On shill bidding and last call bids

[BLZrizz]

I've seen a couple of cases now where bidders have accused sellers of shill bids. Recent cases have the bidders claiming shill bids after a "twice" call, or on the last call before "sold."

http://forum.gsplayers.com/showthread.php?101747-7x-max-light-UAC-handwraps-blessable-zested/

http://forum.gsplayers.com/showthread.php?102095-an-elven-runestaff-harness

I found this issue rather interesting and thought I'd analyze it a bit. Let's make some assumptions:

1. Bidding on "last call" is a known tactic applied by bidders as it frustrates other bidders, making it less likely others will offer a counter.
2. A seller wants MORE competing bids, as it is in their best interest to achieve a higher price and competing bids are the only way to achieve this.
3. Last call bids are closely scrutinized, and all parties are aware that the last call bid, especially from a manufactured account, has some (possibly high) likelihood of chilling further bids.

Given the above, it seems odd that a bidder would accuse sellers of shill bidding solely because of last call bids, as it frustrates most, if not all, of the seller's incentives. To me, if a seller wanted to shill bid, it would seem to be much more effective (or at least less risky) to do it early on in the auction as opposed to on last call. That is, unless the seller didn't care about being the final shill bidder, i.e. terminating the auction with the item still in their possession. This seems to be a risky play, given the PC is also quite the l'archive de provenance, and the seller risks getting stuck with the item or sullying their reputation.

I'd be interested in hearing everyone's thoughts on this.

[WRoss]

Shit happens. When I merchanted, I would bid up items to the price I thought they were worth. If I won it, c'est la vie. I had an item to sell in the future. If you don't like how people are bidding or selling don't buy or sell to them.

[Allereli]

I think both those examples were people who genuinely saw the item/were able to bid on the item for the first time when they did. In regards to the first link, Mnute has been around GS a very long time and is in no way suddenly invented.

[Vorpodu]

Shillers gonna shill

[Astray]

If you don't like how people are bidding or selling don't buy or sell to them.

Fucking thiiiis.

[Methais]

Just tell them to bathe in a sea of dicks.

[Nahkaev]

http://forum.gsplayers.com/showthread.php?100227-Leaving-the-lands-stuff!-Part-1&p=1832165&highlight=#post1832165

this sort of cunty bidding behavior (by zaoloo, shocker) really pisses me off.
granted, in the long run he got screwed - but it's still a really shitty thing to do, and now I've resolved to never buy anything from him.

one thing to consider when participating in auctions is that your behavior is on display to everyone, and GS is a relatively small community.

[Eshielle]

Things like this are the reason I don't allow anonymous buyouts on the things I sell here. It's just too suspicious when there's a lackluster bidding war going on and suddenly the item's gone to some mysterious person who apparently thought the item was worth more than everyone else did. (Then it appears back on the market a month later).

Course there's no real way to avoid this entirely. Unless the last-minute bidder is someone very well known, and it's also reasonably well known that you and that person aren't the same person, there's always going to be some bitching and moaning if someone swoops in an buyouts or bids on an item at the last minute. It's always suspicious, and the people who lose out are always salty. Whether it's more often than not ACTUALLY something shady going on... who can say?

[Vorpodu]

http://forum.gsplayers.com/showthread.php?100227-Leaving-the-lands-stuff!-Part-1&p=1832165&highlight=#post1832165

this sort of cunty bidding behavior (by zaoloo, shocker) really pisses me off.
granted, in the long run he got screwed - but it's still a really shitty thing to do, and now I've resolved to never buy anything from him.

one thing to consider when participating in auctions is that your behavior is on display to everyone, and GS is a relatively small community.

I mean, he did leave you 3 minutes to beat him. Timed auctions are the perfect opportunity for sniping. Good form I say.

[Gelston]

I mean, he did leave you 3 minutes to beat him. Timed auctions are the perfect opportunity for sniping. Good form I say.

Yeah. That is just like eBay auctions. Annoying here that you can't set a reserve though. Well, you could, but you'd really need to trust the seller.

[Luntz]

http://forum.gsplayers.com/showthread.php?100227-Leaving-the-lands-stuff!-Part-1&p=1832165&highlight=#post1832165

this sort of cunty bidding behavior (by zaoloo, shocker) really pisses me off.
granted, in the long run he got screwed - but it's still a really shitty thing to do, and now I've resolved to never buy anything from him.

one thing to consider when participating in auctions is that your behavior is on display to everyone, and GS is a relatively small community.

Dude had his auction up for like a week and you had some super cheap bid of 25mil on a 6x/6x T5 ensorc T4 runestaff. You really didn't expect to get outbid or sniped on that? How did I get screwed again? your bitter tears are delicious

http://i.imgur.com/tqsfuRR.jpg

[gilchristr]

is that a south park reference?

[Latrinsorm]

Shit happens. When I merchanted, I would bid up items to the price I thought they were worth. If I won it, c'est la vie. I had an item to sell in the future. If you don't like how people are bidding or selling don't buy or sell to them.This always strikes me as a weird argument in this context, given that merchanting is a necessarily interpersonal activity.