboo and dying because of it, that's why it's bad. It's you making that choice yourself, not CoL.

- N

[Overlord]

Well would you mind putting down a little side note for me and explaining the purpose of Voln...freeing souls aside.
Dimmus a follor of V'tull and a member of voln merely because he despises Luukos for annihilating his family. Unacceptable ehe?

[Latrinsorm]

You can't lose your soul to the demonic anymore.

Voln is evil. Really. V'tull is probably the Arkati most like Voln. You should fit in great.