Warcry Success Rate

[Gnomad]

I get annoyed when holler doesn't work, so I wanted to see what the success rate was. I used my elf guildmaster, level 82 with 22 INF bonus and Griffin's Voice running (which shouldn't affect success, but you never know):

Since HEALME doesn't fix your vocal cords I parked my warrior in front of the AdG treasure master, hollered his face off, and bought balm whenever I needed. 600,000 bounty points later:

Stance doesn't seem to matter.

Defensive Stance:
[holler: 106 successful hollers, 82 unsuccessful, 56.38297872340426%]

Offensive Stance:
[holler: 388 successful hollers, 312 unsuccessful, 55.42857142857143%]

Group status doesn't seem to matter:
[holler: 88 successful hollers, 77 unsuccessful, 53.333333333333336%]

Enhanced to +20 to 44 INF bonus after raiding playershops:
[holler: 367 successful hollers, 136 unsuccessful, 72.96222664015905%]

Assuming the formula looks like other Guild stuff, it'd be something like:

Ranks + Level/4 + INF Bonus - Warcry Difficulty + d100

Which, for my warrior, would be

104 (124 enhanced) - Warcry Difficulty + d100

If Holler has a difficulty of 100 then things would fall nicely into place, with a 54 and 74% chance for unenhanced vs enhanced.

Other cries:
[shout: 100 successful shouts, 0 unsuccessful, 100.0%]
[cry: 86 successful cries, 0 unsuccessful, 100.0%]
[cry: 59 successful targetted cries, 8 unsuccessful, 88.05970149253731%]

Which sheds some doubt on the formula. Difficulty would have to be pretty low for shout and untargetted cry to work so often. I'll redo the script, get someone to buy me more balm, and see if throat status has any effect.

Also, my warcries seem to last 2 minutes and 43 seconds. Not quite sure where that comes from. 2*(Ranks + level/4) would be 2 minutes and 44 seconds, so maybe that?

[JNewhall]

Thanks for sharing this research! I'm interested to see what else you find out.

Side note: I always thought holler lasted a flat 2 minutes? Didn't realize it could vary.

Were you always attempting with a fresh voice? Others have theorized that vocal stress decreases success rate.

I think cry difficulty may change depending on your rank. I remember on critter reps I started with a high failure rate, but by the time I got to a new cry for reps, I almost never failed. That would be consistent with what you found for cry difficulty. Holler being the last cry, it just stays difficult.

I'm curious about what affects success rate against critters. For example, bellow works on first time against about 75% of bandits but more like 50% of grimswarm. (To be clear, the check for bellow never fails, just the check for affecting the critter.) They're all spawning at level, so that's not it. I haven't thought of a good way to test for what's relevant.

[Gnomad]

I only applied balm when his throat was dead, not after each holler. Watching things scroll by it looked like voice status didn't matter, but I haven't actually checked yet.

Yeah, when I make a macro that does warcry holler/spell active immediately back to back, I get the 2:43 number. Weird.

Success rate is hard to figure out now. Warcries used to just use CS. Then they made some guild updates and hid the formula. Might still be a CS thing behind the scenes, might not be.

[Gnomad]

Also of note: So that I could stay in the balm room, I was Cry-ing at a F2P alt, and I can say:

At least for players, Carn's Cry does not stack. Or she'd have been frozen for a while.

[Aganii]

Re: holler duration with rank 1 griffin's voice and +33 influence bonus:

>test
You throw back your head and let out a thundering holler!

Your fighting spirit is bolstered to heroic proportions!

Roundtime: 3 sec.
R>

You currently have the following active spells:
Griffin's Voice .................... 2:49:02
Horland's Holler ................... 0:02:54

Looks pretty close to that formula Gnomad guessed

[Gnomad]

I had a lower-level, lower-ranked player confirm that they also got within a second of 2*(ranks + level/4) so I think I've nailed cry duration down.

[SpiffyJr]

Pretty shitty success rate. Wish I knew this before I was rank 60 and almost mastered! Hah. Bellow and Cry are still pretty solid at least.

[Gnomad]

It is, but warcries are still awesome. Griffins voice and the warcry review really made them useful.

I use Shout if I'm going to be doing a long group hunt or am group hunting something I know I'm going to use a lot of warcries on. It never fails, gives much less voice strain than Holler, and is only 5 less AS.

Holler's success rate is bad, but it's self-cast +20 AS and uses voice, not stamina/mana/spirit/favor. Even if you tanked INF, you can still generally get one off per hunt. Heck, take 1 rank of griffin's voice, holler till you get your AS, then switch to your normal stance and hunt. If it wears off, stand around for 3-20 seconds yelling until it comes back or you blow your voice out. Worst case, you wasted 20 seconds.

[Enuch]

Have you posted on the officials? Maybe the failure rate is unintended or at least not supposed to be so drastic. May be worth cross-posting

[JNewhall]

I think the failure rate on Holler is intentionally bad to balance all the advantages that Gnomad described.

[Gnomad]

I think the failure rate on Holler is intentionally bad to balance all the advantages that Gnomad described.

This. Before the warcry review, holler used to be completely unused vs. shout. Wasn't worth the 5 AS for all the downsides.

After review, they gave it the self-cast feature.

[SpiffyJr]

A 20 AS boost which requires MASTERING a guild skill is hardly game breaking. I'd rather they tie it to stamina and/or mana because, as is, it's more annoying to use than the benefit gained from it... and I'm a halfling. I love the other warcries though.

[Gnomad]

I do wish it was better, but compared to what you get out of mastering most other guild skills, it's amazing. 50% = 88% chance to get in 3 tries; 94% in 4. That's not bad (and failures are easier on your throat than successes).

How much would adding four enchants to your weapon cost? +20 weapons bonus enhancives? How much work do you have to do to get 425 for only a little more AS?

[SpiffyJr]

Enchants and enhancives require less time than I spent (almost) mastering warcries and are always active. 425 is obviously way more time but the benefits are so large (ds, td, as, utility, etc) AND ALWAYS ACTIVE that comparing them is silly. My success rate at 62 ranks and level 51 are far below 50%. I've blown my entire voice and failed to activate it. It's a trash ability for the work invested, period. Had I known earlier what I know now I'd have stopped training warcries.

*EDIT* For science I'll go ahead and write a script to calculate my success rate as well. I'm guessing it's around the 30% or less range.

[SpiffyJr]

[sholler: success rate: 1/11 (9.090909090909092%)]

This is going great so far...

[Gnomad]

Jesus, that's level 51 with mastery? Okay, time to revisit the formula.

What's your inf bonus?

[SpiffyJr]

7 regular, 9 with my badge on (currently have it on for testing this shit). I'm not mastered yet - 62 ranks.

[Gnomad]

It'd be huge if you could get a good sample in before and after promotion; it'd help see what effect a rank has.

Cries definitely do progress quickly after learning them. Trying to find a good way to calculate the difficulty levels based on that.

I've played around with n*(Ranks - rank cry is assigned), and n*(Ranks + level/4 - rank cry is assigned), but I can't make it match the data.

Maybe 7*(Ranks - rank cry is assigned) + (Level/4)/2 + INF + d100, for +55, +75 enhanced, +90 targeted cry, 100% everything else? That just doesn't look right, though.

Level/4 shows up a lot and is an artifact from when the plans were to let any class join any guild - you would get a +level/4 effective rank bonus if you joined your own guild. It might not apply here, but it seems odd to not have it be part of your rank calculation.

If it is adding directly to ranks, though, and if difficulty is based on how many ranks past when you learned the cry, then having a +7 from levels on you could also make a vast difference.

[SpiffyJr]

I'll burn through this gift then level up and see what happens. That sample size above is only 11 holler's which is pretty insignificant.

Also, I apparently lied to you - I'm still 61 ranks (see below).



You have 61 ranks in the War Cries skill.
You need 15 training points to earn your next rank.
The Training Administrator told you to spiff up the shrubbery.
You have 9 repetitions remaining to complete this task.

[Aganii]

My character is capped with a large INF bonus but I definitely see more than a 50% activation rate and its probably closer to 70-75% possibly more. If I have zero vocal stress I usually get the first two hollers off with out a problem even without griffin's voice. I ended up dropping griffin's voice since 3-6 minutes of holler is plenty to get through most of a hunt and I dont use warcries otherwise. As I hunted the confluence more and more I ended up getting one rank of griffin's voice again since bellow is so useful in there.

I dont necessarily want warcries to move to the stamina system but something alittle more reliable so you dont spend 5 RT lookin foolish wouldnt be overpowered.

[Archigeek]

I hunt a bit longer hunts than most people, and routinely get a 8-10 hollers off per hunt. Sometimes you hit a bad streak though, where you wiff 6 times in a row.

[SpiffyJr]

Maybe it's better at cap and/or mastered in the guild. At level 51 with a 9 influence bonus it's completely unusable. I've had good success with the other warcries, though.

[Jeril]

Only 30 warcries so far but I'm at 90% success rate. I need to remember to use them more often.

[Jeril]

[sholler: success rate: 79/100 (79.0%)]

[Astray]

Gotta loosen up your throat, relax the jaw.

[SpiffyJr]

I'm actually making a new warrior just because of this shit. ^.^

[Jeril]

[sholler: success rate: 167/213 (78.4037558685446%)]

[Gnomad]

What's your inf bonus?

[Archigeek]

Nice.

[Jeril]

What's your inf bonus?

30 and 36 when I wear my enhancives.

[Gnomad]

30 and 36 when I wear my enhancives.

I assume those 213 trials are a mix of both?

[Jeril]

I assume those 213 trials are a mix of both?

Correct.

[allen]

Do any stats besides influence have a direct effect on war cry?